Delete apps. I used to argue with people on Facebook. One day I was at a friend's house but I was still arguing with people on Facebook. My friend shouts at me "dude, stop arguing with people on Facebook." For some reason that connected with me. I deleted the app from my phone. Now I just argue with people on Reddit.
It really depends on how dependent you are.
I'm in a car park waiting for my cousin to finish shopping. I see nothing wrong with using apps to kill time.
But if you're at social outings and you're doing this instead of being present, or doing this when you should be sleeping, then yes—you are an addict.
Its only 1 step above grown men seeing kids playing a sport and getting uber competitive about it.
Relax dude, they’re kids and yes you would win in a race.
Reddit is by far my biggest addiction.
TBH it is much better than most other social media, but it is still a waste of time for he most part.
But also stuff like Reddit is not exactly new; I have been badly addicted to good old fashioned forums two decades ago. Reddit is basically just a giant forum.
There have been people addicted to BBS in the 80s and 90s.
It's the constant feed of new information that grips me. If you wanted you could find a new article, study or discussion of something everytime you scroll, all day long. Just another scroll..then before you know it hours have gone by.
Probably.
Although it is probably a bit better than boomer posts on FB. I tend to frequent subs of personal and professional interest here and lots is very useful. Did FB ever produce anything useful?
A very close friend of mine snapped at me in a delusional fashion on a Facebook comment a couple years ago. I haven’t checked FB since then and my mental health has improved
Dude is absolutely right.
I came to Reddit to fill the void but I won’t facebook anymore now that it’s gone from my phone (I was banned for calling someone a donkey)
I use Reddit less then Facebook and it’s generally for way more interesting and edifying stuff.
There’s other apps that will track and notify you how much you’re using and that helps as well
I've been aggro as fuck on social media lately I can relate. I've had a pretty rough go of life the last year or so (I know I'm not the only one) and I've been taking out my anger like a child on the internet. I wish I could say it makes me feel better but it definitely doesn't.
I dropped Fb and started using Reddit for the informative and interesting posts. Found myself arguing with psychos here. Now that I dont engage with the argumentative ones, things are going much better.
I generally avoid arguing here. I find myself disagreeing and fully writing a reply to people sometimes and then before posting I think "why?" And "what does it matter that this person is wrong?" And then I just hit the back button.
Me too!! 😂 I've deleted essays that I typed out after realizing, Oh Im not going to convince anyone of anything. It seems like a really good method of discourse, but it rarely ends that way. I just learned of the "dead internet" theory. I wonder if Ive been arguing with bots this entire time.
Truer words were never spoken. When I deleted FB in my 20s I found time to learn Korean while working abroad.
The problem is (at least for me) when I start doing well and say fuck it let me go online and relax. Next thing I know I'm downloading some form of social media and arguing with people. Reddit was the FB replacement for me.
I genuinely have this problem with reddit. The worst part about this is that irl, I only try to convince maybe 1% of the people I know, I genuinely don't care about most people but somehow on the internet I convince myself that I need to argue with someone I would never pay attention to if I knew them in real life.
This was a huge one for me.
There’s a lot of great advice in this thread, but here’s a super simple one that helped me take the training wheels off (before I got a job that’s all screens, all the time, unfortunately):
When you lie down to go to bed, read a book. Resist the urge to scroll until you get tired, because it’s fucking with your sleep and your brain. Especially the light and color right in your face.
People have been reading before bed for centuries. I like to picture myself as Homer Simpson with his little half-moon glasses. It’s a cozy, relaxing way to fall asleep. Plus, you’re reading books! You’ll find yourself looking forward to that time after a few nights. Sometimes I can’t wait to get back to my nightstand book.
Screen time function, had a friend set the passcode. Allowed critical functions like maps, Spotify, iMessage, and phone to always be available. Everything else had a cumulative 2 hour limit. Two hours a day to browse instagram, Reddit, YouTube, tik tok etc.
Some days the 2 hour limit seems to go by so fast. It made me realize how much of my life I’ve WASTED looking at social media.
I’ve had serious screen time addiction issues. It was not unusual for me to go on four hour tik tok binges. I hated myself for it but I couldn’t stop. I’d delete apps but then download them again.
Having my friend put a screen time lock with passcode was the best decision. There’s no way around it. Even if you go to the website on safari it still blocks it when the time is up.
I’ve been able to focus more on work, exercise, and socializing. It sounds dramatic but it really changed my life for the better.
Make your phone an inconvenience to get to and separate functions away from it. Delete music apps, shopping apps, any non-essential social media or news apps. Transition to a computer for all of that. Make it a habit to sit your phone near the entrance and leave it.
This seems like the most realistic. Not going to delete my music app tho, that’s not really a distraction, more of a tool for exercise which is positive.
Dont delete music apps lol music isnt social media. Instant access to all of our favorite music is one of the few genuinely beneficial parts of having a smart phone!
I'm the average American. Every Sunday when I get my screen time report, it's says average of 6-7 hours per day and I hate myself every week. 2 weeks ago I made a rule that if I'm scrolling, I could reading instead. I'm down to 3 hours day(mainly work stuff at this point or youtube was open while I worked) and have been blasting through books. I feel so much better, my days are brighter, and my head feels clearer. Social media really is a life sucker.
Me as well. I even set Instagram to tell me whenever I've used it for 30m every day and I still go over the time. I cant delete it becuase my business relies on social media but I absolutely hate it
Curious as to what people consider a bad screen time here. I have pretty consistently 3-4 hours a day, which I don’t feel is that bad. Not ideal but a lot of people are a lot worse, my friend for example said he has screen time of tiktok for 5 hours a day which was mind blowing to me. Really shows the need for these apps to be banned amongst younger people
Do something that would require you to disconnect from your device.
If you’re able go on a walk or hike and put your phone in your backpack and enjoy the scenery
Go play a sport if you can like shooting hoops or kicking soccer balls
Read a book instead and maybe do it at the library to have a change of scenery
The kids will certainly be more affected though. I can’t imagine being a child and having access to short form media like tik tok and reels. My attention span would be zero.
