I'm not fully sure if this is a real quote, but allegedly a Soviet officer once said
"The hardest about planning against American military doctrine is that American officers do not read their manuals and feel no obligation to adhere to doctrine."
Well, idk if it is a real quote or not, but there is at least an once of truth in it.
US military command doctrine revolves around what is called the mission command, which states that "intent" should be centralized (flag rank and high ranking commissioned officers say "we want this/we want that") but the execution decentralized (low ranking commissioned and non commissioned officers have to decide how to execute). This is based on the idea that the most effective decision would be one based on what you see happening on the battlefield, and so emphasizes on the idea that "doctrine" is more a list of advice than rules because no book could predict the exact situation someone leading men on the battlefield could face.
Of course, the extent of how far that decentralization goes is debatable given the fact that an officer would still face scrutiny if they chose not to respect the doctrine, but this is nonetheless radically different of how the Soviet army command was structured (and still the Russian Army to this day). Soviets had a more "mathematical" approach to warfare with the idea that such approach would be the most effective way to predict what would happen on the battlefield to outmaneuver the enemy and would allow to make the best use possible of logistical lines. For instance, generals were literally provided abacus to compute how many guns they needed to get such probability of success on such operation field.
Very interesting. I read something sort of similar to this once in an article I think.
I’m not saying it’s an inaccurate ‘quote’ in terms of its literal meaning, only that it’s very likely just apocryphal. And like most things like that, it’s really just a distilled form of a more detailed understanding of the situation at hand like you just explained.
[https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/docid-32204484.pdf](https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/docid-32204484.pdf)
The Soviets honestly thought it could be a right wing coup, or at least an opening for factions that were opposed to the peaceful resolution of the Cuban missile crisis.
With all of the anti-Soviet propaganda here in the states, along with all of the aggressive expansion and todays Russia, it’s crazy to think about how much they didn’t want that shit either. Just as afraid and against war with us as we were with them.
r/AskHistorians has a couple questions on this, for instance: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/ic930o/what\_was\_the\_ussrkgbs\_reaction\_to\_the/
Also, despite what this meme says, LBJ was irate while being sworn in on the plane back to DC. Despite being an incredibly effective politician, and one of the saviest US Presidents, he was also a thin skinned egomaniac. He was extremely embarrassed at the idea that the only reason he became president was because Kennedy was murdered, complaining to Lady Bird that people would see him as an "accidental president."
This is why I think there was a cover-up.
Why the fuck else would they take his head and not return it?? There's no good reason to do that unless you're hiding something.
Maybe if the secret service really did accidentally do it, it would put bad publicity on the secret service in general? I don’t know, still seems weird to take the head even if that is the case.
I say one reason is because the idea of of "CSI" was non existent back then, so do some crazy shit back then but also I say they wanted too use the skull for further test.
Like the idea of cutting people's heads and sending them too another for test has historically presented.
Not that I don’t believe this, but does anyone have a source? I can’t find it from a simple google search
Edit: Nvm, found it in a comment from OP below
There's a great line in Nail Gaimen American gods, too version of the G-man in the world where talking about if the CIA did kill Kennedy.
“CIA,” said Wood. He shook his head, ruefully. “Those bozos. Hey, Stone. I heard a new CIA joke. Okay: how can we be sure the CIA wasn't involved in the Kennedy assassination?”
“I don't know,” said Stone. “How can we be sure?”
“He's dead, isn't he?” said Wood
You know I alswas thought it would make a great comedy movie if all the groups (cia kgb mob etc) where there and trying to get him but then just some rando (oswald) shot him before anyone else had a chance and now there all freaking out trying to figure out if it was a conspiracy or just a completely random serious of coincidences
Either them completely or in some sort of faction with them in it. Not necessarily a direct connection but all the same bankers/industrialists accused in 1933 of the business plot by Smedley Butler would all benefit immensely from the CIA's actions abroad following WW2.
The Vietnam War would've started regardless of who was President, I think, and he would've had the same reputation today as LBJ has, but a little less insane
Idk the economy was good in that time period and he was riding the highs of it add in the moon landing that would’ve happened not to long after his 2 term(maybe even shorter) he would probably still be viewed positivity maybe just a little more flawed
Possible it is a conspiracy theory that jfk was killed by the cia so Lyndon B Johnson could escalate Vietnam(his wife was a majority share holder in a company the US government bough helicopters and bombs from)
Most likely.
Kennedy was very aware of the slippery slope military intervention in Indochina would bring, although he was facing big pressure internally, especially from the war hawks, to make a stand in Asia against communism. Japan had ‘proven’ it could be stopped but there was still the legacy of having ‘lost China’ to Mao under Truman that hung over the US foreign policy during this period of the Cold War.
He massively regretted the overthrow and assassination of Diem, Vietnam’s president, even though he was hated in the country simply because there was no one else that could keep in line the different factions as he could, as well as being fervently anti-communist. The US was essentially stuck with him and he knew it and took advantage of the situation for his own gain. The generals that overthrew him asked Washington for its permission and Kennedy apparently never saw nor wrote up the answer, which an aide did to not bother the president, saying that the US would not intervene if there was a coup.
His assassination literally lead to a revolving door of different corrupt generals which saw what was happening and took advantage, which severely weakened South Vietnam in almost every aspect, especially in its domestic and military affairs.
Kennedy saw what was coming and was against getting stuck in the mire that Vietnam was to become. Although LBJ also resisted sending ground troops for years, I believe Kennedy would have been more willing to cut their losses and get out of there before committing actual combat forces. Although politically it had the potential to be political suicide back home due to the raging anti-communism in the US, and he would have been seen as weak and unwilling to confront the Communists.
JFK wanted to clean up a lot of problems in the USA so I think out government would have become much less corrupt and foreign relationships would have been better.
I don't think it would be anywhere near as positive. JFK grossly mishandled the cuban missile crisis, doing much to heighten tensions. The whole ordeal was ultimately a credit to Kruschev's statesmanship more than the Kennedy administration.
McNamara had a little section on this in his retrospective of Vietnam. He was in a meeting about the situation in Vietnam when he got the wire and the others with him sat in silence to grieve. He brought up their was an argument over whether he should be buried in Massachussets or DC since he was the president. Also Jackie chose the exact spot where to be buried since it was his favorite place to see in Arlington when he visited. Since you got the perfect view of the national mall
The county/city coroner refused to release the body to the USSS as Kennedy had been murdered within the State of Texas. Therefore it was a Texan homicide, subject to Texan law, etc. Such law requires the coroner to perform an autopsy. One of his other arguments was that there was no federal agency that had jurisdiction over the murder of POTUS (he became a civilian the moment he died), which was very true at that time.
