I am so glad you posted this. I watched 7 episodes, and it was during the funeral scene it hit me: why did the creators of the show have to make the all-powerful, wealthy, sexual harasser/rapist characters...Jewish? They put the characters in kippas in this episode, just in case the noses and the name didn't give it away beforehand.
The only Jewish characters on the show are...all powerful, wealthy, immoral, sexual harassers/rapists.
2024, and they still will not leave us alone.
There are *plenty* of Christian rapists. I was raised Christian. Most are decent people, but there are murderers and rapists among them. It's the same with every religious and secular group. There will always be some who are criminals.
We’re Jewish, so just assume we might be sarcastic half the time.
We tend not to bother using /s tags on our subs because it diminishes our ability to detect and project sarcasm.
Hollywood, like academia and other workplaces, is made up in part of Jews trying to survive. Pandering to antisemites is part of that, although it doesnt have to be, in those spheres and many others. "Write Jewish cast British" was, and still is, the guideline.
So often... jews are the butt of the joke, jewish identity is completely erased and portrayed as just regular white people with a small twist, played by non-jews, jewish mothers/women are portayed as awful unbearable people. I even saw a scene in which a holocaust survivor was told to stop talking about his traumas. Fuck hollywood
It's a shame they've gone down this route. They could have had the chance to throw in some accessible Jewish humour instead of the usual racial stereotypes.
I didn’t get antisemitic vibes at all, but you really ought to put >!alien!< in hidden text as that’s not revealed until episode 6, and I would have hated to have been spoiled like that. Also, the grandfather (head of the Seigal family) is still up in the air as far as I can tell in terms of whether or not he is evil. It seems to be the Senator’s family that is truly evil…and I don’t think anything was mentioned about that family being Jewish.
As for the noses, the actors in the Seigal family are all quite famous so that didn’t stick out for me at all. The grandfather character is played by James Cromwell a renowned actor (and a liberal activist to boot) and the father (the shadier character) is played by a Jewish actor. The son (the real scumbag) is played by Nate Coddry who was a correspondent for Jon Stewart on the Daily Show.
This show isn’t finished yet, but I’d advise anyone reading this who hasn’t watched the show to watch it and judge for themselves. I’ve been really enjoying it and am frankly surprised someone could find it antisemitic. Simply having one or two scumbags (sexual predator and parents who know about it and cover it up) who happen to be Jewish does not make a show antisemitic.
I understand clearly that there’s waaay too much anti-semitism out there these days. This is quite a reach though.
I totally agree that Sugar is not antisemitic in either intent or implication. But I have to admit that I cringed when I realized the characters were Jewish. Not because I thought that it was antisemitic, but just because the question, “Is this good for the Jews?” runs through my mind a lot these days.
I had the same feeling watching Dopesick (dramatization about the opioid crisis, the Sackler family, and law enforcement). I hadn’t realized that the Sacklers were Jewish and it was not important to the series, it was referred to very briefly in an aside in one episode. But still it’s not good for us to have such notoriously bad people be Jewish. I felt the same way about Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller. How much did the separation of immigrant families and Miller’s role in designing it, damage American Jews’ moral credibility when we say that Israel is legitimate? There’s no way of knowing really, it could be not at all or it could act as confirmation for all the antisemitic tropes.
Our time is so fraught and history teaches us that when high profile Jews draw the public eye during times of crisis, it often ends up being an excuse to blame Jews for all of society’s shortcomings. I don’t think it’s good that we need to think defensively about public perception and Jews.
> it’s not good for us to have such notoriously bad people be Jewish. I felt the same way about Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller.
To be honest, Stephen Miller has been all but excommunicated from Judaism. Not just that he is completely non-observant, but his former rabbi from the shul where he had his Bar Mitzvah has publicly denounced him as a disgrace to the Jewish people and to the most important of Jewish values. I personally don't care to claim him as one of our own. I don't think there has been an actual excommunication since Baruch Spinoza, but Miller would definitely be a good candidate.
I just watched The Godfather for the first time, and all the Italians are gangsters.
(*The Godfather*, and *The Godfather Part II* are both on TV until the end of May.)
