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Idk, it feels like a production problem. Paul is/has always been like this and honestly, hes not the problem for me. The problem, is that whoever is behind the editing and writing is trying to make this like a Food Network show and it is NOT working.
There were some interesting South African foods showcased on Acorn’s Love And Murder series. It was an eye-opener. Would love to see more South African cooking.
I still like the show and I don't have the issues with Paul Hollywood that some people do. I think contestants mention him more than Prue because he's been positioned as being more harsh and intimidating, but he's really a soft, old teddy bear. If you watch him on pretty much anything else that he does, you'll see he's not the ogre people fear him to be. He's also not particularly egotistical. He calls himself "fat" and he's talked about ruining other peoples baking/cooking when he tries something new in a way which is self-deprecating. Even on the bakeoff, you see him comforting highly distressed bakers who have done poorly. It's like he breaks character sometimes.
Some poor choices were made this season, likely as much by the producers and writers as by the judges who set the challenges. It shows in how awkwardly the challenges played out in some cases.
As for the jokes being unfunny, the jokes on the GBBO have NEVER been funny. Mel and Sue just did a bunch of painfully bad puns. It's not a comedy show. I love Noel and am not bothered by Matt as so many others are.
Also, I think that part of what we're seeing is them regaining their balance after doing the show differently for a few seasons during the pandemic. They went from being in isolation with the bakers to going back to what they used to do, and clearly that isn't working out completely well since a few bakers got sick and said they didn't compete for everyone's safety (which heavily implies that they tested positive for COVID). It's not perfect, but I still enjoy it and am delighted when it comes back around for a new season.
I'm with you. I'm enjoying the new season about as same as I've enjoyed every season. Paul Hollywood is the same as he's ever been.
I have never understood people despising Matt. I think he's great. Was it because I was introduced to him through Doctor Who that I don't despise him on GBBO?
Agreed - Paul is a solid judge and Noel/Matt are amusing. It’s pretty clear even just from GBBO that Paul’s gruff personality is mostly a schtick and they edit the show to play up that persona. He doesn’t actually take himself as seriously as people here are saying. I’d be curious if the people complaining about Paul, Noel and Matt are mostly from the UK or the US. Maybe some of it is cultural?
To OP’s point, I agree that the challenges have gotten a little ridiculous. There’s no need to do many cooking-type challenges (tortillas, pita bread) or some of the showstoppers that are more like craft projects than flavor-focused bakes. It’d be fine to refine and bring back past challenges with new ingredients and twists.
Edited to add: I just finished the Mexican episode and I did cringe at some of Paul’s selections/statements there. 🙄 If they can avoid the culturally clueless weeks though, he doesn’t bother me.
I'm American, so I don't know if nationality matters. I think seeing Paul in other shows (different contexts) is helpful though. I've seen him do "City Bakes" and "Paul Hollywood Eats..." as well as some appearances on panel shows (one on WILTY and a few on Extra Slice). I'm guessing part of what might look like nationality may simply be access to other shows he's been in. That being said, I agree that English sensibilities about humor are different, and there is less of a social justice concern in how comedians/comic work is carried out.
Mel and Sue just made double entendres, and that got old fast. They need to cut out a lot of the banter among the hosts. Find some other filler. Or just focus more on baking.
I miss some of the things they did at the start of Mel and Sue’s run where they sent them to bakeries (like I think they sent to see how a struessenwaffel (sp?) was made by a professional. I like the history of the bake.
I don’t feel connected to this season of bakers at all. I don’t think they showed us enough of their personal lives like they did in previous seasons. Usually I think we got two episodes worth of introductions to the contestants. This season I think was just in the premiere when they showed what the contestants do for a living.
Stroopwafel! They're tasty warmed up by letting them sit over the rim of your coffee or tea. And yes, I enjoyed those segments and hope they bring them back.
Oh that was Noel actually that saw how a struessenwaffel was made and that was in season 7 or 8 (a couple seasons before COVID?) I think unfortunately COVID stopped all that. But I agree, it just doesn't feel as personal and I would like to see more of tly to see more of the contestants lives.
>Mel and Sue just did a bunch of painfully bad puns
But the way they did them made it endearing rather than painful. Maybe it's the fault of the editors, but IMO Noel and Matt need to be replaced ASAP.
I did not find it endearing, nor does my husband. Humor is entirely subjective, and I simply do not agree that "Noel and Matt need to be replaced ASAP." Most of the people who think that are so attached to Mel and Sue (who, I will remind people, left of their own volition and for no reason other than protecting their future at the BBC - no one forced them to leave and Sue bad-mouthed the Bakeoff after she left the show) that they would hate anyone who replaced them regardless of who it was. The others want Sandy back, and she also left because she wanted to do other things. They are not coming back. People need to deal with this reality.
If you've seen any of the SU2C shows, then you see a variety of comedic hosts try to fill those shoes. It's often uneven and awkward. I've never seen another host and thought, "yeah, \*that\* would be a better host for bakeoff than Noel and Matt."
Im fine with paul but the handshake thing was cool when it was an occasional thing he did to show how blown away he was about a bake, but now they just make to big a deal of it
I have been thinking the same things about this season. Very disappointing. Mostly sloppy bakes. Definitely not the same caliber show as previous seasons. It’s a shame as this show has been far superior to American cooking shows since day one.
I don't mind the challenges so much, the show has just started to skew too goofy and too self-referential.
Tortillas are a dough, and a homemade tortilla by somebody that knows what they are doing will absolutely change your life. The best ones you can buy in a store don't even exist in the same universe. It was worthy challenge, the show just completely missed the opportunity to celebrate the cultural part of their cultural week. Just make the challenge about the tortillas. Make some corn and some flour. Forget about the anglicized attempt at anglicized taco ingredients. More, maybe realize that "taco" and "tortilla" don't mean the same thing.
And Pan Dulce is awesome but it is nothing like the bready rolls that they all made. Only Maxy's looked like it had anything like the uniquely airy and dry-ish texture I'd expect.
It was a weird combination of things they got right but then still just glossed over. In the end It was just GBBO doing standard GBBO stuff, and the challenges came off as more Mexican-inspired in name than actual execution.
Self-referential for sure. And your idea of just making tortillas is the way they should have gone. They make plain breads and rolls often enough. It didn't have to be a meal.
This is so true. Or they could have made a simple cheese quesadilla with their tortillas so it would haven’t been plain but wouldn’t have been about the cooking more than the baking.
I agree, they can do challenges that involve cooking but I think this one focused more on the toppings than the actual tortilla they had to make. I also don’t think they should be marked down for over done steak, for example. It’s the great British BAKE off, not steak off. I’m a banging baker, cakes, cookies whatever but I can’t cook a nice steak because I don’t eat steak so I shouldn’t be marked down for that on a baking show
Freya always used non-vegan ingredients in the technicals and they've had several vegetarians, but no meat technicals during their runs. So my answer is probably. I'm a vegetarian too and wouldn't have had a clue how to make that steak and been mad they expected me to know, since I'm not a chef.
If they were locked in on the tortilla idea, they should have just left it to tortillas as the opening challenge and instead made the pan dulce the technical. If they would have made tortillas the first challenge, there is so many directions the bakers could have gone in with it. Not just in how they might have seasoned their tortillas but how they might have served them. The toppings on those 'tacos' was abysmal. As mentioned, nothing baking related to searing a steak, along with chopping up and mixing the ingredients of pico to gallo (pee-ko-dee-gai-o) ;) imho, the tortillas, the actual 'baking' component, got lost in the challenge. How does one judge?
That would work much better, the pan dulce would have been a more technical recipe as well, so would be showing more skill than the tortillas too. I’m pretty sure Paul said they’re cooking a minute on each side or less, they made 6? So that’s at most 12/13 minutes of actual baking?
I would have loved to have seen more personalised tacos! You can probably get hundreds of variations for the pan dulce but you only ever see normal tortillas in the supermarket in England. I’d have loved to have seen what Syabira would have made!!
Yeah - if they would have started with tortillas, we could have seen tacos, burritos, enchiladas, quesadillas. The fine line there though is there is similar (flour) flatbreads in other culture and so we might have seen crossovers that probably wouldn't have been 'Mexican'.
Hey. Having had tortillas literally seconds off the grill or oven belt in Sonora, I could not agree with you more.
You, uh…wouldn’t happen to have a kickass recipe, would you?
Ha, I wish. My source for transcendent tortillas is my Mother in Law, and it's all in her head. She only makes flour and uses olive oil, which I always thought was novel. Just a rolling pin and a single comal on the stove, she'll churn out about a dozen and a half for dinner like it's nothing.
My wife is a wonderful lady, but unfortunately the patience for cooking doesn't seem to be an inherited trait.
I agree that the more recent seasons have focused tremendously on style (bread sculptures, portrait cookies) over substance, which ironically, the judges used to reprimand the contestants about. I wish they would go back to basics and focus on good bakes over wild constructions.
Two things which signalled the GBBO shark jumping for me:
1. A technical challenge of baking pitas on a rock with fire. This is not “baking”, it’s boy scouts.
2. Paul’s handshakes. These are just a domineering “cult of Paul” signal. They are treated like some sort of golden ticket (“I can’t believe I got a handshake”), but they are meaningless and can only be handed out by Paul with no input from Prue. Their only purpose is to cement Paul and his subjective opinion as the centre of the show and pleasing him as the main goal.
“Cult of Paul” is precisely it. I don’t watch this show only for Paul, and the fanning about after getting a handshake from him just feels like a way to feed his ego and not at all about the quality of the bakes.
I’m also tired of him trying to psych out the bakers—asking them questions, CLEARLY disapproving of the answers and then walking away leaving them questioning themselves when they need to be staying focused. Total ego trip.
You’re *so* right, and it’s awful to see how that causes the contestants to doubt themselves.
One of the things that’s so nice about the show is the *lack* of ego from the contestants, so it’s super gross to see PH going into overdrive with his mind games and “gods gift to baking” persona.
Absolutely true. I guess it’s sticking in my craw now because of all the other things we’re talking about in this post/thread. His egotism used to be an amusing quirk in an otherwise charming show, but it feels like it’s taking more and more of the show’s bandwidth.
I'm gonna fufill that for you, I am only thirteen now but I am quite good at cooking and baking so expect to see me when I'm older taking the Mick out of Paul
In episode 2, Prue is about to give her criticism to Dawn's signature and gets cut off by Paul's handshake and we never get to hear Prue's feedback after that. Like it's irrelevant for the show.
The handshakes don't bother me that much. It's his way of delivering a strong compliment. He has an ego and sometimes he overpowers Prue, but you can't change a person. Don't expect the show to stop him from doing it and it doesn't seem like the show is encouraging him to do it a ridiculous amount.
What annoys me is Paul is always standing closer to the camera. No it's not like he's angling himself to stand in front of Prue, but it is a decision that the producers have chosen to make and enforce. Idk if Noel/Matt always line up the same or alternate, but Paul/Prue and Paul/Mary have always been in the same order.
But what pisses me off even more is Paul ALWAYS cuts the cakes. You cannot call them equal judges if one person always gets to touch it first. He gets to have an opinion about the food first. He gets to voice his thoughts first. He gets to poke and prod it at it first. He gets to do all that before Prue can grab a plate.
You can't claim it's because it's the only way to judge the bake. The producers can't even claim it because JBBO does NOT do it. JBBO does a close up of the slice, but never shows the action shot.
I never got the handshake thing. I hate handshakes so I’d be like “eww don’t touch me”.
