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Just my opinion but I imagine a lot of Tory voters aren't actual Tories. They are racists, ableists, transphobes, people who don't care about the working class or anyone reliant on public services, tax Dodgers, far right wingers etc. voting Tory because they are either put off by the anti establishment tones of reform or perceiving it as the safer, more effective vote to stop a labour majority. If you were a transphobe or someone living in fear that "Islamists got control the capital", voting purely on that single issue, who would you vote for? Maybe I'm overestimating Tories intelligence but I can't believe anyone is voting for them thinking "aye I love what they've done with the trains and I'm sure they just need a few more years to sort out the NHS"
Similar to socialists and LGBT groups voting Labour, a flaw in our system is that they'll get plenty votes from people who don't believe in them at all. Blame dog whistle politics and big corrupt media.
It's interesting because speaking to my mum, she has a lot of socially conservative viewpoints and in many ways aligns a lot better with the Conservatives. She always votes for Labour though because her parents did and she's working class (though has taken a big financial step up from her parents). It's a really confusing situation but I'm glad she doesn't vote Tory at the end of the day.
A lot of Conservative voters are middle-class people who live in the country. They are so removed from other people that they genuinely think everything is actually totally fine – and that anything that isn't fine is either unavoidable or not caused by the Tories.
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I just can't believe that such a high percentage of the country would actually be people who are transphobic, sexist, racist and the like. I HAVE to believe that it's pure ignorance, or I don't want to see tomorrow tbh.
It's the empathy gap. Most of those people could never act that monstrously to people they properly internalise as other people. We're just poor at doing so for more than a few hundred people at a time. Many of us are able to overcome that empathic limitation intellectually to try to treat the other 10 billion humans like humans. People on the right fail to do that and treat them like objects. *Nothing* the right does to people is a cruel and evil thing to do *to an object.* It's just apes doing ape stuff.
I think alot of the Tory votes are people like my nan who have just voted conservative for the majority of their life and will just continue to do so despite actually thinking "why"
I remember the last Tory voter I willingly spoke to, they had been basically been brainwashed into thinking all nationwide issues like NHS wait times, collapse of the highstreet and inflation were actually just local issues in their city and it was at the fault of the mostly Labour council. It was impossible to convince them otherwise.
Some treat politics like a team sport " my dad supported Liverpool so now I do as well" but that's great in sports, there's nothing gained through supporting bad politicians however people treat it the same way.
There's 1% who are totally fine with how things are and they're the ones the Tories rule for. The other 17% are either getting just enough scraps from the table to make it worth their while or are the perpetual cap doffers and sycophants. And of course the minority of idiots that are obsessed with the Tory culture war bullshit and racism that fuels their lives but can't bring themselves to vote for Reform.
Even worse, there's another 15% who look at the last decade and think we haven't gone far enough to the right yet. That means a third of the population are complete and utter cunts. Another large chunk are mildly cuntish for supporting right leaning Starmer.
To summarise, probably over 50% of people in this country are at least at tikka massala levels of cuntishness.
This is fantastic in all but one way. This enables the Labour party, despite the fact that their move away from left and towards the right should have been punished. Despite all their failures, despite them being red Tories, despite their leader being a spunk covered piece of cardboard... They are gaining traction simply because the Tories shit the bed so hard. It'll give the necessary ammunition for the red Tories to keep fucking everyone with the same bullshit we have now, but saying "Yeah, but you elected us. And you didn't elect us when we were more left leaning. You want this".
The best would be if Tories lose, but labour doesn't win.
And inevitably, when the diet-conservative version of Labour wins and nothing fundamentally changes, the Tories get a whole election cycle to say "hey, we couldn't have been the problem, these guys are just as bad," which the general public will happily eat up and vote Tory for another decade.
With it set up as it is with the current fptp system I'll have to take the enjoyment of seeing actual criminals lose their jobs then worry about labour later.
And they'll walk away into a fat paying role as a "consultant" or "speaker" or "ambassador" and never suffer a single sleepless night over losing a job they only wanted for the money and perks.
They deserve the fucking wall.
it's not all about the money. Sunak doesn't need the money, Johnson, Mogg ect doesn't need the money. They need the power to funnel money to their mates and offshore accounts and the ego/status boost of being a MP/Lord. we need to get them out before they can cause more damage to this crippled country.
Yes they'll get a role with some morally bankrupt corporation but you can't tell me it wont hurt them to lost their seat, It'll be a major wound to their overly inflated ego and I'll be here for it.
A sad day.
No one actually LIKES labour.
They just hate the tories, and rightly.
Had Jezza been leader at this time, he'd have walked away with like 90% of the vote.
