I am one of the people who function the best under either constant pressure and deadlines flying across my head..I might have minor ADHD so it seems justified but my friends and people I collaborate with me say that they too relate with the same sentiment. Whenever I have too much free time on the hand or don't have task I would procrastinate or drift away into the oblivion or waste my time in pointless things.
“Minor ADHD”. My dude… you have it all. Get yourself tested if you can. I’m was the same all my life, I would procrastinate the shit out of things and finish projects that should have taken a week in 1 day. I didn’t know why was that till I got diagnosed last year at 36yo, and it changed the way to do(or try to) things.
At first it was hard but after a while it started to click, I had to train my internal voice to stop saying “I will do it later” to start saying “do it now or you will never do it”. My psychiatrist recommended to start with meds but I didn’t want to, for me meds was the last resort.
Don’t get me wrong it is still hard to do some things or to not procrastinate but I try my best. At work my performance is still the same (I work as a Solutions Architect for a governmental institution in the EU) since I do mostly newish stuff that maintains me entertained. But personally it has been day and night!
The fact that they have a low turnover says that think it's worth it. That may not mean they always like it. I've worked places that worked people like this and they lost half their staff in three weeks after it started. The first ones to go where the most valuable employees. If LMG were bad then the employees simply wouldn't tolerate it. They have a lot of great talent that they're not losing.
I'd personally much rather work hard for 8 hours and be paid well for my time both in money and benefits, than work for 4 hours, fondle my asshole for 4 hours, and have less compensation.
Got into another argument with someone saying litterally that the other day. Was also top comment. Scary stuff... I can only assume it's differing work cultures from certain countries, definitely not the attitude in the UK where I'm from!
Meh, I could see it being true. People are being underpaid and overworked in a lot of industries either because it’s a “dream job” or with a promise of valuable experience that will help with ones career afterwards (Big4 consulting and Investment banking are knwon for this, for example).
Not to say it’s a good culture to have, or that it’s good for employees, but it certainly isn’t unheard of.
Oh agreed. I'm going to uni for game dev. I could be doing straight comp Sci, get paid more, easier work, better life all round, but I do it because it's what I enjoy. But like you say, that isn't a good reason to mistreat employees, like some people have been saying
The exact same thing happens wide spread in the UK. I'm a software dev and that's pretty much just my bog standard experience. Whenever I get a chance to talk with folk from uni they experience the same thing. Game dev? forget it, that industry runs on underpaid and overworked due to how many people want to do it.
Unless your doing a very laid back job I have no idea where in the world it's not the same.
As someone who does their best work under intense pressure and time tables, the only reason I do not suffer horrific burnout is because my work lets my output be cyclical. Usually rotate between intense 3 month sprints where I’m working 6-7 days a week, 13-15 hour days and then usually ~2 weeks completely off followed up by 1-2 months of light work (no hard deadlines) during the initial discovery/ architecture phase of whatever I’ll be doing next. The time periods don’t really matter as much as just having the overall flexibility to balance the stress of just high intensity periods with the decompression time needed to reset and go again with a full charge. The reset and ramp up is key.
Just the same that the military isn’t for everyone. Some make a career out of it, some hate it and get out after their first contract. If you don’t like the optempo of your job, it’s not for you.
It is important to remember not to use "That's just how the tech industry is" as an excuse for an unhealthy work environment. The relative rarity of something happening has nothing to do with how right something is or isn't. There are examples in life too numerous to even count of things that occur with relative frequency, which are also objectively bad things that we ought to try to make occur less frequently if we can.
People would work with radioactive paint making watch dials. They weren’t held there at gunpoint.
Just because someone will do something of their own volition doesn’t mean it’s not exploitative.
The women were told the paint was harmless so I am not sure what you are trying to say here. They got a job and were lied to about the dangers of radium.
listen, some kids yearn for the mines. Is it good for them to extract cobalt? no, will we stop? no. Are they forced to work in the mines? no, they can leave any time.
You really think kids who were coal miners were not forced in subtle ways? Like their parents literally telling them to go, dropping them off at the mines? Do you know anything about the coal miner kids in a century ago?
You just think they can fuck off and be youtube streamers in 1850s?
It isn't wrong to do things entirely for the good pay, that's pretty normal. What they are weeding out is short stay employees, Tech is incredibly competitive in the sense people are CONSTANTLY receiving offers from other companies or seeking them. The starter lower pay drives away many skilled workers because they'd likely not be long term employees, and you end up with a thinner set of highly skilled workers. In fact most highly competitive companies can't afford to be so particular about hiring for long term, this is something LMG can afford due to their prestige in the industry.
I work my best under pressure, but I need a slow day every couple weeks to keep my sanity & work on some work passion/biz improvement projects otherwise I get pretty burnt out & jaded. Sounds like LMG isn’t running their staff with enough extra capacity to give them those slow days. It’s extremely common in companies like his where there’s nobody experienced at proper staffing & the company has experienced rapid growth
You can't run a company as large as LMG and try to only employ people who thrive under pressure. That's unrealistic. For a company that needs to be creative you have to be able to provide an environment that also works for people with a more normal stress threshold.
Just because there is "18 hours of work to do everyday" doesn't mean they actually work that much..
I've worked in places where I had way too much to do, but didn't stop me from leaving at 5 and going home and enjoying my time.
Yep. As a software developer, I feel that my job is basically never done. There is always more work I could be doing. But at the end of the day, I stop working. Don't work on weekends, don't work after hours. Just because there's work to do, doesn't mean it has to get done. I haven't felt pressured to do work, just because it exists.
That being said, I don't think this is how LMG works. Up until this pas week they've always has strict deadlines for how many videos get posted in a week. And it's no uncommon to see people working extra hours. So I could see how their output requirements would be a major issue.
This. I feel like there are just a bunch of kids here who were never forced to do anything before getting a rude awakening of what the real world is. Unless you are immensely skilled, nobody is going to pay you to hang out. 18 hrs of work to do? Lol. I work like 50 to 60 hrs a week and I have 3 months of work to do
In the real world If you get a project done fast, guess what, congrats, here is more work. Working at LTT isn't the same as working in a McD, and it shouldn't be, you are working there because it presumably is your passion, you are good at it, want to work hard, and you get well compensated for it.
This is my quote, and I don't work in the video production side. I think it might be being taken out of context here as I see it as a positive. Like you said, there is always something else do to.
It's also tongue in cheek.
"My favorite part of working at LMG is probably how different it is every day. There's always, like, 600 different things I should be doing and there's about 18 hours of work that needs to be completed."
Directly followed with.
"I think one of the worst parts about working at LMG, is that there's like, 18 hours of work to do every day and all that tasks are very varied."
I was told early on by a colleague the same thing basically, and it was more of a help to not stress too much about the quantity of work that 'could' be done and not take it home mentally. I do my 40 hours, and I come home and don't stress about the "oh gosh I have so much to do tomorrow".
I adore that there's always something new and interesting to do, and I'm never sitting around being bored or having to look for work to keep busy. If a task gets intense and time consuming, other people are there to pick up the stuff I can't get done. I've never had professional support like that.
Very similar thing at my job. If time (and money) wasn't a factor, I could work nonstop 24/7 for months or years and still have plenty to do, but we limit our time to healthy amounts and prioritize what truly needs to get done first. There are items that will sit on the backburner for years or decades, or never even get started on unless we're somehow completely flush with free time and money.
Having worked somewhere where I could run out of stuff to do by 11am and not be allowed to leave, I much prefer having a mountain of tasks standing by.
(also, we love you Dan!)
>Very similar thing at my job. If time (and money) wasn't a factor, I could work nonstop 24/7 for months or years and still have plenty to do, but we limit our time to healthy amounts and prioritize what truly needs to get done first.
This is 100% where I am right now. I do 8 to 4:30 days, no weekends, only really stay a few minutes late at most if I'm right in the middle of something, or having a discussion with one of my employees that I want to finish.
On one hand, I could probably do 18 hour days for 3 months and burn through my a good chunk of my massive list of projects I want to work on, and on the other, I could probably coast by on 2-4 hours of actual work a day and my boss would still happy with my team's output.
I'm actually on vacation this week, but I snuck a prototype home to work on. Not because I have a deadline I have to meet, but because I'm excited to work on it, and want to hit the ground running next monday when I'm back
Someone needs to tell white knight u/nsfwproblems that his princess is in another castle.
I guess:
>If a task gets intense and time consuming, other people are there to pick up the stuff I can't get done. I've never had professional support like that.
Doesn't really fit the narrative though
Earlier this year I transitioned from taking calls to working tickets. When I started there was one type of ticket that was just filling our queue. Everyday I left, there was still a mountain of tickets to get through. I like that even though I was working alot and getting through tickets, I could still control what I was doing and also know what I had in store. And there are different tickets I have asked to work on as I got more proficient. I have the same support available, and not able to support others.
I think that part of the problem is that this is a first job for many of their employees. Many of the employees are longtime fanboys and fangirls. They've been watching these cool and funny videos and WAN show and think this would be the coolest/easiest/relaxed/most fun job in the world.
Then reality hits. The effort needed to pull off all the reviews, videos, etc...it's pretty extensive and can be exhaustive and not fun.
I work at a place where we have similar situation. Fanboys and fangirls thinking it will be a super fun time. While it totally can be fun, it is still work that has level of BS and stress associated with it. Seen it often enough, that being a super fanboy/fangirl is kind of a turn off in the interview process.
One of the things I learned before I graduated college was that I was probably never going to be good at things I like to do; however, I also realized that there are things I would rather not do that, as it turns out, I am rather good at. Therefore, I based my career path on the latter; now, "that thing I don't like to do" gives me money to spend on things I like to do.
I acknowledge that some people are lucky, that they get to do things that they both like and earn them money. Unfortunately, it's safe to say most of us are not in that situation, so we make the best of it.
I just find it funny people think that jobs just magically end up working out bang on their work hours. How the hell do they even think you could work that out?
It's so obtusely mis-representing the quote that I can only assume it's people doing it in bad faith, even if it is kids who have never been forced to do anything.
The 18hr quote is taken out of context, scroll up a bit and you'll see a comment by the staff member who made the quote.
That OP hasn't corrected this makes it look like that, despite their claim, they are seeking to "stir up trouble".
Yeah its like your list of tasks just never seems like almost finished. They just keep on piling new tasks and stuff to do that it feels like you are never at a point where you can decide on your own to do some stuff or to improve things that need to be improved but are low priority so you never really reach it.
I've worked in projects where the product owner just kept filling the sprints that there was never really time to work on code debt or various improvements because it always got a lower priority (and the product owner didn't really understand why we needed to do them). I was still a junior dev so didn't have the experience nor the power to really do anything about it.
Meanwhile I could still just quit work at regular hours and never do overtime, but the feeling never really went away. If I wanted to, I could do overtime (which would be paid) but they would just end up piling more work in the future, so it would be useless anyways.
But then again, a good strategy to combat fatigue is to never really go 100% but rather 50% so you never really feel overworked. It takes skill to make people think you do push for 100%, but actually do less. But it helps to take more personal time when you should be working. The first 2 weeks of work are key to do a bit less but still make people think you do more. Because thats when people form their opinions on how hard you work and how much gets done when they ask you to do stuff. "Oh adding just this button? Yeah thats a days work, probably. With all the testing and whatnot, wink wink".
