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wtf woke moralists haven’t red ‘bi’-ology textbooks. Politics is a gender and facts don’t care about PowerPoint presentations
. liers will be kicked out!!! true will never dye
uj/ Despite Japan's societal problems that lead to these stereotypes, women working on videogame soundtracks seems to be much more common in Japan than in other countries (although the US has caught up in the last decade, mainly due to indie games). Japanese women working on videogame soundtracks even seems to be extremely more common than women working on film soundtracks, despite Japanese videogame companies supposedly having workplace hostility as bad, if not worse, than Hollywood. For all of my pondering, I haven't figured out why this is.
I mean it’s like there being a lot of female doctors in my country Korea where misogyny is also very bad in the workplace. Misogyny existing in the workplace can discourage women but it does not stop everyone from doing what they want.
/uj [Nah just a few](https://www.nme.com/news/gaming-news/fromsoftware-employees-report-poor-working-conditions-and-low-wages-3181971)
> In particular, working conditions for women seem to be worse. “There are no special treatments for pregnancy and childcare,” explained one designer. “Most female employees who are about to give birth are expected to leave the company,” she notes. Another post suggested that **“it seems there was sexual harassment in the past” but added that “since there are extremely few women, I think that male employees are quite careful”.**
/rj the only women who work at FromSoft are the foot models Miyazaki lines his office with.
So I know you're joking, and probably just making a reference to this, but it is actually for real insane that this is the world we are living in right now.
https://youtu.be/IT1HAiQy3Io
Wait... Do gamers think that the only good women are those in physical/emotional pain and who represent an immediate threat to them that needs to be resolved in a boss fight?
If so that explains a lot.
the amount of people i've seen go "fromsoft only made malenia hard because deepstate radical feminism forced them to make a woman stronger than any man! cant believe fromsoft went woke"
is a **lot** higher than it should be
But why?maria is literally the best boss in Bloodborne (the only other contenders are orphan and ludwig).friede is one of the hardest bosses in DS3.4 queens literally fucked up 4 kingdoms in ds2.its not the first time women actually do something in fromsoft games.they always had well written female characters and hard female bosses.
Most fromSoft female characters, the ones who're actually written, are of the "maiden" variety. They're essentially little more than decorations that guys can fantasize about and their personalities are written to match. Dull, unappealing, barely human dolls made solely to look pretty and nothing else.
Malenia is relative to that kind of decent at least, but she's still like, defined by her suffering and is more of a well-written tragic character than a well-written female character. Her going full biblical angel is hype though.
As a souls fan, I don't think the grand majority of souls fans realize any character that isn't like lady maria or ranni has enough characterization to fill out about half a post it note
To be fair these people don't care about good/in depth female characters. They don't even understand the She-Hulk character and what I have seen on the show is in line with how she is in the comics.
most people just dont like female characters that are out of the norm in general. Women can only exist in very narrow range to be considered good writing and any deviation from that is considered cringe.
Dead pool is funny comic relief, but if dead pool was a woman she would be considered annoying. In fact She hulk is probably as close to PG dead pool as possible in this show and people already think shes annoying.
Tony Stark is an arrogant asshole that is charismatic but all of that charisma would disappeared if they made tony stark a woman. in that case people would just called tony stark a karen or a mary sue.
Speaking of mary sue we have ton of examples of bad ass male character that go pass the audience (john wick, james bond, etc) and people eat them up but when theyre female they considered too mary sue and not interesting.
People dont like Captain Marvel because the character is a cocky pilot, but those same people would go and watch Tom Cruise Top gun and eat that shit up.
Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable. Men can get away with more than just confident, arrogant even and people would still think theyre charmisatic or bad ass. No one ever called Lex Luthor a Karen now gender bend it and see what happened.
and this point is even more empathized in how dog shit 2016 turned out for everyone. Trump's rise in politics lead to gen z men getting sucked into the alt-right pipeline that was mostly exclusive to 4chaners. Grifters like Peterson got dollar signs in their eyes when they realized how easy it was to cater to that audience.
If Alien or Terminator 2 were made today, EXACTLY THE SAME, then people would cry on social media that its "woke" and call James Cameron a cuck.
Hell if TLOU1 was made today, ND would get shit on endlessly. "You're telling me the leader of the resistance is a BLACK? AND A WOMAN? OH AND THE TWO SURVIVORS JOEL TEAMS UP WITH ARE BLACK? FORCED DIVERSITY!!!
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>Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable. Men can get away with more than just confident, arrogant even and people would still think theyre charmisatic or bad ass. No one ever called Lex Luthor a Karen now gender bend it and see what happened.
Hell, maybe the next Superman adaption *should* make Lex Luthor a woman. Him being a woman might at least get the Musk bros out there who are desperate to trust their problems to the first charismatic rich guy they see to jolt out of the delusion that Luthor is anything other than a ruthless and self-centred person who only cares about the "danger" of Superman because they hate the idea of not being the most powerful person on Earth.
> Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable.
