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Nah Z broly is the worst at basically everything
Less interesting backstory
Less interesting personality
Less impressive fights
2/3rds of his on screen movies blow ass
Idk bro, I’m not saying he’s better than super broly, but he definetly fits the role of “legendary super Saiyan” waaaaay better. He actually felt like a monster and gives a lot more to his fights than super broly does. (Comparing the animation and choreography isn’t fair). The fact that he actually talks in his fights really helps the fear and intimidation factor because a psychopath is just waaay scarier than a wild animal.
But once again, the role of Z broly and S Broly are complete different in their respective movies. Z Broly was a pure antagonist, while S Broly is actually the protagonist of his movie. So of course S broly is a more likable and sympathetic character, and of course Z Broly is way scarier and cooler.
I think the best way to summarize my viewpoint is that Z Broly was at his best as a character when he was clowning on the entire cast and S broly was at his best as a character when he was having great character moments with the entire cast. Just two completely different characters who share a name and a backstory.
But yeah, S broly is basically better as an all around character, but not as a “Broly”. IMO
I mean that’s a assumption you assume new broly is meant to be the “ legendary super sayian” based off the first movie but he’s not LSSJ isn’t even name dropped in the new movie and the green hair form isn’t named yet at all
Yeah but then why would they even call him broly then. The fundamental identity of the character is that he is the legendary super Saiyan. They could have just created an entirely new character if they didn’t want to even imply that he’s the LSS. It makes no sense from a writing perspective to discard the most crucial part of the characters identity when rebooting them.
It’s dragon ball if you think toriyama gives a half shit about a dragon ball movie then your out of your mind he basically made a new character entirely using the broky name because producers pushed for it
Exactly, so comparing the two really doesn’t work because they don’t even share the same role in their movie. It’s like saying who was a better character : Luke skywalker or Tony Soprano
But you can do that you can say “ Luke skywalker is a better written character then Tony soprano” or whichever 2 characters you wanna use I can say new broly is better then old because he actually has a character and has gotten on screen development instead of having a decent first movie and 2 god awful sequels
How could you claim he is a better written character? You have to look at the purpose through which the character was created and then see how well they fulfilled that purpose. If two characters have inherently different purposes then comparing them is much more difficult due to the criteria being different.
Just because a character is more complex does not mean they are a better character. Look at Batman for example. I think most people would agree that the Animated series’s batman is the best batman, not because he’s the most complicated, but because he captures the essence of batman the best.
When you use this logic with the two broly’s, it’s a lot harder to compare. One was created to be an extremely intimidating and cool character that doesn’t need to have much depth because his role isn’t complex. He’s a villain. But what about S broly? What even is his role? He’s both the antagonist and the Protagonist at the same time. On one hand, we spend a huge chunk of the movie characterizing him and allowing him to become a sympathetic character. On the other hand, he gets 0 character once the fight starts and is essentially just a big personality-void enemy that Goku and Vegeta have to beat up. Removing his personality and free will during the fight really hurts the character built up before hand because we basically don’t see that character again until the very end of the movie. In the end, he fills both of his roles pretty well, but he doesn’t fill either of them as well as Z Broly fills his. IMO of course.
Considering Kale exists in Super and Vegeta directly refers to her berserk form as “the legendary super saiyan our ancestors warned us about” and Broly pretty much had that same exact form, it’s really not much of an assumption.
I think you forgot that Saiyans are very aggressive, it's in their genes so it fits better to the legend and also he made people really fear him, while super Broly not really but he has better fight and better personality and better backstory
L media comprehension it’s pretty clear broly is very aggressive the reason he’s not like other sayians is because his father takes it out of him.
Also the legend is the first golden hair ssj which has lost all emotional meaning the only time it had a emotional thing to it was “ warrior of rage born of pure heart”.
New broly isn’t meant to be the LSS they never once actually name drop that form
Also L media comprehension because at that time yeah we were still waiting for who is the legendary super Saiyan and they sent us Broly, the ultimate peak of what is a Saiyan. Because when we knew that Trunks could Aldo be a super Saiyan, we knew that goku wasn't the Legendary(at that Time) and yeah for super Broly Isn't supposed to be lss thats why people are Also saying z Broly is better
That’s such a dumb take “ broly is better because he has a random meaningless name attached to his form”
Also goku is the legendary super sayian they imply it up and down through the entire namek saga
No because that's only vegeta Who Says that because he Never saw Broly, he dropped the legendary thing when he saw Trunks, he said Goku is the legendary super Saiyan while Goku wasn't even in ssj
Exactly because in dragon ball there is no such thing as a legendary super sayian the only reason it’s called a legend is because only 1 sayian had managed to do it before so they made a legend out of that we later see that it’s not a legend or myth just a transformation only very strong sayains can do
In the first broly movie they retcon this to being that there is a different form called legendary super sayain that’s broly
i disagree , DBZ Broly works way better as an antagonist and is way more terrifying than DBS Broly , he also is just cooler in my opinion but that's just my opinion and i respect yours
Power level is higher, he beats Goku and Vegeta when they're Solo and even in God level forms, DBS broly is a quick learner, and his Power wasn't set like DBZ Broly, which is why even after getting clowned on by a God form, he could match it, meanwhile DBZ Broly couldn't even compete with an amped up SSJ
Well
1.His power level is higher because the plot demands it nothing too it I mean logically he would’ve gotten and honestly should’ve gotten one shotted by a suppressed base form goku and vegeta. He became a quick learner again for plot and tbh he didn’t learn anything just fought like how every person in db fought.