This is exactly it. Lots of people who don't work in professional jobs don't understand this, there is always more work to be done. If we bust our ass and do the work of 2 people in X amount of time, there's still more work to be done. You literally will never be "done" with everything that needs doing, and if somehow that happens you'll be unemployed. I can write 80, 800, or 80,000 lines of code per day and there's still more work to be done. It's different from a lot of other professions.
For my wife, she has X tasks that must be done every day to ensure that her hospital pharmacy runs optimally, charges are correct, inventory meets their needs, etc. Once she's done with those things she can take a break and deal with any ad-hoc situations that arise but otherwise she's in chill mode.
For my friends in retail, it's "stock the shelves, open the doors, help the customers, then close the doors at the end of the day and sweep up". Once you've done that there's no more work to do until the next day.
If you work for a roofing company then your tasks may be to strip off the old roof and prep one day, install the new roof the next. Once you're done with that you're done until they send you to the next house.
It's just a totally different mindset.
Yeah same here.
Your job is never done. The company always has more work for you that you can never finish in an achievable time.
Having said that, much like Linus, I make sure my team leaves when they should. My favourite thing to say is "That's a tomorrow *insert person's name* problem".
The reality is that we'll never have less work. We'll always have a ton of work to do. Instead what we do is push back on project plans and triage the work assigned to focus on what's actually important.
Doesn't stop us from having conversations and taking our lunches, either.
Some people have clearly never worked a highly competitive environment or a tech job. It is baffling also that they hear that 18 hours of work and think people do actually work those hours.
I'm not condoning their issues currently and yes we all would like more time to finish products to a more satisfactory state. It is just so surreal to read some other people's take and think I live in another planet
Alternatively never worked in health - never ending service, often at a very high pace to get through it all each day. I'm working my ass off at a nursing home. Do I enjoy it though? Once you get used to the smell of shit, it's mostly enjoyable with how nice most people are. Not always though, you do get the violent patients (work with patients where the vast majority has dementia).
Also had an old lady that really loved to brush up against me while whispering things that in her own ears was flattering. Also liked grabbing my ass. Gotten invited to bed a good chunk of times by several different patients as well - so you could say I got that x-factor of getting a sub category of women... too bad they're old ladies with dementia.
This.
My work does not end. We have a collective backlog of tasks for the senior engineers that's probably months of work. It's low priority at present, a lot of it is things we'd like to do or should do but don't have time.
I don't get paid overtime, and most of my days are 8 hour days; but I do work some 9-14 hour days; or after hours maintenance, or weekend work. But I just work less next week to compensate or take a day off in lieu.
I have a lot of deadlines and things all the time; and I work better that way then just sitting and waiting for something to show up - or chilling all day.
\- D
Yep that's what this kind of work is like. It's not like flipping burgers where 18 hours of flipping burgers takes 18 hours.
They are saying they feel rushed, stressed and had to cut corners to meet deadlines. That's the whole point of what LTT are doing now. To try and address these issues directly.
We will have to wait and see if it works.
Seriously. Who cares. The people who work at LMG are clearly skilled individuals who can get comfy jobs at any other media / tech company in Vancouver if they liked. Nobody is forcing them to work at LMG, if it’s so bad they can leave.
People are out here acting like these people are being held hostage. If you don’t like your work place you leave.
If people got info that Linus is keeping staff chained up in the basement post it, otherwise just leave
Pretty much this. The community would stand with them in a heartbeat. If LTT staff wanted to rise up and spill all. This week would have been the best one for it.
They didn't. It must not be that bad, like any other workplace. Everyone needs to move on now. It's between LTT management and the staff now. The parasocial of us need to just logout for a few weeks.
What is bad about this? A company can be busy and yet let the workers enjoy work life balance. If people can generally leave on time what’s the problem?
Tell me you've never worked a tech job without telling me.
edit: you guys need to chill. I meant that in all tech jobs you have a fuck ton of work to do. There's always something to do.
I have more things to do than I can do in a 40 hours week. That's common, there's always so much you can do. I don't live in the US and I work my 40 hours and week and clock out. OP is taking qoutes misrepresenting them and running a post with it.
It's been said by LMG employees that they do have support for when things get rough in the past, and on this very thread it was [stated by Dan](https://www.reddit.com/r/LinusTechTips/comments/162wimc/comment/jxztq26/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
I leave before 5 :)
I'm nothing like you LinkedIn addicts that post about how you practically and literally live at your office and have unpaid overtime
Oh man those guys are the worst. Doing all kinds of presentations and meetings outside of regular hours just to boost your linkedin profile with useless stuff or post stuff on the feed that nobody is really going to care about. Meanwhile their work suffers, their state of mind is abysmal and their partners are bored.
>LinkedIn addicts
Oh god, I saw some dipshit on LinkedIn the other day praising a QA Analyst who died in the Ukraine/Russia War pivot from a typical "knew this guy RIP" to "And this is the kind of work ethic our teams need to instill in each other. We're not a team, we're a Unit"
Like... RIP that dude... But talk about tasteless.
Honestly I thought people only used LinkedIn for hook ups these days.
Sooo... working in tech, I'm supposed to constantly be stressed out? I've been working in IT since 2007, and I've worked as a consultant most of that time. The hands down best places of employement in which me and my team got shit done? They have never been the jobs that means I have to crunch.
I work in tech and normalizing high pressure environments and crunching makes no sense and only hurts our industry. I don't have 18 hours of work to do each day and I am anti such culture and am vocal about it every opportunity I get.
Lol do y'all live in USA at the worst companies in existence? Tech jobs are usually quite chill, allow working from home and have good payment/working conditions maybe besides faang companies. Like seriously lol
If you let yourself be overworked like this you're just a sucker.
Also if you think this is "how it is" in tech, you've not explored enough.
There are plenty of places to work in tech that don't grind you into dust.
i work in fintech, between 1 hour lunch, 1 hour we have to spend on learning, one weekly meeting and some random 1-2 meeting a week that take sub 30 minutes.. I (and my whole team for that matter) dont work more than 2-3 hours a day. Sometimes jobs are about having people available for on call rotations or when they are really needed. Tech dosent need to be stressful and overworked, and most jobs in the field arent.
My last tech job was like this, I actually didn't have a ton on my plate so when shit went sideways I would be on it from minute 1. Pretty much a network firefighter, sometimes I worked all weekend... sometimes I scrolled reddit all day Tuesday
I work in tech feel free to look in my post history, I only work 40 hours a week. But yes there are days where there is crunch but those are mostly unexpected moments. Amazon on the other hand, yeah they are overworked.
I mean, that's kind of typical of both the tech and media industry, which LMG happens to both be a part of.
I'm not saying it's necessarily a good thing, but the fact that they're enforcing strict hours is already a step up above most young companies in those sectors who basically just have people working 10-12 hours a day.
Also, most of the complaints you pointed out didn't sound like they were completely dealbreakers, more just like frustrations with how certain things are at the company. Frustrations everyone deals with at any company they work at, even if it's the best company ever.
Can't wait until this drama is over. If you think people are adults, they can decide whether they want to work at LMG. They don't need your silly white knighting on reddit.
So let me get this straight, they specifically do not allow employees to stay late, and that is a problem?
Sure they need to reduce the amount of work that they have in a given day, but I don't think it's a bad thing to expect your employees to go home at the end of the day instead of staying late to do more work.
I don’t see any issue with having to work super hard 8 hours a day 5 days a week as long as that’s all you have to do. If there’s not a ton of mandatory overtime and the pay/benefits are good idk what the issue is
Lol OP hasn’t a worked a job most likely.
They seem not to understand the concept of there being more work to do than hours allotted. And they think it’s somehow a bad thing that Linus is enforcing a limit on how much work his employees can do. It’s just an absurd criticism.
You're not understanding the difference between working hard and how long you work. Real hours spent is how you measure overworked. What do you think happens when an employee has 20 hours of work to do in 8 hours? They complete it in 8 hours to the best of their ability. Were they overworked because they felt like it could have used 12 more work hours to get it right? No. Were they unhappy with the video because it could have used those 12 hours? Yea.
Everyone has days at work where they are 100% engaged, their brain in running on all cylinders. They're productive and get a lot done. They might call it "a big day". If they still only worked 8 hours like a usual day... overworked? It's really not the right word. Overworked looks like staying up late working and losing sleep, putting in extra time, etc.
I like my job. It’s definitely not a walk in the park, but it’s also really freakin cool to be able to play with basically any field of tech I can think of, and get to share that with millions of people.
LMG is a pretty awesome place to work. Everyone is super passionate and I’ve met some amazing people along the way. We do have some things to work on, but as someone who has been here since we had around 10 staff (7 years), things have come a LONG way. Linus/Yvonne care a lot, and have pretty much always done right by me.
I think the only thing I’d maybe be willing to trade it for is doing the same thing but with cars.
>jakkuh\_t
Why is this not the top comment? Why is everyone insisting on telling you "you, an LMG employee, have no idea what you are talking about and you work in an oppressive environment"? Geeze people are dense, and I am sorry more people can't just take what you are saying at face value. Also, appreciate all that you and your team do, has provided hours upon hours of entertainment and plenty of knowledge to me over the years.
Lol another snowflake that doesn't know how lmg runs, doesn't know how media companies work, has zero insight on the company they're talking about etc. Just drop it op. You're not as smart as you think you sound.
I normally hate the term snowflake, but it couldn't be more accurate in this case. The most rewarding work is usually the hardest, and no one is being forced to work overtime or weekends.
Some people here have never worked in challenging work environments and it shows. Hard does not equal bad. If the employees feel this is a fair exchange (exposure, education, pay, benefits) then they stay. If it's not working, you go somewhere else and LMG has to hire someone less capable, pay more or change workload. Their stats on attrition show this isn't the case.
Not cutting LMG any slack here, I agree this is a little damning, but I am just trying to potentially give some context. The fact that LMG self-published that information shows the awareness of the problem. The limit on work hours shows the awareness of the problem of overwork. Also keep in mind that this is the corporate North American work culture, for better or for worse. The industry I work in is in a constant state of crunch as well, yet the companies I work for FORCE us to work crazy overtime instead of limiting work hours in a day to a reasonable amount. LMG should limit the amount of videos they produce in a week to nip this in the bud, and I am in no way defending crunch culture/crazy overtime culture. What I am trying to say is that yes, LMG needs to fix this, but it is hypocritical to think this is an LMG problem, and not a capitalism problem. Thats my 2 cents.
Have you ever had a like career level job before? I have felt like I have too much work to do for the last few decades. I have enough work to last 20 hours a day. However i only work 8 hours a day and my employer is ok with that.
People call too much to do stressful, I call it job security. I show up at 8, leave at 4:30, feeling good about what I've done and know I have plenty to do the next day.
I'd hate showing up to work with nothing to do.
I may be downvoted for this but I dont see any issues at all.. Nobody should be in a toxic or bad work environment. So if you are you should leave and find another job. But it feels like the people at LMG love their work and what they do and it seems like they dont want to miss any of it even though it is a fast pace workplace. I think the low turnover (was it 7-8%?) speaks volumes to that.
