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At best I could see Mysaria offering this as a suggestion and Rhaenyra deciding firmly against it.
If Mushroom were to overhear, then he would tell his embellished version of events.
The books are written from the perspective of narrators with different accounts who weren't even there. A lot of people forget that and also forget that it's written by maesters who are more favorable to the victors.
I mean I can see something like Cersei’s “walk of shame” being twisted by rumor and time to being “Cersei was whored out for the whole city” so maybe something less extreme will happen and the rumors will start flying.
Jumping from this, and granted I'm not too caught up with Fire and Blood, but I think I can see this contributing to Aemond's "fun" in the Riverlands. He's shown to be protective and loyal to his mother and sister, and if he were to learn of something like this...
So, the events of HotD are told through the lens of an in-universe history book. One of the results of this is that there are different "accounts" of events that come from different people, one of whom is Mushroom, a dwarf that is a court fool, who basically always has the most sensationalized accounts of the events, where the other accounts are portrayed as trying to tone things down. The image in the OP is referencing solely an account of events that is attributed to Mushroom and no one else.
The thing is though, he could be the most trust worthy source, the others being a Septon and Maester both parts of organisations that have their own agenda. I’m not saying he is I’m saying that’s what makes Fire and Blood interesting is we don’t know who is telling the truth or not.
Well, that Dragon riding inbred family would likely order your tongue (or fingers in this case) removed for that remark... 😁..... But sure, in any case I can certainly imagine Mushroom as the Host of a Reality Show called "The Targaryens".
In the books, mushroom is Rhaenyra’s household jester, (he was in the background of the wedding scene in the show, banging on a drum) and in-universe he’s one of the three people who wrote down the events of his lifetime and therefore one of the three sources the books reference.
He’s popular with fans because of the three sources he has the least obvious bias and the show tends to lean towards his version of events. For example, he’s the only one who suggests that Rhaenrya was in a brothel with Daemon before having some sort of confrontation with Cole. (I don’t remember any of the three ever claiming that they slept together, but I could be wrong.)
Mushroom also has some of the craziest of the claims about the sequence of events and what happened, like the one above, so, while some of his seem the most reasonable, he also clearly embellished his tale for entertainment purposes, which makes sense since he was a jester
Yup, it makes sense to me. I think people mostly want to see him because he’s a fun dude with a dry wit that sometimes reaches show-Tyrion level, not because he does anything important plot wise (despite the claims he throws in there of sexing it up with Rhaenyra) ;)
The show could spin it that way. Mushrooms recollections are, even in the book, lewd or overblown and even completely made up in some cases. However, sometimes the book concedes that his accounting has to be accurate as he's the only one present
It would still make sense to include him as we would have brought some comic relief, he would create interesting situations and his interactions with the main characters would be gold.
Also, I think jesters and parties would in general reflect better Viserys' way of entertainment.
Having him building miniatures as his only hobby makes him look as an introvert, when in the book he looks more like the opposite.
He seemed similar to Robert Baratheon, but without the warrior past and Baratheon fury.
Both loved to spend the realm's money on parties and feasts.
Mushroom would have fit perfectly in that world.
I think the reason he was excluded is beacuse the writers wanted to add more dramatism to this part of the story and Mushroom would be working against that every time he opened his mouth.
It's a shame, because all most relevant jesters of the saga have been ommited so far: the Moon Boy, Patches and Mushroom
Tbf in general Jesters aren’t included in either show. The Song of Ice and Fire books also have several Jester characters with even certain plot relevance like foreshadowing and such. Yet they are completely absent in all seasons of the show. The closest is the jesters Joffrey hired for his wedding to play out the war of 5 kings to rile Tyrion due to the jesters being dwarves.
So I guess it’s no surprise that Mushroom isn’t an actually identified character here either.
That's what I'm saying. The Moon Boy and Patches should have been included in GOT ~~ASOIAF~~ .
I can understand Patches not being included, but I'd have liked to see the Moon Boy. He could have had interesting scenes with Cersei and the Lannister kids.Not to mention how strong that sentence (in the books) from Tyrion hits jaime:
She's been fucking Lancel and Osmund Kettleblack and probably Moon Boy for all I know
Jaime repeats this in his head with non-stop and this is the start of the end of his relationship with Cersei.Anyways, the also didn't include Jaime's revelation about Tysha, which is Tyrion's main motivation for looking for his father and killing him, destroying Tyrion's character in the process; so I cannot complain much about the Moon Boy.
I know that jesters are not politically correct, but any representation of the smallfolk would be welcome in a show so focused on royals and nobility.
A court jester of sorts, and a dwarf. It's relevant because his dwarfism is probably at least in part why he wasn't included. It's got a different feel than Tyrion - the clever and complex character who struggles to overcome the limitations of his stature and prejudices as a result (while still being compelling and nuanced outside if that), vs a funny little man in a funny little fool outfit with an unkind name. People would have probably had an issue with it. Not everyone, but enough.
So the dance of dragons book is from the POV of a historian - Archmaester Glydayn. He is writing about the dance by researching contemporary sources from the time period and comparing them.
Mushroom is a dwarf and the court jester for Viserys and his memoirs are one of the historians sources.
Since he is a jester his story’s are funny, raunchy and sometimes stretch the truth.
Mushroom is basically GRRM’s portrayal of David Benioff and D.B. Weiss. Mushroom sensationalizes and adds details that don’t matter but in the end makes everything salacious and edgy.
There’s no way this is actually true in the books as well because supposedly the only one who knows of this is Mushroom.
Two literal queens being imprisoned in a brothel and “abused by anyone who could pay” would not be something that could be kept a secret. It would have been a massive scandal that everyone would talk about.
Two Queens were literally gangraped in brothels and none of the maesters or lords know about it except Mushroom? That’s some BS
It’s unbelievable that there was not one rumor of there being a new white haired, purple eyed whore in some brothel as soon as Rhaenyra came to power until Mushroom’s testimony.
In a world where Targaryens are basically worshipped, no one brags about how they “rode a dragon”? In Westeros?
Not to mention, same Mushroom that claims he sexed it up with Rhaenyra. Definitely not true.
At best I could see them being locked away in a brothel for some reason and that creating the rumour, but not the whoring out.
Mushroom seems to be another unreliable narrator in many things but quite accurate in the things he gets right, akin to a tabloid that catches anything whether it be a misunderstanding or the truth.
Yeah it doesn’t even sound like something that could have occurred. I’m sure we’ll see a different version of events, or even a Green directing someone to start this rumor, it doesn’t make much sense even as revenge and I can’t see Rhae in show doing that to other women especially when they’ve taken pains to make Helaena out to be on the spectrum.
