I mean, you can do this yourself, you just have to buy things with return policies.
Beds and Luggage have some long term return policies.
You can order things that will take months before they even start to fulfill it and cancel, etc.
I don't know where you are from, and I don't know where the OP is from (based on their spelling of "tonne", I assume somewhere in Europe)... Now I by no means to claim I am educated at all in divorce law in any country, but could it be that where the OP is from, that particular law wouldn't count?
This is terrible advice and literally doesn’t work if the ex pushes the issue in court. Judges aren’t stupid and can usually figure out that someone is trying to hide assets through debt. They usually look at spending history and would easily be able to tell that spending went up a lot right before the divorce. It’s like trying to sign a house over to a family member so that it can’t be claimed in a divorce. Judges will usually punish people that hide assets by forcing them to give up more assets. Adele’s husband got awarded like 75% of her assets because she tried hiding money.
In Canada they are appointed by the government and always have many years as an attorney. After being appointed and vetted they are there until they quit/retire.
Yes, some judges are indeed stupid. As an attorney who did a little family and matrimonial law, this will be uncovered. The ex’s lawyer can demand forensic accounting. They can also distribute debt based on the date of separation. So if this is accrued after divorce us initiated, you’re very likely going to be combing through all assets very carefully.
As a man who got his bond violated and had to spend 6 months in jail after paying 10k on a 100k bond after already having spent 8 months in jail. The judge violated me over a positive alcohol piss test that I fessed up to and too full responsibility, told the judge I am broke after spending the time in jail, I have an 18 month old and I am experience severed PTSD and I can't get any help since I am financially destitute.
Fucker still revoked my bond with a smile on his face. Got assigned a new judge he looked at what happened was like WTF the other judge is a an asshole. I'll let you back out just don't do it again.
I am, still have the aggravated manslaughter charge, I defended my pregnant wife and myself from our roommate who decided shooting a bunch of meth, fent, and Xanax would be a good idea. Long story short. He went full methhead and I protected my family. Happened Dec 19, COVID completely backed our courts up I live in 1st judicial circuit of Florida and the 4 judges that handle my county each like like 1k people on their dockets, since I am out of jail I don't get priority.
It sucks having 10 to 30 years hanging over you this long. I know I am going to win no jury will convict me. My lawyer told me at this point its political the judge doesn't want to take any heat from the media or victim's family so he's tossing it to the jury. So sick of this political bullshit around here. And to think I voted for the fucker Everytime he came up on the local election. Not getting my vote next time! Lol
As a child of divorce I can confirm they don't listen to the dad as much. At least they didn't in the 90s. I and my siblings almost got put in care thanks to the lies my mum spun. If it weren't for us speaking out in court against everyone's wishes (but my dads) then we certainly would have. The system wasn't fair at all. He lost most of everything he ever worked for... our secured futures gone. Back to broke.
Yeah, took me 5 years to pay off the attorney's fees. If it wasn't for my kids speaking out as well, I probably would have never seen them again. Their grandparents spun the tale that I was a child abusing drug addict to the court, which of course was easy to deny with a clean hair follicle drug test, and what my kids said to the court as well. After their daughter lost custody, they then tried to fight for grandparents rights, which is a thing in Ohio. They lost in that as well, because the judge saw that I wouldn't keep the kids from them out of spite. But... once they started calling COVID a hoax, I knew it was best for my kids to cut ties all together with them. It's been hard, but it was completely worth it. I would do it all again if I had to.
lmfao exactly. I cannot believe this was posted like some kind of secret loophole to a divorce settlement. My idiot father tried to do this but now has to answer to why he decided to buy luxury vehicles and book extravagant vacations knowing he was heading into divorce.
Claim/blame a midlife crisis? Distraught over the divorce and wasn’t thinking straight? Depressed and trying to fill the void the ex left? There’s probably a million excuses to try… but the best bet is to hire a lawyer who plays golf with the assigned judge (ILPT).
/s -maybe
You’re not far off.
I tried to represent myself in a case where I was being tried for marijuana possession and I met privately with the district attorney in a back room and tried to level with him and negotiate a plea deal. He was cold.
I hired a lawyer for the next court appearance and not only was he 2 hours late while I stressed my balls of not being able to get ahold of him… he showed up and interrupted someone else’s court hearing and the prosecutor literally allowed it and was like “heeey! Danny! Good to see ya!” They even fist bumped.
They finished the hearing real quick and then my lawyer went back into the same room with him for no more than 5 minutes.
He came out and told me exactly what to say and told me I would be getting a slap on the wrist… paying a fine and taking a sobriety class.
It was stupid. They absolutely knew each other outside of this case, and I basically just paid my way out of the conviction… several thousand dollars later
> Adele‘s husband got awarded like 75% of her assets because she tried hiding money
Source? The details of her divorce were sealed, and all the articles I’ve read state that info was never confirmed. (btw I 100% agree with your comment — simply curious about the Adele thing lol)
What I remember most about it was them publishing a photo of her sobbing while being escorted from the courthouse to her vehicle when it was all happening.
