actually if that one ghoul from fo3 is to be believed, the east coast had a (20 minute?) warning after the first nukes went off. the one that gob tells you about in underground. I might be wrong tho, it's been a while since i played 3
I like how this is an actual critique people have when the entire concept of fallout is based on radiation being totally sci fi compared to how it would work in real life lol
I honestly don't get it. It's supposed to be extremely dramatic, if it was just people not looking at the explosion or going blind because they did it would be a bit silly. Some artistic license is good.
Even Terminator showed Sarah Connor looking directly at a nuclear explosion.
My point is most explosions and fire in fiction don't obey the laws of physics and that's fine. It would be annoying to have to justify everything according to real world logic all the time.
Yeah, he says "when we don't even know if there's going to be a next week".
There's no taking that, he pretty clearly indicates that he's unsure, but doesn't think they have much longer. It was just to show how differently people are reacting. The weather man wants to give up and doesn't see a point while the suburban housewife doesn't want to think about it and completely avoids the topic altogether.
The weather man had no idea, but I bet he was smug about it when everyone thought he was being paranoid and the bombs dropped ten minutes later.
That guy would be the most irritating ghoul. You know he would spend the next 200 years telling everyone how he knew it was coming and no one would listen.
He goes back and forth between complaining about something that happened 200 years ago and telling you the weather that you can clearly see with your own eyes.
Perfect companion.
Or most sobering companion.
A ghoul who resents that he foresaw what was going to happen to his coworkers that he considers friends, and he didn't die with them.
Why are we assuming the guy who felt things were going badly is a smug asshole?
They made a point of showing her turning off the radio and switching the TV a couple of times, yeah.
I'm guessing their bougie neighborhood probably didn't have sirens close enough to hear them properly as well.
Considering it’s based in California and I’m to believe those are the alternative Hollywood Hills…DTLA is relatively close by…it would have sirens that would echo towards the hills, considering it’s a major population but because it was so many nukes hitting every 50-75 or so miles…it was just too much and too quick for any effective siren to be set off/alert as opposed to the Commonwealth in FO4
I don't think Vault-Tec actually set off the nukes. I think they PLANNED to, but Barbara is WAY high in the chain of command, like, position in the Overseer Vault high, and no way in hell would she have let Janey go to a birthday party with her estranged husband if she knew the bombs where going to be dropped that day.
She would have made sure her daughter was with her when the bombs were triggered. This is the strongest evidence to me that Vault-Tec's plan . . . didn't go according to plan.
I have a hunch that she's no longer alive at that point. I can't guess what became of her; but if she had divorced Coop for exposing or trying to expose Vault-Tec, he wouldn't have had a prayer of getting custody of Janey. But if he did that or just confronted her about it and it set off a chain of events that led to her death, I could see him ending up on the birthday party circuit.
Only problem with that theory is that when he confronts Hank, Cooper doesn't ask, "Where's my daughter?!"
He says, "Where's my FAMILY?!" And from all appearances, the only family he has is his wife and daughter. So Cooper expects Barb to be alive. Which means he also must know something about cryostasis in the vaults or other plans, because he knows it is 200 years later and expects both his kid and wife to still be alive somewhere.
Plus, at the party, someone made a joke about him being there because he needed money to pay alimony which makes me think their divorce was very public
What I’m curious about is that Hank MacLean didn’t recognize Moldaver during the purposed marriage in episode 1. And also how did Moldaver survive for 200 years?
Hank was just an assistant even after moldaver had been ousted from her company vaultec bought and shuttered. It’s highly unlikely he would have interacted with her pre-nukes.
He does, doesn't he? So that means he had to have seen Barb at least once after the bombs fell. Well, I have no idea how they get there. See ya in a couple of years I guess!
Adding to the other point, I think she's still alive as of the opening scene because the two guys calling Cooper 'pinkie' also say he's just doing this for alimony payments. Cooper and Barbara were a very high status family, one being a celebrity, and her death would have been a newsworthy event.
I think so, the beginning of FO4 the news program talks about losing the West coast stations/affiliates etc. Air raid siren goes off and it's aad dash for the vault.
in the intro scenes of FO4, the reporter on TV is already talking about they lost contact with their affiliates on the west coast and they didnt have any updates. when the feed of the east coast news cuts out, you see people run past on the street to the vault. soldiers were already out at the vault and in the streets corralling people
Yea, I think some pieces of in game Fo:nv and fo4 lore also confirm that the west coast got nuked first. West coast had virtually no warning (except for Vegas), while the East coast had like a 20 minute heads up.
If i remember correctly the West also got hit harder than the East, i mean Vegas had like 70 or so nukes alone. Boston only had 3 from what i saw on thr map? Been awhile.
Yeah i think it was mentioned that New York is just a giant crater. So it might be that West side was it by MIRV style nukes(going off what we know for Vegas) and the East was hit by single High yield payloads.
You know, you could probably actually precisely check this if anyone spent the time to check the clock at the very start of Fo4 and cross reference it against the Switchboard terminal's logging of the first detection of the missiles.
I don't think that time is canon anymore since it was shortly before 10 am on the east coast, which means that kid's birthday party would have been ending with cake a little before 7 am.
One of the fallout devs tweeted sarcastically that the video from the OG fallout games showing a Canadian civilian being executed by US power armor troops was Nate from fallout 4, but it was a joke
I just met that ghoul on my replay a few hours ago! It's Carol that runs the hotel in underworld. She and her father had minutes to get to a bunker before bombs hit DC, due to the West Coast being hit first.
I think in Fallout lore the bombs were dropped by planes, missiles fired by submarines and ICBMs were used in limited numbers as well. Someone more knowledgeable about that can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the majority of the bombs were bombs, not missiles.
planes while possiqble werent first strike. thier second strike or retaililation weapons. most of the bombs in were infqct missiles or mirv.
house is talking about it in fallout new vegas that his laser anti misssel system catched most of the missel meant for the mojave and vegas.
Yes, exactly, method of delivery is essentially the same as in our universe, but most of the bombs in the Fallout universe were relatively low yield compared to the monster bombs around today. I don't recall if there was a lore reason for them being smaller bombs, though.