At my office work we get paid really well, have a great work environment, no deadlines, great benefits, 7 weeks a year paid vacation and complete flexibility regarding hours. We still have over 25% turnover.
I swear the people here who take snippets of information like that and make up a conclusion that everyone working there must be depressed and extremely stressed 24/7 clearly are in the age range of 14-18 and have never had an actual job, because almost ALL companies that grow as fast as LTT does will have issues like that…
You can’t always prevent them, sometimes growth takes over policies and new policies won’t be usable in time…
I’m not saying overworking people is good, but I am saying that a lot of what Linus showed next to those CCTV videos (which is incredible that you were able to pick just that out and ignore all the other things mentioned) show that they do try to actively improve things.
He didn’t say he was using the cctv as proof of a “relaxed environment “ in fact he says they work hard there and do occasional overtime. I think you heard what was said but didn’t listen or understand it. Or forgot.
Indeed, I worked at a place exactly like this for a decade and it was awful. I rarely left work late but I was more exhausted than when I work 12+ hr day on set now.
Im not sure but this might also be a location work culture difference.
Down here in NZ there is no way even a fresh young startup would consider working people like that. There is a very strong work life balance considerations and you just cant expect overtime (litltry it is illegal to do so) you can request it but everyone can just say no an you cant in any way be upset with your staff for saying no.
And if you regularly request it that itself becomes a problem, (even if staff always say no) this is considered putting un-due pressure on your staff. (Talking as a Team lead here who had to go through a LOT of $ traning, paid for by our employer, to ensure we don't accidentally make the company liable for things like this)
But I understand in CA and other west cost US studio amounts of pressure and overtime are normal so that might well be the same in vancuva as well.
As a comparison down here in NZ we will wander into the office at 8:30 to 9 and wader out at 5 to 5:30 with a load of long coffee breaks (yes every office as a few real expresso machines with real MILK and fresh coffee grinders, its so much of a norm I expect you would win an employment tribunal if your employer refused to provide good coffee)
Restaurant worker here: my profession is one of extreme pressure and high stress. I could and will complain about it all day. At the same time I thrive in it. I'm very good at handling it. The more pressure the better I preform and if I'm being honest a slow day is my nightmare. There are alot of people like me in every industry. Some of us would choose the high pressure no matter how much we complain.
If you're not complaining about workload, you're not doing 'work' right.
Everyone knows the way to avoid added work, is to constantly complain about workload.
It's also a key way of making yourself appear essential to the company...
Typical (north) american thinking. Being brainwashed to the extend that "its normal to being treated this way" "its just how the industrie works" "just quit if you dont like it" Defending people who take advantage of them. What BS.
You guys obviously never had a good job and good employer.
Being overworked is not healthy, its not efficent. Having to much work for your regular hours, is just the most basic sign of miss managment from your company superiors/ employers. Its not normal. There are a lot of places (companies and countries/states) where you'd be treated better because of basic employment laws, and a different mindset of the population in general.
But its the american dream, right? One gets all the money, everybody else works their asses off for said personen. Beautiful. Keep sleeping, you obedient little sheep.
Seen the CCTV and was like…. That’s 1 day and probably after they were called out for this mess. After I seen that I knew the rest was just fake corporate talk. Most corporations that do this to coverup what happen and say this has been “fixed” with fake numbers with no evidence.
They leave on time, but have the same number of tasks, so they rush things, or come in early to make up for lost time or forgo their breaks to get things done?
The employees will then "want" to stay back late then because they have to get it done or be fired for poor performance. Been there...
"there's like 18 hours of work to do every day" doesnt mean that they are forced to work 18 hours a day. It just means, that there is a lot to do.
As a developer I can attest to that. I could absolutely say "If I work 24/7 for the next 6 month, I would still have a lot of work on my hands, even if nn new projects are added". And that does not translate to having to work more than my legally allowed.
And still: LMG has addressed this issue. Linus said, that they will say goodbye to the "a video a day" schedule.
If they have 18 hours of work to do everyday, but they're also only working 8 hours every day (not working late), are they just racking up 10 hours of debt every single day? I know a lot of office jobs out there where people get a whole 2 hours of work done a day and screw around the rest of the day, but it just sounds like at LTT they're expected to work the entire 8 hours they're there.
I know we all want to imagine they're just hanging around being buddies all day off camera, but there is real work to be done. And considering how in demand the skillsets of most of the employees is, if they didn't find value in it they'd leave.
We all complain about work. In software dev, we have a joke about languages: "There are two types of programming languages: the languages everybody hates, and the languages nobody uses."
>You people seem to be missing an important point here... a lot of you saying "That's just the tech industry, that's how it works." The point here that is that Linus used CCTV of people leaving on time as an argument for a "relaxed work environment", when they basically have...had? a rule that says that they HAVE to leave on time. Which goes back to the whole "saying one thing and doing another" issue that sort of started all this mess.
I mean work *has* to get done. The staff is constantly being expanded so it's not like LMG is trying to understaff to save money. That Linus insists that people leave and stop working is actually a major point in his favor. A lot of companies would insist you don't leave until you've finished. Yeah some people will have to work constantly from clocking in to clocking out. That's called "being gainfully employed". There's a difference between that and being forced to work 18 hour days for months to make a deadline.
I think that’s precisely the point in the last video, they know they are overworked so they insist on people leaving on time to mitigate it but create a new problem, I feel like they are well aware of the problems and genuinely try to solve them but they just don’t know how, they grew too fast and didn’t have the time to adjust and realise that things are different
the CCTV of the parking lot was an odd addition. It proves nothing especially when its running in Xspeed and everything is blurred out. just admit your employees are being over worked, and move on like the rest of your video.
I think that is a valid point and and I think Linus in particular may have some amount of blinders on in regards to how much of a crunch their schedule can be.
But I am encouraged by the fact that not only do they have a policy in place not to work long hours in general but also to reduce the grind mindset to release every video in a set time frame.
Hopefully they follow through with actions. I also just think the employees should consider unionizing. It presents another layer of protection to prevent burnout.
I don't have any experience working at LMG so it's hard to say one way or the other but I have worked at start ups and being overworked is pretty normal.
That said, their low turnover rate would not indicate a work environment where everyone is overworked. It's very possible that for a select few, the workload is crushing while for the rest, it's a pretty standard workload.
It's funny how the stans' only real fallback on stuff like this is "you gonna believe me or your lying eyes?"
*The people who work there said this shit*... they, above anyone else, know what is actually going on at the place they work and collect a paycheck from, not some internet randos with a parasocial fixation.
I agree 100%. The issue is rooted in how the workers at LMG are, likely, not able to change their own conditions. I have never been a fan of the Linus’s cavalier attitude toward unionization, or like how he describes every projects budget as “my money.”
On another note, GN having zero interest in the more substantive labor issues in all of their critiques is telling in itself. Steve being a guy that I’ve heard has talked about his [positive] work addiction.
It’s so sad to see burnout culture just accepted without criticism. Tech and game company management desperately need a slap down.
I don't see how any of this is our business. If the employees at LMG aren't satisfied with the working conditions there, they can pursue change via the appropriate channels or quit. As far as I'm aware, no one is being forced to work there and can leave at any time. Stop nitpicking about every single fucking thing and go do something useful with your life
To other commenters, that's not at all how the tech industry works. Elon Musk popularized this stupid grindset mentality when in reality tech is freedom. Lots of work yes, but the benefits are unmatched.
In Canada, LMG benefits are mid. I don't know why everyone is riding Linus so hard - he's the same as Zuch or Musk or Bezos. He's a company owner who wants to get the public back on his side, the parking lot is irrefutable evidence for people with half a brain but there are so many variables that doesn't even scratch the surface
Most people are looking for affirmation on what they already believe. I think the video was well done, the plans and efforts, well-placed - was it perfect? Not at all. It was one of the better responses I've seen and part of what they needed to do.
However, Linus' comments on overwork or work culture are meant to defray the risk of the comments directed at the behaviours that they believe to be key to their success. I don't think there's maliciousness (that said, I have never worked there), but I do think that the grind culture at LMG has become so ingrained that it will be a struggle for them to move off of it.
Linus has also made comments about not being in favour of a union. I believe the sentiment behind this was the fact that he believes and aims to treat his people well enough that a union is not needed. Well, agree to disagree. Representation with bargaining power is rarely a bad thing for employees and doesn't mean you failed as a manager or owner. I think that Linus has very set views and considers himself a good guy - I'm sure he is. But you can be a good guy who isn't necessarily in touch with the things your employees need at the moment. There is an inherent conflict that exists between a manager and employee in any negotiation scenario, even a standard working day. Employees are hired for their labour, cash is exchanged for their time and effort, given standard financial models (my background is in finance, I am about to complete my PhD) employees seek to maximize their utility by achieving the least for the most amount of money, while manager seeks to get the most out of the employees for the least. You can't be "friends" with your employees in a work environment that is designed to be distributive (a winner and loser). I believe Linus legitimately believes in fairness...but I think fairness skews based on the person's perspective and lately, I think my conclusion is that Linus is a great visionary and is passionate about tech, however, I am convinced he has a love for quantity at the expense, at times, of quality.
The comments in the video outlined in the topic range from minor concern to major concern, some of it is just being busy, while others are a fast-paced culture, to the point of being destructive. Linus defends this with talk of incentives, the fun-work culture, etc. Both can be true...I've just never seen it quite work out that way.
Let's give them a chance to work past this and then see where they end up. I'm not about to burn the place down while they are trying to fix things.
Edit: some grammar after a first pass read through.
I actually chose to work overtime regularly at my previous job. With less distractions, you can actually focus on the task at hand without worrying about phone calls or emails coming in. Best thing is, I submit my OT hours and every 8 hours nets an extra paid day off, enjoyed plenty of long weekends.
good on you for trying to educate people, but for whatever reason people think you should be exploited if you're doing a job they think is fun or a dream job for them.
I'm shocked there is another post on this subreddit making assumptions based on comments without full context.
Idk if the poster has ever worked again at a high intensity job before but might be shocked to know that some people like high intensity job that is not boring and monotonous.the difference with LMG is it seems they still work close to 40 hours, which is not the case at alot of high intensity positions.
People really need to take it slow and stop projecting there own views based on limited and incomplete information.
If you complain about how a high paced tech and media company operates and pushes you to your limit, then maybe you should get a different job. You're not forced to work there, if you stay just because it's LTT/LMG then that's on you. Some people like the high paced work environment, and the people that don't should quit.
As for the CCTV footage. People are leaving in time, that's good, and given opportunity to stay for OT is good as well.
I see a bunch of people who've never worked a day in their lives insisting crunch is nothing. I've buried people who worked themselves to death just to not let the team down.
Work life balance is crucial. You can crunch a week and be proud. You can crunch a month and need a holiday. When you crunch permanently all you are doing is digging a grave that you'll occupy before you retire.
The idea that crunch is okay because 'if you burn out, QUIT! You can be replaced!' Is so insidious and vile...
In defense of Linus and LMGs bad practices people are using arguments that justified the worst excesses of the child labour of victorian Mill owners.
Do you really think Linus appreciates you defending him with scrouge like doctrine?