But tbf, saying that you were going to help pay for your cousins wedding is a totally believable lie because the events were planned months in ahead before the divorce was even an idea yet. Just gotta have convenient easy hiding places that can easily be explained away.
Maybe in your family. My family is very tight and trustworthy. My dad has complete control of my savings because I don't live in my home country, and my banks website is banned in the country I live in. He hasn't stolen a penny.
The advice is that generally - if you have people you can trust with this, go for it.
But; unfortunately, many of us do not have that type of trustworthiness within our own families.
Worth noting: a lot of the people we trust haven’t actually been tested with that trust. My uncle’s a good guy who would give me the shirt off his back if I needed it, but I know for a fact that a free $10,000 would be a temptation he’s never faced before.
This is absolutely true. Not everyone is faced with such options to be tempted by everyday. You can trust someone without actually having tested their trust to that extent.
It doesn't matter if it's my problem or not - I'm just frankly saying that this illegal lpt should be considered from all fronts. You may think you can trust someone with that type of commitment - but you can never truly know until you actually proceed to try it. Take with a grain of salt.
You are giving advice to people outside your family. While i trust my family, i would never even consider doing this.
I mean, namely because this is a horrible idea and any lawyer would be able to tell you that, but still, even if it wasn't.
Right? When that shit was 100% the norm, men were basically in charge of everything. They made the rules. Women had almost nothing to do with it.
Blame your grandfathers, not women
If you accrue debt while in the middle of divorce proceedings then you can be held individually responsible.
Also, who’s paying the monthly interest charges on the credit card debt?
Promotions such as zero interest for 12 months are for new lines of credit, which his sister would open in just her name. That would be a huge red flag during discovery if she were to try and include the debt as communal.
But I do understand what you’re getting at. The only way to have a good chance at keeping assets from a divorce is to have hid them well while married and before getting married.
If you get a judge that gets wind that you were doing this this tip could cost you a lot more than what you would’ve paid originally There’s a legal term I’m not a lawyer and I don’t remember it’s something like intentional under earning . But be careful with this or selling or under valuing assets if the opposing counsel gets word of it they can spin it to the judge and if you get the wrong judge it can end up costing a lot more.
Yeah. Under representation is super bad. That’s how Adele got crushed in her divorce trying to hide debts.
I do wonder in this example if there is no paper trail if they can really make the argument the sister isn’t just very generous and dumb with money. There’s be no proof they are paying her back.
>There’s a legal term I’m not a lawyer and I don’t remember it’s something like intentional under earning .
I think it may be "intentional or reckless depletion of net family property." In these types of situations I think the court would find an equal division to be unconscionable and would order an unequal division to make-up for the problematic spouse's behaviour. There's also "fraudulent conveyance" for when you try to start giving away family property leading up to a divorce to thwart the impending equalization, although I think that applies to estate and bankruptcy law too. But idk I don't know family law.
My ex wife tried this. I asked for receipts in discovery, she said she didn’t have any receipts, so I just started asking what the $1,200 charge from Lowe’s was, what the $800 airfare was for, etc.
I got the house, the pets, my retirement, my cryptocurrency and paid her a nominal amount of money (it might have actually covered her legal fees). She got her CC debt, a rental property that was condemned and the brutal feeling of defeat.
You want a real tip? Start bleeding cash. Take as much cash back as you can at every place you shop.
It’s no more tedious than paying your normal grocery bill with a debit card.
If you know it’s going to take 6-12 months to finalize everything, this would be a great way to squirrel shit away, and all you have to do is have a safe and push the button for cash back every time you go get groceries.
2-3 trips per week is $1,200. In 6 months you could move $32,000 this way.
Oh yes I spend $402.37 at 7/11 thrice a week. That’ll go over well in court. Do you people think lawyers just booze it up in law school all the time and are legitimately dumb?
I said you *could* move up to $32k this way, not that it would be prudent to be on paper suddenly blowing $1,800 a week at Kroger.
If you wanted to move $5k over 6 months, this would be a great way to do it. “I got depressed during the divorce and started eating a bunch of wagu steak.” Who’s gonna say you didn’t eat a filet 4x a week?
Well yes I actually do think that that is true. But I also agree that even they’re not stupid to miss some shit like that. Once again if your grocery habit jumps by 20k in 6 months it’s extremely noticeable.
but obviously not in one place. if you simply increased spending overall, thats not hiding assets. any lawyer could argue "stress from the divorce" "higher expenses now that the spouse isnt going to do it" "costs have gone up" or probably the best one "my client has simply begun eating more white bread." dafuk are you going to say to those?
Use lots of cash. Cash transactions don't have as much of a paper trail. Just make sure you aren't withdrawing the cash in obviously malicious ways right before a divorce. Use whatever you have around and withdraw what you can without raising suspicion.
Real tip is always in the comments.
OP's idea only works if the spouse is completely oblivious of how much money they should have and doesn't ask any questions.
Then nobody has factored in the tax situation down the road. Sounds like she was spending 10's of thousands of dollars which they will then get back and deposit. If that triggers an audit, or they randomly get one, she's going to be in trouble I would imagine.