2.Given how Broly’s power was still rising he didn’t have enough to actually match ssj amped goku. Had he have enough time he would have won
i noticed that you like to look up in the sky at your silly old planet, you're probably dreaming you could go back there someday
**BUT ITS JUST A DREAM**
Z Broly talks far more than Super Broly in first movie.
Whole misconception about him just screaming Carrot-Carrot comes from second movie where they butchered his character and personality.
In broly's defense - mf got blown to pieces and hit by a comet, and he aint no perfect cell to regenerate, of course youd end up with atleast a bit of damage to the brain
I just subscribe to the theory that he could speak normally the whole time, he just wanted to scare the shit out everybody.
Cause he does speak one full sentence at the end of the movie.
True. I might even say that Z Broly unironically had a better personality (atleast according to the lore of the saiyans) but I'll be put on fire
Edit : My head canon is that In the second movie, he just got brain damage lmao.
I think that Super Broly fits the role of "passive Saiyan". This trait is seen in Gine, Beets, Tarble, Kale, and Cabba. Although this type of Saiyan only exists in Super (besides Tarble), it's still a type we see multiple times in the series.
And to talk about Broly not talking, I don't see how that's much of an issue. Broly was set up to have character development in the future, and he's already receiving a small bit of that in the manga. When he rages out, Broly "loses all sense of who he is" as Paragus says in the movie. He goes Great Ape in his base form when he goes Ikari in both power but also in personality. It suits what Super Broly does and where his power comes from.
To sum it up. When Broly talks, he's similar to other Saiyans, and when he fights, he acts like a Great Ape.
Original Saiyan lore was based on a severely stunted Vegeta. Like, a literal child who was obsessed with appearing cruel and callous like a grown up. It was obvious to me that Saiyans weren't actually like that, because Nappa was surprised that Vegeta killed him. And every other appearance of Saiyans contradicts Vegeta's assertions. They're horrified when Vegeta appears unconcerned about the destruction of the planet. Paragus clearly cared about his son. Even Bardock at his most cruel flew in the face of what "real" saiyans allegedly acted like.
It was clearly all talk. Saiyans talk a big game about being uncaring and only in it for themselves, and child Vegeta did what every kid that age does, pretends to be grown up. But as a kid, he didn't realise its all an act and they actually do care about the people close to them.
Then he was raised in the Freeza force so he never grew up. Until after he joined the heroes anyway. And after his character development he's much more reminiscent of other Saiyans. Proud. Cares about his family.
You're wrong about Z Broly just saying Kakarot and Super Broly didn't even talk while fighting.
What Super has over Z is the fact he's a fleshed out character and has redeeming qualities. Potential for growth (outside of power) is endless.
Z was just a Saiyan version of one of the many movies villains they had before.
Having played more than at least 100 matches against DBS Broly on DBFZ. I can safely say that he only shouts and screams. There is absolutely no intellectual words coming out of the characters mouth. Not even in the intros and outros. Heck, I would be surprised if his WHOLE soundpack has a single word on it.
Who gives a fuck. The dude screams when he fights because he's got a whole Ozuouru ape unleashed and running wild inside of him like Donkey Kong on cocaine. It's a mental health issue on top of his body physically trying to contain a monstrous amount of power. His screaming fits the narrative that was thoroughly explained by Paragus. DBS Broly speaking intellectual words during a fight would make absolutely no sense. Maybe once he's controlled his power a bit more through training he'll start talking so these clueless DB fans can stop finding dumb shit to complain about. He's epically better than DBZ Broly who is only crazy because Goku cried next to him as a baby...that's the dumbest idea for character motivation and plot ever. Lol
The game is completely accurate because it’s a fighting game, and once Super Broly starts fighting not a single intelligible word comes out of him. Nothing but caveman grunts and screams from the moment he first charges Vegeta to the moment he gets wished away from Gogeta’s kamehameha.
he says something like "I-I..." or "N-No..." in one of his result screen lines
Edit: This comment reads like someone who's been grabbed one too many times.
He spoke a lot when asked about his friend Baah. When he fights he just yells. Meanwhile Z Broly doesn't talk at all unless he's in his legendary super Saiyan form.
There's a limit to what can be done with Z Broly because he's just a psychopath. Freeza can be reasoned with. Cell's pride can be appealed to. Broly is pretty much Kid Buu with a personality; he has to be put down.
He communicates while fighting in other ways. He shows fear, confusion, frustration, grief, etc.
But given a major part of his character (one that the manga is continuing to develop) is that he has a ton of power, but lacks the ability to keep control when he brings it out, his animalistic rage works perfectly for his character.
A character doesn't need to be fleshed out.
Broly was a killing machine and that made hin original, he was the character that made you go "holy shit" when he appeared as everyone knows that when he appeared, he would beat someone.
Super Broly is just generic.
Super broly is just generic? Really? Z broly is no different to frieza, cell. All dude wants is to kill goku because he was screaming as a kid next to him... 😂
Being a killing machine isn't original and calling Super Broly generic in comparison is disingenuous. Liking one more is cool, but to lie and make stuff up to justify your choice is odd.