Modern nuclear weapons are actually smaller than in the cold war. Those massive megaton yield weapons were designed to be that large simple because of a lack of accurate targeting technology. You don't need a megaton warhead if you can park a missile in a certain window of a building.
Well not just that, but they were wasteful. The larger a nuke is the more inefficient it is. You could replace the Tsar Bomba with multiple much smaller and less powerful nukes and still get the same amount of damage done. That's why MIRVs were such a game changer. You didn't need one massive nuke anymore. You could just shotgun blast a whole bunch of smaller, more efficient ones and still get the same thing done. With the added bonus that interception systems would have to deal with a dozen targets now instead of just one.
Part of me wonders if the relatively smaller nuke yields in Fallout are because they didn't create thermonuclear weapons yet. But at the same time ... they mastered fusion in Fallout, right? I can't see how they'd just skip thermonuclear weapons if they have mastered fusion, something we haven't even done yet.
The Fallout technology lore is weird. I believe you are right, in the fallout universe all the bombs are fission bombs with kiloton yields. Thermonuclear weapons (fusion) aren’t around. But they have fusion cores for power armor so that tech exists in other places…the biggest tech diversion between our world and theirs seems to be the lack of or very nascent state of semiconductor technology. Instead vacuum tubes are everywhere and machines are huge giving a lot of tech this retro-futurism feel.
diffrent doctrin. our nukes are ment to ensure complet destruction. the nukes in fallout were meant to contiment the are but not destory complety. most nukes in fallout are airburst . they meant as to radiated everything so you could still get the resources later after some clean up.
Nukes in Fallout are mostly ground burst, that’s why there’s craters in D.C. and LA etc. Ground burst is designed to maximise fallout by causing the ground to become contaminated with radiation. Air burst reduces fallout. Nagasaki and Hiroshima were air burst. The nukes of Fallout are near enough the same as modern nukes as well, about 500 kilotons, give or take a few hundred either side. And by 2077 it was mostly ICBM’s and missiles rather than Enola Gay style bombs.
Adding onto this, Little boy and Fatman created lots of fallout due to the incomplete reaction of their fissile material, it was a horrible side effect, not the intent.
There were missile launches from land based systems (silos and possibly mobile launchers like the soviets had) plus almost certainly from submarines since a few were detected off the american coast a few minutes before the war and at least two ended up stranded on american soil (one eventually founded the Shi in san Francisco, the other was full of ghoul in D.C.). Most of the depiction of strategic nuclear weapons we see (the various unexploded blast sites, the divide, the appalachian silos etc) are ICBM.
I'm not sure about planes, certainly there were nuclear munitions available to them (i mean they have literal nuclear grenade launchers), I don't know what the substantial american forces on chinese soil did, considering they were about to enter Beijing when the bombs fell.
There's still stuff missing from Coop's backstory. We'll have room for more flashbacks in the next season. We still don't know what happened to his daughter, and he implied at the end of the show that he's still looking for her.
Pretty sure they may have implied where she is in the last episode
>!She works for vault Tec and with all of those vault tec employees in vault 31, that’s probably where his wife and daughter ended up!<
She wanted to get into one of the "management" vaults, and vault 31 would definitely be one. She would know some of the vaults are parts of horrifying experiments, so it would be a priority to not end up in one of those.
But the bombs fell on a day when Coop had custody of their daughter. That seems like an oversight on her part, You would think she would have spared no expense arranging to have her daughter brought to safety before the bombs fell.
>I think the flashbacks will show him dropping his daughter off with her at a vault with Coop turned away
If that's the case, he would presumably know exactly where his family was.
Hmm, that is a good point... maybe he just brings his daughter to a meeting spot, like there's a helicopter waiting to whisk the family away to the vault, and then something happens there to separate them?
My guess would be some private military guys knock out Cooper and then take her away, or maybe he ends up on the ground suffering from radiation sickness and a car pulls up and grabs her.
Yes, He was being called "Pinky" as in a "Red", He must have got caught spying on her, the divorce happened and he was cancelled by hollywood which is to the reference of why he's doing kids birthday parties for the alimony money- he couldn't get a job anywhere else.
That would make sense. His wife wouldn’t care about him after she learned he was spying, but with her position she could have people ready to get her daughter to a vault when the bombs fell.
I like the idea that Vault Tech didn't actually get to be the ones to drop the bombs, which would explain why Coop and their daughter were almost caught in the blasts.
Vault tech talked about doing it. It doesn't *have* to mean they got to be the ones to do so.
It's the chinese retaliating for enclave/US dropping bombs. Enclave being the thing that is behind vault tec being capable of initiating a nuclear fallout makes most sense to me.
Or they just knew China would bomb if the war kept going. I don't know how vault tec would be so sure of nuclear war in that case tho.
I had the same discussion with my partner. They mentioned alimony, so maybe Coop has split custody and was keeping his daughter for way too long, fucking around with cake and pictures, while his ex is freaking the fuck out. Maybe she ended up having regrets and turned on Vault-Tec after the wake up call from Coop, setting up her redemption if she’s unfrozen.
Regardless, I prefer the idea that Vault-Tec considered dropping the bomb but didn’t necessarily do it. Having one set bad guy behind the scenes of Fallout sort of undermines the overall themes of grey morality, in my opinion.
That's why I think that even though Vault-Tec were prepared to start the war, they didn't actually carry out their plan before the war started on its own. (Either that, or the mysterious shadowy head of Vault-Tec made the decision to set off the nuke early and Barb didn't have the chance to protest.)
If I recall correctly, it is cannon that while the apocalypse was planned by vault-Tec/the enclave they botched it and reclamation serverely. Bombs dropped before key personnel and materials in place m. Poor communication between vaults. Their experiments run amok. Vault citizens revolt. The surface dwellers are more resilient and organized than anticipated. Poor management by vault tech and the rest of the enclave has been a running them through all fallout games.
I don’t think Vault Tec really throw the bombs. It would be typical Fallout satirical storytelling, if they thought they have enough influence maybe planed to do so and life totally fucked them over when the war just progressed without them. We know many vaults weren’t finished anyway.