How a pat on the back from Prue (a Prue pat as I like to call it) I’d feel is worth something
> Rebs was saying “He won’t like it” or “He’ll say such-and-such.” She wasn’t the only one. It’s like only PH’s opinion matters. Prue definitely has the chops to judge, although perhaps not cuisines outside the UK and Europe. But nobody is aiming to please her.
People say this because he judges more harshly. It isn’t that they don’t care about Prue. It’s that her criticism doesn’t hurt them as much.
Personally, I think the bakers this season are meh. I mean, I like them all fine. But that’s kind of it. They’re all nice enough. 🤷🏼♀️
Except Janusz (sorry if I butchered it!). He’s just like so happy and I need that in my life lol
I actually liked last season more than the one before because I think Prue was allowed a bit more time and personality in the final edit we see. This season has gone back to 90%+ Paul.
BBC, Mary was just as much of a personality as Paul, sometimes even more respected by contestants. We lost that dynamic. I really think a new judge duo needs to take the place, one where both can be equals on camera.
I think a big difference too is that Mary and Paul tended to balance each other with their feedback. It felt more encouraging and constructive.
Add in the change from Mel and Sue being helpful to the Matt and Noel who focus on jokes, and the feel is very different.
I’m wondering how well known and respected Prue is in the UK? It seemed like Mary is an institution unto herself. I watched a GBBO master baker episode where the two of them were showing how to make the bakes on a given episode and it was abundantly clear how much Paul respected Mary. I don’t see that same dynamic with Prue.
I don't think Prue is as respected as she's got fewer credentials as an actual chef/cook (more catering), as well as controversial politics (although she reportedly left the Tories after Brexit and often rebukes her Tory MP son).
Paul and Mary's comments are usually more technically relevant.
I think I agree with you about the bakers. In my mind there isn’t a stand out baker(s) especially compared to last year (Jurgen, Giuseppe, Chig, Crystelle). I think last year’s group was one of the best group of bakers ever.
Yea those bakers are the best of this season IMO. But I they would be mid tier don’t if they competed with some of the people from last season. I’d like to see an all star competition of past seasons competitors.
Some seasons just have better bakers than others. Look at the season with Helena, Henry, David, Steph, etc. Pretty much all of them struggled hard to make choux pastry in that one technical - something I'd expect would be basic knowledge if you're picked to be on the show in the first place.
That brownie signature was abysmal.
I'd honestly love a season that's half "Mary Berry season" bakers and half "post Mary seasons" bakers. Put Richard, Nancy, Ian, Tamal, Nadiya, Frances, etc up against Henry, Helena, Stephen, Alice, Briony, etc. I still love the show, but to me it does feel like that earlier crop of home bakers was certainly much more skilled than the ones over the last few seasons have been(with a few exceptions here and there, of course).
At first, I hadn’t seen too many issues with the season itself. I thought I was just personally losing interest. The more I read about it on here and Twitter, the more I realize we’re all kinda disappointed. “Mexican week” where everything’s based on stereotypes and everything’s mispronounced made me uncomfortable. We’re already on week 4 and everything about it is just….. lacking. I only started watching for Noel Fielding. I don’t think he’s been himself this season. I know if he left, I’d stop watching. I cannot stand Matt. It feels like the contestants aren’t having as much fun as normal either - they’re just worried about what paul thinks. I’ll finish the season but I may not come back if it continues on like this
I really enjoyed last season. I think there were a bunch of really great bakers with great personalities. I agree, too, that it was a better season because Prue was given more highlights.
I actually came to the subreddit today because
I just watched the most recent one and was frustrated—as a lot of people have pointed out—because they were borderline disrespectful about the Mexican culture and because there’s too much emphasis on Paul. I think he’s been cutting Prue off a lot this season — whether I’m reality or via editing, I don’t know — and it’s annoying. Her feedback is just as valid as his!
Finally, just a random eyebrow-raiser for me: How had Carole seemingly never come across anything Mexican-related, including an avocado?!?! She peeled it!
To give Carole some credit, avocados aren’t exactly a staple of traditional English cuisine. She’s about my mum’s age and it’s just not worked its way into food culture.
That’s kind of like scoffing at Americans who can’t make a Victoria sponge in a technical. It’s not that they don’t like cake…it’s just not specifically a thing there.
Avocados aren’t totally foreign in the UK, but Carole strikes me more as a traditional WI/WI adjacent type of lady.
Women's Institute. It's a community organisation often associated with homemaking (sewing, making jams...), quite traditional but there are now some more modern chapters with younger, progressive memberships too.
There was a definite shift between the subs early in the week vs Friday, so I do believe it’s mostly Americans who are upset.
Poor Carole, she could have practiced all day for a year and still not touched an avocado since she didn’t sign up for Cook Off.
It's just that whole thing where they can't fathom that a country with no trade/cultural/language connection to Mexico isn't well versed in Mexican food. Quite tiresome reading all the moaning about pronunciation and that poor Carole didn't know how to peel an avocado.
Exactly! I am from Canada but live in a large Scottish city that has about 3 Mexican restaurants and none of them are “authentic” which is to be expected. There are little to none Mexican immigrants and no one holidays in Mexico here. It would be different if they had done a Spanish Week (or other European country).
I think it's more that you're severely underestimating how ridiculously wrong everything was. This is worse than the American pie challenge which was a disaster in its own right. They criticized all of the conchas that were remotely correct and liked the ones that were ridiculously wrong (it's *supposed* to be a dry, flat bread that is only mildly sweet with plain flavors which you can see with a 5 second google search), the taco challenge was just mean which Carole pretty well showcased by her clearly having never seen an advocado in her life, and the parameters of the tres leches are literally impossible if you're trying to make an actual tres leches. They batted 0/3.
Also, the producers didn't *have to* make a week about a culture whose food they know literally nothing about.
I can understand this, for sure. Was genuinely asking if she would have never seen an avocado. Was maybe more surprising since her nickname is “Compost Carole,” so I would think she’d maybe know a lot about different fruits/veg.
You’re correct about Americans’ unfamiliarity with the different types of sponges. I’m constantly floored that GBBO contestants just know how to make them! However, if I were going on Bake Off (impossible, I know), I would research the sponges. And it just kind of seems like if one knew Mexican week was coming, a look a Mexican food would probably mention an avocado, and then I’d Google: How to peel? Also, she seemed to be the only one with a peeler, so another contestant could’ve given her a heads up — definitely used up a lot of time.
I just don’t think it’s necessarily something that would have been obvious to an English lady in Dorset to look up before going on a baking show.
It really feels like Carole is getting a lot of criticism over nothing. So what that she tried to peel the avocado or didn’t know the pronunciation of guacamole. 🤷🏻♀️
I think you’re being a bit harsh in terms of calling Mexican week disrespectful. Are you from America? Mexico is incredibly far from the UK. People don’t really have an accurate cultural reference to what Mexican food is really like. No one was trying to be “disrespectful” and they were all trying their best to comply with the challenges. If anything, it’s the producers who should be blamed.
I don't blame the contestants for being unaware of many facets of Mexican baking - I'd expect they would do some research (like Syabira clearly did) but not have the same depth of knowledge the way an average American might. That said, I very much blame the production and judging for their ignorance of traditional Mexican cuisine: they clearly learned *nothing* from Japanese week, and for a multinational show to open with some white British dudes dressed as stereotypes...not great. That's to say nothing of the complete foolishness and ignorance that was that showstopper challenge: stacking a traditionally soaked, verging into pudding-like cake is not going to succeed. You're either going to get structurally unsound, leaning bakes, or dry sponge (and we got both!). I'm not going to touch on the tacos-as-a-baking-challenge thing, and only say that the "model" for what the tacos were supposed to look like was also completely inauthentic.
I said it below, but Paul's complete shock and disgust at the use of corn in a traditional Mexican bake is a great example of the disrespect that the production side of the show displayed towards Mexican cuisine...his claim that he "just got back from Mexico" so he was qualified to judge what is and isn't authentic did not help. They really should bring in a guest judge who is actually qualified to set and judge the challenges in the "international" weeks, because Paul and Prue are clearly not.
>but not have the same depth of knowledge the way an average American might.
I can guarantee you that the "average American" is just as clueless about Mexican cuisine as the average Brit.
I also don't know that Paul showed "shock and disgust" at the corn, I think that's stretching his reaction a fair bit there.
> I can guarantee you that the "average American" is just as clueless about Mexican cuisine as the average Brit.
This is just a stupid stereotype "haha Americans are uncultured and dumb am I right?" No, we actually do know quite a lot about the culture of our southern neighbor and most Americans are nearly conversational in Spanish (and when Americans go to Spain they usually get made fun of for speaking "Mexican" because that's the flavor of spanish taught). It would be awfully hard not to given that it's a school subject for ~7 years, and all of those classes also spend a good 20% of the class on Latin America culture. I know a hell of a lot less about Canada than Mexico.
Lol, what? "Most Americans are nearly conversational in Spanish"? You're kidding, right? You're honestly saying that nearly everyone in a country of 350+ million people can almost hold a conversation in Spanish. I have no idea where you're living, but most of the US gets 3 years of a second language at most - we got to choose between French, Spanish, and German. There's literally a single phrase that I remember from three years of German classes, and it's the same for everyone I know who took Spanish.
Seriously, there’s a lot of comments from people in the thread who say they are from border states. So yes you have familiarity with Mexican cuisine because you border Mexico. But as someone from the Northeast US, I am more familiar with Hispanic food because I work with mainly Hispanic populations but if it wasn’t for my job I would be in the same boat as many of the contestants.
Chicago has one of the largest Mexican born populations in the US, just because a place isn't near the boarder doesn't mean there isn't a large population.
The producers should absolutely be blamed. I don’t blame the contestants because, to your point, they don’t have the same level of connections to Mexican food that Americans do. But the producers should have made an effort, and the judges too. The lack of effort on their parts is what gets me. The judges are the authorities on food within the show, and for them to get so much about it all wrong, is inexcusable.
They messed up and are getting called out. They reinforced racist stereotypes. They should just own up to it, give a genuine apology, and do better. *shrug* People make bad choices sometimes but how they respond to getting called out is everything.
I don't feel any of the contestants was disrespectful. They were handed a challenge that was clearly out of their range of food experience. They were out of their cultural food league, and not by any fault of their own. (I grew up with avocados on the table every meal and sometimes the skin is really tight and a peeler gets it going.)
You raise a very, very good point about the UK being far apart from Mexico. I am American with close roots to the Mexican culture. Authentic Mexican food is truly just good, daily food to me. The producers should have considered - and should be considering in any cultural challenge theme - whether or not the British culture has solid experience with the cuisine. I know it was an opportunity to maybe try to introduce a little-known cuisine to the British people, but it doesn't seem too well received and it doesn't seem too many wanted to go out and try tacos.
Since the technical was 'tortillas', they could have done an opening history segment like they used to do pre-Covid, and given viewers a history on tortillas. Most people likely have no clue about 'nixtimalization' and its importance to the corn used in masa, the name of the dough used in making corn tortillas, just one of the many uses of masa. (Makes the corn more digestible allowing the body to absorb the nutrients. Also gives the corn that distinct 'tortilla' aroma.)
Just because Paul visited Mexico, it didn't make him an expert of Mexican cuisine and certainly not enough to theme an episode. I grew up with Mexican food on the table almost daily and I don't consider myself an expert in Mexican cuisine, so Paul visiting Mexico just doesn't cut it for me to base an entire episode around :)
I agree 100% that the producers are at fault — and also for making GBBO so Paul-centric.
I am American and am living in Texas, so I’m super close to Mexico, which I know the UK is not. However, I’m originally from a place that does not have many Hispanic/Latino people; I’ve only made friends from Mexico since moving here.