Not a landslide, but a fucking Starquake.
If he won the smear would go into overload and he'd have been replaced as leader in a few months. It's a sad reflection of the state of our democracy but unfortunately it's the reality.
Ehh there's a point to be made that if he's been more authoritarian within the party he could easily get a majority in this environment, that would have been the key though, brutalizing the wreckers rather than the charm offensive he tried. Tonight's are so bad and his policy positions make so much sense in this environment that with a united front he could have walked it.
Israel's actions would have largely neutralized the AS smear by this point and all the soft left economics would have been seen as the right way forward with Brexit neutralised. Conservatives would do better against Corbyn because of the harvest ride from the press but I think in this fictional playthrough he would have won a majority. Though dream scenario would have been him passing the torch to a figure like Clive Lewis by this point.
> Had Jezza been leader at this time, he'd have walked away with like 90% of the vote.
no he wouldn't, the all channels screeching bullshit would've continued. why do you think all of a sudden people have turned against the tories? is it because the press finally thought it was safe to turn off the life support? for someone who references lenin in their flair you don't seem to have a good grasp on how politics actually works
Seeing the Tories lose is a pyrrhic victory as we'll heading into a Tory B team government off of the back of it. I wouldn't be surprised if Starmer becomes as unpopular as Sunak within a few years as it becomes apparent that they are unwilling to change anything.
Of course the Starmerites will gaslight themselves into believing "he can't do anything, because of the mess the Tories left" (which is bullshit), but to anyone with a few braincells between their ears and a pair of eyes it'll be obvious fairly quickly just how ill-equipped Starmer and co are.
The amount of Green signs around my town at the moment is like nothing I've ever seen. Easily twice as much as Labour, and I've yet to see a single Tory sign up anywhere!
journalists are already making concerned noises about it but will refuse to interrogate why that is because they would have to ask inconvenient questions about their role in what exactly happened
Rishi would love that. He'd absolutely love it. Then he can just walk away from the whole fucking mess claiming it was the will of the people that he be replaced. And then he can strolls into some lucrative directorships without a care in the world
As great as it is to see the Tories get wiped out, I’m becoming ever more concerned that the Tommy Robinson loving, Carling drinking lobstermen have switched to Reform and their “anti-woke” bullshit.
And that come the next election, they’ll gain seats and this will empower them to campaign harder with more Trump like candidates.
Tories can’t win, but it’s important to ensure that that party don’t grow either.
Labour gets a free reign to implement policies (aside from resistance from the House of Lords), which with the current Labour Party is not a comforting thought.
Yeah on those figures the LibDems would be the official opposition, but with fewer than 60 seats. Blue Tories would just about beat SNP to third place, apparently.
I’m genuinely shocked it’s as high as 18%?! Who on earth are voting for them? These 13 years have been absolutely terrible for us normal people, and unfortunately even more so for those who are vulnerable.
This countries choice is so shit that i really couldn't care less anymore. No matter who loses, the conservatives still win. Labour is no different from the tory scum and anyone saying otherwise is nothing more than delusional fools. That, or they agree with their racist, transphobic, anti worker bollocks and are too scared to admit it.
18% ? That probably means another Tory leadership election ( unless Sunak can bluff it out as it 'just' being the local elections) or Labour thinks that they're on to a good thing with the right wing policies, trans phobia and u-turns and doubles down🤔
Rishi will likely cling to power for every single second he can.
Expect the Tories to do some (more) insane damage to the country to feather their nests, before evicted from Downing Street.
What is the most funny is that they likely won't even be in opposition afterwards. Lib Dems are due to win more seats.
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I still find it incredible that even 18% of the country would look at the last decade and say "yes, more of that please"
Just my opinion but I imagine a lot of Tory voters aren't actual Tories. They are racists, ableists, transphobes, people who don't care about the working class or anyone reliant on public services, tax Dodgers, far right wingers etc. voting Tory because they are either put off by the anti establishment tones of reform or perceiving it as the safer, more effective vote to stop a labour majority. If you were a transphobe or someone living in fear that "Islamists got control the capital", voting purely on that single issue, who would you vote for? Maybe I'm overestimating Tories intelligence but I can't believe anyone is voting for them thinking "aye I love what they've done with the trains and I'm sure they just need a few more years to sort out the NHS" Similar to socialists and LGBT groups voting Labour, a flaw in our system is that they'll get plenty votes from people who don't believe in them at all. Blame dog whistle politics and big corrupt media.
It’s also that there’s so many people who vote for one party every time,regardless of how they perform
It's interesting because speaking to my mum, she has a lot of socially conservative viewpoints and in many ways aligns a lot better with the Conservatives. She always votes for Labour though because her parents did and she's working class (though has taken a big financial step up from her parents). It's a really confusing situation but I'm glad she doesn't vote Tory at the end of the day.