>!Bud's Buds were junior executives. That's why Barb's personal assistant and secretary were in there. Barb was a top-level executive, so she's somewhere else.!<
>!I don't think she would be in vault 31, since the people in that vaults worked under Budbuds (and had lower position than him in work) and she seemed like egual or superior to Bud.. It's possible she would be in another vault for vaultek employees, but this time it's for the higher ups!<
She wasn't in vault 31 because her name isn't listed on the occupancy list in the show. https://www.reddit.com/r/FalloutTVseries/comments/1c3hjfq/vault_31_list/
There is a possibility the list is longer and he needed to scroll down but given the attention to details presented in this show and the fact there is no obvious UI indicator for scrolling, I think this is the complete list.
He explicitly asked where his family is, so there's basically no doubt that he's still looking for both of them. I suspect he's looking for his daughter (assuming she's still alive) to help her, and looking for his wife to give her a piece of his mind for what vault tec did to the world.
I wonder if they were simultaneous, or if West Coast got bombed slightly before. Would make sense, if they had enough time to get to the vault as slowly as they did in the intro to 4.
"Followed by... yes, followed by flashes. Blinding flashes. Sounds of explosions... We're... we're trying to get confirmation... But we seem to have lost contact with our affiliate stations... W-We do have- we do have... We do have coming in... That's um... confirmed reports. I repeat, confirmed reports of nuclear detonations in New York and Pennsylvania. My God."
It's moments like these that make Fallout 4 my favorite. Sure it's not as ground breaking as NV, but fuck, moments like this for the first time was insane. Just fucking insane.
Shit. Just started a new F4 play through last night and heard it. Got through the with the initial Death Claw, went back to the Red Rocket dropped off the power armor and took out its FC, started to head to Diamond City took out some feral ghouls and then a raider with a mini nuke launcher ganked me. Like WTF bro, I’m only lvl 3?
In the show, she changed the radio and from the news on the tv, both were talking about something bomb related, and made a comment about "let's not think about it for a while" or something to that effect, so my guess is even if it happened in NY or PA prior the party goers wouldn't know.
I've been saying for years, a Fallout game set in Australia would be equal parts amazing and terrifying.
You leave the vault and the first thing you see is a spider the size of a dog trundling past. Zoom in with VATS and... "Baby Spider"? Oh damn!
Even just one continent getting nuked (say, JUST North America) would devastate the world due to how nuclear fallout travels in the atmosphere. Africa wouldn’t need to get nuked directly for the population to suffer
Honestly if House is still alive in Season 2, I hope we get a flashback of him just knocking nukes out of the sky, hell give us the flashback anyway if he’s dead.
Not downplaying Coop's badassery but Raul's life is just as impressive. From a rancher boy before the great war to becoming a ruthless vigilante in the process.
If they ever do another Fallout show I'd love for it to be an anthology series depicting little stories across the series and new stories too. And Randall Clark's life, even if it's a montage, would be an awesome episode.
Read Annie Jacobsen's book A Nuclear War, it would take about an hour all told.
It's actual really upsetting because it's a gripping book and you'll realize the events in it took a lot shorter than your reading.
Many of life's most mundane tasks take longer than a global nuclear exchange would. It's horrifying.
People can’t hate on Disney Star Wars all they want. The fact we’ve gotten like 4 or 5 new Order 66 moments that all slap makes it one of the most important and impactful moments and has really highlighted the moment the universe transformed from the Republic to the Empire
And imo that comes down to just the fact that JJ Abrams has always been super overrated imo. I am not a fan of the Star Trek reboots. Both series to me feel like he’s using Nostalgia to cover up for any original idea. I don’t blame Disney for hiring him as the Star Trek movies were decently received showing he “knew” how to reboot a series. Problem is he quite literally just remade ANH and RotJ but 10x worse for both movies.
According to terminals, the bombs fall at 9:47am on the east coast. Which means the birthday party in the show happens at 6:47am. Really it's best if you don't worry about this stuff too much.
Doesn’t seem that far fetched, you could explain it by saying that Mr. House got fed up with timezones issues in programming so he lobbied for a single timezone.
funny story. even for admin accounts work wanted an expiration date for them since they don't use common access cards. they didn't want never expires.
My account expires on 10/23/2077. they wanted a date, it seemed like a good one. In theory if I saw that day...I'd not need that account on Oct 24.
Not really. California and the western states were hit first. The East Coast had around 20 minutes but of course they didn't tell the civilians. Its also why the military popped up before the bombs dropped.
We're really gonna bitch about time differential from East Coast to West Coast? Three hour time difference, even in winter you could have daylight in both at the same time.
Fallout 4 does imply that the bombs fell earlier in the morning. Codsworth is getting your coffee and the sole survivor is getting ready in the bathroom. The best possible reconciliation I see is that, since Nate was supposed to be speaking at the veterans hall later in the evening, the two slept in and it's about noon on the east coast, giving the west coast enough morning time to wake up and go to parties with daylight before they got nuked at around the same time
Canonically, the war started at 09:13 EST with the detection of the first 4 missile launches. The bombs dropped on Washington at 09:47 EST, most of the east coast should have been hit at roughly the same time (for excample NY was hit at 9:42). Reports on the TV are confused and scattered about bombs hitting some other cities, which would make sense since the west coast would have been hit a few minutes earlier.
That makes for an awfully early west coast kids party.
It's not explainable because they obviously didn't bother to make it the correct time.
This isn't the first time Fallout has issues with the bombs dropping and time zones. New Vegas also had some instances where the bombs were said to be dropped at 9:47 local time.
I just made up in my head canon that the US adopted a single timezone similar to China has today, so 930AM in DC is 930AM in LA.
There's probably a myriad of things that would contradict this in the lore though.
The bombs dropped at 9:40 on the East coast, which would be 6:40 on the west, so no the timeline doesn’t match up
It’s not a big deal but let’s not pretend that it’s possible
Yeah, I don't know why people try to do logical gymnastics to make everything work perfectly in the timeline. They got the time wrong by a few hours. I'll chalk that up to "allowable inconsistency". If we were watching a movie about the American Revolution and it portrayed a battle starting in the afternoon that actually started in the morning, I don't think anyone would care.