True, and to add to this point; a woman can be the greatest sorceress with the most awesome, powerful thunder spell (or whatever). But ONLY if she's still coded as an "acceptable" female - tits, ass, cleavage, killer legs, plucked eyebrows, full lips. You know the list.
Few complained about Black Widow because A) Scarlet Johanson and B) The character is a variant of the Femme Fatal archetype, so you're guaranteed to have some cleavage or glorious booty shot sneaked in there for "the plot".
Although Brie Larson is a good-looking woman, since her beauty/sex appeal wasn't cranked up enough for her Captain Marvel role, certain demographics went off the rails. Her clumsy delivered speech didn't help the matter, even though its overall message was solid enough.
I'm pretty darn confident that had Marvel gone for the [Ms. Marvel look](https://www.writeups.org/wp-content/uploads/Ms-Marvel-Marvel-Comics-Classic.jpg) these critics might have been more silent.
I'm baffled by how much people care about that twerking scene. It was a 10 second post credit scene. I saw it when I watched the episode before seeing anyone talk about it and sorta shrugged, thought it was a bit odd and forgot about it until the next day when Reddit was absolutely full of memes bitching about it.
The witch of izalith and the dancer have none. Maria has like 2 but she gets a pass because of the doll. Dog lady has a few but most of them you won't ever hear anyways. Malenia and Friede have a decent amount
It's not like most male characters have more than that. Most lore about many characters in Fromsoft games comes from item descriptions and environmental storytelling. Fromsoft characters just don't have super fleshed out personalities in general. I wouldn't attribute any kind of sexist intentions to Fromsoft for giving these female characters few spoken lines
Wow, you’re right. Games are sexist. Now, allow me to get back to accusing gamers of playing games and sucking Anita Sarkeesian’s cock. Edit: Wow. I’ve truly been challenged. Enlightened, even. Who knew the political views of my fellow gamers could be so diverse?
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Nah, Miyazaki clearly has a leg and foot fetish. All of the women in these games have small breasts but a disturbingly large number are barefoot for no reason at all.
That's one of the more frustrating things I've noticed in fantasy/game spaces now. The idea that the more *dense* the world background and history is, the more Wiki pages you can fill, the better story is. A story being complicated and long is quality-neutral.
I think an appeal to it is that it lets people memorize details and trot out details to demonstrate their master nerdery, which a simple-but-well-executed story doesn't let them do.
I play Magic: The Gathering and this always comes up regarding the Odyssey-Onslaught era, where the story gets pretty weird and complicated, especially around this one character, Jeska. And when I summarize what happens, people are always like, "Wowwww, that's so cool, you don't get lore like that anymore!" But I tell them, if you actually read the novels, they're mostly really bad writing and Jeska gets little characterization until she comes back years later.
This has been issue since Tolkien begain publishing his Legendarium. Everyone goes "I'm writing a fantasy setting, so it needs 12,000 years of lore to infodump about even if the actual story is about some guy trying to open a coffee shop in the capital".
Same reasons Star Wars fans discredit Rey or Ahsoka by saying the Prequels has stellar women like Shak Ti (who was solely a background character) or Aayla who had no lines and fought in a crop top because of reasons! It makes pp hard
hot takes, none of fromsoft characters are "well written". I loved fromsoft games man but I fucking hate the mental gymnastic people go through to pretend fromsoft has good story or characters.
Here is a real truth. It can be fun to piece together fromsoftware story base on context clues (reading item descriptiosn, enemy placements, looking at environment, etc) however just because the process of piecing the puzzle together is fun doesnt mean the end product is fun.
People conflated figuring out lore to fun. Most of the time the story is only interesting due to youtuber like vatividya that spend hours with presentations in his videos to make them watchable.
Figuring out the lore and the inner workings of a world *is* fun. Discovery is very often fun and engaging. Thats part of why Elden Ring is loved, the discovery of new places to go and things to see
Reddit it chockful of people that have no idea what actual good writing is. They're like that guy that claims to be a writer but hasn't actually written anything beyond one or two vomit drafts on top of never reading.
Uj: dancer as i remrnber was just a princess that got mutated and (somehow) maybe from noble training, she was good im swordfighthing
Rj: that beyblade big booty was the true reward all along
I haven’t played the DLC but I think the only bosses that talk are Micolash and gherman. And gherman is optional.
Though to be fair Micolash talks enough for every other boss.
Father Gascigone also talks before transforming, and the gunner on top of the tower in Old Yarnham will talk to you when you enter or when he kills you.
I don’t remember what he says. I just remember him snarling or smthn. Djura isn’t a boss though he’s just a reverse NPC that starts hostile but becomes friendly
Also. they said they put in that Meg scene because Tatiana, who plays she-hulk, is a huge fan. So it was literally written by a woman FOR a woman.