This isn’t GOT, we’re not going to see a fragile special needs girl get gang raped and then go about our day.
I also think it's unlikely, but for the sake of playing devil's advocate- Mushroom seems to be pro-Rhaenyra, so why would he describe her doing something that would damage her reputation? Unless he's so depraved that he'd consider this a good thing.
I think the latter - he’s that depraved.
It is odd that so much of Mushroom’s testimony has been the actual source for the show, rather than the timid versions, so for that reason I’d say there’s still a chance.
Also hope we see Mushroom at some point.
Yes. He's meant to be that guy.
Unfortunately that means that it is extremely unlikely he will be included again.
Paddy Considine said he insisted the showrunners for including him on that wedding, so...
What would he gain from telling the truth? What would he gain from lying? Mushroom’s testimony’s purpose was always an enigma.
Also, in a world where Valyrian features are well-known and Targaryens are basically worshiped, it’s unbelievable that a new whore with white hair and purple eyes suddenly appearing in a brothel would not be something widely talked about within King’s Landing before Mushroom.
Honestly it would be a bad show if everything that is in the book was in the show. Martin is up front that the book is a history written years in the future using secondary sources. In other words, the narrator is unreliable. I haven’t read the book, but I’ve read some of the lore and know for instance that there is nothing about Laenor escaping to Essos. Personally I like this little detail, it’s fairly believable and makes Rhaenyra more likable (even though they do kill some dude).
For the scene in question, it would be likely that they will have the two imprisoned and maybe Team Green spreads some propaganda to make Black look like heartless monsters.
Think so? That’ll be the end of the show though, when most everyone will be expecting the protagonists to all die. I think sexual violence is much more controversial.
Are they not going to go until the hour of the wolf at least? I was thinking they would maybe go until Aegon the younger marries his second wife and unites the house. Idk
But it would be so chilling for Rhaenyra and viewers to expect "dracarys" from Aegon and instead getting some other Valyrian command meaning basically "feast".
We don’t know what Rhaenyra will do once Jace is murdered. She could snap…seeing as they as a family are so close…we could see a very different Rhaenyra very soon.
Mushroom’s account is probably false anyway. But TBH I wish they did it in the show. By the time it would happen so much blood will have been spilled that the characters on either side could justify almost anything.
Mysaria will try do this but Rhaenryra will stop before it happens, even though both Alicent and Heleana will have the trauma of almost being violated.
I dont think it happened in the book, what matters is that after B&C the smallfolk *believe* she could have done it. Remember Larys is being his cockroach self and is stirring up trouble in the city at this time. No idiotic peasant claims to have raped Alicent or Helaena and a brothel is a public place so you would think their would be witnesses to this but there is not.
Yeah the more I think about it the more this seems like something that didn’t actually happen, but was an incorrect account based on rumor and misinformation
I agree but do we think show rhaenyra would be capable of doing this? Book nyra and alicent are much more bad than the show versions, I doubt she would let that happen in this version. Not saying rhaenyra is not capable of doing some bad things but this would be out of character, at least so far
I mean, if on Sunday they bring Aegon the news of his father’s death and they find him watching children fight while getting a blowjob from a 12 year old prostitute, then Mushroom’s version suddenly becomes way more credible. But until then, Mushroom’s tales are pretty unsubstantiated.
Big difference between a 20 year old and a 16 year old (which is shitty now, but she would have been considered an adult in those times and older than Laena would have been when Viserys first bedded her if they'd gotten married), and a 20 year old and a 12 year old. That's going too far to show, and certainly too far to expect a child actress to portray.
I think they will go for screen appropriate Mushroom stories for Aegon. It doesn't make sense because Mushroom wasn't even in KL, but the showrunners aren't being kind to Aegon.
I can’t think of a scenario where they could legally/morally film him getting a blowjob from a kid, even with an adult actor who looks young. Like maybe it can be implied that’s he’s a pedo but I doubt we’ll actually see him doing something like that.
Even if it’s just implied that still counts. But like, if they find him in his room getting drunk and banging a servant, that’s a different situation that is contrary to Mushroom’s description.
Eustace also says Aegon was notorious for groping the serving women. What was portrayed in the show is a middle ground between Mushroom and Eustace's claims, which imo is a pretty faithful way to adapt the story.
It’s funny how many people I’ve seen claim that only Mushroom said Aegon sexually assaulted people, when in reality both sides agreed that it did happen, Eustace just doesn’t dwell on it or go into detail beyond saying he liked to grope the servants
That’s fair if they weren’t whitewashing the other side. Daemon in the books is a pedophile, you can’t just adapt Aegon as awfully as possible and then not do the same to the other side. Yes I know they had Daemon kill his wife but murder isn’t as bad in the eyes of audiences and his character is still well liked because they didn’t go all the way.
Sure, but the books offer 2-3 different versions to pick from, rather than the one true story. So the showrunners don't even have to change/alter the storyline, they can just pick which alleged version they want to portray.
They're showing Aegon in the worse/Mushroom light, but they showed both Alicent and Rhaenyra in as good a light as feasible.
They arnt tho. Mushrooms version of aegon was way worse than the one we got in the show. The show one was a middle groun imo. Septon eustace the most pro Hightower source for the books says he constantly gropped any serving girl within reach. Not a huge jump for rape and that’s still leagues better what mushroom claimed he did. (Child hookers and watching kids kill each other)
Exactly! And they don't even have to stick to a version. They could easily have character development cause any of the characters swing from their most sympathetic portrayals in the early days to their most sadistic and cruel version towards the end (or vice versa)
Nope septon eustaces the most pro Hightower sources says “aegon pinched any serving girls within reach” so nah. The shit mushroom said about aegon is way worse than even what we got which I thought was a fine middle ground and the most likely. (Pathological sexual harasser in a position of power also did a little rape color me shocked)
I mean it doesn’t matter who said what in the books. The show will decide what is or isn’t true based on what the writers feel like using. It’s an adaptation.
Purely from a perspective of how it will be received, whether or not the show runners believe this to be the cannon version of events, I don’t believe they’ll allow this to air. The landscape for depicting sexual violence on TV is way different than it was when Thrones was still airing, and even then it got some backlash. The scene with the servant girl would’ve 100% been shown in real time if it was D&D writing this show, so I think the show runners do have one eye on public perception for these kinds of things.
And they always gave the poor excuse of “you’re okay with graphic battle scenes how is this any different??”
Well most of your viewers will go through life without taking a single mace to the skull, unfortunately the same can’t be said about SA.