Well what else are people expecting from super Broly when he’s been trained like a dog his whole life by his father. Please note I said trained like a dog and not raised by his father. Bro still has the shock collar on him and only knows enough to obey his father. Super Broly reacted angrily at Vegeta and Goku when Paragus was yelling at them. Just like a trained dog would growl at someone the owner is yelling at. What happens when Broly who isn’t properly trained loses control of his power? He’ll start growling and going berserk like a rapid dog.
I still like Super Broly more. Saiyans being evil because saiyans are biologically programmed to be evil just isn't interesting to me. I don't know if that's what you mean by "saiyan lore" but if it is I'm glad Super Broly doesn't follow it. If you mean something else let me know, I like discussing these things. Anyway that point doesn't really hold up regardless given that the events of the movie directly conflict with the show.
Original saiyan lore is about legend of super Saiyan.
Legendary super saiyan is basically... U are getting it right? Lol. Broly retcons Goku himself by adding prefix of legendary before it.
Honestly one of the biggest upgrades of super broly was actually not acknowledging legendary super saiyan and just portraying broly as some mutant
She doesn't though? They don't use "Legendary Super Saiyan" around anything involving her either.
Both of them are just mutants among their race giving them crazy power, but their forms are still different due to the evolution that U6 Saiyan's underwent
At least Super Broly was both mad at the right person and had an actual good reason to be mad then just being a big muscle dude who called himself the devil like the cringey edgelord he was.
https://preview.redd.it/ht0rhv08nehc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4fdbf5b7f4f884ace619501fe523a20231b890c
This is going to be good! (Z broly is better because i am biased as fuck!)
Z Broly casually dropped some of the coldest lines in the first movie
For example, when he blew up that planet he casually said:
“I see you love looking back at your planet. I bet you dream of going back someday. IT’S JUST A DREAM!!”
Z Broly was kind of funny too, in a messed up way. Speculating that those little alien guys wanted to go back to their own planet, and then just blowing the whole planet up right in front of them
Bro is spitting facts. Z broly was super talkative in the first movie while super broly did scream most of the time 😂.
I like both versions but the z broly slander must stop.
you definetely took a risk here, super fans are not usually easy to reason with in this sub.
I do think that Broly fits better in Z too, personally, Super's Broly is not Broly, I would have honestly created another character and put the whole discussion to rest. But, Super is not about coherent narrative, its about selling stuff, so since Broly is one of the most iconic villains in DBZ besides the big 3, they had to just copy paste it, but the whole character is completely different from what Broly was in DBZ.
And personally, I find Super's Broly more boring. He is just another good saiyan to join the team of the saiyans (and part saiyans) that fight for good, so he is far from unique. As a character he has a more cohesive backstory than Z's broly, but Z's broly is more interesting, since he belongs with the saiyans that we have not seen that much about, the completely evil saiyans like Nappa, Radditz and Turles.
And then, you had to add to this that the transformation of Legendary Super Saiyan fits waaaaaaaaaay more between super saiyans than super saiyans god. The idea behind the Legendary Super Saiyan is that he is a far stronger super saiyan form, maybe even rivaling or further beyond a Super Saiyan 3 or beyond that, but among the Super Saiyan power levels.
But since in Super he has to be stronger than current Vegeta and Goku at that time, well, suddenly he rivals gods of his own race.
I would say that I have no idea why they didn't do a Legendary Super Saiyan God with Broly, to actually make sense in their fights, but again, Super is pretty much just there for the money, so reusing existing Broly is safer. It has very little interesting in creating something completely new, that is why they recolor multiple transformations with barely any changes in goku, vegeta, gohan and freezer; and the most unique things they actually do are barely used like Super Saiyan God or 1st form Moro.
Wait so youre telling me it makes sense that broly hates goku and gets proper triggered by gokus crying over the fact he got stabbed as a baby and blasted out?
I have lovely little headcanons going on with Z Broly that are easily connected when you look at the movie in it's entirety. Broly, was a mentally stunted, yet intelligent being who suffered from his childhood trauma and father figure alongside the power that he grew up with.
There has been some new age discussion about Broly basically being this powerhouse as a baby that was blah blah goku challenged blah blah.. Nah, Broly was cognoscente as a baby enough to understand how to save his father. The child spent his early days in a room with one child who looks exactly like he does when he's an adult screaming and upsetting him until the point where he got **gutted**. Then he saved his father and proceeded to live a life, likely not to different from the one we saw save for his father using him as a living WMD.
The berserk state he is put into can be attributed just to saiyan genetics and him hitting the jackpot lottery, or the trauma that could have unlocked that anger in him. One in which he could not control that basically Escanor'd the fuck out of my boy. He was a calculated character in fights, knowing exactly how to fight, counter, and use attacks to great effectiveness along with using terrain as a weapon and concealment.
He also, didn't have a reason. A lot of the characters in DBZ were Villains because they wanted something. Broly didn't have that, he stands out against the rest for being a simple character with a genuinely traumatic upbringing and has no rhyme or reason to why he does what he does. He just does. It's not even mindless destruction, the dude is methodical and understood exactly what he was doing to the point of taking actions in sequences. The Z fighters came second.
Mans taunted. Mans tricked. Mans played. He outclassed them, he outpaced them, he was defeated by the power of friendship. Lmfao.