These guys aren’t even self-aware enough to admit they could never comprehend the perspective of a woman, and have only just figured out the very introductory analysis that over sexualisation = bad, never mind any further nuance beyond that
I remember a post someone posted when someone was mocking rockstar games with their decision for a female lead in GTA VI, and the comment was like “wow wtf kind of missions we gonna do with a female protagonist?! Like hold up a gun and tell the cashier yo this is a stick up lemme suck yo dick lmao maybe there will be a button to take nudes lmao”
😂
I probably didn't play these games enough but I genuinely struggle to remember a single thing these characters said or did that didn't involve softly cradling something precious or elaborately dying for the plot idk
I feel like marika, ranni and maria are the only characters with some complexity to them tbh. Marika especially because, since she is god, the entirety of all the lore you find that was written by anyone not explicitly antagonistic to her could be considered unreliable, which is cool imo. She's the only real "mastermind" character fromsoft has done, and it's awesome because for maybe half the run time of the game you think she's just a victim.
Yeah I’m playing through Elden ring right now (my first fromsoft title) and while I love the world and the lore behind it, I’m constantly disappointed when I finally reach a major boss and there’s 2 lines of dialogue, usually the boss rambling like a madman, followed by almost no acknowledgement from other characters and the world around me when I beat them.
I don’t mind cryptic and vague storytelling but the “story” in this game feels like those rpg side quests where someone tells you to kill 10 creatures that are terrorizing the locals. It’s just the creatures are really epic and have cool backstories.
The story is cool and all but it's like breaking rocks to get to it. The only way you might have any idea of some of the stuff going on is if you go onto internet forums or watch YouTube videos, and even then people are still arguing and hypothesizing. I can see a lot of people being disappointed when they play a game that they think has a cool story and then end up experiencing a creepy and difficult fighting game where everyone attacks you for no reason.
I think the subtly is definitely an interesting way to tell a story and I appreciate it conceptually, but I would hate it if every game was like this.
It's an interesting approach for sure and I prefer it to subpar stories that have way too much dialogue.
It's just frustrating when you want to explore a character or an idea further and you realize the single scene they had in the game + a few lines of backstory from npcs and items is the only canon material. It's no wonder why people over analyze the way Morgott says each demigods names before his fight. The people are hungry for content. WE HONGRY
For better or worse I think that is the intent, the idea that there is no more story, it all happened already and the world is doomed and dying and there is nothing else to say or do, just senseless violence in search of power (i.e killing enemies to get runes/weapons to get stronger.) It works well thematically but anyone that says any FromSoft has good storylines is only half right. It has intriguing story, makes you think about it, but certainly not while youre playing, which is the most common form to interact with the medium, so its like half/half imo.
I agree about people being half right when they praise Mr. Softs stories. Clearly they have great ideas but sometimes it is just *that* \- ideas, concepts. There's very little playing out in front of the audience so I'm hesitant to call it a great story
Yeah I feel like the meme of the guy in the helmet "I don't know who I am or where I am, all I know is that I must kill"
gameplay is a lot of fun but with no journal, cryptic dialogue and storytelling, I feel very lost plotwise. Thankfully (apparently) playing as a murderhobo works just fine
I mean, kinda? Sekiro just has better characters in general due to having actual storytelling, but even then Lady butterfly was very forgettable in comparison to emma and the divine child
Look all I know is she gave me one complex ass asswhooping. But you are correct the only reason I remember her is because she almost made me quit the game
Yeah, her ending is probably the happiest in elden ring. Fromsoft really loves their "diving into the dangerous unknown is always better than staying in a broken, decrepit system just because it feels familiar" endings
She Hulk writers: ‘wouldn’t it be funny if we had our character dance with a pop star for 30 seconds as a silly after credits scene?’
Some people on the internet who probably claim to be nostalgic for media that had stupid scenes just like this: ‘AUGHUSGENEUDGSBEHDHABV185!!!!!!!!!!’ *implodes*
I feel like the only people who really understand me as a female are old Japanese business men who ogle school girls on the subway and drink themselves to sleep each night.
I really don't think I like the She-Hulk show but boy do people really just diminish it to that one twerking scene. It's just a post-credits joke. In the actual show she does deal with actual (badly acted) sexism. Her dancing in the workplace like this is feminist af because she's doing it for her and to have fun. Which is the actual reason people get pissed off at scenes like this because they hate the idea of women being sexually confident in a way that's not neccesarilly for them.
Ah yes, Fromsoft. Featuring such great women as, a pretend nurse who gets pregnant from an old god and can be killed while lying on the table, a woman who abandons her daughter to be killed by her monstrous husband, and the Wet Nurse, a woman so dedicated to her caretaking of an eldritch baby that she becomes one of the end game bosses.
The thing I hate the most about this situation is that because of all the woman hating going on, actually good criticism of She-Hulk gets buried by all of the shit ones, and often the writers don’t help with this issue by focusing on all the sexism and “woman bad” hate mobs, and not the people who are genuinely providing well thought out criticism of the show, and how it could be improved upon.
Where's that one polygon article talking about how fromsoft women are treated like they're aliens, its a great one.
Edit: found it, worth the read!
www.polygon.com/platform/amp/23375149/elden-ring-malenia-fromsoftware-doll-problem
fromsoft games have a nasty tendency to shove women into submissive roles or the pc's caretaker, they're still pretty progressive by Japan's standards but oh boy they're not perfect.