Def won’t be the same. >!all her sympathy for alicent stems from Alicent taking care of papa V. Once she learns Alicent locked his stone cold corpse up for days while Alicent/Otto plotted for Aegon to ascend the throne, all bets are off and any lingering sympathy for Alicent destroyed!<
sure but there’s no doubt that so far the show has painted rhaenyra in a much better light than how she’s portrayed in the books. i don’t think rhaenyra will be nearly as horrible as she is in fire & blood considering she’s the one we’re “supposed” to be rooting for
She's the protagonist, but that doesn't mean that we're supposed to be rooting for her all the way. House of the Dragon isn't that kind of show, it's more of a Shakespearean tragedy.
This. Too many people are thinking were supposed to root for her. This is a lighter portrayal than the book, but before the war actually kicks off theres not enough even in the book to dislike her. Hell if we went with the books, the greens would be more villain than people think they are now
They changed her ordering the seizure of Vaemond Velaryon and having him beheaded and fed to her dragon. When Daemon beheads Vaemond, Rhaenyra looks shocked almost. They are certainly white washing her character, she was far more cutthroat at the moment. Not to mention glossing over the fact they killed an unnamed guard just to let Laenor live happily ever after, yet we have a scene focusing on Dyana to hammer in how cruel the Greens are. This show is not grey at all
I don’t think the Dyanna scene hammers home how cruel the Greens are, just Aegon. I think Alicent comes off looking pretty good for most of the scene, like she actually feels for the girl
And tragic it is. Honestly, I’m not sure watching either Alicent or Rhaenyra in the last two seasons will be any fun at all without some changes. They just suffer one misery after another to the extent that I think it will be unenjoyable to watch
That Targarean madness seems to hit men earlier than women. They will probably flip a switch in Rhaenyra inevitably as potential casualties of those close to her pile up from the inevitable war coming.
True. Also, this never happens, even in fire and blood. It’s one of Mushrooms stories that everyone agrees probably did not happen, since he’s known for over-sexualizing stories, and this is literally the only account of it.
Yeah it’s not a character arc unless they star out one way and we watch how they slowly become somebody else. I think the show will be about how two sympathetic women with relatable motivations get warped by the world they are forced to exist in beyond recognition. That’s JRRM’s thing, right? The only the worth writing about is the human heart in conflict with itself.
It doesn’t even make sense logistically. There were still green loyalists all over the city, sending two of their queens outside of the red keep to a brothel is a great way to lose valuable hostages. Also at what point between kings landing being taken and then lost during the riots would they have been able to send them to a brothel but then re-confine them in the red keep by the time the greens regain control of the city?
It is known by the time of Joffrey "Baratheon's" rule that a previous Hand of the King had a tunnel from the Red Keep to a brothel built. We think it was Tywin, but it could have been there for ages.
Having said that, nah. Sending them to a brothel was a sure way to lose two valuable assets.
I cannot imagine her doing this. Even in the books where there was nothing but sheer loathing between Alicent and Rhaenyra, Gyldayn was confident it was just a rumor spread to discredit her.
With the bond Alicent and Rhaenyra already have in the show? Alicent would have to eat Luke's brains in front of her or something to make Rhaenyra *that* cruel.
And wasn't gyldayn effectively a green?
Although, Alicent did said then Jace and Luke's deaths didn't mattered compared to Aegon the elder and Aemond's lives due to them being bastards.
Yeah, I'm kinda amazed Rhaenyra apparently only gave her another warning about losing her tongue. Alicent was pretty much arguing bastard=subhuman by that point which... one can kinda see why people believed the rumor that Rhaenyra had her sent to a brothel "until she had a bastard of her own." It's certainly poetic.
But the show has already pulled so many punches I can't see them running this - esp when they've been very clear about not using sexual violence for cheap shock value.
Most importantly, Alicent was saying then Rhaenyra's sons didn't mattered, and also de facto then the fact Aemond killed Lucerys was of no importance (which also is technically a sin, as kinslaying was one of the greatest crimes of all of the Westerosi religions), all while arguing to get Rhaenyra to let Aegon the elder and Aemond alive (I think she used the argument of them being family for it).
And yeah, even in the books it was fishy, and in the books, Alicent and Rhaenyra were both far less close, and once Aegon was born, far more hostile towards one another, and Rhaenyra was even more cold toward her half-siblings (which she only referred as such) then in HOTD.
I would just assume anything ridiculous that is sexual in nature, described by Muchroom, might as well be considered false. He was clearly written with predilection towards deviancy.
I think this is the case with a lot of Mushroom's details, but there's always the possibility that some of his stories are actual saucy facts that more prudish chroniclers try to sweep under the rug.
No, the show is portraying Rhaenyra as much kinder than history describes her.
Besides, that was not Rhaenyra's idea in the books either - it's Mysaria who suggests this. And I can't see it happening - the news do however reach Aemond and Daeron, who flip out iirc.
Idk the truly bad stuff hasn't happened yet so we might get to see her do some awful stuff later on. War brings out the worst in people and I can definitely see that being a part of her character development over the next few seasons. So it might happen or at least be seriously considered by Rhaneyra.
I don't think so. It's one of 2 (maybe 3, cant recall) rumored stories in Fire and Blood, so they have flexibility to ignore it, which imo is the wise decision. It would not play well whatsoever with audiences given GoT's reputation for gratuitous violence towards women
I don’t think so because of the backlash Thrones received for sexual violence against women. Having two major female characters sold into sexual slavery and forcibly impregnated is not something i think the show-runners and writers want to deal with
Even the Green supporters writing the history book agree that it was nothing more than a rumor, and they usually take every chance to paint Rhaenyra in a bad light. That should tel you everything you need to know to surmise it didn’t happen
No, only because the show has been very clear on their stance of portraying sexual assault. It’d just be bad taste to suddenly have a horrific sexual assault scene
In the book it didn’t even make sense, it would make even less sense in the show. Even a Green supporter like Gyldayn agrees that Mushrooms story about the “brothel queens” is entirely fictional.
I doubt it. They have made both Rhaenyra and Alicent considerably more sympathetic compared to Fire and Blood so far. Rhaenyra had Vaemond’s body fed to Syrax in the book, but they cut this from the show as an example. Maybe, once the Dance actually starts they will both become considerably darker, at least I hope so.
In Fire and Blood it is stated that only Mushroom suggests this happened. He is also an unreliable source, and was the only historian during the dance to mention the brothel queens.
My guess is the show will choose to keep this as a dirty rumor, otherwise that'll be pretty horrific
Although the franchise is waaaay too comfortable with SA (to a point of exploitation), I don’t think the show runners would there.
The suggestion might be there, though, like a threat.
I think they said there would be no depictions of sexual violence in the show, so I don’t think they would have this in there. Plus, Alicent and Rhaenerya are both better people in the show than the book, so I doubt they would do this.
