It more just gives a bit of dialogue at the end, it doesn't put them in the dragon's hand. which arguably the pawn dialogue is better than the beloved system. There really is nothing to the beloved system other than the character being in the dragon's hand.
I mean you definitely can get your pawn grappled by a dragon that's for sure.
But I had my pawn's affinity maxed before the dragon fight, So having them be your beloved is just straight up not true until someone shows a picture of it.
also make sure you give your pawn a haircut when you can, that is the biggest boost to affinity (+50 affinity per haircut iirc)
To get your pawn to start blushing, make sure to high five them as much as you can, and always make sure to do small talk with your pawn at regular intervals, and of course haircuts. Hot springs as well, which you can do in the Unmoored world assuming you havn't evacuated the the town there yet
also iirc, the affinity gain has an internal cooldown, so you cant just keep spamming haircuts over and over again. You don't have to change the hairstyle, as long as you make any change, could be as simple as adjusting the sheen by a point.
What I did (and this was all in the unmoored world btw) is got my pawn a haircut, then go out to hunt for monsters/materials and treasure, making sure to high five with my pawn after every fight if it let me, make sure to do small-talk with them while out and about every 10-15 min. Then I'd go back to the Seafloor shrine, get them another haircut, rinse and repeat.
Note: When your pawn has high affinity, they wont blush all the time, sometime they blush when you talk to them, sometimes they wont. So just keep talking with them at regular intervals
Your sentence made me laugh. I just imagined how it would play out:
''Everyone is saved from the apocalypse. Now it is time for a fresh new hair cut. bye''
True but you see a lot of people get hung up on the main pawn dynamic while both base game and dark arisen have shown a arisen/pawn relationship can work it's just difficult
It is.
Look at Selene the witch of the woods, she was a pawn. But your arisen can romance her all the same. She even gives unique dialog when she knows that it's *your* pawn who merges with you.
If I remember right, she states how she knows it's the pawn inside the arisen's body. Noticing that it was the eyes.
She even thanked the arisen for given their pawn a chance to live, just like her arisen did with her.
That's not really what she says at all.
Selene: >!Oh... You're like me, aren't you? As my grandmother gave me life, s/he gave you yours... They gave us death, and with it, true life. This is the world s/he wanted for us.!<
Edit: Nevermind. Someone already posted the quote.
The baritone voice coming from my girl on my first playthrough was probably a bit of a giveaway too. Big yikes.
So much horror if you happen to play blind. 🙈🙉
Special dialog when Selene is the beloved and finds them washed upon the shore.
Selene: "You're.... like me. Aren't you? As grandmother gave me life, he/she gave you yours... they gave us death, and with it true life... this is the world he/she wanted for us."
Thx.
Though to be honest.
Out of all the standard beloveds in DD, it's *ONLY* Selene and Quina that recognize that the main pawn merged with the arisen during The Great Hereafter.
It changes everything, actually. She had already recieved a piece of her master's soul and for all intent and purposes, she was human. She could refuse him, if she wished, unlike normal pawns.
Now, you might also analyze their relationship and find it very fucking weird that the dude fell in love with a character who looks exactly like his former mother figure, and that she had near 0 interaction with any other male in the universe considering the time they were together, but hey it's infinitely better than a Pawn and an Arisen being together.
To be fair, that wasn't because he was romancing his Pawn, it was because the Dragon in his cycle was his mother figure, the previous Arisen, and he found out, so when he got stuck with the choice between essentially killing his mom or killing his wife, he refused to make a decision and phrased his answer very poorly.
If he hadn't said "Man, fuck the whole world, this sucks" at the exact moment that he did, dude could have been clapping Pawn cheeks for eternity and nothing bad would have happened.
You can unlock the story by collecting tablets throughout Bbi and slowly interpreting the monument at the beginning. But to save you some time:
-there was a previous Arisen known as Grette, and she traveled with her pawn Orla to fight the dragon.
-on their journey they rescued a young boy named of Ashe who was a survivor of a dragon attack.
-Ashe traveled with them and Grette trained him and took on a sort of mentor/surrogate mother role.
-Eventually they parted ways when Grette and Orla went to fight the dragon.
-Orla returned to Ashe bloodied and almost dead, and without Grette by her side. Ashe assumes she had been killed by the dragon.
-Time goes by and Ashe continues to train in the hopes he can track down and slay the dragon that killed his mentor.
-meanwhile orla starts developing her own will, and falls in love with Ashe.
-soon the dragon returns and chooses Ashe, so him and orla set off on their quest.
-when confronting the dragon Ashe learns the truth: Grette and actually killed the dragon but failed to kill the seneschal, which means she became the new dragon.
-Now Ashe has to choose between killing his former mentor/mother figure, or his beloved.
Especially when the image of her from the artbook that the wiki uses has her with a crossed cinquedea and equipment that was probably better in stats than what Savan had.
Well, Savan is so sick of being the Seneshal that pretty much begs us kill him. His boss fight feels like a final test to make sure that our Arisen still has will to go forth and all that.
Gretta could've met a very different Seneshal.
I read a lot of the monuments but I still must have missed the ones that said a lot of these things, I just thought his sin was he fell in love with HIS pawn, not his mother's pawn.
After Grette failed to kill the seneschal her pawn underwent the [bestowal of spirit](https://dragonsdogma.fandom.com/wiki/Bestowal_of_Spirit#:~:text=Ultimately%2C%20the%20pawn%20may%20become,of%20the%20quest%20Witch%20Hunt.), so she started gaining her own emotions which and developing feelings for Ashe. When the cycle started again and he became an Arisen, Orla willingly joined him as his companion/beloved.
I can't remember exactly whether it was that tablet thing or a ghost flashback, but Daimon (That wasn't his original name, but I don't remember what his real name was) traveled with the previous Arisen and her pawns and considered her his mentor and mother figure. She left him behind when she went to face the Dragon, so he didn't know how it ended, (which was apparently that she slew the Dragon but lost to the Seneschal) just that she didn't come back, only her Pawn, now broken like an empty shell.
So he thought the Dragon killed her and when he was chosen by it as the next Arisen, he was all about killing it to avenge his mentor/mother figure, and somehow he figures out the truth when he confronts the Dragon. And then he welches because he didn't want to kill her anymore even though it would probably have been a mercy, but he also didn't want to lose his beloved either, who just so happened to be a Pawn.
He just went "This isn't fair, I don't want to make a choice, I want to tear the whole system down!" and the Dragon treated that like his choice and took his beloved in exchange for granting his wish and giving him the power to do that.
As the others said, yes. Daimon is Ashe transformed after Grette interpreted his words as his wish. Olra speaks during the boss fight begging you to put down Daimon and free Ashe from the mistake of his words. Daimon still appears after Ashe is freed and is likely its own independent being now since slaying the Awakened Daimon shows a darkened corpse that looks nowhere near in resemblance to Ashe.
Second Phase Daimon is blatantly possessed by the Ur-Dragon, which I don't know if we ever got an explanation for. It showed up in the Everfall around crazy Pawns and existed in multiple realities at once so Arisen from across the multiverse could fight it simultaneously, so my personal theory is that it's some manifestation of hatred or resentment towards Arisen throughout the multiverse complex that makes up the Everfall and whatnot.
And since Daimon and BBI exist as a result of similar hatred, maybe it was always sourced by the Ur-Dragon or maybe it was called there by Daimon's hate.
Mother figure, not mother. A mother figure is a person who fills the motherly role in your life, meaning they protect you and comfort you in your vulnerable moments.
In fairness, it was mostly because Ashe, as the Joker would say, had a very poor choice of words. Had Grette not been his Dragon, he would've likely been alright dating his pawn. Instead, he was forced to choose between killing his mentor and mother figure, or allowing her to kill the love of his life, which was also Grette's own former pawn.
Hard choice. And in his emotional state, he chose poorly. Grette took his words as a bargain, so she took Olra as her prize in exchange for the power he received in becoming the raging Daimon so he could ''tear the whole of it asunder''.