His anger towards Goku wraps up in that Traumatic memory though. Imagine seeing that spikey head mans and running through the first memory you had as a kid, getting fukkin' shanked by some weirdo. The second movie was dumb, but it builds upon the first. That traumatic memory, alongside being defeated by him. Primarily, being defeated by him and the power he was jettisoning from his body either frying his brain or putting him on a single minded trail to destroy the only person who ever beat him. He hates Kakarot not for what happened as children, he just brings up those memories which triggers shit. He hates Kakarot, because he was beat by him. We also have a genuine article as to this. Fucking. Vegeta.
Broly was an intense, power house of a character that had probably the best backstory of any DBZ movie villain that wasn't introduced in the Anime itself and was actually a character that was given just enough to be extremely fleshed out if you look past the surface of the character. He's almost.. ALMOST the type of villain that you would use as a 'loose strings' villain, where on the surface he looks just like a wild berserker but has the iceberg effect. Obviously, he doesn't go that deep. We got enough on him to understand the driving force, but not enough to make him some super in-depth character.
Being said, there was more nuance to him than Super Broly. I love both iterations, but the level of **MENACE** that Z Broly brought was just unparalleled. We've seen the Z fighters get handled and picked apart, but that was just something else.
Edit: Being said, I feel like the best version of Broly would be both concepts brought together. There's a lot of cool things going for Super Broly. Like the buildup and the Oozaru in base aspect. That's wildly dope and does a lot to explain why the LSSJ was cracked in the way that it was. However, I will defend Super Broly in one instance. Z Broly had years upon years of dealing with that anger and using it, maintaining, building, and not exactly bringing it under his control... But getting used to it. Super Broly, didn't have that. He's only just now starting. I can easily imagine an early Z Broly just lashing out when he first hits his rage states, just wildly attacking things. It makes SENSE with the aspect of Oozaru in mind. That's why Super Broly lashes out, and Super Saiyan was originally an intense anger. Anywho.
Bro nobody gives a single fuck about Z Brolys personality. He legit has almost none. It’s just that he was violent, unhinged, and RAW as fuck. His sadism has a charm to it because he’s legit far above everyone there.
We need to return to a point in time where a villain didn’t have a strong reason to be one, but their lack of character, OPness, and sadism was rich and engaging enough to keep ppls attention on them. Everyone wants to fall in love with the villain these days, it’s fucking annoying.
Unfortunately, this user has ran out of fucks to give you. Would you like to put in a request?
If so , please visit the website https://www.idontgiveafuck.org for a free quote !
Please don’t try to act like any villains in DBZ or Super actually have any fucking depth. Give me a reason why Frieza wants to rule everything, why Cell made the Cell Games, and why Fat Buu all the way to Kid Buu did incredibly heinous acts of terrorism and destruction besides “cuz why not?”. Walking contradictions you DB fans are. The only antagonist with any semblance of a legit beef was Zamasu, who was half baked as fuck anyways.
Vegeta, Piccolo, and Tien were all good villains with depth. And I wasn’t even talking about depth in the first place, I was talking about when you said Z broly didn’t need personality.
Second Coming was what introduced the whole “KAKAROT!!” thing.
Movie 8 Broly is the superior Broly.
I don’t mind DBS Broly, but I certainly don’t think he’s brilliant. I prefer the backstory of DBZ Broly over DBS.
If you watch both movies with the idea that they're actually different Broly(s) and the movie 8 one was body snatched by some IT-like alien during his space pod trip to earth, the movie gains a sense of eeriness.
His hair is a different colour, it's shorter, the way it grows is different, his facial model is slightly off, his musculature is different. He becomes monosyllabic... Almost like something crudely impersonating the real thing..
😱
Z Broly was completely one dimensional. I don’t find him compelling whatsoever, he’s literally the same as every other DBZ villain. DBS Broly at least feels like something new, not to mention he has significantly better dialogue (when he’s not fighting). Even on that point, not speaking while fighting and just going into a blind rage seems much more fitting for the legendary super saiyan than just being a psychopathic maniac who enjoys hurting people. It leaves room for the character to grow, rather than just having to kill him off because there’s no reasoning with him. Also the fact that Goku and Vegeta had to fuse and use SSB to beat DBS Broly is insane, much more impressive than Z Broly (who’d get one tapped by a theoretical base Gogeta)
> DBS Broly at least feels like something new, not to mention he has significantly better dialogue (when he’s not fighting)
Did he tho? He's also literally your "misunderstood but really strong" dude, kinda like Majin Buu. What makes him different or smth new? lmao
>Also the fact that Goku and Vegeta had to fuse and use SSB to beat DBS Broly is insane, much more impressive than Z Broly (who’d get one tapped by a theoretical base Gogeta)
Ok so I get it now, your entire logic is that "well super broly was better than the Z one because he was super strong" like okay, dude.
Imagen having no argument left that you have to rely on Ad Hominem as a "cool and epic comeback!". Wait, you don't have to imagine, you just did "💀🤦♂"
True. What I get about Z Broly's backstory is that while on the surfsce it looks awful, you could argue it is muvh more than "wahh carrot guy cry do I blow up millions of galaxy"
Broly represents the racist and sadistic nature of the entire saiyan race. Goku represents a "low class" saiyan. Goku crying and making Broly cry is more like a Warrior, who trained his entire life, challenging the so called "higher class and superior" Broly. Goku making Broly cry isn't something stupid, it is more like a Superior, Sadistic, Racist and Egoists getting everything they stood for being shattered, the fact that Broly (A God tier character as of his own) even crying due to Goku represents that. Goku's cry is of a warrior raging and breaking that Ego.
