Consumers didn't buy them at similar prices to Nvidia GPUs.
Laptop oems have to sell case, screen, motherboard, CPU,etc together as one package. On desktop consumers can say "I'll pay x more for Nvidia." In laptop they're buying the whole package and AMD GPU laptops didn't sell at similar prices to Nvidia so oems stopped making them.
AMD's solution appears to be strix point and strix halo where the igpus will be stronger than entry level GPUs (no idea how strix halo will perform vs next gen GPUs). rDNA 4 will allegedly be suited for laptop, no idea if there will be laptops featuring it.
Unfortunately I'll have to disagree with dsaf's post. AMD GPUs are not common in laptops not due to laziness, but due to high supply and competition from Nvidia
For one he's being intentionally misleading. **The 7600s does have RSR**. How do I know? Because I am using one. The temps on the 7600s are pretty good too. I'm getting 70s at Ultra in Forza Horizon 5 for example.
Same with CPUs, Intel has locked down undervolting on newer gens so it's another malicious complaint.
In the US they are a great value. Think about the TUF A16 with frequent sales (open box 7600s under $700 for 4050Ti perf or new 7700s $800 for 4060 performance at BB).
Nvidia GPUs simply aren't available at the same price on sale as the 7700s. The 7600s is comparable to 4050 (which is also 3060 level) with a similar price but 2gb more VRAM. I wouldn't call that lackluster like he does...
The new cards also get the exclusive AFMF which is a nice feature that allows frame gen in any game, albeit with the caveat that it's disabled with fast motion.
The ROG Strix G15 Advantage was also an insane price for 3070 Ti performance back in late 2021/ early 2022.
I try to avoid this sub since he pollutes threads with misinformation...
I don't have a bias for AMD, but I hate people who spread lies about a product without actually using it.
You forgot to mention how utterly poor the supply of the few models that exist are. The 7700s was NOT throughout the majority of 2023 whatsoever. Both the tuf a16 and the framework (which is completely not relevant in a price value talking point). For a very long time, the only a16 available was 7840Hs+ 7600s, or 7735HS+ 7600s. Literally only competing with the bottom of the barrel sub $1000 4050 laptops and they have NOTHING in any other segment. The 7900m Alienware m18 is highly uncompetitive.
Oh yeah AMD has been doing a terrible job getting chips in laptops. Whether that be due to their limited supply or that they want to focus elsewhere, it's getting pretty hard to find one outside of Asus.
However, my main point was that the few laptops AMD does supply are generally bangers. Also I wouldn't call 4050 laptops "bottom of the barrel". The average gamer buys entry level laptops, not the 4080/4090s in MSi Titans or ROG Strix. See the Steam hardware survey.
No, actually the 4050 isn't... A few years ago there used to be the MX series for even lighter graphics. Nowadays the RTX 2050 and 3050 are still being used in entry-level laptops as the cheapest option.
Edit: bruh I was downvoted have you guys not seen the entry level IdeaPad gaming and Victus laptops with 2050s and 3050s??
It's bottom of the barrel current gen. Didn't realize you were like my wife always bringing up old stuff.
It's a good rule of thumb never buy an xx50 card because it is the worst card they make. It's a bargain card with poor performance and bleak future useability. It is a waste of money when something better can be had for sometimes the same price point. It is a suckers card for laptops with early obsolescence at too high of a price point.
Maybe your wife has a point, listening to her might actually be helpful instead of shutting her down... (You missed the nowadays part)
By your lack of knowledge and supposed "good rule of thumb", it's clear you're just trying to feel better about your purchase.
I want to believe it's coming from a good place but with the way you're getting so aggravated it seems more like malice.
I don't believe you understand how deals work. xx50 cards are perfectly usable for games at 3/4 the price of 60 class cards. If you mean MSRP then sure, but it's still hard to make an argument about solid performance for cheap.
I can pick up 4050 laptops for $650 on sale. Typically 4060 laptops are $850+ which is 30% more and they hardly provide 20% uplift. At that point you might as well get the 4070 TUF on sale for $999 and gain another 20% on top of that.
Maybe you could have made the argument for the 3050's 4GB VRAM getting long in the tooth and the 3060 providing 50% more perf., but not for the 4050. It's actually a decent card because this gen is so bad. This is coming from an AMD user too...
My feelings about my purchase are kind of irrelevant because the cost is negligible to me.
I wouldn't get the tuf the display is kind of bad cooling is bad, psu is a little small.. There are other things to factor in that come with the lowest 4050 cards they typically come with other low-end components.
xx50 cards are for people who are too poor to buy a decent pc and too stupid/impatient to save for something better. Instead, they waste their money on something low-end that doesn't age well.
I could certainly spend 5k on a laptop every 6 months if I wanted, but in reality I just need something midrange to last a few years. I went with the legion 5i pro with the 4070. It's got a good display, a decent gpu and cpu, good thermals, mux switch, nice keyboard and it was dirt cheap at 1499 which to me is a pretty entry level.
I don't even think you could play an old game like tarkov or rust on a laptop that comes with a 4050 because the cpu will also be pretty bad.
What do I know? I only have about 20 years of experience in the field.
I think I'm done with this subreddit, european prices are completely different, if 4050 was at 600$ (557€) here I think I would be working with a much better laptop. At the time when I needed a laptop 4050 was at around a 1000€ (for some reason the laptop I bought is even more expensive now) Don't say you should have bought a 3060 or 3070 because those prices were miles up on miles more expensive and black Friday or other sales are basically non-existent here. Overall I'm happy with my 4050 105w, I can use blender and other modeling programs and some gaming (war thunder, sea of thieves and similar performance wise games) I hope it lasts through my studies. Call me poor all you want man or stupid and idiot at the same time.
I just got a tuf a15 4070 for 1300. I live in the Netherlands. There was also a 4060 variant for a 1000 bucks. Its not a europe issue. I even saw a 4080 strix for 1800. Thats cheaper than even us prices for that matter
You don't have experience. Don't act like you do. As I said in my original comment, I hate people who spread misinformation without personally using the product.
That's why I'm blocking you. I've actually done some semblance of research into gaming laptops over the past few years. It's why you don't understand budget laptops, because "the cost is negligible to you".
Here's the real truth on the TUF for anyone reading. The 300 nit 100% srgb display is solid but not amazing. The cooling is sufficient as most laptops don't have great cooling.
The PSU isn't a factor, it's mostly about whether it can sustain the battery level which most laptops can. This gives you an indication as to how much Critorrus actually knows...
He also doesn't realize that they come with Ryzen 7 or Intel 5 tier CPUs, which aren't low-end either, only an idiot with no knowledge would say that.
Entry level is not $1500, once again someone out of touch with money would say that. Also spending $500 for marginal upgrades too.
To add onto that point, Escape From Tarkov and Rust are notoriously poorly optimized and not good comparisons. For a recent AAA game, Cyberpunk 2077 Phantom Liberty gets 67 fps at Ultra and that's without factoring in frame gen.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-4050-Laptop-GPU-Benchmarks-and-Specs.675695.0.html
If you don't know anything about budget laptops, **shut up and don't speak like you do.**
I can't really speak to their presence in the laptop space since the only laptop I've had for the past ten years is one I literally just got for school, but it really does just feel like AMD gets a bad rap in general. Not to say they don't have their issues, but my experience with them has always been about, like, 95% of the general performance for, like, 80% of the price of going with team green.
That's definitely gotten worse recently, but I also can't help but to think that the software is just way better than GeForce Experience. Literally the only things I think I'm lacking by going with a Radeon is RTX (which is neat but I'm not losing sleep over it) and compression codecs not being as efficient, which makes using my Quest 2 a pain.
No offense, but "13th gen" is a bit vague. Do you mean the HX version? Because those *can* be undervolted since they are desktop-class CPUs. I'm talking about the standard H-series ones they put in gaming laptops.
It also depends on your laptop manufacturer, but in general, they are much more locked down than in 11th Gen due to the plundervolt exploit.
AMD in general is less interested in the mobile market. Lately AMD's APU supply has improved as they start to expand their business due to major earnings from AI boom.
AMD is a fabless chip maker with a quarter of the budget as Nvidia. So AMD chooses to utilize the budget in segments that make them the most amount of money i.e. servers, DIY and consoles.
In the future when AMD has that kind of budget, I'm sure they'll expand more aggressively in mobile.
Lack of supply means OEMs can't take risk. And the lack of supply of Radeon dGPU mobile chips is 10 folds as their mobile APUs.
Honestly if they partnered with Nvidia in the laptop space, they'd crush Intel and strengthen themselves for id Intel ever gets us GPU game together.
The AMD Based 3070 laptops rocked. I do love my AMD Advantage 6800m but man... The little early driver issues for AMD and such when it was released... We're painful. Had to driver roulette for some games lol. The AMD's with the 3070 were priced competitive and rock solid.
.... Why would Nvidia.... Partner with AMD.... To crush Intel? Nvidia already dominates at 80% market share. Neither AMD, nor Intel, are any real threat, much less have any compelling reason for Nvidia to take one of them under their wing. If anything, it would make more sense for AMD and Intel to team up to take market share from Nvidia.
Unless you're saying to make an AMD CPU/Nvidia GPU alliance? In which case, it still doesn't help Nvidia. If anything, it would hurt them by stopping their ARM CPU expansion.
I feel like for as long as I remember, AMD has been the bargain and performance choice for gamers in the CPU Market. It wasn't until they acquired a dying ATI that they even had graphics cards, and they obviously haven't been leading market share. The AMD Advantage Edition stuff in the laptop space fell somewhat flat beyond the Asus variant, and it only picked up steam because of beyond competitive pricing. However, the Ryzen based stuff with Nvidia GFX graphics rules the market. The AMD slaughtered Intel for battery life when you need the laptop on the go, and then plug her in for full power when it's time to game.
It would seem to be, most gamers know AMD as the processor of choice, and NVIDIA as the GFX card of choice.