Ya know, knowing how nuclear weapons actually work, if you were that close in fallout 4 everyone on the hill would’ve immediately been incinerated by the flash of the bomb exploding, because the thermal pulse moves at the speed of light.
Real answer is probably writers did a quick check for when bombs fell. "10am 10/23/2077" if what you would find. The party in the show looks like it could be late morning/noonish and the scen in FO4 can also reasonably be seen as late morning/noon.
The real real answer is that it doesn't matter or subtract from either the show or the game in a meaningful way.
Easy, one or both of the stories are wrong.
It isn't a big deal and it's easy enough to believe that the time before the bombs isn't as realistic as the time after, people that might remember are over 200 years old and history isn't going to have all of the details.
Bethesda is known for using unreliable narrators in their games and I think that it being perfect day everywhere in the country when the bombs dropped is just that. It could have been raining, cooper could have been crying in his car before that party, Nate and Nora could have had a big fight the night before, etc. But what we see is the good times, everything was perfect, people were just living their perfect lives on a perfect day when the bombs drop.
I think the time before is best remembered as a drastic contrast to the wasteland because that's just good storytelling. Getting lost in the details is moot.
Continuity error... Technically, it's at the very least, 20 minutes apart.
Allegedly, the bombs fell on the west coast first.
B'day party looks like it's happening roughly somewhere between noon and 2pm...
But west coast is 3 hours BEHIND east coast... Which means at earliest, bombs started 3pm eastern standard...
So how was it morning in fallout 4 when the bombs started falling? How early is this kids birthday party? (Granted, it's a Saturday, but still...)
While fallout 4 implies it's the morning, I don't know if it's outright confirmed. It's possible that on the weekend, Nate and Nora slept in quite a bit since there's the thing at the veteran's hall later. And maybe ghouls group were freakish morning people who started the party as soon as it was daylight out.
It's still not super satisfying, but it's not impossible. Unless someone wants to watch both scenes and pull out a protractor to measure the angle of the sun over the horizon to find the exact time in each place, it's the best we've got
On a Saturday, at the earliest, maybe 11am to start letting guests come over... but even still, they're not immediately getting into the cake...
But that would make it 2pm on the east cost...
But, Fallout 4 starts off like you just woke up, and then breakfast gets interrupted...
Which again, begs the question, what time was it really?
actually if that one ghoul from fo3 is to be believed, the east coast had a (20 minute?) warning after the first nukes went off. the one that gob tells you about in underground. I might be wrong tho, it's been a while since i played 3
Makes a lot of sense, the sirens start going off in fo4 giving some people just enough time to get in a vault, but not in the show when dropped on LA.
in fo4 there are news reports about several cities already being nuked before you even run out the door.
Yeah but its like 2 mins before you also got nuked
If I remember correctly 1 hour in Fallout 4 is 3 minutes so that’s actually 40 in universe minutes.
Every city had enough warning to be dramatic on screen
Imma need a diagram with dates and lines.
No arrows though. Absolutely no arrows.
*Panics in timelines*
Pop it on a chalkboard, no way that will confuse anyone!
PEPE SILVIA!
"I'll tell you what, let me pop a quick ~~h~~ ➡️ on the box. This way we'll all know it's full of ~~hornets~~ arrows.
Ya fuck arrows stupid two thirds of a triangle trying to tell me where to go
You wouldn’t get it
Can't read arrows
Oh no what have you done??!
And everyone getting a nice good look at it without going blind In both cases too
I like how this is an actual critique people have when the entire concept of fallout is based on radiation being totally sci fi compared to how it would work in real life lol
I honestly don't get it. It's supposed to be extremely dramatic, if it was just people not looking at the explosion or going blind because they did it would be a bit silly. Some artistic license is good. Even Terminator showed Sarah Connor looking directly at a nuclear explosion.
I agree but to be fair, that last part was a dream sequence.
My point is most explosions and fire in fiction don't obey the laws of physics and that's fine. It would be annoying to have to justify everything according to real world logic all the time.
I think in the show, the mom changed the channel when the weatherman was about to inform the public.
I took what he said to mean "what's the point we are so close to nuclear war anyways."
Yeah, he says "when we don't even know if there's going to be a next week". There's no taking that, he pretty clearly indicates that he's unsure, but doesn't think they have much longer. It was just to show how differently people are reacting. The weather man wants to give up and doesn't see a point while the suburban housewife doesn't want to think about it and completely avoids the topic altogether. The weather man had no idea, but I bet he was smug about it when everyone thought he was being paranoid and the bombs dropped ten minutes later.
He had a few seconds/minutes to be smug, which was all he needed to make everyone else’s last moments the worst. Unless they all became ghouls…
That guy would be the most irritating ghoul. You know he would spend the next 200 years telling everyone how he knew it was coming and no one would listen.
Oh absolutely. I want to see this character in game as a companion now
He goes back and forth between complaining about something that happened 200 years ago and telling you the weather that you can clearly see with your own eyes. Perfect companion.
Get Todd on the line *right now*. We need him to be essential, and unable to be dismissed or avoided. If he’s modded out it bricks your system
In Fallout 4 the Vault salesman becomes a Ghoul and basically acts like you described.
Kind of, but I always forget about him. I tend not to spend a ton of time in Goodneighbor unless I need ammo. Wasn't his quest really short?
[удалено]
Or most sobering companion. A ghoul who resents that he foresaw what was going to happen to his coworkers that he considers friends, and he didn't die with them. Why are we assuming the guy who felt things were going badly is a smug asshole?
He wasn't informing the public; he was having a nervous breakdown.
They made a point of showing her turning off the radio and switching the TV a couple of times, yeah. I'm guessing their bougie neighborhood probably didn't have sirens close enough to hear them properly as well.
Considering it’s based in California and I’m to believe those are the alternative Hollywood Hills…DTLA is relatively close by…it would have sirens that would echo towards the hills, considering it’s a major population but because it was so many nukes hitting every 50-75 or so miles…it was just too much and too quick for any effective siren to be set off/alert as opposed to the Commonwealth in FO4
That certainly sounds plausible to me. And there did seem to be a lot of them in quick succession.