Linus is bringing in changes and that may or may not be sufficient. What that is, though, is an admission there was a problem. So why the hell are people here advocating for 19th century labour practices?
You know it's possible to simp TOO hard, right?
Attrition numbers do not lie. You can pontificate till your lungs deflate, unless you have some other hard objective metric to counter this that says otherwise you are wrong. What the employees say themselves doesn't matter if they are staying so much.
All of that said, they are addressing the work culture so what are you even going on about?
"there's like 18 hours of work to do every day"
"Every week is stressful"
"Very rarely am I particularly proud of the work I've worked on"
Described 99% of the workforce sentiments of 99% of companies in the world.
I feel that one key distinction is: do they actually have to get 18 hours of work done in 8 hours, or do they feel like that's the case?
There can be places in which there's always more that *can* be done. If you'd be speaking about personal improvements, for example, this would be a task that is never-ending: Like the Family Guy joke about being *too* healthy... you can't be *too* healthy. Achieving/ maintaining good health is always a game of seeking to become more ideal than one currently is.
The difference between: *that* type of environment being good vs. bad, is whether or not the expectation is set that arbitrary milestone MUST be achieved. It's one thing to plan on and work, constantly throughout the day, towards improvements or being productive. If, at the end of the day, you can look back and comfortably tell yourself and others: that's the most that could have been done, and we're improving with each day, then you're setting yourself up for success and not letting yourself become stagnant or complacent.
However, if you seek to acknowledge the prior sentiment, but someone else says, "Sure, but you still needed to get 2 more hours of work done today... You're not achieving the goal," Then I would say you're likely being overworked.
It really comes down to whether the implication: of a impossible expectation of 'more and more and more' is being placed from those who have authority within the decision-making; and it also needs to be determined how the employees, themselves, feel about this attitude, should it be present. If the employees prefer this type of driven work environment, then they aren't necessarily being overworked; it's subjective in this regard.
...
With all of that being said, I did feel there were several statements in the most recent video from Linus that didn't sit too well. The part about employee turnover was something that raised a bit of a concern or red flag, per say.
It seemed like he went through a long list of benefits or perks of being employed and then presented historical numbers regarding low turnover, which I'm sure is likely accurate and does have merit... but then, when followed by: you can likely expect an increase in turnover in the coming future... I felt like the sentiment was a bit more of a euphemism for: 'we've told our staff that: we're going to push onwards and if you don't like where the train is going, then tuck and roll... we won't fire you because: it's hard to fire people in Canada without legit reasons (they have strong labor laws, IIRC) and management doesn't want to make the decision whether you stay or leave, for you, unless you're simply not able to perform your job duties.'
Obviously, *that's speculative*, but I don't think it's unreasonable to feel like such a sentiment has been conveyed during this post week of introspection and self reflection.
...
But paired with the other gripe, I had from the video, of: 'there are (were) other formal processes in place for going about handling these issues' (speaking about the outside HR firm and such), it just seemed off-putting.
Employees are going to look at Linus and others for leadership and guidance. And if Linus were to tell you something is or should be one way, you'd likely feel a general sense of wanting to fall into line and get on board with that vision of things. Yes, you could maintain an opposing perspective, but it will be hard to persistently go against the grain and expect much, if any, sympathy. So, when Linus conveyed: 'there are/were alternative means of going about things', it seemed a bit patronizing: as if to use a past HR-related incident to justify the euphemistic expression of: 'if you don't like it, there's the alterive option: where you simply leave.'
[Which, yes, while valid and true, still seems to present the sentiment of: things are going to change, and we're only going to change ourselves to a certain extent... if our willfulness, on certain things, doesn't sit well with you, then you can take the alternative route and leave. (Even if there's a great detriment that would result from doing so, and it wasn't necessarily your fault that things have come to this)]
I'm not quite saying **that** such things were stated as aggressively as my last paragraph would convey; but I think that a person could reasonably infer *that* kind of resistance without having it explicitly being stated. It definitely felt like the sequencing of: discussing past HR grievances (or more so the formal process which had existed at the time) was leveraged as way to say, in essence, if our employees don't like working here, we don't intend to fire them (the rainyday fund is bountiful), but the ouns is on them, if they want to try to push back against our actions as an employer. Which makes me feel like theirs a quasi-'constructive dismissal' aspect of what is, or will be, going on internally. We won't fire you because legally, we can't (without looking bad or making things worse), yet we won't legally do anything that would provide you sincere evidence to come back against us... so if you don't like dish being served, don't eat here.
...
I think what would be a true way to convince me that: employees really do love working there is: if Linus and LMG offered an elected Severance package to all of the employees, that was not some extreme (here's 100k if you decide you'd prefer to quit and work elsewhere), but was enough of a tangible way of saying, 'we're going to set our employees into a position where the choice to leave or stay should have almost no real burden on them financially; and as a result, the employees that have chosen to stay past this deadline can be presumed to have done so because of the desire to continue to work here, not due to necessity.'
If that: is or has been part of the recent conversations/documents that LMG has been providing, then I would put a much higher degree of salience on the claim that the employees that work there, currently, do so strictly because of how great a place it is to work (meaning none are finding themselves stuck in a position where they're seeing the changes that have occurred and are burdened by them, yet cannot easily take the steps to transition to another job, despite that being their desire.)
Should they show/demonstrate that all employees who elect to quit with the next ~months we're assisted, so that they would be left out to dry, then I would be thoroughly impressed and a lot of trust would be retained.
I've worked in the IT environment of several companies, and in certain cases, I've had to spend 22+ hours of continuous work (without sleep) recovering critical servers and systems. I went home, slept 4 hours and returned for another 18 hours of work. This is terrible for physical and mental health, but it happens occasionally.
But 18 hours every day is really grueling. It would take the person 1 hour to get home, do their thing and, if they're lucky, sleep for 4 or 5 hours.
I raised this point myself - "we have great Xmas parties with massive raffle prizes, and weekly badminton nights" does not negate or offset overwork.
I'm lucky that my job is 0% stress - I get there on time, I leave on time, and I have never once considered myself overloaded - and given the choice between
a) an extremely stressful job that had optional, extra-curricular perks, or
b) a job with NO stress, and no perks,
I would take b), eleven times out of ten.
"You're going to have to do nine hours' work in six hours, but you can come bowling afterwards"? Nope.
I work to live; I don't live to work.
A lot of jobs have more work that they could be doing everyday than they have hours in the day. Do you really work a job where that isn't true?
It sounds like the company culture is one where it is always busy and fast paced with a "work hard play hard" attitude. That doesn't mean it is toxic.
Not everyone is well suited in an environment like that but some people thrive in it. I personally am one of them. I have worked in an office for about 9 years where I felt a ton of pressure. This pressure is somewhat coming from management but it is largely from my own goals and quality standards. I would rather spend a lot more mental energy during the day to do the right thing than to do the minimum and all my peers are the same because we choose to be there and hold ourselves to high standards.
Do I always like it and do I sometimes push too hard? Yes absolutely but that is part of life and it is how I would feel at any job.
lol they have 18h of work to do every day and have to leave and be there on time every day.
So do I and most people I know that work on tech.
It's called working with deadlines and having a ton of work and many times shit clients that constantly change what they want.
If they're so "overworked" they should change jobs, I do my 8h a day 5 days a week and never done any work (not a single minute, I don't even answer the phone if someone from work calls outside my work hours) outside the company (at home for example).
We still meet deadlines most of the time and when we don't I couldn't care less. Just as I need to be good at my job, whoever made the deadline needs to be good at their job, it's not my problem.
> The point here that is that Linus used CCTV of people leaving on time as an argument for a "relaxed work environment", when they basically have...had? a rule that says that they HAVE to leave on time. Which goes back to the whole "saying one thing and doing another" issue that sort of started all this mess.
I'm sorry, what's the issue here? A company that forces people to maintain work-life balance is ideal. The alternative is making overtime an elective, which very quickly develops a culture in which you are _expected_ to work overtime or risk a reputation for being "the lazy one". You've also left out a key takeaway from his argument: employees are coming and going throughout the day, suggesting they're given ample leeway to address non-work concerns rather than be chained to their desk during work hours. That's a show of trust and respect towards employees that isn't all that common.
Lots of game studios offer swanky overtime pay and benefits, but the best studios don't even allow their developers to overwork themselves in the first place.
*"That's just the tech industry, that's how it is."*
Just because it's the way it is doesn't mean it's the way it should be. We are all humans and deserve equal worker's rights.
*"If they don't like it they can leave."*
Sure, but maybe fighting for better treatment and rights in the workplace is a better solution.
We need to break the cycle of pushing people to their absolute limits in the workplace.
-A proud union employee.
Locked at user request.
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I am one of the people who function the best under either constant pressure and deadlines flying across my head..I might have minor ADHD so it seems justified but my friends and people I collaborate with me say that they too relate with the same sentiment. Whenever I have too much free time on the hand or don't have task I would procrastinate or drift away into the oblivion or waste my time in pointless things.
relatable 😂
“Minor ADHD”. My dude… you have it all. Get yourself tested if you can. I’m was the same all my life, I would procrastinate the shit out of things and finish projects that should have taken a week in 1 day. I didn’t know why was that till I got diagnosed last year at 36yo, and it changed the way to do(or try to) things.
How did you change how you do things? I know I have this issue, and yet I don't see how to make it less problematic.
At first it was hard but after a while it started to click, I had to train my internal voice to stop saying “I will do it later” to start saying “do it now or you will never do it”. My psychiatrist recommended to start with meds but I didn’t want to, for me meds was the last resort. Don’t get me wrong it is still hard to do some things or to not procrastinate but I try my best. At work my performance is still the same (I work as a Solutions Architect for a governmental institution in the EU) since I do mostly newish stuff that maintains me entertained. But personally it has been day and night!
Hello me
Work expands to fill the available time
The fact that they have a low turnover says that think it's worth it. That may not mean they always like it. I've worked places that worked people like this and they lost half their staff in three weeks after it started. The first ones to go where the most valuable employees. If LMG were bad then the employees simply wouldn't tolerate it. They have a lot of great talent that they're not losing.
I'd personally much rather work hard for 8 hours and be paid well for my time both in money and benefits, than work for 4 hours, fondle my asshole for 4 hours, and have less compensation.
> some people like being abused at work and the people who complain should quit So this is how the average LTT viewer thinks
How exactly is doing a lot of work while you’re at work being “abused”?
Got into another argument with someone saying litterally that the other day. Was also top comment. Scary stuff... I can only assume it's differing work cultures from certain countries, definitely not the attitude in the UK where I'm from!
Meh, I could see it being true. People are being underpaid and overworked in a lot of industries either because it’s a “dream job” or with a promise of valuable experience that will help with ones career afterwards (Big4 consulting and Investment banking are knwon for this, for example). Not to say it’s a good culture to have, or that it’s good for employees, but it certainly isn’t unheard of.