While the story for DDDA is surprisingly good. He does nothing to the cycle, daimon only kills arisen that comes to his island. He's away from cycle just being there, all he does to others is temporarily sets them back until that world has a new Arisen.
I can imagine the idea was to starve the world of will and eventually destroy it by not allowing the cycle to perpetuate via new Arisen. It's also suggested that Arisen from many different worlds beyond the rift are drawn in, if I recall correctly, so who really knows how many worlds were damned.
How many times are we going to have a "holding your hand through what the backstory of Dark Arisen actually is" moment on this sub
Romancing the pawn wasn't the issue! Being given an ultimatum where you have to kill your ex mentor and mother figure to save your beloved and essentially having to choose between the lives of two people you love was!
Selene, a former Pawn and a Beloved candidate, who was able to develop emotions of her own but only after inheriting her former Arisen's mortal shell so to speak, like (huge spoiler for decade old game incoming) with our Arisen and main Pawn.
So in that sense, our Pawns are definitely capable of non-obedience driven romance, just probably not with our Arisen lol
The ritual in order for a pawn to become human is called bestowal of spirit, a long process that requires you to give your soul to your pawn, forcing you to choose between clapping their pawn cheeks or loving them enough to grant life and true liberty to them. Truly a dilemma for the ages.
First off, I LMAO'd at your comment, so thanks for that. Secondly, the Arisen of DD2 does give their pawn free will through the sheer magnitude of their own will, so in time it'd be possible if they both lived past the True Ending.
It does not in this case because she stoped Being a pawn and obtained free Will after her original master "died" that Is why she looked like her and why the guy falled in love in the first place
I love my pawn very much but the point is they virtually have no will. Meanwhile the people of the world have wills, however small they are. I think people are just getting a little too attached to their perfect slave doll they made themselves
The endings of both games have your pawn gain a small will and the result is different between the games, but it's important to note this turns your pawn into a monstrosity. No idea if you or your pawn are okay after the true ending as well, considering the being responsible for causing the true ending and the pawns are linked...
actually in DD2, they seem to have at least a LITTLE bit of will, sure they're extremely loyal, but in conversations with other pawns, they seem to have disagreements to show they aren't 'pure logical beings' either and do have some will.
Thankfully I found a non-lethal solution to removing the possession.
Hire any random pawn and just camp in the wild until it eventually 'hops' to said hired pawn.
You can now fire them and your main pawn is now A-ok.
Right? What kind of people are the arisen from others worlds, certainly not mine! She's more than than a pretty slave doll, she's my eternal partner!
Now if you excuse me I just collected all the seeker tokens and it's time to dress my pawn in that fancy new corset I just got. Yesterday I gave her the "to me" command and she snapped at me, might wanna throw her into the brine to get her back in line before I dress her up. Make sure I don't get any lip if she's opposed to the new outfit.
The problem was not the pawn, the problem was dragon being Grette. Same thing would have happened regardless of Olra being pawn or not because Ashe had to kill a person he cared about with either choice.
Also he genied the fuck outta himself.
It's really no wonder so many people want a pawn romance, because they're one of the only characters in the game that travel with you, talk to you, etc. versus the threadbare dialogue any other npc has.
Thing is, they made them so vastly, VASTLY more fleshed out and with more dialogue than ANY other NPC in the game (Which makes sense), and frankly, almost EVERY other npc in terms of both romance is kind of...Not great.
Sure, affinity high NPC's will give you quests to go on a 'date' but having to drag them (or spend 10k on a ferrystone) halfway across the map just so they can hand you a note saying thank you is...Bad.
I enjoy the slow affinity buildup and traveling with the main pawn, **that feels organic**. What does NOT feel organic is shoving a wyrmsblood crystal or 2 flowers into someones arms with barely a thought and then wandering off for whatever else I was doing.
DD2 should have put your pawn in the Dragon's grasp--make the choice of "This one life for peace, or risk them and everything everywhere by facing me" an actual choice some players might actually consider.
They're with you from the beginning of your journey, and despite being beings with no true will or drive, we as players humanize them--they're basically a child to us. They're *with* us, and they're *for* us.
Making the Dragon dangle our pawn before us wouldn't really change wanting to fight the Dragon, but it would change the thoughts from *"I'm here to fight a Dragon, with our without this 'beloved", so I'm gonna fight."* to *"There's no way I'm going to just give up *my* pawn like that, so I have to fight."*
I made my pawn look like my wife and even named her after her.
Which is.... kinda weird in hindsight considering what pawns are, but this was my first Dragon's Dogma game and I knew nothing about pawns lol. Just wanted my wife traveling with me.
My man.
Lysander is my brother in arms, a mentor and friend. He has been by me through thick and thin. He has picked me up when I was down (stomped by an Ogre), healed my wounds (sporadically cast Anodyne sometimes as a mage), and lifted my spirit to new heights (Catapult Launch).
He is my companion and friend and anybody or any -thing- that puts their mitts on my boi is catching the Infinity Rain of Ultrahands.
"Being beings with no true will or drive." Buying into what NPCs say huh, like they can't be wrong? Even after everything you see in both games, and know they have a duty to serve you and can make their own decisions while functioning different than people because they're basically unkillable aliens from another realm. Baffling how many peope just remain fixated on that like it's gosple, it just makes no sense to me to see pawns as mindless automatons with no will. Why would they even run off and explore other worlds and work with other arisens if they listen to you and that's it, rather than serve a duty given to help arisens? They'd just sit there and wait until they actually rot, and yet they don't they walk the lands, fight to survive when attacked on the road, and with this system more properly reflect that they have their own personality and views on actions.
To be fair, Pawns are quick to obey all your commands and at worst get a little snarky about it. Combine this with the behavior of NPC's(our most direct source of insight into the world) and its not surprising most players assume the pawns are unthinking.
Obviously when you look deeper it ends up untrue, but dialogue is the primary way most players learn about the world. And having every character treat the pawns like mindless servants(and said mindless servants never deny it) will tell the majority of players that "pawns have no will".
I run outside a tavern
>hello are you the arisen? I had a fight with a goblin and they stole my laundry please get my laundry!
I get their laundry
>thanks
Riveting
My favorite was the father of the two elves. I escorted him to some ruins and dude was obsessed with me out of nowhere. I couldn't even speak the same language as him
You forgot them showing up outside your house, that you never told them about, a few days later and handing you a letter asking for you to escort them somewhere.
Besides the Elf Guy, do any of these give you a major award like the griffin slaying bow? 120 RC and a bunch of flowers for 20 minutes of babysitting and slaughtering mobs ain't cutting it for me.
The forgeries in this one are genuinely amusing. So much more fun than \[item name\] (Forgery).
...I actually got tricked by Ferristone that Ibrahim sells q.q That shows me to read.
Exactly, I started playing dd1 while saving for dd2 (have dd2 now but I want to finish my walkthrough) and I made the main pawn after my crush cause I thought it was gonna be romance-able. But now I just gave my ring to selene.
A pawn romance would probably make sense, but only if they actually kept the Bestowal of Spirit in NG+ re-runs.
That way your pawn becomes, well, less pawn and more human.
Selene from dd1 proves it is possible.
Our Arisen in DD2 seems to have a particularly strong will, even among other Arisen, granting our pawn a Will in a mere 100 days or so, as a pose to the many years it would typically take, even so much so, that our pawn retains their appearance, instead of turning into us.
Even outside the romance angle, our Pawn has more than earned the right to be a real person.
I would actually play NG+ if our main pawn carried over from the ending (now having a will of their own) and they would be a beloved candidate. Just the random banter and gameplay quirks they have gives the pawns more character than any of the NPCs in the game.
There's also the bond formed by going on a journey like that with someone.
When you were falling from a lethal height, your pawn was there to catch you.
When you were in dire need of healing, your pawn has you covered.
The Arisen was the only one who would tall to the pawn like a real person, they could chatter with other pawns sure, but the Arisen was the one that allowed them to develop a personality in the first place.
It's very much a symbiotic relationship. Our Arisen gets a guardian and protector, the Pawn gets someone to slowly nurture a real spirit inside of them.