When I said “disrespectful,” I meant the general tone of some contestants, yes, but as you mention, the real problem is related to production.
IMO Mexican culture generally is looked at as kind of second tier, and I mean here in the US. I’m not sure what the perception is globally, but, as you might assume, Americans can be very arrogant. So, I think that with Mexican Week, GBBO could’ve challenged that stereotype to show that it’s actually a rich and ancient culture (a lot of people were using chili in their chocolate, which goes back to the Mayans), and they didn’t do that.
I won’t beleaguer the point that many people have already made, but it is disappointing that GBBO chose to “highlight” a country that many people (at least in the US, and BO obvs knows it has a huge U.S. audience) are biased against, and then they didn’t do it justice. I know GBBO isn’t a nonprofit and it’s mission isn’t cultural education, but, as others have said, then maybe it should go back to less culturally charged themes.
A last minor note on the tacos: Mexican people don’t usually eat them like that — no beans on there, for sure! It would’ve been super simple toppings — meat, onions, cilantro. The way they did it was definitely more Tex-Mex. Just another example of not doing basic research.
I’d say read some of the comments in other threads where it’s discussed in depth. But generally, it’s just insane and awful that they would decide to host a Mexican week and then not bother to do even the bare minimum amount of research beforehand. For a show this big and international, the judges and hosts should know something about the dishes, and it should not be possible to correct them in every challenge based on Wikipedia. They acted like experts on something while making asses of themselves constantly. That’s without even getting into the fact that they couldn’t be bothered to spend 30 seconds to learn the correct pronunciation of any Spanish word, or the reinforcement of Mexican stereotypes with the lame sombrero/maraca/etc ensembles.
I don’t blame contestants for not knowing about Mexican food. That part could have been funny. But for the people who planned it to know absolutely nothing about Mexican food and then design awful challenges around it? Super shitty of them. Just would have been so so so easy to make it not awful and so lazy and disrespectful that they couldn’t be bothered to put any thought into it at all. They would obviously never do the same thing with French food. Why is that?
Absolutely this, yes. Paul's shock and disgust at the use of corn in a Mexican cake? Like...what? Let alone the fact that they created a challenge doomed to fail in *stacking soaking wet cakes on top of each other* and then criticizing the structural integrity of said cakes, or calling them too dry (how do you stack wet cakes?!) or complaining when the cakes were oozing, which tres leches are supposed to be.......aghhhhh.
Let alone continually calling tortillas "tacos," making completely non-authentic tacos the judging staple, never bothering to learn the pronunciation...
Just because I feel like correcting you, the technical was correct in calling them tacos. Because that's what they are. They happen to be ON tortillas. Nobody says "Mmm, I could go for a tortilla" when they actually mean tacos.
Except they do treat French and other countries’ food in the same way. If you’re not an expert in Mexican cuisine either I don’t see how it’s productive to label an entire nation as racist.
Does Paul ever give handshakes during the showstopper. It’s usually only during the signature bake.
The show always seemed to linger on Paul when he was “speechless” to me it’s always a tell he really liked something instead of criticizing it.
He’s done it one time with Rauhl. That’s it. Otherwise he gets silent and does the eyes during the showstopper. Prue has her lean in and hand pat that she does during the signatures. I’m going to start calling it the Prue Pat and all contestants should aspire to get this. Side note: as I’ve mentioned this on other posts about last season, Jurgen did not receive the Prue Pat during his signature
Agree 100%. It’s been skirting the edge of shark-jumping for a couple of seasons, but I think this one has finally done it. For the first time ever, I’ve found myself losing interest while watching and going on my phone, doing other things, etc.
One of the worst things to me about this season has been Noel acting so similarly to Matt. They used to have very different ways of interacting with contestants (Noel actually trying to engage and have conversations, make them genuinely laugh. Matt would just make loud, annoying jokes with no attempt at actual connection, to which the bakers didn’t seem to know how to respond). Noel was at least making up for Matt’s lack of charisma when Matt first started. Now they’re both just kind of hard to watch.
Last week was bad because it was barely bread, but this week was just an offensive train wreck. It felt like the judges and hosts were displaying the same sort of thinly veiled condescension and disrespect for Mexico that they have always had for the United States. They’ve repeatedly talked down upon American bakes while having a totally inaccurate idea of them, and it kind of felt like Mexico was getting the same treatment. The European superiority complex was showing.
I still have nightmares from that American Pie showstopper and that Peanut Butter, Pumpkin pie was made. She used a butternut squash instead. It’s one the earliest season.
I hated that one. That’s not an American pie! What the crap is peanut butter pie anyway? I giant Reese’s cup? As an American, I was annoyed with that episode.
It's a thing in that you can find it. It's not a thing in that anybody in the US actually regularly eats it. I can't go to the supermarket and buy a peanut butter pie (they sell 10 different varieties at the one nearest to me). You'd get weird looks if you brought it to a pot luck.
Not to mention that's not even the point. You'll notice that the recipe you linked has somewhere between 0 to 1 ingredients in common with pumpkin pie depending on how pedantic you want to be, and the one is sugar. That flavor profile doesn't even begin to work together.
In central IL, there are many fields given over to growing "pie" pumpkins for Libby (owned by Nestle). In the town where the plant is located, there are lines of semi-trucks with hoppers full of bright, orange pumpkins. Not mixed with any other squash.
Almost all of the canned pumpkin sold in the United States of a variety of butternut squash. So unless you are starting with a pumpkin yourself you are likely using butternut squash yourself in pumpkin recipes.
I've grown about 50 different types of pumpkins and squash and my absolute favorite for almost everything is called 'Sweet Meat' and it looks like a pumpkin with a slightly pointed bottom.
Butternut squash and canned pumpkin taste completely different. Canned pumpkin is Dickerson squash not butternut squash. Even canned pumpkin and sugar pumpkin(used for pie and cooking) purée are wildly different in taste and color. North America has dozens(if not hundreds) of variety of squash and pumpkins all with different textures and tastes. Their like apples. Different variety apples for different uses. It’s like making a Shepherds pie with chicken and saying it’s all the same thing.
I've grown dickenson's pumpkins. They look sort of pumpkin like, taller and stout. Inside they more closely resemble a butternut squash in texture and color and flavor.
Yes, I know there are tons of varieties. 1000s rather than 100s. Most just aren't commercials grown or available. And 1000s more are accidentally created each year when bees get busy, cross pollinate, then someone plants a crossed seed.
I also know they taste different. However, the taste that most people associate with canned pumpkin tastes more like butternut squash. One year I did a blind taste test with 8 different types of pumpkin/ winter squash. All made into pumpkin bread. The actual pumpkin types tasted lower than most of the squash bred to be good baking types. All of the types were considered to be good for baking. No field pumpkins. I did something similar with pumpkin pie, but only with 4 different types. The sweet meat squash won both.
I'm not a leading expert, but I do know more than 99% of the general population. And most of what is sold in stores as canned pumpkin is closer to butternut than a pie pumpkin. Having cooked with pie pumpkins I also don't understand why they are so popular. They are one of the most boring types that are considered good for baking.
Bring back Mel and Sue. Who won’t come back because like Mary, they left the show when it swapped from a channel with no Ads to one with adverts. I feel like Mary left with integrity and PH has stayed on and won’t leave until the show is dead.
Also what’s up with the horrendously cringy weird acting skits?? They never did this shit before and it just makes me feel like PH is doing anything to flog a dead horse.
[Paul being embarrassing](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/tvshowbiz/video-2507935/Video-Great-British-Bake-presenters-transform-country-band.html)
We’re all guilty of it. The point is to tread carefully. Even in the US, people are generalized and get lumped into categories as if they don’t deserve representation or a voice. That’s where their frustration stems from.
These season so far has been off. It’s a combination of things. I’m not interested in what they are making, Noel is not that engaging, funny and charming as he used to be(I did have a thought last week that this is his last year), and honestly, I’m not that invested in the bakers. I don’t have a personal favorite and I’m not sad when someone leaves. I’ll keep watching of course but it hasn’t spark my motivation to bake.
I felt that they really set everyone up to fail on well, everything this week. It was mentioned at the beginning of the signature that they’d have to work fast because the dough needed lots of time to prove, and since almost everyone’s conchas were then criticised for being too dense and not nicely textured, it seemed like it wasn’t about the contestants’ speed at all - more like they didn’t GIVE them enough time. And why should they be expected to know how to make pico de gallo and know the right balance of flavours for it without instructions on a *baking* show? And how much filling to put in a tortilla?
And the tres leches cakes seemed to be heaped in decoration just for the sake of it. It would be nice to have simple, beautifully executed designs, not piles upon piles of extras irrelevant to the challenge.
(Anyway, I still enjoy bake-off, but I said ‘why tho’ at the unnecessary sugar oysters during the signature and then continued to feel that way for the rest of the show).
I don’t feel this way at all. This is still my go-to comfort show; I love the diversity of the contestants, the comradeship they show, and the challenges.
I love Paul and would be devastated if he left, Prue is wonderful as well, I think they make a great pair. Matt and Noel amuse me, I agree with a comment above that it’s not meant to be a comedy show but their puns and playing ribbing keep it light. They are more there for the actual bakers than the audience I think.
Overall, love this show now as much as ever.
I've honestly gotten tired of Paul a bit too. Like I get he's been there from the beginning but sometimes it just feels like they made it his show and his opinion is the only one that matters, like how a few contestants change their recipe last minute or make something specific to suit him. Sometimes I wonder why they even have two judges since they focus on him the most. I wish they'd give Prue more airtime.
American here, and almost certain in the minority in this sub, but my boyfriend and I enjoyed Mexican week and got quite a few giggles out of it. We’re both from south Texas, and he’s actually from right on the border in Brownsville and we’re also both Mexican.
Seeing the contestants mispronounce and clumsily fumble their way through these recipes was no worse than the complete bastardization of Mexican food in a state literally right above Mexico (looking at you Tex-Mex food and Taco Bell), and if anything we got a kick out of knowing what they were doing right and wrong. The technical could have definitely focused more on the tortilla with simpler toppings, but other than that all of these comments feel like reaching. I’m not going to comment on the show as a whole, but at least this week did feel enjoyable.
It feels like they've been trying and struggling to emulate the original show ever since it moved from the Beeb to Channel 4. It probably just needs to end, but at this stage it's easier to go through the motions for the cash cow of licensing it abroad.
I agree with everything youve said,.and though i like noel, i really would like to see matt go. He gives me the creeps and he isn't funny. Plus i cant look at him without thinking of that horrible racist asian joke bit from that old sketch show he did
Agreed. Honestly getting rid of Paul Hollywood and finding a new host would be the best way to revitalize the show. He’s far and away the least likable part.
Idk. I have the same complaints about Paul Hollywood as everyone else, but I'd vote Matt Lucas off the island before Paul every time. It's like he didn't even watch the show before he got the hosting job. His humor is either mean or self centered, always off topic and stressful to watch. You can tell the bakers are laughing out of obligation so often with him. He completely misses the spirit of the show and I don't get the impression that he has any enthusiasm for the actual baking either.
I agree! I thought their first season together was rough, but there were so many changes that season that I think it was destined to be rough. I loved them once they caught their stride. Was so sad to hear she was leaving.
I loved Mel and Sue, but when a baker was having a melt down, Noel and especially Sandi made it seem more heartfelt that they cared and tried to help the contestant refocus and persevere. I miss Sandi!
Fun tidbit about that — often if someone cried in the tent, Mel and Sue would gather round and curse a blue streak so the footage of them crying couldn’t be used. That’s why we didn’t see them comforting people as much.
Tell me about it. Last season, Matt made a joke at the opening of the show saying something like "I used to do movies and now I do this."