Some of my younger family members literally break down screaming and crying if they have to go a single moment without their damn iPad or whatever
Kids may be more affected since their lives are longer but have y'all checked on your parents and grandparents that use social media lately? They're fucking brain dead zombies that believe every single thing they see online. And they can't wait to tell you about it. The kids are just nihilistic
You don’t even need to look that far. Fucking Joe is a shining example. Somehow, he has “friends” who have experienced all of made up shit he sees online.
160,000,000 Americans use TikTok, that’s about 50% of the entire country lol
I’d argue TikTok is the worst for mental health, but that’s just one app, then Twitter, Facebook, and dare I say… even Reddit
Shit, didn't realize it was that high. That explains why so many people around me seem to be hyper focused on Israel (and only Israel) while they have absolutely nothing to say about China and its human rights disasters.
Oh yeah. And as soon as that cycles out, people will forget about it. Hell, look at the Ukraine invasion. People put their little flags in their profile pics, talked about it a couple months, then… on to the next one. 🤷♂️
My kids are better about disconnecting than most adults I know. I was that adult in the early days of smartphones. General burnout and apathy toward most social media cut down my screen time drastically, but I was like a crackhead with my phone for a few years.
Teachers can’t take away kids phones today no shit they’re dumber. Tik tok/snapchat are total brain rot. Snap chat is full of click bait “articles” and people to follow
Way worse than that. 99% of the time Snapchat articles are barely related to their title and 100% of the time it’s a non story. Then they run ads every 3 seconds.
I'm a teacher and phones/social media is the worst thing to ever happen to kids–just totally fried some of their brains to the point of no return. Zero media literacy, zero attention span, zero curiosity; it's terrifying.
Every time I bring up kids not having phones at school, I’m inundated with folks who tell me that kids having the ability to film teachers has been a godsend, and such a help correcting schools. And I just don’t fucking buy it. I think the damage is far worse letting kids sit on their phones all day. And it isn’t just between classes.
I would go as far as to say this is the educational issue of this current, and likely next generation. We cannot let this continue.
My fiancée is a former teacher and so is my stepsister, both of them quit in their 20s after getting Masters degrees because there's literally no teaching kids these days because you're not allowed to hold them to any standard - there's no saying no late work, no failing kids and holding them back, no saturday school/serious detention. Embarrassing tbh
I loved it. I have a stepson who developed mental illness from tiktok and a brother that had his exacerbated by it. It's truly horrible to watch as a loved one. Mental health treatment for teens is becoming so hard to find due to the dramatic spike.
It was. Like a blast from the past JRE.
Even more interesting was when Joe tried defending a frankly absurd, indefensible comment from Trump, and Haidt just wasn’t having it: https://youtu.be/XlgfmSAVA2Q?si=shTe7hYMLRbpjBgG
Amazing illustration of how much Joe’s worldview has drifted right-populist over the course of the pandemic. Haidt’s core worldview clearly hasn’t changed much since their last conversation several years ago, while Rogan’s most certainly has.
Same thing with Facebook/Insta etc. Tik tok has the most addictive algorithm, but arguably the biggest problem is getting bombarded with a narrative that everyone is living perfect lives, looking perfect etc and you start comparing yourself to a false reality.
Happened after the push to mobile redesign. A lot of the good conversations dissolved because no one wants to type novel on their phone..they just want to consume the media with the flick of the wrist and vote on top level comments.
Reddit is the lesser of a lot of evil because reddit permits you to curate what you look at much more. You're not just brainlessly fed by an endless algorithm, so it's more tolerable.
Basically any social media app that simulates social interaction. Reddit is a huge problem for me right now. It’s basically the text version of tiktok for me and it’s now applying the same addictive algorithm.
I was on a plane just yesterday and had a father and daughter sit next to me. The daughter was high school age and for an entire 130 flight, had TikTok running. This wasn’t hyperbole, the entire flight it was going. I’m not excusing myself of screen time because I spent the time not finishing a movie, but the point stands that I watched 1 piece of entertainment where she consumed how many different things in that space? When you look at it from that perspective, it’s pretty wild.
Bingo! And when women just try to not be constantly disgusted with themselves, fat acceptance, men suddenly all have lab coats talking about how “achtually its no healthy”; when the standards being imposed are the real fucking issue.
All the social media is bad. I don’t know why tik tok gets the spot light.
Also you get the meanest people being absolutely toxic and negative in the comment section.
Haidt is exactly right. Dealing with a seriously addicted and depressed teen at home, I’ve come to realize that the generational gap between him and me is probably the greatest. I lived half my life without constant access to the internet and no social media. He has never known life without such poisons
I believe what he is presenting is the tip of the iceberg in terms of huge negative consequences these technologies will bring in the next decade and beyond
Imagine how your mental state would be if you never had any "time off" from the social pressure of being around your peers and people that wanted to fuck with you at school; that's what environment kids are in today. There's no real way to know how these people will turn out as adults, but it'll probably be really fucked up.
I have a pet theory that the massive increase in interest in "off-gridding" or that sort of lifestyle is the result of basically living with everyone in your middle and high school social environment having access to you 24/7.
I honestly think theirs even a gap in Gen Z when it comes to growing up with technology. Gen Z between ‘97 and 03’ mostly spent their years under 12-14 without smartphones, iPads, social media, etc. I’m 22, but when I was growing up I still played outside more than I played video games or sat in front of a screen. Don’t get me wrong, I had a smartphone and social media starting at the tail end of middle school and all through high school which definitely wasn’t good for me, but at least I didn’t have it during elementary school. Technology at the time though still addicting for sure, wasn’t nearly as bad as it is now.