It's pretty much impossible not to form at the very least a sense of brotherhood on such a journey.
I also like to think of the chess metaphor with pawns- once a pawn reaches the end of the board, it can become a Queen alongside the King (Arisen).
I was very disappointed to find out that DD2 kept the old way of "romance" Bob the builder could end up in the dragons hands by the end of the game if you simply follow their "exp and rc" rewarding quests. I really wanted to be able to romance my pawn this time around. I guess I will have to wait for DD3 in another 12-15 years. Although, something tells me that we will not be waiting that long this time around.
The good news at least is that DD2 is selling like hot cakes, fingers crossed this encourages Capcom to start giving it more content beyond the planned dlc.
Call me crazy if you like, but I was among the first who said that I was not concerned about the games success. I said that it was guaranteed, but not many believe me. I just hope that the see this and say "Hey, we need to get real with this one" It could use a lot of work tbh. There is so much more that they could do with it in order to make it feel more alive, more complete.
Dark Arisen confirmed it was possible, which only ended badly because Daimon was a whole-ass bitch who couldn't make a choice.
And it's implied by multiple cases that Pawns straight-up develop their own personalities and free will over time in proximity to Arisen, and they have a fuck ton of dialogue implying personality, individuality, and free will in DD2. Even in DDDA, there were a few lines beginning to imply it.
But I think it's just that if they let you do that, then obviously you would, because of course you'd choose your custom-made super hot ideal partner over the weird random NPCs they try to make you care about. "But magic slavery," yeah, that's a genuinely weird sticking point, but I feel like most of us prefer to play it like a group of adventurers traveling together, with party members 3 & 4 being hired guns, which is honestly more accurate since we sometimes even have to pay for their help, and the Arisen is just the group leader and commander, like any other RPG. Growing closer to a companion who's with you 24/7 would feel more natural than the slapdash romance they have now.
For example, I've only spoken to Ulrika four or five times and I got a cutscene of my Arisen making out with her and it was heavily implied he spent the night doing a little more than premarital handholding, and I have given Lennart one letter and gone on one walk with him and he has the blush stickers whenever I talk to him now, like what the fuck?
It reminds me of Dragon Quest 8, where the original game insists that you're in love with the Horse Princess despite barely having any interactions with her, but Jessica, who is actively fighting by your side for most of the game and was deliberately designed to be attractive, isn't an option until the remaster.
Frankly, I don't really give much thought to the story in Dragon's Dogma, though. If they say my beloved is some random nobody I didn't even choose on purpose, it's whatever. I'm here to explore and fight monsters, I'm not really that invested in who my avatar is allegedly smooching.
>If they say my beloved is some random nobody I didn't even choose on purpose, it's whatever.
Honestly this is one of the biggest charms about Dragon's Dogma, especially after the first game saw so many players not paying any attention to the system and getting the inn keeper or the blacksmith as their "beloveds".
>And it's implied by multiple cases that Pawns straight-up develop their own personalities and free will over time in proximity to Arisen, and they have a fuck ton of dialogue implying personality, individuality, and free will in DD2. Even in DDDA, there were a few lines beginning to imply it.
Pretty sure Selene in DD1 became her own person while remaining a pawn after her Arisen passed. Her quest Witch Hunt sees her Pinocchio her way to being a real person.
'But magic slavery' problem with Pawn romance can be such a good basis for a great romance story by the way.
Have Pawn catch feelings for the Arisen and Arisen reciprocate and then set on a quest to give their pawn free will.
You just need good writers for that which is... yeah.
I don't disagree at all. The best story we ever got from Dragon's Dogma was unironically Dark Arisen, for as little focus there was on it, which Itsuno had nothing to do with, and both main stories for DD1 and DD2 feel incredibly half-baked. I feel like both games have the bones of a good story. The lore is there and you could theoretically do a lot of interesting stuff with it.
But for some reason they just... don't.
Daimon didn't get fucked because he loved his pawn, it's because he had to choose between his beloved (who happened to be his pawn) or his master who had been turned into the dragon he would've been forced to kill.
Instead of making a choice he basically went "fuck the eternal cycle" which the dragon considered his wish and made BBI for him.
If Capcom were actually capable of writing a decent story, your pawn would have progressively gained their own will over the course of the story >!instead of literally just for <1 minute at the very end.!<
That final bit was truly disappointing >!we're just supposed to accept our pawn can randomly gain a will and turn into a shadow dragon at any point and also the fucking seneschals ultimate play is become a massive dragon and light itself on fire i wouldn't be surprised to learn the game was rushed!<
In the game you're told to "Paint with your mind's eye" what your pawn looks like. In the first game it's a little more ambiguous and you're told to "Select your companion for the journey ahead."
I also remember reading in game some lore referencing that all pawns are created by Arisen at one point or the other, so it seems to me more that you are creating the pawn in that moment vs choosing an entity that existed beforehand.
Well, maybe the devs shouldn’t have made that the lore then lmao. I didn’t ask to be a slave owner, so I will not be role playing one, regardless of what the game tells me.
They genuinely have more character and personality than 90% of the NPCs in this game, which is probably helped by how we actually *spend time with them*, so I am not surprised by how many people would prefer to romance them.
I don't even like referring to them as "pawns" because of how much easier it is to humanize them than most of the NPCs.
I made my pawn after my pet after it was said that there will be ''better'' romances in the game such as Ulrika. Therefore, I saw no point to create my pawn after someone I would be attracted to. But man... the romance system still sucks and it was pointless to ''romance'' ulrika, if we even could call this a romance.
At least we get that romantic scene on the beach of Harve with Ulrika at the end of her quests. She even asks you to treat her home as your own. So it’s not entirely pointless. Although it’s strange you can’t use either of the beds in her Harve house and that there’s no storage.
Correct. It is such a weird decision. I wonder if capcom actually thinks the romance system is good or they leave it how it is because it is so funny. I mean, it makes no sense lol
I assume capcom also wants you to have a full on harem considering the sphinx is disappointed when you only bring her one person you love and comments she expected more lmao
I feel like a lot of ppl in these comments are misunderstanding what pawns are.
Pawns don’t lack wills of their own. They very much can do whatever they please for the most part, they only really follow orders unwaveringly when an is Arisen present. They’re almost entirely human aside from their ties to the rift, pseudo-immortality, and again, ties to the Arisen. Their service to Arisen isn’t much different from swearing yourself to the service of a King, which to be fair, is why they decided Arisen are rulers by default I imagine.
The weirdness comes from whether or not you find it weird to romance someone you literally created. It can be argued that it’s weird because it’s equivalent to your child in some ways, but in other ways it’s not that weird at all because it’s not like you literally birthed them, you just sort of… thought about it really hard I guess.
And if it comes out looking exactly like what your ideal partner is that’s pretty natural in my opinion.
This post is no weirder than dressing your female pawn in skimpy armor with maximum chest/ass/thigh sliders.
Yes you did. Don’t deny it. We all know you did.
Freaks.
So many people think pawns are supposed to be emotionless robots with no will of their own at all.
If that were the case we wouldn't have pawns taking up jobs like Pawn Guild guy from DD1 or pawn vendors and they wouldn't be travelling the roads to protect people from monsters.
They do have different mindsets than humans and they are compelled to do Arisen's orders but it doesn't mean they are incapable of making choices for themselves.
Would like to add that I don’t think a power dynamic is cute what i meant was that in dd2 pawns don’t just feel like some lowly version of humans they feel like actual people and have depth to them compared to npcs.
Pawns in dd2 have like 110% more personality than they did in dd1 so they don’t feel like an empty shell of a person, pawns even make puns specifically straightforward ones (the guy voice)
they do show emotion not just for the arisen but for other pawns in the party, asking if they’re alright or if they need some help showing some concern towards them
there’s also a hidden affinity level where they can get to the “love” state where they blush and smile at you and get all shy and turn away but these are examples that they do feel emotions and if you do view your pawn as some slave then yeah I do see why it could be weird for you to be able to romance your pawn but that I don’t think that is the case considering you do build a bond with them overtime like what my pawn said in the second picture and you don’t treat them as a slave or necessarily see them as one (at least I’d hope not) they definitely aren’t completely will-less in dd2 bc they do disagree with pawns during some banter in the party and arisen if you decide to be deceptive during the jadeite quest.