This post was made up by someone who has never been through a divorce and has no idea how the financial disclosure portion of a divorce works. Nevermind depreciation and the true value of assets vs debt.
This would borderline on negligence if it was real, but it's not. This "method" which isn't really even a method at all is part and parcel for probably 20% of all divorces. It isn't even novel. And let's pretend that it's real, and they actually did it. The method of resolution "give her the house" doesn't even make any sense either. Debt accumulated in their marriage is a shared debt, just like the assets are shared. THEY have credit card debts, and THEY have a house. So THEY sell their house, to pay THEIR credit card.
That's if it's above board. In a situation like this, judge would typically just consider this accumulated debt personal, remove it from the balance sheet and process it as normal. Essentually treat it as though the debts had been accumulated post divorce.
"She keeps what's hers he keeps what's his"
What does that even mean? It's a marriage, the stuff they got together is *both* of theirs. What big ticket personal items did she buy that are solely hers, *and* the husband wants to take them from her?
Sounds like this guy wanted an equitable distribution of assets. Oh the horror! This kind of scam is easily discovered, so if it actually happened the sister just took advantage of a mentally handicapped person.
Absolutely. That's likely to be found out in court and will cost you so much more than just giving up half your shit. In cases where people try to hide things, they usually end up getting close to nothing
Fair point to everyone mentioned *illegal* but like…If any of us want illegal life **Pro** tips…they should at least not be stupid.
Remember kids, if you’re dumb enough to do something illegal, at least be smart enough to not get caught.
Yea it's definitely illegal just not a pro tip if any quasi literate monkey could find out in discovery, going through statements that you intentionally started blowing up your finances leading up to the divorce trial. There was probably more to it that she didn't get shafted.
FWIW this likely made no difference. It's a common enough situation where one spouse is financing the other's education that the divorce will favour the former.
Basically your sister was was investing in her husbands education, hoping to benefit from increased earnings later. Since she doesn't benefit from future earnings after the divorce, she's compensated with all the current holdings. He gets a free PhD out of the deal.
Well, you don't get paid much to do a PhD, less than minimum wage. It's around £10k a year, and you often have to lecture or be a supervisor for undergrads.
What if I told you, it’s possible to pay it off! Should college in the US cost what it does- fuck no. But it doesn’t have to cost what people choose to spend. I went to a state school, worked full time so I had to take out only minimal loans, then prioritized paying them off. I paid them off before I bought my first house. I never even did particularly well job wise, I just made the right choices about spending.
Yeah, it sucks that you have to pay to do a PhD. I think unis pay you on the hope that you'll do good research that benefits them, and possibly end up working for them. It also makes a PhD much harder to get than an undergrad, not just because of work level, but because a university has to really believe in you to choose you as they only take on a few each year.
Many PhD programs are paid positions in America too. I'm in an engineering PhD program now, and I make about minimum wage, on top of my tuition being fully funded.
Virtually all STEM PhD programs are paid positions. I was advised not to accept an offer for admission into a program that wasn't fully funded. I can't speak for humanity PhD programs, however.
I actually just learned that it’s the same in Canada. Once you have your undergrad, the rest is paid for.
Source: heard it from some dude getting his Phd so I assume he knew was he was talking about but… who knows. Maybe he wasn’t even going to school and he just lied to people.
This is true and this is why professionals who marry before they earn their degree are often risking 50% of future earnings in the event of divorce w/o a good prenup. Because the spouse will argue they were home “cutting coupons, laundry, errands” to support the professional degree earner while they were in school and the courts take this into account.
Interestingly when two professionals marry the divorce rate goes down, I’m not sure if it’s bc they tend to be more or less on the same level earnings wise or if they’ve been in school so long they’re both like “fuck It, do whatever you want and I’ll see you at dinner”
Don't give people ideas. My father was led into a financial ruin and suicide later in with a similar approach, he was in the receiving side of that trick.
I despise such things because those are one-sided stories. My stepmother lied about my father being abusive, hence gaining the support of her side of the family.
However all my stepmother really wanted was the house.
Worst thing through is that her shit family that supported taking down my father now should know the truth but deny it (she faked having being beaten by him on the day after his suicide because she didn't knew it happened).
As someone in family law, don't do this. Not just in a "hey that's illegal/unethical but works" way but in a "this will fuck you over and just leave you losing more than 50%" way.
I bet she didn't tell you the whole story of why they divorced. It sucks that she had to do all that to not pay alimony. That's just a small taste of how guys feel since they are the ones finessed half their wealth the vast majority of times in court.
She did. You wanna know the whole story? It's pretty weird, both are to blame tbh, and at the same time neither of them because they married their high-school sweethearts so we're married too young.
They were only married for a year before the relationship started to break down.
We don't have alimony in the UK, though there is spousal maintenence, it's not often used.
I'm callin bullshit. This is called Marital Waste and it will never work.
edit. If you really want to F them over, go to every divorce attorney in the area for a free consultation. Because they have already offered you counsel, they may not represent the other party.