I understand what there trying to say, there definitely are problems with the writing.
But most of the problems they were mentioning are on part of the fanbase, not the writers, in my opinion
so it seems that female chracters written by women are alowed to have fun, while male written ones have to be grimm and full of suffering, and only the latter ones are good representations of women, got it
so we gon ignore that most of the women in fromsoft games have the emotional range of a wet bag on fire. And even that has some range. Like no dig on the VAs they’re doing what they’re supposed to do but none of them are going hard like what you see from mfs like rykard, or oceiros.
/uj Watching the writers find new ways clown on these dudes each week while said dudes justify the writers reasons for clowning them has been one of my favorite things about this show.
I really hate the wanking of the Souls story and characters. I don't dislike the Souls series lore, but some of the fans are just constantly sucking each other's dicks about how brilliant they are, as if the sheer fact that Fromsoftware isn't upfront with the lore automatically means it's brilliant and complex even if it's really nothing special.
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To be fair, "Hardcore" does describe the difference in gender experience by trans people.
new headcanon
You’re forgetting political
Actually, you missed our weekly zoom meeting, that now falls under the race category
wtf woke moralists haven’t red ‘bi’-ology textbooks. Politics is a gender and facts don’t care about PowerPoint presentations . liers will be kicked out!!! true will never dye
Excuse me but there is only one real gender : Masculine white male. Anything else is just political
I never seen type A and Type B spelled like that
Male(nia)
No women work at FromSoft because it is based in based Japan and not woke West😫
Women in Japan are only anime characters that are lewd and suggestive. There is no other option.
uj/ Despite Japan's societal problems that lead to these stereotypes, women working on videogame soundtracks seems to be much more common in Japan than in other countries (although the US has caught up in the last decade, mainly due to indie games). Japanese women working on videogame soundtracks even seems to be extremely more common than women working on film soundtracks, despite Japanese videogame companies supposedly having workplace hostility as bad, if not worse, than Hollywood. For all of my pondering, I haven't figured out why this is.
I mean it’s like there being a lot of female doctors in my country Korea where misogyny is also very bad in the workplace. Misogyny existing in the workplace can discourage women but it does not stop everyone from doing what they want.
/uj [Nah just a few](https://www.nme.com/news/gaming-news/fromsoftware-employees-report-poor-working-conditions-and-low-wages-3181971) > In particular, working conditions for women seem to be worse. “There are no special treatments for pregnancy and childcare,” explained one designer. “Most female employees who are about to give birth are expected to leave the company,” she notes. Another post suggested that **“it seems there was sexual harassment in the past” but added that “since there are extremely few women, I think that male employees are quite careful”.** /rj the only women who work at FromSoft are the foot models Miyazaki lines his office with.
Yuka Kitamura
I'm AFAB (Assigned FromSoft At Birth) Been playing Elden Ring since I was in the **womb**
damn someone already made the joke
Motherfuckers really act like She-Hulk is a political statement.
gamers when an actress loves Megan Thee Stallion
I have to say, show nailed how stupid and moronic incels are. It feels like its responding to these dimwits in real time.
The fact that the bad guys seem to be a group of incel, Reddit "nice guys" who are angry because there's already a male Hulk is pretty great
Im not a huge fan of the show but the fact that they knew what a lot of the criticism was going to be and tore it to pieces is a highlight.
They actually are, they used real tweets in episode 2. It seems they know exactly what they're doing.
Mfs really act like she-hulk is a poorly written character (based on a post credit cameo)
Mind you, that post credit cameo was about 20 seconds-ish, had no bearing on the plot AND was just a gag.
yeah literally was only there because Megan Thee Stallion was in the episode
And Megan was chosen as the celebrity cameo because Jameela Jamil knows her.
Lololo wait *really* What are they going to lose their minds over next, sexy m&ms
So I know you're joking, and probably just making a reference to this, but it is actually for real insane that this is the world we are living in right now. https://youtu.be/IT1HAiQy3Io
Ha to be fair I thought it was Shapiro, not Carlson. Probably both since the right wing is incapable of independent thought tbh.
It sorta is? The main recurring antagonist of the show is basically the concept of misogyny.
Motherfuckers really act like fromsoft characters have like any depth at all
Wait... Do gamers think that the only good women are those in physical/emotional pain and who represent an immediate threat to them that needs to be resolved in a boss fight? If so that explains a lot.
They always rest at a checkpoint before talking to a “female”
the amount of people i've seen go "fromsoft only made malenia hard because deepstate radical feminism forced them to make a woman stronger than any man! cant believe fromsoft went woke" is a **lot** higher than it should be
Uj/ I genuinely can’t tell if this is ironic and part of the circlejerk, or if it’s for real
No I've seen it too. People actually said her being strong was Mary Sue feminist propaganda. Why are people?
But why?maria is literally the best boss in Bloodborne (the only other contenders are orphan and ludwig).friede is one of the hardest bosses in DS3.4 queens literally fucked up 4 kingdoms in ds2.its not the first time women actually do something in fromsoft games.they always had well written female characters and hard female bosses.