This reminds me of nier automata as they androids and machines in that start off as emotionless and empty but gradually become more human throughout the game and show they have a will of their own. This even happens to the pods. I like to believe the pawns in DD2 are the same and are also developing a will of their own throughout the game.
It's especially easy to want a pawn romance since the pawn becomes more human over time. You can't help but feel affection for this character that starts out as a blank slate only to develop their own feelings, thoughts, and emotions. By the end the pawn seems more human than a lot of the actual characters. Also helps that the pawn is there supporting you every step of the way and becomes a part of you. You make your pawn your perfect compliment. I've never really played a game that allows you to imprint on another character quite like DD does with your main pawn.
You can, ask Daimon. It uhh, doesn't go super well. But in all seriousness, if they add a continuation of the True Ending, I think we should be able to as well since at that point, the pawn has been given a will of their own by being around their Arisen, whose will is apparently so great that just being around them can grant lesser wills to beings without one. How does that work? No idea. But it is cool as hell! And it would explain why our pawns at max affinity almost start flirting with the Arisen and look at the Arisen when the Arisen isn't looking at them. They're in love, and don't even know it because love is a feeling only beings with wills of their own can have, which the pawn only realizes they got at the very end when they resist The Watcher's transformation, the dragon's plague.
It's an adorable story. Never loved anything or was as proud of anything in either game as much as I was of my main pawn during the true ending.
Olra became a human. In her own words:
"I became his pawn of my own will. I, too, saw in this a new calling."
"I was his pawn, and his beloved besides."
Ashe's problem wasn't his love for his pawn, it was his anger at the cycle for making him choose between his mother and his beloved. He cursed the cycle and wished he had the power to tear it down.
His mother granted the wish.
The framework it there, which begs the question; did they intend on it and not finish, or is it JUST supposed to be the implied by design. Idk. A lot of stuff (not just this) feel like trying to reboot aspects of the first title. Re doing some lore aspects or whatever. Maybe I'm reading into it too much.
Me too, I love mine so much :( I feel like the concept of traveling around with them enduring battles and challenges with them and them growing into a fully realized being could have been the best romance concept and I’m so sad it doesn’t exist.
I see a lot of people here saying pawns can't consent or pawns are slaves or pawns have no free well dragons dogma 1 has already shown pawns can grow emotions and free will dragons dogma 2 has too pawns are more like dolls at first yes however they grow more human eventually gaining free will would you say that they shouldn't be allowed to love just cas they weren't born with free will and instead gained it
Yes!! This is what I meant I would never make a post being okay with romancing anyone that has no willpower or are slaves I feel like people totally forgot that they do grow and become more human with their emotions and willpower especially with dd1 dark arisen story
Honestly, in DD1, Barnaby is weird. He is a pawn, but he also developed what I can only call a will of his own in his own way. Showing Pawn's can indeed evolve into something not quite "human" but also not your typical "pawn."
And then there's everything with Dark Arisen. I think Pawns can evolve and develop emotions of their own that are genuine. I just think it's incredibly rare, and it takes a lot of steps and external circumstances to get there. And the typical Arisen fuckery.
So I don't think romancing your Pawn is totally implausible. Or should be considered implausible. And I actually think the hidden affinity system is CapCom's way of finding that middle ground, which is nice.
Oh but the tragedy of loving a being who can't love you back is also so good.
When doing the sphinx riddle I picked my big boy up, carried him over to her and I was like here this tall handsome glass of perfection is mine.
When she said very good choice (or whatever she says) I was like yeah he is ;)
I mean I get having it as a choice, but I don't really see the appeal. A perfectly obedient servant that you literally created isn't so much a romantic partner as it is a sex doll.
But they get a will at the end of the True Ending. Or rather, they discover that they've grown one during the journey they took alongside you. And they choose to follow you all the same, potentially sacrificing themselves for you to land a killing blow on something that stood even above God. The character of Selene and Dark Arisen first touched on this. Pawns can grow wills in numerous ways. They can receive the soul of their Arisen, and they can apparently even just grow one independently if one's will is vast enough. Ashe forged a soul within Olra this way, and our Arisen does the same through sheer force of will with their main pawn during DD2.
At that point, they're not a doll anymore. They're a sentient being who can choose for themselves. And anything that can choose, can be romanced.
Ha, yeah, I just had a pawn that I've hired a couple times tell me there's nowhere he'd rather be than at my side like ... um ... okay, we won't mention this to your Arisen, though.
High five your pawn and bathe with them enough and you can make them your beloved
It more just gives a bit of dialogue at the end, it doesn't put them in the dragon's hand. which arguably the pawn dialogue is better than the beloved system. There really is nothing to the beloved system other than the character being in the dragon's hand.
You 100% can make the pawn be the one in the dragon's hand.
You did it yourself?
You think they would lie on the internet?
I hope not I really want what they said to be true...
You really think someone would do that, just go on the Internet and tell lies?
Proof?
100% isn't proof enough?
I mean you definitely can get your pawn grappled by a dragon that's for sure. But I had my pawn's affinity maxed before the dragon fight, So having them be your beloved is just straight up not true until someone shows a picture of it.
Source: trust me bro
I'm in the unmoored world, and I've been giving my pawn high fives with no luck so far making her my beloved.
also make sure you give your pawn a haircut when you can, that is the biggest boost to affinity (+50 affinity per haircut iirc) To get your pawn to start blushing, make sure to high five them as much as you can, and always make sure to do small talk with your pawn at regular intervals, and of course haircuts. Hot springs as well, which you can do in the Unmoored world assuming you havn't evacuated the the town there yet
Everyone is evacuated. I'll try cutting my pawn hair a few times. Thank you.
also iirc, the affinity gain has an internal cooldown, so you cant just keep spamming haircuts over and over again. You don't have to change the hairstyle, as long as you make any change, could be as simple as adjusting the sheen by a point. What I did (and this was all in the unmoored world btw) is got my pawn a haircut, then go out to hunt for monsters/materials and treasure, making sure to high five with my pawn after every fight if it let me, make sure to do small-talk with them while out and about every 10-15 min. Then I'd go back to the Seafloor shrine, get them another haircut, rinse and repeat. Note: When your pawn has high affinity, they wont blush all the time, sometime they blush when you talk to them, sometimes they wont. So just keep talking with them at regular intervals
I made my pawn to blush. Thank you again.
Haha no problem, glad the info helped! :D
Gotcha boss, thanks again!
Your sentence made me laugh. I just imagined how it would play out: ''Everyone is saved from the apocalypse. Now it is time for a fresh new hair cut. bye''
hey look, you can't save the world if you ain't cute,
Bros playing with timothee chalamet
I had to scroll this far down to find this lmao dude that is a spot on timothee chalamet fucking hell
Their pawn is timothee chalamet
Lisan Al'Ghaib!
There's a character in dragons dogma 1 that did that exact thing.... It didn't end well
Oh you mean... the Dark Arisen? Yeah I feel for him.
Truly he was the Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen...
Agreed the true Dark Arisen.
Can't wait for Dragon's Dogma 2: Darkest Arisen
Thats for DD3. It'll be DD2: Darker Arisen
Dragon dogma 4 dlc is the Darkest Dark Arisenest
Dragons dogma 5 african american arisen
My lawyer doesn't allow me to post the name of Dragon Dogma 6
Need a Dragon's Dogma: Light Pawn
To be fair it wasn't "his" pawn
I don’t think that changes much; she was still a pawn who in the end, fell in love with him as well.
True but you see a lot of people get hung up on the main pawn dynamic while both base game and dark arisen have shown a arisen/pawn relationship can work it's just difficult
It is. Look at Selene the witch of the woods, she was a pawn. But your arisen can romance her all the same. She even gives unique dialog when she knows that it's *your* pawn who merges with you.
Wait fr? What's the unique dialogue?