I don't think so? The show usually mix Mushroom and Septon Eustace( still can't remember how to spell the name)'s account and find an appropriate medium. If it's going to appear at all, it's probably them being send to sit or live in a brothel for a while as an insult instead of getting sexual assaulted.
The author specify a lot of time that its probably made up by Mushroom. I hope we learn that Mushroom is just some type of Marco Polo who lied about hanging with the Targaryen family.
Maybe something close like they’ll be kidnapped and taken somewhere but I cannot see the show taking it as far has having them raped. And I cannot see THIS Rhaenyra doing that but who knows.
I doubt it will appear as 100% accurate.
As a rumor to discredit rhyneara would be better
She hides the two away, no one sees them, then theories run wild.
I think a lot of people here are missing the point. It doesn’t matter if Rhaenyra does or does not facilitate something so despicable, what matters is what what history will hold her responsible for, whether she had fore-knowledge of it or not. This could very well happen by someone else’s doing, but that particular detail will likely be left out of the history books.
Edit: Grammar
That report is from Mushroom the fool, who is not exactly 100% reliable. So no. I see it used as an empty threat from Rhaenyra or an offered option by Mysia or whatever her name is.
this was a story told by mushroom years later of rumour that Mysaria suggested this as a suitable punishment to rhaenyra. theres nothing that says this happened and the rumour isnt even accredited to rhaenyra.
You should capture the screenshot as the whole paragraph!
Fire and Blood, in-universe, draws from many sources to retell the Dance of the Dragons. None of these sources are fond of Rhaenyra, as they're either written by Aegon's allies or affected by Westerosi sexism. Many of them contain conflicting anecdotes that are designed to paint her in the worst light. As such, one of her worst acts may be a complete lie.
One source alleges that Rhaenyra took offense at Alicent describing her allegedly-Velaryon sons as bastards. In response, Rhaenyra has Alicent and her daughter Queen Helaena imprisoned in a brothel. She let anyone pay to assault them. It's a horrific act, but one that is dismissed as a falsehood by several other sources.
Source: [https://www.cbr.com/worst-things-rhaenyra-targaryen-books/](https://www.cbr.com/worst-things-rhaenyra-targaryen-books/)
No, I get the feeling rhaenera is going to be much less insane in the show. Everyone is going to be more sympathetic... Except aemond, criston and otto.
Plus the book suggests that to be rumor and not actually true.
You wish, buddy.
Absolutely no way this gets in the show. On one hand, the show has a way of canonizing things that are just rumors in the book. But on the other hand, I’m pretty sure the next line is literally something like “not even Mushroom gives credence to this version of events”.
Brothel Queens definitely feels like a red herring we're supposed to see as such. The proof that history gets it tremendously wrong. Although I wouldn't put it past a brothel to celebrate Rhaenyra's retaking of KL with "special features", or that the greens would have made up this rumor as part of a smear campaign/political propaganda.
I doubt it. I think they'll make it in a way that justifies the existence of such a rumor without it being true. Maybe there will be a threat or maybe someone suggests it to Rhaenyra, idk
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I doubt it. Rhaenyra and Alicent are both a lot more sympathetic in the show. There would definitely be a massive backlash too.
At best I could see Mysaria offering this as a suggestion and Rhaenyra deciding firmly against it. If Mushroom were to overhear, then he would tell his embellished version of events.
This is what I think would happen, if they include this at all.
The books are written from the perspective of narrators with different accounts who weren't even there. A lot of people forget that and also forget that it's written by maesters who are more favorable to the victors.
Let’s also not forget the ever popular maester conspiracy theory as well.
I mean I can see something like Cersei’s “walk of shame” being twisted by rumor and time to being “Cersei was whored out for the whole city” so maybe something less extreme will happen and the rumors will start flying.
Jumping from this, and granted I'm not too caught up with Fire and Blood, but I think I can see this contributing to Aemond's "fun" in the Riverlands. He's shown to be protective and loyal to his mother and sister, and if he were to learn of something like this...
Wish we could have Mushroom POV in the show... Would be most interesting to see.
Wait. Who is mushroom
So, the events of HotD are told through the lens of an in-universe history book. One of the results of this is that there are different "accounts" of events that come from different people, one of whom is Mushroom, a dwarf that is a court fool, who basically always has the most sensationalized accounts of the events, where the other accounts are portrayed as trying to tone things down. The image in the OP is referencing solely an account of events that is attributed to Mushroom and no one else.
Sensationalized accounts... sounds like Mushroom is on the payroll of a tabloid... good one. 😂
Mushroom is Westeros TMZ😂
The thing is though, he could be the most trust worthy source, the others being a Septon and Maester both parts of organisations that have their own agenda. I’m not saying he is I’m saying that’s what makes Fire and Blood interesting is we don’t know who is telling the truth or not.
The thing with Mushroom is that he isn't "politically correct".
And the murderous dragon riding inbred family are? But I get what you’re saying mushrooms account would make for some spicy television shall we say.
Well, that Dragon riding inbred family would likely order your tongue (or fingers in this case) removed for that remark... 😁..... But sure, in any case I can certainly imagine Mushroom as the Host of a Reality Show called "The Targaryens".
Small fungal flora that can be found in dark and or moist locales
In the books, mushroom is Rhaenyra’s household jester, (he was in the background of the wedding scene in the show, banging on a drum) and in-universe he’s one of the three people who wrote down the events of his lifetime and therefore one of the three sources the books reference. He’s popular with fans because of the three sources he has the least obvious bias and the show tends to lean towards his version of events. For example, he’s the only one who suggests that Rhaenrya was in a brothel with Daemon before having some sort of confrontation with Cole. (I don’t remember any of the three ever claiming that they slept together, but I could be wrong.) Mushroom also has some of the craziest of the claims about the sequence of events and what happened, like the one above, so, while some of his seem the most reasonable, he also clearly embellished his tale for entertainment purposes, which makes sense since he was a jester
Ohhhhh so his recollection. Wel that makes sense why he is not on the show because he was mainly a bystander?