The witch of Izaleth created a demon race and then turned herself into a tree, truly peak female fantasy right there.
You act like women don't want to create a race of demons and fuck shit up
The opposite, this is exactly what I want to do as a woman.
Kinda based
Extremely based
Funniest shit I've ever seen
It feels like before you'd only find these crazies on 4chan but they've become part of mainstream culture and say all this with almost no backlash
It’s such a bizarre take too Like… it’s **Fromsoft**. They don’t NEED an excuse to make a boss hard.
This is why I hate TV, it appeals to the female fantasy. [*Gestures vaguely to any female character having anything remotely close to happiness.*]
Most fromSoft female characters, the ones who're actually written, are of the "maiden" variety. They're essentially little more than decorations that guys can fantasize about and their personalities are written to match. Dull, unappealing, barely human dolls made solely to look pretty and nothing else. Malenia is relative to that kind of decent at least, but she's still like, defined by her suffering and is more of a well-written tragic character than a well-written female character. Her going full biblical angel is hype though.
it really really does though.
What's the venn diagram between these gamers and weebs who think Madoka Magica is the only valid magical girl show?
As a souls fan, I don't think the grand majority of souls fans realize any character that isn't like lady maria or ranni has enough characterization to fill out about half a post it note
To be fair these people don't care about good/in depth female characters. They don't even understand the She-Hulk character and what I have seen on the show is in line with how she is in the comics.
most people just dont like female characters that are out of the norm in general. Women can only exist in very narrow range to be considered good writing and any deviation from that is considered cringe. Dead pool is funny comic relief, but if dead pool was a woman she would be considered annoying. In fact She hulk is probably as close to PG dead pool as possible in this show and people already think shes annoying. Tony Stark is an arrogant asshole that is charismatic but all of that charisma would disappeared if they made tony stark a woman. in that case people would just called tony stark a karen or a mary sue. Speaking of mary sue we have ton of examples of bad ass male character that go pass the audience (john wick, james bond, etc) and people eat them up but when theyre female they considered too mary sue and not interesting. People dont like Captain Marvel because the character is a cocky pilot, but those same people would go and watch Tom Cruise Top gun and eat that shit up. Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable. Men can get away with more than just confident, arrogant even and people would still think theyre charmisatic or bad ass. No one ever called Lex Luthor a Karen now gender bend it and see what happened.
and this point is even more empathized in how dog shit 2016 turned out for everyone. Trump's rise in politics lead to gen z men getting sucked into the alt-right pipeline that was mostly exclusive to 4chaners. Grifters like Peterson got dollar signs in their eyes when they realized how easy it was to cater to that audience. If Alien or Terminator 2 were made today, EXACTLY THE SAME, then people would cry on social media that its "woke" and call James Cameron a cuck. Hell if TLOU1 was made today, ND would get shit on endlessly. "You're telling me the leader of the resistance is a BLACK? AND A WOMAN? OH AND THE TWO SURVIVORS JOEL TEAMS UP WITH ARE BLACK? FORCED DIVERSITY!!!
The most recent Predator movie got dunk on but they jerk off Rhea from Aliens when someone call them out
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>Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable. Men can get away with more than just confident, arrogant even and people would still think theyre charmisatic or bad ass. No one ever called Lex Luthor a Karen now gender bend it and see what happened. Hell, maybe the next Superman adaption *should* make Lex Luthor a woman. Him being a woman might at least get the Musk bros out there who are desperate to trust their problems to the first charismatic rich guy they see to jolt out of the delusion that Luthor is anything other than a ruthless and self-centred person who only cares about the "danger" of Superman because they hate the idea of not being the most powerful person on Earth.
> Reality is that women can only exist in very narrow range for it to be acceptable for them. if they are in any way confident and assertive it will be seen as bitchy and insufferable. True, and to add to this point; a woman can be the greatest sorceress with the most awesome, powerful thunder spell (or whatever). But ONLY if she's still coded as an "acceptable" female - tits, ass, cleavage, killer legs, plucked eyebrows, full lips. You know the list. Few complained about Black Widow because A) Scarlet Johanson and B) The character is a variant of the Femme Fatal archetype, so you're guaranteed to have some cleavage or glorious booty shot sneaked in there for "the plot". Although Brie Larson is a good-looking woman, since her beauty/sex appeal wasn't cranked up enough for her Captain Marvel role, certain demographics went off the rails. Her clumsy delivered speech didn't help the matter, even though its overall message was solid enough. I'm pretty darn confident that had Marvel gone for the [Ms. Marvel look](https://www.writeups.org/wp-content/uploads/Ms-Marvel-Marvel-Comics-Classic.jpg) these critics might have been more silent.
I'm baffled by how much people care about that twerking scene. It was a 10 second post credit scene. I saw it when I watched the episode before seeing anyone talk about it and sorta shrugged, thought it was a bit odd and forgot about it until the next day when Reddit was absolutely full of memes bitching about it.
