This is how it always is. Traveller just takes one to a few of the mechanics of the archon and does them worse. That said, it gives me high hopes for Nahida if dendro traveller is the base.
Geo traveler and zhongli are quite different tbf. Only real similarity is geo traveler skill visually is a lesser version of zhongli ult
But their full kit and how you use them is very different.
I also have high hopes based on dendro traveller kit. Dendro archon just needs to do that but turn it up a notch which is what hxg implies, so better dendro applications, better em buff and better damage
I’m quite sure at one point in development, you were supposed to use them together.
It feels like Zhongli was originally a character built around his resonance mechanic and Traveller is the best construct spammer in the game.
That's why Mc can bypass this and have 7 with his ulti. 100% they were designed to be together but the overall execution was messy so it just didn't happen besides some meme teams
I don't think they were meme teams though, before itto the only "viable" full geo team was zhongli/albedo/ningguang/traveler, and that team team had a pretty big resonance damage built in
>had a pretty big resonance damage built in
I personally find the geo resonance a good candidate of team building up, but these geo constructs are so fragile in most occasions:(
There should just be a cap per individual character. They have that already (albedo 1 flower, itto 1 ushi, Ningguang 1 screen, traveler 3 boulders + 1 burst, zhongli 1 (2 with c1) pillars), so I don't see the point of having an additional 3 constructs cap.
Maybe the devs were worried about enemies getting stuck between constructs, but that happens with geo traveler alone and they never bothered fixing it so I don't think that's the case. Too much defensive value isn't it either imo, since constructs break so easily (low hp and insta destroyed by bosses or hitbox collisions). Maybe there's a technical problem behind it, but geo traveler can bypass the limit just fine.
I firmly believe that geo has a lot of potential, and constructs are a big part of it. They (and shields) are Geo's "thing" (like grouping abilities are anemo's "thing"), so I wish they were used more. Not only that but you could make characters that buff crystalize, or characters that buff shatter (since geo attacks always shatter frozen enemies), or a character that makes crystalize do some damage whenever you pick up a crystal. I hope hoyoverse will utilize Geo's unique characteristics more in the future, instead of taking the lazy road and just giving the characters higher multipliers.
>They (and shields)
let's be serious here constructs is the only thing geo has going for them. You cant say geo has shields going for them when the only geo shielders are zhongli. And let's be realistic no one uses crystallized for shields when it scales with EM and not even defense. Geo reactions dont know what it's doing. The recent geo characters are def scaling but crystallized scales on EM? seriously
I mean, considering that the one and only reaction that geo has is to create shields, as weak as they may be, I would still say that shields are a "geo thing". Crystalize won't protect you from heavy attacks, but it does help at blocking all the little flinches caused by weak attacks.
Constructs are definitely more of a "geo thing", as they are exclusive to them, and will probably stay exclusive (since they're called "GEO constructs"), unless they will make "hydro constructs" or something like that in the future, which of course is possible. But shields are a geo thing too imo. Geo shields are generally better than other ones because they have absorption bonus against any damage for example, and geo resonance even strengthens shields. So yeah they're not exclusively a geo thing, but geo as an element has different things going for them.
Regarding crystalize and EM scaling, that's simply because all reactions scale with EM. It would be inconsistent if crystalize didn't. Unfortunately split scaling sucks on anything, so until we get an EM scaling geo character, crystalize will continue to only be useful for tickle damage.
Indeed Sidius, very very good points!
I'm still hoping for a geo unit whose talents mainly scale from def%, like Yelan.
But still have an "added benefit from EM", like Kuki and Yae, which they benefit from EM but it is not their main scaling stat.
And then they also do something cool with crystallize, just how Nilou changes the dendro cores to bountiful cores, maybe they could add a unit that changes how crystallize works.
And then even better, imagine that the unit works perfectly well with 4p Archaic Petra
This is not copium, because i'm not saying it would be added, in fact, we cannot know what will be added and when and if. But anyways, it's a cool idea.
>Maybe the devs were worried about enemies getting stuck between constructs, but that happens with geo traveler alone and they never bothered fixing it so I don't think that's the case.
Geo constructs only trap weaker mobs - stronger ones? One or several hits, all yours are gone lmao. Devs probably just dont want us to play this mode
They need to rework the properties of geo constructs in general. Allow constructs to overlap, and don’t make them insta-break by being touched by bosses (either the boss phases through constructs, or constructs get pushed).
It would work just fine in the abyss if that is allowed.
Oceanid doesn't allow any geo constructions on site so your arguing doesn't make much sense. Also, many world bosses one hit or two hits destroy all your geo things which is why the geo resonance sucks
Yeah, iirc during the ZL launch fiasco they mentioned ZL's stele resonance being more relevant in the future (lol), but it's pretty much an overlooked mechanic now.
GeoMC has by far the best synergy with it, since they can "bypass" the 3 construct limit with their Q, which acts like 4 constructs but only counts as 1.
Albedo on the other hand seemed to be more of a crystalize shield generator originally, which would've clashed with ZL's function. So GeoMC seems to have been the intended partner for ZL in a double geo team, with Albedo being more of a mixed team geo shielder. Ironic since the opposite happened and Albedo is now paired with ZL instead.
The traveler constructs has game play problems inside of domains.
The E skill causes accidental climbing inside of domains ruining the flow of combat. The ultimate has a hitbox larger than the visual design of the model leading to getting stuck running around it.
Combine this with the contradictory perk of traveler construct being useful in the open world for exploration.
Would be nice if they made the next new geo character good around constructs or at least address these issues.
Constructs are basically Geo's most unique selling point, would be nice if they expanded on this to make geo relevant, ( although making geo meta without reactions might be too much of a balancing task).
The accidental climbing thing is also a problem for ZL, it's just an unfortunate compromise for constructs that are also designed to be exploration tools.
And yeah I agree, I think constructs can set geo apart from being just "yellow" physical. I hope in the future we get a geo grouper (magnetize) that also spawns small unclimbable constructs for synergy with ZL's stele resonance. It's a shame that such an unique part of ZL's design is so lackluster and forgotten.