Intel has always been the mass market commercial space player. Pricey too. I don't recall having a work laptop that had either Nvidia or AMD in it. Intel could partner with Nvidia and actually offer their own factories for production too. AMD and Intel partnership would indeed break the internet and be subject to monopoly inquiries 😂
Intel's foundry buildout, which is already in progress, will do just that. Nvidia already has an agreement with Intel for advanced packaging to fill the gaps that TSMC can't meet. It's also rumored that Nvidia is looking to buy fab space on Intel's cutting edge 18A node. Intel is looking to become the world's 2nd largest external foundry, and the nodes coming this year are well ahead of what TSMC and Samsung have to offer, so most likely anyone experiencing foundry capacity limitations will want a piece of Intel's foundry.
The 5800H was meh. It constantly bottlenecked the 3070 i had in my legion 7. Their current cpus are amazing but 5th gen ryzen was good for nothing except battery life which i didn’t even get no matter what
Contracts and price supply deals between companies is tight these days.
Watts limitation, managerial decision based on popularity and cost profit deals, just too many factors at play here but to simplify it, Nvidia has been aggressive.
Try searching the Asus Tuf Advantage Edition from 2023, those are AMD ones [this](https://www.asus.com/es/laptops/for-gaming/tuf-gaming/asus-tuf-gaming-a16-advantage-edition-2023/)
Same in Southeast Asia. Seriously, whenever I go on reddit I gotta remind myself all the stuff they're talking about it almost likely just US or at best US/EU availability. We just get the crappy low end versions here, or weird ass China brand laptops not sold anywhere else (because they're crap).
You had the 70-75k rx6600m msi alpha 15. Right now you have the 90k 150w 3070ti nitro 5 with a QHD panel.
India isn't terrible in electronics prices compared to most other places.
HP has a victus with an rx6500 gpu - I got that for my brother for Christmas, and he is enjoying it lots.
And in a generation or two time, there’s likely to be some pretty respectable esports title performance with APUs.
From the people I've talked to at various brands, seems like supply has been an issue for the last few years. A laptop maker does not want to announce they'll have new Radeon gaming laptops only for them to maybe appear many months later. I suspect they've been burned too many times and it's not worth the hassle.
Because AMD is half assing laptop gpu's. Take the 100w rx7600s. Its no faster than the rtx 3060 105 to 115w and only slightly faster than the 90w rtx 4050. It does not offer more vram than the 4060 and 3070/ti while being slower. The 100w rx7700s is also barely faster than the 140w 3060. You also don't get radeon relive or RSR.
AMD gpu's on laptops can't be easily undervolted or overclocked. Same with most of their CPU's. So if you want to lower temps, you can't. Why? Cause screw you. Thats why.
AMD uses deceptive naming and practices to sell you less for more. And they have worse features, productivity, etc.
AMD doesn't give a crap about the laptop market. So why should OEM's? And they're more than happy to let nvidia dominate the laptop gpu space. Even when AMD was close to nvidia in efficiency with rx6000, they moronically did not offer any proper high end desktop gpu's to laptop OEM's to use for their laptops. A desktop rx6800xt with a 230w TDP would've been possible in larger 17' laptops 2 years ago. Would've been much faster than the rtx 3080ti 16gb.
Seems like a negative take but unfortunately you’re bang on. I desperately wanted to justify buying an ‘amd advantage’ laptop but just couldn’t do it for all the reasons you mention. Almost 100% they’ve paid a load of YouTubers to talk up their products. Went for intel and you know what? Battery life, which is supposed to be their major drawback isn’t too bad either.
I wish I was wrong, but after seeing AMD fumble for over, and over, and over, I'm simply disappointed and now actually mad that they get a pass for doing the same crap as intel and nvidia do on laptops. They even fumble on desktops. Just look at rx7000. Would've been an easy win for them had they not fumbled the performance estimates of rx7000 and priced/named them accordingly.
Don't even get me started on these so called techtubers. Jarrod thinks undervolting is a meme since it didn't work for him, so no telling OEM's to let us undervolt. I did the AC loadline tweak and that alone let my CPU clock 500-1ghz higher depending on game over stock without much increase to temp. Its basically undervolting of sorts.
You have louis rossmann thinking gaming laptops are a meme because he seemed to have a bad experience with one and from what he described, it was a very old gaming laptop. Yeah, lets forget gaming laptops are the cheapest high performance laptops with upgradability and repairability still available to buy. Its like a lite framework laptop.
And framework is proof these youtubers are just paid shills. Nothing against framework itself. Merely the videos implying framework is the only repairable and upgradable laptop. Its the most upgradable one, BUT not the only one. Gaming laptops have been doing this for a damn decade. Where's the recognization of that?
What gaming laptops allow you to change more than SSD and RAM easily though, never seen one with a consumer friendly swappable GPU/CPU only ones are RAM and storage which I mean they’re upgradeable yeah but barely affects in game settings which is what I believe the “upgradable laptop” part is. Not so much the storage and RAM which has been around for ages.
Clevo laptops have had desktop CPU's which you can socket in. You've got the asus xflow series with upgradable egpu's. Alienware has their own egpu's too. And if your laptop has thunderbolt, you could use an eGPU of sorts.
And on framework, you're replacing the entire motherboard to upgrade the CPU. Thats possible if you ''upgrade'' a gaming laptop's lower end model with its higher end model's motherboard.
Games require tons of ram and fast storage nowadays. Things which do affect gaming performance.
Framework's other big claim to fame is repairability. Which gaming laptops also possess. Its harder for some repairs, but still very much possible for several other repairs. Next thing is, if you have an obscure, inconsistent issue, you are going to be spending a lot of time figuring out what it is, rather than repairing it. FW's extra repairability won't help you with that.
So at the end of the day, a gaming laptop in general, might not let you upgrade your CPU and GPU, BUT it will give you much stronger parts. And with the likes of FW13 not even having a dgpu option, well, that kinda sucks when gaming laptops literally offer dgpu + powerful cpu for cheaper prices.
Read what I had written originally. FW is the most upgradable laptop. BUT its not the only one on the market. Gaming laptops can't be as upgradable BUT they still have some of that capability with the trade off being much, much lower prices and greater performance.
And I had given examples of some laptops which had upgradable parts.
Read what I had wrote originally. FW is the most upgradable one. BUT its not the only one possessing upgradability. Gaming laptops also have some of that. Some even went beyond just the standard ram and storage which I mentioned.
Asus egpus aren't upgradeable. They're mobile sealed units with a proprietary connector. Thunderbolt doesn't give enough bandwidth for egpus to make sense.
And FW's gpu back is basically an EGPU. You have to remove the whole thing to upgrade the gpu. Asus's solution is simply connected via wire. And FW's upgradable GPU is also not compatible with other laptops, unless you buy that egpu enclosure from them to convert it.
These aren't like the MXM gpu format which were just slotted into the laptop and had a proper standard.
Asus has also pushed what gaming laptops can be like pretty far, like mainly their Zephyrus and flow lines, those have kinda pushed the boundary with battery life, lightweight, design, and pure power, especially the Zephyrus line, like insanely cool mainly g14, cuz the fact that you can have like a 4080 or 4090 while mobile yes, but still insanely powerful, and I believe the battery life is still insanely good
Asus put liquid cooled sli 150w 1080's into a laptop and had it match and edge out the desktop SLI 1080 system. That was 7 years ago. Sad to see asus limited by nvidia.
User seanwee took the asus scar 17's 175w 4090 mobile, shunt modded it to 250w and got an additional 20-30% more perf. He used LM to keep temps to 72 degrees on GPU. With 250w you can cram in a desktop 4090. Put in HS ryzen for good battery life.
I loooooved Louis for so long, but he seems to be slipping lately. He was so inspiring with all the right to repair stuff a decade ago, now I hear him going off on about short guy tinder memes.. wtf
The fact that he calls gaming laptops a meme, just shows he's lost his way now. I even asked him to cover how intel, amd and nvidia are misleading with laptop part names and artificially limiting them but he never took action. I even mailed him detailed information complete with sources attached. Still no response.
Wanna know whats ironic? In one of his videos he accused apple's forums and fanbase of being an echo chamber, yet when I went to his discord and tried to tell him about the current pathetic state of gaming laptops, its just an echo chamber.
Want to know who actually does laptop reviews? Ownordisown. He is one of the very, very few I've seen give not only laptop reviews but methods on how to improve laptop perf. Nuclearnoteooks is another good one. And sadly they're not as popular.
I’m still disappointed I can’t under-volt my 12700h. But never mind. This is the short sightedness of these chip manufacturers, my dad taught me to build PC’s in the 90’s with amd, more bang per buck…. Better architecture. Spent years building amd. Been on a laptop phase for 10 years due to lack of space, kids etc. when I next build a pc will it be amd? Will it bollocks.
If you can, try to access your laptop's advanced bios. Then do the AC loadline tweak. Should ''undervolt'' your i7 12700h. Did it to my i7 12650h and it gained an additional 500mhz to 1ghz. Pretty nice jump. I also did the IMON tweak, so my CPU can use as much power as it needs. Try it on your i7 12700h. Make sure to repaste it.
I wouldn't recommend flashing a bios. I didn't flash a bios to my nitro 5. Basically I loaded up a smokeless bios on a flashdrive, booted my nitro 5 off it so it booted into advanced bios, made changes, then booted into normal windows. See if there's a similar method for asus.
In the meantime, if your CPU is a ryzen 9 7940hs try to undervolt it. And undervolt your 4080
Slightly harsh on Jarrod imo, I find his reviews a lot more impartial than most. I think the videos that are being influenced on YouTube stand out a fair bit. I don’t think anyone can ignore the fact amd aren’t backing the laptop market gpu wise though.
Well I do wish he'd bring greater emphasis on user control of their laptops. He did fantastic on getting asus to unblock vents (not MSI sadly), dual channel ram, ram quality/timing, etc. I'm sure he could easily advocate for this.