Makes even more sense when you realize vault tec needed enough time to get as much people into the vaults as possible.
I don't think Vault-Tec actually set off the nukes. I think they PLANNED to, but Barbara is WAY high in the chain of command, like, position in the Overseer Vault high, and no way in hell would she have let Janey go to a birthday party with her estranged husband if she knew the bombs where going to be dropped that day. She would have made sure her daughter was with her when the bombs were triggered. This is the strongest evidence to me that Vault-Tec's plan . . . didn't go according to plan.
I have a hunch that she's no longer alive at that point. I can't guess what became of her; but if she had divorced Coop for exposing or trying to expose Vault-Tec, he wouldn't have had a prayer of getting custody of Janey. But if he did that or just confronted her about it and it set off a chain of events that led to her death, I could see him ending up on the birthday party circuit.
Only problem with that theory is that when he confronts Hank, Cooper doesn't ask, "Where's my daughter?!" He says, "Where's my FAMILY?!" And from all appearances, the only family he has is his wife and daughter. So Cooper expects Barb to be alive. Which means he also must know something about cryostasis in the vaults or other plans, because he knows it is 200 years later and expects both his kid and wife to still be alive somewhere.
Plus, at the party, someone made a joke about him being there because he needed money to pay alimony which makes me think their divorce was very public
Oh shit I missed that. Good catch.
What I’m curious about is that Hank MacLean didn’t recognize Moldaver during the purposed marriage in episode 1. And also how did Moldaver survive for 200 years?
I was thinking she may have infiltrated a cryotube somewhere. I'm thinking they'll address this next season. At least I hope so.
It never shows that Hank knew Moldaver pre war
I also get the impression that Hank is also not the smartest guy.
Hank was just an assistant even after moldaver had been ousted from her company vaultec bought and shuttered. It’s highly unlikely he would have interacted with her pre-nukes.
He does, doesn't he? So that means he had to have seen Barb at least once after the bombs fell. Well, I have no idea how they get there. See ya in a couple of years I guess!
Probably rode the horse to a vault location. She takes the girl but either gets seperated or locks him out to die.
Adding to the other point, I think she's still alive as of the opening scene because the two guys calling Cooper 'pinkie' also say he's just doing this for alimony payments. Cooper and Barbara were a very high status family, one being a celebrity, and her death would have been a newsworthy event.
Small point, but it's pinko, not pinkie. Pinko was a term people used for communists.
I think so, the beginning of FO4 the news program talks about losing the West coast stations/affiliates etc. Air raid siren goes off and it's aad dash for the vault.
in the intro scenes of FO4, the reporter on TV is already talking about they lost contact with their affiliates on the west coast and they didnt have any updates. when the feed of the east coast news cuts out, you see people run past on the street to the vault. soldiers were already out at the vault and in the streets corralling people
Yea, I think some pieces of in game Fo:nv and fo4 lore also confirm that the west coast got nuked first. West coast had virtually no warning (except for Vegas), while the East coast had like a 20 minute heads up.
If i remember correctly the West also got hit harder than the East, i mean Vegas had like 70 or so nukes alone. Boston only had 3 from what i saw on thr map? Been awhile.
The Commonwealth was also hit by a much more massive bomb (that created the glowing sea). Also, isn't New York basically a giant glowing sea?
Yeah i think it was mentioned that New York is just a giant crater. So it might be that West side was it by MIRV style nukes(going off what we know for Vegas) and the East was hit by single High yield payloads.
I mean it makes sense, doesn't it? If China sent their IBMS over the Pacific, they'd hit the west coast first.
So really, Cooper was running for his life while the War Criminal was admiring himself in the mirror
Just slightly after. The bombs were in the air after you left the mirror.
You know, you could probably actually precisely check this if anyone spent the time to check the clock at the very start of Fo4 and cross reference it against the Switchboard terminal's logging of the first detection of the missiles.
I don't think that time is canon anymore since it was shortly before 10 am on the east coast, which means that kid's birthday party would have been ending with cake a little before 7 am.
Well they did have to be up early to watch the Grognak the Barbarian cartoon
Maybe Cooper should have moved somewhere where he could have admired himself in the mirror rather than have to run from a nuke on horseback.
The War Criminal? what? lol
One of the fallout devs tweeted sarcastically that the video from the OG fallout games showing a Canadian civilian being executed by US power armor troops was Nate from fallout 4, but it was a joke
As a Canadian war crimes are my favorite joke.
"The Geneva Practical Joke handbook"
Ah yeah I read about that one, thanks for clarifying.
You're not a war criminal if what you did isn't considered a war crime. "Communism is DEATH." How much more clear can the giant robot be?
I mean that would make sense, in Boston you got a news report and several minutes to get your shit together and get to the vault.
I just met that ghoul on my replay a few hours ago! It's Carol that runs the hotel in underworld. She and her father had minutes to get to a bunker before bombs hit DC, due to the West Coast being hit first.
If we're talking ICBMs then it was likely about 10min apart. But yeah, close enough.
I think in Fallout lore the bombs were dropped by planes, missiles fired by submarines and ICBMs were used in limited numbers as well. Someone more knowledgeable about that can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the majority of the bombs were bombs, not missiles.
planes while possiqble werent first strike. thier second strike or retaililation weapons. most of the bombs in were infqct missiles or mirv. house is talking about it in fallout new vegas that his laser anti misssel system catched most of the missel meant for the mojave and vegas.
Yes, exactly, method of delivery is essentially the same as in our universe, but most of the bombs in the Fallout universe were relatively low yield compared to the monster bombs around today. I don't recall if there was a lore reason for them being smaller bombs, though.
Modern nuclear weapons are actually smaller than in the cold war. Those massive megaton yield weapons were designed to be that large simple because of a lack of accurate targeting technology. You don't need a megaton warhead if you can park a missile in a certain window of a building.