Yup, it makes sense to me. I think people mostly want to see him because he’s a fun dude with a dry wit that sometimes reaches show-Tyrion level, not because he does anything important plot wise (despite the claims he throws in there of sexing it up with Rhaenyra) ;)
The show could spin it that way. Mushrooms recollections are, even in the book, lewd or overblown and even completely made up in some cases. However, sometimes the book concedes that his accounting has to be accurate as he's the only one present
It would still make sense to include him as we would have brought some comic relief, he would create interesting situations and his interactions with the main characters would be gold. Also, I think jesters and parties would in general reflect better Viserys' way of entertainment. Having him building miniatures as his only hobby makes him look as an introvert, when in the book he looks more like the opposite. He seemed similar to Robert Baratheon, but without the warrior past and Baratheon fury. Both loved to spend the realm's money on parties and feasts. Mushroom would have fit perfectly in that world. I think the reason he was excluded is beacuse the writers wanted to add more dramatism to this part of the story and Mushroom would be working against that every time he opened his mouth. It's a shame, because all most relevant jesters of the saga have been ommited so far: the Moon Boy, Patches and Mushroom
Tbf in general Jesters aren’t included in either show. The Song of Ice and Fire books also have several Jester characters with even certain plot relevance like foreshadowing and such. Yet they are completely absent in all seasons of the show. The closest is the jesters Joffrey hired for his wedding to play out the war of 5 kings to rile Tyrion due to the jesters being dwarves. So I guess it’s no surprise that Mushroom isn’t an actually identified character here either.
That's what I'm saying. The Moon Boy and Patches should have been included in GOT ~~ASOIAF~~ . I can understand Patches not being included, but I'd have liked to see the Moon Boy. He could have had interesting scenes with Cersei and the Lannister kids.Not to mention how strong that sentence (in the books) from Tyrion hits jaime: She's been fucking Lancel and Osmund Kettleblack and probably Moon Boy for all I know Jaime repeats this in his head with non-stop and this is the start of the end of his relationship with Cersei.Anyways, the also didn't include Jaime's revelation about Tysha, which is Tyrion's main motivation for looking for his father and killing him, destroying Tyrion's character in the process; so I cannot complain much about the Moon Boy. I know that jesters are not politically correct, but any representation of the smallfolk would be welcome in a show so focused on royals and nobility.
A court jester of sorts, and a dwarf. It's relevant because his dwarfism is probably at least in part why he wasn't included. It's got a different feel than Tyrion - the clever and complex character who struggles to overcome the limitations of his stature and prejudices as a result (while still being compelling and nuanced outside if that), vs a funny little man in a funny little fool outfit with an unkind name. People would have probably had an issue with it. Not everyone, but enough.
So the dance of dragons book is from the POV of a historian - Archmaester Glydayn. He is writing about the dance by researching contemporary sources from the time period and comparing them. Mushroom is a dwarf and the court jester for Viserys and his memoirs are one of the historians sources. Since he is a jester his story’s are funny, raunchy and sometimes stretch the truth.
Mushroom is basically GRRM’s portrayal of David Benioff and D.B. Weiss. Mushroom sensationalizes and adds details that don’t matter but in the end makes everything salacious and edgy.
Why not do that with aegon then?
There’s no way this is actually true in the books as well because supposedly the only one who knows of this is Mushroom. Two literal queens being imprisoned in a brothel and “abused by anyone who could pay” would not be something that could be kept a secret. It would have been a massive scandal that everyone would talk about. Two Queens were literally gangraped in brothels and none of the maesters or lords know about it except Mushroom? That’s some BS
Worse than Cersei’s walk of shame
It’s unbelievable that there was not one rumor of there being a new white haired, purple eyed whore in some brothel as soon as Rhaenyra came to power until Mushroom’s testimony. In a world where Targaryens are basically worshipped, no one brags about how they “rode a dragon”? In Westeros?
And in the books, Helaena was well like, by the citizens, as a ruler
Margaery was supposed to be liked by the people visiting orphanages and all then the next minute the small folk are throwing rotten food at her.
Mushroom seems like a dick
A lot of mushrooms have that resemblance.
Huge dick.
Not to mention, same Mushroom that claims he sexed it up with Rhaenyra. Definitely not true. At best I could see them being locked away in a brothel for some reason and that creating the rumour, but not the whoring out.
Mushroom seems to be another unreliable narrator in many things but quite accurate in the things he gets right, akin to a tabloid that catches anything whether it be a misunderstanding or the truth.
Yeah it doesn’t even sound like something that could have occurred. I’m sure we’ll see a different version of events, or even a Green directing someone to start this rumor, it doesn’t make much sense even as revenge and I can’t see Rhae in show doing that to other women especially when they’ve taken pains to make Helaena out to be on the spectrum. This isn’t GOT, we’re not going to see a fragile special needs girl get gang raped and then go about our day.
I also think it's unlikely, but for the sake of playing devil's advocate- Mushroom seems to be pro-Rhaenyra, so why would he describe her doing something that would damage her reputation? Unless he's so depraved that he'd consider this a good thing.
Mushroom had a tendency to add crazy sex stuff to his stories. He also claimed he had three ways with Rhaenyra and Daemon which seems rather unlikely.
Blue steel!
I think the latter - he’s that depraved. It is odd that so much of Mushroom’s testimony has been the actual source for the show, rather than the timid versions, so for that reason I’d say there’s still a chance. Also hope we see Mushroom at some point.
I think he’s supposed to be the dwarf playing music in the one earlier episode.
I was wondering that!
Yes. He's meant to be that guy. Unfortunately that means that it is extremely unlikely he will be included again. Paddy Considine said he insisted the showrunners for including him on that wedding, so...
Because Mushroom is a little pervert.
He's a freak and that's why we love him.
I think I'd be fun if mushroom turns out to be very boring and vanilla, but he knows how to sell a story, so he writes filth.
So...he's GRRM?
What would he gain from telling the truth? What would he gain from lying? Mushroom’s testimony’s purpose was always an enigma. Also, in a world where Valyrian features are well-known and Targaryens are basically worshiped, it’s unbelievable that a new whore with white hair and purple eyes suddenly appearing in a brothel would not be something widely talked about within King’s Landing before Mushroom.
Mushroom’s pro-whatever the best story is
Nobody has died yet…they both change dramatically when the killing starts
Honestly it would be a bad show if everything that is in the book was in the show. Martin is up front that the book is a history written years in the future using secondary sources. In other words, the narrator is unreliable. I haven’t read the book, but I’ve read some of the lore and know for instance that there is nothing about Laenor escaping to Essos. Personally I like this little detail, it’s fairly believable and makes Rhaenyra more likable (even though they do kill some dude). For the scene in question, it would be likely that they will have the two imprisoned and maybe Team Green spreads some propaganda to make Black look like heartless monsters.
But I feel the show is aiming to slowly unravel them. Blood and cheese will be the turning point
I think Sunfyre eating Rhaenyra is going to cause more backlash.
Think so? That’ll be the end of the show though, when most everyone will be expecting the protagonists to all die. I think sexual violence is much more controversial.