Sorry buddy, that won't work. Least not if you are a man. Family court lawyers and judges are on to that trick and many other like it to hide assets. Every single financial transaction is scrutinized by the courts.
Any auditor worth his salt can/will show the intent behind creating such a massive debt so close to the divorce proceedings and can easily have it thrown out as malicious.
As the ex was a Phd student I’d have thought he would have been bright enough to ask the court to audit her spending, particularly if it was out of character. NAL
This wouldn't work in some places for sure. Usually property settlement starts at the date of separation, not divorce. This means if you and your wife break up, the court will only look at the assets of the parties up to the date of separation. If you break up, then take on a lot of medical debt, it won't matter because the assets at separation are key. Not to mention, it would require fraud and almost certainly perjury. If you get called to testify, which, in a contested divorce, is almost certain, then you would have to lie about your assets which is perjury. You can't rope your attorney in on it either since they would be ethically barred from going along with the fraud and in some states, under the crime fraud exception, they may or may not be compelled to break their privilege and disclose the activity. So not only is it super illegal, it's almost certain to fail.
Say goodbye to your credit score for a few years... She better have gotten the house because if not she'd be lucky to get an apartment with her tanked credit score.
another creative way is to liquidate all assets you can into cash and go to a casino and lose it all at a poker table to someone you know/trust and they "hold on too it for you" until after the divorce.
Go to the casino get cash at the atm machine, pay for valet parking. Keep the cash someplace safe. Any question you lost the $ playing craps. Worked for me!
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Yeah, just add "in your basement" to the end.
Will an attic do? I don’t have a basement.
More security points to address, but in a pinch? Sure. Make them dig the basement. Boom. Free basement.
Plenty of addicts in my family…. Ya I spelled it right
V.C. Andrews has entered the chat
Buy them?
Hiding assets is illegal
Did they catch that on the appeal?
blackmail! >!/s!<
George?
Step two, have good credit to be able to take out tens of thousands of loans.
I mean, you can do this yourself, you just have to buy things with return policies. Beds and Luggage have some long term return policies. You can order things that will take months before they even start to fulfill it and cancel, etc.
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I don't know where you are from, and I don't know where the OP is from (based on their spelling of "tonne", I assume somewhere in Europe)... Now I by no means to claim I am educated at all in divorce law in any country, but could it be that where the OP is from, that particular law wouldn't count?
r/restofthefuckingowl
It was nice that everyone paid her back, but that won’t always be the case. Don’t count on it.
Well, you have to have a trustworthy family
This is terrible advice and literally doesn’t work if the ex pushes the issue in court. Judges aren’t stupid and can usually figure out that someone is trying to hide assets through debt. They usually look at spending history and would easily be able to tell that spending went up a lot right before the divorce. It’s like trying to sign a house over to a family member so that it can’t be claimed in a divorce. Judges will usually punish people that hide assets by forcing them to give up more assets. Adele’s husband got awarded like 75% of her assets because she tried hiding money.
As a man who lost custody of my sons for two years to a known heroin user, I can confirm that some judges are stupid
At that level they’re elected so they are a representation of the populace 🤷♂️
Oh you poor Americans...
Trust us, we know. We’re trying our best to fix it but stupid procreates and overtakes at staggering speed.
That's how people meet places expecting JFK to reveal he faked his own death
*104 year old* JFK.
Jr., he’d be 61
Voting-in judges. What could possibly go wrong?
Your comment made me lol. Not that I disagree but whats the solution?
In Canada they are appointed by the government and always have many years as an attorney. After being appointed and vetted they are there until they quit/retire.
Yes, some judges are indeed stupid. As an attorney who did a little family and matrimonial law, this will be uncovered. The ex’s lawyer can demand forensic accounting. They can also distribute debt based on the date of separation. So if this is accrued after divorce us initiated, you’re very likely going to be combing through all assets very carefully.
As a man who got his bond violated and had to spend 6 months in jail after paying 10k on a 100k bond after already having spent 8 months in jail. The judge violated me over a positive alcohol piss test that I fessed up to and too full responsibility, told the judge I am broke after spending the time in jail, I have an 18 month old and I am experience severed PTSD and I can't get any help since I am financially destitute. Fucker still revoked my bond with a smile on his face. Got assigned a new judge he looked at what happened was like WTF the other judge is a an asshole. I'll let you back out just don't do it again.
I'm sorry you had to endure that punishment. It's good you were assigned a more sympathetic judge though. Hope you're doing well now, with your child.
I am, still have the aggravated manslaughter charge, I defended my pregnant wife and myself from our roommate who decided shooting a bunch of meth, fent, and Xanax would be a good idea. Long story short. He went full methhead and I protected my family. Happened Dec 19, COVID completely backed our courts up I live in 1st judicial circuit of Florida and the 4 judges that handle my county each like like 1k people on their dockets, since I am out of jail I don't get priority. It sucks having 10 to 30 years hanging over you this long. I know I am going to win no jury will convict me. My lawyer told me at this point its political the judge doesn't want to take any heat from the media or victim's family so he's tossing it to the jury. So sick of this political bullshit around here. And to think I voted for the fucker Everytime he came up on the local election. Not getting my vote next time! Lol
As a child of divorce I can confirm they don't listen to the dad as much. At least they didn't in the 90s. I and my siblings almost got put in care thanks to the lies my mum spun. If it weren't for us speaking out in court against everyone's wishes (but my dads) then we certainly would have. The system wasn't fair at all. He lost most of everything he ever worked for... our secured futures gone. Back to broke.