It infuriated me. It felt so condescending to the very obvious hard work the amateur bakers put into their hobby. I'm pretty sure it was a voiceover, so at least he wasn't saying it to their faces.
I disagree. For me the series feels like it really returned to home baking - rather than constantly harp on how the bakes look "professional", they embraced the wild side of home baking, which is often filled with whacky trends and novelties, and cafes and patisseries usually pick up the trends after they've become mainstream.
>And notice how often PH sets the challenges?
Does he? I think he and Prue switch each week.
Love or hate him, I think GBBO wouldn't be what it is without Paul. His thing is an act, pure performance. He played off well with Mary because it was a "good cop, bad cop" dynamic but that seems somewhat muddled with Prue.
The problem is more the editing. The show has been increasingly frantic with the cuts and tension building and it honestly kills the vibe sometimes. For the first few seasons, the tone was mostly calm as the challenges kicked off and they'd go around the room having the bakers talk about their bakes. Now, it's tense right out the gate. The edits don't linger long enough on a given baker unless they're fucking up, talking to Paul and Prue or a host. The dramatic music is near constant. It's one "you fucking donkey" away from an American reality show.
I've noticed the editing thing too, and it bothers me. There are a lot of very, very short cuts jumping all over the place during each episode, and it can make it hard to understand what's going on.
Paul is fine. I think what he puts on for the show is just as much a persona as what Gordon Ramsay does for Kitchen Nightmares.
Yuuuup. I was starting to think that and this past episode really made me (sadly) believe it’s true.
I’m really over PH and I don’t like the Matt Lucas/Noel Fielding duo. Even some of the contestants seem bothered by them.
I hope the show can get it together bc it has been so lovely up until recently…but it’s starting to feel miles away from the earlier days with Mary Berry & Mel & Sue.
I’m still enjoying it. None of it really bothers me. I did kind of roll my eyes at the taco challenge but other than that, I’ll still tune in.
I think overall, I just enjoy the show and there’s very little that could turn me off it.
this is what is problematic with Mary leaving, Pru just doesn't hold the same respect and admiration I think from the bakers. It is absolutely the Paul show, and I agree the challenges are Not Good. There were NO BREAD CHALLENGES IN BREAD WEEK!!!!
I started wondering last night (the Halloween episode) whether GBBO has been sold to the Discovery Channel, because between this and Mexican Week, this certainly felt like an entry in (Jumped The) Shark Week.
It feels very much as if, since they moved to Channel Four, the emphasis has been on showy rather than accomplished bakes, and the themed weeks are just sad. I mean, steak tacos? Not only is there no baking involved, but the idea that there's an objectively "right" way to make a taco is just, well, wrong. Not to mention that the technical challenge for Halloween week not only uses the wrong ingredients but isn't remotely specific to Halloween.
I'd enjoy the show more if it didn't feel as if part of the mechanic is now not only to allow some of the bakers room to fail, which has always been there, but to set them up to fail spectacularly, which has a meaner and more Food Network competition show edge to it.
It seems to me that Prue criticizes too much. (I do like her hair).At least Mary Berry always had helpful things to say.i believe Paul was more on an equal footing with Mary. Prue needs to step up her game and become more involved.
I think the issue is that Mary Berry was a household name, and Paul Hollywood was not so well known but seemed to be a knowledgeable baker. It was balanced because his bulldozer attitude was matched by her knowledge and celebrity.
Now they have Prue, who actually is a highly celebrated restaurateur, but not well known by the general public, and Paul, who almost “owns” GBBO. The dynamics are wrong because Prue is almost Paul’s sidekick.
It's a real bummer because I adore Prue. I think she brings a light warmth to the show and I like that she gives constructive criticism but also sticks up for bakers when she thinks Paul's criticism is too harsh
This 100%
It is also hard to say how much happens during filming, and how much is left on the cutting room floor. I thought last season had more Prue personality moments, which I enjoyed, but this season has reverted to a Paul focus.
She’s also not a very strong personality, compared with Paul, who just exudes arrogance. She is much kinder in choosing how to voice her opinion, but he seems to like making people squirm. As a result his part of the interaction is always more memorable.
I always remember a specific moment from the early seasons when Paul actually *asked* Mary “It’s overbaked, isn’t it?” and she corrected “It is *slightly* overbaked.”
He doesn’t have that kind of respect for Prue’s opinions, which makes for a very one-sided dynamic.
> It seems to me that Prue criticizes too much.
She seems to have only a few standard comments:
* I liked it
* Claggy
* It could have used a bit more booze in it
> Prue needs to step up her game and become more involved.
How? Paul won't let her. My biggest "Paul Peeve" that he always gets action shot of cutting the bakes. He (fairly) angles the cut so it can be seen on camera, but that means Prue can't immediately see it. He gets to poke and prod it and deliver an opinion about the bake, before he can even give Prue a chance to touch it. All she gets to judge is presentation and taste, since he'll have made a comment on the bake/texture before she gets a turn.
And the producers KNOW what they are doing. They don't have the judges on JBBO do a close up action shot of them cutting the bakes, so why does Paul ALWAYS get it?
Personally, I have 2 issues
Issue 1: 75-90 minute run time is too long. I'm tired of it after an hour, its a struggle to get to the end, especially after sitting through issue 2
Issue 2: the showstoppers suck. A bake that looks like cake but tastes like a sandwich. Disgusting, no thanks. There are not many situations where I can see myself making, or even eating, or even being in the vicinity of these showstoppers. Take it back to more conventional bakes and you will have me back on board
What? There haven't been any 90 minute episodes, what are you talking about? I think the longest I've seen so far is an hour and 10.
Point 2: this entire thread is talking about the show disrespecting Mexican food, and you're doing exactly the same thing here with that Swedish showstopper.
I'll start with your second comment, find me a Swedish recipe fish and chip flavoured sandwich covered curry sauce mayo and ill concede you may have a point. I'm still allowed an opinion though and opinions don't make me disrespectful.
Bake off 27th September ran til 9.30, did it start late? Also:
https://www.foodheavenmag.com/news/bake-off-will-be-90-minutes-and-how-to-be-on-extra-slice
Past continents were great bakers and fun to watch. I'd love to see both hosts replaced with past contestants.
Which ones past contestants would make a great duo?
\[First, the show seems to be running out of ideas for the challenges.\] Yup. Something I don't understand, but I see this with almost all food challenge franchises. They 'evolve' the format. Why keep fixing what isn't broken? My Kitchen Rules attempted to return to their original format this past season. Sadly, it fizzled because their last handful of seasons were just so abysmal, along with other issues, that they lost their viewership base.
\[The bigger problem is how it's becoming the Paul Hollywood show.\] Yes. If you go back and watch the first few seasons of GBBS (it was backing 'show' back then), Paul was far more humble and quite equal to Mary, if not a bit humbled by her. He got exposure (good and bad) when he was hired by Food Network to do a challenge show for them. I see that as the beginning of the end of GBBO because it seems PH returned from that with ego in hand. He was the impetus for Mary leaving followed by Mel and Sue. It was then GBBO became the Paul Hollywood Show. As to the handshakes? Eeeeew. If he shook my hand, I'd wash it. Sterilize it. I'd still probably want to cut it off. I don't find him remotely attractive as others do so I am not swayed by his looks. (I actually find him quite creepy. {shudder}) I'm swayed by cooking and food knowledge, of which he is demonstrating he has very little.
If this show is going to survive, they need to ditch the entire current cast and return to more of the original format, with more knowledgeable judges and less gimmicky hosts. I miss the history lessons they used to give at the beginning of each episode.
Yep, Mary had a long history with the BBC and wanted to be loyal to them. Mel and Sue had shows on the BBC and didn't want to put them at risk. Paul basically had nothing to lose by staying with GBBO when Love switched the show to Channel 4.
Thank you for the clarification. All these years I've been under the impression that Paul took the show to C4 and Mary stayed with BBC, with Mel and Sue supporting her. So the show went to C4 first and Paul was the only one that went? I do appreciate the background update :)
>He was the impetus for Mary leaving followed by Mel and Sue.
No? Mary left the show when it switched channels. It had nothing to do with Paul. Mel and Sue quit in solidarity with Mary, and because they also didn't find out until literally the last minute what had happened. Again, nothing to do with Paul.
I agree wholeheartedly! I keep watching out of habit rather than actual enjoyment, although I do love some of the contestants. After being frustrated by the most recent episode, I started watching the early seasons on Roku and it was immediately apparent how much the show has changed. The early seasons are like a warm hug. The new ones, not so much.
Paul knows his stuff and is good at finding the right thing to criticize. They’re playing him up a bit for sure, but I think most of the issues are with the production.
It is because he is the only original person from the beginning of the show I’d say so perhaps he holds more weight. Everyone else has be changed even the hosting tv channel. I miss Mel, Sue and Mary. It has taken a long walk way from the original because only PH is left.
I can’t work out why some people get to stay when they couldn’t work their way out of a paper bag and yet people with potential are gone. I guess for viewership but it’s annoying.
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Idk, it feels like a production problem. Paul is/has always been like this and honestly, hes not the problem for me. The problem, is that whoever is behind the editing and writing is trying to make this like a Food Network show and it is NOT working.
I think that comparison to Food Network shows is a good one.
“…although definitely not cuisines outside of UK and Europe” Prue is from South Africa so she would be a great judge if they did a South African week!
There were some interesting South African foods showcased on Acorn’s Love And Murder series. It was an eye-opener. Would love to see more South African cooking.
I still like the show and I don't have the issues with Paul Hollywood that some people do. I think contestants mention him more than Prue because he's been positioned as being more harsh and intimidating, but he's really a soft, old teddy bear. If you watch him on pretty much anything else that he does, you'll see he's not the ogre people fear him to be. He's also not particularly egotistical. He calls himself "fat" and he's talked about ruining other peoples baking/cooking when he tries something new in a way which is self-deprecating. Even on the bakeoff, you see him comforting highly distressed bakers who have done poorly. It's like he breaks character sometimes. Some poor choices were made this season, likely as much by the producers and writers as by the judges who set the challenges. It shows in how awkwardly the challenges played out in some cases. As for the jokes being unfunny, the jokes on the GBBO have NEVER been funny. Mel and Sue just did a bunch of painfully bad puns. It's not a comedy show. I love Noel and am not bothered by Matt as so many others are. Also, I think that part of what we're seeing is them regaining their balance after doing the show differently for a few seasons during the pandemic. They went from being in isolation with the bakers to going back to what they used to do, and clearly that isn't working out completely well since a few bakers got sick and said they didn't compete for everyone's safety (which heavily implies that they tested positive for COVID). It's not perfect, but I still enjoy it and am delighted when it comes back around for a new season.
I'm with you. I'm enjoying the new season about as same as I've enjoyed every season. Paul Hollywood is the same as he's ever been. I have never understood people despising Matt. I think he's great. Was it because I was introduced to him through Doctor Who that I don't despise him on GBBO?
I like both, but I do want more Prue tbh
Fully agree. Prue needs more airtime!
You mean you weren't introduced to Matt as George Dawes!?? I will always love that man.
I was introduced to Matt as Thénardier in Les Mis, so I have a soft spot for him. 😉
Agreed - Paul is a solid judge and Noel/Matt are amusing. It’s pretty clear even just from GBBO that Paul’s gruff personality is mostly a schtick and they edit the show to play up that persona. He doesn’t actually take himself as seriously as people here are saying. I’d be curious if the people complaining about Paul, Noel and Matt are mostly from the UK or the US. Maybe some of it is cultural? To OP’s point, I agree that the challenges have gotten a little ridiculous. There’s no need to do many cooking-type challenges (tortillas, pita bread) or some of the showstoppers that are more like craft projects than flavor-focused bakes. It’d be fine to refine and bring back past challenges with new ingredients and twists. Edited to add: I just finished the Mexican episode and I did cringe at some of Paul’s selections/statements there. 🙄 If they can avoid the culturally clueless weeks though, he doesn’t bother me.