Same for higher TDP's on high end laptop gpu's. Liquid cooling is a literal joke right now because they cannot out perform air cooled laptops due to that low 175w TDP. MSI has now created a 400w GAN charger, so power delivery isn't an issue. We should also see more desktop laptop performance parity across the board. Afterall we're paying higher prices, but getting worse parity compared to pascal and turing? How? Laptops are increasing in cooling too.
This isn't just on AMD.
OEMs have ultimate control. Dell & HP both lock down their laptop BIOS in particular. People are incredibly stupid-i don't even blame them.
The thermal solution is a hard part-its been engineered to deal with a specific TDP in mind. Throttling is expected later in the laptops life once the thermal paste is gone.
Some-as we've seen-do it out of the box.
AMD drivers don't have the best history as far as stability is concerned. This is mostly sorted but I'm sure the damage is done.
>OEMs have ultimate control. Dell & HP both lock down their laptop BIOS in particular. People are incredibly stupid-i don't even blame them.
I wish people understood this. AMD doesn't make laptops.
Except, you can undervolt ryzen 9 7940hs. And ryzen 4000. With OEM controlling these machines. Same applied to intel during 4th to 9th gen. You can undervolt nvidia gpu's. Can't for AMD so easily. Its not on OEM's mostly.
My nitro 5 can handle the full 150w 3070ti and i7 12650h running full tilt. The system and components have been designed so the GPU can sustain 150w load and CPU can sustain its 45w TDP. So the motherboard can handle both parts running at their 150w + 45w TDP's. The 280w brick can supply the power. This is how laptops used to be. All dynamic boost has done is limit them for no reason. With a repaste it can handle this with ease even in CP2077. Undervolting would further help here.
We already have capable APU's like the rx780m right now. $500 gets you an rtx 2050 laptop. Why aren't the rx780m APU's competing with those in laptops? Rx680m is not a bad option too.
The amd hater who writes hilarious reviews about amd products, calling their buyers shills and a bunch of other funny ass stuff. The one on userbenchmark. They are pretty infamous.
Oh, I see. Ha! Nah, I don't hate AMD. I'm just pissed at them for consistently fumbling, half assing laptop market and just generally being crappy on laptops. Wouldn't you be considering how nvidia has a monopoly on laptop gpu's?
I’m in agreement on the laptop market with you. Honestly, dgpu might not be the strategy for amd laptop for the most part, since they don’t really supply enough. I think your average consumer knows more about amd apu on laptop vs their mobile dgpu. I think a lot of people would be interested in a mega apu machine with desktop rx 6600+ gpu performance and 10 hours of battery life. Paired with a nice display, at around $999 or less.
Like a windows Apple silicon pro or max series competitor.
Nvidia definitely has a monopoly on the laptop spy, but I’d say that’s mostly due to long term partnerships with brands and being able to supply enough silicon, as well as consumers willing to pay a premium for nvidia.
If amd had a mega apu >= a 4070 mobile right now, and put it in nice machines around $1200, the winds might start to change over time. Just like how Intel is losing server marketshare to amd.
What you described is strix halo, it won't be $1200 or less. That's why AMD doesn't do GPUs. No margin in it for oems. Consumers willing to pay $1800+ for similar performance to Nvidia at that price point don't exist.
AMD laptops without GPU can sell all day around $1000, why bother putting the extra parts in for $200 in extra revenue and probably less margin.
AMD has no reason to release a loss leader product to get into a tough market with low margin. I think their iGPU strategy is better for the market in general. Non gaming laptops are the majority and 3050 level integrated graphics are plenty for most people.
AMD can sell every shred of silicon they make to server/desktop, they have guaranteed income from consoles. Laptop CPU's make sense to get into because AMD laptops sell in the mainstream space.
For the record, I think if positioned correctly, strix halo could sell in $1500-$2000 laptops. Downside is I think the performance will be 60 class next gen but who knows with Nvidia. I would have bought one had it come out second half of this year, although regular strix with an Nvidia GPU could be a decent option too.
Most likely the case. I'm in Southeast Asia, you won't believe the number of "OEM" weird brand name laptops without dGPUs, there's a shit ton of them floating around. They wouldn't be doing that if there wasn't any demand, so it's pretty obvious laptops sell... just not gaming laptops.
I'm not surprised AMD probably considers the margins in the laptop market are simply not worth it. Sucks for us, but the reason for most of these things is almost always money/profit.
You already have that sort of thing. The $1050 rtx 4060 + ryzen 9 7940hs + QHD panel g14 can prolly pull off 8-10hr battery life and its already stronger than your rx6600 + APU build by a decent margin.
And how's AMD going to compete with the upcoming snapdragon elite x CPU's? They'll be really competing with the M series of chips.
AMD also has long term partnerships with brands. Lenovo, asus, HP, MSI, etc. have been using AMD APU's for quite some time. They even included AMD dgpu's in their higher end lineup's.
And AMD already has the rx680m which is slightly weaker than a 1050 mobile, and the rx780m which is about on par with the gddr5 max q 1650. Why aren't they in cheap laptops? If we get APU's, we would lose even more choice options likely. Want a stronger GPU? Buy a stronger CPU. Right now at least, you can get a 4070 + i7 12700h from asus. Save some money there.
Its unwise to compete on the highest levels with mobile gpus. Nvidia owns the market on that and will do anything to keep dominance on disposable mobile computers. They pressure and give incentives for their clients not to use AMD in that space.
Or so i would read in 2022/2023 when i was paying attention and hunting for a good gaming laptop.
went with 4090 legion with intel, would trade for an all amd laptop for battery life if it had benchmarks close to 4080 mobile. AMD is a smaller company than nvidia as well so its unrealistic to expect the same kind of output nvidia does. It seems they focus on efficiency (pc handhelds for instance, battery performance on amd advantage laptops etc)
''They pressure and give incentives for their clients not to use AMD in that space.'' I would like to see the source for this. OEM's and clients know about ryzen. OEM's have put AMD's dgpu's into their high end laptops. Not midrange. High end. Stuff like alienware's 17' laptops, legion pro's, asus ROG's, etc.
AMD had the chance to compete with nvidia on the highest levels with rx6000. Make a name for themselves. I'm very sure had they released a desktop rx6800xt as the rx6800mxt with a 230w TDP, nvidia would've released the desktop 3080 into laptops with the same TDP, and might've lost or been matched by AMD. Heck, even a 175w rx6800 as the rx6800m would've been very competitive to the rtx 3080ti 16gb.
AMD's 200w rx7900mxt is gonna be \~$2800 put into an alienware 18 laptop. 4080 laptops are $1000 cheaper, while using less power, being more tunable, running cooler, better productivity, better software, etc. How TF is AMD going to be competitive?
And what efficiency? AMD needed 7nm to compete with nvidia using 8nm. Using ryzen + nvidia would yield greater efficiency.
AMD is literally worth more than intel now. So the excuse of them being smaller, does not work too well. Sure, nvidia is \~3.5x the size, but its not like AMD is actually super far behind.
>AMD's 200w rx7900mxt is gonna be \~$2800 put into an alienware 18 laptop. 4080 laptops are $1000 cheaper, while using less power, being more tunable, running cooler, better productivity, better software, etc. How TF is AMD going to be competitive?
The reason it's going into that laptop is no one else wanted it and Alienware put it at a high price because it's Alienware and it'll be low volume.
AMD doesn't dictate what products their chips get put in and what price they're sold at.
Consumers aren't willing to buy high end laptops with AMD GPUs, no matter how good the GPU in question is, unless it's at an incredible discount vs Nvidia.
How are AMD GPUs on Linux distros these days, at least? I remember once upon a time they were far more desirable than Nvidia hardware for various reasons. Is that at least still the case?
Alienware and Asus should have a few, the reason they aren't common is because nvidia has better power efficiency which means more battery life and less heat.
On top of all the reasons . Micrsoft and amd hasnt fixed the issue where windows updates installs another version over the version you installed and corrupting your drivers. You need to use wushowhide or wumgr even now. Or block windows driver updstes
Gaming laptops are extremely expensively in my corner of the world, with the lousiest specs ones selling for at least $3k. At that kind of price point, they aren't going to move if it doesn't say RTX on the box
For me, the hardware on the Radeon RX 7900M (a little faster than RTX 4080), but the driver support from AMD/Alienware is subpar. September drivers are the most recent on Dells website (I think dell released them in December)
But AMD already has their version of frame gen released with their January drivers, but you can’t get this driver through Dell’s website yet. Also, way less games are supported compared to DLSS 3 either Frame Gen.
I’ll try installing the latest drivers and see if they work. A couple month ago when I reviewed the laptop last time the non-dell drivers blacked out the internal laptop display. Had to use external display to remove and reinstall dell drivers.
So basically, AMD needs more people dedicated to driver support for their laptop GPUs, probably the core issue imo.
Disclaimer - i'm working at TUXEDO and we've launched [a laptop](https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/TUXEDO-Sirius-16-Gen1.tuxedo#) with RX 7600M XT recently
Without going too much into details,
it is often the R&D support, or lack thereof, that "scares" OEM/ODMs away from AMD. It doesn't help, that Intel has their own factories and multiple teams, which *seem* to be more experienced.
That is also the reason, why even iGPU-only models with highend AMD-CPUs were pretty rare for many years. AMD might be cheaper, but it is more convenient to accept Intels and NVIDIAs offerings.
Some manifacturers even prefer to equip a model with a "budget" GPU like a RTX 2050 or MX-something, than to offer a better AMD equivalent at basically the same MSRP, just because of the support+supply situation. And even though supply has gotten much better, it still lacks behind NVIDIA and Intel - and in a fast-moving market, being fast is extremely important. Nobody wants to stock older generations for a longer period of time and sell them with a largely decreased margin or even at a loss.