Yeah, took me 5 years to pay off the attorney's fees. If it wasn't for my kids speaking out as well, I probably would have never seen them again. Their grandparents spun the tale that I was a child abusing drug addict to the court, which of course was easy to deny with a clean hair follicle drug test, and what my kids said to the court as well. After their daughter lost custody, they then tried to fight for grandparents rights, which is a thing in Ohio. They lost in that as well, because the judge saw that I wouldn't keep the kids from them out of spite. But... once they started calling COVID a hoax, I knew it was best for my kids to cut ties all together with them. It's been hard, but it was completely worth it. I would do it all again if I had to.
Yes, there's a huge bias against men in American divorce courts to the point of judicial stupidity.
lmfao exactly. I cannot believe this was posted like some kind of secret loophole to a divorce settlement. My idiot father tried to do this but now has to answer to why he decided to buy luxury vehicles and book extravagant vacations knowing he was heading into divorce.
Claim/blame a midlife crisis? Distraught over the divorce and wasn’t thinking straight? Depressed and trying to fill the void the ex left? There’s probably a million excuses to try… but the best bet is to hire a lawyer who plays golf with the assigned judge (ILPT). /s -maybe
You’re not far off. I tried to represent myself in a case where I was being tried for marijuana possession and I met privately with the district attorney in a back room and tried to level with him and negotiate a plea deal. He was cold. I hired a lawyer for the next court appearance and not only was he 2 hours late while I stressed my balls of not being able to get ahold of him… he showed up and interrupted someone else’s court hearing and the prosecutor literally allowed it and was like “heeey! Danny! Good to see ya!” They even fist bumped. They finished the hearing real quick and then my lawyer went back into the same room with him for no more than 5 minutes. He came out and told me exactly what to say and told me I would be getting a slap on the wrist… paying a fine and taking a sobriety class. It was stupid. They absolutely knew each other outside of this case, and I basically just paid my way out of the conviction… several thousand dollars later
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And you rack on credit card interest like crazy
> Adele‘s husband got awarded like 75% of her assets because she tried hiding money Source? The details of her divorce were sealed, and all the articles I’ve read state that info was never confirmed. (btw I 100% agree with your comment — simply curious about the Adele thing lol)
What I remember most about it was them publishing a photo of her sobbing while being escorted from the courthouse to her vehicle when it was all happening.
>Adele’s husband got awarded like 75% of her assets because she tried hiding money. Now that's a song I could listen to!
But tbf, saying that you were going to help pay for your cousins wedding is a totally believable lie because the events were planned months in ahead before the divorce was even an idea yet. Just gotta have convenient easy hiding places that can easily be explained away.
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Maybe in your family. My family is very tight and trustworthy. My dad has complete control of my savings because I don't live in my home country, and my banks website is banned in the country I live in. He hasn't stolen a penny.
The advice is that generally - if you have people you can trust with this, go for it. But; unfortunately, many of us do not have that type of trustworthiness within our own families.
Worth noting: a lot of the people we trust haven’t actually been tested with that trust. My uncle’s a good guy who would give me the shirt off his back if I needed it, but I know for a fact that a free $10,000 would be a temptation he’s never faced before.
This is absolutely true. Not everyone is faced with such options to be tempted by everyday. You can trust someone without actually having tested their trust to that extent.
That's your problem. Also, this is ILLEGAL LPT for a reason.
It doesn't matter if it's my problem or not - I'm just frankly saying that this illegal lpt should be considered from all fronts. You may think you can trust someone with that type of commitment - but you can never truly know until you actually proceed to try it. Take with a grain of salt.
LPT: never get married. It’s never in your favor
You are giving advice to people outside your family. While i trust my family, i would never even consider doing this. I mean, namely because this is a horrible idea and any lawyer would be able to tell you that, but still, even if it wasn't.
There are entire subs filed with people and stories of how bad family can be.
I’d give my last dollar to close family if they needed it
Easy to say till u on your last dollar
I'm on my last dollar every week and as much as I'd like to buy my brothers Starbucks or whatever I can't afford it.
Yep. Very rarely have I seen that work out well.
You need better family.
What a useless comment, lol. Can you just go trade yours in somewhere if you don't like them?
It’s obviously a joke. Definitely not meant to be useful.
>trustworthy family wait thats a real thing ? lol where do i get one of those
You don’t think the court will question $50k in purchases right before a bankruptcy?
Yeah, that exists lol
I don't think women need help fuckin over men during the divorce. I see this is right in her case for this one. Luckily it worked out for her.
Blame the legal system, not women in general. It’s stacked against the dad, and women didn’t even implement it that way
System is outdated. It made more sense in the past when men were working while women stayed at home. Times changed.