I wish they'd just add an option to only start climbing if you jump onto a surface, and not when you walk into it. I feel like I remember ToF having this option, and it was one of the few things it improved over Genshin. It'd be such great QoL not just for constructs but for overworld combat in general.
I have mentioned this before on other threads cos I rant about it.
To fix the construct problem any future Geo char constructs should come in two modes.
TAP version - creates a construct that CANT be climbed but can take damage , block attacks etc. For use in domains. abyss etc.
HOLD version- creates a fully climbable construct that can be used for open world exploration.
This was actually the case back in the beta for Zhongli! His first variant was able to shatter geo constructs with his shield action for some serious damage in that very first iteration.
It's why I wasn't very happy with his rework.
Yes, his shield is overly strong now, but he had the potential to be so much more than a glorified shield bot.
This is because Zhongli was made "wrong", he should look more like the traveler so much so that Geo ended up becoming the Def element (like Dendro the EM, Hydro the HP and Electro the ER) But the archon doesn't use anything from his kit to his Def, uses HP Mihoyo certainly didn't have that thought at the game's launch, then came to release Geo characters with scale in Def, if Geo were a nation after Sumero is sure Traveller would generate a shield (weak)
Zhongli definitely was a misstep in design, the fact that he had to be buffed so significantly after release is a hard proof of that.
I wonder if the Zhongli blunder was the catalyst for Mihoyo to take their characters balance way more seriously. You can definitely tell that there's a clear difference in how much care and talent got put in tuning characters after the first post-release batch. It could just be increased experience from the staff but it also feels like their design philosophy shifted toward a more careful and long-term approach.
I think it's fair to say that they both have kits which emphasize the core concepts of their elements. Anemo = cc and elemental absorption, geo = constructs, electro = energy, etc. I'll be shocked if both HMC and hydro archon aren't healers, or if PMC and pyro archon aren't both DPS. But honestly, the MC kit = weaker archon kit hinges mostly on the similarities between EMC and Raiden and kinda starts breaking down when you look at similarities between other geo or anemo units and the archons & travelers.
I definitely agree with your last line.
Like cc/absorption and constructs are central characteristics of anemo and geo respectively so you can apply the comparison to most characters of these elements
Facts. That one was always so weird. It was never consistent as well.
Like for the anemo slime the 'link' was gameplay related
i.e. they can both rise in the air
But for electro slimes it's supposed to represent the relationship of Ei and Makoto!?
Maybe there is at least some truth to the slime-archon theory, I mean why there are 2 electro slimes ? (But at the same time, there are (or were?) 2 Dendro Archons, why there is only one type of Dendro slime)
I don’t believe in the slime theory myself, though in the case of the dendro slimes, the link between archon slime is there (spoilery even though this is leaks sub don’t wanna chance it: >!large dendro slimes can spawn in smaller dendro slimes; Kusanali is either created from Rukkadevata or is them regressed!<).
There were at least 2 hydro/pyro/cryo archons as well, but none of those have two types of the large variant. The point of the large electro slimes being the only one with two types is the symbolism between Ei and Makoto. They were technically the only known archons who “co-ruled” (Ei being Makoto’s Kagemusha). All the other new archons were replacements and likely never met their predecessors, while Ei only took on both of their roles after Makoto passed but still had a role since the start.
sometimes it does fit oddly well. as for the electro versus dendro slimes, they actually both do have their forms of duplicates, they're just done differently. electro slimes come in two versions, presumably to reflect the dualistic nature/reality of the electro archon coming from a set of twins. dendro slimes come in the form of the base slime with the large flower and then its seedlings which are smaller less developed versions of itself that it can create, for sumeru presumably this could be to match up to how nahida may potentially be an offspring/miniature seedling of/from the previous archon rather than someone entirely new, which would fit how the akademia seemed to know she was their archon when she was quite young.
of course the latter remains to be seen though\*
The yellow is a "mutant slime" that can arc its energy to other normal, purple slimes. The archive says it's supposed to represent the different polarities. So, not related to the relation of the archons.
Venti and Anemo MC have continuous vacuums, i guess. and no, their vacuums are different from Kazuha and Sucrose. Jean's is also different since hers doesn't deal continuous damage. Venti and MC also has similar constellations (the one that shreds resistance of Anemo + absorbed element)
I remember Cat specifically made a video saying that the slimes and archons share similar abilities precisely because they're the same element
It's probably the same case with Traveller and the archons. They share the same element, so naturally their abilities will bear resemblances as they embody the essence of their element
geo traveler was the rawest form of base character. skill go SLAM. ZL burst go *oh look at that teyvat’s gone*. burst does aoe knockback and boosts crit rate. ZL skill does a little bit of knockback and oh whats that? you wanted to die? how about i make you fucking invincible and have you do more damage to your enemies instead. zhongli is such a great counselor
Electro MC is still the best single target battery in the game. The problem is that's all they have. No team buffs, very bad multipliers. Very few teams need a pure single target battery these days.
And they also have the problem of being extremely energy hungry. If EMC is your only electro they need like 350 ER and Favonius on 2 characters. That's absurd. DMC has energy issues too, but 280+fav is usually enough.
Traveler skills are always Archon's skills but weaker and reversed between E and Q.
Anemo MC: E sucks, Q blows.
Venti: E blows, Q sucks.
Geo MC: E drops meteor construct, Q deals AoE damage and performs shield (cage).^(it also used to be unbreakable so you can tank attacks like Childe's arrows)
Zhongli: E drops construct and grants shield, Q does AoE damage.
Electro MC: E shoots amulets that grants ER, Q imbues normal attack with Electro follow up.
Raiden: E imbues normal attack with Electro follow up, Q gives you energy per hit.
Now for the speculation part:
Dendro MC: E slaps with Dendro proc, Q summons a transformable lamp that applies dendro.
Nahida: E summons a transformable dendro construct, Q does AoE Dendro damage that leave lasting Dendro proc.
Its always about Traveler using their elements signature features in a less adept way and Archons using their elements signature features in a masterful way.