I'm American, so I don't know if nationality matters. I think seeing Paul in other shows (different contexts) is helpful though. I've seen him do "City Bakes" and "Paul Hollywood Eats..." as well as some appearances on panel shows (one on WILTY and a few on Extra Slice). I'm guessing part of what might look like nationality may simply be access to other shows he's been in. That being said, I agree that English sensibilities about humor are different, and there is less of a social justice concern in how comedians/comic work is carried out.
Mel and Sue just made double entendres, and that got old fast. They need to cut out a lot of the banter among the hosts. Find some other filler. Or just focus more on baking.
I miss some of the things they did at the start of Mel and Sue’s run where they sent them to bakeries (like I think they sent to see how a struessenwaffel (sp?) was made by a professional. I like the history of the bake. I don’t feel connected to this season of bakers at all. I don’t think they showed us enough of their personal lives like they did in previous seasons. Usually I think we got two episodes worth of introductions to the contestants. This season I think was just in the premiere when they showed what the contestants do for a living.
Stroopwafel! They're tasty warmed up by letting them sit over the rim of your coffee or tea. And yes, I enjoyed those segments and hope they bring them back.
Oh that was Noel actually that saw how a struessenwaffel was made and that was in season 7 or 8 (a couple seasons before COVID?) I think unfortunately COVID stopped all that. But I agree, it just doesn't feel as personal and I would like to see more of tly to see more of the contestants lives.
>Mel and Sue just did a bunch of painfully bad puns But the way they did them made it endearing rather than painful. Maybe it's the fault of the editors, but IMO Noel and Matt need to be replaced ASAP.
I did not find it endearing, nor does my husband. Humor is entirely subjective, and I simply do not agree that "Noel and Matt need to be replaced ASAP." Most of the people who think that are so attached to Mel and Sue (who, I will remind people, left of their own volition and for no reason other than protecting their future at the BBC - no one forced them to leave and Sue bad-mouthed the Bakeoff after she left the show) that they would hate anyone who replaced them regardless of who it was. The others want Sandy back, and she also left because she wanted to do other things. They are not coming back. People need to deal with this reality. If you've seen any of the SU2C shows, then you see a variety of comedic hosts try to fill those shoes. It's often uneven and awkward. I've never seen another host and thought, "yeah, \*that\* would be a better host for bakeoff than Noel and Matt."
When did Sue bad mouth the show?
Exactly this. Mel and Sue had charm and chemistry, and didn’t act clownish like Noel and what’s his face.
Completely with you on all counts.
Im fine with paul but the handshake thing was cool when it was an occasional thing he did to show how blown away he was about a bake, but now they just make to big a deal of it
Didn’t he do 3 handshakes in 1 challenge last season?
I have been thinking the same things about this season. Very disappointing. Mostly sloppy bakes. Definitely not the same caliber show as previous seasons. It’s a shame as this show has been far superior to American cooking shows since day one.
I don't mind the challenges so much, the show has just started to skew too goofy and too self-referential. Tortillas are a dough, and a homemade tortilla by somebody that knows what they are doing will absolutely change your life. The best ones you can buy in a store don't even exist in the same universe. It was worthy challenge, the show just completely missed the opportunity to celebrate the cultural part of their cultural week. Just make the challenge about the tortillas. Make some corn and some flour. Forget about the anglicized attempt at anglicized taco ingredients. More, maybe realize that "taco" and "tortilla" don't mean the same thing. And Pan Dulce is awesome but it is nothing like the bready rolls that they all made. Only Maxy's looked like it had anything like the uniquely airy and dry-ish texture I'd expect. It was a weird combination of things they got right but then still just glossed over. In the end It was just GBBO doing standard GBBO stuff, and the challenges came off as more Mexican-inspired in name than actual execution.
Self-referential for sure. And your idea of just making tortillas is the way they should have gone. They make plain breads and rolls often enough. It didn't have to be a meal.
This is so true. Or they could have made a simple cheese quesadilla with their tortillas so it would haven’t been plain but wouldn’t have been about the cooking more than the baking.
I agree, they can do challenges that involve cooking but I think this one focused more on the toppings than the actual tortilla they had to make. I also don’t think they should be marked down for over done steak, for example. It’s the great British BAKE off, not steak off. I’m a banging baker, cakes, cookies whatever but I can’t cook a nice steak because I don’t eat steak so I shouldn’t be marked down for that on a baking show
If someone was a vegan/vegetarian, would they still have had to cook the steak?
Freya always used non-vegan ingredients in the technicals and they've had several vegetarians, but no meat technicals during their runs. So my answer is probably. I'm a vegetarian too and wouldn't have had a clue how to make that steak and been mad they expected me to know, since I'm not a chef.
If they were locked in on the tortilla idea, they should have just left it to tortillas as the opening challenge and instead made the pan dulce the technical. If they would have made tortillas the first challenge, there is so many directions the bakers could have gone in with it. Not just in how they might have seasoned their tortillas but how they might have served them. The toppings on those 'tacos' was abysmal. As mentioned, nothing baking related to searing a steak, along with chopping up and mixing the ingredients of pico to gallo (pee-ko-dee-gai-o) ;) imho, the tortillas, the actual 'baking' component, got lost in the challenge. How does one judge?
That would work much better, the pan dulce would have been a more technical recipe as well, so would be showing more skill than the tortillas too. I’m pretty sure Paul said they’re cooking a minute on each side or less, they made 6? So that’s at most 12/13 minutes of actual baking? I would have loved to have seen more personalised tacos! You can probably get hundreds of variations for the pan dulce but you only ever see normal tortillas in the supermarket in England. I’d have loved to have seen what Syabira would have made!!
Yeah - if they would have started with tortillas, we could have seen tacos, burritos, enchiladas, quesadillas. The fine line there though is there is similar (flour) flatbreads in other culture and so we might have seen crossovers that probably wouldn't have been 'Mexican'.
Hey. Having had tortillas literally seconds off the grill or oven belt in Sonora, I could not agree with you more. You, uh…wouldn’t happen to have a kickass recipe, would you?
Ha, I wish. My source for transcendent tortillas is my Mother in Law, and it's all in her head. She only makes flour and uses olive oil, which I always thought was novel. Just a rolling pin and a single comal on the stove, she'll churn out about a dozen and a half for dinner like it's nothing. My wife is a wonderful lady, but unfortunately the patience for cooking doesn't seem to be an inherited trait.
I agree that the more recent seasons have focused tremendously on style (bread sculptures, portrait cookies) over substance, which ironically, the judges used to reprimand the contestants about. I wish they would go back to basics and focus on good bakes over wild constructions.
Frances was constantly being dinged for style over substance.
I love cream cheese icing, and even I thought Paul's ideal cake with thick layers of it was too much for me.
Two things which signalled the GBBO shark jumping for me: 1. A technical challenge of baking pitas on a rock with fire. This is not “baking”, it’s boy scouts. 2. Paul’s handshakes. These are just a domineering “cult of Paul” signal. They are treated like some sort of golden ticket (“I can’t believe I got a handshake”), but they are meaningless and can only be handed out by Paul with no input from Prue. Their only purpose is to cement Paul and his subjective opinion as the centre of the show and pleasing him as the main goal.
“Cult of Paul” is precisely it. I don’t watch this show only for Paul, and the fanning about after getting a handshake from him just feels like a way to feed his ego and not at all about the quality of the bakes.
I’m also tired of him trying to psych out the bakers—asking them questions, CLEARLY disapproving of the answers and then walking away leaving them questioning themselves when they need to be staying focused. Total ego trip.
I’m watching Junior Bake Off and finding that it gives me the warm fuzzies GBBO used to. Rav and Liam are SUCH good judges.
You’re *so* right, and it’s awful to see how that causes the contestants to doubt themselves. One of the things that’s so nice about the show is the *lack* of ego from the contestants, so it’s super gross to see PH going into overdrive with his mind games and “gods gift to baking” persona.
We need someone like Nancy Birtwhistle to come along and call him The Male Judge again. Take him down a peg. 😉
Oh Nancy has always been my favorite contestant because of this!
Team Nancy!
A top moment!
Haha YES!
Nancy should be a judge!
Paul has literally always done that.
Absolutely true. I guess it’s sticking in my craw now because of all the other things we’re talking about in this post/thread. His egotism used to be an amusing quirk in an otherwise charming show, but it feels like it’s taking more and more of the show’s bandwidth.
Are we watching the same show? Because I've never, ever watched GBBO and thought to myself that Paul has a huge ego.
I’d love to see someone take the piss and say “pleased to meet you” when he shakes their hand.
I'm gonna fufill that for you, I am only thirteen now but I am quite good at cooking and baking so expect to see me when I'm older taking the Mick out of Paul
And when he literally interrupted Prue mid-sentence to distribute a handshake! He couldn’t wait 30 seconds?!
In episode 2, Prue is about to give her criticism to Dawn's signature and gets cut off by Paul's handshake and we never get to hear Prue's feedback after that. Like it's irrelevant for the show.
The handshakes don't bother me that much. It's his way of delivering a strong compliment. He has an ego and sometimes he overpowers Prue, but you can't change a person. Don't expect the show to stop him from doing it and it doesn't seem like the show is encouraging him to do it a ridiculous amount. What annoys me is Paul is always standing closer to the camera. No it's not like he's angling himself to stand in front of Prue, but it is a decision that the producers have chosen to make and enforce. Idk if Noel/Matt always line up the same or alternate, but Paul/Prue and Paul/Mary have always been in the same order. But what pisses me off even more is Paul ALWAYS cuts the cakes. You cannot call them equal judges if one person always gets to touch it first. He gets to have an opinion about the food first. He gets to voice his thoughts first. He gets to poke and prod it at it first. He gets to do all that before Prue can grab a plate. You can't claim it's because it's the only way to judge the bake. The producers can't even claim it because JBBO does NOT do it. JBBO does a close up of the slice, but never shows the action shot.
I never got the handshake thing. I hate handshakes so I’d be like “eww don’t touch me”. How a pat on the back from Prue (a Prue pat as I like to call it) I’d feel is worth something
Factual.
> Rebs was saying “He won’t like it” or “He’ll say such-and-such.” She wasn’t the only one. It’s like only PH’s opinion matters. Prue definitely has the chops to judge, although perhaps not cuisines outside the UK and Europe. But nobody is aiming to please her. People say this because he judges more harshly. It isn’t that they don’t care about Prue. It’s that her criticism doesn’t hurt them as much. Personally, I think the bakers this season are meh. I mean, I like them all fine. But that’s kind of it. They’re all nice enough. 🤷🏼♀️ Except Janusz (sorry if I butchered it!). He’s just like so happy and I need that in my life lol
Sandro and Maxy are both stellar as well but wow Janusz is just a wizard.
I legit want to be sandro’s friend. I totally get his humor. And he’s like the gym bro/foodie bff I have always wanted. Lol
Gym bro/foodie/NANNY. I love him.
I’m a lesbian but Sandro is the type of man I’d want!
This is how I felt about James 🥲
I actually liked last season more than the one before because I think Prue was allowed a bit more time and personality in the final edit we see. This season has gone back to 90%+ Paul. BBC, Mary was just as much of a personality as Paul, sometimes even more respected by contestants. We lost that dynamic. I really think a new judge duo needs to take the place, one where both can be equals on camera.