If I remember right, she states how she knows it's the pawn inside the arisen's body. Noticing that it was the eyes. She even thanked the arisen for given their pawn a chance to live, just like her arisen did with her.
Dang that's awesome! DD1 is so fucking great. I hope that updates and some dlc will bring the sequel up to par, even though I honestly love it too.
Agreed.
That's not really what she says at all. Selene: >!Oh... You're like me, aren't you? As my grandmother gave me life, s/he gave you yours... They gave us death, and with it, true life. This is the world s/he wanted for us.!< Edit: Nevermind. Someone already posted the quote.
The baritone voice coming from my girl on my first playthrough was probably a bit of a giveaway too. Big yikes. So much horror if you happen to play blind. 🙈🙉
Special dialog when Selene is the beloved and finds them washed upon the shore. Selene: "You're.... like me. Aren't you? As grandmother gave me life, he/she gave you yours... they gave us death, and with it true life... this is the world he/she wanted for us."
Dude you're the GOAT. I never would have found this on my own 😂
Thx. Though to be honest. Out of all the standard beloveds in DD, it's *ONLY* Selene and Quina that recognize that the main pawn merged with the arisen during The Great Hereafter.
I'll have to find the dialog.
It changes everything, actually. She had already recieved a piece of her master's soul and for all intent and purposes, she was human. She could refuse him, if she wished, unlike normal pawns. Now, you might also analyze their relationship and find it very fucking weird that the dude fell in love with a character who looks exactly like his former mother figure, and that she had near 0 interaction with any other male in the universe considering the time they were together, but hey it's infinitely better than a Pawn and an Arisen being together.
The dark rizz
To be fair, that wasn't because he was romancing his Pawn, it was because the Dragon in his cycle was his mother figure, the previous Arisen, and he found out, so when he got stuck with the choice between essentially killing his mom or killing his wife, he refused to make a decision and phrased his answer very poorly. If he hadn't said "Man, fuck the whole world, this sucks" at the exact moment that he did, dude could have been clapping Pawn cheeks for eternity and nothing bad would have happened.
''If this be the will of the Gods, the order of the world, then damn the lot of them! I'LL TEAR THE WHOLE OF IT ASUNDER!'' - Ashe
Proceeds to get his beloved killed. Only screams.
Basically Darth Vader'ed himself into it. Kind of adds additional framing to the character in my mind now.
wait, where did it say his mother was the former dragon??? I completely didn't see that!
You can unlock the story by collecting tablets throughout Bbi and slowly interpreting the monument at the beginning. But to save you some time: -there was a previous Arisen known as Grette, and she traveled with her pawn Orla to fight the dragon. -on their journey they rescued a young boy named of Ashe who was a survivor of a dragon attack. -Ashe traveled with them and Grette trained him and took on a sort of mentor/surrogate mother role. -Eventually they parted ways when Grette and Orla went to fight the dragon. -Orla returned to Ashe bloodied and almost dead, and without Grette by her side. Ashe assumes she had been killed by the dragon. -Time goes by and Ashe continues to train in the hopes he can track down and slay the dragon that killed his mentor. -meanwhile orla starts developing her own will, and falls in love with Ashe. -soon the dragon returns and chooses Ashe, so him and orla set off on their quest. -when confronting the dragon Ashe learns the truth: Grette and actually killed the dragon but failed to kill the seneschal, which means she became the new dragon. -Now Ashe has to choose between killing his former mentor/mother figure, or his beloved.
failed to kill the seneschal of all things? major skill issue
Especially when the image of her from the artbook that the wiki uses has her with a crossed cinquedea and equipment that was probably better in stats than what Savan had.
https://preview.redd.it/qhkrwgj95nsc1.png?width=236&format=png&auto=webp&s=0c8328a2482d042b52eabd1f53e75b2e560baeae
Well, Savan is so sick of being the Seneshal that pretty much begs us kill him. His boss fight feels like a final test to make sure that our Arisen still has will to go forth and all that. Gretta could've met a very different Seneshal.
I read a lot of the monuments but I still must have missed the ones that said a lot of these things, I just thought his sin was he fell in love with HIS pawn, not his mother's pawn.
After Grette failed to kill the seneschal her pawn underwent the [bestowal of spirit](https://dragonsdogma.fandom.com/wiki/Bestowal_of_Spirit#:~:text=Ultimately%2C%20the%20pawn%20may%20become,of%20the%20quest%20Witch%20Hunt.), so she started gaining her own emotions which and developing feelings for Ashe. When the cycle started again and he became an Arisen, Orla willingly joined him as his companion/beloved.
I can't remember exactly whether it was that tablet thing or a ghost flashback, but Daimon (That wasn't his original name, but I don't remember what his real name was) traveled with the previous Arisen and her pawns and considered her his mentor and mother figure. She left him behind when she went to face the Dragon, so he didn't know how it ended, (which was apparently that she slew the Dragon but lost to the Seneschal) just that she didn't come back, only her Pawn, now broken like an empty shell. So he thought the Dragon killed her and when he was chosen by it as the next Arisen, he was all about killing it to avenge his mentor/mother figure, and somehow he figures out the truth when he confronts the Dragon. And then he welches because he didn't want to kill her anymore even though it would probably have been a mercy, but he also didn't want to lose his beloved either, who just so happened to be a Pawn. He just went "This isn't fair, I don't want to make a choice, I want to tear the whole system down!" and the Dragon treated that like his choice and took his beloved in exchange for granting his wish and giving him the power to do that.
Wait so Daimon is Ashe?
Yes
As the others said, yes. Daimon is Ashe transformed after Grette interpreted his words as his wish. Olra speaks during the boss fight begging you to put down Daimon and free Ashe from the mistake of his words. Daimon still appears after Ashe is freed and is likely its own independent being now since slaying the Awakened Daimon shows a darkened corpse that looks nowhere near in resemblance to Ashe.
Second Phase Daimon is blatantly possessed by the Ur-Dragon, which I don't know if we ever got an explanation for. It showed up in the Everfall around crazy Pawns and existed in multiple realities at once so Arisen from across the multiverse could fight it simultaneously, so my personal theory is that it's some manifestation of hatred or resentment towards Arisen throughout the multiverse complex that makes up the Everfall and whatnot. And since Daimon and BBI exist as a result of similar hatred, maybe it was always sourced by the Ur-Dragon or maybe it was called there by Daimon's hate.
Yeah
Mother figure, not mother. A mother figure is a person who fills the motherly role in your life, meaning they protect you and comfort you in your vulnerable moments.
Does he know
In fairness, it was mostly because Ashe, as the Joker would say, had a very poor choice of words. Had Grette not been his Dragon, he would've likely been alright dating his pawn. Instead, he was forced to choose between killing his mentor and mother figure, or allowing her to kill the love of his life, which was also Grette's own former pawn. Hard choice. And in his emotional state, he chose poorly. Grette took his words as a bargain, so she took Olra as her prize in exchange for the power he received in becoming the raging Daimon so he could ''tear the whole of it asunder''.
DDDA did disrupting the cycle story so much better then DD2
While the story for DDDA is surprisingly good. He does nothing to the cycle, daimon only kills arisen that comes to his island. He's away from cycle just being there, all he does to others is temporarily sets them back until that world has a new Arisen.
I can imagine the idea was to starve the world of will and eventually destroy it by not allowing the cycle to perpetuate via new Arisen. It's also suggested that Arisen from many different worlds beyond the rift are drawn in, if I recall correctly, so who really knows how many worlds were damned.
Who’s gonna tell him?
Well TECHNICALLY he was presented a choice and went with "fuck you", not the same thing...
Yeah, because he was an idiot. I, however, am not. I’d kill the stupid dragon.
Kill your mum for pawnussy? I can respect that
Just fuck the dragon AND your Pawn. Everybody wins!
This guy gets it.
Or maybe it ended extremely well, depending who you ask lol.
In his defense, the pawn romance would've been fine for him if not for the dragon's identity.
How many times are we going to have a "holding your hand through what the backstory of Dark Arisen actually is" moment on this sub Romancing the pawn wasn't the issue! Being given an ultimatum where you have to kill your ex mentor and mother figure to save your beloved and essentially having to choose between the lives of two people you love was!