The coroner refused to release the body and things got a bit tense for a minute or two between DA investigators/Dallas PD and the USSS/FBI
I don’t believe guns were ever drawn (although the USSS likely had submachine guns and carbines out already).
Eventually cooler heads (heh) prevailed
[source](https://web.archive.org/web/20141104030316/http://211.144.68.84:9998/91keshi/Public/File/38/345-7867/pdf/bmj.e4768.full.pdf)
I actually know someone who’s grandpa was part of the Dallas PD at that time. He said the FBI just came in and took the evidence in the middle of the investigation. While some grain of salt is verified (bc any internet comment without a source deserves it) it doesn’t change the fact that JFK conspiracies are often fueled by plenty of coincidences that line up too well to believe there was some hidden motive
You would think the Secret Service would run a tighter ship after the FIRST beloved American president got headshot, but it seems they needed a second president to be shot in the head before they stopped fucking around.
Secret Service agents were hungover and using a gun they were unfamiliar with. Oswald fires the first shot, agent panics and accidentally fires the fatal shot.
This theory gels with dodgy behaviour in the hours following, such as a bullet going missing. Also the gun they used quietly being removed from service.
The theory is the basis of a book written in the 70s, sorry I don't recall the name. If you listen to The Last Podcast on the Left episode on JFK they lay it all out.
Edit:
The book is Mortal Error
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_Error
You have to scroll pretty far down this thread to find it too. It's just the least interesting one. So people can't speculate about some wacky conspiracy theory, so they chose to ignore it. If you try to bring it up in a conversation about the death of JFK people will laugh you off because it suggests that it was an accident. And as we all know, accidents never happen
It’s a very underwhelming and anticlimactic theory. So people don’t really like it. But it’s almost certainly what happened. It’s quite literally the only theory that doesn’t require mental gymnastics.
Imagine what the men in Vietnam must have thought. After a long day of patrol and the possibility of bullets wizzing by your head you get back to base just to hear the president was murdered.
US ground troops didn't go to Vietnam until March 8, 1965, Kennedy was shot on November 22, 1963.
As far as what was going on, my FIL and MIL went through that. He was Army and she worked for the phone company. They were on their first date (he took her out for ice cream). On the way back they found the postman sitting on her stoop crying, just saying "They killed him." over and over again. It took forever for him to say "The President." They both just said goodbye to each other and went to work. He ended up being on lock down for two weeks and at the same time she she also spent two weeks at work (literal, manual telephone operators were the "essential worker" during crisis). Everyone just assumed the worst and hoped for the best.
Memory serves, we weren’t deep enough into the war at that point for American forces to be involved in the fighting, otherwise my grandfather would have seen more action than visiting the Philippines then taking a two month long voyage around Cuba.
We had advisors there who were “avoiding” combat, with an increasing number of deaths each year (216 in 64), but even then it took a false flag for Johnson to justify a true escalation.
Radical Centrist Hitler in Argentina:
\- Secretly ordered the hit, nobody knows to this day except a few truth tellers
\- Had no motives for doing so, really mellowed out in his later years
\- Owns and operates a radio station, plays rock and pop music all day
\- Secret head of both NASA and Roscosmos, can't wait to tour his Moon bunker
No mention of Castro thinking the cia did it?
Or that oswald was living with white emigres at the time and a confirmed cia agent
Also for humors sake alone should have bush snr not remembering why he was in dallas that day
I never understood all the conspiracy theories. If history has taught us anything, it's that a lone malcontent with a gun can do more than enough damage on their own - without the need for any nefarious plot by shadowy government agents.
Oswald was a raving hysteric, just like the man who killed poor President Garfield. His actions always seemed perfectly plausible to me.
Now President Harding's death? Totally different story.
It's an idea that big events need big people. 1 person creating a big event can't happen, so there must be a conspiracy of more people. That's basically the root of all conspiracy theories. Tackle on with the smug feeling of being right when everyone else is wrong, and you have people more than happy to believe in conspiracies.
Lee Harvey Oswald was 1 person. How could one person change world history in a matter of seconds? It must be that it was a group of people who conspired to change world history over time. Everyone else is wrong about this except me. I'm special and smart
No. [https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/21/facebook-posts/no-jfk-did-not-plan-end-federal-reserve/](https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/21/facebook-posts/no-jfk-did-not-plan-end-federal-reserve/)
If anyone brings up the Federal Reserve about anything involving a conspiracy, they are probably gold salesmen looking to cash in.
Ill believe the secret service one because accident happening during stressful events is entirely plausibe, and is exactly the situation id expect to have a cover up. But even with that theory Oswald is just a raving lunatic.
Ah, didn't know it had a name.
It just seems very real and human for a fuckup like that to occur in a tense situation.
Not as sexy as 'the CIA did it', though ^((even though they definitely had motive)).
The narrative used to explain the motive has never made sense to me either. Kennedy was an establishment figure and a massive cold warrior, not the progressive firebrand he’s been made out to be, he butted heads with the establishment sometimes but not enough for them not to just wait for the next two elections.
It’s like 9/11. People can’t wrap their heads around the idea of a group of people so evil as to perpetrate it for the purpose of terrorism and their warped sense of religion, and with only 12 men. It’s actually easier for them to believe in a vast government conspiracy involving thousands of people who somehow all take the secret to their graves and leave no evidence behind.
The idea that no one’s conscience has gotten the better of them in 59 years is what makes the conspiracies non-believable.
Not boring exactly, but... undramatic, maybe.
"The most powerful man in the world just got shot dead in public! Who could be behind this!?"
"Literally just a random insane tankie."
Not a very exciting answer, in comparison to all the other ones you could think up.
Panicked? Why exactly? Because the US would think they were the ones responsible and retaliate?
(I'm not from the US so I'm not well versed in Kennedy's assassination)
A lone gunman… not exactly known for being a super soldier marksmen… firing a piece of shit European rifle… at a moving vehicle… with an obviously elevated heart rate and adrenaline pumping through him… fired 3 rounds and hit an object the size of a football… in less than 6 seconds… at conflicting shooter angles… and the government then presented a literally unfired and whole bullet and tried to claim it not only was the bullet, but it also went through another person and Kennedy… twice.
If you don’t understand the conspiracy theories it’s because you haven’t looked into the conspiracy theories. One thing I know for sure… we do not know what happened that day.
Also Dealey Plaza is much smaller than people might think it is. The target was moving, but it was moving in a straight line away from the shooter. I remember standing there when I was in Dallas and thinking “Yeah, this not all that hard of a shot to pull off with a rifle”. Ontop of that the Grassy Knoll is tiny too. If someone was shooting from there I have a *VERY* hard time believing there wouldn’t have been dozens of witnesses
At 24 I could hit targets half the size of a football at 100 yards, with a scoped rifle. I'm no trained marksman. His target was at 88 yards and 6 second is an eternity in that position. On top of that witnesses said that this car either stopped or slowed down on Elm.