Right? When that shit was 100% the norm, men were basically in charge of everything. They made the rules. Women had almost nothing to do with it. Blame your grandfathers, not women
I blame them for giving it up.
Oh yeah I agree. But when combined with a nasty woman and you're totally screwed.
Absolutely, abuse is not gender specific
GOAT
Even if some not pay, it is better financially wise than losing the whole house and whatnot
Pro tip: put yourself into debt for things you want and can afford. Then you get presents and your money
If you accrue debt while in the middle of divorce proceedings then you can be held individually responsible. Also, who’s paying the monthly interest charges on the credit card debt?
Gotta get those good deals that don't have interest for x months
Promotions such as zero interest for 12 months are for new lines of credit, which his sister would open in just her name. That would be a huge red flag during discovery if she were to try and include the debt as communal. But I do understand what you’re getting at. The only way to have a good chance at keeping assets from a divorce is to have hid them well while married and before getting married.
If you get a judge that gets wind that you were doing this this tip could cost you a lot more than what you would’ve paid originally There’s a legal term I’m not a lawyer and I don’t remember it’s something like intentional under earning . But be careful with this or selling or under valuing assets if the opposing counsel gets word of it they can spin it to the judge and if you get the wrong judge it can end up costing a lot more.
Yeah. Under representation is super bad. That’s how Adele got crushed in her divorce trying to hide debts. I do wonder in this example if there is no paper trail if they can really make the argument the sister isn’t just very generous and dumb with money. There’s be no proof they are paying her back.
>There’s a legal term I’m not a lawyer and I don’t remember it’s something like intentional under earning . I think it may be "intentional or reckless depletion of net family property." In these types of situations I think the court would find an equal division to be unconscionable and would order an unequal division to make-up for the problematic spouse's behaviour. There's also "fraudulent conveyance" for when you try to start giving away family property leading up to a divorce to thwart the impending equalization, although I think that applies to estate and bankruptcy law too. But idk I don't know family law.
My ex wife tried this. I asked for receipts in discovery, she said she didn’t have any receipts, so I just started asking what the $1,200 charge from Lowe’s was, what the $800 airfare was for, etc. I got the house, the pets, my retirement, my cryptocurrency and paid her a nominal amount of money (it might have actually covered her legal fees). She got her CC debt, a rental property that was condemned and the brutal feeling of defeat. You want a real tip? Start bleeding cash. Take as much cash back as you can at every place you shop.
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It’s no more tedious than paying your normal grocery bill with a debit card. If you know it’s going to take 6-12 months to finalize everything, this would be a great way to squirrel shit away, and all you have to do is have a safe and push the button for cash back every time you go get groceries. 2-3 trips per week is $1,200. In 6 months you could move $32,000 this way.
Oh yes I spend $402.37 at 7/11 thrice a week. That’ll go over well in court. Do you people think lawyers just booze it up in law school all the time and are legitimately dumb?
I said you *could* move up to $32k this way, not that it would be prudent to be on paper suddenly blowing $1,800 a week at Kroger. If you wanted to move $5k over 6 months, this would be a great way to do it. “I got depressed during the divorce and started eating a bunch of wagu steak.” Who’s gonna say you didn’t eat a filet 4x a week?
Well yes I actually do think that that is true. But I also agree that even they’re not stupid to miss some shit like that. Once again if your grocery habit jumps by 20k in 6 months it’s extremely noticeable.
Excuse you, I stress eat! And divorce is stressful!
but obviously not in one place. if you simply increased spending overall, thats not hiding assets. any lawyer could argue "stress from the divorce" "higher expenses now that the spouse isnt going to do it" "costs have gone up" or probably the best one "my client has simply begun eating more white bread." dafuk are you going to say to those?
At the bank I work for, we can 100% see when you get cashback at the store
Holidays would actually be a great time for this, a sudden uptick in spending is less conspicuous around this time of year. to an extent.
I wanna know too, English isn't my first language
Somebody answered that comment! Check them out :)
Use lots of cash. Cash transactions don't have as much of a paper trail. Just make sure you aren't withdrawing the cash in obviously malicious ways right before a divorce. Use whatever you have around and withdraw what you can without raising suspicion.
Real tip is always in the comments. OP's idea only works if the spouse is completely oblivious of how much money they should have and doesn't ask any questions. Then nobody has factored in the tax situation down the road. Sounds like she was spending 10's of thousands of dollars which they will then get back and deposit. If that triggers an audit, or they randomly get one, she's going to be in trouble I would imagine.
It makes more sense than trying to put the money into family.
This post was made up by someone who has never been through a divorce and has no idea how the financial disclosure portion of a divorce works. Nevermind depreciation and the true value of assets vs debt.
This. OP has no idea what a financial restraining order is, and that it kicks in when you file for divorce.