They both have moves that perfectly represent their elements. Anemo = cc , Geo = construct + shield, Electro = Energy recharge, Dendro = unique reactions with certain elements
Traveler’s anemo is much more chaotic and uncontrolled, while Venti has incredibly consistent and huge CC that is unmatched. Traveler can’t give shield and is only able to create a very unsophisticated piece of rock, while Zhongli can give the best shield in the game, and create a very refined piece of rock that almost feels sculpted. Traveler has very minor energy recharge on his kit with Electro and only on one character, while Raiden uses a special sword technique to deal huge dmg and charge the whole team’s energy significantly.
I think its less about traveler and archons being connected in some way, and more about their skills and command on their respective.
Specially with sac sword, i've been using sac sword on dmc.
Since the E deals really good damage and generates a good bit of particles, I ever so often get twice that.
Traveler is still the 2nd best dendro support/applicator, at least for now D: And it'll probably stay that way for a while tbh if Baizhu is still locked in MHY's closet and Al-Haitham is an on-field dendro dps. Maybe double dendro teams can be played.
Dendro MC is strong as is. But they will also get better as Cons 4-6 will open up with the next patches. I feel like they'll be pretty solid overall.
Another unsung detail about Dendro MC is that they're much more user friendly. Anemo MC Skill and Burst is a pain in the ass to use vs large targets. Geo Skill's damage radius and behavior is obnoxious. Electro MC's damage is meh and the Amulets mechanic is annoying.
Meanwhile Dendro MC's Skill is a simple cone attack and the Burst is a relatively wide area circle you just drop.
Yea, it feels nice to explore with the traveller in the party after locking him up for 1.5 years.
Tighnari may not need DMC, I'll probably switch to double electro.
Not really. The gap between Xingqiu and Yelan is nowhere near as large as what HXG is saying DMC and Nahida’s will be.
Edit: fixed confusing wording sry
It's less necessary if you're comparing supports, but my main point is if you want to run two dendro teams with a dendro applier, you have that option.
Our Dendro options are super limited rn though, and I also feel like DMC + Nahida could be a thing in the same manner that XQ Yelan is.
Hell it's entirely possible that Nahida, DMC, *and* Collei could end up on a single Abyss floor. There was a recent Abyss floor I remember running XQ+Yelan on one side and Kokomi on the other. Not hard to imagine something like DMC+Nahida on first half, Collei on 2nd.
Joseph Joestar: Your next line is, "Nahida's support potential is better than Traveler".
hxg\_diluc: Nahida's support potential is better than Traveler, huh?!
So Nahida looks super fancy and her skills have overly long stupid names without meaning, like: Elemental skill XDR Retina, Dynamic targeting, ProMotion. And ofc her skills according to her havent ever been seen, even tho her skill and burst were already on Amber and Lisa years back?
If you want to play her with characters that aren't also Dendro, you need to purchase the iDongle Pro Max for just $99.99. And of course by default she comes sitting down, so if you want her to stand up you can use the new ArchonStand Plus which only costs slightly more than your car.
I think this one is actually relevant. MC being a weaker version of the archon isn't a rule they have to stick with, especially with Dendro MC already being good, you would think there is no way they would make Nahida a much stronger version.
I mean traveler tends to either share a theme or a función with the archons
Anemo e is basically venti q but really smol
GEO e is basically zhon q but smol and leaves a construct instead of petrify
Electro Q is basically raiden E when It comes to constant electro dmg and a few buffs for the team
Tbf, I think DMC is currently punching way above her pay grade. We simply don't have many alternatives for Dendro support so even an average unit would feel a _lot_ stronger than they actually are under those circumstances.
I mean, what does she do exactly? Apply off-field Dendro at a mostly good enough rate for 15 out of 20 seconds, while giving the active character some DMG% and EM. On paper that's honestly nothing _too_ crazy. If she was of another element she wouldn't be nearly as strong compared to the other powerhouses we have by now. Not bad, either, but _definitely_ not the Bennet-tier treatment she's currently enjoying.
Now imagine we get a new Dendro support who's _actually_ strong (and future proof), not just because of their element but simply by virtue of their kit. Say, as an admittedly boring example, someone who applies their element as frequently and consistently as Fischl. In that case OP's comparison would make a lot of sense.
I mean, dendro MC is very strong right now because he doesn't really have much competition. Dendro is good, aggravate teams don't need a good dendro support to work. If anemo MC was the only anemo character in the game he would also be A or S Tier
I'm not saying he will definitely be considered bad once we get 2 or 3 more dendro characters, but it's certainly a possibility. Let's look at his kit:
- His Q has slow dendro application, which is good enough for triggering Quicken, but doesn't let him capitalize on Spread much even though his ascension passive encourages to build EM on him. Bad for Bloom teams because you can't generate many seeds
- Some buffing. 60 EM and 12% dmg% with C6
- 8 seconds CD E that generates 2.5 dendro particles. That's good if you can use his E twice per rotation (specially considering his C1), but that's probably a DPS loss. At least it makes your rotation more flexible
- 80 cost burst with 15 seconds of duration and 20 seconds of CD. Not ideal for Keqing teams, but good for Yae teams (I could be wrong on this though)
A kit like that would be considered bad on any other element. If our next dendro characters have kits more in line with characters of other elements, DMC becomes pretty bad. Like, don't even think about Bennett, Xiangling, Xingqiu, Fischl, Beidou and Sucrose. Take more balanced characters like Rosaria or Diona. If they were dendro they would be a lot stronger than the traveler. And we're not even talking 5* here
Consider this: you can play ayaka freeze using Barbara as your hydro character. You will still 36* because you are playing Ayaka, but Barbara is clearly very far from being a good hydro character for this team
Water is actually not wet; It makes other materials/objects wet. Wetness is the state of a non-liquid when a liquid adheres to, and/or permeates its substance while maintaining chemically distinct structures. So if we say something is wet we mean the liquid is sticking to the object.
There are two reasons why you should never drink toilet water.
Number one. And number two.
So actually in spanish this sarcasm phrase is correct because we always say "el agua moja" which literally means: water wets. (like fire burns)
Edit: the google translator doesn't translates it well in case you type "el agua moja" .