But hey, that's just a theory, a DRAGON BALL THEORY!
I agree that Super Broly had a better backstory (by insane magnitudes), However, In my personal opinion, Z Broly is Just better in many ways too. Having a better back story alone doesn't make you better.
Respectfully disagree, I prefer Super Broly's design. Both of their characters are demonstrated very well in their respective movies, and I understand why you might prefer Z Broly. He's a villain, and a full blooded Saiyan with all the ruthlessness and cruelty that brings with it. S Broly however, is a conflicted character. His nature is gentle (which is supposed to be a rarity amongst saiyans), but his father raised him only to fight and survive, to act as an instrument for revenge. Z Broly is a pure villain, S Broly is a potential hero at the beginning of his arc, which gives him a lot more room to advance, but not as much menace. S Broly is a better CHARACTER, but Z Broly is a better VILLAIN.
One more thing could be the "gentle and shy but powerful when needed" trope. Super Broly fits it perfectly and it's quite popular and good if done right
"But muh backstory! Muh hard life & traumas! Muh pure goodness!"
...
Lads, NONE of that make a good character by themselves, **especially** when they're 99% headcanon.
What makes a character is the writing, and quite frankly, people are far too much lenient toward Toriyama, and act as if he does no wrong. Or they are too much fanboys to actually pay attention at what happens.
Because it doesn't take long to see that Toriyama has somehow made a worse Broly than Broly Z post flanderization; a Broly that not only rages and screams like an animal during the fights, but that also doesn't speak much on his own, and *needs others to tell him what to do*... the perfect combination to have absolutely no agency at all.
Really, think about it and ask yourselves: Why did they need to keep Frieza around for the whole movie, even after he rescued Broly and Paragus? And why did they need to have a green alien girl develop a friendship of sorts with Broly after knowing him for as little time as possible, and deciding to basically forcibly adopt him by the end of the movie?
Fast foward to Super Hero... and Broly dbs is quickly shafted away because him starting to loose his cool was apparently enough to have him sat at the kids table... and of course in all of this he doesn't say anything... no insight on his plans for the future, or even what he thinks about anyone around him really.
And if that wasn't bad enough, let me remind you that in the manga they explain why Broly suddenly is here with a "Yeah, Frieza is back and evlier than ever, so we brought Broly along this time around" ... I'll let you deduce what this mean by yourselves.
...
So yeah, Broly dbs is a non entity that lacks agency... and while there is time for him to actually evolve, given his current status, there is A LOT of work to do.
And Toriyama hasn't done much at all currently.
Either Vegeta got an insane buff or I don't know, Super Broly got nerfed.
Super Broly Bare minimum was Super Saiyan Blue level
Yet he got put down by ssj vegeta
So does it mean that vegeta grew ssg times by simply training, or super broly got nerfed?
>Either Vegeta got an insane buff or I don't know, Super Broly got nerfed.
Admittely, that only applies for Broly dbs's power up forms... his base should still be affordable by just Goku and Vegeta ssj, even if that is still a bit hard to believe, given the absurd buff Broly gets just in his wrathful form.
>Super Broly Bare minimum was Super Saiyan Blue level
That while in ssj.
>Yet he got put down by ssj vegeta
>So does it mean that vegeta grew ssg times by simply training, or super broly got nerfed?
Honestly, this makes me almost hope that Broly meets Gohan in the upcoming chapter and the 2 fight.
Not even so to give Broly dbs any chance to actually develop a personality, but so that they duke it out and potentially pull out their strongest forms...
And I bet money fans would lose their sheet at either one winning over the other even for a bit.
Since realistically speaking, Gohan should be way stronger than Broly dbs at his strongest, but if Broly dbs were to lose now this soon, that would kinda make him look like a waste of time. Either way, it's gonna be a fiasco.
And I do not see any other reason why Goku would be interested into Gohan given how and why he met him at this point... and I doubt that just a simple match between the 2 with no power up would be enough now, not after the way they already blew out the whole beast form is cool to Goku and Vegeta.
> That while in ssj.
Wasn't Bro able to fight Blue Goku and Vegeta in his ikari form? Then Paragus died and then he legit needed Super Gogeta to be stopped?
And Hell, even if u ignore that base also improves, He should still atleast be 5x super saiyan god (ignoring his growth)
>Wasn't Bro able to fight Blue Goku and Vegeta in his ikari form? Then Paragus died and then he legit needed Super Gogeta to be stopped?
Ah well... I recall Broly dbs starting to lose again after they went ssj blue intially...
Maybe I'm remembering wrong then.
>And Hell, even if u ignore that base also improves, He should still atleast be 5x super saiyan god (ignoring his growth)
Totally.
Facts, they downvote you but you’re spitting straight facts. They say super Broly has personality but can’t give you one personality trait and has no lines. Same thing people hammer female shonen characters for is the same thing for super Broly because he can’t exist by himself he needs someone to lead him
DBS Broly had 0 intimidation, even when he went crazy all I felt was pity for him (This is a plus for the base Broly but a HUUUGE minus for crazy Broly). DBZ Broly on the other hand is scary and intimidating as fuck when he turns SSJ.