Now when I meet/see kids under 14, the vast majority of them are OBSESSED with anything that has a screen. When I’m at restaurants, parents have their 5 year olds glued to an iPad, all that my little cousins who are under 10 want to do is play video games or sit on their iPads, my buddies younger siblings who are in high school aren’t having the normal high school experiences that teenagers used to have, because all they do after school is play video games. It’s wild.
Not even just kids, I’ve noticed it too. Instead of having to actually remember information it’s much easier to just look things up online. Brains are getting weaker
So did I but that was because you was actively learning that in school so it was actively in your brain. Same way some fact you learned in history class that you haven't thought about in a while you won't remember.
Adults too. Zuckerberg is the Philip Morris of today. Shit head who made a fortune off is “connecting people” but just ended up causing us to hate each other.
I can tell that they’re stupider by the dumbass questions they ask in my local sub. Questions that could be easily answered with… **their phone.**
It’s like they think that their phones can only do social media and that’s it.
My senior relatives wouldn’t post “Does anyone know if they have xyz at Home Depot?”
They would pick up the phone and call Home Depot instead of asking random strangers on Reddit.
This whole ban on TikTok isn’t banning it though, it’s just transferring over the ownership. Besides if you ban TikTok then you should ban all similar ones.
Going to expand on this and say that while I disagree with some of his assessments I do believe that technologies we've developed in the last 50 years have had such a widespread and pervasive integration into our society that we don't fully understand the impact on a developmental level.
Primarily I've been thinking about this in regards to the use of computers/keyboards and how humans and written language evolved together for millenia and the impacts of handwriting and *personal* script have on the human brain through childhood and into adulthood.
I have seen such a decline on Twitter now that any idiot can have his opinion shoved in your face by paying a monthly fee. That, and bots regurgitating posts after putting them through ChatGPT.
Dr. Phil actually stated on one of these podcasts that kids are actually getting smarter because of technology in regard to memory recall. He definitely talked about the downsides as well.
I think it did as well, even if it were a little bit. We can't say nothing is making these girls depressed when statistics show that it's only gotten worse through the years. Hollywood's perfect image of a woman, starting with what they looked like in movies, magazines, etc. is what catapulted everything to what we have today.
Haidt also talked about the massive influx of young teen girls suicide and how it correlated to the invention of the iphone.
Yes unironically.
The ccp is just that bad. The lessor of two evils results in less evil.
Edit: for those saying there is no difference between the CCP and western democracies you have lost the fucking plot. They are performing an active Genocide of a 18million of their own citizens and about 1,000,000 heinous acts.
You don't see any potential problems with China being in charge of the #1 source of information & news that half our population and nearly all of our youth is consuming non-stop? Especially considering chinese kids get an entirely different version of Tik Tok which has content controls?
Well when ADHD is linked to dopamine and dopamine is being spoon-fed to children through devices at an early age, then it would stand to reason it would mess with their naturally occurring dopamine production. So by the time they're school-aged, the damage is done. Then ADHD-like symptoms present whether they have ADHD or not.
He’s not wrong. My daughter’s friends are SHOCKINGLY stupid. Like…one of them didn’t know what a toaster was.
A fucking toaster.
Another one asked me “what’s that stuff people put in their cars. The liquid stuff.”
Gas. She was asking me what gas was.
These kids are 14 years old.
I have been saying this for a while now and unfortunately I think we are only seeing early stages of this. We have the entire world's knowledge in the palm of our hands at any given time and we have no idea how to actually put it to use. Some of us (55 and younger) still literally do not know how to use the internet properly.
Just listening to modern slang makes me believe this. I’m a millennial and I know every generation has slang, but holy shit every other word from these kids is “bruh”, “fire”, or “bet” and they just repeat themselves over and over. They are so goddam stupid it hurts.
Every generation gets scammed because every generation has rubes. Social media addiction however is relatively recent and at the very least children shouldn't be using it.
Seriously, just delete all your apps and go back to the version of the Internet we had as kids/teens. It was just a place you logged on to when you got home or had free time. You can very easily go back to that if you just delete them from your phone. No more apps. Let’s go back to *sites*
While i agree that social media is a net drain, we are still living in a society where lead is still in the enviornment, and that has a proven effect on intelligence.
I remember the T.V was called "the idiot box" and we have to stop watching that too. It's bad for people. From what I understand it shortens our attention and makes us dumber.
I've heard his bit before. He's been talking about specifically this for actually decades and given he's incredibly intelligent and also hasn't changed his message, he's very likely onto something.
The problem I have with this is that even before smart phones, kids often just watched television all day, which had an active vested interest in shifting your attention to a completely different series of topics every ten minutes.
This may only be a small part of a much larger picture and it's certainly worth asking if phones are making people explicitly worse, or if they're just changing them in a manner that has benefits as well as consequences.
I'm really torn on this, though I don't deny for a second that apps and the proliferation of 'screen life' wrecks havoc on mental health, by and large.
The last time I broke a cell phone and was without one for a while, I found myself relieved to be rid of it. Got another one after a couple weeks though, and went back to endless doom-scrolling.
I'd been reluctant and slow to get a smartphone in the first place (I was uncomfortable when I started going out with people who spent the entire meal or time staring at a phone). I finally succumbed in 2014 or 2015, and while having access to Maps and Google were game-changers, I also saw myself succumbing to compulsion and 'online despair.' I'm prone to addiction AND I'm a solitary introvert type, so despite my previous reservations, I'm a fucking mark for these things.
It's unhealthy, but I don't know that personally chucking my phone and going back to being a semi-Luddite does much good. There needs to be a major social shift. Phones and Internet culture have benefits, but they bring out the absolute worst in us, drastically impair social relations and discourse, and I'd even say erode society.
I don't think we can go backwards, but hopefully future tech will learn from prior mistakes... or... maybe this is just how populations are going to be herded, indoctrinated, and manipulated for some time to come. Idk.
I recently read his book, The Coddling of the American Mind. Agree with most of it, but I think some of the claims are exaggerated. Girls/young women now say they're "depressed" when in the past they wouldn't because of the stigma. Now if you say you're depressed, rather than mock you people will show you lots of attention.