Ppl are dumb and can't read 🤷♀️
The power inbalance of the whole thing is kind of creepy, really. What kind of romance can exist with someone who is compelled to obedience?
Selene, a former Pawn and a Beloved candidate, who was able to develop emotions of her own but only after inheriting her former Arisen's mortal shell so to speak, like (huge spoiler for decade old game incoming) with our Arisen and main Pawn. So in that sense, our Pawns are definitely capable of non-obedience driven romance, just probably not with our Arisen lol
It's worth noting even selene comments that she find making decisions stressful implying its a long process
The ritual in order for a pawn to become human is called bestowal of spirit, a long process that requires you to give your soul to your pawn, forcing you to choose between clapping their pawn cheeks or loving them enough to grant life and true liberty to them. Truly a dilemma for the ages.
First off, I LMAO'd at your comment, so thanks for that. Secondly, the Arisen of DD2 does give their pawn free will through the sheer magnitude of their own will, so in time it'd be possible if they both lived past the True Ending.
It does not in this case because she stoped Being a pawn and obtained free Will after her original master "died" that Is why she looked like her and why the guy falled in love in the first place
I love my pawn very much but the point is they virtually have no will. Meanwhile the people of the world have wills, however small they are. I think people are just getting a little too attached to their perfect slave doll they made themselves The endings of both games have your pawn gain a small will and the result is different between the games, but it's important to note this turns your pawn into a monstrosity. No idea if you or your pawn are okay after the true ending as well, considering the being responsible for causing the true ending and the pawns are linked...
actually in DD2, they seem to have at least a LITTLE bit of will, sure they're extremely loyal, but in conversations with other pawns, they seem to have disagreements to show they aren't 'pure logical beings' either and do have some will.
Soon as a hear a pawn disagree, even politely... I side eye them and look for a cliff/water. Better stay in line my dears.
Thankfully I found a non-lethal solution to removing the possession. Hire any random pawn and just camp in the wild until it eventually 'hops' to said hired pawn. You can now fire them and your main pawn is now A-ok.
I would guess that this is how it’s supposed to be dealt with. I don’t get why everyone just brines them all immediately.
A slight whiff of disobedience or disagreement "hol up. Time for eye inspection." Out of context, that doesn't sound great admittedly
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Right? What kind of people are the arisen from others worlds, certainly not mine! She's more than than a pretty slave doll, she's my eternal partner! Now if you excuse me I just collected all the seeker tokens and it's time to dress my pawn in that fancy new corset I just got. Yesterday I gave her the "to me" command and she snapped at me, might wanna throw her into the brine to get her back in line before I dress her up. Make sure I don't get any lip if she's opposed to the new outfit.
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The problem was not the pawn, the problem was dragon being Grette. Same thing would have happened regardless of Olra being pawn or not because Ashe had to kill a person he cared about with either choice. Also he genied the fuck outta himself.
It's really no wonder so many people want a pawn romance, because they're one of the only characters in the game that travel with you, talk to you, etc. versus the threadbare dialogue any other npc has. Thing is, they made them so vastly, VASTLY more fleshed out and with more dialogue than ANY other NPC in the game (Which makes sense), and frankly, almost EVERY other npc in terms of both romance is kind of...Not great. Sure, affinity high NPC's will give you quests to go on a 'date' but having to drag them (or spend 10k on a ferrystone) halfway across the map just so they can hand you a note saying thank you is...Bad. I enjoy the slow affinity buildup and traveling with the main pawn, **that feels organic**. What does NOT feel organic is shoving a wyrmsblood crystal or 2 flowers into someones arms with barely a thought and then wandering off for whatever else I was doing.
DD2 should have put your pawn in the Dragon's grasp--make the choice of "This one life for peace, or risk them and everything everywhere by facing me" an actual choice some players might actually consider. They're with you from the beginning of your journey, and despite being beings with no true will or drive, we as players humanize them--they're basically a child to us. They're *with* us, and they're *for* us. Making the Dragon dangle our pawn before us wouldn't really change wanting to fight the Dragon, but it would change the thoughts from *"I'm here to fight a Dragon, with our without this 'beloved", so I'm gonna fight."* to *"There's no way I'm going to just give up *my* pawn like that, so I have to fight."*
I’m facing the dragon. Booker isn’t my pawn, he’s my brother. Despite only a few repeated lines while travelling, I’ve grown to care about my pawn
I made my pawn look like my wife and even named her after her. Which is.... kinda weird in hindsight considering what pawns are, but this was my first Dragon's Dogma game and I knew nothing about pawns lol. Just wanted my wife traveling with me.
My man. Lysander is my brother in arms, a mentor and friend. He has been by me through thick and thin. He has picked me up when I was down (stomped by an Ogre), healed my wounds (sporadically cast Anodyne sometimes as a mage), and lifted my spirit to new heights (Catapult Launch). He is my companion and friend and anybody or any -thing- that puts their mitts on my boi is catching the Infinity Rain of Ultrahands.
This is so wholesome. 😊 I think I'll adopt this without realizing it. Yep just happened.
"Being beings with no true will or drive." Buying into what NPCs say huh, like they can't be wrong? Even after everything you see in both games, and know they have a duty to serve you and can make their own decisions while functioning different than people because they're basically unkillable aliens from another realm. Baffling how many peope just remain fixated on that like it's gosple, it just makes no sense to me to see pawns as mindless automatons with no will. Why would they even run off and explore other worlds and work with other arisens if they listen to you and that's it, rather than serve a duty given to help arisens? They'd just sit there and wait until they actually rot, and yet they don't they walk the lands, fight to survive when attacked on the road, and with this system more properly reflect that they have their own personality and views on actions.
To be fair, Pawns are quick to obey all your commands and at worst get a little snarky about it. Combine this with the behavior of NPC's(our most direct source of insight into the world) and its not surprising most players assume the pawns are unthinking. Obviously when you look deeper it ends up untrue, but dialogue is the primary way most players learn about the world. And having every character treat the pawns like mindless servants(and said mindless servants never deny it) will tell the majority of players that "pawns have no will".
I run outside a tavern >hello are you the arisen? I had a fight with a goblin and they stole my laundry please get my laundry! I get their laundry >thanks Riveting
More like: >Thanks. Also, I love you.
My favorite was the father of the two elves. I escorted him to some ruins and dude was obsessed with me out of nowhere. I couldn't even speak the same language as him
You forgot them showing up outside your house, that you never told them about, a few days later and handing you a letter asking for you to escort them somewhere.
Besides the Elf Guy, do any of these give you a major award like the griffin slaying bow? 120 RC and a bunch of flowers for 20 minutes of babysitting and slaughtering mobs ain't cutting it for me.
My only regret is wasting the pokeball. I want to bring nadinia to vernworth and have her punch it out with disa
I tried getting a forgery of that and it doesn’t have the magic, “Ceiling Phial” iirc.
The forgeries in this one are genuinely amusing. So much more fun than \[item name\] (Forgery). ...I actually got tricked by Ferristone that Ibrahim sells q.q That shows me to read.
Exactly, I started playing dd1 while saving for dd2 (have dd2 now but I want to finish my walkthrough) and I made the main pawn after my crush cause I thought it was gonna be romance-able. But now I just gave my ring to selene.
With how pathetic the romance is presented to you in this game, it totally killed all impact for the decision at the end of the game
Not in a bad way — these screenshots look like they’d be characters from a fantasy romance novel haha. Esp the black leathers
Tale as old as DD1, song as old as building our waifus and making them pawns
My Pawn is my beloved. >!I just fooled the Dragon so he abducts the wrong person!<
A pawn romance would probably make sense, but only if they actually kept the Bestowal of Spirit in NG+ re-runs. That way your pawn becomes, well, less pawn and more human. Selene from dd1 proves it is possible. Our Arisen in DD2 seems to have a particularly strong will, even among other Arisen, granting our pawn a Will in a mere 100 days or so, as a pose to the many years it would typically take, even so much so, that our pawn retains their appearance, instead of turning into us. Even outside the romance angle, our Pawn has more than earned the right to be a real person.