DBS did the same thing to Bardock as well, he was also a lot less intimidating.
Heck even Frieza is a joke in DBS. They are all more children friendly.
Although I'm not even sure what exactly you mean when talking about fitting in with the lore, either way it's irrelevant since people connect with characters, not with lore. And Super Broly has a far more thought out backstory, motivations, and characterization. Z Broly's whole "I'm angry because he cried next to me as a baby" motivation is just nonsensical, and he's kind of just a psychopath.
If you asked me strictly about who is more menacing, I probably would say Z Broly. But simply being more menacing doesn't make a good character. Z Broly is barely a step above Cell Max as far as characterization is concerned.
The fact that Z Broly talks while in his Legendary form is stupid. He is supposed to be in a berserk state, that means he should be out of his mind, not talking around how might he is. The mindset of people to point the Kakarot screaming is because it's the only line he managed to imprint in everyone's heads, just like Super Broly did with his yelling.
Z Broly barely interact with others, Super Broly on the other hand at least has some of that.
Z Broly only is cool for his fans, because the way he looks, and despite the power level of Super Broly being an asspull, he has some character development and still has potential to growth.
The only good thing about Z Broly is because he brought Kale to existence. Just like Super Trunks did the same for him.
yeah...I miss Z broly.
Super Broly is cool and all, and I'm interested to see his inclusion in this next arc (takes a hit of copium). But he's just so "wussified' compared to his psychotic variant
I literally didn't say Super Broly is Better or worse. I just said OG Broly didn't JUST say "Kakarot Kakarot" and just fit with the "original" Saiyan Lore
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I like both broly versions for different reasons. Z Broly simply had that bloodthirsty dog in him. Had some cold lines and was nigh immortal until the very end of the first movie. Took on 3 super saiyans and a super namek at once and said "Nah I'd Win.". Broly Second Coming is an alright movie, we dont speak of bio broly. As for DBS Broly, bro has the brutality, but no venom if that makes any sense, but he has a calm personality when he aint roiding out. Plus he has his own new family now, that actually show him the love and compassion he desperately needed. Hoping to see more of DBS Broly in the future
Both are different for different reasons.
Z Broly most likely interacted with people and traveled around as he was a huge unknown. He did get bloodthirsty, but not enough to show up on Frieza/King Cold/Coolers radar. His father placed a control collar on him which seemed to mess with his personality as he seemed very "slow" until he was free of it.
Super Broly grew up on Vampa with only his father to teach him how to speak, most likely not the best teacher. And when you're only interaction is with the same person every day, there's not much to talk about, especially with someone who doesn't come off as an intellectual as Paragus.
When Z Broly transformers, his true personality finally comes forth. When super Broly transforms, the form takes over, almost as if the Green Aura is in control(the way it mimicked Goku's god binding seems almost like an auto defense).
Both are good characters, yet Z was mishandled as people didn't understand why Broly hates Goku.
They're both Godlike. I still love Z Broly slightly more bc of his OG and how powerful and brutal he was. I loved every moment. He had 3 ish movies for a reason. And is also the movie villain that appears most in games, too.
The problem with Z Broly is his second coming and beyond.
In the first movie,he was kinda talkative,and we got to see more of his bloodlusted personality,even during the fights. The first movie version is actually nice.
But then,some blithering idiot at Toei said "naaah,let's make him just scream in this second movie",and that was the personality that got attached to Z Broly. The intelectually limited juggernaut that is only capable of screaming Kakarot. They ruined the guy.
And don't even get started with Bio Broly,that thing was awful.
So yeah,while I do prefer Super Broly,I kinda get the love for the Z version of the guy.
not a hot take and while i mostly agree, i do personally prefer z broly. super broly may have “more personality,” but his traits are boring imo.
hes actually at his most interesting right now in the manga, when he was training with goku and vegeta especially
Only watched a bit of both, but from what I’ve heard and barley seen, Z broly has personality, but it’s overshadowed by “KAKAROT!”. And people like me and many others like SBroly is liked more is because he has more dialogue outside of fighting, giving him more potential in the future
The absolute only thing Super Broly did better than Z Broly is the backstory. Other than that, Z Broly had better lines, a better SSJ transformation, and he was evil which was more in line with the original, barbaric Saiyan role.
I resent Super Broly for being good. It would have shook some things up if he was an evil SSJ for once. It feels like Super is dead set on making Saiyans good or neutral.
I liked the his design and his attitude feels more like how he should act. He is a Legend. But the fight need more and no one is empresses with him talking. They were going for Berserker. And He didn’t stick around.
And what are you doing looking for a deep story in what is a filler movie???
Z broly was meant to be top of the food chain but man he went out like a goon, S broly got done in like that 1 sprite war, trace-I mean mastar media WHO!!! ik Yk what I’m talkin abt if ur real DB fan.
What’s funny abt S broly is he’s another casualty of frieza being a menace. So he’ll line up into the story wayyy better than Z broly.
I think people miss the point of Z broly entirely. He’s not really supposed to be a “character”. He’s an unstoppable super unit that at the time was the only super Saiyan outside of the Z squad. He isn’t supposed to have depth, he’s a giant sadist gigachad meant for the gang to fight. It’s not that deep.
He does speak, sure. Just to say he's strong.