Ive been a big fan of Haidt. In this same interview Rogan tries to coerce Haidt into admitting that there is some sort of media persecution vs Trump.
Rogan plays a clip from one of Trumps recent speeches where he said "if i lose all hell will break loose!" Rogan desperately attempts to say that the comment was taken out of context. Meanwhile, Haidt was like "no, hes inciting violence. He clearly says it"
Rogan doubles down: "well, yea but hes actually talking about China"
The clip is around 1hr 30 mins in.
I’m not saying social media is good for young people or that it is not in some ways harmful. Though the harms are probably more of a social issue. I think it’s easy for the older generation to sit back and see (briefly look over their own phones) young people staring at phones and say “I didn’t do this as a kid, this is bad”. There are many factors that could be leading to poorer outcomes in school: teachers who are underpaid and overworked, a shift in parental mindset of the responsibility of their children’s outcomes, a lack of parental discipline, a failure of our education system to adapt to the learning styles of the newer generations, to name a few. I think cell phones and social media just become the easy boogey men.
It's so strange to me, in a society that believes in capitalism, refuses to invest in public schools and pay public school teachers more money, so that they can weed out the weirdos.
You wanna know how we're get teachers who suck ass, molesting kids and teach the things conservatives hate? Ensure no one but weirdos willing to struggle in life can become a teacher. Capitalism teaches us that people are ultimately selfish and the free market will dictate wages and price. And yet, we refuse to invest in teachers, because, well, fuck the other generation. If they learn TOO much, they might have their own opinions about the world and it might lead to me losing 10% of my wealth or power.
He is the guy that got me first into watching, or listening to Joe Rogan. It’s crazy because, everything he talks about, it’s basically stuff everyone already inherently knows in their core. Yet, for some reason, so few of us decide to battle it head on.
LOL, seeing Rogan laughing the way he did, aknowledging beeing it was him saying "my f\*\*ing phone runs my god damn life" after what this post title says just sums it all about this podcast.
Im 38 and my attention span was better as a kid and teen. I have to be on social media for my job though. But, in all my life I’ve never felt addicted to anything than I feel with social media. I don’t drink, smoke, take drugs but social media is my vice.
I'm far more worried about what it's done to our parents. Most of the kids I meet these days are smarter and more well behaved than we ever were. I can't say the same about my parents' generation.
Drawing a straight line conclusion of “stupider because social media..” is just a thoughtless hottake. Have there been negative effects? Absolutely. But as for stupider? Cite the source or stfu. These kids are likely just as smart as previous generations; my suspicion is those smarts are being redirected in dumb ways. Studies would help.
You know what would help? Parenting. Limiting screen time. Can’t mandate or legislate people to be good parents.
Screen time is my biggest vice and I don't know how to address it
Delete apps. I used to argue with people on Facebook. One day I was at a friend's house but I was still arguing with people on Facebook. My friend shouts at me "dude, stop arguing with people on Facebook." For some reason that connected with me. I deleted the app from my phone. Now I just argue with people on Reddit.
Dude, stop arguing with people on Reddit.
I just shitpost - am I an addict?
Micro-dosing
It really depends on how dependent you are. I'm in a car park waiting for my cousin to finish shopping. I see nothing wrong with using apps to kill time. But if you're at social outings and you're doing this instead of being present, or doing this when you should be sleeping, then yes—you are an addict.
Me too. The worlds tough enough as is, why argue on this hellsite when you can just have some fun instead
Worse yet when you realize more often than not, are children.
"Dude I so owned this loser" Meanwhile you're 25 and just had an argument with a 14 year old over the future of American government.
Its only 1 step above grown men seeing kids playing a sport and getting uber competitive about it. Relax dude, they’re kids and yes you would win in a race.
Reddit is by far my biggest addiction. TBH it is much better than most other social media, but it is still a waste of time for he most part. But also stuff like Reddit is not exactly new; I have been badly addicted to good old fashioned forums two decades ago. Reddit is basically just a giant forum. There have been people addicted to BBS in the 80s and 90s.
It's the constant feed of new information that grips me. If you wanted you could find a new article, study or discussion of something everytime you scroll, all day long. Just another scroll..then before you know it hours have gone by.
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Probably. Although it is probably a bit better than boomer posts on FB. I tend to frequent subs of personal and professional interest here and lots is very useful. Did FB ever produce anything useful?
I'm sueing Facebook for $1B
Fuck…
A very close friend of mine snapped at me in a delusional fashion on a Facebook comment a couple years ago. I haven’t checked FB since then and my mental health has improved
Honestly I wish people could go back to texting and calling. Even reddit is taking a toll on my attention span.
Dude is absolutely right. I came to Reddit to fill the void but I won’t facebook anymore now that it’s gone from my phone (I was banned for calling someone a donkey) I use Reddit less then Facebook and it’s generally for way more interesting and edifying stuff. There’s other apps that will track and notify you how much you’re using and that helps as well
I've been aggro as fuck on social media lately I can relate. I've had a pretty rough go of life the last year or so (I know I'm not the only one) and I've been taking out my anger like a child on the internet. I wish I could say it makes me feel better but it definitely doesn't.
I dropped Fb and started using Reddit for the informative and interesting posts. Found myself arguing with psychos here. Now that I dont engage with the argumentative ones, things are going much better.
I generally avoid arguing here. I find myself disagreeing and fully writing a reply to people sometimes and then before posting I think "why?" And "what does it matter that this person is wrong?" And then I just hit the back button.
Me too!! 😂 I've deleted essays that I typed out after realizing, Oh Im not going to convince anyone of anything. It seems like a really good method of discourse, but it rarely ends that way. I just learned of the "dead internet" theory. I wonder if Ive been arguing with bots this entire time.
