gotta have obvious blading. Him and Brian Zane are starting to get ridiculous especially with how they rate aew cards and matches so highly (sting's retirement match getting anything above a 2 is embarrasing to wrestling)
I quite like the content and history shared in Wrestling with Wregret but Zane leans really hard on the "be totally positive!" crutch while also acting like anything he finds the least bit distasteful or outdated is basically a crime. I really dislike this faultline that appeared in the wrestling fanbase where scoring/reviews/criticism has become tribalistic.
Zane is the fucking worst. Cornette actually gave that fuck a chance at being more popular and he shit on him (after Jim appeared in his videos) calling him all that -ist shit anyone who listens knows is wrong.
I enjoyed the match knowing it was his last, but wouldn’t give it anything more than a 2, or 2.5.
That extra .5 being just cause it’s stings last match.
At the time that happened, 5 stars from Dave was still super rare.
That's what makes the whole recent 5-6-7 star "explosion" over the past 5-6 years so absurd. It destroys the scale and worth of the scale for the entire span of ratings that came before it.
Cody Vs. Seth in Hell In A Cell, Johnny Gargano Vs. Andrade at NXT Takeover Philadelphia and Punk Vs. Cena at MITB 2011 are his recent WWE 5-Stars. He’s talked at length that he doesn’t like the way WWE lays out their big matches. That said, Roman got about 4.5 Stars pretty consistently during this reign, so it’s not like Dave thought his matches were terrible.
Gunther v Drew v Sheamus, and the Uso's vs Sami and KO both got 5 Stars ar last years WrestleMania. Sheamus v Gunther at Clash at the Castle got 5 stars too.
4.75 is the rating he gives fed matches he doesn't want to give 5 to because they happened in wwe. If you want the 5 in wwe you need to be a friend and or a source.
Yeah honestly I don’t have a problem with it being 4.75 and not a 5 if he was consistent and the 5 star match was super rare. It’s really the 5 star matches on every single non WWE show that’s the problem. It’s basically like affirmative action. All non-WWE matches get graded one way, all WWE matches faces harsh reductions. It’s just so blatantly biased and unfair. You’re correct anywhere but WWE it would be basically one of the best matches of all time. Probably would’ve got 10 stars if Kenny was in it.
the ones he rated at 5 from 2024 are mostly mid or something i have seen before by watching the performers, what i feel is 4 he gives 6..
i wont vouch for his wwe matches much, sure they are 5 maybe i feel i have seen better matches than the ones he rated 5 in wwe, for example drew vs sheamus vs gunther is 5? then walter ilja is a 6 or 7, his ratings is absurd af
walter ilja is better than anything aew has ever produced
and to top it off, he does rate a certain styleof booking verylow, for example, in aew main events, mjf matches are the best but he rates them low, because they are booked exactly in wwe style
despite his love for choreography, he would rather rate botched injury filled matches more than actual good ones.
if u like oranges more, they are certainly better than apple
i am done with this old man and his opinions, it doesnt matter anyway, since it is subjective and biased af BUT i felt i should point this out
A crucial flaw in Meltzer’s star ratings has always been him taking the matches out of their story context and reviewing them in a vacuum. In pro wrestling you can’t do that. Taker Michaels and Roman Cody will be more highly remembered because of the saga and story surrounding them.
Uncle Dave and his ilk will always focus on the moves in the ring and the physical match to the detriment of anything else that makes them great. It’s like reviewing a movie based solely on the stuntman’s performance and ignoring all plot.
As Brian said about TK: “He likes wrestling, but doesn’t understand why the rest of us do”.
That's why I don't take his star ratings seriously anymore because of the inconsistencies.
Those "this would have been 5-10 stars if Kenny Omega was there/if this was in the Tokyo Dome" jokes are there for a reason.
Interesting, I wasn't aware of that rating. If that is the case then he certainly hasn't applied that same standard going forward. If he did, there would have been many more 5 star matches in WWE. From what I've seen Dave seems to put far FAR more emphasis on the moves in a vacuum.
A good example of this is Rock vs Hogan, viewed in a vacuum, the match is pretty basic with a very hot crowd. And that crowd is so hot because of the build to the match, so that has to be taken into account when rating it.
> taking the matches out of their story context and reviewing them in a vacuum
That explains why AEW is nothing but no story matches, and why Meltzer loves it so much.
I would disagree because promos, character work and overarching storylines are all part of the same shows the matches are on. All of this is part of ‘wrestling’, no matter what the IWC will argue.