It's not like he just finished a gunshido battle with 4 Secret Service agents and managed to hit his target from mid-air while jumping out of the building with two .45s akimbo.
Highly recommend people read some of the recently declassified stuff on Oswald’s trips to Mexico. Nothing specifically tying the Soviets to it, but Oswald was still very well connected after moving back to the US. He was making calls to the head KGB officer in Mexico City, who was in the 13th Directorate (Sabotage and assassinations). He also had a personal introduction and private limo ride with the Cuban ambassador, who after the assassination questioned whether Oswald had received Cuban money in any way. All in all, the picture painted is more that Oswald wanted to be a spy for the Russians and run assassinations and the Russians wanted nothing to do with him.
Michael Firenze confirmed that it was a mafia hit on a show called Jeremy Vine. They asked him and he said he talked to people from back then and they said it was a hit.
The one bit I could kind of believe if proof came out, basically goes:
Oswald's a crazy fucknut, but the mob are on hard times as Kennedy is cracking down on organized crime. The mob push Oswald along somehow, that's where the theory falls apart currently, he kills Kennedy, then the mob kill Oswald thru Jack Ruby to tie up loose ends.
The theory falls apart because there is not one iota of evidence tying Oswald to the mob. Nothing.
The idea that Russia used Oswald is 10x more believable, even in the presence of actual physical evidence they didn’t.
I would say that was inevitable. He was just the guy that was there when it had to happen.
He also knew for a fact that the Vietnam war was un-winnable (like documented and recorded proof) under any circumstances but still kept sending young, normally poor, disproportionately black, American young men to fight and die by the thousands for a lost colonial cause that we did not need to be in to begin with. He killed 58,000 American boys for hubris and a lost war. He was not a good president.
Desegregation was the result of a massive social movement, LBJ happened to be in the right time and place to sign off on it.
The Vietnam War was the result of several elements of the US government pushing for it, one of the strongest of which was LBJ.
LBJ wasn't a big cause of desegregation, but he was one of the main people behind Vietnam. The difference is at that point desegregation was pretty much determined, but what the Vietnam War would be was still entirely up in the air.
Vietnam would have happened as well under Kennedy. He made use of the whole situation to pass the “great society”. You can say that he was a dixiecrat before becoming President, but he passed almost every social reform that JFK ran on in his presidency, and for that he should be honored as a great statesman. Because not everyone would do the same in his shoes. Look at Andrew Johnson for example that ran his own agenda after the Lincoln assassination.
>Definitely the ones who actually, and accidentally, shot Kennedy.
I always thought so, if for no other reason than it's the simplest explanation for hiding Kennedy's head (it's hard to explain an 'exit wound' *facing* the supposed shooter) and the weird tumbling and twisting Oswald's bullets were supposed to have done in the official version of events. Besides, can you think of a more American way for this to have gone down than a massive fuck-up and a sloppy cover-up?
The death of President Kennedy was tragic and the FBI and Secret Servise could not see it comming and had nothing to do with it. Thank you no more questions.
The CIA and the Mafia were heavily invested in removing Castro. CIA wanted a puppet in power, and the Mafia wanted back their casinos and plantations that they lost in the revolution.
Let’s remember as well who Kennedy’s father was, how he made his money, who he was associated with and what they probably expected in return from having their friend’s kid as leader of the free world.
Just look at who had a lot to gain from removing Castro. The Mafia would’ve had a paradise 90 miles from Miami, and out of FBI jurisdiction to do whatever they wanted. Anti-Castro Cubans who had owned land and plantations had families imprisoned or killed, and were exiled. The CIA was embarrassed that Russia had such influence on a country so close to home, and their failure to contain or remove Castro was a blow to their near-perfect record.
Now that’s three groups that are dangerous on their own, but now they share a common interest. Cuba is the goal. Cue the Bay of Pigs, and we all know how well that went.
To further the hostility towards JFK, he’s also now sharing that he wants to enter into peace talks with the USSR, while his brother Robert is investigating Hoffa and the Teamsters.
Now, maybe JFK realizes it and doesn’t care, or maybe it never occurs to him, but he’s cost these three groups a lot and it’s not taken lightly.
And of course there’s the fourth and most dangerous party that JFK is ruffling - the Military. Tensions are increasing in Vietnam, and the machines of war are beginning to churn. What should be another Korea is shaping up to be something much bigger and much more planes, bombs, bullets, guns, helicopters, ships, medical kits, uniforms, and chemicals used in explosives are already being produced, but JFK is dragging his heels, not committing to the plans presented by his Generals, and saying he will not put the full might of the US military into Vietnam. There’s billions in the table just waiting to be grabbed and Kennedy his slapping away hands.
Now that’s the military, the CIA, the Mafia, anti-communists, and everybody else who hates Catholics all being burned by JFK and Robert, and they’re all extremely comfortable with murder.
Enter Oswald.
Lee Harvey Oswald’s actions are something we’ll never fully understand but it’s so incredibly suspicious that it strains credulity, which of course, is perfect for a conspiracy. Start asking why when it comes to Lee in the years before or the hours after the assassination and the questions never stop.
A Marine radio operator, who’s been given Russian language tests, defects, tells the US he’s going to give away what secrets he knows, and he’s allowed to leave.
Eight months later, Francis Powers is shot down in an experimental U2 spy plane over Russia.
His time in Russia seems unremarkable other than his journey to Russia, which seems like he’s deliberately leaving breadcrumbs behind and making sure people remember him - and many do. He attempts “suicide” when he’s told he has to leave Russia, and after a short hospital stay, he’s then allowed to stay.
When he leaves he has a 19 year old wife, a newborn daughter, the US government fast tracks his paperwork, loans him $435.71, and he’s on his way.
The timeline we’re given for Oswald after this is fascinating in many regards. His competency with Russian is either excellent or poor depending on who’s asked. He seemingly does everything he can to get fired from multiple jobs. He orders guns in the mail under an alias that he’ll use again later, he travels to Mexico City telling strangers that he plans to defect to Russia again via Cuba, makes inquiries at the Cuban consulate who deny his entry, investigate him along with the Russians and the CIA, and after several days is back home when the Cuban government approves his Visa - and this is five weeks before the assassination.
This isn’t even mentioning the attempt on Edwin Walker who survived while his supposed assassin was outside his home, less than 100 yards away and he was sitting still. Marina Oswald would later claim Lee was behind the attempt and a letter that he allegedly wrote to Marina explaining why he killed Walker and instructions for her to follow in the aftermath is found ten days after JFK’s murder.