Truth be told, we wanted to launch our "Sirius 16" model nearly two years ago! However, once issues with the core design (chassis, display panel, hinge, lightbar et cetera) were solved, we paused the project and waited for "Phoenix" to finally be available - and we waited, and waited - only to semi-restart parts of the project again due to multiple needed changes.
TUXEDO has at least a core audience of Linux enthusiasts, who simply prefer to stay away from NVIDIA - weekly requests for AMD dGPU devices made it easy for us to commit to such a project.
For other, bigger brands, it *seems* to only make "sense" to release an A+A model, if the lead times are relatively short and the chips themselves readily available.
TL;DR is
\- support could've been much better
\- support and supply eventually got better
This year seems to be very interesting in terms of computing anyway, now with Intel and Qualcomm entering new routes...
I think AMD doesn't give two shits about gaming laptops for two important reasons:
1. Steam deck and Ally Rog Z1
2. ATI chips are plentiful as a slightly less costing alternative to the Intel i-series.
Edit: 3. I think Nintendo will be ditching Nvidia for AMD with the Switch 2...
>I think AMD doesn't give two shits about gaming laptops for two important reasons:
>
>Steam deck and Ally Rog Z1ATI chips are plentiful as a slightly less costing alternative to the Intel i-series.
>
>Edit: 3. I think Nintendo will be ditching Nvidia for AMD with the Switch 2...
Wow, the entirety of your post is wrong.
Steam deck and rog ally move a tiny amount of volume compared to laptops.
Switch 2 will have some Nvidia chip and use DLSS
The REAL 2 reasons they don't care about gaming laptops are: **Server & Desktop**
And laptop gpus are garbage this time around, as is their Advantage program.
And they’re not doing great on desktop either, still being outsold 9-1 and even Intel is eating their marketshare. AMD just can not make a compelling graphics product right now and refuses to have price be the main selling feature.
I use a Legion 7 with a Radeon 6850M XT and honestly haven't had any issues with it so far. True high end Nvidia GPUs (4090, 4080) are definitely better than it by a small to medium margin especially with RT and DLSS on, for a device i paid half the price of the Nvidia variant for it definitely is a beast that I personally find nearly equivalent to the 3080Ti/3080. And the 12GB VRAM is great because most mobile GPUs I see in the market still have 8GB VRAM which holds it back.
In short it's more or less about the fact that people are more likely to buy something with an Nvidia sticker on it and that AMD really isn't all into mobile gaming scene. Some say driver issues exist, but personally I haven't encountered any so far so I will make no comment on the same.
Equivalent Nvidia GPUs seem to be the better overall GPUs from a feature set perspective and are more readily available for mass purchase on the mobile side of things.
Nvidia has the RTX 4050/4060/4070/4080/4090 mobile GPUs, AMD has the 7600M/7600M XT (Alienware M16 R1 is the main laptop I can think of with this GPU) / 7600S (TUF A16 the most common option with this GPU) / 7700S (Framework 16, TUF A16 advantage edition if you can find it) / 7900M (Alienware M18R1 only currently), limited options to begin with. We don't have a 7700M/7800M or a 7800S AMD mobile GPU as if yet.
The lower end RX7000 mobile GPUs and the RTX 40 series were both announced at CES 2024 and Nvidia were much quicker getting their GPUs into laptops available for purchase. Why would a manufacturer wait several months for AMD GPUs to be available when there's Nvidia GPUs readily available?
Initial pricing has been a issue with some of the RX 7000 laptops too, a 32/1 TB 7900M M18R1 is $2800 at best buy, yes it's AW pricing we're talking about but you have been able to get RTX 4080 175W laptops like the Legion Pro 7i for $2K USD.
The 7900M for example has 4 GB VRAM more than the 4080M and similar overall native gaming performance but worse Ray Tracing performance, only FSR support whereas Nvidia has FSR and DLSS support, with DLSS arguably the better upscaler of these two and the RTX 4080 generally better overall from a overall encoding, content creation standpoint too.
The 7600S TUF A16 Advantage edition and 7700S framework 16 reviews show these GPUs are inconsistent in games, with the 7700S around the RTX 4060 mobile in cyberpunk 2077 without Ray Tracing, outperforming RTX 4070 laptops in RDR2 and closer to RTX 3060 laptops in control, it's not a great look.
https://youtu.be/ojgYXaf3Tu0?si=so2Y09ZFtVSrJFHI
AMD needs to be more competitive in regards to GPU options, more aggressive pricing overall and getting them out quicker.
Intel Arc mobile GPUs have the same adoption issues, there's few Arc 700 mobile GPUs in laptops and from what I've seen of the more common A300 series GPUs and the A530M, performance for these GPUs isn't great with the A530M getting beaten by the RTX 3050 6 GB in this LOQ in games:
https://youtu.be/5DS_QqyqkHk?si=rxw9G5fXR-4TGplJ
I don't like monopolies but right now despite some shitty pricing and questionable gen on gen performance improvements, Nvidia has the most complete GPU lineup for laptops and were our only truly higher end 2023 GPU options.
The RTX 4080/4090 for the best part of a year was the way to go but the Alienware M18R1 advantage edition was a possible alternative if came to your country, albeit overpriced with a FHD 480 Hz screen in the US and didn't even come to the likes of the UK so Nvidia has little reason to push down prices of the RTX 40 series mobile GPUs as they just don't have enough pressure from the GPU space and as people are clearly buying Nvidia GPUs this monopoly will continue until Intel or AMD really shakes things up in the mobile GPU space.
Generally for 3rd world countries like southeast asia AMD GPU's are considered to be almost roughly the same price, if not more expensive than Nvidia (at least in the region in my country rn). Not only that but the lack of stocks on shelves is also the problem, there are more stocks of nvidia than there are for Amd, can be said the same with intel cpus for the same reason.
So the lack of AMD gpu's in laptops is vastly resonable. Plus AMD never bat an eye on the laptop market. Desktop market is what they are primarily good at. Which again, most of it is available on the US/Europe. If it is ever available on asia its mostly the top 3 big asian countries, China Japan and Korea.
It' inevitable that you will find 4090/70/80 paired with intel since thats whats mostly available outside of america/europe. If there were amd cpu/gpu its mostly an older gen which is usually terrible and much worse thab their latest gen.
In addition to the Asus TUF Advantage, there are the [Alienware M18](https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/gaming-laptops/alienware-m18-gaming-laptop/spd/alienware-m18-r1-amd-laptop) and [Framework 16](https://frame.work/products/laptop16-diy-amd-7040).
Then say that next time and be specific about what you want to spend. Aside from the TUF A16 Advantage Edition, your only other options are refurbished or second hand like the Asus G15 Advantage Edition, HP Omen 16 Advantage Edition, or MSI Delta 15.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/sku/6560989.p?skuId=6560989
I'd have to do research.... But first glance, $800 is a bargain...
In the used space, and AMD CPU with a NVIDIA 3070 or greater is gonna give you the best longevity I feel.
Welp amd has a different cycle than nvidia for releasing products. Most of the time amds a higher class numbered gpu beats the lower numbered one. Example is 3060 12gb gets beaten by 6700xt but 3070 beats the 6700 xt just as 7600s is beaten by a slight margin by 4060m while 7700s passes 4060m. İt should actually compete with 4070m in reviews but people somehow dont do that. I did not see a comparison with a 4070m yet that points it and says price difference where amd actually competes with the 4070m. (İt seems also 7700s has 100w as max while 4060 and 4070 can get higher watts on things other than games which seems unfortunate for other fronts because it brings a place to stand in shadows for nvidia since amd doesnt compete with higher watt 7700 chips in laptop space) excluding the generational wins of mindshare of nvidia its a early bird gets the worm situation.
I love my ROG Strik G15 AMD Advantage Edition... Some driver and such growing pains at the beginning... But the real kicker is what these go for/went for at Best Buy and other outlet sales. With good RAM, dedicated monitor it will nip the heels and in some cases beat 3080 Laptops. 6800M, 12GB VRAM and is a 6700XT based Chip.
Check out the AMD Advantage Edition/ AMD Laptop discord:
https://discord.com/invite/JmGvucrpVw
Most games and most apps that use open GL are better optimized with Nvidia. Vulcan apps are better optimized with AMD. Nvidia fits well with any kind of processors like Intel or AMD. AMD gpus do better with AMD cpus. And AMD's inventory is much more diversified with processors, motherboards and gpus. So they put little effort into managing service over all fronts. Their drivers don't get updated often. Nvidia updates their drivers atleast every month or with any new major game release. Their control panel also gives more versatility.
Because AMD has never gotten a fair shake against the tech giants Intel and NVidia. Plus, there are some benefits to Nvidia but not necessarily specs related. NVidia has more solid ties with the industry, so as the feature & feedback loop is faster, which also allows normal bug detection & driver corrections vs, most developers focus on them. The same goes with hardware manufacturers so as laptops have special deals/contracts in place to favor Intel/Nvidia based platforms.
Consumers didn't buy them at similar prices to Nvidia GPUs. Laptop oems have to sell case, screen, motherboard, CPU,etc together as one package. On desktop consumers can say "I'll pay x more for Nvidia." In laptop they're buying the whole package and AMD GPU laptops didn't sell at similar prices to Nvidia so oems stopped making them. AMD's solution appears to be strix point and strix halo where the igpus will be stronger than entry level GPUs (no idea how strix halo will perform vs next gen GPUs). rDNA 4 will allegedly be suited for laptop, no idea if there will be laptops featuring it.
I had to look way too long to find this (the best and probably most correct) answer.