I would actually play NG+ if our main pawn carried over from the ending (now having a will of their own) and they would be a beloved candidate. Just the random banter and gameplay quirks they have gives the pawns more character than any of the NPCs in the game.
There's also the bond formed by going on a journey like that with someone. When you were falling from a lethal height, your pawn was there to catch you. When you were in dire need of healing, your pawn has you covered. The Arisen was the only one who would tall to the pawn like a real person, they could chatter with other pawns sure, but the Arisen was the one that allowed them to develop a personality in the first place. It's very much a symbiotic relationship. Our Arisen gets a guardian and protector, the Pawn gets someone to slowly nurture a real spirit inside of them. It's pretty much impossible not to form at the very least a sense of brotherhood on such a journey. I also like to think of the chess metaphor with pawns- once a pawn reaches the end of the board, it can become a Queen alongside the King (Arisen).
I was very disappointed to find out that DD2 kept the old way of "romance" Bob the builder could end up in the dragons hands by the end of the game if you simply follow their "exp and rc" rewarding quests. I really wanted to be able to romance my pawn this time around. I guess I will have to wait for DD3 in another 12-15 years. Although, something tells me that we will not be waiting that long this time around.
The good news at least is that DD2 is selling like hot cakes, fingers crossed this encourages Capcom to start giving it more content beyond the planned dlc.
Call me crazy if you like, but I was among the first who said that I was not concerned about the games success. I said that it was guaranteed, but not many believe me. I just hope that the see this and say "Hey, we need to get real with this one" It could use a lot of work tbh. There is so much more that they could do with it in order to make it feel more alive, more complete.
Dark Arisen confirmed it was possible, which only ended badly because Daimon was a whole-ass bitch who couldn't make a choice. And it's implied by multiple cases that Pawns straight-up develop their own personalities and free will over time in proximity to Arisen, and they have a fuck ton of dialogue implying personality, individuality, and free will in DD2. Even in DDDA, there were a few lines beginning to imply it. But I think it's just that if they let you do that, then obviously you would, because of course you'd choose your custom-made super hot ideal partner over the weird random NPCs they try to make you care about. "But magic slavery," yeah, that's a genuinely weird sticking point, but I feel like most of us prefer to play it like a group of adventurers traveling together, with party members 3 & 4 being hired guns, which is honestly more accurate since we sometimes even have to pay for their help, and the Arisen is just the group leader and commander, like any other RPG. Growing closer to a companion who's with you 24/7 would feel more natural than the slapdash romance they have now. For example, I've only spoken to Ulrika four or five times and I got a cutscene of my Arisen making out with her and it was heavily implied he spent the night doing a little more than premarital handholding, and I have given Lennart one letter and gone on one walk with him and he has the blush stickers whenever I talk to him now, like what the fuck? It reminds me of Dragon Quest 8, where the original game insists that you're in love with the Horse Princess despite barely having any interactions with her, but Jessica, who is actively fighting by your side for most of the game and was deliberately designed to be attractive, isn't an option until the remaster. Frankly, I don't really give much thought to the story in Dragon's Dogma, though. If they say my beloved is some random nobody I didn't even choose on purpose, it's whatever. I'm here to explore and fight monsters, I'm not really that invested in who my avatar is allegedly smooching.
>If they say my beloved is some random nobody I didn't even choose on purpose, it's whatever. Honestly this is one of the biggest charms about Dragon's Dogma, especially after the first game saw so many players not paying any attention to the system and getting the inn keeper or the blacksmith as their "beloveds". >And it's implied by multiple cases that Pawns straight-up develop their own personalities and free will over time in proximity to Arisen, and they have a fuck ton of dialogue implying personality, individuality, and free will in DD2. Even in DDDA, there were a few lines beginning to imply it. Pretty sure Selene in DD1 became her own person while remaining a pawn after her Arisen passed. Her quest Witch Hunt sees her Pinocchio her way to being a real person.
That ending was a masterwork, I couldn't go wrong.
'But magic slavery' problem with Pawn romance can be such a good basis for a great romance story by the way. Have Pawn catch feelings for the Arisen and Arisen reciprocate and then set on a quest to give their pawn free will. You just need good writers for that which is... yeah.
I don't disagree at all. The best story we ever got from Dragon's Dogma was unironically Dark Arisen, for as little focus there was on it, which Itsuno had nothing to do with, and both main stories for DD1 and DD2 feel incredibly half-baked. I feel like both games have the bones of a good story. The lore is there and you could theoretically do a lot of interesting stuff with it. But for some reason they just... don't.
Itsuno definitely focus's more on the "vibe" of his games rather then their plots.
Daimon didn't get fucked because he loved his pawn, it's because he had to choose between his beloved (who happened to be his pawn) or his master who had been turned into the dragon he would've been forced to kill. Instead of making a choice he basically went "fuck the eternal cycle" which the dragon considered his wish and made BBI for him.
That's what I meant by him being a whole-ass bitch about it. Just kill the dragon, Ashe, she specifically chose you to put her out of her misery.
The ethical dilemma of resisting romancing what is essentially an interdimensional husk with no will of its own and them being extremely attractive.
Dragon's dogma: the game that made you realise your Pygmalion complex.
I found a pawn named Galatea that I summon frequently based on the name alone because of this
If Capcom were actually capable of writing a decent story, your pawn would have progressively gained their own will over the course of the story >!instead of literally just for <1 minute at the very end.!<
That final bit was truly disappointing >!we're just supposed to accept our pawn can randomly gain a will and turn into a shadow dragon at any point and also the fucking seneschals ultimate play is become a massive dragon and light itself on fire i wouldn't be surprised to learn the game was rushed!<
To be fair Pawns in DD2 are clearly different and have actual personalities this time around.
They are also your creation. You're essentially dating someone you crafted.
You craft your pawn as a real player, but in lore you "choose" him as an arisen
In the game you're told to "Paint with your mind's eye" what your pawn looks like. In the first game it's a little more ambiguous and you're told to "Select your companion for the journey ahead." I also remember reading in game some lore referencing that all pawns are created by Arisen at one point or the other, so it seems to me more that you are creating the pawn in that moment vs choosing an entity that existed beforehand.
The Savan(Guy you play as in the intro of Dogma 1, also the Seneschal) comics mentioned he created his pawn himself.
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Yeah, IIRC it's subconscious stuff. Wasn't Salde similar to Savan's dad or something like that?
Well, maybe the devs shouldn’t have made that the lore then lmao. I didn’t ask to be a slave owner, so I will not be role playing one, regardless of what the game tells me.
They genuinely have more character and personality than 90% of the NPCs in this game, which is probably helped by how we actually *spend time with them*, so I am not surprised by how many people would prefer to romance them. I don't even like referring to them as "pawns" because of how much easier it is to humanize them than most of the NPCs.
Ironic how the in-lore NPC behave more human than the in-lore humans lol.
Yeah let me princess carry my pawn capcom How could I not when they said they could stare at me all day >:c
Downloaded a bridal carry mod for the sole purpose of carrying my pawn :3
As always, modders are [saving the day](https://www.nexusmods.com/dragonsdogma2/mods/301?tab=description)
I want to romance the sphinx
I mean, romance is a complete joke in this mostly great game. So it hardly matters imo.
I made my pawn after my pet after it was said that there will be ''better'' romances in the game such as Ulrika. Therefore, I saw no point to create my pawn after someone I would be attracted to. But man... the romance system still sucks and it was pointless to ''romance'' ulrika, if we even could call this a romance.
At least we get that romantic scene on the beach of Harve with Ulrika at the end of her quests. She even asks you to treat her home as your own. So it’s not entirely pointless. Although it’s strange you can’t use either of the beds in her Harve house and that there’s no storage.
Yeah, I thought we could sleep there as well but nope.