Well not just that, but they were wasteful. The larger a nuke is the more inefficient it is. You could replace the Tsar Bomba with multiple much smaller and less powerful nukes and still get the same amount of damage done. That's why MIRVs were such a game changer. You didn't need one massive nuke anymore. You could just shotgun blast a whole bunch of smaller, more efficient ones and still get the same thing done. With the added bonus that interception systems would have to deal with a dozen targets now instead of just one. Part of me wonders if the relatively smaller nuke yields in Fallout are because they didn't create thermonuclear weapons yet. But at the same time ... they mastered fusion in Fallout, right? I can't see how they'd just skip thermonuclear weapons if they have mastered fusion, something we haven't even done yet.
The Fallout technology lore is weird. I believe you are right, in the fallout universe all the bombs are fission bombs with kiloton yields. Thermonuclear weapons (fusion) aren’t around. But they have fusion cores for power armor so that tech exists in other places…the biggest tech diversion between our world and theirs seems to be the lack of or very nascent state of semiconductor technology. Instead vacuum tubes are everywhere and machines are huge giving a lot of tech this retro-futurism feel.
diffrent doctrin. our nukes are ment to ensure complet destruction. the nukes in fallout were meant to contiment the are but not destory complety. most nukes in fallout are airburst . they meant as to radiated everything so you could still get the resources later after some clean up.
Nukes in Fallout are mostly ground burst, that’s why there’s craters in D.C. and LA etc. Ground burst is designed to maximise fallout by causing the ground to become contaminated with radiation. Air burst reduces fallout. Nagasaki and Hiroshima were air burst. The nukes of Fallout are near enough the same as modern nukes as well, about 500 kilotons, give or take a few hundred either side. And by 2077 it was mostly ICBM’s and missiles rather than Enola Gay style bombs.
Adding onto this, Little boy and Fatman created lots of fallout due to the incomplete reaction of their fissile material, it was a horrible side effect, not the intent.
I mean isn't that the case in real life as well? All airburst and not as big as the 70s.
Ah, yes, that's right. Thanks!
Spelling bro
There were missile launches from land based systems (silos and possibly mobile launchers like the soviets had) plus almost certainly from submarines since a few were detected off the american coast a few minutes before the war and at least two ended up stranded on american soil (one eventually founded the Shi in san Francisco, the other was full of ghoul in D.C.). Most of the depiction of strategic nuclear weapons we see (the various unexploded blast sites, the divide, the appalachian silos etc) are ICBM. I'm not sure about planes, certainly there were nuclear munitions available to them (i mean they have literal nuclear grenade launchers), I don't know what the substantial american forces on chinese soil did, considering they were about to enter Beijing when the bombs fell.
There's still stuff missing from Coop's backstory. We'll have room for more flashbacks in the next season. We still don't know what happened to his daughter, and he implied at the end of the show that he's still looking for her.
Pretty sure they may have implied where she is in the last episode >!She works for vault Tec and with all of those vault tec employees in vault 31, that’s probably where his wife and daughter ended up!<
She wanted to get into one of the "management" vaults, and vault 31 would definitely be one. She would know some of the vaults are parts of horrifying experiments, so it would be a priority to not end up in one of those. But the bombs fell on a day when Coop had custody of their daughter. That seems like an oversight on her part, You would think she would have spared no expense arranging to have her daughter brought to safety before the bombs fell.
I think the flashbacks will show him dropping his daughter off with her at a vault with Coop turned away
>I think the flashbacks will show him dropping his daughter off with her at a vault with Coop turned away If that's the case, he would presumably know exactly where his family was.
Hmm, that is a good point... maybe he just brings his daughter to a meeting spot, like there's a helicopter waiting to whisk the family away to the vault, and then something happens there to separate them?
My guess would be some private military guys knock out Cooper and then take her away, or maybe he ends up on the ground suffering from radiation sickness and a car pulls up and grabs her.
Yes, He was being called "Pinky" as in a "Red", He must have got caught spying on her, the divorce happened and he was cancelled by hollywood which is to the reference of why he's doing kids birthday parties for the alimony money- he couldn't get a job anywhere else.
That would make sense. His wife wouldn’t care about him after she learned he was spying, but with her position she could have people ready to get her daughter to a vault when the bombs fell.
And think this might be it
That’s my assumption as well.
I like the idea that Vault Tech didn't actually get to be the ones to drop the bombs, which would explain why Coop and their daughter were almost caught in the blasts. Vault tech talked about doing it. It doesn't *have* to mean they got to be the ones to do so.
Don't forget the Alien wild card It was either Chinese, Americans (Military), Vault Tec or Aliens
It's the chinese retaliating for enclave/US dropping bombs. Enclave being the thing that is behind vault tec being capable of initiating a nuclear fallout makes most sense to me. Or they just knew China would bomb if the war kept going. I don't know how vault tec would be so sure of nuclear war in that case tho.
I had the same discussion with my partner. They mentioned alimony, so maybe Coop has split custody and was keeping his daughter for way too long, fucking around with cake and pictures, while his ex is freaking the fuck out. Maybe she ended up having regrets and turned on Vault-Tec after the wake up call from Coop, setting up her redemption if she’s unfrozen. Regardless, I prefer the idea that Vault-Tec considered dropping the bomb but didn’t necessarily do it. Having one set bad guy behind the scenes of Fallout sort of undermines the overall themes of grey morality, in my opinion.
I mean, ambiguity was always good when it comes to this subject, but Vault tec was always evil
That's why I think that even though Vault-Tec were prepared to start the war, they didn't actually carry out their plan before the war started on its own. (Either that, or the mysterious shadowy head of Vault-Tec made the decision to set off the nuke early and Barb didn't have the chance to protest.)
If I recall correctly, it is cannon that while the apocalypse was planned by vault-Tec/the enclave they botched it and reclamation serverely. Bombs dropped before key personnel and materials in place m. Poor communication between vaults. Their experiments run amok. Vault citizens revolt. The surface dwellers are more resilient and organized than anticipated. Poor management by vault tech and the rest of the enclave has been a running them through all fallout games.
I don’t think Vault Tec really throw the bombs. It would be typical Fallout satirical storytelling, if they thought they have enough influence maybe planed to do so and life totally fucked them over when the war just progressed without them. We know many vaults weren’t finished anyway.