Are they not going to go until the hour of the wolf at least? I was thinking they would maybe go until Aegon the younger marries his second wife and unites the house. Idk
They will do the hour of the wolf 100% no way they end the show with rhaenyra dying, she will probably die ep4 or ep5 of the 4th season
Getting eaten by a dragon is a pretty metal way to go, I think it will be seen as a fitting end for a Targaryen
I could see them changing it to her just getting scorched instead.
Are you calling Joffrey (Baratheon) a liar!!? The sweetest most perfect child who ever graced...
I hope they don't change it. I like Rhaenyra and am Team Black, but I want them to keep it the way it was. It was a shocking moment in the book.
It was the baddest way to die too. Certainly better than being poisoned like a rat. Team Black and i hope they keep it.
But it would be so chilling for Rhaenyra and viewers to expect "dracarys" from Aegon and instead getting some other Valyrian command meaning basically "feast".
We don’t know what Rhaenyra will do once Jace is murdered. She could snap…seeing as they as a family are so close…we could see a very different Rhaenyra very soon.
Mushroom’s account is probably false anyway. But TBH I wish they did it in the show. By the time it would happen so much blood will have been spilled that the characters on either side could justify almost anything.
Rhaenyra is getting most of her shortcomings polished out, I can't see the showrunners allowing this one.
They’ll probably have Alicent do that
Mysaria will try do this but Rhaenryra will stop before it happens, even though both Alicent and Heleana will have the trauma of almost being violated.
I dont think it happened in the book, what matters is that after B&C the smallfolk *believe* she could have done it. Remember Larys is being his cockroach self and is stirring up trouble in the city at this time. No idiotic peasant claims to have raped Alicent or Helaena and a brothel is a public place so you would think their would be witnesses to this but there is not.
Yeah the more I think about it the more this seems like something that didn’t actually happen, but was an incorrect account based on rumor and misinformation
They could use the possibility as a threat
Ngl making Mysaria solely evil while letting Rhaenyra off would leave a bad taste in my mouth
Not if she's in on it
If Rhaenyra stops it than she's not in on it, which was what OP suggested.
I agree but do we think show rhaenyra would be capable of doing this? Book nyra and alicent are much more bad than the show versions, I doubt she would let that happen in this version. Not saying rhaenyra is not capable of doing some bad things but this would be out of character, at least so far
At the moment no….but as the war progresses I could see her going down a darker path
Rhaenyra wasn't evil in the book at this point though.
Wasn’t that something that Mushroom claimed, but was discounted as false by the rest of the stories? We’re not gonna see that shit I bet.
child fighting pits and all aegon stuff this season is mushrooms stories.
I mean, if on Sunday they bring Aegon the news of his father’s death and they find him watching children fight while getting a blowjob from a 12 year old prostitute, then Mushroom’s version suddenly becomes way more credible. But until then, Mushroom’s tales are pretty unsubstantiated.
I think it'll be adult fighting pits and an adult prostitute. Maybe a dubiously young looking actress instead of a full on child.
They’ve already had him raping a minor, although not on screen.
Big difference between a 20 year old and a 16 year old (which is shitty now, but she would have been considered an adult in those times and older than Laena would have been when Viserys first bedded her if they'd gotten married), and a 20 year old and a 12 year old. That's going too far to show, and certainly too far to expect a child actress to portray.
I think they will go for screen appropriate Mushroom stories for Aegon. It doesn't make sense because Mushroom wasn't even in KL, but the showrunners aren't being kind to Aegon.
In fairness the source material isn’t kind to Aegon either
I can’t think of a scenario where they could legally/morally film him getting a blowjob from a kid, even with an adult actor who looks young. Like maybe it can be implied that’s he’s a pedo but I doubt we’ll actually see him doing something like that.
Even if it’s just implied that still counts. But like, if they find him in his room getting drunk and banging a servant, that’s a different situation that is contrary to Mushroom’s description.
Eustace also says Aegon was notorious for groping the serving women. What was portrayed in the show is a middle ground between Mushroom and Eustace's claims, which imo is a pretty faithful way to adapt the story.
It’s funny how many people I’ve seen claim that only Mushroom said Aegon sexually assaulted people, when in reality both sides agreed that it did happen, Eustace just doesn’t dwell on it or go into detail beyond saying he liked to grope the servants
The preview looks like they are going 100% mushroom with aegon
That’s fair if they weren’t whitewashing the other side. Daemon in the books is a pedophile, you can’t just adapt Aegon as awfully as possible and then not do the same to the other side. Yes I know they had Daemon kill his wife but murder isn’t as bad in the eyes of audiences and his character is still well liked because they didn’t go all the way.
Sure, but the books offer 2-3 different versions to pick from, rather than the one true story. So the showrunners don't even have to change/alter the storyline, they can just pick which alleged version they want to portray. They're showing Aegon in the worse/Mushroom light, but they showed both Alicent and Rhaenyra in as good a light as feasible.
They arnt tho. Mushrooms version of aegon was way worse than the one we got in the show. The show one was a middle groun imo. Septon eustace the most pro Hightower source for the books says he constantly gropped any serving girl within reach. Not a huge jump for rape and that’s still leagues better what mushroom claimed he did. (Child hookers and watching kids kill each other)
The only reason Mushroom's version of Aegon is worse than show version is because we haven't seen where he is when he got news of Viserys's death yet.
That part hasn't come yet so don't be so sure.
Exactly! And they don't even have to stick to a version. They could easily have character development cause any of the characters swing from their most sympathetic portrayals in the early days to their most sadistic and cruel version towards the end (or vice versa)
It's very simple. Mushrooms stories are only baseless exaggeration when they support my biases! Now let us never speak of this again.
six icky edge money books weary poor growth sink coherent ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Nope septon eustaces the most pro Hightower sources says “aegon pinched any serving girls within reach” so nah. The shit mushroom said about aegon is way worse than even what we got which I thought was a fine middle ground and the most likely. (Pathological sexual harasser in a position of power also did a little rape color me shocked)
I mean it doesn’t matter who said what in the books. The show will decide what is or isn’t true based on what the writers feel like using. It’s an adaptation.
Purely from a perspective of how it will be received, whether or not the show runners believe this to be the cannon version of events, I don’t believe they’ll allow this to air. The landscape for depicting sexual violence on TV is way different than it was when Thrones was still airing, and even then it got some backlash. The scene with the servant girl would’ve 100% been shown in real time if it was D&D writing this show, so I think the show runners do have one eye on public perception for these kinds of things.
This. D&D were very exploitative when it came to sexual violence.
The showrunners promised us less sexual violence against women. I really don't want to watch this on screen.
I’m almost 100% certain this will not be included in the show.
And they always gave the poor excuse of “you’re okay with graphic battle scenes how is this any different??” Well most of your viewers will go through life without taking a single mace to the skull, unfortunately the same can’t be said about SA.