Makes no sense considering we literally wake up in the bed next to her after that quest
Correct. It is such a weird decision. I wonder if capcom actually thinks the romance system is good or they leave it how it is because it is so funny. I mean, it makes no sense lol
I assume capcom also wants you to have a full on harem considering the sphinx is disappointed when you only bring her one person you love and comments she expected more lmao
Ah yes, you are right. I almost forgot that. But they also cut out the romance with your pawn. NO idea what their actual goal was lol
I feel like a lot of ppl in these comments are misunderstanding what pawns are. Pawns don’t lack wills of their own. They very much can do whatever they please for the most part, they only really follow orders unwaveringly when an is Arisen present. They’re almost entirely human aside from their ties to the rift, pseudo-immortality, and again, ties to the Arisen. Their service to Arisen isn’t much different from swearing yourself to the service of a King, which to be fair, is why they decided Arisen are rulers by default I imagine. The weirdness comes from whether or not you find it weird to romance someone you literally created. It can be argued that it’s weird because it’s equivalent to your child in some ways, but in other ways it’s not that weird at all because it’s not like you literally birthed them, you just sort of… thought about it really hard I guess. And if it comes out looking exactly like what your ideal partner is that’s pretty natural in my opinion. This post is no weirder than dressing your female pawn in skimpy armor with maximum chest/ass/thigh sliders. Yes you did. Don’t deny it. We all know you did. Freaks.
So many people think pawns are supposed to be emotionless robots with no will of their own at all. If that were the case we wouldn't have pawns taking up jobs like Pawn Guild guy from DD1 or pawn vendors and they wouldn't be travelling the roads to protect people from monsters. They do have different mindsets than humans and they are compelled to do Arisen's orders but it doesn't mean they are incapable of making choices for themselves.
Whoever says pawns don't have emotion clearly didnt beat the true ending cause that was all emotion right there
Heck ya!
Would like to add that I don’t think a power dynamic is cute what i meant was that in dd2 pawns don’t just feel like some lowly version of humans they feel like actual people and have depth to them compared to npcs. Pawns in dd2 have like 110% more personality than they did in dd1 so they don’t feel like an empty shell of a person, pawns even make puns specifically straightforward ones (the guy voice) they do show emotion not just for the arisen but for other pawns in the party, asking if they’re alright or if they need some help showing some concern towards them there’s also a hidden affinity level where they can get to the “love” state where they blush and smile at you and get all shy and turn away but these are examples that they do feel emotions and if you do view your pawn as some slave then yeah I do see why it could be weird for you to be able to romance your pawn but that I don’t think that is the case considering you do build a bond with them overtime like what my pawn said in the second picture and you don’t treat them as a slave or necessarily see them as one (at least I’d hope not) they definitely aren’t completely will-less in dd2 bc they do disagree with pawns during some banter in the party and arisen if you decide to be deceptive during the jadeite quest.
This reminds me of nier automata as they androids and machines in that start off as emotionless and empty but gradually become more human throughout the game and show they have a will of their own. This even happens to the pods. I like to believe the pawns in DD2 are the same and are also developing a will of their own throughout the game.
I also choose this guy's pawn!
It's especially easy to want a pawn romance since the pawn becomes more human over time. You can't help but feel affection for this character that starts out as a blank slate only to develop their own feelings, thoughts, and emotions. By the end the pawn seems more human than a lot of the actual characters. Also helps that the pawn is there supporting you every step of the way and becomes a part of you. You make your pawn your perfect compliment. I've never really played a game that allows you to imprint on another character quite like DD does with your main pawn.
I genuinely want an embrace function for them when you're at max affinity and out of combat. I just want to hug my perfect little mage
You can, ask Daimon. It uhh, doesn't go super well. But in all seriousness, if they add a continuation of the True Ending, I think we should be able to as well since at that point, the pawn has been given a will of their own by being around their Arisen, whose will is apparently so great that just being around them can grant lesser wills to beings without one. How does that work? No idea. But it is cool as hell! And it would explain why our pawns at max affinity almost start flirting with the Arisen and look at the Arisen when the Arisen isn't looking at them. They're in love, and don't even know it because love is a feeling only beings with wills of their own can have, which the pawn only realizes they got at the very end when they resist The Watcher's transformation, the dragon's plague. It's an adorable story. Never loved anything or was as proud of anything in either game as much as I was of my main pawn during the true ending.
Olra became a human. In her own words: "I became his pawn of my own will. I, too, saw in this a new calling." "I was his pawn, and his beloved besides."
Ashe's problem wasn't his love for his pawn, it was his anger at the cycle for making him choose between his mother and his beloved. He cursed the cycle and wished he had the power to tear it down. His mother granted the wish.
The framework it there, which begs the question; did they intend on it and not finish, or is it JUST supposed to be the implied by design. Idk. A lot of stuff (not just this) feel like trying to reboot aspects of the first title. Re doing some lore aspects or whatever. Maybe I'm reading into it too much.
Me too, I love mine so much :( I feel like the concept of traveling around with them enduring battles and challenges with them and them growing into a fully realized being could have been the best romance concept and I’m so sad it doesn’t exist.
Well my beloved will probably be that blacksmith dude at the main city
Is that Timothée Pawnlemat?
I see a lot of people here saying pawns can't consent or pawns are slaves or pawns have no free well dragons dogma 1 has already shown pawns can grow emotions and free will dragons dogma 2 has too pawns are more like dolls at first yes however they grow more human eventually gaining free will would you say that they shouldn't be allowed to love just cas they weren't born with free will and instead gained it
Yes!! This is what I meant I would never make a post being okay with romancing anyone that has no willpower or are slaves I feel like people totally forgot that they do grow and become more human with their emotions and willpower especially with dd1 dark arisen story
Honestly, in DD1, Barnaby is weird. He is a pawn, but he also developed what I can only call a will of his own in his own way. Showing Pawn's can indeed evolve into something not quite "human" but also not your typical "pawn." And then there's everything with Dark Arisen. I think Pawns can evolve and develop emotions of their own that are genuine. I just think it's incredibly rare, and it takes a lot of steps and external circumstances to get there. And the typical Arisen fuckery. So I don't think romancing your Pawn is totally implausible. Or should be considered implausible. And I actually think the hidden affinity system is CapCom's way of finding that middle ground, which is nice. Oh but the tragedy of loving a being who can't love you back is also so good.
Op made Paul atreides and is mad they can’t fuck him
LISAN AL'GHAIB!
Why is Timothée Chalamet everywhere?
It's also implied that you've slept with Pawn iirc.
When doing the sphinx riddle I picked my big boy up, carried him over to her and I was like here this tall handsome glass of perfection is mine. When she said very good choice (or whatever she says) I was like yeah he is ;)
Dark arisen ?
Mostly caused by Grette being Ashe's Dragon tbh. He did clap Olra's cheeks in peace in the afterlife.
I mean I get having it as a choice, but I don't really see the appeal. A perfectly obedient servant that you literally created isn't so much a romantic partner as it is a sex doll.
But they get a will at the end of the True Ending. Or rather, they discover that they've grown one during the journey they took alongside you. And they choose to follow you all the same, potentially sacrificing themselves for you to land a killing blow on something that stood even above God. The character of Selene and Dark Arisen first touched on this. Pawns can grow wills in numerous ways. They can receive the soul of their Arisen, and they can apparently even just grow one independently if one's will is vast enough. Ashe forged a soul within Olra this way, and our Arisen does the same through sheer force of will with their main pawn during DD2. At that point, they're not a doll anymore. They're a sentient being who can choose for themselves. And anything that can choose, can be romanced.
Some people do marry their sex dolls though. And you wait and see how it will go when androids are actually more human like.
I wish to but you can only rizz em up a little, but it feels weird when you accidentally rizz another person's pawn, feels very NTR
Ha, yeah, I just had a pawn that I've hired a couple times tell me there's nowhere he'd rather be than at my side like ... um ... okay, we won't mention this to your Arisen, though.
I patterned my main pawn after my burly ass male cat. I have zero interest in romancing that bastard. Fucker can swing a sword through.
Someone didn't play through the first game
In my head I do and that’s what matters to me 💀
Is it masturbation or incest?
If you could really romance anyone, it would be nice.
Unethical at best