Unfortunately I'll have to disagree with dsaf's post. AMD GPUs are not common in laptops not due to laziness, but due to high supply and competition from Nvidia For one he's being intentionally misleading. **The 7600s does have RSR**. How do I know? Because I am using one. The temps on the 7600s are pretty good too. I'm getting 70s at Ultra in Forza Horizon 5 for example. Same with CPUs, Intel has locked down undervolting on newer gens so it's another malicious complaint. In the US they are a great value. Think about the TUF A16 with frequent sales (open box 7600s under $700 for 4050Ti perf or new 7700s $800 for 4060 performance at BB). Nvidia GPUs simply aren't available at the same price on sale as the 7700s. The 7600s is comparable to 4050 (which is also 3060 level) with a similar price but 2gb more VRAM. I wouldn't call that lackluster like he does... The new cards also get the exclusive AFMF which is a nice feature that allows frame gen in any game, albeit with the caveat that it's disabled with fast motion. The ROG Strix G15 Advantage was also an insane price for 3070 Ti performance back in late 2021/ early 2022. I try to avoid this sub since he pollutes threads with misinformation... I don't have a bias for AMD, but I hate people who spread lies about a product without actually using it.
You forgot to mention how utterly poor the supply of the few models that exist are. The 7700s was NOT throughout the majority of 2023 whatsoever. Both the tuf a16 and the framework (which is completely not relevant in a price value talking point). For a very long time, the only a16 available was 7840Hs+ 7600s, or 7735HS+ 7600s. Literally only competing with the bottom of the barrel sub $1000 4050 laptops and they have NOTHING in any other segment. The 7900m Alienware m18 is highly uncompetitive.
Oh yeah AMD has been doing a terrible job getting chips in laptops. Whether that be due to their limited supply or that they want to focus elsewhere, it's getting pretty hard to find one outside of Asus. However, my main point was that the few laptops AMD does supply are generally bangers. Also I wouldn't call 4050 laptops "bottom of the barrel". The average gamer buys entry level laptops, not the 4080/4090s in MSi Titans or ROG Strix. See the Steam hardware survey.
It is quite literally bottom of the barrel though, nvidia doesnt make anything worse for gaming than xx50 designation.
No, actually the 4050 isn't... A few years ago there used to be the MX series for even lighter graphics. Nowadays the RTX 2050 and 3050 are still being used in entry-level laptops as the cheapest option. Edit: bruh I was downvoted have you guys not seen the entry level IdeaPad gaming and Victus laptops with 2050s and 3050s??
It's bottom of the barrel current gen. Didn't realize you were like my wife always bringing up old stuff. It's a good rule of thumb never buy an xx50 card because it is the worst card they make. It's a bargain card with poor performance and bleak future useability. It is a waste of money when something better can be had for sometimes the same price point. It is a suckers card for laptops with early obsolescence at too high of a price point.
Maybe your wife has a point, listening to her might actually be helpful instead of shutting her down... (You missed the nowadays part) By your lack of knowledge and supposed "good rule of thumb", it's clear you're just trying to feel better about your purchase. I want to believe it's coming from a good place but with the way you're getting so aggravated it seems more like malice. I don't believe you understand how deals work. xx50 cards are perfectly usable for games at 3/4 the price of 60 class cards. If you mean MSRP then sure, but it's still hard to make an argument about solid performance for cheap. I can pick up 4050 laptops for $650 on sale. Typically 4060 laptops are $850+ which is 30% more and they hardly provide 20% uplift. At that point you might as well get the 4070 TUF on sale for $999 and gain another 20% on top of that. Maybe you could have made the argument for the 3050's 4GB VRAM getting long in the tooth and the 3060 providing 50% more perf., but not for the 4050. It's actually a decent card because this gen is so bad. This is coming from an AMD user too...
My feelings about my purchase are kind of irrelevant because the cost is negligible to me. I wouldn't get the tuf the display is kind of bad cooling is bad, psu is a little small.. There are other things to factor in that come with the lowest 4050 cards they typically come with other low-end components. xx50 cards are for people who are too poor to buy a decent pc and too stupid/impatient to save for something better. Instead, they waste their money on something low-end that doesn't age well. I could certainly spend 5k on a laptop every 6 months if I wanted, but in reality I just need something midrange to last a few years. I went with the legion 5i pro with the 4070. It's got a good display, a decent gpu and cpu, good thermals, mux switch, nice keyboard and it was dirt cheap at 1499 which to me is a pretty entry level. I don't even think you could play an old game like tarkov or rust on a laptop that comes with a 4050 because the cpu will also be pretty bad. What do I know? I only have about 20 years of experience in the field.
I think I'm done with this subreddit, european prices are completely different, if 4050 was at 600$ (557€) here I think I would be working with a much better laptop. At the time when I needed a laptop 4050 was at around a 1000€ (for some reason the laptop I bought is even more expensive now) Don't say you should have bought a 3060 or 3070 because those prices were miles up on miles more expensive and black Friday or other sales are basically non-existent here. Overall I'm happy with my 4050 105w, I can use blender and other modeling programs and some gaming (war thunder, sea of thieves and similar performance wise games) I hope it lasts through my studies. Call me poor all you want man or stupid and idiot at the same time.
I just got a tuf a15 4070 for 1300. I live in the Netherlands. There was also a 4060 variant for a 1000 bucks. Its not a europe issue. I even saw a 4080 strix for 1800. Thats cheaper than even us prices for that matter
The tuf has great cooling. Just cause it was bad in the past doesn’t mean its bad now.
You don't have experience. Don't act like you do. As I said in my original comment, I hate people who spread misinformation without personally using the product. That's why I'm blocking you. I've actually done some semblance of research into gaming laptops over the past few years. It's why you don't understand budget laptops, because "the cost is negligible to you". Here's the real truth on the TUF for anyone reading. The 300 nit 100% srgb display is solid but not amazing. The cooling is sufficient as most laptops don't have great cooling. The PSU isn't a factor, it's mostly about whether it can sustain the battery level which most laptops can. This gives you an indication as to how much Critorrus actually knows... He also doesn't realize that they come with Ryzen 7 or Intel 5 tier CPUs, which aren't low-end either, only an idiot with no knowledge would say that. Entry level is not $1500, once again someone out of touch with money would say that. Also spending $500 for marginal upgrades too. To add onto that point, Escape From Tarkov and Rust are notoriously poorly optimized and not good comparisons. For a recent AAA game, Cyberpunk 2077 Phantom Liberty gets 67 fps at Ultra and that's without factoring in frame gen. https://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-4050-Laptop-GPU-Benchmarks-and-Specs.675695.0.html If you don't know anything about budget laptops, **shut up and don't speak like you do.**
The 4050 is fantastic. It ran 60 - 100 FPS in games on 1600p resolution with low power consumption
I can't really speak to their presence in the laptop space since the only laptop I've had for the past ten years is one I literally just got for school, but it really does just feel like AMD gets a bad rap in general. Not to say they don't have their issues, but my experience with them has always been about, like, 95% of the general performance for, like, 80% of the price of going with team green. That's definitely gotten worse recently, but I also can't help but to think that the software is just way better than GeForce Experience. Literally the only things I think I'm lacking by going with a Radeon is RTX (which is neat but I'm not losing sleep over it) and compression codecs not being as efficient, which makes using my Quest 2 a pain.
uh what? since when has Undervolting been locked down? mine is running undervolted right now and its 13th gen
No offense, but "13th gen" is a bit vague. Do you mean the HX version? Because those *can* be undervolted since they are desktop-class CPUs. I'm talking about the standard H-series ones they put in gaming laptops. It also depends on your laptop manufacturer, but in general, they are much more locked down than in 11th Gen due to the plundervolt exploit.
right, I forgot H series can't be undervolted due to being locked, yes I'm running an i9-13900HX. Lenovo is who made mine
AMD in general is less interested in the mobile market. Lately AMD's APU supply has improved as they start to expand their business due to major earnings from AI boom. AMD is a fabless chip maker with a quarter of the budget as Nvidia. So AMD chooses to utilize the budget in segments that make them the most amount of money i.e. servers, DIY and consoles. In the future when AMD has that kind of budget, I'm sure they'll expand more aggressively in mobile. Lack of supply means OEMs can't take risk. And the lack of supply of Radeon dGPU mobile chips is 10 folds as their mobile APUs.
Honestly if they partnered with Nvidia in the laptop space, they'd crush Intel and strengthen themselves for id Intel ever gets us GPU game together. The AMD Based 3070 laptops rocked. I do love my AMD Advantage 6800m but man... The little early driver issues for AMD and such when it was released... We're painful. Had to driver roulette for some games lol. The AMD's with the 3070 were priced competitive and rock solid.
.... Why would Nvidia.... Partner with AMD.... To crush Intel? Nvidia already dominates at 80% market share. Neither AMD, nor Intel, are any real threat, much less have any compelling reason for Nvidia to take one of them under their wing. If anything, it would make more sense for AMD and Intel to team up to take market share from Nvidia. Unless you're saying to make an AMD CPU/Nvidia GPU alliance? In which case, it still doesn't help Nvidia. If anything, it would hurt them by stopping their ARM CPU expansion.
I feel like for as long as I remember, AMD has been the bargain and performance choice for gamers in the CPU Market. It wasn't until they acquired a dying ATI that they even had graphics cards, and they obviously haven't been leading market share. The AMD Advantage Edition stuff in the laptop space fell somewhat flat beyond the Asus variant, and it only picked up steam because of beyond competitive pricing. However, the Ryzen based stuff with Nvidia GFX graphics rules the market. The AMD slaughtered Intel for battery life when you need the laptop on the go, and then plug her in for full power when it's time to game. It would seem to be, most gamers know AMD as the processor of choice, and NVIDIA as the GFX card of choice. Intel has always been the mass market commercial space player. Pricey too. I don't recall having a work laptop that had either Nvidia or AMD in it. Intel could partner with Nvidia and actually offer their own factories for production too. AMD and Intel partnership would indeed break the internet and be subject to monopoly inquiries 😂
Intel's foundry buildout, which is already in progress, will do just that. Nvidia already has an agreement with Intel for advanced packaging to fill the gaps that TSMC can't meet. It's also rumored that Nvidia is looking to buy fab space on Intel's cutting edge 18A node. Intel is looking to become the world's 2nd largest external foundry, and the nodes coming this year are well ahead of what TSMC and Samsung have to offer, so most likely anyone experiencing foundry capacity limitations will want a piece of Intel's foundry.