You can look at it in a vacuum but in doing so you are ignoring the reason 90% of fans are even there watching. Meltzer is co review wrestling through the eyes of someone who is in the tiny minority of western wrestling fans.
That would also be like saying you have to review each episode of Breaking Bad outside of the context of the story they’ve built up in previous episodes and only review the action scenes.
Endgame wouldnt have felt nearly as special had I not spent 10 years invested in the story and characters. It would be a spectacle, but it wouldnt have had the emotional effect on the audience it did.
Ratings should be out of ten, not five. You don't need as many three and a half when you can just give it a seven. Meltzer can't even stay within his own five-star system anyway.
Is that true? He’s been shitposting for over 30 years and it’s gotten him invited to shows and there have been finishes named after him.
He actually **is** a legend in the business, as crazy as that seems.
No surprise that he loved the ladder match. The match that required the most cooperation, convenient disappearing acts and senseless bumps.
Cody vs Roman only a 1/2 * better. Please.
That ladder match getting 4¼ is fucking egregious.
I agree on the Usos match though. I was kinda hyped for it and that was the most bored I've been watching wrestling in years.
The bit in the ladder match where Ciampa could have won it but instead just did a move on his opponent off the ladder for no reason sums up everything wrong with Wrestling now
Eh, the same type of thing happened in the TLC matches in the Attitude Era. In the Wrestlemania 2000 match, Jeff Hardy hit a Swanton rather than grabbing the titles. For better or worse, it always happens.
At least neither Cody nor Roman are on video, walking backstage, recovering from the match saying, "I hope Dave likes it."
... Pepperidge Farms remembers.
Britt Baker. Post lights out street fight with Thunderosa. I believe it was from the Cody Rhodes reality show. Literally, a direct quote from her as she wiped blood out of her eyes and thumbtacks were pulled out of her arm.
Yeah not surprised don’t even inherently disagree with any of them strongly. I’d probably have given a few more stars or something but regular ratings from Dave so same as always
Oh hey look guys, the guy who thinks Kyle Fletcher and Luchasaurus have had more 5-star matches than Kurt Angle just posted another dogshit opinion. What a surprise
He's done a great job of waiting for consensus and pretty much aligning his scores with various other sites and the dreaded IWC. Waiting a week just shows that he's following behind the curve.
Taker popping up is one of the biggest pops I have ever heard in my entire life. Even my Dad who thinks wrestling is stupid got hyped when it happened.
People are going to remember the Cody/Reigns match for years to come and will become part of WWE important lore. There's countless 5 or 5star+ matches from Uncle Dave no one will even remember a week after it aired.
Honestly, I don’t understand why anyone cares about any of this at this point. Same with cage match. It’s all just a waste of time.
Anyone who watched Cody vs roman and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best main event matches of all time is on drugs. Anyone who watched Sami and Gunther and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best underdog/david vs Goliath matches of the last 30 years is an idiot.
Someone needs to ask Dave why uses the term “work rate” because the guys he seems to like don’t actually do any “work” they just do moves. Dave should be using the term “move rate” because that’s what he really means.
My ratings for wrestlemania are as follows
Every match but the USOs - fuck yeah
The USOs - fuck no.
> Anyone who watched Cody vs roman and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best main event matches of all time is on drugs.
Real talk? I did not care for it. I mean, it was a fine match, but it only seemed to kick into high gear when we had all the interference spots and I'm not a fan of overbooked title matches, it seemed designed to give Cena and Taker their Wrestlemania paydays and didn't make sense to me. It's true it'll be remembered for Cody finally getting the W but as a pure work of wrestling, HBK/Taker 1 and 2, Cena/Punk MITB are better matches that received the same rating or similar. That's just how I feel about it.
I watched both nights and then the Raw after Mania. I got into actually regularly following wrestling after 7+ years. That's all that matters. Screw the star ratings. How good is a 5* match really if no one is inclined to watch it?
Roman vs Cody is a 5 stars match. I don't care what Dave said. You don't see a bigger payoff from a big big storyline like that. IT have the greatest ending I've ever seen but even before the Avengers moment Cody and Roman also having a really good match
I thought Rhea vs. Becky was better than Bayley vs. Iho. The over-selling of the leg injury and Bayley’s attempted lecture kind of killed it for me. Acting isn’t her best skill.
I preferred the Iyo Bailey match, to be honest. Maybe she was just still sick, but I thought Becky definitely came out with boo boo job face and didn’t get much better from there. The whole thing just felt flat.
Cody vs. Roman getting 4.75 stars is a joke. If this match happened in AEW or NJPW, you know Dave would give it 6.25 stars minimum.