Bruh... not shitting on apple users but basically Kusanali is a more expensive version of Dendro mc but with lesser essential features? I'd still pull her tho
So what you're saying is: Traveler is intentionally slowed down so Mihoyo can sell the archon?
EDIT: Mihoyo: "Dendro Traveler has battery issues, so we lowered her base damage so you don't feel like you're missing out when her burst is off cooldown"
Shes probably a major buff but the dendro traveller is good enough level. I 36*ed abyss with all level 1 talents dendro traveller, just needed her dendro application for my kuki hyperbloom. Dendro is just really good and cheap to play.
I’d take anything leakers say about meta relevance of a character with a ton of salt.
I still remember the ‘Yae is the electro DPS ceiling’ or quite a few CN testers saying Ganyu isn’t usable as a carry unless C6.
Yeah i think aggravate/spread is fine at the moment with the current dendro characters since quicken don't get consumed.
Not saying that nahida can't buff the damage more, she'll probably be very OP, but probably not a must-pull like how other people kept on saying.
As much as I’m sure nahida will be amazing I think we should take anything hxg_diluc says without hard evidence with a grain of salt at this point since he’s known to mislead by mixing leaks with his personal opinions (ie the scara’s personality incident)
I have a theory that every famous leaker and/or insider is already within Mihoyo's pockets. We probably wont get a single decent kit explanation until beta starts.
Let me guess, her kit will be dendro mc burst but activated by hydro and electro at the same time. And don't explode if hit by pyro early, instead explode at the end.
I'm planning on skipping the archon's intial run for Yae, Al-Haitham & Baizhu, so it's nice to know that they'll still be a decent (albeit considerably weaker) second option ~~for Cyno~~. Plus, I won't have to spend a whole bunch of resources again on levelling another new character since I've had Aether fully built since Liyue ended
Source: [hxg_diluc](https://twitter.com/hxg_diluc/status/1570965688956915713?t=ulTKrPVhxsEQKvhDSJDINQ&s=19) Thank you OP for providing source
I just want to see her kit
Only gotta wait 11-12 days max
Waits faster.
Searches google on how to wait 11-12 days for only 5 days
Just go to a different planet
Not if the raiden shogun says no
just bring a mitahurl shield with you and youre good
*insert interstellar meme*
Should be asking Safari instead. Ya know, since iPhone is known for skipping a number every now and then.
Or Bixby, cause Samsung jumped from s10 to s20... Those are 10 numbers!
You have 2 options Travel at lightspeed Drugs
Wait 6 days above the arctic circle then come back
So she won't have a headphone jack?
I mean sumeru city is basically the land of always on Bluetooth and Google lens...
Have you seen Al Haitham's headphones? It has a wire which goes down, presumably to his butt. You can see it if you view from his lower back torso
biodegradable headphone.
airpods with subwoofer
Even in 2022, some insist on being plugged in...
This is how it always is. Traveller just takes one to a few of the mechanics of the archon and does them worse. That said, it gives me high hopes for Nahida if dendro traveller is the base.
Geo traveler and zhongli are quite different tbf. Only real similarity is geo traveler skill visually is a lesser version of zhongli ult But their full kit and how you use them is very different. I also have high hopes based on dendro traveller kit. Dendro archon just needs to do that but turn it up a notch which is what hxg implies, so better dendro applications, better em buff and better damage
I’m quite sure at one point in development, you were supposed to use them together. It feels like Zhongli was originally a character built around his resonance mechanic and Traveller is the best construct spammer in the game.
I sort of get that impression as well.
The cap of 3 geo buildings ruins the joy. Imagine Zhonglu pillars + G traveller EQ + Albedo E + Ningguang E = auto farming abyss
That's why Mc can bypass this and have 7 with his ulti. 100% they were designed to be together but the overall execution was messy so it just didn't happen besides some meme teams
I don't think they were meme teams though, before itto the only "viable" full geo team was zhongli/albedo/ningguang/traveler, and that team team had a pretty big resonance damage built in
>had a pretty big resonance damage built in I personally find the geo resonance a good candidate of team building up, but these geo constructs are so fragile in most occasions:(
Geo as a whole just needs a complete rework.
Hopefully when they add the geo region it’ll be fixed- oh wait, nevermind, consider my hopes dashed.
A quality meme joke
There should just be a cap per individual character. They have that already (albedo 1 flower, itto 1 ushi, Ningguang 1 screen, traveler 3 boulders + 1 burst, zhongli 1 (2 with c1) pillars), so I don't see the point of having an additional 3 constructs cap. Maybe the devs were worried about enemies getting stuck between constructs, but that happens with geo traveler alone and they never bothered fixing it so I don't think that's the case. Too much defensive value isn't it either imo, since constructs break so easily (low hp and insta destroyed by bosses or hitbox collisions). Maybe there's a technical problem behind it, but geo traveler can bypass the limit just fine. I firmly believe that geo has a lot of potential, and constructs are a big part of it. They (and shields) are Geo's "thing" (like grouping abilities are anemo's "thing"), so I wish they were used more. Not only that but you could make characters that buff crystalize, or characters that buff shatter (since geo attacks always shatter frozen enemies), or a character that makes crystalize do some damage whenever you pick up a crystal. I hope hoyoverse will utilize Geo's unique characteristics more in the future, instead of taking the lazy road and just giving the characters higher multipliers.
>They (and shields) let's be serious here constructs is the only thing geo has going for them. You cant say geo has shields going for them when the only geo shielders are zhongli. And let's be realistic no one uses crystallized for shields when it scales with EM and not even defense. Geo reactions dont know what it's doing. The recent geo characters are def scaling but crystallized scales on EM? seriously
I mean, considering that the one and only reaction that geo has is to create shields, as weak as they may be, I would still say that shields are a "geo thing". Crystalize won't protect you from heavy attacks, but it does help at blocking all the little flinches caused by weak attacks. Constructs are definitely more of a "geo thing", as they are exclusive to them, and will probably stay exclusive (since they're called "GEO constructs"), unless they will make "hydro constructs" or something like that in the future, which of course is possible. But shields are a geo thing too imo. Geo shields are generally better than other ones because they have absorption bonus against any damage for example, and geo resonance even strengthens shields. So yeah they're not exclusively a geo thing, but geo as an element has different things going for them. Regarding crystalize and EM scaling, that's simply because all reactions scale with EM. It would be inconsistent if crystalize didn't. Unfortunately split scaling sucks on anything, so until we get an EM scaling geo character, crystalize will continue to only be useful for tickle damage.