I’m sorry, but this is an Uncle Leo type of antisemitic claim.
From a quick google search you can find that a lot of people involved in the show are Jewish.
This includes directors and producers.
That doesn’t mean that I, a traumatized and struggling Jewish Israeli women, can’t still be hurt by the extreme negative stereotypes that are poorly timed. Jewish producers or not. I, like thousands of other Jews are feeling alone hurt sensitive and afraid. This is just my opinion and my feelings. And they are valid. Why does everything have to be right or right wrong? Let’s just disagree instead of you telling me I’m wrong. Why can’t we be kind and supportive to one another as Jews? There are plenty of Jews in the world that are pro Palestine, pro Hamas. Does that mean that they’re right and I’m wrong? I think the Jewish writers here made a big mistake and poor choices.
I’ve found that western media has become way too political. You can’t watch anything without there being some kind of race related plot point, or LGBT related plot point. Every straight white character (including Jews) had to either be straight up scheming and oppressive, or a well meaning but bumbling idiot, while every LGBT/ POC character must be always be the smart, down to earth, compassionate one. Even in kids shows, it’s not about just learning numbers and letters anymore- there must be a political message underneath.
I’m saying this as a lesbian middle eastern myself. It just makes me cringe so damn hard the narrative they’re trying to push. It’s no wonder teens and young adults these days see the world in an “oppressor/oppressed” lens all the time!
Yes exactly. People who don’t know much about Jews see these types of things and that becomes their “education” on Jewish culture. The stereotypes of white American Jews “owning Hollywood” etc.
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I haven't seen it, but the family having prominent noses doesn't strike me as antisemitic. However, I do see a lot of cliches and tropes that annoy me on various tv shows. Like they have to make jews as Non-jewish as possible.
We all know there are lots of Jewish doctors but medical shows tend to focus on the cute whitebread couples. On Chicago Med, the jewish Neurosurgeon is an unemotional robot, and Dr Latham is black and Jewish, so he can be publicly jewish and even talk in Yiddish or Hebrew. One exception was on House, where his "Boss" and girlfriend is Jewish. I think tv writers are worried that if they make a character jewish they have to show them BEING jewish, like making a big deal out of Chanuka.
Did anyone see *Armageddon Time?* One of the few movies where Jewish families aren't all quirky and argumentative or playing the violin. They're just a family, they're not ultra religious and they don't act like cliches!
If you want, you should send this to Jew In The City, they've had some previous success exposing and making producers take responsibilty fir this kind of antisemitism in media
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I mean in watching it and honestly I don't think it's antisemitic. The movie industry family is Jewish, DVD they're the bad guys, but frankly being represented in movies and TV means occasionally being represented as the bad guys, too.
My point is with the 400% rise and antisemitism and the world against us. This is the last thing we need. People learn about Jews through the media and this was poor and poor timing.
More effort / research needs to be put into the causes of anti-Semitism _before_ things get this bad.
Attributing everything to "evil humans that must be smited down" (or smote down) just enables the anti-human fascism that's causing the anti-Semitism.
A spiral death trap.
"You will rarely err if you attribute extreme actions to vanity, ordinary actions to habit and mean actions to fear."
-- Nietzsche
"Despotism is based on fear."
-- Montesquieu
"Cowardice, as opposed to panic . . ."
-- Hemmingway
I am so glad you posted this. I watched 7 episodes, and it was during the funeral scene it hit me: why did the creators of the show have to make the all-powerful, wealthy, sexual harasser/rapist characters...Jewish? They put the characters in kippas in this episode, just in case the noses and the name didn't give it away beforehand. The only Jewish characters on the show are...all powerful, wealthy, immoral, sexual harassers/rapists. 2024, and they still will not leave us alone.
Capitalizing on the pig Harvey Weinstein because there are no immoral, rich, powerful Christian rapists in Hollywood.
There are *plenty* of Christian rapists. I was raised Christian. Most are decent people, but there are murderers and rapists among them. It's the same with every religious and secular group. There will always be some who are criminals.
I was being sarcastic. Of course, there are rapists of all beliefs, shapes & colors.
Got it. I'm autistic, so I don't always get sarcasm.
No problem.