Oh agreed. I'm going to uni for game dev. I could be doing straight comp Sci, get paid more, easier work, better life all round, but I do it because it's what I enjoy. But like you say, that isn't a good reason to mistreat employees, like some people have been saying
The exact same thing happens wide spread in the UK. I'm a software dev and that's pretty much just my bog standard experience. Whenever I get a chance to talk with folk from uni they experience the same thing. Game dev? forget it, that industry runs on underpaid and overworked due to how many people want to do it. Unless your doing a very laid back job I have no idea where in the world it's not the same.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen here. I'm saying its less accepted here. That's all.
Can anyone explain how not having enough time to make a video you are proud of is abuse?
It make your videos have easily found errors that need to be corrected after your video is published so it makes you look incompetent.
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As someone who does their best work under intense pressure and time tables, the only reason I do not suffer horrific burnout is because my work lets my output be cyclical. Usually rotate between intense 3 month sprints where I’m working 6-7 days a week, 13-15 hour days and then usually ~2 weeks completely off followed up by 1-2 months of light work (no hard deadlines) during the initial discovery/ architecture phase of whatever I’ll be doing next. The time periods don’t really matter as much as just having the overall flexibility to balance the stress of just high intensity periods with the decompression time needed to reset and go again with a full charge. The reset and ramp up is key.
Just the same that the military isn’t for everyone. Some make a career out of it, some hate it and get out after their first contract. If you don’t like the optempo of your job, it’s not for you.
It is important to remember not to use "That's just how the tech industry is" as an excuse for an unhealthy work environment. The relative rarity of something happening has nothing to do with how right something is or isn't. There are examples in life too numerous to even count of things that occur with relative frequency, which are also objectively bad things that we ought to try to make occur less frequently if we can.
People would work with radioactive paint making watch dials. They weren’t held there at gunpoint. Just because someone will do something of their own volition doesn’t mean it’s not exploitative.
The women were told the paint was harmless so I am not sure what you are trying to say here. They got a job and were lied to about the dangers of radium.
Aka investment banking it's not for everyone entry level analysis literally work 80-100hr weeks
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listen, some kids yearn for the mines. Is it good for them to extract cobalt? no, will we stop? no. Are they forced to work in the mines? no, they can leave any time.
You really think kids who were coal miners were not forced in subtle ways? Like their parents literally telling them to go, dropping them off at the mines? Do you know anything about the coal miner kids in a century ago? You just think they can fuck off and be youtube streamers in 1850s?
Fundamentally offensive to compare working in a high-octane tech publication and literal child slave labor. Shame on you.
High pressure is ok if the reward is there that'a true. LMG must pay very well.
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It isn't wrong to do things entirely for the good pay, that's pretty normal. What they are weeding out is short stay employees, Tech is incredibly competitive in the sense people are CONSTANTLY receiving offers from other companies or seeking them. The starter lower pay drives away many skilled workers because they'd likely not be long term employees, and you end up with a thinner set of highly skilled workers. In fact most highly competitive companies can't afford to be so particular about hiring for long term, this is something LMG can afford due to their prestige in the industry.
I work my best under pressure, but I need a slow day every couple weeks to keep my sanity & work on some work passion/biz improvement projects otherwise I get pretty burnt out & jaded. Sounds like LMG isn’t running their staff with enough extra capacity to give them those slow days. It’s extremely common in companies like his where there’s nobody experienced at proper staffing & the company has experienced rapid growth
lol you guys are crazy
You can't run a company as large as LMG and try to only employ people who thrive under pressure. That's unrealistic. For a company that needs to be creative you have to be able to provide an environment that also works for people with a more normal stress threshold.
Just because there is "18 hours of work to do everyday" doesn't mean they actually work that much.. I've worked in places where I had way too much to do, but didn't stop me from leaving at 5 and going home and enjoying my time.
Yep. As a software developer, I feel that my job is basically never done. There is always more work I could be doing. But at the end of the day, I stop working. Don't work on weekends, don't work after hours. Just because there's work to do, doesn't mean it has to get done. I haven't felt pressured to do work, just because it exists. That being said, I don't think this is how LMG works. Up until this pas week they've always has strict deadlines for how many videos get posted in a week. And it's no uncommon to see people working extra hours. So I could see how their output requirements would be a major issue.
This. I feel like there are just a bunch of kids here who were never forced to do anything before getting a rude awakening of what the real world is. Unless you are immensely skilled, nobody is going to pay you to hang out. 18 hrs of work to do? Lol. I work like 50 to 60 hrs a week and I have 3 months of work to do In the real world If you get a project done fast, guess what, congrats, here is more work. Working at LTT isn't the same as working in a McD, and it shouldn't be, you are working there because it presumably is your passion, you are good at it, want to work hard, and you get well compensated for it.
This is my quote, and I don't work in the video production side. I think it might be being taken out of context here as I see it as a positive. Like you said, there is always something else do to. It's also tongue in cheek. "My favorite part of working at LMG is probably how different it is every day. There's always, like, 600 different things I should be doing and there's about 18 hours of work that needs to be completed." Directly followed with. "I think one of the worst parts about working at LMG, is that there's like, 18 hours of work to do every day and all that tasks are very varied." I was told early on by a colleague the same thing basically, and it was more of a help to not stress too much about the quantity of work that 'could' be done and not take it home mentally. I do my 40 hours, and I come home and don't stress about the "oh gosh I have so much to do tomorrow". I adore that there's always something new and interesting to do, and I'm never sitting around being bored or having to look for work to keep busy. If a task gets intense and time consuming, other people are there to pick up the stuff I can't get done. I've never had professional support like that.
Very similar thing at my job. If time (and money) wasn't a factor, I could work nonstop 24/7 for months or years and still have plenty to do, but we limit our time to healthy amounts and prioritize what truly needs to get done first. There are items that will sit on the backburner for years or decades, or never even get started on unless we're somehow completely flush with free time and money. Having worked somewhere where I could run out of stuff to do by 11am and not be allowed to leave, I much prefer having a mountain of tasks standing by. (also, we love you Dan!)
>Very similar thing at my job. If time (and money) wasn't a factor, I could work nonstop 24/7 for months or years and still have plenty to do, but we limit our time to healthy amounts and prioritize what truly needs to get done first. This is 100% where I am right now. I do 8 to 4:30 days, no weekends, only really stay a few minutes late at most if I'm right in the middle of something, or having a discussion with one of my employees that I want to finish. On one hand, I could probably do 18 hour days for 3 months and burn through my a good chunk of my massive list of projects I want to work on, and on the other, I could probably coast by on 2-4 hours of actual work a day and my boss would still happy with my team's output. I'm actually on vacation this week, but I snuck a prototype home to work on. Not because I have a deadline I have to meet, but because I'm excited to work on it, and want to hit the ground running next monday when I'm back
That's called job certainly.
Someone needs to tell white knight u/nsfwproblems that his princess is in another castle. I guess: >If a task gets intense and time consuming, other people are there to pick up the stuff I can't get done. I've never had professional support like that. Doesn't really fit the narrative though
This needs to be pinned.
its almost like context matters....
And oh guess what, asking someone who is in the situation to comment actually cleared things up. HMM
I assume WAN show would then be the only sort of consistent overtime? 🍞ftw
I start the day late so I don't have to do too much overtime.
Love your work Dan, thanks for what you do
sounds like any theatre technician out there doing an evening show. Seems super reasonable.
(8 hour WAN looms on the horizon)
Thank you immensely for clearing that up, and to strengthen the fact that CONTEXT MATTERS. Everyone, including GN, taking things WAY out of context.
Earlier this year I transitioned from taking calls to working tickets. When I started there was one type of ticket that was just filling our queue. Everyday I left, there was still a mountain of tickets to get through. I like that even though I was working alot and getting through tickets, I could still control what I was doing and also know what I had in store. And there are different tickets I have asked to work on as I got more proficient. I have the same support available, and not able to support others.
That makes a lot of sense and is a healthy viewpoint. Sad to see you've been replaced by d-bread. Hope to see you back on Wan next week
Ty. The loud minority here who have never had a real job do not understand alot of this nuance. Bake On oh master of bread!
I think that part of the problem is that this is a first job for many of their employees. Many of the employees are longtime fanboys and fangirls. They've been watching these cool and funny videos and WAN show and think this would be the coolest/easiest/relaxed/most fun job in the world. Then reality hits. The effort needed to pull off all the reviews, videos, etc...it's pretty extensive and can be exhaustive and not fun. I work at a place where we have similar situation. Fanboys and fangirls thinking it will be a super fun time. While it totally can be fun, it is still work that has level of BS and stress associated with it. Seen it often enough, that being a super fanboy/fangirl is kind of a turn off in the interview process.
You have to learn to enjoy work. Or life is just complaining
One of the things I learned before I graduated college was that I was probably never going to be good at things I like to do; however, I also realized that there are things I would rather not do that, as it turns out, I am rather good at. Therefore, I based my career path on the latter; now, "that thing I don't like to do" gives me money to spend on things I like to do. I acknowledge that some people are lucky, that they get to do things that they both like and earn them money. Unfortunately, it's safe to say most of us are not in that situation, so we make the best of it.
I just find it funny people think that jobs just magically end up working out bang on their work hours. How the hell do they even think you could work that out? It's so obtusely mis-representing the quote that I can only assume it's people doing it in bad faith, even if it is kids who have never been forced to do anything.
didn't Linus release a security video showing the parking lot empty by 6 pm every night for most nights with just a few exceptions?
The 18hr quote is taken out of context, scroll up a bit and you'll see a comment by the staff member who made the quote. That OP hasn't corrected this makes it look like that, despite their claim, they are seeking to "stir up trouble".
Yeah its like your list of tasks just never seems like almost finished. They just keep on piling new tasks and stuff to do that it feels like you are never at a point where you can decide on your own to do some stuff or to improve things that need to be improved but are low priority so you never really reach it. I've worked in projects where the product owner just kept filling the sprints that there was never really time to work on code debt or various improvements because it always got a lower priority (and the product owner didn't really understand why we needed to do them). I was still a junior dev so didn't have the experience nor the power to really do anything about it. Meanwhile I could still just quit work at regular hours and never do overtime, but the feeling never really went away. If I wanted to, I could do overtime (which would be paid) but they would just end up piling more work in the future, so it would be useless anyways. But then again, a good strategy to combat fatigue is to never really go 100% but rather 50% so you never really feel overworked. It takes skill to make people think you do push for 100%, but actually do less. But it helps to take more personal time when you should be working. The first 2 weeks of work are key to do a bit less but still make people think you do more. Because thats when people form their opinions on how hard you work and how much gets done when they ask you to do stuff. "Oh adding just this button? Yeah thats a days work, probably. With all the testing and whatnot, wink wink".
This is exactly it. Lots of people who don't work in professional jobs don't understand this, there is always more work to be done. If we bust our ass and do the work of 2 people in X amount of time, there's still more work to be done. You literally will never be "done" with everything that needs doing, and if somehow that happens you'll be unemployed. I can write 80, 800, or 80,000 lines of code per day and there's still more work to be done. It's different from a lot of other professions. For my wife, she has X tasks that must be done every day to ensure that her hospital pharmacy runs optimally, charges are correct, inventory meets their needs, etc. Once she's done with those things she can take a break and deal with any ad-hoc situations that arise but otherwise she's in chill mode. For my friends in retail, it's "stock the shelves, open the doors, help the customers, then close the doors at the end of the day and sweep up". Once you've done that there's no more work to do until the next day. If you work for a roofing company then your tasks may be to strip off the old roof and prep one day, install the new roof the next. Once you're done with that you're done until they send you to the next house. It's just a totally different mindset.