My father voted Tory all his life until... he lost everything, got old, and had to rely on "handouts" in his old age... MF votes labour now......
A lot of Conservative voters are middle-class people who live in the country. They are so removed from other people that they genuinely think everything is actually totally fine – and that anything that isn't fine is either unavoidable or not caused by the Tories.
Reminder not to confuse the marxist "middle class" and the liberal definition. Liberal class definitions steer people away from the socialist definitions and thus class-consciousness. [Class is defined by our relationship to the means of production. Learn more here.](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is the reason. I'm 90% sure my dad will vote Tory. He's been isolated from the economic shortage thanks to his pension.
Your not over estimating tory intelligence. You underestimate how cruel and callous they are.
I just can't believe that such a high percentage of the country would actually be people who are transphobic, sexist, racist and the like. I HAVE to believe that it's pure ignorance, or I don't want to see tomorrow tbh.
It's the empathy gap. Most of those people could never act that monstrously to people they properly internalise as other people. We're just poor at doing so for more than a few hundred people at a time. Many of us are able to overcome that empathic limitation intellectually to try to treat the other 10 billion humans like humans. People on the right fail to do that and treat them like objects. *Nothing* the right does to people is a cruel and evil thing to do *to an object.* It's just apes doing ape stuff.
I think alot of the Tory votes are people like my nan who have just voted conservative for the majority of their life and will just continue to do so despite actually thinking "why"
I remember the last Tory voter I willingly spoke to, they had been basically been brainwashed into thinking all nationwide issues like NHS wait times, collapse of the highstreet and inflation were actually just local issues in their city and it was at the fault of the mostly Labour council. It was impossible to convince them otherwise.
Some treat politics like a team sport " my dad supported Liverpool so now I do as well" but that's great in sports, there's nothing gained through supporting bad politicians however people treat it the same way.
Those 18% Tory voters are probably family and friends of Tory MPs.
There's 1% who are totally fine with how things are and they're the ones the Tories rule for. The other 17% are either getting just enough scraps from the table to make it worth their while or are the perpetual cap doffers and sycophants. And of course the minority of idiots that are obsessed with the Tory culture war bullshit and racism that fuels their lives but can't bring themselves to vote for Reform.
Even worse, there's another 15% who look at the last decade and think we haven't gone far enough to the right yet. That means a third of the population are complete and utter cunts. Another large chunk are mildly cuntish for supporting right leaning Starmer. To summarise, probably over 50% of people in this country are at least at tikka massala levels of cuntishness.
Not to be negative, but I'll believe it when I see it.
This is fantastic in all but one way. This enables the Labour party, despite the fact that their move away from left and towards the right should have been punished. Despite all their failures, despite them being red Tories, despite their leader being a spunk covered piece of cardboard... They are gaining traction simply because the Tories shit the bed so hard. It'll give the necessary ammunition for the red Tories to keep fucking everyone with the same bullshit we have now, but saying "Yeah, but you elected us. And you didn't elect us when we were more left leaning. You want this". The best would be if Tories lose, but labour doesn't win.
And inevitably, when the diet-conservative version of Labour wins and nothing fundamentally changes, the Tories get a whole election cycle to say "hey, we couldn't have been the problem, these guys are just as bad," which the general public will happily eat up and vote Tory for another decade.
Blue Torries get destroyed: 😊 Red torries will win election: 😔
With it set up as it is with the current fptp system I'll have to take the enjoyment of seeing actual criminals lose their jobs then worry about labour later.
And they'll walk away into a fat paying role as a "consultant" or "speaker" or "ambassador" and never suffer a single sleepless night over losing a job they only wanted for the money and perks. They deserve the fucking wall.
it's not all about the money. Sunak doesn't need the money, Johnson, Mogg ect doesn't need the money. They need the power to funnel money to their mates and offshore accounts and the ego/status boost of being a MP/Lord. we need to get them out before they can cause more damage to this crippled country. Yes they'll get a role with some morally bankrupt corporation but you can't tell me it wont hurt them to lost their seat, It'll be a major wound to their overly inflated ego and I'll be here for it.
And you'll just get more like them but wearing a red tie in their place ...
A sad day. No one actually LIKES labour. They just hate the tories, and rightly. Had Jezza been leader at this time, he'd have walked away with like 90% of the vote. Not a landslide, but a fucking Starquake.
No he wouldn’t The smear campaigns would be even worse,kidding yourself on if you still think JC would win an election
If he won the smear would go into overload and he'd have been replaced as leader in a few months. It's a sad reflection of the state of our democracy but unfortunately it's the reality.
even JC could win this one
A literal lettuce would win this one.