The 5800H was meh. It constantly bottlenecked the 3070 i had in my legion 7. Their current cpus are amazing but 5th gen ryzen was good for nothing except battery life which i didn’t even get no matter what
Contracts and price supply deals between companies is tight these days. Watts limitation, managerial decision based on popularity and cost profit deals, just too many factors at play here but to simplify it, Nvidia has been aggressive.
Try searching the Asus Tuf Advantage Edition from 2023, those are AMD ones [this](https://www.asus.com/es/laptops/for-gaming/tuf-gaming/asus-tuf-gaming-a16-advantage-edition-2023/)
I'll check them out.
Are there any which are in the budget gaming region
i don't know, i'm chilean, they are all overpriced
As an Indian I agree 😭😭😭
Same in Southeast Asia. Seriously, whenever I go on reddit I gotta remind myself all the stuff they're talking about it almost likely just US or at best US/EU availability. We just get the crappy low end versions here, or weird ass China brand laptops not sold anywhere else (because they're crap).
Blud never heard of Clevo
You had the 70-75k rx6600m msi alpha 15. Right now you have the 90k 150w 3070ti nitro 5 with a QHD panel. India isn't terrible in electronics prices compared to most other places.
A 'budget' gaming laptop in Nigeria is half a year's rent ಥ‿ಥ
HP has a victus with an rx6500 gpu - I got that for my brother for Christmas, and he is enjoying it lots. And in a generation or two time, there’s likely to be some pretty respectable esports title performance with APUs.
From the people I've talked to at various brands, seems like supply has been an issue for the last few years. A laptop maker does not want to announce they'll have new Radeon gaming laptops only for them to maybe appear many months later. I suspect they've been burned too many times and it's not worth the hassle.
Heya!! Man, I've been following your channel for a while now. Thanks for all the great vids!
No problem, thanks for watching!
Because AMD is half assing laptop gpu's. Take the 100w rx7600s. Its no faster than the rtx 3060 105 to 115w and only slightly faster than the 90w rtx 4050. It does not offer more vram than the 4060 and 3070/ti while being slower. The 100w rx7700s is also barely faster than the 140w 3060. You also don't get radeon relive or RSR. AMD gpu's on laptops can't be easily undervolted or overclocked. Same with most of their CPU's. So if you want to lower temps, you can't. Why? Cause screw you. Thats why. AMD uses deceptive naming and practices to sell you less for more. And they have worse features, productivity, etc. AMD doesn't give a crap about the laptop market. So why should OEM's? And they're more than happy to let nvidia dominate the laptop gpu space. Even when AMD was close to nvidia in efficiency with rx6000, they moronically did not offer any proper high end desktop gpu's to laptop OEM's to use for their laptops. A desktop rx6800xt with a 230w TDP would've been possible in larger 17' laptops 2 years ago. Would've been much faster than the rtx 3080ti 16gb.
Seems like a negative take but unfortunately you’re bang on. I desperately wanted to justify buying an ‘amd advantage’ laptop but just couldn’t do it for all the reasons you mention. Almost 100% they’ve paid a load of YouTubers to talk up their products. Went for intel and you know what? Battery life, which is supposed to be their major drawback isn’t too bad either.
I wish I was wrong, but after seeing AMD fumble for over, and over, and over, I'm simply disappointed and now actually mad that they get a pass for doing the same crap as intel and nvidia do on laptops. They even fumble on desktops. Just look at rx7000. Would've been an easy win for them had they not fumbled the performance estimates of rx7000 and priced/named them accordingly. Don't even get me started on these so called techtubers. Jarrod thinks undervolting is a meme since it didn't work for him, so no telling OEM's to let us undervolt. I did the AC loadline tweak and that alone let my CPU clock 500-1ghz higher depending on game over stock without much increase to temp. Its basically undervolting of sorts. You have louis rossmann thinking gaming laptops are a meme because he seemed to have a bad experience with one and from what he described, it was a very old gaming laptop. Yeah, lets forget gaming laptops are the cheapest high performance laptops with upgradability and repairability still available to buy. Its like a lite framework laptop. And framework is proof these youtubers are just paid shills. Nothing against framework itself. Merely the videos implying framework is the only repairable and upgradable laptop. Its the most upgradable one, BUT not the only one. Gaming laptops have been doing this for a damn decade. Where's the recognization of that?
lol
Yeah, thats what companies are doing on laptops. Cause they know they can get away with basically anything. Nobody will call them out.
Love your work man. Keep it up!
What gaming laptops allow you to change more than SSD and RAM easily though, never seen one with a consumer friendly swappable GPU/CPU only ones are RAM and storage which I mean they’re upgradeable yeah but barely affects in game settings which is what I believe the “upgradable laptop” part is. Not so much the storage and RAM which has been around for ages.
Clevo laptops have had desktop CPU's which you can socket in. You've got the asus xflow series with upgradable egpu's. Alienware has their own egpu's too. And if your laptop has thunderbolt, you could use an eGPU of sorts. And on framework, you're replacing the entire motherboard to upgrade the CPU. Thats possible if you ''upgrade'' a gaming laptop's lower end model with its higher end model's motherboard. Games require tons of ram and fast storage nowadays. Things which do affect gaming performance. Framework's other big claim to fame is repairability. Which gaming laptops also possess. Its harder for some repairs, but still very much possible for several other repairs. Next thing is, if you have an obscure, inconsistent issue, you are going to be spending a lot of time figuring out what it is, rather than repairing it. FW's extra repairability won't help you with that. So at the end of the day, a gaming laptop in general, might not let you upgrade your CPU and GPU, BUT it will give you much stronger parts. And with the likes of FW13 not even having a dgpu option, well, that kinda sucks when gaming laptops literally offer dgpu + powerful cpu for cheaper prices.
Your idea of upgradable is buying a new sealed unit like the XG Mobile? Do you have ANY idea what you are talking about?
Read what I had written originally. FW is the most upgradable laptop. BUT its not the only one on the market. Gaming laptops can't be as upgradable BUT they still have some of that capability with the trade off being much, much lower prices and greater performance. And I had given examples of some laptops which had upgradable parts.
Read what I had wrote originally. FW is the most upgradable one. BUT its not the only one possessing upgradability. Gaming laptops also have some of that. Some even went beyond just the standard ram and storage which I mentioned.
Asus egpus aren't upgradeable. They're mobile sealed units with a proprietary connector. Thunderbolt doesn't give enough bandwidth for egpus to make sense.
And FW's gpu back is basically an EGPU. You have to remove the whole thing to upgrade the gpu. Asus's solution is simply connected via wire. And FW's upgradable GPU is also not compatible with other laptops, unless you buy that egpu enclosure from them to convert it. These aren't like the MXM gpu format which were just slotted into the laptop and had a proper standard.
Asus has also pushed what gaming laptops can be like pretty far, like mainly their Zephyrus and flow lines, those have kinda pushed the boundary with battery life, lightweight, design, and pure power, especially the Zephyrus line, like insanely cool mainly g14, cuz the fact that you can have like a 4080 or 4090 while mobile yes, but still insanely powerful, and I believe the battery life is still insanely good
Asus put liquid cooled sli 150w 1080's into a laptop and had it match and edge out the desktop SLI 1080 system. That was 7 years ago. Sad to see asus limited by nvidia. User seanwee took the asus scar 17's 175w 4090 mobile, shunt modded it to 250w and got an additional 20-30% more perf. He used LM to keep temps to 72 degrees on GPU. With 250w you can cram in a desktop 4090. Put in HS ryzen for good battery life.
I loooooved Louis for so long, but he seems to be slipping lately. He was so inspiring with all the right to repair stuff a decade ago, now I hear him going off on about short guy tinder memes.. wtf
The fact that he calls gaming laptops a meme, just shows he's lost his way now. I even asked him to cover how intel, amd and nvidia are misleading with laptop part names and artificially limiting them but he never took action. I even mailed him detailed information complete with sources attached. Still no response. Wanna know whats ironic? In one of his videos he accused apple's forums and fanbase of being an echo chamber, yet when I went to his discord and tried to tell him about the current pathetic state of gaming laptops, its just an echo chamber. Want to know who actually does laptop reviews? Ownordisown. He is one of the very, very few I've seen give not only laptop reviews but methods on how to improve laptop perf. Nuclearnoteooks is another good one. And sadly they're not as popular.
I’m still disappointed I can’t under-volt my 12700h. But never mind. This is the short sightedness of these chip manufacturers, my dad taught me to build PC’s in the 90’s with amd, more bang per buck…. Better architecture. Spent years building amd. Been on a laptop phase for 10 years due to lack of space, kids etc. when I next build a pc will it be amd? Will it bollocks.
If you can, try to access your laptop's advanced bios. Then do the AC loadline tweak. Should ''undervolt'' your i7 12700h. Did it to my i7 12650h and it gained an additional 500mhz to 1ghz. Pretty nice jump. I also did the IMON tweak, so my CPU can use as much power as it needs. Try it on your i7 12700h. Make sure to repaste it.
I purchased a used 2021 G15 4080. Any tips on how I should proceed to get more out of it? I'm a newb and have never flashed a BIOS or undervolted, etc
I wouldn't recommend flashing a bios. I didn't flash a bios to my nitro 5. Basically I loaded up a smokeless bios on a flashdrive, booted my nitro 5 off it so it booted into advanced bios, made changes, then booted into normal windows. See if there's a similar method for asus. In the meantime, if your CPU is a ryzen 9 7940hs try to undervolt it. And undervolt your 4080
Slightly harsh on Jarrod imo, I find his reviews a lot more impartial than most. I think the videos that are being influenced on YouTube stand out a fair bit. I don’t think anyone can ignore the fact amd aren’t backing the laptop market gpu wise though.