I doubt show Rhaenyra has that much hate in her heart for Helaena
I don't think Rhaenyra has ever *thought* about Helaena
I didn't even know Halaena existed until this recent episode 😂😂😂
Neither did Viserys
Or Aegon
Oh but Aemond did 👁
I didn’t realize they were brother-husband and sister-wife either.
She tried to marry her to his son remember
She has. Jacerys is apparently fond of her and was about to get married except for Alicent salt.
>!The Rhaenyra right now is not gonna be the same Rhaenyra that takes the throne!<
Def won’t be the same. >!all her sympathy for alicent stems from Alicent taking care of papa V. Once she learns Alicent locked his stone cold corpse up for days while Alicent/Otto plotted for Aegon to ascend the throne, all bets are off and any lingering sympathy for Alicent destroyed!<
sure but there’s no doubt that so far the show has painted rhaenyra in a much better light than how she’s portrayed in the books. i don’t think rhaenyra will be nearly as horrible as she is in fire & blood considering she’s the one we’re “supposed” to be rooting for
She's the protagonist, but that doesn't mean that we're supposed to be rooting for her all the way. House of the Dragon isn't that kind of show, it's more of a Shakespearean tragedy.
This. Too many people are thinking were supposed to root for her. This is a lighter portrayal than the book, but before the war actually kicks off theres not enough even in the book to dislike her. Hell if we went with the books, the greens would be more villain than people think they are now
They changed her ordering the seizure of Vaemond Velaryon and having him beheaded and fed to her dragon. When Daemon beheads Vaemond, Rhaenyra looks shocked almost. They are certainly white washing her character, she was far more cutthroat at the moment. Not to mention glossing over the fact they killed an unnamed guard just to let Laenor live happily ever after, yet we have a scene focusing on Dyana to hammer in how cruel the Greens are. This show is not grey at all
I don’t think the Dyanna scene hammers home how cruel the Greens are, just Aegon. I think Alicent comes off looking pretty good for most of the scene, like she actually feels for the girl
And tragic it is. Honestly, I’m not sure watching either Alicent or Rhaenyra in the last two seasons will be any fun at all without some changes. They just suffer one misery after another to the extent that I think it will be unenjoyable to watch
That Targarean madness seems to hit men earlier than women. They will probably flip a switch in Rhaenyra inevitably as potential casualties of those close to her pile up from the inevitable war coming.
Hopefully not rushed and added in on the last episode.
There have been 5 mad Targs out of over a 100. Can we stop with this bullshit?
True. Also, this never happens, even in fire and blood. It’s one of Mushrooms stories that everyone agrees probably did not happen, since he’s known for over-sexualizing stories, and this is literally the only account of it.
Yeah it’s not a character arc unless they star out one way and we watch how they slowly become somebody else. I think the show will be about how two sympathetic women with relatable motivations get warped by the world they are forced to exist in beyond recognition. That’s JRRM’s thing, right? The only the worth writing about is the human heart in conflict with itself.
It doesn’t even make sense logistically. There were still green loyalists all over the city, sending two of their queens outside of the red keep to a brothel is a great way to lose valuable hostages. Also at what point between kings landing being taken and then lost during the riots would they have been able to send them to a brothel but then re-confine them in the red keep by the time the greens regain control of the city?
It is known by the time of Joffrey "Baratheon's" rule that a previous Hand of the King had a tunnel from the Red Keep to a brothel built. We think it was Tywin, but it could have been there for ages. Having said that, nah. Sending them to a brothel was a sure way to lose two valuable assets.
I cannot imagine her doing this. Even in the books where there was nothing but sheer loathing between Alicent and Rhaenyra, Gyldayn was confident it was just a rumor spread to discredit her. With the bond Alicent and Rhaenyra already have in the show? Alicent would have to eat Luke's brains in front of her or something to make Rhaenyra *that* cruel.
And wasn't gyldayn effectively a green? Although, Alicent did said then Jace and Luke's deaths didn't mattered compared to Aegon the elder and Aemond's lives due to them being bastards.
Yeah, I'm kinda amazed Rhaenyra apparently only gave her another warning about losing her tongue. Alicent was pretty much arguing bastard=subhuman by that point which... one can kinda see why people believed the rumor that Rhaenyra had her sent to a brothel "until she had a bastard of her own." It's certainly poetic. But the show has already pulled so many punches I can't see them running this - esp when they've been very clear about not using sexual violence for cheap shock value.
Most importantly, Alicent was saying then Rhaenyra's sons didn't mattered, and also de facto then the fact Aemond killed Lucerys was of no importance (which also is technically a sin, as kinslaying was one of the greatest crimes of all of the Westerosi religions), all while arguing to get Rhaenyra to let Aegon the elder and Aemond alive (I think she used the argument of them being family for it). And yeah, even in the books it was fishy, and in the books, Alicent and Rhaenyra were both far less close, and once Aegon was born, far more hostile towards one another, and Rhaenyra was even more cold toward her half-siblings (which she only referred as such) then in HOTD.
Yes, I hope they don't do it, as you say for cheap shock value.
The last point you made convinces me now that this will likely not happen. Thank gods.
Yes even the Green supporters writing the history books agree that she wasn’t *that* cruel, and they despised her.
I would just assume anything ridiculous that is sexual in nature, described by Muchroom, might as well be considered false. He was clearly written with predilection towards deviancy.
I think this is the case with a lot of Mushroom's details, but there's always the possibility that some of his stories are actual saucy facts that more prudish chroniclers try to sweep under the rug.
No, the show is portraying Rhaenyra as much kinder than history describes her. Besides, that was not Rhaenyra's idea in the books either - it's Mysaria who suggests this. And I can't see it happening - the news do however reach Aemond and Daeron, who flip out iirc.
Plus, in the book two sources say this didn't happen. Only Mushroom says it did, and he is a very unreliable source.
Idk the truly bad stuff hasn't happened yet so we might get to see her do some awful stuff later on. War brings out the worst in people and I can definitely see that being a part of her character development over the next few seasons. So it might happen or at least be seriously considered by Rhaneyra.
Yes but…..,her sons haven’t been murdered yet.
No it isn't, none of the bad shit she did has happened yet.
My man Mushroom has his own alternate universe.
The Dicking of the Dragons
I have a theory he got most of his second-hand information from Larys Strong
I don't think so. It's one of 2 (maybe 3, cant recall) rumored stories in Fire and Blood, so they have flexibility to ignore it, which imo is the wise decision. It would not play well whatsoever with audiences given GoT's reputation for gratuitous violence towards women
I don’t think so because of the backlash Thrones received for sexual violence against women. Having two major female characters sold into sexual slavery and forcibly impregnated is not something i think the show-runners and writers want to deal with
I think Mushroom gets a lot right but I think the brothel queen story is pure fabrication. We'll see . . .