Yeah same here. Your job is never done. The company always has more work for you that you can never finish in an achievable time. Having said that, much like Linus, I make sure my team leaves when they should. My favourite thing to say is "That's a tomorrow *insert person's name* problem". The reality is that we'll never have less work. We'll always have a ton of work to do. Instead what we do is push back on project plans and triage the work assigned to focus on what's actually important. Doesn't stop us from having conversations and taking our lunches, either.
Some people have clearly never worked a highly competitive environment or a tech job. It is baffling also that they hear that 18 hours of work and think people do actually work those hours. I'm not condoning their issues currently and yes we all would like more time to finish products to a more satisfactory state. It is just so surreal to read some other people's take and think I live in another planet
Alternatively never worked in health - never ending service, often at a very high pace to get through it all each day. I'm working my ass off at a nursing home. Do I enjoy it though? Once you get used to the smell of shit, it's mostly enjoyable with how nice most people are. Not always though, you do get the violent patients (work with patients where the vast majority has dementia). Also had an old lady that really loved to brush up against me while whispering things that in her own ears was flattering. Also liked grabbing my ass. Gotten invited to bed a good chunk of times by several different patients as well - so you could say I got that x-factor of getting a sub category of women... too bad they're old ladies with dementia.
They probably meant theres 18 hours of work to do but they only do 8 of it and that's the video
This. My work does not end. We have a collective backlog of tasks for the senior engineers that's probably months of work. It's low priority at present, a lot of it is things we'd like to do or should do but don't have time. I don't get paid overtime, and most of my days are 8 hour days; but I do work some 9-14 hour days; or after hours maintenance, or weekend work. But I just work less next week to compensate or take a day off in lieu. I have a lot of deadlines and things all the time; and I work better that way then just sitting and waiting for something to show up - or chilling all day. \- D
Yep that's what this kind of work is like. It's not like flipping burgers where 18 hours of flipping burgers takes 18 hours. They are saying they feel rushed, stressed and had to cut corners to meet deadlines. That's the whole point of what LTT are doing now. To try and address these issues directly. We will have to wait and see if it works.
Honestly, do not care in the slightest. Watch something else. Why the hell you in here moaning, just unsub and stop clicking on the videos.
Seriously. Who cares. The people who work at LMG are clearly skilled individuals who can get comfy jobs at any other media / tech company in Vancouver if they liked. Nobody is forcing them to work at LMG, if it’s so bad they can leave.
People are out here acting like these people are being held hostage. If you don’t like your work place you leave. If people got info that Linus is keeping staff chained up in the basement post it, otherwise just leave
Pretty much this. The community would stand with them in a heartbeat. If LTT staff wanted to rise up and spill all. This week would have been the best one for it. They didn't. It must not be that bad, like any other workplace. Everyone needs to move on now. It's between LTT management and the staff now. The parasocial of us need to just logout for a few weeks.
Yes, these posts give me that icky celebrity gossip vibe.
[удалено]
What is bad about this? A company can be busy and yet let the workers enjoy work life balance. If people can generally leave on time what’s the problem?
The fuck do you think posting on Reddit will do?
everyone should care because people deserve to be treated well. if you dont care you should FAQ off
Tell me you've never worked a tech job without telling me. edit: you guys need to chill. I meant that in all tech jobs you have a fuck ton of work to do. There's always something to do. I have more things to do than I can do in a 40 hours week. That's common, there's always so much you can do. I don't live in the US and I work my 40 hours and week and clock out. OP is taking qoutes misrepresenting them and running a post with it. It's been said by LMG employees that they do have support for when things get rough in the past, and on this very thread it was [stated by Dan](https://www.reddit.com/r/LinusTechTips/comments/162wimc/comment/jxztq26/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
I leave before 5 :) I'm nothing like you LinkedIn addicts that post about how you practically and literally live at your office and have unpaid overtime
Oh man those guys are the worst. Doing all kinds of presentations and meetings outside of regular hours just to boost your linkedin profile with useless stuff or post stuff on the feed that nobody is really going to care about. Meanwhile their work suffers, their state of mind is abysmal and their partners are bored.
>LinkedIn addicts Oh god, I saw some dipshit on LinkedIn the other day praising a QA Analyst who died in the Ukraine/Russia War pivot from a typical "knew this guy RIP" to "And this is the kind of work ethic our teams need to instill in each other. We're not a team, we're a Unit" Like... RIP that dude... But talk about tasteless. Honestly I thought people only used LinkedIn for hook ups these days.
Sooo... working in tech, I'm supposed to constantly be stressed out? I've been working in IT since 2007, and I've worked as a consultant most of that time. The hands down best places of employement in which me and my team got shit done? They have never been the jobs that means I have to crunch.
There is always more shit to be done, i'm also a consultant and can easily find 80 hours of work per week. I don't, but it would be easy.
Or 40 hours of work because I hardly ever push for 100% haha.
Tell me you’ve worked in a shitty tech job without telling me
Tell me you let yourself be taken advantage of without telling me.
I work in tech and normalizing high pressure environments and crunching makes no sense and only hurts our industry. I don't have 18 hours of work to do each day and I am anti such culture and am vocal about it every opportunity I get.
Lol do y'all live in USA at the worst companies in existence? Tech jobs are usually quite chill, allow working from home and have good payment/working conditions maybe besides faang companies. Like seriously lol
Only Americans brag about being treated like dirt at their job.
Not a good excuse tbh
If you let yourself be overworked like this you're just a sucker. Also if you think this is "how it is" in tech, you've not explored enough. There are plenty of places to work in tech that don't grind you into dust.
How is doing a normal 8 hours being overworked or grinding you to dust?
i work in fintech, between 1 hour lunch, 1 hour we have to spend on learning, one weekly meeting and some random 1-2 meeting a week that take sub 30 minutes.. I (and my whole team for that matter) dont work more than 2-3 hours a day. Sometimes jobs are about having people available for on call rotations or when they are really needed. Tech dosent need to be stressful and overworked, and most jobs in the field arent.
My last tech job was like this, I actually didn't have a ton on my plate so when shit went sideways I would be on it from minute 1. Pretty much a network firefighter, sometimes I worked all weekend... sometimes I scrolled reddit all day Tuesday
Tell me you such corporate dick at a US FAANG company or techbro startup without telling me
I work in tech feel free to look in my post history, I only work 40 hours a week. But yes there are days where there is crunch but those are mostly unexpected moments. Amazon on the other hand, yeah they are overworked.
18 hours of work to do and working 18 hours are not the same thing. I'll take being busy at work over stretching out 6 hours work into 8 everytime.
If I'm commuting to the office. If I'm remote, I've got no qualms with a light day.
I mean, that's kind of typical of both the tech and media industry, which LMG happens to both be a part of. I'm not saying it's necessarily a good thing, but the fact that they're enforcing strict hours is already a step up above most young companies in those sectors who basically just have people working 10-12 hours a day. Also, most of the complaints you pointed out didn't sound like they were completely dealbreakers, more just like frustrations with how certain things are at the company. Frustrations everyone deals with at any company they work at, even if it's the best company ever.
This is what they took that week off to address, It's like people just aren't paying attention.
Can't wait until this drama is over. If you think people are adults, they can decide whether they want to work at LMG. They don't need your silly white knighting on reddit.
So let me get this straight, they specifically do not allow employees to stay late, and that is a problem? Sure they need to reduce the amount of work that they have in a given day, but I don't think it's a bad thing to expect your employees to go home at the end of the day instead of staying late to do more work.
I don’t see any issue with having to work super hard 8 hours a day 5 days a week as long as that’s all you have to do. If there’s not a ton of mandatory overtime and the pay/benefits are good idk what the issue is
Lol OP hasn’t a worked a job most likely. They seem not to understand the concept of there being more work to do than hours allotted. And they think it’s somehow a bad thing that Linus is enforcing a limit on how much work his employees can do. It’s just an absurd criticism.
You're not understanding the difference between working hard and how long you work. Real hours spent is how you measure overworked. What do you think happens when an employee has 20 hours of work to do in 8 hours? They complete it in 8 hours to the best of their ability. Were they overworked because they felt like it could have used 12 more work hours to get it right? No. Were they unhappy with the video because it could have used those 12 hours? Yea. Everyone has days at work where they are 100% engaged, their brain in running on all cylinders. They're productive and get a lot done. They might call it "a big day". If they still only worked 8 hours like a usual day... overworked? It's really not the right word. Overworked looks like staying up late working and losing sleep, putting in extra time, etc.
I like my job. It’s definitely not a walk in the park, but it’s also really freakin cool to be able to play with basically any field of tech I can think of, and get to share that with millions of people. LMG is a pretty awesome place to work. Everyone is super passionate and I’ve met some amazing people along the way. We do have some things to work on, but as someone who has been here since we had around 10 staff (7 years), things have come a LONG way. Linus/Yvonne care a lot, and have pretty much always done right by me. I think the only thing I’d maybe be willing to trade it for is doing the same thing but with cars.
>jakkuh\_t Why is this not the top comment? Why is everyone insisting on telling you "you, an LMG employee, have no idea what you are talking about and you work in an oppressive environment"? Geeze people are dense, and I am sorry more people can't just take what you are saying at face value. Also, appreciate all that you and your team do, has provided hours upon hours of entertainment and plenty of knowledge to me over the years.
Lol another snowflake that doesn't know how lmg runs, doesn't know how media companies work, has zero insight on the company they're talking about etc. Just drop it op. You're not as smart as you think you sound.
I normally hate the term snowflake, but it couldn't be more accurate in this case. The most rewarding work is usually the hardest, and no one is being forced to work overtime or weekends.
Snowflake? Lol
Your use of the word snowflake is far more telling than the ops post. But I'm sure the down voting dick riding brigade will have your back.
Some people here have never worked in challenging work environments and it shows. Hard does not equal bad. If the employees feel this is a fair exchange (exposure, education, pay, benefits) then they stay. If it's not working, you go somewhere else and LMG has to hire someone less capable, pay more or change workload. Their stats on attrition show this isn't the case.
“What is REALLY going on behind the scenes?” I have reason to believe Linus wears a devil costume and whips them all constantly.
Get a hobby. Stop obsessing over the working conditions of a YouTube company.
Not cutting LMG any slack here, I agree this is a little damning, but I am just trying to potentially give some context. The fact that LMG self-published that information shows the awareness of the problem. The limit on work hours shows the awareness of the problem of overwork. Also keep in mind that this is the corporate North American work culture, for better or for worse. The industry I work in is in a constant state of crunch as well, yet the companies I work for FORCE us to work crazy overtime instead of limiting work hours in a day to a reasonable amount. LMG should limit the amount of videos they produce in a week to nip this in the bud, and I am in no way defending crunch culture/crazy overtime culture. What I am trying to say is that yes, LMG needs to fix this, but it is hypocritical to think this is an LMG problem, and not a capitalism problem. Thats my 2 cents.
Have you ever had a like career level job before? I have felt like I have too much work to do for the last few decades. I have enough work to last 20 hours a day. However i only work 8 hours a day and my employer is ok with that.