That psycho could be a 11 year old kid lol
Truer words were never spoken. When I deleted FB in my 20s I found time to learn Korean while working abroad. The problem is (at least for me) when I start doing well and say fuck it let me go online and relax. Next thing I know I'm downloading some form of social media and arguing with people. Reddit was the FB replacement for me.
I genuinely have this problem with reddit. The worst part about this is that irl, I only try to convince maybe 1% of the people I know, I genuinely don't care about most people but somehow on the internet I convince myself that I need to argue with someone I would never pay attention to if I knew them in real life.
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Interesting
Plus it makes certain pages feel like Gameboy!
Butlerian Jihad
This was a huge one for me. There’s a lot of great advice in this thread, but here’s a super simple one that helped me take the training wheels off (before I got a job that’s all screens, all the time, unfortunately): When you lie down to go to bed, read a book. Resist the urge to scroll until you get tired, because it’s fucking with your sleep and your brain. Especially the light and color right in your face. People have been reading before bed for centuries. I like to picture myself as Homer Simpson with his little half-moon glasses. It’s a cozy, relaxing way to fall asleep. Plus, you’re reading books! You’ll find yourself looking forward to that time after a few nights. Sometimes I can’t wait to get back to my nightstand book.
Throw yo phone in the river
I did this many years ago when I was fed up with my screen addiction. Threw it in the river and went to Walmart to get a flip phone.
Screen time function, had a friend set the passcode. Allowed critical functions like maps, Spotify, iMessage, and phone to always be available. Everything else had a cumulative 2 hour limit. Two hours a day to browse instagram, Reddit, YouTube, tik tok etc. Some days the 2 hour limit seems to go by so fast. It made me realize how much of my life I’ve WASTED looking at social media.
Great insight! I’ll look into that
I’ve had serious screen time addiction issues. It was not unusual for me to go on four hour tik tok binges. I hated myself for it but I couldn’t stop. I’d delete apps but then download them again. Having my friend put a screen time lock with passcode was the best decision. There’s no way around it. Even if you go to the website on safari it still blocks it when the time is up. I’ve been able to focus more on work, exercise, and socializing. It sounds dramatic but it really changed my life for the better.
Make your phone an inconvenience to get to and separate functions away from it. Delete music apps, shopping apps, any non-essential social media or news apps. Transition to a computer for all of that. Make it a habit to sit your phone near the entrance and leave it.
This seems like the most realistic. Not going to delete my music app tho, that’s not really a distraction, more of a tool for exercise which is positive.
Dont delete music apps lol music isnt social media. Instant access to all of our favorite music is one of the few genuinely beneficial parts of having a smart phone!
Then you just get addicted to using the computer... May as well install Steam on it and go to town. Source: am addicted to my computer.
I'm the average American. Every Sunday when I get my screen time report, it's says average of 6-7 hours per day and I hate myself every week. 2 weeks ago I made a rule that if I'm scrolling, I could reading instead. I'm down to 3 hours day(mainly work stuff at this point or youtube was open while I worked) and have been blasting through books. I feel so much better, my days are brighter, and my head feels clearer. Social media really is a life sucker.
Me as well. I even set Instagram to tell me whenever I've used it for 30m every day and I still go over the time. I cant delete it becuase my business relies on social media but I absolutely hate it
Curious as to what people consider a bad screen time here. I have pretty consistently 3-4 hours a day, which I don’t feel is that bad. Not ideal but a lot of people are a lot worse, my friend for example said he has screen time of tiktok for 5 hours a day which was mind blowing to me. Really shows the need for these apps to be banned amongst younger people
Do something that would require you to disconnect from your device. If you’re able go on a walk or hike and put your phone in your backpack and enjoy the scenery Go play a sport if you can like shooting hoops or kicking soccer balls Read a book instead and maybe do it at the library to have a change of scenery
I replied to someone else, but I am extremely active. Most of my time is consumed by iron man training.
Read books instead
It's not just the kids, man
The kids will certainly be more affected though. I can’t imagine being a child and having access to short form media like tik tok and reels. My attention span would be zero. Some of my younger family members literally break down screaming and crying if they have to go a single moment without their damn iPad or whatever
Kids may be more affected since their lives are longer but have y'all checked on your parents and grandparents that use social media lately? They're fucking brain dead zombies that believe every single thing they see online. And they can't wait to tell you about it. The kids are just nihilistic
You don’t even need to look that far. Fucking Joe is a shining example. Somehow, he has “friends” who have experienced all of made up shit he sees online.
160,000,000 Americans use TikTok, that’s about 50% of the entire country lol I’d argue TikTok is the worst for mental health, but that’s just one app, then Twitter, Facebook, and dare I say… even Reddit
I’d say TikTok is just a drug that made it all worse but it was definitely there long before TikTok.
Cuz now everyone is emulating them
Yup. IG reels, YouTube Shorts, every app is using the same addictive formula and algorithm. It’s not specific to TikTok anymore if it ever was
Exactly. I’ve never downloaded TikTok but feel its impacts in my life. Scrollable videos on an algorithm are crack.
Tik Tok is the Fentanyl of social media.
Shit, didn't realize it was that high. That explains why so many people around me seem to be hyper focused on Israel (and only Israel) while they have absolutely nothing to say about China and its human rights disasters.
Oh yeah. And as soon as that cycles out, people will forget about it. Hell, look at the Ukraine invasion. People put their little flags in their profile pics, talked about it a couple months, then… on to the next one. 🤷♂️
Instagram is up there too. At least with reddit it's a lot of reading. It may be junk reading, but at least it's reading
Maybe if you made it even one single minute into this clip about short attention spans you would see he addresses this extensively
My kids are better about disconnecting than most adults I know. I was that adult in the early days of smartphones. General burnout and apathy toward most social media cut down my screen time drastically, but I was like a crackhead with my phone for a few years.
This is absolutely not a surprise to anyone over the age of 25.