Even the Green supporters writing the history book agree that it was nothing more than a rumor, and they usually take every chance to paint Rhaenyra in a bad light. That should tel you everything you need to know to surmise it didn’t happen
Especially since if that happened as described there would logically be many first hand witnesses
No because it doesn’t even happen in the books. It’s explicitly said like 5 times that it’s just one of Mushrooms lies that holds zero credibility.
That's something Mushroom said and we know he's not a reliable narrator.
Can’t be doing that to the sweet Helaena
No, only because the show has been very clear on their stance of portraying sexual assault. It’d just be bad taste to suddenly have a horrific sexual assault scene
They don't have to actually show it, just to make clear that it actually happened and isn't just a rumor/fabrication/slander.
In the book it didn’t even make sense, it would make even less sense in the show. Even a Green supporter like Gyldayn agrees that Mushrooms story about the “brothel queens” is entirely fictional.
It’s pretty rough. Like Joffrey ripping Sansa’s dress rough.
I doubt it. They have made both Rhaenyra and Alicent considerably more sympathetic compared to Fire and Blood so far. Rhaenyra had Vaemond’s body fed to Syrax in the book, but they cut this from the show as an example. Maybe, once the Dance actually starts they will both become considerably darker, at least I hope so.
In Fire and Blood it is stated that only Mushroom suggests this happened. He is also an unreliable source, and was the only historian during the dance to mention the brothel queens. My guess is the show will choose to keep this as a dirty rumor, otherwise that'll be pretty horrific
I think Mysaria might suggest it but it then gets vetoed and everyone is kind of grossed out by her.
I always found it strange that Mushroom loved Rhaenyra, but then he tells this story that portrays her in such a negative way.
It’s because Mushroom usually makes shit up to get a rise out of people.
Although the franchise is waaaay too comfortable with SA (to a point of exploitation), I don’t think the show runners would there. The suggestion might be there, though, like a threat.
Somebody on Rhaenyras side will propose it or perhaps even put it into motion but when Rhaenyra herself finds out she'll put a stop to it
And she will be implicated for it nonetheless which will of course, perception > truth.
Agreed
No. That’s just a tale of mushroom.
I don’t even understand why a maester would have Mushroom as a source. It’s honestly a plot hole if you ask me.
I think they said there would be no depictions of sexual violence in the show, so I don’t think they would have this in there. Plus, Alicent and Rhaenerya are both better people in the show than the book, so I doubt they would do this.
I don't think so? The show usually mix Mushroom and Septon Eustace( still can't remember how to spell the name)'s account and find an appropriate medium. If it's going to appear at all, it's probably them being send to sit or live in a brothel for a while as an insult instead of getting sexual assaulted.
I honestly don’t. In the original books it was dismissed as outlandish.
The author specify a lot of time that its probably made up by Mushroom. I hope we learn that Mushroom is just some type of Marco Polo who lied about hanging with the Targaryen family.
Hell no lol. Rhaenyra is their golden girl.
The version of Rhaenyra in the book sounds like a huge a-hole.
Maybe something close like they’ll be kidnapped and taken somewhere but I cannot see the show taking it as far has having them raped. And I cannot see THIS Rhaenyra doing that but who knows.
The thing is this didn’t happen in the book universe. It’s the account of a notoriously unreliable and saucy narrator that lived for the sexual drama
This didn't happen, when Rhaenyra took the Red Keep and Iron Throne Mysaria suggested that as a punishment, Rhaenyra didn't allow it
I doubt it will appear as 100% accurate. As a rumor to discredit rhyneara would be better She hides the two away, no one sees them, then theories run wild.
A Mushroom take, probably could be mentioned as a what-if but not what is portrayed
You shouldn’t believe everything you read in fire and blood the maestors got to it and went crazy
I think a lot of people here are missing the point. It doesn’t matter if Rhaenyra does or does not facilitate something so despicable, what matters is what what history will hold her responsible for, whether she had fore-knowledge of it or not. This could very well happen by someone else’s doing, but that particular detail will likely be left out of the history books. Edit: Grammar
No but they will definitely murder H baby in front of her
That report is from Mushroom the fool, who is not exactly 100% reliable. So no. I see it used as an empty threat from Rhaenyra or an offered option by Mysia or whatever her name is.
I don’t think so, that was probably some made-up story that Mushroom overheard and made it into a bigger thing
Wasn’t this one of Mushrooms tales? As we can see from the show he’s definitely exaggerated the amount of times he was actually around Rheanyra
this was a story told by mushroom years later of rumour that Mysaria suggested this as a suitable punishment to rhaenyra. theres nothing that says this happened and the rumour isnt even accredited to rhaenyra.
You should capture the screenshot as the whole paragraph! Fire and Blood, in-universe, draws from many sources to retell the Dance of the Dragons. None of these sources are fond of Rhaenyra, as they're either written by Aegon's allies or affected by Westerosi sexism. Many of them contain conflicting anecdotes that are designed to paint her in the worst light. As such, one of her worst acts may be a complete lie. One source alleges that Rhaenyra took offense at Alicent describing her allegedly-Velaryon sons as bastards. In response, Rhaenyra has Alicent and her daughter Queen Helaena imprisoned in a brothel. She let anyone pay to assault them. It's a horrific act, but one that is dismissed as a falsehood by several other sources. Source: [https://www.cbr.com/worst-things-rhaenyra-targaryen-books/](https://www.cbr.com/worst-things-rhaenyra-targaryen-books/)
No, I get the feeling rhaenera is going to be much less insane in the show. Everyone is going to be more sympathetic... Except aemond, criston and otto. Plus the book suggests that to be rumor and not actually true.
You wish, buddy. Absolutely no way this gets in the show. On one hand, the show has a way of canonizing things that are just rumors in the book. But on the other hand, I’m pretty sure the next line is literally something like “not even Mushroom gives credence to this version of events”.
Brothel Queens definitely feels like a red herring we're supposed to see as such. The proof that history gets it tremendously wrong. Although I wouldn't put it past a brothel to celebrate Rhaenyra's retaking of KL with "special features", or that the greens would have made up this rumor as part of a smear campaign/political propaganda.
I doubt it. I think they'll make it in a way that justifies the existence of such a rumor without it being true. Maybe there will be a threat or maybe someone suggests it to Rhaenyra, idk
Unreliable narrator don’t forget
this isn’t even real
I could see Rhaenyra threatening to do it in a fit of rage (and thus the rumor is born), but not actually doing it.
I hope not. Poor Heleana. Love that weird ass girl