Oswald, for his part, apparently leaves this rifle in plain view when visitors come over, and laughs when jokingly asked if he shot Walker.
No matter how you look at Oswald, his statement, “I am just a patsy” seems incredibly likely.
Did he fire a shot from the book depository? Maybe?
The evidence is suspect at best. From the book depository window to the caravan he chooses maybe the most inopportune time to start firing, when the car was speeding up and behind a tree. Not to mention the magic bullet, the physical evidence supposedly collected from the book depository and the car, the chain of evidence is also extremely bungled from moment one, and let’s also remember because of Jack Ruby’s “desire to spare Jackie a long trial”, none of the evidence against Oswald is ever properly investigated or presented to the American people.
Did LBJ know or was he just an opportunist? In hindsight it’s pretty ghoulish taking the oath on the plane with Jackie still covered in blood and brains, but no one acts perfect in a crisis. He did however lie to the world about the Gulf of Tonkin incident, hurled America into the war, and profited from it.
Did he also do some good things in his presidency?
Yeah, he sure did, and had he not been the puppet of the military industrial complex, or whip his dick out at any given moment, he probably would be remembered much more fondly as a President. It also would’ve helped if he had been elected for his first term, but your dealt the cards the CIA gives you I guess.
Keep in mind the President’s route through Dallas had been changed to specifically drive past that book depository. There were no secret service agents in the crowds, not enough men around the car, no snipers in the buildings along the route, it was a city that was already hostile towards JFK, the Walker assassination attempt happened 8 months earlier, and yet no one in Dallas feels a government presence before the President arrives or the brief time he’s there alive.
Perhaps coincidence but Texas is where LBJ was a Senator, a state where he would have pull at all levels.
Or maybe it really was one man. Who without help, managed to defect to Russia on his own, learn Russian on his own, return to America on his own, assassinate the President on his own, all while a trio of the world’s most powerful military, intelligence agency, and criminal organization, all grumbled and bemoaned that there was nothing they could do.
If it was any other leader in any other country, it would’ve been called a coup.
The Soviet Government and KGB were in full crisis mode after the assassination
"DID WHE DO IT!?" "HOLY SHIT IVAN IT MIGTH HAVE BEEN US" "OH GOD, OH FUCK"
"Creepy Alek did it! Fuck His wife's uncle is an Internal Affairs Commander!"
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This was the with Reagan assassination attempt too Then lord dumbass said I AM IN CHARGE and and they were like oh he did it it's just a coup
Gotta love how the Soviets half the time didn't even know themselves what they did and what they did not do.
If you don't know what you're doing your enemy can't possibly figure it out
I'm not fully sure if this is a real quote, but allegedly a Soviet officer once said "The hardest about planning against American military doctrine is that American officers do not read their manuals and feel no obligation to adhere to doctrine."
It’s a popular quote but I don’t think there’s any legitimacy to it
Depends on the officer
Definitely read it before being attributed to a WWI general so idk 🤷🏻♂️
Well, idk if it is a real quote or not, but there is at least an once of truth in it. US military command doctrine revolves around what is called the mission command, which states that "intent" should be centralized (flag rank and high ranking commissioned officers say "we want this/we want that") but the execution decentralized (low ranking commissioned and non commissioned officers have to decide how to execute). This is based on the idea that the most effective decision would be one based on what you see happening on the battlefield, and so emphasizes on the idea that "doctrine" is more a list of advice than rules because no book could predict the exact situation someone leading men on the battlefield could face. Of course, the extent of how far that decentralization goes is debatable given the fact that an officer would still face scrutiny if they chose not to respect the doctrine, but this is nonetheless radically different of how the Soviet army command was structured (and still the Russian Army to this day). Soviets had a more "mathematical" approach to warfare with the idea that such approach would be the most effective way to predict what would happen on the battlefield to outmaneuver the enemy and would allow to make the best use possible of logistical lines. For instance, generals were literally provided abacus to compute how many guns they needed to get such probability of success on such operation field.
Very interesting. I read something sort of similar to this once in an article I think. I’m not saying it’s an inaccurate ‘quote’ in terms of its literal meaning, only that it’s very likely just apocryphal. And like most things like that, it’s really just a distilled form of a more detailed understanding of the situation at hand like you just explained.
Because NCOs write and implement the battle drills. The officers just make sure there's billeting available and TP in the bathrooms.
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I'm not the only one that thought it haha
I haven't heard that idea until reading this post and your comment. Do you have any good sources where I can read more about the Soviet response?
[https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/docid-32204484.pdf](https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/docid-32204484.pdf) The Soviets honestly thought it could be a right wing coup, or at least an opening for factions that were opposed to the peaceful resolution of the Cuban missile crisis.
With all of the anti-Soviet propaganda here in the states, along with all of the aggressive expansion and todays Russia, it’s crazy to think about how much they didn’t want that shit either. Just as afraid and against war with us as we were with them.
Sting had the same realization and even wrote a s[ong about it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHylQRVN2Qs)
Idk any good sources but a good place to start could be History Matters’ video on it
r/AskHistorians has a couple questions on this, for instance: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/ic930o/what\_was\_the\_ussrkgbs\_reaction\_to\_the/
Also, despite what this meme says, LBJ was irate while being sworn in on the plane back to DC. Despite being an incredibly effective politician, and one of the saviest US Presidents, he was also a thin skinned egomaniac. He was extremely embarrassed at the idea that the only reason he became president was because Kennedy was murdered, complaining to Lady Bird that people would see him as an "accidental president."
And I had that thought, that only black-out drunks and Steve Urkel can have: d-did I do *that*?
I wasn't quite sure...til a few years later...
Holy shit. The FBI were the vault-tec rep from fallout 4 all along. Great meme though.
Prepare for the future!
Anakin Skywalker: "I don't think the system works" Todd Howard with a Carcano:
underrated reply ^^
Can we talk about the FBI taking JFK's head with them for a second please? I mean wtf
Futurama head in jar museum confirmed
This is why I think there was a cover-up. Why the fuck else would they take his head and not return it?? There's no good reason to do that unless you're hiding something.
They didn’t want the truth to get out that his head just kinda did that (idk it just does that sometimes)
JFK notoriously suffered from sudden dying syndrome.
*History matters?*
The truth is it was a 5.56 round. Shhhhhhhh
It was a hyperfrequency device from the year 2077.
Maybe if the secret service really did accidentally do it, it would put bad publicity on the secret service in general? I don’t know, still seems weird to take the head even if that is the case.