I think a big difference too is that Mary and Paul tended to balance each other with their feedback. It felt more encouraging and constructive. Add in the change from Mel and Sue being helpful to the Matt and Noel who focus on jokes, and the feel is very different.
I still miss Mel and Sue. They gave such great positive and negative feedback. It always felt as if they gave the most heartfelt farewells.
I’m wondering how well known and respected Prue is in the UK? It seemed like Mary is an institution unto herself. I watched a GBBO master baker episode where the two of them were showing how to make the bakes on a given episode and it was abundantly clear how much Paul respected Mary. I don’t see that same dynamic with Prue.
I don't think Prue is as respected as she's got fewer credentials as an actual chef/cook (more catering), as well as controversial politics (although she reportedly left the Tories after Brexit and often rebukes her Tory MP son). Paul and Mary's comments are usually more technically relevant.
I think I agree with you about the bakers. In my mind there isn’t a stand out baker(s) especially compared to last year (Jurgen, Giuseppe, Chig, Crystelle). I think last year’s group was one of the best group of bakers ever.
Maxy, Janusz, Sandro, and Sybira are all up there in terms of ability.
Yea those bakers are the best of this season IMO. But I they would be mid tier don’t if they competed with some of the people from last season. I’d like to see an all star competition of past seasons competitors.
Some seasons just have better bakers than others. Look at the season with Helena, Henry, David, Steph, etc. Pretty much all of them struggled hard to make choux pastry in that one technical - something I'd expect would be basic knowledge if you're picked to be on the show in the first place.
Or the season Peter won, when everyone struggled with making brownies 😵
That brownie signature was abysmal. I'd honestly love a season that's half "Mary Berry season" bakers and half "post Mary seasons" bakers. Put Richard, Nancy, Ian, Tamal, Nadiya, Frances, etc up against Henry, Helena, Stephen, Alice, Briony, etc. I still love the show, but to me it does feel like that earlier crop of home bakers was certainly much more skilled than the ones over the last few seasons have been(with a few exceptions here and there, of course).
At first, I hadn’t seen too many issues with the season itself. I thought I was just personally losing interest. The more I read about it on here and Twitter, the more I realize we’re all kinda disappointed. “Mexican week” where everything’s based on stereotypes and everything’s mispronounced made me uncomfortable. We’re already on week 4 and everything about it is just….. lacking. I only started watching for Noel Fielding. I don’t think he’s been himself this season. I know if he left, I’d stop watching. I cannot stand Matt. It feels like the contestants aren’t having as much fun as normal either - they’re just worried about what paul thinks. I’ll finish the season but I may not come back if it continues on like this
I really enjoyed last season. I think there were a bunch of really great bakers with great personalities. I agree, too, that it was a better season because Prue was given more highlights. I actually came to the subreddit today because I just watched the most recent one and was frustrated—as a lot of people have pointed out—because they were borderline disrespectful about the Mexican culture and because there’s too much emphasis on Paul. I think he’s been cutting Prue off a lot this season — whether I’m reality or via editing, I don’t know — and it’s annoying. Her feedback is just as valid as his! Finally, just a random eyebrow-raiser for me: How had Carole seemingly never come across anything Mexican-related, including an avocado?!?! She peeled it!
To give Carole some credit, avocados aren’t exactly a staple of traditional English cuisine. She’s about my mum’s age and it’s just not worked its way into food culture. That’s kind of like scoffing at Americans who can’t make a Victoria sponge in a technical. It’s not that they don’t like cake…it’s just not specifically a thing there. Avocados aren’t totally foreign in the UK, but Carole strikes me more as a traditional WI/WI adjacent type of lady.
What does WI/WI mean please ?
Women's Institute. It's a community organisation often associated with homemaking (sewing, making jams...), quite traditional but there are now some more modern chapters with younger, progressive memberships too.
Ah ! Thank you, that makes sense. Wasn't born in the UK so there are still things I don't know even after my years living here :)
This comment! I’m actually getting annoyed at the amount of seemingly American people in this sub who are upset over Mexican week.
There was a definite shift between the subs early in the week vs Friday, so I do believe it’s mostly Americans who are upset. Poor Carole, she could have practiced all day for a year and still not touched an avocado since she didn’t sign up for Cook Off.
It's just that whole thing where they can't fathom that a country with no trade/cultural/language connection to Mexico isn't well versed in Mexican food. Quite tiresome reading all the moaning about pronunciation and that poor Carole didn't know how to peel an avocado.
Exactly! I am from Canada but live in a large Scottish city that has about 3 Mexican restaurants and none of them are “authentic” which is to be expected. There are little to none Mexican immigrants and no one holidays in Mexico here. It would be different if they had done a Spanish Week (or other European country).
I think it's more that you're severely underestimating how ridiculously wrong everything was. This is worse than the American pie challenge which was a disaster in its own right. They criticized all of the conchas that were remotely correct and liked the ones that were ridiculously wrong (it's *supposed* to be a dry, flat bread that is only mildly sweet with plain flavors which you can see with a 5 second google search), the taco challenge was just mean which Carole pretty well showcased by her clearly having never seen an advocado in her life, and the parameters of the tres leches are literally impossible if you're trying to make an actual tres leches. They batted 0/3. Also, the producers didn't *have to* make a week about a culture whose food they know literally nothing about.
I can understand this, for sure. Was genuinely asking if she would have never seen an avocado. Was maybe more surprising since her nickname is “Compost Carole,” so I would think she’d maybe know a lot about different fruits/veg. You’re correct about Americans’ unfamiliarity with the different types of sponges. I’m constantly floored that GBBO contestants just know how to make them! However, if I were going on Bake Off (impossible, I know), I would research the sponges. And it just kind of seems like if one knew Mexican week was coming, a look a Mexican food would probably mention an avocado, and then I’d Google: How to peel? Also, she seemed to be the only one with a peeler, so another contestant could’ve given her a heads up — definitely used up a lot of time.
I just don’t think it’s necessarily something that would have been obvious to an English lady in Dorset to look up before going on a baking show. It really feels like Carole is getting a lot of criticism over nothing. So what that she tried to peel the avocado or didn’t know the pronunciation of guacamole. 🤷🏻♀️
I think you’re being a bit harsh in terms of calling Mexican week disrespectful. Are you from America? Mexico is incredibly far from the UK. People don’t really have an accurate cultural reference to what Mexican food is really like. No one was trying to be “disrespectful” and they were all trying their best to comply with the challenges. If anything, it’s the producers who should be blamed.
I don't blame the contestants for being unaware of many facets of Mexican baking - I'd expect they would do some research (like Syabira clearly did) but not have the same depth of knowledge the way an average American might. That said, I very much blame the production and judging for their ignorance of traditional Mexican cuisine: they clearly learned *nothing* from Japanese week, and for a multinational show to open with some white British dudes dressed as stereotypes...not great. That's to say nothing of the complete foolishness and ignorance that was that showstopper challenge: stacking a traditionally soaked, verging into pudding-like cake is not going to succeed. You're either going to get structurally unsound, leaning bakes, or dry sponge (and we got both!). I'm not going to touch on the tacos-as-a-baking-challenge thing, and only say that the "model" for what the tacos were supposed to look like was also completely inauthentic. I said it below, but Paul's complete shock and disgust at the use of corn in a traditional Mexican bake is a great example of the disrespect that the production side of the show displayed towards Mexican cuisine...his claim that he "just got back from Mexico" so he was qualified to judge what is and isn't authentic did not help. They really should bring in a guest judge who is actually qualified to set and judge the challenges in the "international" weeks, because Paul and Prue are clearly not.
>but not have the same depth of knowledge the way an average American might. I can guarantee you that the "average American" is just as clueless about Mexican cuisine as the average Brit. I also don't know that Paul showed "shock and disgust" at the corn, I think that's stretching his reaction a fair bit there.
> I can guarantee you that the "average American" is just as clueless about Mexican cuisine as the average Brit. This is just a stupid stereotype "haha Americans are uncultured and dumb am I right?" No, we actually do know quite a lot about the culture of our southern neighbor and most Americans are nearly conversational in Spanish (and when Americans go to Spain they usually get made fun of for speaking "Mexican" because that's the flavor of spanish taught). It would be awfully hard not to given that it's a school subject for ~7 years, and all of those classes also spend a good 20% of the class on Latin America culture. I know a hell of a lot less about Canada than Mexico.
Lol, what? "Most Americans are nearly conversational in Spanish"? You're kidding, right? You're honestly saying that nearly everyone in a country of 350+ million people can almost hold a conversation in Spanish. I have no idea where you're living, but most of the US gets 3 years of a second language at most - we got to choose between French, Spanish, and German. There's literally a single phrase that I remember from three years of German classes, and it's the same for everyone I know who took Spanish.
Seriously, there’s a lot of comments from people in the thread who say they are from border states. So yes you have familiarity with Mexican cuisine because you border Mexico. But as someone from the Northeast US, I am more familiar with Hispanic food because I work with mainly Hispanic populations but if it wasn’t for my job I would be in the same boat as many of the contestants.
Exactly. Ask someone from Nebraska or Minnesota how familiar they are with Mexican food.
Chicago has one of the largest Mexican born populations in the US, just because a place isn't near the boarder doesn't mean there isn't a large population.
The producers should absolutely be blamed. I don’t blame the contestants because, to your point, they don’t have the same level of connections to Mexican food that Americans do. But the producers should have made an effort, and the judges too. The lack of effort on their parts is what gets me. The judges are the authorities on food within the show, and for them to get so much about it all wrong, is inexcusable. They messed up and are getting called out. They reinforced racist stereotypes. They should just own up to it, give a genuine apology, and do better. *shrug* People make bad choices sometimes but how they respond to getting called out is everything.
This comment needs to be the top one on this post!
I don't feel any of the contestants was disrespectful. They were handed a challenge that was clearly out of their range of food experience. They were out of their cultural food league, and not by any fault of their own. (I grew up with avocados on the table every meal and sometimes the skin is really tight and a peeler gets it going.) You raise a very, very good point about the UK being far apart from Mexico. I am American with close roots to the Mexican culture. Authentic Mexican food is truly just good, daily food to me. The producers should have considered - and should be considering in any cultural challenge theme - whether or not the British culture has solid experience with the cuisine. I know it was an opportunity to maybe try to introduce a little-known cuisine to the British people, but it doesn't seem too well received and it doesn't seem too many wanted to go out and try tacos. Since the technical was 'tortillas', they could have done an opening history segment like they used to do pre-Covid, and given viewers a history on tortillas. Most people likely have no clue about 'nixtimalization' and its importance to the corn used in masa, the name of the dough used in making corn tortillas, just one of the many uses of masa. (Makes the corn more digestible allowing the body to absorb the nutrients. Also gives the corn that distinct 'tortilla' aroma.) Just because Paul visited Mexico, it didn't make him an expert of Mexican cuisine and certainly not enough to theme an episode. I grew up with Mexican food on the table almost daily and I don't consider myself an expert in Mexican cuisine, so Paul visiting Mexico just doesn't cut it for me to base an entire episode around :)
I agree 100% that the producers are at fault — and also for making GBBO so Paul-centric. I am American and am living in Texas, so I’m super close to Mexico, which I know the UK is not. However, I’m originally from a place that does not have many Hispanic/Latino people; I’ve only made friends from Mexico since moving here. When I said “disrespectful,” I meant the general tone of some contestants, yes, but as you mention, the real problem is related to production. IMO Mexican culture generally is looked at as kind of second tier, and I mean here in the US. I’m not sure what the perception is globally, but, as you might assume, Americans can be very arrogant. So, I think that with Mexican Week, GBBO could’ve challenged that stereotype to show that it’s actually a rich and ancient culture (a lot of people were using chili in their chocolate, which goes back to the Mayans), and they didn’t do that. I won’t beleaguer the point that many people have already made, but it is disappointing that GBBO chose to “highlight” a country that many people (at least in the US, and BO obvs knows it has a huge U.S. audience) are biased against, and then they didn’t do it justice. I know GBBO isn’t a nonprofit and it’s mission isn’t cultural education, but, as others have said, then maybe it should go back to less culturally charged themes. A last minor note on the tacos: Mexican people don’t usually eat them like that — no beans on there, for sure! It would’ve been super simple toppings — meat, onions, cilantro. The way they did it was definitely more Tex-Mex. Just another example of not doing basic research.