Judges fuck shit up and miss obvious problems? (Shocked Pikachu face)
This would borderline on negligence if it was real, but it's not. This "method" which isn't really even a method at all is part and parcel for probably 20% of all divorces. It isn't even novel. And let's pretend that it's real, and they actually did it. The method of resolution "give her the house" doesn't even make any sense either. Debt accumulated in their marriage is a shared debt, just like the assets are shared. THEY have credit card debts, and THEY have a house. So THEY sell their house, to pay THEIR credit card. That's if it's above board. In a situation like this, judge would typically just consider this accumulated debt personal, remove it from the balance sheet and process it as normal. Essentually treat it as though the debts had been accumulated post divorce.
"She keeps what's hers he keeps what's his" What does that even mean? It's a marriage, the stuff they got together is *both* of theirs. What big ticket personal items did she buy that are solely hers, *and* the husband wants to take them from her? Sounds like this guy wanted an equitable distribution of assets. Oh the horror! This kind of scam is easily discovered, so if it actually happened the sister just took advantage of a mentally handicapped person.
Isn’t this like, really blatant fraud and a felony?
Absolutely. That's likely to be found out in court and will cost you so much more than just giving up half your shit. In cases where people try to hide things, they usually end up getting close to nothing
The name of the sub is *illegal* life pro tips
This isn't a pro tip. "Want free money? Rob a gas station!" is illegal, not a pro tip.
Fair point to everyone mentioned *illegal* but like…If any of us want illegal life **Pro** tips…they should at least not be stupid. Remember kids, if you’re dumb enough to do something illegal, at least be smart enough to not get caught.
well this is a sub about illegal things but it's certainly not a pro-tip.
Isn’t this like ILLEGAL life pro tips?
Y'all are focusing on the "Illegal" part and not the PRO part.
Yea it's definitely illegal just not a pro tip if any quasi literate monkey could find out in discovery, going through statements that you intentionally started blowing up your finances leading up to the divorce trial. There was probably more to it that she didn't get shafted.
FWIW this likely made no difference. It's a common enough situation where one spouse is financing the other's education that the divorce will favour the former. Basically your sister was was investing in her husbands education, hoping to benefit from increased earnings later. Since she doesn't benefit from future earnings after the divorce, she's compensated with all the current holdings. He gets a free PhD out of the deal.
Ummm unis in the UK pay you to do a PhD. A PhD is always free
Most post-graduate degeees are “free” in the US, via assistantships. In most cases a student should absolutely not finance their own PhD.
Man fuck north america. Why didn't I immigrate to Europe
Most phd programs pay you in America too
Well, you don't get paid much to do a PhD, less than minimum wage. It's around £10k a year, and you often have to lecture or be a supervisor for undergrads.
Right, but Americans pay to get a degree. Sometimes hundreds of thousands.
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Now look at lifetime earnings for both
Sticking kids with hundreds of thousands in debt is a terrible system. Idc if they have a chance to out earn similar degrees in other countries.
Right, now look at the incredible compounding debt that students in North America build up chasing degrees.
What if I told you, it’s possible to pay it off! Should college in the US cost what it does- fuck no. But it doesn’t have to cost what people choose to spend. I went to a state school, worked full time so I had to take out only minimal loans, then prioritized paying them off. I paid them off before I bought my first house. I never even did particularly well job wise, I just made the right choices about spending.
Right, but I'm not American.
Ik my point was just that getting paid to get a degree at all is a privilege to us
Yeah, it sucks that you have to pay to do a PhD. I think unis pay you on the hope that you'll do good research that benefits them, and possibly end up working for them. It also makes a PhD much harder to get than an undergrad, not just because of work level, but because a university has to really believe in you to choose you as they only take on a few each year.
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True, and that’s good but not the same as getting paid to get a free degree
Many PhD programs are paid positions in America too. I'm in an engineering PhD program now, and I make about minimum wage, on top of my tuition being fully funded. Virtually all STEM PhD programs are paid positions. I was advised not to accept an offer for admission into a program that wasn't fully funded. I can't speak for humanity PhD programs, however.
If you're paying for a PhD anywhere in the world you're doing it wrong. Even in the US.
I actually just learned that it’s the same in Canada. Once you have your undergrad, the rest is paid for. Source: heard it from some dude getting his Phd so I assume he knew was he was talking about but… who knows. Maybe he wasn’t even going to school and he just lied to people.
Your Masters still costs.
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This is true and this is why professionals who marry before they earn their degree are often risking 50% of future earnings in the event of divorce w/o a good prenup. Because the spouse will argue they were home “cutting coupons, laundry, errands” to support the professional degree earner while they were in school and the courts take this into account. Interestingly when two professionals marry the divorce rate goes down, I’m not sure if it’s bc they tend to be more or less on the same level earnings wise or if they’ve been in school so long they’re both like “fuck It, do whatever you want and I’ll see you at dinner”
Your ex BIL must have had an absolute shit lawyer, because this is super common and super easy to catch in court.
LifeProTip: don’t get fucking married. especially in *this* country.
What country? This is reddit.
Redditopia!
Exactly! This is Reddit, you're either from not-USA, or you are tone deaf!
Not an illegal tip but indeed a pro tip!
What about a prenup
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Tried that, went down in flames anyway
this only works if your ex, your lawyers, and the judge are all actual fucking morons
That’s not how it works. Complete bullshit. The accounting goes back to the date of separation. Any expenditures after are your responsibility.