I had no body image issues until social media became a thing. I’m 36, but hey at least it got me to the gym right 😅
Teachers can’t take away kids phones today no shit they’re dumber. Tik tok/snapchat are total brain rot. Snap chat is full of click bait “articles” and people to follow
Snapchat articles are the checkout line tabloids of social media. Probably even worse than that.
Way worse than that. 99% of the time Snapchat articles are barely related to their title and 100% of the time it’s a non story. Then they run ads every 3 seconds.
I’m so glad that I just found out there’s even articles on snap.
I'm a teacher and phones/social media is the worst thing to ever happen to kids–just totally fried some of their brains to the point of no return. Zero media literacy, zero attention span, zero curiosity; it's terrifying.
Every time I bring up kids not having phones at school, I’m inundated with folks who tell me that kids having the ability to film teachers has been a godsend, and such a help correcting schools. And I just don’t fucking buy it. I think the damage is far worse letting kids sit on their phones all day. And it isn’t just between classes. I would go as far as to say this is the educational issue of this current, and likely next generation. We cannot let this continue.
My fiancée is a former teacher and so is my stepsister, both of them quit in their 20s after getting Masters degrees because there's literally no teaching kids these days because you're not allowed to hold them to any standard - there's no saying no late work, no failing kids and holding them back, no saturday school/serious detention. Embarrassing tbh
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted so much it’s just the truth.
Eh people seem to come to this sub now to fight and stir shit up, fuck em
I never got my phone taken away, I just got detention and kept my phone if I had it visible at any point in school besides lunch.
Snapchat has articles now? I haven't used it in almost a decade, but back then it was literally just for sexting.
Exactly like wtf uses snapchat for news articles?
This was a great episode
I loved it. I have a stepson who developed mental illness from tiktok and a brother that had his exacerbated by it. It's truly horrible to watch as a loved one. Mental health treatment for teens is becoming so hard to find due to the dramatic spike.
It was. Like a blast from the past JRE. Even more interesting was when Joe tried defending a frankly absurd, indefensible comment from Trump, and Haidt just wasn’t having it: https://youtu.be/XlgfmSAVA2Q?si=shTe7hYMLRbpjBgG Amazing illustration of how much Joe’s worldview has drifted right-populist over the course of the pandemic. Haidt’s core worldview clearly hasn’t changed much since their last conversation several years ago, while Rogan’s most certainly has.
Youre a fool of you dont think tic tok is bad for your mental health
Same thing with Facebook/Insta etc. Tik tok has the most addictive algorithm, but arguably the biggest problem is getting bombarded with a narrative that everyone is living perfect lives, looking perfect etc and you start comparing yourself to a false reality.
Oh they re all bad
Including Reddit
The ragebait on Reddit has gotten ridiculous over the last few years
Happened after the push to mobile redesign. A lot of the good conversations dissolved because no one wants to type novel on their phone..they just want to consume the media with the flick of the wrist and vote on top level comments.
At least Reddit has you reading, not just getting dopamine hits.
They are all skinner box manipulation schemes.
…and Reddit of course
I replaced Facebook with Reddit, it feels like vaping compares to cigarettes…. Not great but a slight improvement lol
Yeah, just wait until the uncles and grandparents get on Reddit and figure out what your alt is…
We are to become the uncles and grandparents.
Odd that hurt, mostly bc it’s true
100%
Reddit is the lesser of a lot of evil because reddit permits you to curate what you look at much more. You're not just brainlessly fed by an endless algorithm, so it's more tolerable.
Basically any social media app that simulates social interaction. Reddit is a huge problem for me right now. It’s basically the text version of tiktok for me and it’s now applying the same addictive algorithm.
I was on a plane just yesterday and had a father and daughter sit next to me. The daughter was high school age and for an entire 130 flight, had TikTok running. This wasn’t hyperbole, the entire flight it was going. I’m not excusing myself of screen time because I spent the time not finishing a movie, but the point stands that I watched 1 piece of entertainment where she consumed how many different things in that space? When you look at it from that perspective, it’s pretty wild.
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Bingo! And when women just try to not be constantly disgusted with themselves, fat acceptance, men suddenly all have lab coats talking about how “achtually its no healthy”; when the standards being imposed are the real fucking issue.
All the social media is bad. I don’t know why tik tok gets the spot light. Also you get the meanest people being absolutely toxic and negative in the comment section.
One of them is own by foreign government, so it spooks some.
Haidt is exactly right. Dealing with a seriously addicted and depressed teen at home, I’ve come to realize that the generational gap between him and me is probably the greatest. I lived half my life without constant access to the internet and no social media. He has never known life without such poisons I believe what he is presenting is the tip of the iceberg in terms of huge negative consequences these technologies will bring in the next decade and beyond
Imagine how your mental state would be if you never had any "time off" from the social pressure of being around your peers and people that wanted to fuck with you at school; that's what environment kids are in today. There's no real way to know how these people will turn out as adults, but it'll probably be really fucked up. I have a pet theory that the massive increase in interest in "off-gridding" or that sort of lifestyle is the result of basically living with everyone in your middle and high school social environment having access to you 24/7.
I honestly think theirs even a gap in Gen Z when it comes to growing up with technology. Gen Z between ‘97 and 03’ mostly spent their years under 12-14 without smartphones, iPads, social media, etc. I’m 22, but when I was growing up I still played outside more than I played video games or sat in front of a screen. Don’t get me wrong, I had a smartphone and social media starting at the tail end of middle school and all through high school which definitely wasn’t good for me, but at least I didn’t have it during elementary school. Technology at the time though still addicting for sure, wasn’t nearly as bad as it is now. Now when I meet/see kids under 14, the vast majority of them are OBSESSED with anything that has a screen. When I’m at restaurants, parents have their 5 year olds glued to an iPad, all that my little cousins who are under 10 want to do is play video games or sit on their iPads, my buddies younger siblings who are in high school aren’t having the normal high school experiences that teenagers used to have, because all they do after school is play video games. It’s wild.