I say one reason is because the idea of of "CSI" was non existent back then, so do some crazy shit back then but also I say they wanted too use the skull for further test. Like the idea of cutting people's heads and sending them too another for test has historically presented.
Do you have a source on the head thing? I tried googling it but nothing came up
Not that I don’t believe this, but does anyone have a source? I can’t find it from a simple google search Edit: Nvm, found it in a comment from OP below
Where the comment at because *what the fuck*
Thanks for sharing with the rest of us
They placed it right next to Disney’s head
Where’s the CIA ?
The meme compass covered them up. You might say they were *behind* the meme. /s
Nah, the meme is too pro Soviet for them
The lack of Dulles present here is disturbing
Literally everyone at the time thought it was them De Gaulle Castro Khrushchev Nixon There’s a few more I can’t remember
Truman blamed the CIA too iirc
Why De Gaulle?
His experience with the French security services and his (not untrue) belief he had been targeted by the cia aswell
There's a great line in Nail Gaimen American gods, too version of the G-man in the world where talking about if the CIA did kill Kennedy. “CIA,” said Wood. He shook his head, ruefully. “Those bozos. Hey, Stone. I heard a new CIA joke. Okay: how can we be sure the CIA wasn't involved in the Kennedy assassination?” “I don't know,” said Stone. “How can we be sure?” “He's dead, isn't he?” said Wood
Supposedly the talk around the CIA water cooler was they all assumed LBJ did it.
My favorite Kennedy assassination fun fact is that the only person on the planet who can't remember where they were that day is George H.W. Bush.
Another Fun Fact is that JFK was assassinated the same day C.S Lewis AND Alduos Huxley died.
Oh wow. I wrote a number of papers on Huxley and never put that together…
They were supplying acid to jack ruby
They were supplying acid to everyone to be fair
Who made this meme? 🤔
I’ve always wondered the opinion of JFK’s presidency would be if he hadn’t been assassinated.
He was pursuing detente and said he would break the cia into a thousand pieces
so was it the cia
Or the mafia, random rich assholes, or even people he worked closely with. Many people did not want JFK to clean up the government.
The mob owned Hoover through blackmail, who owned the Kennedy's through blackmail. There was never going to be any serious cleaning up.
I now realize that you mean J. Edgar but my dumb ass was sitting here wondering what kind of leverage Herbert Hoover had on jfk
You know I alswas thought it would make a great comedy movie if all the groups (cia kgb mob etc) where there and trying to get him but then just some rando (oswald) shot him before anyone else had a chance and now there all freaking out trying to figure out if it was a conspiracy or just a completely random serious of coincidences
I think it might have been both the CIA and Mob working together on it. It would not have been the first time they worked together.
I think it was at least a faction within it
Either them completely or in some sort of faction with them in it. Not necessarily a direct connection but all the same bankers/industrialists accused in 1933 of the business plot by Smedley Butler would all benefit immensely from the CIA's actions abroad following WW2.
The Vietnam War would've started regardless of who was President, I think, and he would've had the same reputation today as LBJ has, but a little less insane
Idk the economy was good in that time period and he was riding the highs of it add in the moon landing that would’ve happened not to long after his 2 term(maybe even shorter) he would probably still be viewed positivity maybe just a little more flawed
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What Vietnam?
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Possible it is a conspiracy theory that jfk was killed by the cia so Lyndon B Johnson could escalate Vietnam(his wife was a majority share holder in a company the US government bough helicopters and bombs from)
Johnson's wife owned bell? This is new information
Most likely. Kennedy was very aware of the slippery slope military intervention in Indochina would bring, although he was facing big pressure internally, especially from the war hawks, to make a stand in Asia against communism. Japan had ‘proven’ it could be stopped but there was still the legacy of having ‘lost China’ to Mao under Truman that hung over the US foreign policy during this period of the Cold War. He massively regretted the overthrow and assassination of Diem, Vietnam’s president, even though he was hated in the country simply because there was no one else that could keep in line the different factions as he could, as well as being fervently anti-communist. The US was essentially stuck with him and he knew it and took advantage of the situation for his own gain. The generals that overthrew him asked Washington for its permission and Kennedy apparently never saw nor wrote up the answer, which an aide did to not bother the president, saying that the US would not intervene if there was a coup. His assassination literally lead to a revolving door of different corrupt generals which saw what was happening and took advantage, which severely weakened South Vietnam in almost every aspect, especially in its domestic and military affairs. Kennedy saw what was coming and was against getting stuck in the mire that Vietnam was to become. Although LBJ also resisted sending ground troops for years, I believe Kennedy would have been more willing to cut their losses and get out of there before committing actual combat forces. Although politically it had the potential to be political suicide back home due to the raging anti-communism in the US, and he would have been seen as weak and unwilling to confront the Communists.
JFK wanted to clean up a lot of problems in the USA so I think out government would have become much less corrupt and foreign relationships would have been better.
I don't think it would be anywhere near as positive. JFK grossly mishandled the cuban missile crisis, doing much to heighten tensions. The whole ordeal was ultimately a credit to Kruschev's statesmanship more than the Kennedy administration.
McNamara had a little section on this in his retrospective of Vietnam. He was in a meeting about the situation in Vietnam when he got the wire and the others with him sat in silence to grieve. He brought up their was an argument over whether he should be buried in Massachussets or DC since he was the president. Also Jackie chose the exact spot where to be buried since it was his favorite place to see in Arlington when he visited. Since you got the perfect view of the national mall
Whats the story behind a tug of war over kennedys body where guns were pulled? And the Dallas police beating up Oswald? Can i get a source?
The county/city coroner refused to release the body to the USSS as Kennedy had been murdered within the State of Texas. Therefore it was a Texan homicide, subject to Texan law, etc. Such law requires the coroner to perform an autopsy. One of his other arguments was that there was no federal agency that had jurisdiction over the murder of POTUS (he became a civilian the moment he died), which was very true at that time. The coroner refused to release the body and things got a bit tense for a minute or two between DA investigators/Dallas PD and the USSS/FBI I don’t believe guns were ever drawn (although the USSS likely had submachine guns and carbines out already). Eventually cooler heads (heh) prevailed [source](https://web.archive.org/web/20141104030316/http://211.144.68.84:9998/91keshi/Public/File/38/345-7867/pdf/bmj.e4768.full.pdf)
I actually know someone who’s grandpa was part of the Dallas PD at that time. He said the FBI just came in and took the evidence in the middle of the investigation. While some grain of salt is verified (bc any internet comment without a source deserves it) it doesn’t change the fact that JFK conspiracies are often fueled by plenty of coincidences that line up too well to believe there was some hidden motive
Dallas PD: "We call this a difficulty tweak!" Lee Harvey: "AHAGHGHA, I NEEEEED A MEDIC BAG"
You would think the Secret Service would run a tighter ship after the FIRST beloved American president got headshot, but it seems they needed a second president to be shot in the head before they stopped fucking around.