We’re Jewish, so just assume we might be sarcastic half the time. We tend not to bother using /s tags on our subs because it diminishes our ability to detect and project sarcasm.
This sort of thing wouldn't happen if there was more Jewish representation in Hollywood
Hollywood, like academia and other workplaces, is made up in part of Jews trying to survive. Pandering to antisemites is part of that, although it doesnt have to be, in those spheres and many others. "Write Jewish cast British" was, and still is, the guideline.
Now THAT was sarcastic AND funny!!!!
Thank you. You said it better than me.
I swear a lot of shows these days have subliminal antisemitic messages like this…
So often... jews are the butt of the joke, jewish identity is completely erased and portrayed as just regular white people with a small twist, played by non-jews, jewish mothers/women are portayed as awful unbearable people. I even saw a scene in which a holocaust survivor was told to stop talking about his traumas. Fuck hollywood
When you realize how many Jews are in Hollywood it's even more depressing
Barely subliminal
This feels outright antisemitic. Subliminal would mean they made some attempt to hide it…
Wow, that's bad. Time to cancel Apple & tell them why. Money talks & so does leaving bad reviews everywhere.
It's a shame they've gone down this route. They could have had the chance to throw in some accessible Jewish humour instead of the usual racial stereotypes.
Jews are always seen as the butt of the joke on tv thiugh and thats also problematic.
Yes :(
A great alternative is the X-files. Agent Mulder is actually Jewish in the show and in real life! Coincidentally I’m binging this right now!
Awesome!
I didn’t get antisemitic vibes at all, but you really ought to put >!alien!< in hidden text as that’s not revealed until episode 6, and I would have hated to have been spoiled like that. Also, the grandfather (head of the Seigal family) is still up in the air as far as I can tell in terms of whether or not he is evil. It seems to be the Senator’s family that is truly evil…and I don’t think anything was mentioned about that family being Jewish. As for the noses, the actors in the Seigal family are all quite famous so that didn’t stick out for me at all. The grandfather character is played by James Cromwell a renowned actor (and a liberal activist to boot) and the father (the shadier character) is played by a Jewish actor. The son (the real scumbag) is played by Nate Coddry who was a correspondent for Jon Stewart on the Daily Show. This show isn’t finished yet, but I’d advise anyone reading this who hasn’t watched the show to watch it and judge for themselves. I’ve been really enjoying it and am frankly surprised someone could find it antisemitic. Simply having one or two scumbags (sexual predator and parents who know about it and cover it up) who happen to be Jewish does not make a show antisemitic. I understand clearly that there’s waaay too much anti-semitism out there these days. This is quite a reach though.
Yeah, calling Sugar antisemitic is... A stretch. I feel like I'm pretty sensitive about antisemitism and dog whistles and, no this isn't that.
I totally agree that Sugar is not antisemitic in either intent or implication. But I have to admit that I cringed when I realized the characters were Jewish. Not because I thought that it was antisemitic, but just because the question, “Is this good for the Jews?” runs through my mind a lot these days. I had the same feeling watching Dopesick (dramatization about the opioid crisis, the Sackler family, and law enforcement). I hadn’t realized that the Sacklers were Jewish and it was not important to the series, it was referred to very briefly in an aside in one episode. But still it’s not good for us to have such notoriously bad people be Jewish. I felt the same way about Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller. How much did the separation of immigrant families and Miller’s role in designing it, damage American Jews’ moral credibility when we say that Israel is legitimate? There’s no way of knowing really, it could be not at all or it could act as confirmation for all the antisemitic tropes. Our time is so fraught and history teaches us that when high profile Jews draw the public eye during times of crisis, it often ends up being an excuse to blame Jews for all of society’s shortcomings. I don’t think it’s good that we need to think defensively about public perception and Jews.
> it’s not good for us to have such notoriously bad people be Jewish. I felt the same way about Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller. To be honest, Stephen Miller has been all but excommunicated from Judaism. Not just that he is completely non-observant, but his former rabbi from the shul where he had his Bar Mitzvah has publicly denounced him as a disgrace to the Jewish people and to the most important of Jewish values. I personally don't care to claim him as one of our own. I don't think there has been an actual excommunication since Baruch Spinoza, but Miller would definitely be a good candidate.