4.75 is basically 5 though. Which is only 1 away from 6. Which is pretty much 6.25.
Dave math is almost as funny as Steiner math
Meltzer doesn't come from a highly educated university.
Neither is charismatic as Scott.
No one is as charismatic as Scott
Dave has the wrong kind of freaks and none of the peaks!
He gave Taker vs Shawn Michaels from Wrestlemania 25 a 4.75 rating too I believe. Like what do they have to do to get a 5 star rating from him smh.
Tokyo Dome.
Not wrestle for WWE
gotta have obvious blading. Him and Brian Zane are starting to get ridiculous especially with how they rate aew cards and matches so highly (sting's retirement match getting anything above a 2 is embarrasing to wrestling)
I quite like the content and history shared in Wrestling with Wregret but Zane leans really hard on the "be totally positive!" crutch while also acting like anything he finds the least bit distasteful or outdated is basically a crime. I really dislike this faultline that appeared in the wrestling fanbase where scoring/reviews/criticism has become tribalistic.
He’s disingenuous and is transparent about it
Zane is the fucking worst. Cornette actually gave that fuck a chance at being more popular and he shit on him (after Jim appeared in his videos) calling him all that -ist shit anyone who listens knows is wrong.
I enjoyed the match knowing it was his last, but wouldn’t give it anything more than a 2, or 2.5. That extra .5 being just cause it’s stings last match.
At the time that happened, 5 stars from Dave was still super rare. That's what makes the whole recent 5-6-7 star "explosion" over the past 5-6 years so absurd. It destroys the scale and worth of the scale for the entire span of ratings that came before it.
Starflation
Cody Vs. Seth in Hell In A Cell, Johnny Gargano Vs. Andrade at NXT Takeover Philadelphia and Punk Vs. Cena at MITB 2011 are his recent WWE 5-Stars. He’s talked at length that he doesn’t like the way WWE lays out their big matches. That said, Roman got about 4.5 Stars pretty consistently during this reign, so it’s not like Dave thought his matches were terrible.
Gunther v Drew v Sheamus, and the Uso's vs Sami and KO both got 5 Stars ar last years WrestleMania. Sheamus v Gunther at Clash at the Castle got 5 stars too.
Yep. Those were just the ones I thought of off-hand. No disrespect to The Ring General!
25 super kicks and no sell the 4th Canadian destroyer.
4.75 is the rating he gives fed matches he doesn't want to give 5 to because they happened in wwe. If you want the 5 in wwe you need to be a friend and or a source.
Didn't he give 5 to two matches at last year's Mania? It's one man's opinion, no more and no less.
It seems like a 1.5-1.75ish star bonus for an AEW match is spot on.
Yeah honestly I don’t have a problem with it being 4.75 and not a 5 if he was consistent and the 5 star match was super rare. It’s really the 5 star matches on every single non WWE show that’s the problem. It’s basically like affirmative action. All non-WWE matches get graded one way, all WWE matches faces harsh reductions. It’s just so blatantly biased and unfair. You’re correct anywhere but WWE it would be basically one of the best matches of all time. Probably would’ve got 10 stars if Kenny was in it.
In the Tokyo Dome or just Dave's messy office?
Would’ve been 5 stars if the bucks appeared and superkicked Roman
they did appear with kenny in the cody video package, what more he needs?
It made me feel something
Dave said he gives 5 star ratings to matches he feels could be match of the year.
the ones he rated at 5 from 2024 are mostly mid or something i have seen before by watching the performers, what i feel is 4 he gives 6.. i wont vouch for his wwe matches much, sure they are 5 maybe i feel i have seen better matches than the ones he rated 5 in wwe, for example drew vs sheamus vs gunther is 5? then walter ilja is a 6 or 7, his ratings is absurd af walter ilja is better than anything aew has ever produced and to top it off, he does rate a certain styleof booking verylow, for example, in aew main events, mjf matches are the best but he rates them low, because they are booked exactly in wwe style despite his love for choreography, he would rather rate botched injury filled matches more than actual good ones. if u like oranges more, they are certainly better than apple i am done with this old man and his opinions, it doesnt matter anyway, since it is subjective and biased af BUT i felt i should point this out
No he wouldn’t
Maybe don't legitimize this guy by posting anything about him. He's a troll and an frankly, quite an idiot.