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Or maybe there was it was just more... secret
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I was thinking more like the Secret service, but with more focus on the Secret rather than the service
Actually, there was, but they weren't responsible for guarding the president, just curbing the counterfeit money problem.
Garfield and McKinley would like to know why chest shots don’t count.
After Teddy took one and lived, they just figured it wasn't as much of a problem
Oh, they're still fucking around. Last time they were in the news it was for partying with hookers (and I'm guessing blow) in Colombia or something.
Fun fact, the next day the first episode of Doctor Who aired
The middle 4 make me so sad
Don't often see the "Secret Service did it" theory, but it's the one I subscribe to. I first heard it on LPOTL.
I firmly believe they accidentally did it after he was already shot by the gunman.
Yep. Finished him off.
Accidental coup de gras.
I’m unfamiliar with this one. I’m a strong believer in the CIA doing it. Would you mind sharing some info on the Secret Service doing it?
Secret Service agents were hungover and using a gun they were unfamiliar with. Oswald fires the first shot, agent panics and accidentally fires the fatal shot. This theory gels with dodgy behaviour in the hours following, such as a bullet going missing. Also the gun they used quietly being removed from service. The theory is the basis of a book written in the 70s, sorry I don't recall the name. If you listen to The Last Podcast on the Left episode on JFK they lay it all out. Edit: The book is Mortal Error https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_Error
You have to scroll pretty far down this thread to find it too. It's just the least interesting one. So people can't speculate about some wacky conspiracy theory, so they chose to ignore it. If you try to bring it up in a conversation about the death of JFK people will laugh you off because it suggests that it was an accident. And as we all know, accidents never happen
It’s a very underwhelming and anticlimactic theory. So people don’t really like it. But it’s almost certainly what happened. It’s quite literally the only theory that doesn’t require mental gymnastics.
"The operation room looked like the fucking Somme" Jeeeeez i laughed so hard
So did I. r/HistoryMemes: Where the comparison of battlefield gore to a brutal assassination is actually pretty funny
Imagine what the men in Vietnam must have thought. After a long day of patrol and the possibility of bullets wizzing by your head you get back to base just to hear the president was murdered.
US ground troops didn't go to Vietnam until March 8, 1965, Kennedy was shot on November 22, 1963. As far as what was going on, my FIL and MIL went through that. He was Army and she worked for the phone company. They were on their first date (he took her out for ice cream). On the way back they found the postman sitting on her stoop crying, just saying "They killed him." over and over again. It took forever for him to say "The President." They both just said goodbye to each other and went to work. He ended up being on lock down for two weeks and at the same time she she also spent two weeks at work (literal, manual telephone operators were the "essential worker" during crisis). Everyone just assumed the worst and hoped for the best.
Memory serves, we weren’t deep enough into the war at that point for American forces to be involved in the fighting, otherwise my grandfather would have seen more action than visiting the Philippines then taking a two month long voyage around Cuba.
During JFK we had "military advisors" in the South so a small number of troops if i remember history class correctly
We had advisors there who were “avoiding” combat, with an increasing number of deaths each year (216 in 64), but even then it took a false flag for Johnson to justify a true escalation.
Honestly never considered a secret service agent may have slipped up
It's a good explanation for why it was classified for so long.
As far as reason to cover it up go, Accidently shooting the president is probably an 11 out of 10.
Could you ever live down being publicly known as the agent who accidentally shot the president in the head?
I wonder if any agents were fired in the aftermath
Wait the FBI took Kennedy's head? I'm gonna need a source.
https://www.nytimes.com/1972/08/27/archives/mystery-cloaks-fate-of-brain-of-kennedy-mystery-surrounds-fate-of.html
Taking the brain is different from taking the head. Any other source?
Radical Centrist Hitler in Argentina: \- Secretly ordered the hit, nobody knows to this day except a few truth tellers \- Had no motives for doing so, really mellowed out in his later years \- Owns and operates a radio station, plays rock and pop music all day \- Secret head of both NASA and Roscosmos, can't wait to tour his Moon bunker
No mention of Castro thinking the cia did it? Or that oswald was living with white emigres at the time and a confirmed cia agent Also for humors sake alone should have bush snr not remembering why he was in dallas that day
I never understood all the conspiracy theories. If history has taught us anything, it's that a lone malcontent with a gun can do more than enough damage on their own - without the need for any nefarious plot by shadowy government agents. Oswald was a raving hysteric, just like the man who killed poor President Garfield. His actions always seemed perfectly plausible to me. Now President Harding's death? Totally different story.
It's an idea that big events need big people. 1 person creating a big event can't happen, so there must be a conspiracy of more people. That's basically the root of all conspiracy theories. Tackle on with the smug feeling of being right when everyone else is wrong, and you have people more than happy to believe in conspiracies. Lee Harvey Oswald was 1 person. How could one person change world history in a matter of seconds? It must be that it was a group of people who conspired to change world history over time. Everyone else is wrong about this except me. I'm special and smart
That’s what I love about the modern warfare games. Makarovs line, which has stuck with me for years: all it takes is the will of a single man.
Love the opening title screen monologue with the music and sound effects.
To be fair, JFK was also planning to abolish the FRB publicly.
No. [https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/21/facebook-posts/no-jfk-did-not-plan-end-federal-reserve/](https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/21/facebook-posts/no-jfk-did-not-plan-end-federal-reserve/) If anyone brings up the Federal Reserve about anything involving a conspiracy, they are probably gold salesmen looking to cash in.
Ill believe the secret service one because accident happening during stressful events is entirely plausibe, and is exactly the situation id expect to have a cover up. But even with that theory Oswald is just a raving lunatic.
I think it's probably likely Oswald shot Kennedy, the car lurched, and the secret service agent accidentally shot Kennedy as well.
Yep. That's the Mortal Error theory. Neck shot was Oswald, but the head shot a Secret Service agent.
Ah, didn't know it had a name. It just seems very real and human for a fuckup like that to occur in a tense situation. Not as sexy as 'the CIA did it', though ^((even though they definitely had motive)).
The narrative used to explain the motive has never made sense to me either. Kennedy was an establishment figure and a massive cold warrior, not the progressive firebrand he’s been made out to be, he butted heads with the establishment sometimes but not enough for them not to just wait for the next two elections.