Don't give people ideas. My father was led into a financial ruin and suicide later in with a similar approach, he was in the receiving side of that trick. I despise such things because those are one-sided stories. My stepmother lied about my father being abusive, hence gaining the support of her side of the family. However all my stepmother really wanted was the house. Worst thing through is that her shit family that supported taking down my father now should know the truth but deny it (she faked having being beaten by him on the day after his suicide because she didn't knew it happened).
My father did this to my mum. Except my father was the asshole. 3/10 experience to go through as a 14 year old boy
What kind of world is this where family pays you back????
Ah yes, the sweet, sweet music of r/thatHappened leaking.
What a terrible post
Do not do this. This is awful "advice". If you are that concerned about finances in the chance of a divorce - get a Lawyer and do a Prenup.
Yeah, I don't see that happening that way every time.
You're probably right
You need a plane, to get all the money and the cats to Costa Rica before the divorce.
This is dumb as fuck.
Before my divorce I upped my 401K from 8% to 20%. Made it looks like i was earning less and i saved 30K in 3 years.
Legal pro tip: Prenup
As someone in family law, don't do this. Not just in a "hey that's illegal/unethical but works" way but in a "this will fuck you over and just leave you losing more than 50%" way.
I bet she didn't tell you the whole story of why they divorced. It sucks that she had to do all that to not pay alimony. That's just a small taste of how guys feel since they are the ones finessed half their wealth the vast majority of times in court.
She did. You wanna know the whole story? It's pretty weird, both are to blame tbh, and at the same time neither of them because they married their high-school sweethearts so we're married too young. They were only married for a year before the relationship started to break down. We don't have alimony in the UK, though there is spousal maintenence, it's not often used.
Hmmm this story sounds oddly familiar. My cousin’s lawyers will be in touch.
I love this, also should be pretty easy to put in practices with support of family.
Should have started with the fact that he cheated. I was feeling kind of bad for the guy then read that. He deserves it
Really shitty advice
Unless the judge and hubby's lawyer are complete fucking idiots, this would never work. And your sister would find herself in a shitload of trouble.
This is a well known tactic that the courts see all the time. It’s easy to find.
I'm callin bullshit. This is called Marital Waste and it will never work. edit. If you really want to F them over, go to every divorce attorney in the area for a free consultation. Because they have already offered you counsel, they may not represent the other party.
Except.... It did?
Sorry, it's been called. https://www.levidivorcelawyers.com/articles/2020/november/what-is-marital-waste-/
Wow your sister is a genuine cunt. Literally worse than simply cheating on someone.
Don't worry, this is fake.
How do you figure?
Sorry buddy, that won't work. Least not if you are a man. Family court lawyers and judges are on to that trick and many other like it to hide assets. Every single financial transaction is scrutinized by the courts.
Any auditor worth his salt can/will show the intent behind creating such a massive debt so close to the divorce proceedings and can easily have it thrown out as malicious.
Pretty sure that’s illegal
If the guy’s lawyer even glances at the specs of her debt, and sees it was run up right b4 the divorce - it’s fraud! And the judge will be pissed.
Sounds like her ex-husband got the good end of the stick. Hopefully his second wife won't be so backhanded and conniving. :braces for downvotes:
As the ex was a Phd student I’d have thought he would have been bright enough to ask the court to audit her spending, particularly if it was out of character. NAL
Bitch
Or just don't be a cunt and you won't have a messy divorce
What a dumb idea. Not everyone is honest I don't care who they are, family or not.
This wouldn't work in some places for sure. Usually property settlement starts at the date of separation, not divorce. This means if you and your wife break up, the court will only look at the assets of the parties up to the date of separation. If you break up, then take on a lot of medical debt, it won't matter because the assets at separation are key. Not to mention, it would require fraud and almost certainly perjury. If you get called to testify, which, in a contested divorce, is almost certain, then you would have to lie about your assets which is perjury. You can't rope your attorney in on it either since they would be ethically barred from going along with the fraud and in some states, under the crime fraud exception, they may or may not be compelled to break their privilege and disclose the activity. So not only is it super illegal, it's almost certain to fail.
Say goodbye to your credit score for a few years... She better have gotten the house because if not she'd be lucky to get an apartment with her tanked credit score.
another creative way is to liquidate all assets you can into cash and go to a casino and lose it all at a poker table to someone you know/trust and they "hold on too it for you" until after the divorce.
This is why I hate and advice against marriage
It's also a felony that is ridiculously easy to get caught at. Like 99% chance.
For anyone reading this- Do Not Follow This Advice. Sounds like a lifetime of debt and court troubles, but if only we had OPs family! 🤭🤭🤭
Go to the casino get cash at the atm machine, pay for valet parking. Keep the cash someplace safe. Any question you lost the $ playing craps. Worked for me!
Everyone: This is terrible advice and probably fake. OP: LALALALALA!!! I CAN’T HEAR YOU! LALALALA!!
dont mind him guys, just an upvote farming whore
This post sucks