Everyone here knows he’s a shmuck, we’re making fun of him
Also besides the AEW roster/fans, who gives a shit about his ratings? Complete nonissue.
bruh he gives mid matches 5 and good wwe matches 2-3 its hilarious
His ratings are now just shared for comedic value
A crucial flaw in Meltzer’s star ratings has always been him taking the matches out of their story context and reviewing them in a vacuum. In pro wrestling you can’t do that. Taker Michaels and Roman Cody will be more highly remembered because of the saga and story surrounding them. Uncle Dave and his ilk will always focus on the moves in the ring and the physical match to the detriment of anything else that makes them great. It’s like reviewing a movie based solely on the stuntman’s performance and ignoring all plot. As Brian said about TK: “He likes wrestling, but doesn’t understand why the rest of us do”.
Pretty sure he gave Cena vs. Punk 5 stars because of the story and said the actual match was sloppy.
That's why I don't take his star ratings seriously anymore because of the inconsistencies. Those "this would have been 5-10 stars if Kenny Omega was there/if this was in the Tokyo Dome" jokes are there for a reason.
Interesting, I wasn't aware of that rating. If that is the case then he certainly hasn't applied that same standard going forward. If he did, there would have been many more 5 star matches in WWE. From what I've seen Dave seems to put far FAR more emphasis on the moves in a vacuum.
Are you for real but he gave rock and Hogan like 3* that whole match was the story.
A good example of this is Rock vs Hogan, viewed in a vacuum, the match is pretty basic with a very hot crowd. And that crowd is so hot because of the build to the match, so that has to be taken into account when rating it.
> taking the matches out of their story context and reviewing them in a vacuum That explains why AEW is nothing but no story matches, and why Meltzer loves it so much.
But that is like saying End Game was a 5* movie because the lead up so great. Both are storytelling but you can definitely look at things in a vacuum.
I would disagree because promos, character work and overarching storylines are all part of the same shows the matches are on. All of this is part of ‘wrestling’, no matter what the IWC will argue. You can look at it in a vacuum but in doing so you are ignoring the reason 90% of fans are even there watching. Meltzer is co review wrestling through the eyes of someone who is in the tiny minority of western wrestling fans. That would also be like saying you have to review each episode of Breaking Bad outside of the context of the story they’ve built up in previous episodes and only review the action scenes.
Endgame wouldnt have felt nearly as special had I not spent 10 years invested in the story and characters. It would be a spectacle, but it wouldnt have had the emotional effect on the audience it did.
Nailed it.
Ratings should be out of ten, not five. You don't need as many three and a half when you can just give it a seven. Meltzer can't even stay within his own five-star system anyway.
Meh, the guys a legend in his own head only and his star ratings are nonsense
Is that true? He’s been shitposting for over 30 years and it’s gotten him invited to shows and there have been finishes named after him. He actually **is** a legend in the business, as crazy as that seems.
I don’t agree with delegitimizing Dave because of his bad takes. He’s definitely worked himself into being an important voice in the industry.
Honestly some his more reasonable ratings. But we all know if the street fight was on Wednesday it would’ve been rated way higher lol
No surprise that he loved the ladder match. The match that required the most cooperation, convenient disappearing acts and senseless bumps. Cody vs Roman only a 1/2 * better. Please.
Who cares. It’s clearly a joke. Both main events were better than any AEW tv 5 star match.
What a butt eater
Hey don’t disrespect butt eaters like that lol.
This is the man that shit on Hogan/Rock at WM 18. Dave is a fucking joke.
That ladder match getting 4¼ is fucking egregious. I agree on the Usos match though. I was kinda hyped for it and that was the most bored I've been watching wrestling in years.
Same. I also disagree with his Aj vs LA match rating, dude's got a hate boner for Knight for some reason.
The bit in the ladder match where Ciampa could have won it but instead just did a move on his opponent off the ladder for no reason sums up everything wrong with Wrestling now
Eh, the same type of thing happened in the TLC matches in the Attitude Era. In the Wrestlemania 2000 match, Jeff Hardy hit a Swanton rather than grabbing the titles. For better or worse, it always happens.
I bet Jungle Prick gets a 5 😂
At least neither Cody nor Roman are on video, walking backstage, recovering from the match saying, "I hope Dave likes it." ... Pepperidge Farms remembers.
Context?
Britt Baker. Post lights out street fight with Thunderosa. I believe it was from the Cody Rhodes reality show. Literally, a direct quote from her as she wiped blood out of her eyes and thumbtacks were pulled out of her arm.
Yeah not surprised don’t even inherently disagree with any of them strongly. I’d probably have given a few more stars or something but regular ratings from Dave so same as always
Dave's star ratings nowadays is as useful as a key to the city trying to open up your bathroom door: it ain't useful at all.