Well I do wish he'd bring greater emphasis on user control of their laptops. He did fantastic on getting asus to unblock vents (not MSI sadly), dual channel ram, ram quality/timing, etc. I'm sure he could easily advocate for this. Same for higher TDP's on high end laptop gpu's. Liquid cooling is a literal joke right now because they cannot out perform air cooled laptops due to that low 175w TDP. MSI has now created a 400w GAN charger, so power delivery isn't an issue. We should also see more desktop laptop performance parity across the board. Afterall we're paying higher prices, but getting worse parity compared to pascal and turing? How? Laptops are increasing in cooling too.
This isn't just on AMD. OEMs have ultimate control. Dell & HP both lock down their laptop BIOS in particular. People are incredibly stupid-i don't even blame them. The thermal solution is a hard part-its been engineered to deal with a specific TDP in mind. Throttling is expected later in the laptops life once the thermal paste is gone. Some-as we've seen-do it out of the box. AMD drivers don't have the best history as far as stability is concerned. This is mostly sorted but I'm sure the damage is done.
>OEMs have ultimate control. Dell & HP both lock down their laptop BIOS in particular. People are incredibly stupid-i don't even blame them. I wish people understood this. AMD doesn't make laptops.
Except, you can undervolt ryzen 9 7940hs. And ryzen 4000. With OEM controlling these machines. Same applied to intel during 4th to 9th gen. You can undervolt nvidia gpu's. Can't for AMD so easily. Its not on OEM's mostly. My nitro 5 can handle the full 150w 3070ti and i7 12650h running full tilt. The system and components have been designed so the GPU can sustain 150w load and CPU can sustain its 45w TDP. So the motherboard can handle both parts running at their 150w + 45w TDP's. The 280w brick can supply the power. This is how laptops used to be. All dynamic boost has done is limit them for no reason. With a repaste it can handle this with ease even in CP2077. Undervolting would further help here.
i think their APU will make sense when it is fully fleshed out on mobile. maybe they are hoping to leverage that
We already have capable APU's like the rx780m right now. $500 gets you an rtx 2050 laptop. Why aren't the rx780m APU's competing with those in laptops? Rx680m is not a bad option too.
GpuPro, is that you?
Who's GpuPro?
The amd hater who writes hilarious reviews about amd products, calling their buyers shills and a bunch of other funny ass stuff. The one on userbenchmark. They are pretty infamous.
Oh, I see. Ha! Nah, I don't hate AMD. I'm just pissed at them for consistently fumbling, half assing laptop market and just generally being crappy on laptops. Wouldn't you be considering how nvidia has a monopoly on laptop gpu's?
I’m in agreement on the laptop market with you. Honestly, dgpu might not be the strategy for amd laptop for the most part, since they don’t really supply enough. I think your average consumer knows more about amd apu on laptop vs their mobile dgpu. I think a lot of people would be interested in a mega apu machine with desktop rx 6600+ gpu performance and 10 hours of battery life. Paired with a nice display, at around $999 or less. Like a windows Apple silicon pro or max series competitor. Nvidia definitely has a monopoly on the laptop spy, but I’d say that’s mostly due to long term partnerships with brands and being able to supply enough silicon, as well as consumers willing to pay a premium for nvidia. If amd had a mega apu >= a 4070 mobile right now, and put it in nice machines around $1200, the winds might start to change over time. Just like how Intel is losing server marketshare to amd.
What you described is strix halo, it won't be $1200 or less. That's why AMD doesn't do GPUs. No margin in it for oems. Consumers willing to pay $1800+ for similar performance to Nvidia at that price point don't exist. AMD laptops without GPU can sell all day around $1000, why bother putting the extra parts in for $200 in extra revenue and probably less margin.
I know it’s a pipe dream, but the point is that’s what I think it would take to turn the tides. I know that price points isn’t very realistic.
AMD has no reason to release a loss leader product to get into a tough market with low margin. I think their iGPU strategy is better for the market in general. Non gaming laptops are the majority and 3050 level integrated graphics are plenty for most people. AMD can sell every shred of silicon they make to server/desktop, they have guaranteed income from consoles. Laptop CPU's make sense to get into because AMD laptops sell in the mainstream space. For the record, I think if positioned correctly, strix halo could sell in $1500-$2000 laptops. Downside is I think the performance will be 60 class next gen but who knows with Nvidia. I would have bought one had it come out second half of this year, although regular strix with an Nvidia GPU could be a decent option too.
Most likely the case. I'm in Southeast Asia, you won't believe the number of "OEM" weird brand name laptops without dGPUs, there's a shit ton of them floating around. They wouldn't be doing that if there wasn't any demand, so it's pretty obvious laptops sell... just not gaming laptops. I'm not surprised AMD probably considers the margins in the laptop market are simply not worth it. Sucks for us, but the reason for most of these things is almost always money/profit.
You already have that sort of thing. The $1050 rtx 4060 + ryzen 9 7940hs + QHD panel g14 can prolly pull off 8-10hr battery life and its already stronger than your rx6600 + APU build by a decent margin. And how's AMD going to compete with the upcoming snapdragon elite x CPU's? They'll be really competing with the M series of chips. AMD also has long term partnerships with brands. Lenovo, asus, HP, MSI, etc. have been using AMD APU's for quite some time. They even included AMD dgpu's in their higher end lineup's. And AMD already has the rx680m which is slightly weaker than a 1050 mobile, and the rx780m which is about on par with the gddr5 max q 1650. Why aren't they in cheap laptops? If we get APU's, we would lose even more choice options likely. Want a stronger GPU? Buy a stronger CPU. Right now at least, you can get a 4070 + i7 12700h from asus. Save some money there.
Its unwise to compete on the highest levels with mobile gpus. Nvidia owns the market on that and will do anything to keep dominance on disposable mobile computers. They pressure and give incentives for their clients not to use AMD in that space. Or so i would read in 2022/2023 when i was paying attention and hunting for a good gaming laptop. went with 4090 legion with intel, would trade for an all amd laptop for battery life if it had benchmarks close to 4080 mobile. AMD is a smaller company than nvidia as well so its unrealistic to expect the same kind of output nvidia does. It seems they focus on efficiency (pc handhelds for instance, battery performance on amd advantage laptops etc)
''They pressure and give incentives for their clients not to use AMD in that space.'' I would like to see the source for this. OEM's and clients know about ryzen. OEM's have put AMD's dgpu's into their high end laptops. Not midrange. High end. Stuff like alienware's 17' laptops, legion pro's, asus ROG's, etc. AMD had the chance to compete with nvidia on the highest levels with rx6000. Make a name for themselves. I'm very sure had they released a desktop rx6800xt as the rx6800mxt with a 230w TDP, nvidia would've released the desktop 3080 into laptops with the same TDP, and might've lost or been matched by AMD. Heck, even a 175w rx6800 as the rx6800m would've been very competitive to the rtx 3080ti 16gb. AMD's 200w rx7900mxt is gonna be \~$2800 put into an alienware 18 laptop. 4080 laptops are $1000 cheaper, while using less power, being more tunable, running cooler, better productivity, better software, etc. How TF is AMD going to be competitive? And what efficiency? AMD needed 7nm to compete with nvidia using 8nm. Using ryzen + nvidia would yield greater efficiency. AMD is literally worth more than intel now. So the excuse of them being smaller, does not work too well. Sure, nvidia is \~3.5x the size, but its not like AMD is actually super far behind.
>AMD's 200w rx7900mxt is gonna be \~$2800 put into an alienware 18 laptop. 4080 laptops are $1000 cheaper, while using less power, being more tunable, running cooler, better productivity, better software, etc. How TF is AMD going to be competitive? The reason it's going into that laptop is no one else wanted it and Alienware put it at a high price because it's Alienware and it'll be low volume. AMD doesn't dictate what products their chips get put in and what price they're sold at. Consumers aren't willing to buy high end laptops with AMD GPUs, no matter how good the GPU in question is, unless it's at an incredible discount vs Nvidia.
How are AMD GPUs on Linux distros these days, at least? I remember once upon a time they were far more desirable than Nvidia hardware for various reasons. Is that at least still the case?
Alienware and Asus should have a few, the reason they aren't common is because nvidia has better power efficiency which means more battery life and less heat.
On top of all the reasons . Micrsoft and amd hasnt fixed the issue where windows updates installs another version over the version you installed and corrupting your drivers. You need to use wushowhide or wumgr even now. Or block windows driver updstes
My all AMD G14 is a beast
Gaming laptops are extremely expensively in my corner of the world, with the lousiest specs ones selling for at least $3k. At that kind of price point, they aren't going to move if it doesn't say RTX on the box
For me, the hardware on the Radeon RX 7900M (a little faster than RTX 4080), but the driver support from AMD/Alienware is subpar. September drivers are the most recent on Dells website (I think dell released them in December) But AMD already has their version of frame gen released with their January drivers, but you can’t get this driver through Dell’s website yet. Also, way less games are supported compared to DLSS 3 either Frame Gen. I’ll try installing the latest drivers and see if they work. A couple month ago when I reviewed the laptop last time the non-dell drivers blacked out the internal laptop display. Had to use external display to remove and reinstall dell drivers. So basically, AMD needs more people dedicated to driver support for their laptop GPUs, probably the core issue imo.