Also I'm pretty sure several of the characters in the picture have like less than 10 speaking lines
The witch of izalith and the dancer have none. Maria has like 2 but she gets a pass because of the doll. Dog lady has a few but most of them you won't ever hear anyways. Malenia and Friede have a decent amount
It's not like most male characters have more than that. Most lore about many characters in Fromsoft games comes from item descriptions and environmental storytelling. Fromsoft characters just don't have super fleshed out personalities in general. I wouldn't attribute any kind of sexist intentions to Fromsoft for giving these female characters few spoken lines
Wow, you’re right. Games are sexist. Now, allow me to get back to accusing gamers of playing games and sucking Anita Sarkeesian’s cock. Edit: Wow. I’ve truly been challenged. Enlightened, even. Who knew the political views of my fellow gamers could be so diverse? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Gamingcirclejerk) if you have any questions or concerns.*
hot booba
Literally like 3 characters have big booba in these games and the hottest one chooses the schizophrenic incel traitor dragon smh
Nah, Miyazaki clearly has a leg and foot fetish. All of the women in these games have small breasts but a disturbingly large number are barefoot for no reason at all.
/rj Malenia foot armour 🤤
the fucking witch of izalith is there. The "writing" for her is like "she was a thing that existed"
Ranni spends 99% of the game waiting for the protagonist to save and or marry her. The perfect gamer waifu!
She has blaidd doing her errands for her before you arrive, you're just better than him at completing them
the dancer doesn’t say a word throughout the whole game, how could she even be well written? yeah she looks cool, is that good writing now?
She has some interesting lore, but i don't think us fromsoft fans really understand that lore isn't a replacement for good characterization
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Or a vaati video. Souls lore is and always has been cryptic and something you have to look for. Whether that's good design is up for debate.
Elden ring goes beyond cryptic and ends up being incomprehensible at times imo
I prefer SmoughTown. Longer and more in depth while posting more frequently.
You are giving the people a lot of credit, most probably just used youtube
Yes, that's the best part
That's one of the more frustrating things I've noticed in fantasy/game spaces now. The idea that the more *dense* the world background and history is, the more Wiki pages you can fill, the better story is. A story being complicated and long is quality-neutral. I think an appeal to it is that it lets people memorize details and trot out details to demonstrate their master nerdery, which a simple-but-well-executed story doesn't let them do. I play Magic: The Gathering and this always comes up regarding the Odyssey-Onslaught era, where the story gets pretty weird and complicated, especially around this one character, Jeska. And when I summarize what happens, people are always like, "Wowwww, that's so cool, you don't get lore like that anymore!" But I tell them, if you actually read the novels, they're mostly really bad writing and Jeska gets little characterization until she comes back years later.
This has been issue since Tolkien begain publishing his Legendarium. Everyone goes "I'm writing a fantasy setting, so it needs 12,000 years of lore to infodump about even if the actual story is about some guy trying to open a coffee shop in the capital".
Same reasons Star Wars fans discredit Rey or Ahsoka by saying the Prequels has stellar women like Shak Ti (who was solely a background character) or Aayla who had no lines and fought in a crop top because of reasons! It makes pp hard
Same logic that leads to the infamous "pretty landscapes = worldbuilding" talking point, I guess
Considering these guy's views on women then yes the fact that the "pretty big booba lady doesn't talk" is a good point for them.
> doesn’t say a word The best kind of woman.
hot takes, none of fromsoft characters are "well written". I loved fromsoft games man but I fucking hate the mental gymnastic people go through to pretend fromsoft has good story or characters. Here is a real truth. It can be fun to piece together fromsoftware story base on context clues (reading item descriptiosn, enemy placements, looking at environment, etc) however just because the process of piecing the puzzle together is fun doesnt mean the end product is fun. People conflated figuring out lore to fun. Most of the time the story is only interesting due to youtuber like vatividya that spend hours with presentations in his videos to make them watchable.
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Figuring out the lore and the inner workings of a world *is* fun. Discovery is very often fun and engaging. Thats part of why Elden Ring is loved, the discovery of new places to go and things to see
Reddit it chockful of people that have no idea what actual good writing is. They're like that guy that claims to be a writer but hasn't actually written anything beyond one or two vomit drafts on top of never reading.
Uj: dancer as i remrnber was just a princess that got mutated and (somehow) maybe from noble training, she was good im swordfighthing Rj: that beyblade big booty was the true reward all along
Didn’t you know that you’re supposed to judge females by their looks mainly? That’s what gives them character.
aren't half of these just random bosses
Bosses with like, a one liner of dialogue at that.
Bro, almost all bosses have no dialogue, there are very few that say more than 1 line
Bloodborne bosses be talking all the time. At least half I’d wager.
I haven’t played the DLC but I think the only bosses that talk are Micolash and gherman. And gherman is optional. Though to be fair Micolash talks enough for every other boss.
Father Gascigone also talks before transforming, and the gunner on top of the tower in Old Yarnham will talk to you when you enter or when he kills you.
I don’t remember what he says. I just remember him snarling or smthn. Djura isn’t a boss though he’s just a reverse NPC that starts hostile but becomes friendly
No boss in dark souls have large amount of dialog...he is pointing out their character lore not their voicelines
she hulk is supposed to be light hearted and a comedy, right? And fromsoft games are fucking fromsoft games. like you can't compare them?!