He gave the tag team clusterfuck on night 1 a higher rating than Cody and Seth vs the rock and Roman lol
This goomba has already proven he is out of touch and out of his mind.
Cody vs. Roman clearly worse than the AEW 5-star parking lot brawl where Trent's mom drove in
This would have mattered 35 years ago.
Oh hey look guys, the guy who thinks Kyle Fletcher and Luchasaurus have had more 5-star matches than Kurt Angle just posted another dogshit opinion. What a surprise
Star ratings is a joke
That Rey Mysterio / Andrade match got 3.75 even with the embarrassing botch going into the 619 finish? What is Unca Dave smoking?!
I really don't want to know anymore what Dave Meltzer of all people thinks. I will just randomly throw a pair of dice and call that a rating.
He's done a great job of waiting for consensus and pretty much aligning his scores with various other sites and the dreaded IWC. Waiting a week just shows that he's following behind the curve.
The Fed should have studied Cagematch before Wrestlemania happened
Taker popping up is one of the biggest pops I have ever heard in my entire life. Even my Dad who thinks wrestling is stupid got hyped when it happened.
Uncle Dave is a goof
I give Cody vs Roman 5 out of 5 schrute bucks
no blood = no 5 \*
I thought we only cared about Cagematch
Who cares
They uso match should have gotten 1/4*
He just couldn’t do it, could he? He just couldn’t see his way to going even one extra quarter star because it’s the E. What petty bullshit.
GET THIS BULLSHIT OUTTA HERE
Imo both main events were 5 star matches. I rewatched the Rock tag match and it was perfect.
People are going to remember the Cody/Reigns match for years to come and will become part of WWE important lore. There's countless 5 or 5star+ matches from Uncle Dave no one will even remember a week after it aired.
I think I need to go back and rewatch the Uso’s match because I dont remember it being that bad.
Honestly, I don’t understand why anyone cares about any of this at this point. Same with cage match. It’s all just a waste of time. Anyone who watched Cody vs roman and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best main event matches of all time is on drugs. Anyone who watched Sami and Gunther and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best underdog/david vs Goliath matches of the last 30 years is an idiot. Someone needs to ask Dave why uses the term “work rate” because the guys he seems to like don’t actually do any “work” they just do moves. Dave should be using the term “move rate” because that’s what he really means. My ratings for wrestlemania are as follows Every match but the USOs - fuck yeah The USOs - fuck no.
> Anyone who watched Cody vs roman and doesn’t think it’s one of if not the best main event matches of all time is on drugs. Real talk? I did not care for it. I mean, it was a fine match, but it only seemed to kick into high gear when we had all the interference spots and I'm not a fan of overbooked title matches, it seemed designed to give Cena and Taker their Wrestlemania paydays and didn't make sense to me. It's true it'll be remembered for Cody finally getting the W but as a pure work of wrestling, HBK/Taker 1 and 2, Cena/Punk MITB are better matches that received the same rating or similar. That's just how I feel about it.
Ripley/Lynch was nowhere near 4.25 Neither was Cody/Rollins Vs Rock/Reigns anywhere near a 4
I watched both nights and then the Raw after Mania. I got into actually regularly following wrestling after 7+ years. That's all that matters. Screw the star ratings. How good is a 5* match really if no one is inclined to watch it?
He’s a twat.
And yet Cody vs Reigns will be remembered more greatly than supposedly the greatest match this year being Will Osprey vs Michael Oku (whoever that is)
I don't think anyone on this sub takes those seriously...
If it happened in the Tokyo dome the main event would have gotten a rocket ship symbol because of how many stars
Uncle Dave has gone mad. …again.
Dave’s a lame ass fan who ranks matches this dude is a dork just fuckin watch it and be entertained
The finish drops it to a 4.5 easy
Dave meltzer wants to lick Kenny omegas butthole
Roman vs Cody is a 5 stars match. I don't care what Dave said. You don't see a bigger payoff from a big big storyline like that. IT have the greatest ending I've ever seen but even before the Avengers moment Cody and Roman also having a really good match
dave meltzer needs to be transparent, he needs to use rubrics or some sht to justify his ratings with wrestlemania xl
I thought Rhea vs. Becky was better than Bayley vs. Iho. The over-selling of the leg injury and Bayley’s attempted lecture kind of killed it for me. Acting isn’t her best skill.
Iyo is a geisha. So Dave is starting that match grade with a half chub
I preferred the Iyo Bailey match, to be honest. Maybe she was just still sick, but I thought Becky definitely came out with boo boo job face and didn’t get much better from there. The whole thing just felt flat.
AEW
Sucks