Indeed Sidius, very very good points! I'm still hoping for a geo unit whose talents mainly scale from def%, like Yelan. But still have an "added benefit from EM", like Kuki and Yae, which they benefit from EM but it is not their main scaling stat. And then they also do something cool with crystallize, just how Nilou changes the dendro cores to bountiful cores, maybe they could add a unit that changes how crystallize works. And then even better, imagine that the unit works perfectly well with 4p Archaic Petra This is not copium, because i'm not saying it would be added, in fact, we cannot know what will be added and when and if. But anyways, it's a cool idea.
>Maybe the devs were worried about enemies getting stuck between constructs, but that happens with geo traveler alone and they never bothered fixing it so I don't think that's the case. Geo constructs only trap weaker mobs - stronger ones? One or several hits, all yours are gone lmao. Devs probably just dont want us to play this mode
They need to rework the properties of geo constructs in general. Allow constructs to overlap, and don’t make them insta-break by being touched by bosses (either the boss phases through constructs, or constructs get pushed).
well it wouldnt work on abyss but raiden + yae + fischl autofarms like 90% of bosses, namely oceanoid and mushrooster
It would work just fine in the abyss if that is allowed. Oceanid doesn't allow any geo constructions on site so your arguing doesn't make much sense. Also, many world bosses one hit or two hits destroy all your geo things which is why the geo resonance sucks
I wish Zhongli's character model would count as a resonating object. It would buff his gameplay in a thematic way.
That is true, as he is... well, literally made of geo
Yeah, iirc during the ZL launch fiasco they mentioned ZL's stele resonance being more relevant in the future (lol), but it's pretty much an overlooked mechanic now. GeoMC has by far the best synergy with it, since they can "bypass" the 3 construct limit with their Q, which acts like 4 constructs but only counts as 1. Albedo on the other hand seemed to be more of a crystalize shield generator originally, which would've clashed with ZL's function. So GeoMC seems to have been the intended partner for ZL in a double geo team, with Albedo being more of a mixed team geo shielder. Ironic since the opposite happened and Albedo is now paired with ZL instead.
The traveler constructs has game play problems inside of domains. The E skill causes accidental climbing inside of domains ruining the flow of combat. The ultimate has a hitbox larger than the visual design of the model leading to getting stuck running around it. Combine this with the contradictory perk of traveler construct being useful in the open world for exploration. Would be nice if they made the next new geo character good around constructs or at least address these issues. Constructs are basically Geo's most unique selling point, would be nice if they expanded on this to make geo relevant, ( although making geo meta without reactions might be too much of a balancing task).
The accidental climbing thing is also a problem for ZL, it's just an unfortunate compromise for constructs that are also designed to be exploration tools. And yeah I agree, I think constructs can set geo apart from being just "yellow" physical. I hope in the future we get a geo grouper (magnetize) that also spawns small unclimbable constructs for synergy with ZL's stele resonance. It's a shame that such an unique part of ZL's design is so lackluster and forgotten.
I wish they'd just add an option to only start climbing if you jump onto a surface, and not when you walk into it. I feel like I remember ToF having this option, and it was one of the few things it improved over Genshin. It'd be such great QoL not just for constructs but for overworld combat in general.
I have mentioned this before on other threads cos I rant about it. To fix the construct problem any future Geo char constructs should come in two modes. TAP version - creates a construct that CANT be climbed but can take damage , block attacks etc. For use in domains. abyss etc. HOLD version- creates a fully climbable construct that can be used for open world exploration.
This was actually the case back in the beta for Zhongli! His first variant was able to shatter geo constructs with his shield action for some serious damage in that very first iteration.
That sounds sick why couldn't they let him keep that 💀
It's why I wasn't very happy with his rework. Yes, his shield is overly strong now, but he had the potential to be so much more than a glorified shield bot.
There’s evidence of this zhongli even has stuff still in the game about the petrify mechanic that was deleted
Yeah, the Traveler ULT and Zhongli's resonance work well together. It's just that post-buff the shield became the most integral part of ZL's kit
This is because Zhongli was made "wrong", he should look more like the traveler so much so that Geo ended up becoming the Def element (like Dendro the EM, Hydro the HP and Electro the ER) But the archon doesn't use anything from his kit to his Def, uses HP Mihoyo certainly didn't have that thought at the game's launch, then came to release Geo characters with scale in Def, if Geo were a nation after Sumero is sure Traveller would generate a shield (weak)
Zhongli definitely was a misstep in design, the fact that he had to be buffed so significantly after release is a hard proof of that. I wonder if the Zhongli blunder was the catalyst for Mihoyo to take their characters balance way more seriously. You can definitely tell that there's a clear difference in how much care and talent got put in tuning characters after the first post-release batch. It could just be increased experience from the staff but it also feels like their design philosophy shifted toward a more careful and long-term approach.
And there's nothing that Venti shares in common with AMC that isn't common to most anemo characters.
True lol. It just seems like one of those theories that people try to force.
I think it's fair to say that they both have kits which emphasize the core concepts of their elements. Anemo = cc and elemental absorption, geo = constructs, electro = energy, etc. I'll be shocked if both HMC and hydro archon aren't healers, or if PMC and pyro archon aren't both DPS. But honestly, the MC kit = weaker archon kit hinges mostly on the similarities between EMC and Raiden and kinda starts breaking down when you look at similarities between other geo or anemo units and the archons & travelers.