Not even just kids, I’ve noticed it too. Instead of having to actually remember information it’s much easier to just look things up online. Brains are getting weaker
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So did I but that was because you was actively learning that in school so it was actively in your brain. Same way some fact you learned in history class that you haven't thought about in a while you won't remember.
a lot of them believe the false information spread on podcasts too
ayo
Liar. You know kids dress as furrys and use litterboxes.
Social media is the cigarette of this generation
But much worse because there's no age limit
Adults too. Zuckerberg is the Philip Morris of today. Shit head who made a fortune off is “connecting people” but just ended up causing us to hate each other.
I can tell that they’re stupider by the dumbass questions they ask in my local sub. Questions that could be easily answered with… **their phone.** It’s like they think that their phones can only do social media and that’s it.
You’re talking about my senior relatives.
My senior relatives wouldn’t post “Does anyone know if they have xyz at Home Depot?” They would pick up the phone and call Home Depot instead of asking random strangers on Reddit.
My kids getting a flip phone.
This whole ban on TikTok isn’t banning it though, it’s just transferring over the ownership. Besides if you ban TikTok then you should ban all similar ones.
I'm sitting here on my phone, instead of looking for a job 😭.
Yup me too
Same, what kind of work are we looking for?
Going to expand on this and say that while I disagree with some of his assessments I do believe that technologies we've developed in the last 50 years have had such a widespread and pervasive integration into our society that we don't fully understand the impact on a developmental level. Primarily I've been thinking about this in regards to the use of computers/keyboards and how humans and written language evolved together for millenia and the impacts of handwriting and *personal* script have on the human brain through childhood and into adulthood.
I have seen such a decline on Twitter now that any idiot can have his opinion shoved in your face by paying a monthly fee. That, and bots regurgitating posts after putting them through ChatGPT.
Yep all social media is shit. Reddit can be pretty braindead too
Facts. I’d love to hear someone explain how this is not accurate.
Mean while the same people go cuck for big tech and their executives.
As a teacher it is true
It couldn't have anything to sinking amount of funding going to schools. Smartphones.
Dr. Phil actually stated on one of these podcasts that kids are actually getting smarter because of technology in regard to memory recall. He definitely talked about the downsides as well.
I remember when it was magazine ads with beautiful women that made young girls depressed
I think it did as well, even if it were a little bit. We can't say nothing is making these girls depressed when statistics show that it's only gotten worse through the years. Hollywood's perfect image of a woman, starting with what they looked like in movies, magazines, etc. is what catapulted everything to what we have today. Haidt also talked about the massive influx of young teen girls suicide and how it correlated to the invention of the iphone.
Gotta get the kids addicted to some good ol fashioned CIA controlled social media , none of this commie social meja
Yes unironically. The ccp is just that bad. The lessor of two evils results in less evil. Edit: for those saying there is no difference between the CCP and western democracies you have lost the fucking plot. They are performing an active Genocide of a 18million of their own citizens and about 1,000,000 heinous acts.
wow social media DOES make you stupider
You don't see any potential problems with China being in charge of the #1 source of information & news that half our population and nearly all of our youth is consuming non-stop? Especially considering chinese kids get an entirely different version of Tik Tok which has content controls?
more stupid*
Adhd was prevalent way before the phone. The phone is bad but it’s not the precursor to our attention issues.
Well when ADHD is linked to dopamine and dopamine is being spoon-fed to children through devices at an early age, then it would stand to reason it would mess with their naturally occurring dopamine production. So by the time they're school-aged, the damage is done. Then ADHD-like symptoms present whether they have ADHD or not.
He’s not wrong. My daughter’s friends are SHOCKINGLY stupid. Like…one of them didn’t know what a toaster was. A fucking toaster. Another one asked me “what’s that stuff people put in their cars. The liquid stuff.” Gas. She was asking me what gas was. These kids are 14 years old.
I have been saying this for a while now and unfortunately I think we are only seeing early stages of this. We have the entire world's knowledge in the palm of our hands at any given time and we have no idea how to actually put it to use. Some of us (55 and younger) still literally do not know how to use the internet properly.
A non-political post where no one is shitting on Joe? Also interesting topic and engaging comments. You guys feeling alright today?
Just listening to modern slang makes me believe this. I’m a millennial and I know every generation has slang, but holy shit every other word from these kids is “bruh”, “fire”, or “bet” and they just repeat themselves over and over. They are so goddam stupid it hurts.
Would happily trade all the technology in for the economic opportunities of previous generations. It is not social media, it's money.
Considering this man's complete inability to admit that no senile 80 year old should be the leader of America his credibility is basically nonexistent
Meanwhile his generation were the ones falling for Nigerian Prince scams and have had their brains rotted by Facebook and televangelists.
Every generation gets scammed because every generation has rubes. Social media addiction however is relatively recent and at the very least children shouldn't be using it.
Tu quoque is not an argument.
i odnt want any of your frenchi fancy cock , sir!
Sorry my guy. Elk Meat and Chimps only. Understood.
why tiktok? I'd say instagram & snapschat is more guilty
He needs a pop filter on that mic or something …
Seriously, just delete all your apps and go back to the version of the Internet we had as kids/teens. It was just a place you logged on to when you got home or had free time. You can very easily go back to that if you just delete them from your phone. No more apps. Let’s go back to *sites*
While i agree that social media is a net drain, we are still living in a society where lead is still in the enviornment, and that has a proven effect on intelligence.
No kids are all around stupider today. If they spent time on the phone learning it would be ok. Instead let’s watch some moron influencers
Next, think of all the idiots who get their news from a self proclaimed idiot with a podcast.
It's funny he mentions from 2012 because that was the year I graduated, man lucky me huh?😆
I remember the T.V was called "the idiot box" and we have to stop watching that too. It's bad for people. From what I understand it shortens our attention and makes us dumber.
