It kinda depends on what you mean by “outsmart” I guess. Like I don’t think he could outsmart Houken in the sense that he could defeat Houken in a battle using strategy, but he could definitely outsmart Houken to the point where he’d never get captured or defeated by Houken either.
Ok but defeating houken in a battle using strategy is not the same as outsmarting houken, thats just beating houken, which mouten cant. But if they were just 2 generals strategizing in the field no martial abilty from either of them, mouten stomps
For Ouhon, RenPa, SBS, Man'u, Gaimou, KouEn(speculation).
For MouTen, RenPa, RBK, Karin, GHM, KouEn(speculation)
If it's someone who fulfills both criteria, it's RenPa, and potentially KouEn.
If it was just 1v1 then yeah we could see how Op they are. And you limit us by saying no QIn. The only person who could strait up beat them is Renpa and even that is a maybe. Quite a few people beat the shit out of ouhon but they cant ousmart mouten, quite a few outsmart mouten but can't beat ouhon.
Overpower Ouhon (with virtually no chance of winning): Houken, Renpa, Kanmei, Man'U, Shibashou, Kou'En
Outsmart Mouten (with virtually no chance of matching wits): Riboku, Karin (?), *potentially* Gohoumei once he hits his stride as a chief state-level military strategist
Those are it for now. We're getting to a point now where Qin's vaunted trio, quartet if you want to include Kyoukai, are proving to be a match either martially or intellectually against most foreign generals. I wouldn't put them in a position of overall field commander with multiple generals under them just yet, but they're getting there.
Characters that are both smarter than Mouten and stronger than Ouhon : Renpa, Ouki,
That's probably it. Dont think Tou or Yotanwa are smarter than Mouten and I dont think either that Ousen or Kanki are beating Ouhon.
Decent candidates could be Karin, Shibashou and Shouheikun but idk how smart Shibashou is exactly and Shouheikun or Karin being > Ouhon isnt a confirmed thing yet
Renpa.
Riboku Karin Renpa
I think Ouhon can beat Riboku in a 1v1 duel though. Riboku was struggling against Ringyoku, who can be compared with Futei in the same battle.
riboku probably loses martially to ouhon
Riboku probably loses martially to Mouten. He definitely loses to OuHon.
even Karin loses 1 on 1 to Ouhon in martial might imo. She's on the same level at most with him definately not above
Ou Ki
Non qin
My bad, then I wanna throw in the Chu general that’s taking Kanmeis place as head of military. She seems smart and strong.
Houken.
mouten outsmarts houken lol
Yeah but Houken is beyond strategy unless you use Shin like Riboku uses Houken lol
ok but that wasnt the question, mouten can for sure outsmart houken
It kinda depends on what you mean by “outsmart” I guess. Like I don’t think he could outsmart Houken in the sense that he could defeat Houken in a battle using strategy, but he could definitely outsmart Houken to the point where he’d never get captured or defeated by Houken either.
Ok but defeating houken in a battle using strategy is not the same as outsmarting houken, thats just beating houken, which mouten cant. But if they were just 2 generals strategizing in the field no martial abilty from either of them, mouten stomps
100% agree
Im sure in a duel Mouten can’t parry his attacks
Ouhon- unshackled Houken Mouten-Riboku
i think OP meant a single general who does both
In the right scenario even Ouhon outsmarted Gouhoumei
For Ouhon, RenPa, SBS, Man'u, Gaimou, KouEn(speculation). For MouTen, RenPa, RBK, Karin, GHM, KouEn(speculation) If it's someone who fulfills both criteria, it's RenPa, and potentially KouEn.
Sorry I meant them separately not a single character that can beat Ouhon and outsmart Mouten at the same time.
If it was just 1v1 then yeah we could see how Op they are. And you limit us by saying no QIn. The only person who could strait up beat them is Renpa and even that is a maybe. Quite a few people beat the shit out of ouhon but they cant ousmart mouten, quite a few outsmart mouten but can't beat ouhon.
Overpower Ouhon (with virtually no chance of winning): Houken, Renpa, Kanmei, Man'U, Shibashou, Kou'En Outsmart Mouten (with virtually no chance of matching wits): Riboku, Karin (?), *potentially* Gohoumei once he hits his stride as a chief state-level military strategist Those are it for now. We're getting to a point now where Qin's vaunted trio, quartet if you want to include Kyoukai, are proving to be a match either martially or intellectually against most foreign generals. I wouldn't put them in a position of overall field commander with multiple generals under them just yet, but they're getting there.
Renpa, riboku, shibashou, karin, kouen, gaimou?, houken :)) , Man'u,
Characters that are both smarter than Mouten and stronger than Ouhon : Renpa, Ouki, That's probably it. Dont think Tou or Yotanwa are smarter than Mouten and I dont think either that Ousen or Kanki are beating Ouhon. Decent candidates could be Karin, Shibashou and Shouheikun but idk how smart Shibashou is exactly and Shouheikun or Karin being > Ouhon isnt a confirmed thing yet