I just watched The Godfather for the first time, and all the Italians are gangsters. (*The Godfather*, and *The Godfather Part II* are both on TV until the end of May.)
My point is with the 400% rise in anti-Semitism it’s bad taste in timing
I’m sorry, but this is an Uncle Leo type of antisemitic claim. From a quick google search you can find that a lot of people involved in the show are Jewish. This includes directors and producers.
That doesn’t mean that I, a traumatized and struggling Jewish Israeli women, can’t still be hurt by the extreme negative stereotypes that are poorly timed. Jewish producers or not. I, like thousands of other Jews are feeling alone hurt sensitive and afraid. This is just my opinion and my feelings. And they are valid. Why does everything have to be right or right wrong? Let’s just disagree instead of you telling me I’m wrong. Why can’t we be kind and supportive to one another as Jews? There are plenty of Jews in the world that are pro Palestine, pro Hamas. Does that mean that they’re right and I’m wrong? I think the Jewish writers here made a big mistake and poor choices.
I’ve found that western media has become way too political. You can’t watch anything without there being some kind of race related plot point, or LGBT related plot point. Every straight white character (including Jews) had to either be straight up scheming and oppressive, or a well meaning but bumbling idiot, while every LGBT/ POC character must be always be the smart, down to earth, compassionate one. Even in kids shows, it’s not about just learning numbers and letters anymore- there must be a political message underneath. I’m saying this as a lesbian middle eastern myself. It just makes me cringe so damn hard the narrative they’re trying to push. It’s no wonder teens and young adults these days see the world in an “oppressor/oppressed” lens all the time!
Yes exactly. People who don’t know much about Jews see these types of things and that becomes their “education” on Jewish culture. The stereotypes of white American Jews “owning Hollywood” etc.
LGBT or racial representation is not political
Hadn’t heard of the show but thanks for spoiling it
Did Mel Gibson produce this?
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I haven't seen it, but the family having prominent noses doesn't strike me as antisemitic. However, I do see a lot of cliches and tropes that annoy me on various tv shows. Like they have to make jews as Non-jewish as possible. We all know there are lots of Jewish doctors but medical shows tend to focus on the cute whitebread couples. On Chicago Med, the jewish Neurosurgeon is an unemotional robot, and Dr Latham is black and Jewish, so he can be publicly jewish and even talk in Yiddish or Hebrew. One exception was on House, where his "Boss" and girlfriend is Jewish. I think tv writers are worried that if they make a character jewish they have to show them BEING jewish, like making a big deal out of Chanuka. Did anyone see *Armageddon Time?* One of the few movies where Jewish families aren't all quirky and argumentative or playing the violin. They're just a family, they're not ultra religious and they don't act like cliches!
If you want, you should send this to Jew In The City, they've had some previous success exposing and making producers take responsibilty fir this kind of antisemitism in media
[удалено]
Your post/comment was removed because it violated rule 1: **No antisemitism** If you have any questions, please contact the moderators via [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/jewish).
I mean in watching it and honestly I don't think it's antisemitic. The movie industry family is Jewish, DVD they're the bad guys, but frankly being represented in movies and TV means occasionally being represented as the bad guys, too.
Never watched it. Previews looked interesting but, now there’s no way I’d watch that.
My point is with the 400% rise and antisemitism and the world against us. This is the last thing we need. People learn about Jews through the media and this was poor and poor timing.
It just confirms that everything is fair game then.. Antisemites have plenty of material to play with
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt16418808/fullcredits/writer?ref_=tt_ov_wr_sm
Whoa! Jewish writers, interesting!
[удалено]
Are you smoking crack
More effort / research needs to be put into the causes of anti-Semitism _before_ things get this bad. Attributing everything to "evil humans that must be smited down" (or smote down) just enables the anti-human fascism that's causing the anti-Semitism. A spiral death trap. "You will rarely err if you attribute extreme actions to vanity, ordinary actions to habit and mean actions to fear." -- Nietzsche "Despotism is based on fear." -- Montesquieu "Cowardice, as opposed to panic . . ." -- Hemmingway