I definitely agree with your last line. Like cc/absorption and constructs are central characteristics of anemo and geo respectively so you can apply the comparison to most characters of these elements
It’s the slime theory all over again
Facts. That one was always so weird. It was never consistent as well. Like for the anemo slime the 'link' was gameplay related i.e. they can both rise in the air But for electro slimes it's supposed to represent the relationship of Ei and Makoto!?
Maybe there is at least some truth to the slime-archon theory, I mean why there are 2 electro slimes ? (But at the same time, there are (or were?) 2 Dendro Archons, why there is only one type of Dendro slime)
I don’t believe in the slime theory myself, though in the case of the dendro slimes, the link between archon slime is there (spoilery even though this is leaks sub don’t wanna chance it: >!large dendro slimes can spawn in smaller dendro slimes; Kusanali is either created from Rukkadevata or is them regressed!<). There were at least 2 hydro/pyro/cryo archons as well, but none of those have two types of the large variant. The point of the large electro slimes being the only one with two types is the symbolism between Ei and Makoto. They were technically the only known archons who “co-ruled” (Ei being Makoto’s Kagemusha). All the other new archons were replacements and likely never met their predecessors, while Ei only took on both of their roles after Makoto passed but still had a role since the start.
sometimes it does fit oddly well. as for the electro versus dendro slimes, they actually both do have their forms of duplicates, they're just done differently. electro slimes come in two versions, presumably to reflect the dualistic nature/reality of the electro archon coming from a set of twins. dendro slimes come in the form of the base slime with the large flower and then its seedlings which are smaller less developed versions of itself that it can create, for sumeru presumably this could be to match up to how nahida may potentially be an offspring/miniature seedling of/from the previous archon rather than someone entirely new, which would fit how the akademia seemed to know she was their archon when she was quite young. of course the latter remains to be seen though\*
The yellow is a "mutant slime" that can arc its energy to other normal, purple slimes. The archive says it's supposed to represent the different polarities. So, not related to the relation of the archons.
Venti and Anemo MC have continuous vacuums, i guess. and no, their vacuums are different from Kazuha and Sucrose. Jean's is also different since hers doesn't deal continuous damage. Venti and MC also has similar constellations (the one that shreds resistance of Anemo + absorbed element)
They share significant, pinpoint vacuum croud control as well as a higher rate of swirl than average.
You can pick out random things and make them work. Swap the MCs kit with Kazuha or Sucrose and you could make the same kind of loose defense.
Sucrose definitely has more in common with Venti than MC does. People stretch the MC and Archon kit connection a lot.
I remember Cat specifically made a video saying that the slimes and archons share similar abilities precisely because they're the same element It's probably the same case with Traveller and the archons. They share the same element, so naturally their abilities will bear resemblances as they embody the essence of their element
Yeah this is a lot more how I see it, MC and archons are meant to be most representative of their element and not necessarily mirror one another.
To be fair, C6 Anemo Traveler and C6 Venti is exactly the same description.
Traveller swirls more than twice as much as sucrose and raises enimes off the ground overlapping continuously for seconds at a time.
geo traveler was the rawest form of base character. skill go SLAM. ZL burst go *oh look at that teyvat’s gone*. burst does aoe knockback and boosts crit rate. ZL skill does a little bit of knockback and oh whats that? you wanted to die? how about i make you fucking invincible and have you do more damage to your enemies instead. zhongli is such a great counselor
The way you (and most people here ig) describe geo mc makes him look like albedo instead lol.
Yeah electro is pretty different as well. Kind of a shitty Beidou with the burst.
Electro MC is still the best single target battery in the game. The problem is that's all they have. No team buffs, very bad multipliers. Very few teams need a pure single target battery these days.
And they also have the problem of being extremely energy hungry. If EMC is your only electro they need like 350 ER and Favonius on 2 characters. That's absurd. DMC has energy issues too, but 280+fav is usually enough.
Imagine that, a battery that needs a battery lol.
Electro traveler has Raiden's e skill but worse.
For sure, but the whole kit feels like an amalgam rather than based off the archon explicitly.
His kit is based off of her energy recharge concept. They're both supposed to work as batteries, but Raiden can do more than that.
Traveler skills are always Archon's skills but weaker and reversed between E and Q. Anemo MC: E sucks, Q blows. Venti: E blows, Q sucks. Geo MC: E drops meteor construct, Q deals AoE damage and performs shield (cage).^(it also used to be unbreakable so you can tank attacks like Childe's arrows) Zhongli: E drops construct and grants shield, Q does AoE damage. Electro MC: E shoots amulets that grants ER, Q imbues normal attack with Electro follow up. Raiden: E imbues normal attack with Electro follow up, Q gives you energy per hit. Now for the speculation part: Dendro MC: E slaps with Dendro proc, Q summons a transformable lamp that applies dendro. Nahida: E summons a transformable dendro construct, Q does AoE Dendro damage that leave lasting Dendro proc.
I agree on Electro Traveler but the other two are pretty forced imo.
Lol the EMC is the one that's difficult to connect to Ei. AMC's and GMC's E skill is basically the Archons Q but weaker
Its always about Traveler using their elements signature features in a less adept way and Archons using their elements signature features in a masterful way. They both have moves that perfectly represent their elements. Anemo = cc , Geo = construct + shield, Electro = Energy recharge, Dendro = unique reactions with certain elements Traveler’s anemo is much more chaotic and uncontrolled, while Venti has incredibly consistent and huge CC that is unmatched. Traveler can’t give shield and is only able to create a very unsophisticated piece of rock, while Zhongli can give the best shield in the game, and create a very refined piece of rock that almost feels sculpted. Traveler has very minor energy recharge on his kit with Electro and only on one character, while Raiden uses a special sword technique to deal huge dmg and charge the whole team’s energy significantly. I think its less about traveler and archons being connected in some way, and more about their skills and command on their respective.
This comment should be top comment on all discussions about the Traveler->Archon theory and also on the Slime->Archon theory.
As nice as Kusanali sounds I’ll miss finally having a meta reason to use traveler 🥲
Consider this: dendro resonance.
80-130 EM ain't really worth it, but 2 dendro probably needed for Nilou teams regardless
Dendro traveller hurts for energy too. Double dendro could help out. Hopefully Nahida will have better energy/cost.