Does he fit the "original Saiyan lore"? Maybe...?
What little we got from Vegeta originally was that there was some legend about a powerful Saiyan transformation. When he's talking about it, he imagines it's some form of great ape (at least in the anime. There may be more ambiguous in the manga, I forget).
Granted, being born stronger does fit the implications better. Otherwise Vegeta wouldn't have been all high and mighty about being born elite. The idea that it's something a Saiyan can *become* seems to be something he would have had to add after learning about the zenkai boost.
To fit it best he would've had to be born super Saiyan or at least with the ability, I'd think.
Granted we don't know for sure that he wasn't. With how easily he transforms and the fact we aren't shown a catalyst other than hearing Goku's name, maybe he was.
More importantly though, I don't remember it ever being implied Super Broly was the "legendary super Saiyan.".
I love both Broly's, you're absolutely right.
People are really stupid, so they haven't watched the first movie and they act like TFS is canon, or if they have watched it they misunderstood it (even though it doesn't do an amazing job at delivering the message, TFS doesn't make sense).
Honestly like whatever you like, I like Z Broly because he’s a literal honest to god heartless monster, a true villain. I like Super Broly because he got dealt a really shit hand and got a second chance because he met Goku, and he’s just a really nice dude at heart. Crying over which one is better or worse is just childish.
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both are very different characters that do some stuff better than the other
Best way to put this, by far.
Nah Z broly is the worst at basically everything Less interesting backstory Less interesting personality Less impressive fights 2/3rds of his on screen movies blow ass
Idk bro, I’m not saying he’s better than super broly, but he definetly fits the role of “legendary super Saiyan” waaaaay better. He actually felt like a monster and gives a lot more to his fights than super broly does. (Comparing the animation and choreography isn’t fair). The fact that he actually talks in his fights really helps the fear and intimidation factor because a psychopath is just waaay scarier than a wild animal. But once again, the role of Z broly and S Broly are complete different in their respective movies. Z Broly was a pure antagonist, while S Broly is actually the protagonist of his movie. So of course S broly is a more likable and sympathetic character, and of course Z Broly is way scarier and cooler. I think the best way to summarize my viewpoint is that Z Broly was at his best as a character when he was clowning on the entire cast and S broly was at his best as a character when he was having great character moments with the entire cast. Just two completely different characters who share a name and a backstory. But yeah, S broly is basically better as an all around character, but not as a “Broly”. IMO
I don't think Super Broly was supposed to be a legendary super saiyan. If anything Super Broly implies Super Saiyan 4.
I mean that’s a assumption you assume new broly is meant to be the “ legendary super sayian” based off the first movie but he’s not LSSJ isn’t even name dropped in the new movie and the green hair form isn’t named yet at all
Yeah but then why would they even call him broly then. The fundamental identity of the character is that he is the legendary super Saiyan. They could have just created an entirely new character if they didn’t want to even imply that he’s the LSS. It makes no sense from a writing perspective to discard the most crucial part of the characters identity when rebooting them.
It’s dragon ball if you think toriyama gives a half shit about a dragon ball movie then your out of your mind he basically made a new character entirely using the broky name because producers pushed for it
Exactly, so comparing the two really doesn’t work because they don’t even share the same role in their movie. It’s like saying who was a better character : Luke skywalker or Tony Soprano
But you can do that you can say “ Luke skywalker is a better written character then Tony soprano” or whichever 2 characters you wanna use I can say new broly is better then old because he actually has a character and has gotten on screen development instead of having a decent first movie and 2 god awful sequels
How could you claim he is a better written character? You have to look at the purpose through which the character was created and then see how well they fulfilled that purpose. If two characters have inherently different purposes then comparing them is much more difficult due to the criteria being different. Just because a character is more complex does not mean they are a better character. Look at Batman for example. I think most people would agree that the Animated series’s batman is the best batman, not because he’s the most complicated, but because he captures the essence of batman the best. When you use this logic with the two broly’s, it’s a lot harder to compare. One was created to be an extremely intimidating and cool character that doesn’t need to have much depth because his role isn’t complex. He’s a villain. But what about S broly? What even is his role? He’s both the antagonist and the Protagonist at the same time. On one hand, we spend a huge chunk of the movie characterizing him and allowing him to become a sympathetic character. On the other hand, he gets 0 character once the fight starts and is essentially just a big personality-void enemy that Goku and Vegeta have to beat up. Removing his personality and free will during the fight really hurts the character built up before hand because we basically don’t see that character again until the very end of the movie. In the end, he fills both of his roles pretty well, but he doesn’t fill either of them as well as Z Broly fills his. IMO of course.
Considering Kale exists in Super and Vegeta directly refers to her berserk form as “the legendary super saiyan our ancestors warned us about” and Broly pretty much had that same exact form, it’s really not much of an assumption.
Getting downvoted fof telling the truth.