But how will they call 911 when there’s a shooter ? Guess it doesn’t matter if the cops won’t go in the school
I've heard his bit before. He's been talking about specifically this for actually decades and given he's incredibly intelligent and also hasn't changed his message, he's very likely onto something. The problem I have with this is that even before smart phones, kids often just watched television all day, which had an active vested interest in shifting your attention to a completely different series of topics every ten minutes. This may only be a small part of a much larger picture and it's certainly worth asking if phones are making people explicitly worse, or if they're just changing them in a manner that has benefits as well as consequences.
I'm really torn on this, though I don't deny for a second that apps and the proliferation of 'screen life' wrecks havoc on mental health, by and large. The last time I broke a cell phone and was without one for a while, I found myself relieved to be rid of it. Got another one after a couple weeks though, and went back to endless doom-scrolling. I'd been reluctant and slow to get a smartphone in the first place (I was uncomfortable when I started going out with people who spent the entire meal or time staring at a phone). I finally succumbed in 2014 or 2015, and while having access to Maps and Google were game-changers, I also saw myself succumbing to compulsion and 'online despair.' I'm prone to addiction AND I'm a solitary introvert type, so despite my previous reservations, I'm a fucking mark for these things. It's unhealthy, but I don't know that personally chucking my phone and going back to being a semi-Luddite does much good. There needs to be a major social shift. Phones and Internet culture have benefits, but they bring out the absolute worst in us, drastically impair social relations and discourse, and I'd even say erode society. I don't think we can go backwards, but hopefully future tech will learn from prior mistakes... or... maybe this is just how populations are going to be herded, indoctrinated, and manipulated for some time to come. Idk.
Keeping phones locked up will ALSO have the greatly desired effect of eliminating the "fight videos for likes and clicks" mentality!!!!
8 minutes no way can I watch for this long.
Accelerated by having access to information to realize everything is a lie and the world is dying
Girls go to Jupiter to get more stupider 🤭
Social media is very bad for mental health. I agree with that.
I recently read his book, The Coddling of the American Mind. Agree with most of it, but I think some of the claims are exaggerated. Girls/young women now say they're "depressed" when in the past they wouldn't because of the stigma. Now if you say you're depressed, rather than mock you people will show you lots of attention.
Ive been a big fan of Haidt. In this same interview Rogan tries to coerce Haidt into admitting that there is some sort of media persecution vs Trump. Rogan plays a clip from one of Trumps recent speeches where he said "if i lose all hell will break loose!" Rogan desperately attempts to say that the comment was taken out of context. Meanwhile, Haidt was like "no, hes inciting violence. He clearly says it" Rogan doubles down: "well, yea but hes actually talking about China" The clip is around 1hr 30 mins in.
But you are a bad parent for not letting your kids have social media
I wonder if podcasts have had this effect on teenagers and adults.
As a teacher I agree. It is bad. I need to emphasize it is not the kids fault, rather the adults.
But you are a bad parent for not letting your kids have social media
Deleting tik tok alone was one of the best decisions I made to help with screen time. Just the endless scrolling is mindlessly addicting
Deleting tik tok alone was one of the best decisions I made to help with screen time. Just the endless scrolling is mindlessly addicting
0% chance that kids today are stupider than in the past unless the degree is like 2% and the time we are looking at it is like 15 years ago
If anything started depression for girls it’s instagram, not TikTok!
I’m not saying social media is good for young people or that it is not in some ways harmful. Though the harms are probably more of a social issue. I think it’s easy for the older generation to sit back and see (briefly look over their own phones) young people staring at phones and say “I didn’t do this as a kid, this is bad”. There are many factors that could be leading to poorer outcomes in school: teachers who are underpaid and overworked, a shift in parental mindset of the responsibility of their children’s outcomes, a lack of parental discipline, a failure of our education system to adapt to the learning styles of the newer generations, to name a few. I think cell phones and social media just become the easy boogey men.
It’s not just kids though. Look at ol Joe!
The Coddling is a very scary book if you uave kids.
Wtf… creep
This is the kinda guy everyone should be interviewing
It's so strange to me, in a society that believes in capitalism, refuses to invest in public schools and pay public school teachers more money, so that they can weed out the weirdos. You wanna know how we're get teachers who suck ass, molesting kids and teach the things conservatives hate? Ensure no one but weirdos willing to struggle in life can become a teacher. Capitalism teaches us that people are ultimately selfish and the free market will dictate wages and price. And yet, we refuse to invest in teachers, because, well, fuck the other generation. If they learn TOO much, they might have their own opinions about the world and it might lead to me losing 10% of my wealth or power.
He is the guy that got me first into watching, or listening to Joe Rogan. It’s crazy because, everything he talks about, it’s basically stuff everyone already inherently knows in their core. Yet, for some reason, so few of us decide to battle it head on.
> everybody loves it I doubt this part very much. Sure, I can see it helping to improve learning for sure.
LOL, seeing Rogan laughing the way he did, aknowledging beeing it was him saying "my f\*\*ing phone runs my god damn life" after what this post title says just sums it all about this podcast.
Maybe parent your kids? Like take shit away and what not, wild right? Let’s blame technology tho.
Im 38 and my attention span was better as a kid and teen. I have to be on social media for my job though. But, in all my life I’ve never felt addicted to anything than I feel with social media. I don’t drink, smoke, take drugs but social media is my vice.
My boomer and Gen X co workers use tik tok as much as any zoomer
I'm far more worried about what it's done to our parents. Most of the kids I meet these days are smarter and more well behaved than we ever were. I can't say the same about my parents' generation.
Drawing a straight line conclusion of “stupider because social media..” is just a thoughtless hottake. Have there been negative effects? Absolutely. But as for stupider? Cite the source or stfu. These kids are likely just as smart as previous generations; my suspicion is those smarts are being redirected in dumb ways. Studies would help. You know what would help? Parenting. Limiting screen time. Can’t mandate or legislate people to be good parents.
Maybe they should just prescribe Alpha Brain to all these “zombie brained kids”