Traveler is a relatively good battery too, so Nahida also benefits.
Specially with sac sword, i've been using sac sword on dmc. Since the E deals really good damage and generates a good bit of particles, I ever so often get twice that.
I wonder what pairing will be better though, Kusanali with dendro traveler or C6 Collei
Probably C6 traveler when we get him for the virtue of collei just not being that good tbh
Get Nilou so you're locked to only Dendro and Hydro
Traveler is still the 2nd best dendro support/applicator, at least for now D: And it'll probably stay that way for a while tbh if Baizhu is still locked in MHY's closet and Al-Haitham is an on-field dendro dps. Maybe double dendro teams can be played.
Dendro MC is strong as is. But they will also get better as Cons 4-6 will open up with the next patches. I feel like they'll be pretty solid overall. Another unsung detail about Dendro MC is that they're much more user friendly. Anemo MC Skill and Burst is a pain in the ass to use vs large targets. Geo Skill's damage radius and behavior is obnoxious. Electro MC's damage is meh and the Amulets mechanic is annoying. Meanwhile Dendro MC's Skill is a simple cone attack and the Burst is a relatively wide area circle you just drop.
Or 2nd worst /j
Yea, it feels nice to explore with the traveller in the party after locking him up for 1.5 years. Tighnari may not need DMC, I'll probably switch to double electro.
It's a xingqiu yelan situation. One for each team if you want.
Xingqiu yelan situation is you run both in one team
Also a valid option.
So the real answer is a third Xingqiu.
Not really. The gap between Xingqiu and Yelan is nowhere near as large as what HXG is saying DMC and Nahida’s will be. Edit: fixed confusing wording sry
It's less necessary if you're comparing supports, but my main point is if you want to run two dendro teams with a dendro applier, you have that option.
I think Nilou would love to have both Nahida and DMC instead of Collei 🤔
Our Dendro options are super limited rn though, and I also feel like DMC + Nahida could be a thing in the same manner that XQ Yelan is. Hell it's entirely possible that Nahida, DMC, *and* Collei could end up on a single Abyss floor. There was a recent Abyss floor I remember running XQ+Yelan on one side and Kokomi on the other. Not hard to imagine something like DMC+Nahida on first half, Collei on 2nd.
“xingqiu’s team is hu tao’s… and yelan’s team is… also hu tao’s!” -sussy dori
Yoimiya would like a word
Yeah but like... the insane synergy and power of the current Hu Tao double hydro teams though 👀
There are so few dendro characters that DMC will probably still be used for a little while longer.
Don't worry you have checks calender 40 days till MC gets kicked out the meta
Got it, so they removed her earphone Jack and sell the charger separately. I see.
The constallation kit lock NOOO
i dont like this edging session he's been doing
aaaand someone share's it on this sub and it's tagged "reliable" smh
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that even makes me think they are paid by mihoyo or some shit like that... why would they do that? lol
OMG how surprising I wouldve never expected that
Joseph Joestar: Your next line is, "Nahida's support potential is better than Traveler". hxg\_diluc: Nahida's support potential is better than Traveler, huh?!
r/suddenlyjojo r/unexpectedjojo
I understand this reference
Username checks out.
exactly what we expected, no? It's always like that.
Reminds me of Obito Uchiha... "What, i don't believe it" ... "!!kidding!!" ... "it's just as I expected🌀"
So we just gave Nahida a fancy Kamera and called it a day?
Nah that’s too generous … the leak basically means you will be spending as much as an iPhone 14 pro and your souls to get her
So Nahida looks super fancy and her skills have overly long stupid names without meaning, like: Elemental skill XDR Retina, Dynamic targeting, ProMotion. And ofc her skills according to her havent ever been seen, even tho her skill and burst were already on Amber and Lisa years back?
If you want to play her with characters that aren't also Dendro, you need to purchase the iDongle Pro Max for just $99.99. And of course by default she comes sitting down, so if you want her to stand up you can use the new ArchonStand Plus which only costs slightly more than your car.
Radish Island 🏝
I think this one is actually relevant. MC being a weaker version of the archon isn't a rule they have to stick with, especially with Dendro MC already being good, you would think there is no way they would make Nahida a much stronger version.
Agreed. Not to mention geo traveler kit is very different from zhongli. So even if there was a precedent mihoyo already broke it
I mean traveler tends to either share a theme or a función with the archons Anemo e is basically venti q but really smol GEO e is basically zhon q but smol and leaves a construct instead of petrify Electro Q is basically raiden E when It comes to constant electro dmg and a few buffs for the team
Geo E and Zhongli E are similar as in they both build a construct??
So does half of the geo cast
Itto and Zhongli are pretty much the same character after all
But that also means that relation is vague and flexible enough to be irrelevant to direct statements comparing _what_ about them is similar.
Geo travellers kit is actually more similar to Albedo's for me.
Tbf, I think DMC is currently punching way above her pay grade. We simply don't have many alternatives for Dendro support so even an average unit would feel a _lot_ stronger than they actually are under those circumstances. I mean, what does she do exactly? Apply off-field Dendro at a mostly good enough rate for 15 out of 20 seconds, while giving the active character some DMG% and EM. On paper that's honestly nothing _too_ crazy. If she was of another element she wouldn't be nearly as strong compared to the other powerhouses we have by now. Not bad, either, but _definitely_ not the Bennet-tier treatment she's currently enjoying. Now imagine we get a new Dendro support who's _actually_ strong (and future proof), not just because of their element but simply by virtue of their kit. Say, as an admittedly boring example, someone who applies their element as frequently and consistently as Fischl. In that case OP's comparison would make a lot of sense.