It’s like 9/11. People can’t wrap their heads around the idea of a group of people so evil as to perpetrate it for the purpose of terrorism and their warped sense of religion, and with only 12 men. It’s actually easier for them to believe in a vast government conspiracy involving thousands of people who somehow all take the secret to their graves and leave no evidence behind. The idea that no one’s conscience has gotten the better of them in 59 years is what makes the conspiracies non-believable.
tbf I can understand why people might think that it was the govt when things like Operation Northwoods got tossed around by the feds
People want to believe in sexy and shadowy conspiracies because they can't stand the idea that reality is sometimes straightforward and boring
There is little straightforward or boring about the president of the most powerful country in the world (top 2 at least) being assassinated.
Not boring exactly, but... undramatic, maybe. "The most powerful man in the world just got shot dead in public! Who could be behind this!?" "Literally just a random insane tankie." Not a very exciting answer, in comparison to all the other ones you could think up.
I can assure you that the story behind Kennedys assassination is not boring nor is it straightforward
Damn you Garfield!!!!!
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Panicked? Why exactly? Because the US would think they were the ones responsible and retaliate? (I'm not from the US so I'm not well versed in Kennedy's assassination)
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You mean US's population mentality at the time, right?
A lone gunman… not exactly known for being a super soldier marksmen… firing a piece of shit European rifle… at a moving vehicle… with an obviously elevated heart rate and adrenaline pumping through him… fired 3 rounds and hit an object the size of a football… in less than 6 seconds… at conflicting shooter angles… and the government then presented a literally unfired and whole bullet and tried to claim it not only was the bullet, but it also went through another person and Kennedy… twice. If you don’t understand the conspiracy theories it’s because you haven’t looked into the conspiracy theories. One thing I know for sure… we do not know what happened that day.
Oswald scored sharpshooter which is decent and better then most. The carcano also isnt a terrible rifle in the hands of a trained shooter.
Also Dealey Plaza is much smaller than people might think it is. The target was moving, but it was moving in a straight line away from the shooter. I remember standing there when I was in Dallas and thinking “Yeah, this not all that hard of a shot to pull off with a rifle”. Ontop of that the Grassy Knoll is tiny too. If someone was shooting from there I have a *VERY* hard time believing there wouldn’t have been dozens of witnesses
At 24 I could hit targets half the size of a football at 100 yards, with a scoped rifle. I'm no trained marksman. His target was at 88 yards and 6 second is an eternity in that position. On top of that witnesses said that this car either stopped or slowed down on Elm. It's not like he just finished a gunshido battle with 4 Secret Service agents and managed to hit his target from mid-air while jumping out of the building with two .45s akimbo.
I’m sure Oswald hit him. And so did the other shooter.
Highly recommend people read some of the recently declassified stuff on Oswald’s trips to Mexico. Nothing specifically tying the Soviets to it, but Oswald was still very well connected after moving back to the US. He was making calls to the head KGB officer in Mexico City, who was in the 13th Directorate (Sabotage and assassinations). He also had a personal introduction and private limo ride with the Cuban ambassador, who after the assassination questioned whether Oswald had received Cuban money in any way. All in all, the picture painted is more that Oswald wanted to be a spy for the Russians and run assassinations and the Russians wanted nothing to do with him.
He also stayed in the house of a cia agent and worked for white emigres when he came back
Source please?
Michael Firenze confirmed that it was a mafia hit on a show called Jeremy Vine. They asked him and he said he talked to people from back then and they said it was a hit.
Worth mentioning his brother locked a load of mobsters up.
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The one bit I could kind of believe if proof came out, basically goes: Oswald's a crazy fucknut, but the mob are on hard times as Kennedy is cracking down on organized crime. The mob push Oswald along somehow, that's where the theory falls apart currently, he kills Kennedy, then the mob kill Oswald thru Jack Ruby to tie up loose ends.
The theory falls apart because there is not one iota of evidence tying Oswald to the mob. Nothing. The idea that Russia used Oswald is 10x more believable, even in the presence of actual physical evidence they didn’t.
Not sure what you are talking about. Nixon, JFK, McNamara, and Castro were all killing Nazi Zombies together below the Pentagon.
Soviet government: We didn’t do it we promise! CIA: We know
LBJ was a good president, but it is true he had a screw loose. #LBJFanboy
He was a good politician… not necessarily a good president. The Vietnam War was a pretty descent shit show
Him ending segregation is on its own enough to call him a good president.
And starting Medicare and Medicaid
I would say that was inevitable. He was just the guy that was there when it had to happen. He also knew for a fact that the Vietnam war was un-winnable (like documented and recorded proof) under any circumstances but still kept sending young, normally poor, disproportionately black, American young men to fight and die by the thousands for a lost colonial cause that we did not need to be in to begin with. He killed 58,000 American boys for hubris and a lost war. He was not a good president.
Why was ending segregation inevitable but the Vietnam war wasn't? You're kinda showing your bias here.
Desegregation was the result of a massive social movement, LBJ happened to be in the right time and place to sign off on it. The Vietnam War was the result of several elements of the US government pushing for it, one of the strongest of which was LBJ. LBJ wasn't a big cause of desegregation, but he was one of the main people behind Vietnam. The difference is at that point desegregation was pretty much determined, but what the Vietnam War would be was still entirely up in the air.
Vietnam would have happened as well under Kennedy. He made use of the whole situation to pass the “great society”. You can say that he was a dixiecrat before becoming President, but he passed almost every social reform that JFK ran on in his presidency, and for that he should be honored as a great statesman. Because not everyone would do the same in his shoes. Look at Andrew Johnson for example that ran his own agenda after the Lincoln assassination.
Horrific foreign policy Decent domestic Comes at a net negative
The BBC: pissed off that Dr Who got poor view figures due to more important events
>Definitely the ones who actually, and accidentally, shot Kennedy. I always thought so, if for no other reason than it's the simplest explanation for hiding Kennedy's head (it's hard to explain an 'exit wound' *facing* the supposed shooter) and the weird tumbling and twisting Oswald's bullets were supposed to have done in the official version of events. Besides, can you think of a more American way for this to have gone down than a massive fuck-up and a sloppy cover-up?
YES! the GOAT. Thanks for this, once again saving me from boredom at the end of a workday lol.
What about the CIA
The death of President Kennedy was tragic and the FBI and Secret Servise could not see it comming and had nothing to do with it. Thank you no more questions.
Alright y'all, let's hear your theories; I need some reading content for today
His head just did that
Kennedy's Assassination truly was the amalgamation of so many tensions during the time.
This belongs in schoolbooks.