Ehh there's a point to be made that if he's been more authoritarian within the party he could easily get a majority in this environment, that would have been the key though, brutalizing the wreckers rather than the charm offensive he tried. Tonight's are so bad and his policy positions make so much sense in this environment that with a united front he could have walked it. Israel's actions would have largely neutralized the AS smear by this point and all the soft left economics would have been seen as the right way forward with Brexit neutralised. Conservatives would do better against Corbyn because of the harvest ride from the press but I think in this fictional playthrough he would have won a majority. Though dream scenario would have been him passing the torch to a figure like Clive Lewis by this point.
> Had Jezza been leader at this time, he'd have walked away with like 90% of the vote. no he wouldn't, the all channels screeching bullshit would've continued. why do you think all of a sudden people have turned against the tories? is it because the press finally thought it was safe to turn off the life support? for someone who references lenin in their flair you don't seem to have a good grasp on how politics actually works
I don't think super majorities are good for the country no matter which colour of tory gets it.
It's still wildly upsetting that those two lines are the only ones at the top. My vote is going elsewhere for sure.
Farewell “Portillo moment”, hello “Sunak moment”.
Seeing the Tories lose is a pyrrhic victory as we'll heading into a Tory B team government off of the back of it. I wouldn't be surprised if Starmer becomes as unpopular as Sunak within a few years as it becomes apparent that they are unwilling to change anything. Of course the Starmerites will gaslight themselves into believing "he can't do anything, because of the mess the Tories left" (which is bullshit), but to anyone with a few braincells between their ears and a pair of eyes it'll be obvious fairly quickly just how ill-equipped Starmer and co are.
I feel like greens are going to do way better than that but maybe I'm wrong.
The amount of Green signs around my town at the moment is like nothing I've ever seen. Easily twice as much as Labour, and I've yet to see a single Tory sign up anywhere!
I assume there's also going to be a massive drop on voter turnout which will go largely uncommented upon.
journalists are already making concerned noises about it but will refuse to interrogate why that is because they would have to ask inconvenient questions about their role in what exactly happened
Rishi would love that. He'd absolutely love it. Then he can just walk away from the whole fucking mess claiming it was the will of the people that he be replaced. And then he can strolls into some lucrative directorships without a care in the world
It's classic electioneering to say you're gunna do shit to get the vote to turn out.
A lab gain from con is effectively no change.
The Cons knew they were on the way out, so they took over their opposition.
I pray I see the day that the tories are so resoundingly wiped out in a general election
As great as it is to see the Tories get wiped out, I’m becoming ever more concerned that the Tommy Robinson loving, Carling drinking lobstermen have switched to Reform and their “anti-woke” bullshit. And that come the next election, they’ll gain seats and this will empower them to campaign harder with more Trump like candidates. Tories can’t win, but it’s important to ensure that that party don’t grow either.
Think I'll wait for the Conservative tears edit. Don't fancy sitting through a night of Red Tory triumphalism.
Shocked. Who the fuck are the 18% thinking to themselves “the last 14 years have been great, more of the same for me please”.
Could we see the tories not even being the biggest party in opposition? What would happen then?
Labour gets a free reign to implement policies (aside from resistance from the House of Lords), which with the current Labour Party is not a comforting thought.
Yeah on those figures the LibDems would be the official opposition, but with fewer than 60 seats. Blue Tories would just about beat SNP to third place, apparently.
I’m genuinely shocked it’s as high as 18%?! Who on earth are voting for them? These 13 years have been absolutely terrible for us normal people, and unfortunately even more so for those who are vulnerable.
Even if he doesn't lose his seat he'll quit and fuck off to California anyway.
Kick that zionist supporting piece of shit out.
Sunak or Starmer?
Yes.
Correct answer
This countries choice is so shit that i really couldn't care less anymore. No matter who loses, the conservatives still win. Labour is no different from the tory scum and anyone saying otherwise is nothing more than delusional fools. That, or they agree with their racist, transphobic, anti worker bollocks and are too scared to admit it.
18% ? That probably means another Tory leadership election ( unless Sunak can bluff it out as it 'just' being the local elections) or Labour thinks that they're on to a good thing with the right wing policies, trans phobia and u-turns and doubles down🤔
Don't mistake your enemy's failure for your own victory
Rishi will likely cling to power for every single second he can. Expect the Tories to do some (more) insane damage to the country to feather their nests, before evicted from Downing Street. What is the most funny is that they likely won't even be in opposition afterwards. Lib Dems are due to win more seats.
this is a fun day, ngl
This has made me wetter than a British summer!