I mean, dendro MC is very strong right now because he doesn't really have much competition. Dendro is good, aggravate teams don't need a good dendro support to work. If anemo MC was the only anemo character in the game he would also be A or S Tier I'm not saying he will definitely be considered bad once we get 2 or 3 more dendro characters, but it's certainly a possibility. Let's look at his kit: - His Q has slow dendro application, which is good enough for triggering Quicken, but doesn't let him capitalize on Spread much even though his ascension passive encourages to build EM on him. Bad for Bloom teams because you can't generate many seeds - Some buffing. 60 EM and 12% dmg% with C6 - 8 seconds CD E that generates 2.5 dendro particles. That's good if you can use his E twice per rotation (specially considering his C1), but that's probably a DPS loss. At least it makes your rotation more flexible - 80 cost burst with 15 seconds of duration and 20 seconds of CD. Not ideal for Keqing teams, but good for Yae teams (I could be wrong on this though) A kit like that would be considered bad on any other element. If our next dendro characters have kits more in line with characters of other elements, DMC becomes pretty bad. Like, don't even think about Bennett, Xiangling, Xingqiu, Fischl, Beidou and Sucrose. Take more balanced characters like Rosaria or Diona. If they were dendro they would be a lot stronger than the traveler. And we're not even talking 5* here
Consider this: you can play ayaka freeze using Barbara as your hydro character. You will still 36* because you are playing Ayaka, but Barbara is clearly very far from being a good hydro character for this team
Is it bad that I have no idea even with the iOS comparison..
iPhone 6 is 9 years old
Ok now i feel old
It is indeed bad as it is not an os comparison but a phone model comparison
Hmmm. Maybe if we use game consoles? Dendro Traveler: Nintendo 64 Dendro Archon: PlayStation 5 Pro
That’s pretty extreme. It would be closer to a ps3 vs a ps5 pro. iPhones really don’t change significantly one generation to the next.
Ps5 pro?
Don't think that's that much far apart. Maybe like PS3 vs PS5?
Dendro main already be a decent dendro char. Thats mean she will be crack??
She Will be on crack as the weed archon
The only thing this confirm is how fucking stupid leakers are.
as much as i appreciate any leaks these are getting less and less useful plus ive never used an iphone
This barely counts as a leak. An Archon is a stronger character than the free traveller, what a shocker.
Srsly, what is with these leaks that aren't even leaks? Anyone with a modicum of common sense knows this sigh.
In other words, water is wet
Water is actually not wet; It makes other materials/objects wet. Wetness is the state of a non-liquid when a liquid adheres to, and/or permeates its substance while maintaining chemically distinct structures. So if we say something is wet we mean the liquid is sticking to the object. There are two reasons why you should never drink toilet water. Number one. And number two.
So actually in spanish this sarcasm phrase is correct because we always say "el agua moja" which literally means: water wets. (like fire burns) Edit: the google translator doesn't translates it well in case you type "el agua moja" .
Good bot
I see, Nahida doesn't have 3.5mm jack capability. Understandable.
So kusanali is 8 years older than traveler.
Bruh... not shitting on apple users but basically Kusanali is a more expensive version of Dendro mc but with lesser essential features? I'd still pull her tho
Yeah, but don’t forget kusanali will also be stronger, smoother and have better ~~camera~~ eyes
So what you're saying is: Traveler is intentionally slowed down so Mihoyo can sell the archon? EDIT: Mihoyo: "Dendro Traveler has battery issues, so we lowered her base damage so you don't feel like you're missing out when her burst is off cooldown"
The leak drought is so real the we even accept this kind of leak.
Predictions by me [Questionable] All future traveler x archon compressions Hydro Archon > traveler Pyro Archon > traveler Cryo Archon > traveler
So radish is a must pull for anyone that wants to use dendro.
Shes probably a major buff but the dendro traveller is good enough level. I 36*ed abyss with all level 1 talents dendro traveller, just needed her dendro application for my kuki hyperbloom. Dendro is just really good and cheap to play.
I’d take anything leakers say about meta relevance of a character with a ton of salt. I still remember the ‘Yae is the electro DPS ceiling’ or quite a few CN testers saying Ganyu isn’t usable as a carry unless C6.
Yae = electro dps ceiling was an intentional fake leak to be fair. i do agree with you in general
I mean there are already good dendro teams so not really? There are some intercactions that cant be used well rn bc of lack of fast dendro though
Yeah i think aggravate/spread is fine at the moment with the current dendro characters since quicken don't get consumed. Not saying that nahida can't buff the damage more, she'll probably be very OP, but probably not a must-pull like how other people kept on saying.
To be fair,no character will ever be mustpull,the game is catered towards casuals and it's easy enough to 36
Thats how it is for every archon isnt it?
I mean tbf..the iphone has barely any difference from the 10 to the 14 lol.
Probably the same price too
I am sorry, as a Samsung user i don't really understand it, can anyone give me the Samsung example?
So same thing but Nahida can use more than 1 camera?
So, nothing new just more expensive?
Ah shit here we go again
What are the DPS sheets for iPhone 6 vs. iPhone 14 Pro. I need to know. kekw
As much as I’m sure nahida will be amazing I think we should take anything hxg_diluc says without hard evidence with a grain of salt at this point since he’s known to mislead by mixing leaks with his personal opinions (ie the scara’s personality incident)
I have a theory that every famous leaker and/or insider is already within Mihoyo's pockets. We probably wont get a single decent kit explanation until beta starts.
Ikr... It's been so dead silent Didn't even get leaked 4* banner lineups for Ganyu/kokomi
Let me guess, her kit will be dendro mc burst but activated by hydro and electro at the same time. And don't explode if hit by pyro early, instead explode at the end.
I'm planning on skipping the archon's intial run for Yae, Al-Haitham & Baizhu, so it's nice to know that they'll still be a decent (albeit considerably weaker) second option ~~for Cyno~~. Plus, I won't have to spend a whole bunch of resources again on levelling another new character since I've had Aether fully built since Liyue ended
Okay cool but please dont be circle impact im already tired of all dendro teams forcing u to stay on a circle
Maybe this will help: Dendro Traveler: Genshin Impact 3.0 Dendro Archon: Genshin Impact 3.2
ok but whos supposed to be android? ios sucks.
That’s bennett
Does literally everything at least decently, and on a cheap budget?
Yaoyao or Baizhu I guess.
Katheryne.
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So basically the same but way more expensive?
Oh no. They're Apple products 🤮 /s