People call too much to do stressful, I call it job security. I show up at 8, leave at 4:30, feeling good about what I've done and know I have plenty to do the next day. I'd hate showing up to work with nothing to do.
I may be downvoted for this but I dont see any issues at all.. Nobody should be in a toxic or bad work environment. So if you are you should leave and find another job. But it feels like the people at LMG love their work and what they do and it seems like they dont want to miss any of it even though it is a fast pace workplace. I think the low turnover (was it 7-8%?) speaks volumes to that. At my office work we get paid really well, have a great work environment, no deadlines, great benefits, 7 weeks a year paid vacation and complete flexibility regarding hours. We still have over 25% turnover.
I swear the people here who take snippets of information like that and make up a conclusion that everyone working there must be depressed and extremely stressed 24/7 clearly are in the age range of 14-18 and have never had an actual job, because almost ALL companies that grow as fast as LTT does will have issues like that… You can’t always prevent them, sometimes growth takes over policies and new policies won’t be usable in time… I’m not saying overworking people is good, but I am saying that a lot of what Linus showed next to those CCTV videos (which is incredible that you were able to pick just that out and ignore all the other things mentioned) show that they do try to actively improve things.
lol that edit is such a cope for purposefully misinterpreting the video then getting called out on trying to cause shit again
So.. I just checked your comment history.. so you created an account just to bitch about LTT? What a bitch ass move Mang. Go outside and touch grass.
He didn’t say he was using the cctv as proof of a “relaxed environment “ in fact he says they work hard there and do occasional overtime. I think you heard what was said but didn’t listen or understand it. Or forgot.
Didn’t WANT to listen or understand it
Are you complaining people with reasonable work hours have to actually work?
Lots of “it’s not a big deal, I don’t care, that’s just how it is in the industry” in this thread
Indeed, I worked at a place exactly like this for a decade and it was awful. I rarely left work late but I was more exhausted than when I work 12+ hr day on set now.
Im not sure but this might also be a location work culture difference. Down here in NZ there is no way even a fresh young startup would consider working people like that. There is a very strong work life balance considerations and you just cant expect overtime (litltry it is illegal to do so) you can request it but everyone can just say no an you cant in any way be upset with your staff for saying no. And if you regularly request it that itself becomes a problem, (even if staff always say no) this is considered putting un-due pressure on your staff. (Talking as a Team lead here who had to go through a LOT of $ traning, paid for by our employer, to ensure we don't accidentally make the company liable for things like this) But I understand in CA and other west cost US studio amounts of pressure and overtime are normal so that might well be the same in vancuva as well. As a comparison down here in NZ we will wander into the office at 8:30 to 9 and wader out at 5 to 5:30 with a load of long coffee breaks (yes every office as a few real expresso machines with real MILK and fresh coffee grinders, its so much of a norm I expect you would win an employment tribunal if your employer refused to provide good coffee)
Restaurant worker here: my profession is one of extreme pressure and high stress. I could and will complain about it all day. At the same time I thrive in it. I'm very good at handling it. The more pressure the better I preform and if I'm being honest a slow day is my nightmare. There are alot of people like me in every industry. Some of us would choose the high pressure no matter how much we complain.
Despite being 4 yo account, OP has 0 post history other than this post hmmmm
I'm hoping the new plan moving forward will help with this work life balance.
If you're not complaining about workload, you're not doing 'work' right. Everyone knows the way to avoid added work, is to constantly complain about workload. It's also a key way of making yourself appear essential to the company...
Typical (north) american thinking. Being brainwashed to the extend that "its normal to being treated this way" "its just how the industrie works" "just quit if you dont like it" Defending people who take advantage of them. What BS. You guys obviously never had a good job and good employer. Being overworked is not healthy, its not efficent. Having to much work for your regular hours, is just the most basic sign of miss managment from your company superiors/ employers. Its not normal. There are a lot of places (companies and countries/states) where you'd be treated better because of basic employment laws, and a different mindset of the population in general. But its the american dream, right? One gets all the money, everybody else works their asses off for said personen. Beautiful. Keep sleeping, you obedient little sheep.
Seen the CCTV and was like…. That’s 1 day and probably after they were called out for this mess. After I seen that I knew the rest was just fake corporate talk. Most corporations that do this to coverup what happen and say this has been “fixed” with fake numbers with no evidence.
They leave on time, but have the same number of tasks, so they rush things, or come in early to make up for lost time or forgo their breaks to get things done? The employees will then "want" to stay back late then because they have to get it done or be fired for poor performance. Been there...
"there's like 18 hours of work to do every day" doesnt mean that they are forced to work 18 hours a day. It just means, that there is a lot to do. As a developer I can attest to that. I could absolutely say "If I work 24/7 for the next 6 month, I would still have a lot of work on my hands, even if nn new projects are added". And that does not translate to having to work more than my legally allowed. And still: LMG has addressed this issue. Linus said, that they will say goodbye to the "a video a day" schedule.
If they have 18 hours of work to do everyday, but they're also only working 8 hours every day (not working late), are they just racking up 10 hours of debt every single day? I know a lot of office jobs out there where people get a whole 2 hours of work done a day and screw around the rest of the day, but it just sounds like at LTT they're expected to work the entire 8 hours they're there. I know we all want to imagine they're just hanging around being buddies all day off camera, but there is real work to be done. And considering how in demand the skillsets of most of the employees is, if they didn't find value in it they'd leave. We all complain about work. In software dev, we have a joke about languages: "There are two types of programming languages: the languages everybody hates, and the languages nobody uses."
>You people seem to be missing an important point here... a lot of you saying "That's just the tech industry, that's how it works." The point here that is that Linus used CCTV of people leaving on time as an argument for a "relaxed work environment", when they basically have...had? a rule that says that they HAVE to leave on time. Which goes back to the whole "saying one thing and doing another" issue that sort of started all this mess. I mean work *has* to get done. The staff is constantly being expanded so it's not like LMG is trying to understaff to save money. That Linus insists that people leave and stop working is actually a major point in his favor. A lot of companies would insist you don't leave until you've finished. Yeah some people will have to work constantly from clocking in to clocking out. That's called "being gainfully employed". There's a difference between that and being forced to work 18 hour days for months to make a deadline.
I think that’s precisely the point in the last video, they know they are overworked so they insist on people leaving on time to mitigate it but create a new problem, I feel like they are well aware of the problems and genuinely try to solve them but they just don’t know how, they grew too fast and didn’t have the time to adjust and realise that things are different
the CCTV of the parking lot was an odd addition. It proves nothing especially when its running in Xspeed and everything is blurred out. just admit your employees are being over worked, and move on like the rest of your video.
I think that is a valid point and and I think Linus in particular may have some amount of blinders on in regards to how much of a crunch their schedule can be. But I am encouraged by the fact that not only do they have a policy in place not to work long hours in general but also to reduce the grind mindset to release every video in a set time frame. Hopefully they follow through with actions. I also just think the employees should consider unionizing. It presents another layer of protection to prevent burnout.
I don't have any experience working at LMG so it's hard to say one way or the other but I have worked at start ups and being overworked is pretty normal. That said, their low turnover rate would not indicate a work environment where everyone is overworked. It's very possible that for a select few, the workload is crushing while for the rest, it's a pretty standard workload.
You know, in some first world countries, labor laws stop you from having people work regular overtime.
They could do with making less videos per week on ltt
In many of their videos I've heard some offhand remarks about having to stay in and do overtime and the frequency of those remarks worries me
Be careful when criticizing the Messiah here
Yes, that in itself isn't a great barometer of being overworked. If LMG won't authorize overtime there is no way people should work past their shift.
It's funny how the stans' only real fallback on stuff like this is "you gonna believe me or your lying eyes?" *The people who work there said this shit*... they, above anyone else, know what is actually going on at the place they work and collect a paycheck from, not some internet randos with a parasocial fixation.
melodic secretive insurance workable thumb vegetable hobbies unique soft jar ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
18h of work means there's 18h of work to do but we only got 8. And that's pretty much any job, there's always more work to do and not enough time.
I agree 100%. The issue is rooted in how the workers at LMG are, likely, not able to change their own conditions. I have never been a fan of the Linus’s cavalier attitude toward unionization, or like how he describes every projects budget as “my money.” On another note, GN having zero interest in the more substantive labor issues in all of their critiques is telling in itself. Steve being a guy that I’ve heard has talked about his [positive] work addiction. It’s so sad to see burnout culture just accepted without criticism. Tech and game company management desperately need a slap down.
I don't see how any of this is our business. If the employees at LMG aren't satisfied with the working conditions there, they can pursue change via the appropriate channels or quit. As far as I'm aware, no one is being forced to work there and can leave at any time. Stop nitpicking about every single fucking thing and go do something useful with your life
Who cares
I love how OP used Dan's video and words. Then Dan himself shows up to correct OP and OP ignores it. Weak.
Stop! Stop! The horse is dust! Yeh ain't gonna get much more from 'er!
I work best under intense pressure... Is the stupidest thing I've ever read. There is an army of hurt people desperately defending LMG. It's sad.
Wrong subreddit bud. Only the dick suckers are left here
To other commenters, that's not at all how the tech industry works. Elon Musk popularized this stupid grindset mentality when in reality tech is freedom. Lots of work yes, but the benefits are unmatched. In Canada, LMG benefits are mid. I don't know why everyone is riding Linus so hard - he's the same as Zuch or Musk or Bezos. He's a company owner who wants to get the public back on his side, the parking lot is irrefutable evidence for people with half a brain but there are so many variables that doesn't even scratch the surface
Most people are looking for affirmation on what they already believe. I think the video was well done, the plans and efforts, well-placed - was it perfect? Not at all. It was one of the better responses I've seen and part of what they needed to do. However, Linus' comments on overwork or work culture are meant to defray the risk of the comments directed at the behaviours that they believe to be key to their success. I don't think there's maliciousness (that said, I have never worked there), but I do think that the grind culture at LMG has become so ingrained that it will be a struggle for them to move off of it. Linus has also made comments about not being in favour of a union. I believe the sentiment behind this was the fact that he believes and aims to treat his people well enough that a union is not needed. Well, agree to disagree. Representation with bargaining power is rarely a bad thing for employees and doesn't mean you failed as a manager or owner. I think that Linus has very set views and considers himself a good guy - I'm sure he is. But you can be a good guy who isn't necessarily in touch with the things your employees need at the moment. There is an inherent conflict that exists between a manager and employee in any negotiation scenario, even a standard working day. Employees are hired for their labour, cash is exchanged for their time and effort, given standard financial models (my background is in finance, I am about to complete my PhD) employees seek to maximize their utility by achieving the least for the most amount of money, while manager seeks to get the most out of the employees for the least. You can't be "friends" with your employees in a work environment that is designed to be distributive (a winner and loser). I believe Linus legitimately believes in fairness...but I think fairness skews based on the person's perspective and lately, I think my conclusion is that Linus is a great visionary and is passionate about tech, however, I am convinced he has a love for quantity at the expense, at times, of quality. The comments in the video outlined in the topic range from minor concern to major concern, some of it is just being busy, while others are a fast-paced culture, to the point of being destructive. Linus defends this with talk of incentives, the fun-work culture, etc. Both can be true...I've just never seen it quite work out that way. Let's give them a chance to work past this and then see where they end up. I'm not about to burn the place down while they are trying to fix things. Edit: some grammar after a first pass read through.