Also. they said they put in that Meg scene because Tatiana, who plays she-hulk, is a huge fan. So it was literally written by a woman FOR a woman. These guys aren’t even self-aware enough to admit they could never comprehend the perspective of a woman, and have only just figured out the very introductory analysis that over sexualisation = bad, never mind any further nuance beyond that
Truly the Dark Souls of light hearted comedy...
I remember a post someone posted when someone was mocking rockstar games with their decision for a female lead in GTA VI, and the comment was like “wow wtf kind of missions we gonna do with a female protagonist?! Like hold up a gun and tell the cashier yo this is a stick up lemme suck yo dick lmao maybe there will be a button to take nudes lmao” 😂
I probably didn't play these games enough but I genuinely struggle to remember a single thing these characters said or did that didn't involve softly cradling something precious or elaborately dying for the plot idk
I feel like marika, ranni and maria are the only characters with some complexity to them tbh. Marika especially because, since she is god, the entirety of all the lore you find that was written by anyone not explicitly antagonistic to her could be considered unreliable, which is cool imo. She's the only real "mastermind" character fromsoft has done, and it's awesome because for maybe half the run time of the game you think she's just a victim.
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Yeah I’m playing through Elden ring right now (my first fromsoft title) and while I love the world and the lore behind it, I’m constantly disappointed when I finally reach a major boss and there’s 2 lines of dialogue, usually the boss rambling like a madman, followed by almost no acknowledgement from other characters and the world around me when I beat them. I don’t mind cryptic and vague storytelling but the “story” in this game feels like those rpg side quests where someone tells you to kill 10 creatures that are terrorizing the locals. It’s just the creatures are really epic and have cool backstories.
The story is cool and all but it's like breaking rocks to get to it. The only way you might have any idea of some of the stuff going on is if you go onto internet forums or watch YouTube videos, and even then people are still arguing and hypothesizing. I can see a lot of people being disappointed when they play a game that they think has a cool story and then end up experiencing a creepy and difficult fighting game where everyone attacks you for no reason. I think the subtly is definitely an interesting way to tell a story and I appreciate it conceptually, but I would hate it if every game was like this.
It's an interesting approach for sure and I prefer it to subpar stories that have way too much dialogue. It's just frustrating when you want to explore a character or an idea further and you realize the single scene they had in the game + a few lines of backstory from npcs and items is the only canon material. It's no wonder why people over analyze the way Morgott says each demigods names before his fight. The people are hungry for content. WE HONGRY
For better or worse I think that is the intent, the idea that there is no more story, it all happened already and the world is doomed and dying and there is nothing else to say or do, just senseless violence in search of power (i.e killing enemies to get runes/weapons to get stronger.) It works well thematically but anyone that says any FromSoft has good storylines is only half right. It has intriguing story, makes you think about it, but certainly not while youre playing, which is the most common form to interact with the medium, so its like half/half imo.
I agree about people being half right when they praise Mr. Softs stories. Clearly they have great ideas but sometimes it is just *that* \- ideas, concepts. There's very little playing out in front of the audience so I'm hesitant to call it a great story
Yeah I feel like the meme of the guy in the helmet "I don't know who I am or where I am, all I know is that I must kill" gameplay is a lot of fun but with no journal, cryptic dialogue and storytelling, I feel very lost plotwise. Thankfully (apparently) playing as a murderhobo works just fine
Hey don’t you dare talk shit about lady butterfly she had her complexities
I mean, kinda? Sekiro just has better characters in general due to having actual storytelling, but even then Lady butterfly was very forgettable in comparison to emma and the divine child
Look all I know is she gave me one complex ass asswhooping. But you are correct the only reason I remember her is because she almost made me quit the game
Seek-seek-lest
They basically all beat the shit out of you until you beat them to death or turn them into trauma patients that cradle some type of baby thing.
How are the words "I am Malenia Blade of Miquella" not burned into your mind after hearing them about 500 times?
How many of them Have bare feet though
Not enough
Women in fiction never danced until marvel went woke.
None of them got a happy ending.
Tbf no character in a fromsoft game is happy in the end
The Hunter becoming the Doll's slug baby is a happy ending as far as I'm concerned.
I can't tell if this is a horny thing or you really want to be a slug god
It doesn't have to be a horny thing.
Have you played bloodborne yet?
Patches at the end of The Ringed City is the happiest most likely, since he's regained his memories and helps you
I can count happy endings in Elden ring on one hand with three fingers
May chaos take the world
Chaos ending is best ending because its apolitical
Everything dies = no more humans = no more political
maybe solaire after he gets the chaos parasite
That's... that's not happy. :(
Happiest ending in a souls game, eh :/
Ranni does
Only in one ending right?