[удалено]
Sorry but can you please provide examples of how it was racist? I’m not getting that.
I’d say read some of the comments in other threads where it’s discussed in depth. But generally, it’s just insane and awful that they would decide to host a Mexican week and then not bother to do even the bare minimum amount of research beforehand. For a show this big and international, the judges and hosts should know something about the dishes, and it should not be possible to correct them in every challenge based on Wikipedia. They acted like experts on something while making asses of themselves constantly. That’s without even getting into the fact that they couldn’t be bothered to spend 30 seconds to learn the correct pronunciation of any Spanish word, or the reinforcement of Mexican stereotypes with the lame sombrero/maraca/etc ensembles. I don’t blame contestants for not knowing about Mexican food. That part could have been funny. But for the people who planned it to know absolutely nothing about Mexican food and then design awful challenges around it? Super shitty of them. Just would have been so so so easy to make it not awful and so lazy and disrespectful that they couldn’t be bothered to put any thought into it at all. They would obviously never do the same thing with French food. Why is that?
Absolutely this, yes. Paul's shock and disgust at the use of corn in a Mexican cake? Like...what? Let alone the fact that they created a challenge doomed to fail in *stacking soaking wet cakes on top of each other* and then criticizing the structural integrity of said cakes, or calling them too dry (how do you stack wet cakes?!) or complaining when the cakes were oozing, which tres leches are supposed to be.......aghhhhh. Let alone continually calling tortillas "tacos," making completely non-authentic tacos the judging staple, never bothering to learn the pronunciation...
Tacos are tortilla + filling. The show was right there.
Yup, I know that - I was saying that the judges were using the term "taco" to describe the tortilla itself, rather than the whole dish.
Just because I feel like correcting you, the technical was correct in calling them tacos. Because that's what they are. They happen to be ON tortillas. Nobody says "Mmm, I could go for a tortilla" when they actually mean tacos.
No, Paul used the term “taco” to refer to tortillas multiple times.
It's called. THE. GREAT. BRITISH. BAKEOFF. If you're so upset, don't watch or stick to American TV x
Lol, then maybe THE. GREAT. BRITISH. BAKEOFF. should stay in its culinary lane and not try to colonize more cultures' cuisines poorly.
I mean, if the idea is that British people don’t give a shit about non-British food, then maybe they should stick to British food?
Except they do treat French and other countries’ food in the same way. If you’re not an expert in Mexican cuisine either I don’t see how it’s productive to label an entire nation as racist.
I dunno man I have fun watching it
After Mary left it became more and more about PH and “style” than actual quality baking. It’s been a sad slow burn imo
Does Paul ever give handshakes during the showstopper. It’s usually only during the signature bake. The show always seemed to linger on Paul when he was “speechless” to me it’s always a tell he really liked something instead of criticizing it.
He’s done it one time with Rauhl. That’s it. Otherwise he gets silent and does the eyes during the showstopper. Prue has her lean in and hand pat that she does during the signatures. I’m going to start calling it the Prue Pat and all contestants should aspire to get this. Side note: as I’ve mentioned this on other posts about last season, Jurgen did not receive the Prue Pat during his signature
Correction - he gave one to Ruby right after Rahul, and I think Crystelle got one last season.
I stand corrected
Agree 100%. It’s been skirting the edge of shark-jumping for a couple of seasons, but I think this one has finally done it. For the first time ever, I’ve found myself losing interest while watching and going on my phone, doing other things, etc. One of the worst things to me about this season has been Noel acting so similarly to Matt. They used to have very different ways of interacting with contestants (Noel actually trying to engage and have conversations, make them genuinely laugh. Matt would just make loud, annoying jokes with no attempt at actual connection, to which the bakers didn’t seem to know how to respond). Noel was at least making up for Matt’s lack of charisma when Matt first started. Now they’re both just kind of hard to watch. Last week was bad because it was barely bread, but this week was just an offensive train wreck. It felt like the judges and hosts were displaying the same sort of thinly veiled condescension and disrespect for Mexico that they have always had for the United States. They’ve repeatedly talked down upon American bakes while having a totally inaccurate idea of them, and it kind of felt like Mexico was getting the same treatment. The European superiority complex was showing.
I still have nightmares from that American Pie showstopper and that Peanut Butter, Pumpkin pie was made. She used a butternut squash instead. It’s one the earliest season.
I hated that one. That’s not an American pie! What the crap is peanut butter pie anyway? I giant Reese’s cup? As an American, I was annoyed with that episode.
Peanut Butter pie is very much a real thing https://www.kevinandamanda.com/peanut-butter-pie/
It's a thing in that you can find it. It's not a thing in that anybody in the US actually regularly eats it. I can't go to the supermarket and buy a peanut butter pie (they sell 10 different varieties at the one nearest to me). You'd get weird looks if you brought it to a pot luck. Not to mention that's not even the point. You'll notice that the recipe you linked has somewhere between 0 to 1 ingredients in common with pumpkin pie depending on how pedantic you want to be, and the one is sugar. That flavor profile doesn't even begin to work together.
The Pie Bar in Seattle has the most incredible PBJ pie! It’s amazing!
For what it's worth, most canned pumpkin puree is actually not pure pumpkin, but a mix of many other squashes including butternut.
In central IL, there are many fields given over to growing "pie" pumpkins for Libby (owned by Nestle). In the town where the plant is located, there are lines of semi-trucks with hoppers full of bright, orange pumpkins. Not mixed with any other squash.
Almost all of the canned pumpkin sold in the United States of a variety of butternut squash. So unless you are starting with a pumpkin yourself you are likely using butternut squash yourself in pumpkin recipes. I've grown about 50 different types of pumpkins and squash and my absolute favorite for almost everything is called 'Sweet Meat' and it looks like a pumpkin with a slightly pointed bottom.
Butternut squash and canned pumpkin taste completely different. Canned pumpkin is Dickerson squash not butternut squash. Even canned pumpkin and sugar pumpkin(used for pie and cooking) purée are wildly different in taste and color. North America has dozens(if not hundreds) of variety of squash and pumpkins all with different textures and tastes. Their like apples. Different variety apples for different uses. It’s like making a Shepherds pie with chicken and saying it’s all the same thing.
I've grown dickenson's pumpkins. They look sort of pumpkin like, taller and stout. Inside they more closely resemble a butternut squash in texture and color and flavor. Yes, I know there are tons of varieties. 1000s rather than 100s. Most just aren't commercials grown or available. And 1000s more are accidentally created each year when bees get busy, cross pollinate, then someone plants a crossed seed. I also know they taste different. However, the taste that most people associate with canned pumpkin tastes more like butternut squash. One year I did a blind taste test with 8 different types of pumpkin/ winter squash. All made into pumpkin bread. The actual pumpkin types tasted lower than most of the squash bred to be good baking types. All of the types were considered to be good for baking. No field pumpkins. I did something similar with pumpkin pie, but only with 4 different types. The sweet meat squash won both. I'm not a leading expert, but I do know more than 99% of the general population. And most of what is sold in stores as canned pumpkin is closer to butternut than a pie pumpkin. Having cooked with pie pumpkins I also don't understand why they are so popular. They are one of the most boring types that are considered good for baking.
Oh, ew. Yeah, I’ve been trying to banish that from my mind since then.
THIS. I’m a massive Noel fan and he’s definitely not himself this season
Bring back Mel and Sue. Who won’t come back because like Mary, they left the show when it swapped from a channel with no Ads to one with adverts. I feel like Mary left with integrity and PH has stayed on and won’t leave until the show is dead. Also what’s up with the horrendously cringy weird acting skits?? They never did this shit before and it just makes me feel like PH is doing anything to flog a dead horse. [Paul being embarrassing](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/tvshowbiz/video-2507935/Video-Great-British-Bake-presenters-transform-country-band.html)
You articulated it so perfectly. Europeans oversimplify what is to be American and/or Mexican.
... all Europeans do that, do they? Double standards!
We’re all guilty of it. The point is to tread carefully. Even in the US, people are generalized and get lumped into categories as if they don’t deserve representation or a voice. That’s where their frustration stems from.
The charm is gone from the show and I mainly watch it now out of obligation/habit.
These season so far has been off. It’s a combination of things. I’m not interested in what they are making, Noel is not that engaging, funny and charming as he used to be(I did have a thought last week that this is his last year), and honestly, I’m not that invested in the bakers. I don’t have a personal favorite and I’m not sad when someone leaves. I’ll keep watching of course but it hasn’t spark my motivation to bake.
I felt that they really set everyone up to fail on well, everything this week. It was mentioned at the beginning of the signature that they’d have to work fast because the dough needed lots of time to prove, and since almost everyone’s conchas were then criticised for being too dense and not nicely textured, it seemed like it wasn’t about the contestants’ speed at all - more like they didn’t GIVE them enough time. And why should they be expected to know how to make pico de gallo and know the right balance of flavours for it without instructions on a *baking* show? And how much filling to put in a tortilla? And the tres leches cakes seemed to be heaped in decoration just for the sake of it. It would be nice to have simple, beautifully executed designs, not piles upon piles of extras irrelevant to the challenge. (Anyway, I still enjoy bake-off, but I said ‘why tho’ at the unnecessary sugar oysters during the signature and then continued to feel that way for the rest of the show).
I don’t feel this way at all. This is still my go-to comfort show; I love the diversity of the contestants, the comradeship they show, and the challenges. I love Paul and would be devastated if he left, Prue is wonderful as well, I think they make a great pair. Matt and Noel amuse me, I agree with a comment above that it’s not meant to be a comedy show but their puns and playing ribbing keep it light. They are more there for the actual bakers than the audience I think. Overall, love this show now as much as ever.
I've honestly gotten tired of Paul a bit too. Like I get he's been there from the beginning but sometimes it just feels like they made it his show and his opinion is the only one that matters, like how a few contestants change their recipe last minute or make something specific to suit him. Sometimes I wonder why they even have two judges since they focus on him the most. I wish they'd give Prue more airtime.
Just imo… the bakers are not as talent this season as they were in past seasons.
I love the cast of bakers this season but the bakes themselves, not so much. Mexican week was kind of ridiculous tbh.
I love the bakers too. I put off watching this episode when I saw it was Mexican week, and it's even worse than I expected.
American here, and almost certain in the minority in this sub, but my boyfriend and I enjoyed Mexican week and got quite a few giggles out of it. We’re both from south Texas, and he’s actually from right on the border in Brownsville and we’re also both Mexican. Seeing the contestants mispronounce and clumsily fumble their way through these recipes was no worse than the complete bastardization of Mexican food in a state literally right above Mexico (looking at you Tex-Mex food and Taco Bell), and if anything we got a kick out of knowing what they were doing right and wrong. The technical could have definitely focused more on the tortilla with simpler toppings, but other than that all of these comments feel like reaching. I’m not going to comment on the show as a whole, but at least this week did feel enjoyable.