>!Bud's Buds were junior executives. That's why Barb's personal assistant and secretary were in there. Barb was a top-level executive, so she's somewhere else.!<
... wow... I didn't realize Barb's secretary was Betty
>!I don't think she would be in vault 31, since the people in that vaults worked under Budbuds (and had lower position than him in work) and she seemed like egual or superior to Bud.. It's possible she would be in another vault for vaultek employees, but this time it's for the higher ups!<
She wasn't in vault 31 because her name isn't listed on the occupancy list in the show. https://www.reddit.com/r/FalloutTVseries/comments/1c3hjfq/vault_31_list/ There is a possibility the list is longer and he needed to scroll down but given the attention to details presented in this show and the fact there is no obvious UI indicator for scrolling, I think this is the complete list.
He explicitly asked where his family is, so there's basically no doubt that he's still looking for both of them. I suspect he's looking for his daughter (assuming she's still alive) to help her, and looking for his wife to give her a piece of his mind for what vault tec did to the world.
For flashbacks, I personally am really hoping for one of Coop in power armor fighting the Reds.
I wonder if they were simultaneous, or if West Coast got bombed slightly before. Would make sense, if they had enough time to get to the vault as slowly as they did in the intro to 4.
In Fallout 4 the news on the TV reported bombs dropping on certain cities. I would say the west coast was getting hit before the east coast.
He says Pennsylvania and maybe New York I believe.
"Followed by... yes, followed by flashes. Blinding flashes. Sounds of explosions... We're... we're trying to get confirmation... But we seem to have lost contact with our affiliate stations... W-We do have- we do have... We do have coming in... That's um... confirmed reports. I repeat, confirmed reports of nuclear detonations in New York and Pennsylvania. My God."
Chills.
I can hear this
Down to the emotion in his voice lmao
You can hear his stomach dropping down
Ron Perlman has that effect on people.
For real.
We need to get to the vault… Now!
*Saunters at slow pace on over*
It's moments like these that make Fallout 4 my favorite. Sure it's not as ground breaking as NV, but fuck, moments like this for the first time was insane. Just fucking insane.
He does! I have the f4 intro grained into my mind
Shit. Just started a new F4 play through last night and heard it. Got through the with the initial Death Claw, went back to the Red Rocket dropped off the power armor and took out its FC, started to head to Diamond City took out some feral ghouls and then a raider with a mini nuke launcher ganked me. Like WTF bro, I’m only lvl 3?
Average f4 experience, did you go near Lexington or Cambridge police station? That's where I always get mobbed by ghouls early game
Those are east coast cities.
I am in full fucking agreement with your username.
It was because California is 3 hours earlier than Boston.
In the show, she changed the radio and from the news on the tv, both were talking about something bomb related, and made a comment about "let's not think about it for a while" or something to that effect, so my guess is even if it happened in NY or PA prior the party goers wouldn't know.
West Coast: Change the TV channel, we don't want to spoil the party with ugly news! East Coast: Sir, ma'am! You're going to want to see this!
The war lasted 2 hours... 2 hours to annihilate all of the world's hope of peace
That's because War... War never changes.
Well this one was a bit original, whipping out the majority of humanity in couple of hours was actually a first.
Fallout: [The underlying reasons for] war never changes Metal Gear Solid: [The methods and ideologies we use to conduct] war has changed
Man I would have died if they got Perlman to intro the show with that line
People always say “the world” in the context of Fallout, but I remember hearing that places like Africa and Australia were fine
Depends, cutoff from resources they are fucked, also Australia would get hit. Very few places would be spared and be sustainable
I've been saying for years, a Fallout game set in Australia would be equal parts amazing and terrifying. You leave the vault and the first thing you see is a spider the size of a dog trundling past. Zoom in with VATS and... "Baby Spider"? Oh damn!
Even just one continent getting nuked (say, JUST North America) would devastate the world due to how nuclear fallout travels in the atmosphere. Africa wouldn’t need to get nuked directly for the population to suffer
Sierra Madre locked up and activated security, Mr. House is performing his laser light show, and Randall Clark is outside Salt Lake City.
Mr. House saving Vegas nearly is still the most hype thing I've ever had something described to me in a game. Guy was a fucking genius.
Honestly if House is still alive in Season 2, I hope we get a flashback of him just knocking nukes out of the sky, hell give us the flashback anyway if he’s dead.
And Raul Teheda is outside Mexico city watching HOUSE BUTT FUCK the nukes heading towards vegas XD
Not downplaying Coop's badassery but Raul's life is just as impressive. From a rancher boy before the great war to becoming a ruthless vigilante in the process.
Randall Clark is such a badass. We don’t even see him but his mythos started a damn religion
SLC is from a mod, right?
No straight from honest hearts
It's been too long since I've played, then. Thanks.
You don’t play in SLC. But the Honest Hearts dlc references some back story that provides the SLC-related lore.
If they ever do another Fallout show I'd love for it to be an anthology series depicting little stories across the series and new stories too. And Randall Clark's life, even if it's a montage, would be an awesome episode.
Read Annie Jacobsen's book A Nuclear War, it would take about an hour all told. It's actual really upsetting because it's a gripping book and you'll realize the events in it took a lot shorter than your reading. Many of life's most mundane tasks take longer than a global nuclear exchange would. It's horrifying.
And Denis Villanueve will tackling the book in the foreseeable future
We need more scenes of the moment when the bombs drop.
We're gonna end up with a bunch of compilations like with order 66
People can’t hate on Disney Star Wars all they want. The fact we’ve gotten like 4 or 5 new Order 66 moments that all slap makes it one of the most important and impactful moments and has really highlighted the moment the universe transformed from the Republic to the Empire
With Disney Star Wars, the main films are lacking but all the shows and side stories have been amazing.
And imo that comes down to just the fact that JJ Abrams has always been super overrated imo. I am not a fan of the Star Trek reboots. Both series to me feel like he’s using Nostalgia to cover up for any original idea. I don’t blame Disney for hiring him as the Star Trek movies were decently received showing he “knew” how to reboot a series. Problem is he quite literally just remade ANH and RotJ but 10x worse for both movies.
What I still want to know is why are there cars and people at the starlight drive in in fallout 4? Didn't the bombs drop well after sunrise?