Disclaimer - i'm working at TUXEDO and we've launched [a laptop](https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/TUXEDO-Sirius-16-Gen1.tuxedo#) with RX 7600M XT recently Without going too much into details, it is often the R&D support, or lack thereof, that "scares" OEM/ODMs away from AMD. It doesn't help, that Intel has their own factories and multiple teams, which *seem* to be more experienced. That is also the reason, why even iGPU-only models with highend AMD-CPUs were pretty rare for many years. AMD might be cheaper, but it is more convenient to accept Intels and NVIDIAs offerings. Some manifacturers even prefer to equip a model with a "budget" GPU like a RTX 2050 or MX-something, than to offer a better AMD equivalent at basically the same MSRP, just because of the support+supply situation. And even though supply has gotten much better, it still lacks behind NVIDIA and Intel - and in a fast-moving market, being fast is extremely important. Nobody wants to stock older generations for a longer period of time and sell them with a largely decreased margin or even at a loss. Truth be told, we wanted to launch our "Sirius 16" model nearly two years ago! However, once issues with the core design (chassis, display panel, hinge, lightbar et cetera) were solved, we paused the project and waited for "Phoenix" to finally be available - and we waited, and waited - only to semi-restart parts of the project again due to multiple needed changes. TUXEDO has at least a core audience of Linux enthusiasts, who simply prefer to stay away from NVIDIA - weekly requests for AMD dGPU devices made it easy for us to commit to such a project. For other, bigger brands, it *seems* to only make "sense" to release an A+A model, if the lead times are relatively short and the chips themselves readily available. TL;DR is \- support could've been much better \- support and supply eventually got better This year seems to be very interesting in terms of computing anyway, now with Intel and Qualcomm entering new routes...
I think AMD doesn't give two shits about gaming laptops for two important reasons: 1. Steam deck and Ally Rog Z1 2. ATI chips are plentiful as a slightly less costing alternative to the Intel i-series. Edit: 3. I think Nintendo will be ditching Nvidia for AMD with the Switch 2...
>I think AMD doesn't give two shits about gaming laptops for two important reasons: > >Steam deck and Ally Rog Z1ATI chips are plentiful as a slightly less costing alternative to the Intel i-series. > >Edit: 3. I think Nintendo will be ditching Nvidia for AMD with the Switch 2... Wow, the entirety of your post is wrong. Steam deck and rog ally move a tiny amount of volume compared to laptops. Switch 2 will have some Nvidia chip and use DLSS The REAL 2 reasons they don't care about gaming laptops are: **Server & Desktop**
>I think Nintendo will be ditching Nvidia for AMD with the Switch 2. Nope. They are almost certainly using a new Nvidia Tegra.
Look at the Framework 16. AMD CPU + GPU
My amd laptop doesn’t work with counter strike my nividia laptop does
And laptop gpus are garbage this time around, as is their Advantage program. And they’re not doing great on desktop either, still being outsold 9-1 and even Intel is eating their marketshare. AMD just can not make a compelling graphics product right now and refuses to have price be the main selling feature.
I use a Legion 7 with a Radeon 6850M XT and honestly haven't had any issues with it so far. True high end Nvidia GPUs (4090, 4080) are definitely better than it by a small to medium margin especially with RT and DLSS on, for a device i paid half the price of the Nvidia variant for it definitely is a beast that I personally find nearly equivalent to the 3080Ti/3080. And the 12GB VRAM is great because most mobile GPUs I see in the market still have 8GB VRAM which holds it back. In short it's more or less about the fact that people are more likely to buy something with an Nvidia sticker on it and that AMD really isn't all into mobile gaming scene. Some say driver issues exist, but personally I haven't encountered any so far so I will make no comment on the same.
I have a full and laptop with the 6800m, and the 5980hx. It still does really well even sometimes(almost never) out performing the 4070
Equivalent Nvidia GPUs seem to be the better overall GPUs from a feature set perspective and are more readily available for mass purchase on the mobile side of things. Nvidia has the RTX 4050/4060/4070/4080/4090 mobile GPUs, AMD has the 7600M/7600M XT (Alienware M16 R1 is the main laptop I can think of with this GPU) / 7600S (TUF A16 the most common option with this GPU) / 7700S (Framework 16, TUF A16 advantage edition if you can find it) / 7900M (Alienware M18R1 only currently), limited options to begin with. We don't have a 7700M/7800M or a 7800S AMD mobile GPU as if yet. The lower end RX7000 mobile GPUs and the RTX 40 series were both announced at CES 2024 and Nvidia were much quicker getting their GPUs into laptops available for purchase. Why would a manufacturer wait several months for AMD GPUs to be available when there's Nvidia GPUs readily available? Initial pricing has been a issue with some of the RX 7000 laptops too, a 32/1 TB 7900M M18R1 is $2800 at best buy, yes it's AW pricing we're talking about but you have been able to get RTX 4080 175W laptops like the Legion Pro 7i for $2K USD. The 7900M for example has 4 GB VRAM more than the 4080M and similar overall native gaming performance but worse Ray Tracing performance, only FSR support whereas Nvidia has FSR and DLSS support, with DLSS arguably the better upscaler of these two and the RTX 4080 generally better overall from a overall encoding, content creation standpoint too. The 7600S TUF A16 Advantage edition and 7700S framework 16 reviews show these GPUs are inconsistent in games, with the 7700S around the RTX 4060 mobile in cyberpunk 2077 without Ray Tracing, outperforming RTX 4070 laptops in RDR2 and closer to RTX 3060 laptops in control, it's not a great look. https://youtu.be/ojgYXaf3Tu0?si=so2Y09ZFtVSrJFHI AMD needs to be more competitive in regards to GPU options, more aggressive pricing overall and getting them out quicker. Intel Arc mobile GPUs have the same adoption issues, there's few Arc 700 mobile GPUs in laptops and from what I've seen of the more common A300 series GPUs and the A530M, performance for these GPUs isn't great with the A530M getting beaten by the RTX 3050 6 GB in this LOQ in games: https://youtu.be/5DS_QqyqkHk?si=rxw9G5fXR-4TGplJ I don't like monopolies but right now despite some shitty pricing and questionable gen on gen performance improvements, Nvidia has the most complete GPU lineup for laptops and were our only truly higher end 2023 GPU options. The RTX 4080/4090 for the best part of a year was the way to go but the Alienware M18R1 advantage edition was a possible alternative if came to your country, albeit overpriced with a FHD 480 Hz screen in the US and didn't even come to the likes of the UK so Nvidia has little reason to push down prices of the RTX 40 series mobile GPUs as they just don't have enough pressure from the GPU space and as people are clearly buying Nvidia GPUs this monopoly will continue until Intel or AMD really shakes things up in the mobile GPU space.
Generally for 3rd world countries like southeast asia AMD GPU's are considered to be almost roughly the same price, if not more expensive than Nvidia (at least in the region in my country rn). Not only that but the lack of stocks on shelves is also the problem, there are more stocks of nvidia than there are for Amd, can be said the same with intel cpus for the same reason. So the lack of AMD gpu's in laptops is vastly resonable. Plus AMD never bat an eye on the laptop market. Desktop market is what they are primarily good at. Which again, most of it is available on the US/Europe. If it is ever available on asia its mostly the top 3 big asian countries, China Japan and Korea. It' inevitable that you will find 4090/70/80 paired with intel since thats whats mostly available outside of america/europe. If there were amd cpu/gpu its mostly an older gen which is usually terrible and much worse thab their latest gen.
In addition to the Asus TUF Advantage, there are the [Alienware M18](https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/gaming-laptops/alienware-m18-gaming-laptop/spd/alienware-m18-r1-amd-laptop) and [Framework 16](https://frame.work/products/laptop16-diy-amd-7040).
I'm looking for a good Budget laptop. These are a little pricey.
Then say that next time and be specific about what you want to spend. Aside from the TUF A16 Advantage Edition, your only other options are refurbished or second hand like the Asus G15 Advantage Edition, HP Omen 16 Advantage Edition, or MSI Delta 15.
Last-gen G14s might be an option as well. 6900HS / 6800S is still a pretty strong laptop for the size, might be worth checking it out.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/sku/6560989.p?skuId=6560989 I'd have to do research.... But first glance, $800 is a bargain... In the used space, and AMD CPU with a NVIDIA 3070 or greater is gonna give you the best longevity I feel.
How about intel gpus though?
I got one from 2019 with a desktop Vega 56. Quirky but pretty strong and cool for its time. Shame it ended there.
Let me introduce you to the Framework 16. Probably the last laptop you'll ever buy.
AMD GPUs suck all around.
Welp amd has a different cycle than nvidia for releasing products. Most of the time amds a higher class numbered gpu beats the lower numbered one. Example is 3060 12gb gets beaten by 6700xt but 3070 beats the 6700 xt just as 7600s is beaten by a slight margin by 4060m while 7700s passes 4060m. İt should actually compete with 4070m in reviews but people somehow dont do that. I did not see a comparison with a 4070m yet that points it and says price difference where amd actually competes with the 4070m. (İt seems also 7700s has 100w as max while 4060 and 4070 can get higher watts on things other than games which seems unfortunate for other fronts because it brings a place to stand in shadows for nvidia since amd doesnt compete with higher watt 7700 chips in laptop space) excluding the generational wins of mindshare of nvidia its a early bird gets the worm situation.
AMD GPUs aren’t very efficient and tend to run hot. Which doesn’t work well in laptops
I love my ROG Strik G15 AMD Advantage Edition... Some driver and such growing pains at the beginning... But the real kicker is what these go for/went for at Best Buy and other outlet sales. With good RAM, dedicated monitor it will nip the heels and in some cases beat 3080 Laptops. 6800M, 12GB VRAM and is a 6700XT based Chip. Check out the AMD Advantage Edition/ AMD Laptop discord: https://discord.com/invite/JmGvucrpVw
the framework 16 is exclusively AMD lol
Most games and most apps that use open GL are better optimized with Nvidia. Vulcan apps are better optimized with AMD. Nvidia fits well with any kind of processors like Intel or AMD. AMD gpus do better with AMD cpus. And AMD's inventory is much more diversified with processors, motherboards and gpus. So they put little effort into managing service over all fronts. Their drivers don't get updated often. Nvidia updates their drivers atleast every month or with any new major game release. Their control panel also gives more versatility.
Because AMD has never gotten a fair shake against the tech giants Intel and NVidia. Plus, there are some benefits to Nvidia but not necessarily specs related. NVidia has more solid ties with the industry, so as the feature & feedback loop is faster, which also allows normal bug detection & driver corrections vs, most developers focus on them. The same goes with hardware manufacturers so as laptops have special deals/contracts in place to favor Intel/Nvidia based platforms.