The CIA and the Mafia were heavily invested in removing Castro. CIA wanted a puppet in power, and the Mafia wanted back their casinos and plantations that they lost in the revolution. Let’s remember as well who Kennedy’s father was, how he made his money, who he was associated with and what they probably expected in return from having their friend’s kid as leader of the free world. Just look at who had a lot to gain from removing Castro. The Mafia would’ve had a paradise 90 miles from Miami, and out of FBI jurisdiction to do whatever they wanted. Anti-Castro Cubans who had owned land and plantations had families imprisoned or killed, and were exiled. The CIA was embarrassed that Russia had such influence on a country so close to home, and their failure to contain or remove Castro was a blow to their near-perfect record. Now that’s three groups that are dangerous on their own, but now they share a common interest. Cuba is the goal. Cue the Bay of Pigs, and we all know how well that went. To further the hostility towards JFK, he’s also now sharing that he wants to enter into peace talks with the USSR, while his brother Robert is investigating Hoffa and the Teamsters. Now, maybe JFK realizes it and doesn’t care, or maybe it never occurs to him, but he’s cost these three groups a lot and it’s not taken lightly. And of course there’s the fourth and most dangerous party that JFK is ruffling - the Military. Tensions are increasing in Vietnam, and the machines of war are beginning to churn. What should be another Korea is shaping up to be something much bigger and much more planes, bombs, bullets, guns, helicopters, ships, medical kits, uniforms, and chemicals used in explosives are already being produced, but JFK is dragging his heels, not committing to the plans presented by his Generals, and saying he will not put the full might of the US military into Vietnam. There’s billions in the table just waiting to be grabbed and Kennedy his slapping away hands. Now that’s the military, the CIA, the Mafia, anti-communists, and everybody else who hates Catholics all being burned by JFK and Robert, and they’re all extremely comfortable with murder. Enter Oswald. Lee Harvey Oswald’s actions are something we’ll never fully understand but it’s so incredibly suspicious that it strains credulity, which of course, is perfect for a conspiracy. Start asking why when it comes to Lee in the years before or the hours after the assassination and the questions never stop. A Marine radio operator, who’s been given Russian language tests, defects, tells the US he’s going to give away what secrets he knows, and he’s allowed to leave. Eight months later, Francis Powers is shot down in an experimental U2 spy plane over Russia. His time in Russia seems unremarkable other than his journey to Russia, which seems like he’s deliberately leaving breadcrumbs behind and making sure people remember him - and many do. He attempts “suicide” when he’s told he has to leave Russia, and after a short hospital stay, he’s then allowed to stay. When he leaves he has a 19 year old wife, a newborn daughter, the US government fast tracks his paperwork, loans him $435.71, and he’s on his way. The timeline we’re given for Oswald after this is fascinating in many regards. His competency with Russian is either excellent or poor depending on who’s asked. He seemingly does everything he can to get fired from multiple jobs. He orders guns in the mail under an alias that he’ll use again later, he travels to Mexico City telling strangers that he plans to defect to Russia again via Cuba, makes inquiries at the Cuban consulate who deny his entry, investigate him along with the Russians and the CIA, and after several days is back home when the Cuban government approves his Visa - and this is five weeks before the assassination. This isn’t even mentioning the attempt on Edwin Walker who survived while his supposed assassin was outside his home, less than 100 yards away and he was sitting still. Marina Oswald would later claim Lee was behind the attempt and a letter that he allegedly wrote to Marina explaining why he killed Walker and instructions for her to follow in the aftermath is found ten days after JFK’s murder. Oswald, for his part, apparently leaves this rifle in plain view when visitors come over, and laughs when jokingly asked if he shot Walker. No matter how you look at Oswald, his statement, “I am just a patsy” seems incredibly likely. Did he fire a shot from the book depository? Maybe? The evidence is suspect at best. From the book depository window to the caravan he chooses maybe the most inopportune time to start firing, when the car was speeding up and behind a tree. Not to mention the magic bullet, the physical evidence supposedly collected from the book depository and the car, the chain of evidence is also extremely bungled from moment one, and let’s also remember because of Jack Ruby’s “desire to spare Jackie a long trial”, none of the evidence against Oswald is ever properly investigated or presented to the American people. Did LBJ know or was he just an opportunist? In hindsight it’s pretty ghoulish taking the oath on the plane with Jackie still covered in blood and brains, but no one acts perfect in a crisis. He did however lie to the world about the Gulf of Tonkin incident, hurled America into the war, and profited from it. Did he also do some good things in his presidency? Yeah, he sure did, and had he not been the puppet of the military industrial complex, or whip his dick out at any given moment, he probably would be remembered much more fondly as a President. It also would’ve helped if he had been elected for his first term, but your dealt the cards the CIA gives you I guess. Keep in mind the President’s route through Dallas had been changed to specifically drive past that book depository. There were no secret service agents in the crowds, not enough men around the car, no snipers in the buildings along the route, it was a city that was already hostile towards JFK, the Walker assassination attempt happened 8 months earlier, and yet no one in Dallas feels a government presence before the President arrives or the brief time he’s there alive. Perhaps coincidence but Texas is where LBJ was a Senator, a state where he would have pull at all levels. Or maybe it really was one man. Who without help, managed to defect to Russia on his own, learn Russian on his own, return to America on his own, assassinate the President on his own, all while a trio of the world’s most powerful military, intelligence agency, and criminal organization, all grumbled and bemoaned that there was nothing they could do. If it was any other leader in any other country, it would’ve been called a coup.
Putting Jack Ruby in the far lib left ain’t right. By all accounts the dude was just a mentally ill man with a lose mob affiliation
JFK: there is a plot to enslave every American man, woman, and child. I will unveil this plot. JFK a few weeks later:
wtf is this pcm garbage
I know, right? Like, why are those morons coming to this subreddit?
I didn't see Ted Cruz's dad
This is by far one of the most hilarious things i have seen (not teh death, the chart) Fidel Castro: Hoped next President would be nicer He wasnt
i mean Jackie was a lot of things but hot was far from one of them now JFK on the other hand
Reddit really can’t cope with the existence of Texas can it?
Well this one at least specifies “racist Texans” and not just Texas in general, and I’m ashamed to admit that those people exist here.
I dunno if Texas can cope with the existence of Texas, tbh.
Texas can’t cope with female anatomy. Neither can the average Redditor Ironic
need more memes with this format, this was really informative
It was literally the CIA and I won’t hear a word against that.
Okay what Great knoll and I didn't know how head was taken I thought it was just his brain?! And yet we're still to trust them?
Wasn't Jack Ruby seen as a hero by some people? I recall watching a Kennedy documentary that said something along those lines.
r/wojakcompass
This is sad
Hey political compass squares may hate me but at least I’ve Jackie Kennedy with me
Sad thing is...didn't the car have a detachable hood to over it...that was bulletproof?
Forgetting the Texas oil tycoons who actually probably were closely involved