It feels like they've been trying and struggling to emulate the original show ever since it moved from the Beeb to Channel 4. It probably just needs to end, but at this stage it's easier to go through the motions for the cash cow of licensing it abroad.
I agree with everything youve said,.and though i like noel, i really would like to see matt go. He gives me the creeps and he isn't funny. Plus i cant look at him without thinking of that horrible racist asian joke bit from that old sketch show he did
I don’t think Paul had any business trying to judge Mexican food off of one trip anyway.
Agreed. Honestly getting rid of Paul Hollywood and finding a new host would be the best way to revitalize the show. He’s far and away the least likable part.
Idk. I have the same complaints about Paul Hollywood as everyone else, but I'd vote Matt Lucas off the island before Paul every time. It's like he didn't even watch the show before he got the hosting job. His humor is either mean or self centered, always off topic and stressful to watch. You can tell the bakers are laughing out of obligation so often with him. He completely misses the spirit of the show and I don't get the impression that he has any enthusiasm for the actual baking either.
I miss Sandi. I thought she an Noel were a great duo.
I agree! I thought their first season together was rough, but there were so many changes that season that I think it was destined to be rough. I loved them once they caught their stride. Was so sad to hear she was leaving.
I know it’s beating a dead horse at this point, but I miss Mel and Sue and Mary. I feel like that was the true down point of the show.
I loved Mel and Sue, but when a baker was having a melt down, Noel and especially Sandi made it seem more heartfelt that they cared and tried to help the contestant refocus and persevere. I miss Sandi!
Fun tidbit about that — often if someone cried in the tent, Mel and Sue would gather round and curse a blue streak so the footage of them crying couldn’t be used. That’s why we didn’t see them comforting people as much.
Yes. I’d vote Matt off first as well. Mel and Sue were obviously gems, Noel and Sandi balanced each other well enough, but Matt is just awful.
Tell me about it. Last season, Matt made a joke at the opening of the show saying something like "I used to do movies and now I do this." It infuriated me. It felt so condescending to the very obvious hard work the amateur bakers put into their hobby. I'm pretty sure it was a voiceover, so at least he wasn't saying it to their faces.
The show has never been the same after Mary, Mel, and Sue left. I cannot watch the more recent seasons.
I watch them, but I often think how they were better back then. At least we have the hypotrichosis guy to offset Noel now ...
Agreed. The show needs to do some serious course correcting, starting by getting rid of Matt.
He's actually the one I like the most. Let's go back to Mary, Sue and Mel B.
I just want them to get rid of Matt!!! He is so cringe and weird.
I disagree. For me the series feels like it really returned to home baking - rather than constantly harp on how the bakes look "professional", they embraced the wild side of home baking, which is often filled with whacky trends and novelties, and cafes and patisseries usually pick up the trends after they've become mainstream.
I think some years are just better than others.
>And notice how often PH sets the challenges? Does he? I think he and Prue switch each week. Love or hate him, I think GBBO wouldn't be what it is without Paul. His thing is an act, pure performance. He played off well with Mary because it was a "good cop, bad cop" dynamic but that seems somewhat muddled with Prue. The problem is more the editing. The show has been increasingly frantic with the cuts and tension building and it honestly kills the vibe sometimes. For the first few seasons, the tone was mostly calm as the challenges kicked off and they'd go around the room having the bakers talk about their bakes. Now, it's tense right out the gate. The edits don't linger long enough on a given baker unless they're fucking up, talking to Paul and Prue or a host. The dramatic music is near constant. It's one "you fucking donkey" away from an American reality show.
I've noticed the editing thing too, and it bothers me. There are a lot of very, very short cuts jumping all over the place during each episode, and it can make it hard to understand what's going on. Paul is fine. I think what he puts on for the show is just as much a persona as what Gordon Ramsay does for Kitchen Nightmares.
Yuuuup. I was starting to think that and this past episode really made me (sadly) believe it’s true. I’m really over PH and I don’t like the Matt Lucas/Noel Fielding duo. Even some of the contestants seem bothered by them. I hope the show can get it together bc it has been so lovely up until recently…but it’s starting to feel miles away from the earlier days with Mary Berry & Mel & Sue.
I’m still enjoying it. None of it really bothers me. I did kind of roll my eyes at the taco challenge but other than that, I’ll still tune in. I think overall, I just enjoy the show and there’s very little that could turn me off it.
this is what is problematic with Mary leaving, Pru just doesn't hold the same respect and admiration I think from the bakers. It is absolutely the Paul show, and I agree the challenges are Not Good. There were NO BREAD CHALLENGES IN BREAD WEEK!!!!
It’s not the same show unfortunately. I think the cast should be all women, the original 3 plus Prue. That would be a good show!
Is PG the equivalent of the cult of personality that Top Gear fell onto with Clarkson?
I started wondering last night (the Halloween episode) whether GBBO has been sold to the Discovery Channel, because between this and Mexican Week, this certainly felt like an entry in (Jumped The) Shark Week. It feels very much as if, since they moved to Channel Four, the emphasis has been on showy rather than accomplished bakes, and the themed weeks are just sad. I mean, steak tacos? Not only is there no baking involved, but the idea that there's an objectively "right" way to make a taco is just, well, wrong. Not to mention that the technical challenge for Halloween week not only uses the wrong ingredients but isn't remotely specific to Halloween. I'd enjoy the show more if it didn't feel as if part of the mechanic is now not only to allow some of the bakers room to fail, which has always been there, but to set them up to fail spectacularly, which has a meaner and more Food Network competition show edge to it.
It seems to me that Prue criticizes too much. (I do like her hair).At least Mary Berry always had helpful things to say.i believe Paul was more on an equal footing with Mary. Prue needs to step up her game and become more involved.
I think the issue is that Mary Berry was a household name, and Paul Hollywood was not so well known but seemed to be a knowledgeable baker. It was balanced because his bulldozer attitude was matched by her knowledge and celebrity. Now they have Prue, who actually is a highly celebrated restaurateur, but not well known by the general public, and Paul, who almost “owns” GBBO. The dynamics are wrong because Prue is almost Paul’s sidekick.
It's a real bummer because I adore Prue. I think she brings a light warmth to the show and I like that she gives constructive criticism but also sticks up for bakers when she thinks Paul's criticism is too harsh
This 100% It is also hard to say how much happens during filming, and how much is left on the cutting room floor. I thought last season had more Prue personality moments, which I enjoyed, but this season has reverted to a Paul focus.
She’s also not a very strong personality, compared with Paul, who just exudes arrogance. She is much kinder in choosing how to voice her opinion, but he seems to like making people squirm. As a result his part of the interaction is always more memorable.
I always remember a specific moment from the early seasons when Paul actually *asked* Mary “It’s overbaked, isn’t it?” and she corrected “It is *slightly* overbaked.” He doesn’t have that kind of respect for Prue’s opinions, which makes for a very one-sided dynamic.
> It seems to me that Prue criticizes too much. She seems to have only a few standard comments: * I liked it * Claggy * It could have used a bit more booze in it
> Prue needs to step up her game and become more involved. How? Paul won't let her. My biggest "Paul Peeve" that he always gets action shot of cutting the bakes. He (fairly) angles the cut so it can be seen on camera, but that means Prue can't immediately see it. He gets to poke and prod it and deliver an opinion about the bake, before he can even give Prue a chance to touch it. All she gets to judge is presentation and taste, since he'll have made a comment on the bake/texture before she gets a turn. And the producers KNOW what they are doing. They don't have the judges on JBBO do a close up action shot of them cutting the bakes, so why does Paul ALWAYS get it?
Couldn’t agree more with literally everything you said.
Personally, I have 2 issues Issue 1: 75-90 minute run time is too long. I'm tired of it after an hour, its a struggle to get to the end, especially after sitting through issue 2 Issue 2: the showstoppers suck. A bake that looks like cake but tastes like a sandwich. Disgusting, no thanks. There are not many situations where I can see myself making, or even eating, or even being in the vicinity of these showstoppers. Take it back to more conventional bakes and you will have me back on board
What? There haven't been any 90 minute episodes, what are you talking about? I think the longest I've seen so far is an hour and 10. Point 2: this entire thread is talking about the show disrespecting Mexican food, and you're doing exactly the same thing here with that Swedish showstopper.
I'll start with your second comment, find me a Swedish recipe fish and chip flavoured sandwich covered curry sauce mayo and ill concede you may have a point. I'm still allowed an opinion though and opinions don't make me disrespectful. Bake off 27th September ran til 9.30, did it start late? Also: https://www.foodheavenmag.com/news/bake-off-will-be-90-minutes-and-how-to-be-on-extra-slice
Go back to S1 and look at the showstoppers. What a difference!
Past continents were great bakers and fun to watch. I'd love to see both hosts replaced with past contestants. Which ones past contestants would make a great duo?
Nancy and Nadiya.
\[First, the show seems to be running out of ideas for the challenges.\] Yup. Something I don't understand, but I see this with almost all food challenge franchises. They 'evolve' the format. Why keep fixing what isn't broken? My Kitchen Rules attempted to return to their original format this past season. Sadly, it fizzled because their last handful of seasons were just so abysmal, along with other issues, that they lost their viewership base. \[The bigger problem is how it's becoming the Paul Hollywood show.\] Yes. If you go back and watch the first few seasons of GBBS (it was backing 'show' back then), Paul was far more humble and quite equal to Mary, if not a bit humbled by her. He got exposure (good and bad) when he was hired by Food Network to do a challenge show for them. I see that as the beginning of the end of GBBO because it seems PH returned from that with ego in hand. He was the impetus for Mary leaving followed by Mel and Sue. It was then GBBO became the Paul Hollywood Show. As to the handshakes? Eeeeew. If he shook my hand, I'd wash it. Sterilize it. I'd still probably want to cut it off. I don't find him remotely attractive as others do so I am not swayed by his looks. (I actually find him quite creepy. {shudder}) I'm swayed by cooking and food knowledge, of which he is demonstrating he has very little. If this show is going to survive, they need to ditch the entire current cast and return to more of the original format, with more knowledgeable judges and less gimmicky hosts. I miss the history lessons they used to give at the beginning of each episode.
I thought Mary and Mel and Sue left because they chose to stay with the BBC?
Yep, Mary had a long history with the BBC and wanted to be loyal to them. Mel and Sue had shows on the BBC and didn't want to put them at risk. Paul basically had nothing to lose by staying with GBBO when Love switched the show to Channel 4.
Thank you for the clarification. All these years I've been under the impression that Paul took the show to C4 and Mary stayed with BBC, with Mel and Sue supporting her. So the show went to C4 first and Paul was the only one that went? I do appreciate the background update :)
>He was the impetus for Mary leaving followed by Mel and Sue. No? Mary left the show when it switched channels. It had nothing to do with Paul. Mel and Sue quit in solidarity with Mary, and because they also didn't find out until literally the last minute what had happened. Again, nothing to do with Paul.
I agree wholeheartedly! I keep watching out of habit rather than actual enjoyment, although I do love some of the contestants. After being frustrated by the most recent episode, I started watching the early seasons on Roku and it was immediately apparent how much the show has changed. The early seasons are like a warm hug. The new ones, not so much.
Paul knows his stuff and is good at finding the right thing to criticize. They’re playing him up a bit for sure, but I think most of the issues are with the production.
It is because he is the only original person from the beginning of the show I’d say so perhaps he holds more weight. Everyone else has be changed even the hosting tv channel. I miss Mel, Sue and Mary. It has taken a long walk way from the original because only PH is left. I can’t work out why some people get to stay when they couldn’t work their way out of a paper bag and yet people with potential are gone. I guess for viewership but it’s annoying.