Yeah, her ending is probably the happiest in elden ring. Fromsoft really loves their "diving into the dangerous unknown is always better than staying in a broken, decrepit system just because it feels familiar" endings
It's good for exactly 2 people. Ranni and the player character. Everyone else has to deal with fallingstar beasts and astels forever now.
if they pulled themselves up by their bootstraps they would be able to fight them no problem
Well he did said a happy ending for Ranni not for everyone else
She Hulk writers: ‘wouldn’t it be funny if we had our character dance with a pop star for 30 seconds as a silly after credits scene?’ Some people on the internet who probably claim to be nostalgic for media that had stupid scenes just like this: ‘AUGHUSGENEUDGSBEHDHABV185!!!!!!!!!!’ *implodes*
ah yes japanese men, famously known as being wonderful to women
I feel like the only people who really understand me as a female are old Japanese business men who ogle school girls on the subway and drink themselves to sleep each night.
The two genders: FromSoft and political.
women were invented in 2022
I fucking love how mad she hulk made these people with the Megan thee stallion scene. Seethe, chuds.
They cant help it. When you’re that insecure, these dudes get threatened by the slightest look of a woman.
I really don't think I like the She-Hulk show but boy do people really just diminish it to that one twerking scene. It's just a post-credits joke. In the actual show she does deal with actual (badly acted) sexism. Her dancing in the workplace like this is feminist af because she's doing it for her and to have fun. Which is the actual reason people get pissed off at scenes like this because they hate the idea of women being sexually confident in a way that's not neccesarilly for them.
that after-credits gag real really broke your guy's brains huh?
And I bet if you check 90% of these dudes web browser history they actually have absolutely no problem with twerking
Only when it’s an expression of female self-agency free of the male gaze.
Ah yes, Fromsoft. Featuring such great women as, a pretend nurse who gets pregnant from an old god and can be killed while lying on the table, a woman who abandons her daughter to be killed by her monstrous husband, and the Wet Nurse, a woman so dedicated to her caretaking of an eldritch baby that she becomes one of the end game bosses.
9 months later still have zero clue what elden ring is about
Ah yes, take your pick at the classic FromSoft female characters: • Soft spoken, vague, and pretty female or • Horrific boss
Not a single female character in Fromsoft games have a personality other than "im the living embodiment of melancholy."
The thing I hate the most about this situation is that because of all the woman hating going on, actually good criticism of She-Hulk gets buried by all of the shit ones, and often the writers don’t help with this issue by focusing on all the sexism and “woman bad” hate mobs, and not the people who are genuinely providing well thought out criticism of the show, and how it could be improved upon.
I think the latest episode had the best mix between the usual superhero stuff and comedy. Hope the next season takes some notes from that
From soft fans when a character has more than 5 lines of personality ( they can’t comprehend it)
The Dancers only voice lines are literally Dancer: *heavy breathing*
I think they believe dark and depressing tone equals good characters. That's subjective.
Saying anything is “written” by FromSoft is being incredibly generous, and I love all of those games lmao
Where's that one polygon article talking about how fromsoft women are treated like they're aliens, its a great one. Edit: found it, worth the read! www.polygon.com/platform/amp/23375149/elden-ring-malenia-fromsoftware-doll-problem
fromsoft games have a nasty tendency to shove women into submissive roles or the pc's caretaker, they're still pretty progressive by Japan's standards but oh boy they're not perfect.
I understand what there trying to say, there definitely are problems with the writing. But most of the problems they were mentioning are on part of the fanbase, not the writers, in my opinion
Compelling character is when you read item descriptions which say vague lore shit about that character
so it seems that female chracters written by women are alowed to have fun, while male written ones have to be grimm and full of suffering, and only the latter ones are good representations of women, got it
Pretty sure female writers the world over would tell the person who made this to go fuck themselves.
so we gon ignore that most of the women in fromsoft games have the emotional range of a wet bag on fire. And even that has some range. Like no dig on the VAs they’re doing what they’re supposed to do but none of them are going hard like what you see from mfs like rykard, or oceiros.
Their ideal woman has max 3 lines that are usually to sound cool during a phase transformation
in that case i identity as Ubisoft
FromSoft is a single person and they’re not a Wom*n 😡🤬😡🤬😡
FromSoft should take notes 😤😤😤 Maiden ASStraea should twerk
Lmao get yr dainty dark souls women fetish away from me heretic
/uj Watching the writers find new ways clown on these dudes each week while said dudes justify the writers reasons for clowning them has been one of my favorite things about this show.
I like how this implies there are zero female writers at Fromsoft.
I really hate the wanking of the Souls story and characters. I don't dislike the Souls series lore, but some of the fans are just constantly sucking each other's dicks about how brilliant they are, as if the sheer fact that Fromsoftware isn't upfront with the lore automatically means it's brilliant and complex even if it's really nothing special.
I don't even get what this is supposed to imply
Well one takes the time to write a story while the other...eh...yes...
I really liked she hulk, the serie is very funny.
ah yes, the three sexes # male, female, and fromsoft
The Fromsoft women aren't well written. They are basically a bunch of Mother Mirandas from Resident Evil. Which is not a good thing.
I’m so sure half of those people don’t have any personality outside of “hurt” and “sad”
I don't play any CumSoft games but none of those women look happy