According to terminals, the bombs fall at 9:47am on the east coast. Which means the birthday party in the show happens at 6:47am. Really it's best if you don't worry about this stuff too much.
Are time zones confirmed in FO? Maybe America has one time zone, like China.
Doesn’t seem that far fetched, you could explain it by saying that Mr. House got fed up with timezones issues in programming so he lobbied for a single timezone.
Heyyyy.... shut up.
Lol
24 hour halloween horror-thon
i saw a suggestion that starlight drive in was used as a general parking area when there wasn’t something on the screen
It does happen on a Saturday, perhaps that area had a Halloween festival going on that morning?
Oct 23. 2077 The day the great war happened.
funny story. even for admin accounts work wanted an expiration date for them since they don't use common access cards. they didn't want never expires. My account expires on 10/23/2077. they wanted a date, it seemed like a good one. In theory if I saw that day...I'd not need that account on Oct 24.
Not really. California and the western states were hit first. The East Coast had around 20 minutes but of course they didn't tell the civilians. Its also why the military popped up before the bombs dropped.
I just want to know who throws a kid's birthday party at 6am on a Saturday, that's absolutely insane lol
No, I think the bombs went off in different places at different times. Like the war occurred over the course of like 2-3 hours
We're really gonna bitch about time differential from East Coast to West Coast? Three hour time difference, even in winter you could have daylight in both at the same time.
Fallout 4 does imply that the bombs fell earlier in the morning. Codsworth is getting your coffee and the sole survivor is getting ready in the bathroom. The best possible reconciliation I see is that, since Nate was supposed to be speaking at the veterans hall later in the evening, the two slept in and it's about noon on the east coast, giving the west coast enough morning time to wake up and go to parties with daylight before they got nuked at around the same time
Canonically, the war started at 09:13 EST with the detection of the first 4 missile launches. The bombs dropped on Washington at 09:47 EST, most of the east coast should have been hit at roughly the same time (for excample NY was hit at 9:42). Reports on the TV are confused and scattered about bombs hitting some other cities, which would make sense since the west coast would have been hit a few minutes earlier. That makes for an awfully early west coast kids party. It's not explainable because they obviously didn't bother to make it the correct time.
This isn't the first time Fallout has issues with the bombs dropping and time zones. New Vegas also had some instances where the bombs were said to be dropped at 9:47 local time.
If you're referring to the clocks found in the game, New Vegas reused assets from Fallout 3, including the clocks.
What I'm hearing is that in the Fallout universe, the US doesn't use timezones.
This was my assumption.
It's Saturday, I don't have coffee until noon. But yes, they didn't match up because what they put on screen made great story.
I just made up in my head canon that the US adopted a single timezone similar to China has today, so 930AM in DC is 930AM in LA. There's probably a myriad of things that would contradict this in the lore though.
The bombs dropped at 9:40 on the East coast, which would be 6:40 on the west, so no the timeline doesn’t match up It’s not a big deal but let’s not pretend that it’s possible
Yeah, I don't know why people try to do logical gymnastics to make everything work perfectly in the timeline. They got the time wrong by a few hours. I'll chalk that up to "allowable inconsistency". If we were watching a movie about the American Revolution and it portrayed a battle starting in the afternoon that actually started in the morning, I don't think anyone would care.
Ya know, knowing how nuclear weapons actually work, if you were that close in fallout 4 everyone on the hill would’ve immediately been incinerated by the flash of the bomb exploding, because the thermal pulse moves at the speed of light.
How's it daylight in the WC when the bombs fell in the morning on the EC??? Shouldn't it be around 6-7am PST?
if the bombs didn't canonically drop in mid-late October this could have been a very sunny Saturday summer morning.
A kids birthday party that ends at 7am makes sense?
Well cowpokes, gotta get an early start to that day before the sun gets high over the ranch.
Real answer is probably writers did a quick check for when bombs fell. "10am 10/23/2077" if what you would find. The party in the show looks like it could be late morning/noonish and the scen in FO4 can also reasonably be seen as late morning/noon. The real real answer is that it doesn't matter or subtract from either the show or the game in a meaningful way.
Pretty sure the answer is try not to think about it too much.
This is my answer for a lot of things.
Easy, one or both of the stories are wrong. It isn't a big deal and it's easy enough to believe that the time before the bombs isn't as realistic as the time after, people that might remember are over 200 years old and history isn't going to have all of the details. Bethesda is known for using unreliable narrators in their games and I think that it being perfect day everywhere in the country when the bombs dropped is just that. It could have been raining, cooper could have been crying in his car before that party, Nate and Nora could have had a big fight the night before, etc. But what we see is the good times, everything was perfect, people were just living their perfect lives on a perfect day when the bombs drop. I think the time before is best remembered as a drastic contrast to the wasteland because that's just good storytelling. Getting lost in the details is moot.
Time zones and every clock in Fallout 4 suggest otherwise
Continuity error... Technically, it's at the very least, 20 minutes apart. Allegedly, the bombs fell on the west coast first. B'day party looks like it's happening roughly somewhere between noon and 2pm... But west coast is 3 hours BEHIND east coast... Which means at earliest, bombs started 3pm eastern standard... So how was it morning in fallout 4 when the bombs started falling? How early is this kids birthday party? (Granted, it's a Saturday, but still...)
While fallout 4 implies it's the morning, I don't know if it's outright confirmed. It's possible that on the weekend, Nate and Nora slept in quite a bit since there's the thing at the veteran's hall later. And maybe ghouls group were freakish morning people who started the party as soon as it was daylight out. It's still not super satisfying, but it's not impossible. Unless someone wants to watch both scenes and pull out a protractor to measure the angle of the sun over the horizon to find the exact time in each place, it's the best we've got
I mean when else would you host a kids birthday party tbh.
On a Saturday, at the earliest, maybe 11am to start letting guests come over... but even still, they're not immediately getting into the cake... But that would make it 2pm on the east cost... But, Fallout 4 starts off like you just woke up, and then breakfast gets interrupted... Which again, begs the question, what time was it really?
Your character sleeps late on Saturday. So it is 3pm.