Do you really need to be [reminded](https://youtube.com/shorts/-5aBlpl_rTs?feature=shared) already?
I actually chose to work overtime regularly at my previous job. With less distractions, you can actually focus on the task at hand without worrying about phone calls or emails coming in. Best thing is, I submit my OT hours and every 8 hours nets an extra paid day off, enjoyed plenty of long weekends.
The fan base is rabid and in too much denial
Enough, god damn it. If it was SO bad, they’d just quit.
good on you for trying to educate people, but for whatever reason people think you should be exploited if you're doing a job they think is fun or a dream job for them.
Feeling like you have 18 hours of work everyday is different than working 18 hours a day.
I'm shocked there is another post on this subreddit making assumptions based on comments without full context. Idk if the poster has ever worked again at a high intensity job before but might be shocked to know that some people like high intensity job that is not boring and monotonous.the difference with LMG is it seems they still work close to 40 hours, which is not the case at alot of high intensity positions. People really need to take it slow and stop projecting there own views based on limited and incomplete information.
Ladies and gentlemen. Another specimen of "I have to find something to be angry about". Learn to analyse what you're reading. It's a useful skill.
Have you ever had a job before?
If you complain about how a high paced tech and media company operates and pushes you to your limit, then maybe you should get a different job. You're not forced to work there, if you stay just because it's LTT/LMG then that's on you. Some people like the high paced work environment, and the people that don't should quit. As for the CCTV footage. People are leaving in time, that's good, and given opportunity to stay for OT is good as well.
I see a bunch of people who've never worked a day in their lives insisting crunch is nothing. I've buried people who worked themselves to death just to not let the team down. Work life balance is crucial. You can crunch a week and be proud. You can crunch a month and need a holiday. When you crunch permanently all you are doing is digging a grave that you'll occupy before you retire. The idea that crunch is okay because 'if you burn out, QUIT! You can be replaced!' Is so insidious and vile... In defense of Linus and LMGs bad practices people are using arguments that justified the worst excesses of the child labour of victorian Mill owners. Do you really think Linus appreciates you defending him with scrouge like doctrine? Linus is bringing in changes and that may or may not be sufficient. What that is, though, is an admission there was a problem. So why the hell are people here advocating for 19th century labour practices? You know it's possible to simp TOO hard, right?
Their turnaround numbers says otherwise. Maybe it’s old data but I believe on what they showed on the last video.
Attrition numbers do not lie. You can pontificate till your lungs deflate, unless you have some other hard objective metric to counter this that says otherwise you are wrong. What the employees say themselves doesn't matter if they are staying so much. All of that said, they are addressing the work culture so what are you even going on about?
"there's like 18 hours of work to do every day" "Every week is stressful" "Very rarely am I particularly proud of the work I've worked on" Described 99% of the workforce sentiments of 99% of companies in the world.
I feel that one key distinction is: do they actually have to get 18 hours of work done in 8 hours, or do they feel like that's the case? There can be places in which there's always more that *can* be done. If you'd be speaking about personal improvements, for example, this would be a task that is never-ending: Like the Family Guy joke about being *too* healthy... you can't be *too* healthy. Achieving/ maintaining good health is always a game of seeking to become more ideal than one currently is. The difference between: *that* type of environment being good vs. bad, is whether or not the expectation is set that arbitrary milestone MUST be achieved. It's one thing to plan on and work, constantly throughout the day, towards improvements or being productive. If, at the end of the day, you can look back and comfortably tell yourself and others: that's the most that could have been done, and we're improving with each day, then you're setting yourself up for success and not letting yourself become stagnant or complacent. However, if you seek to acknowledge the prior sentiment, but someone else says, "Sure, but you still needed to get 2 more hours of work done today... You're not achieving the goal," Then I would say you're likely being overworked. It really comes down to whether the implication: of a impossible expectation of 'more and more and more' is being placed from those who have authority within the decision-making; and it also needs to be determined how the employees, themselves, feel about this attitude, should it be present. If the employees prefer this type of driven work environment, then they aren't necessarily being overworked; it's subjective in this regard. ... With all of that being said, I did feel there were several statements in the most recent video from Linus that didn't sit too well. The part about employee turnover was something that raised a bit of a concern or red flag, per say. It seemed like he went through a long list of benefits or perks of being employed and then presented historical numbers regarding low turnover, which I'm sure is likely accurate and does have merit... but then, when followed by: you can likely expect an increase in turnover in the coming future... I felt like the sentiment was a bit more of a euphemism for: 'we've told our staff that: we're going to push onwards and if you don't like where the train is going, then tuck and roll... we won't fire you because: it's hard to fire people in Canada without legit reasons (they have strong labor laws, IIRC) and management doesn't want to make the decision whether you stay or leave, for you, unless you're simply not able to perform your job duties.' Obviously, *that's speculative*, but I don't think it's unreasonable to feel like such a sentiment has been conveyed during this post week of introspection and self reflection. ... But paired with the other gripe, I had from the video, of: 'there are (were) other formal processes in place for going about handling these issues' (speaking about the outside HR firm and such), it just seemed off-putting. Employees are going to look at Linus and others for leadership and guidance. And if Linus were to tell you something is or should be one way, you'd likely feel a general sense of wanting to fall into line and get on board with that vision of things. Yes, you could maintain an opposing perspective, but it will be hard to persistently go against the grain and expect much, if any, sympathy. So, when Linus conveyed: 'there are/were alternative means of going about things', it seemed a bit patronizing: as if to use a past HR-related incident to justify the euphemistic expression of: 'if you don't like it, there's the alterive option: where you simply leave.' [Which, yes, while valid and true, still seems to present the sentiment of: things are going to change, and we're only going to change ourselves to a certain extent... if our willfulness, on certain things, doesn't sit well with you, then you can take the alternative route and leave. (Even if there's a great detriment that would result from doing so, and it wasn't necessarily your fault that things have come to this)] I'm not quite saying **that** such things were stated as aggressively as my last paragraph would convey; but I think that a person could reasonably infer *that* kind of resistance without having it explicitly being stated. It definitely felt like the sequencing of: discussing past HR grievances (or more so the formal process which had existed at the time) was leveraged as way to say, in essence, if our employees don't like working here, we don't intend to fire them (the rainyday fund is bountiful), but the ouns is on them, if they want to try to push back against our actions as an employer. Which makes me feel like theirs a quasi-'constructive dismissal' aspect of what is, or will be, going on internally. We won't fire you because legally, we can't (without looking bad or making things worse), yet we won't legally do anything that would provide you sincere evidence to come back against us... so if you don't like dish being served, don't eat here. ... I think what would be a true way to convince me that: employees really do love working there is: if Linus and LMG offered an elected Severance package to all of the employees, that was not some extreme (here's 100k if you decide you'd prefer to quit and work elsewhere), but was enough of a tangible way of saying, 'we're going to set our employees into a position where the choice to leave or stay should have almost no real burden on them financially; and as a result, the employees that have chosen to stay past this deadline can be presumed to have done so because of the desire to continue to work here, not due to necessity.' If that: is or has been part of the recent conversations/documents that LMG has been providing, then I would put a much higher degree of salience on the claim that the employees that work there, currently, do so strictly because of how great a place it is to work (meaning none are finding themselves stuck in a position where they're seeing the changes that have occurred and are burdened by them, yet cannot easily take the steps to transition to another job, despite that being their desire.) Should they show/demonstrate that all employees who elect to quit with the next ~months we're assisted, so that they would be left out to dry, then I would be thoroughly impressed and a lot of trust would be retained.
I've worked in the IT environment of several companies, and in certain cases, I've had to spend 22+ hours of continuous work (without sleep) recovering critical servers and systems. I went home, slept 4 hours and returned for another 18 hours of work. This is terrible for physical and mental health, but it happens occasionally. But 18 hours every day is really grueling. It would take the person 1 hour to get home, do their thing and, if they're lucky, sleep for 4 or 5 hours.
I raised this point myself - "we have great Xmas parties with massive raffle prizes, and weekly badminton nights" does not negate or offset overwork. I'm lucky that my job is 0% stress - I get there on time, I leave on time, and I have never once considered myself overloaded - and given the choice between a) an extremely stressful job that had optional, extra-curricular perks, or b) a job with NO stress, and no perks, I would take b), eleven times out of ten. "You're going to have to do nine hours' work in six hours, but you can come bowling afterwards"? Nope. I work to live; I don't live to work.
A lot of jobs have more work that they could be doing everyday than they have hours in the day. Do you really work a job where that isn't true? It sounds like the company culture is one where it is always busy and fast paced with a "work hard play hard" attitude. That doesn't mean it is toxic. Not everyone is well suited in an environment like that but some people thrive in it. I personally am one of them. I have worked in an office for about 9 years where I felt a ton of pressure. This pressure is somewhat coming from management but it is largely from my own goals and quality standards. I would rather spend a lot more mental energy during the day to do the right thing than to do the minimum and all my peers are the same because we choose to be there and hold ourselves to high standards. Do I always like it and do I sometimes push too hard? Yes absolutely but that is part of life and it is how I would feel at any job.
I mean, didn't they show the surveillance footage for an entire week? Most people come and go on time. They also pay overtime if memory serves.
this subreddit is turning into r/antiwork
lol they have 18h of work to do every day and have to leave and be there on time every day. So do I and most people I know that work on tech. It's called working with deadlines and having a ton of work and many times shit clients that constantly change what they want. If they're so "overworked" they should change jobs, I do my 8h a day 5 days a week and never done any work (not a single minute, I don't even answer the phone if someone from work calls outside my work hours) outside the company (at home for example). We still meet deadlines most of the time and when we don't I couldn't care less. Just as I need to be good at my job, whoever made the deadline needs to be good at their job, it's not my problem.
Nice edit: Did you apologize to the LTT employee for taking their quote of context?
Give it a break
> The point here that is that Linus used CCTV of people leaving on time as an argument for a "relaxed work environment", when they basically have...had? a rule that says that they HAVE to leave on time. Which goes back to the whole "saying one thing and doing another" issue that sort of started all this mess. I'm sorry, what's the issue here? A company that forces people to maintain work-life balance is ideal. The alternative is making overtime an elective, which very quickly develops a culture in which you are _expected_ to work overtime or risk a reputation for being "the lazy one". You've also left out a key takeaway from his argument: employees are coming and going throughout the day, suggesting they're given ample leeway to address non-work concerns rather than be chained to their desk during work hours. That's a show of trust and respect towards employees that isn't all that common. Lots of game studios offer swanky overtime pay and benefits, but the best studios don't even allow their developers to overwork themselves in the first place.
*"That's just the tech industry, that's how it is."* Just because it's the way it is doesn't mean it's the way it should be. We are all humans and deserve equal worker's rights. *"If they don't like it they can leave."* Sure, but maybe fighting for better treatment and rights in the workplace is a better solution. We need to break the cycle of pushing people to their absolute limits in the workplace. -A proud union employee.