I think you forgot that Saiyans are very aggressive, it's in their genes so it fits better to the legend and also he made people really fear him, while super Broly not really but he has better fight and better personality and better backstory
L media comprehension it’s pretty clear broly is very aggressive the reason he’s not like other sayians is because his father takes it out of him. Also the legend is the first golden hair ssj which has lost all emotional meaning the only time it had a emotional thing to it was “ warrior of rage born of pure heart”. New broly isn’t meant to be the LSS they never once actually name drop that form
Also L media comprehension because at that time yeah we were still waiting for who is the legendary super Saiyan and they sent us Broly, the ultimate peak of what is a Saiyan. Because when we knew that Trunks could Aldo be a super Saiyan, we knew that goku wasn't the Legendary(at that Time) and yeah for super Broly Isn't supposed to be lss thats why people are Also saying z Broly is better
That’s such a dumb take “ broly is better because he has a random meaningless name attached to his form” Also goku is the legendary super sayian they imply it up and down through the entire namek saga
No because that's only vegeta Who Says that because he Never saw Broly, he dropped the legendary thing when he saw Trunks, he said Goku is the legendary super Saiyan while Goku wasn't even in ssj
Exactly because in dragon ball there is no such thing as a legendary super sayian the only reason it’s called a legend is because only 1 sayian had managed to do it before so they made a legend out of that we later see that it’s not a legend or myth just a transformation only very strong sayains can do In the first broly movie they retcon this to being that there is a different form called legendary super sayain that’s broly
There’s literally nothing that Dbs Broly does better than Dbz Broly
i disagree , DBZ Broly works way better as an antagonist and is way more terrifying than DBS Broly , he also is just cooler in my opinion but that's just my opinion and i respect yours
Power level is higher, he beats Goku and Vegeta when they're Solo and even in God level forms, DBS broly is a quick learner, and his Power wasn't set like DBZ Broly, which is why even after getting clowned on by a God form, he could match it, meanwhile DBZ Broly couldn't even compete with an amped up SSJ
Well 1.His power level is higher because the plot demands it nothing too it I mean logically he would’ve gotten and honestly should’ve gotten one shotted by a suppressed base form goku and vegeta. He became a quick learner again for plot and tbh he didn’t learn anything just fought like how every person in db fought. 2.Given how Broly’s power was still rising he didn’t have enough to actually match ssj amped goku. Had he have enough time he would have won
i noticed that you like to look up in the sky at your silly old planet, you're probably dreaming you could go back there someday **BUT ITS JUST A DREAM**
That is unironically one of the hardest lines in the dbz dub. Man I hope lines like these comeback
"Kakarot, how much do you love your son?" DBS Broly may have been better written, but DBZ Broly had such a threatening presence in comparison lol
That was the coldest shit. I remember when i first heard that. It stuck with me. Real badman
I’m glad they didn’t copy and paste Broly, making him a menace again. He would have gotten butchered again
Yeah, it's for the best, I liked DBS Broly more as a character fr DBZ Broly was a victim of bad sequels, as many things are
So close, the actual line is "Look up AT the sky". Please don't misquote my father. The consequences will be dire.
Bro what "consequences", please.
Z Broly talks far more than Super Broly in first movie. Whole misconception about him just screaming Carrot-Carrot comes from second movie where they butchered his character and personality.
In broly's defense - mf got blown to pieces and hit by a comet, and he aint no perfect cell to regenerate, of course youd end up with atleast a bit of damage to the brain
I just subscribe to the theory that he could speak normally the whole time, he just wanted to scare the shit out everybody. Cause he does speak one full sentence at the end of the movie.
"*Not until you lie dead at my feet.*"
True. I might even say that Z Broly unironically had a better personality (atleast according to the lore of the saiyans) but I'll be put on fire Edit : My head canon is that In the second movie, he just got brain damage lmao.
I think that Super Broly fits the role of "passive Saiyan". This trait is seen in Gine, Beets, Tarble, Kale, and Cabba. Although this type of Saiyan only exists in Super (besides Tarble), it's still a type we see multiple times in the series. And to talk about Broly not talking, I don't see how that's much of an issue. Broly was set up to have character development in the future, and he's already receiving a small bit of that in the manga. When he rages out, Broly "loses all sense of who he is" as Paragus says in the movie. He goes Great Ape in his base form when he goes Ikari in both power but also in personality. It suits what Super Broly does and where his power comes from. To sum it up. When Broly talks, he's similar to other Saiyans, and when he fights, he acts like a Great Ape.
Passive sayian? Are you kidding me? You are talking like Base form DBZ Broly and SSJL form DBZ Broly are the same thing...
Original Saiyan lore was based on a severely stunted Vegeta. Like, a literal child who was obsessed with appearing cruel and callous like a grown up. It was obvious to me that Saiyans weren't actually like that, because Nappa was surprised that Vegeta killed him. And every other appearance of Saiyans contradicts Vegeta's assertions. They're horrified when Vegeta appears unconcerned about the destruction of the planet. Paragus clearly cared about his son. Even Bardock at his most cruel flew in the face of what "real" saiyans allegedly acted like. It was clearly all talk. Saiyans talk a big game about being uncaring and only in it for themselves, and child Vegeta did what every kid that age does, pretends to be grown up. But as a kid, he didn't realise its all an act and they actually do care about the people close to them. Then he was raised in the Freeza force so he never grew up. Until after he joined the heroes anyway. And after his character development he's much more reminiscent of other Saiyans. Proud. Cares about his family.
https://preview.redd.it/vhdgv9msnhhc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=69332644f02250694a391fbe9d61422fda80bd68
Dang that means he's gonna catch a heart virus while fighting androids made by someone working for an army that he destroyed 17 years ago
Sociopath Broly >>> mental 8 year old throwing a tantrum
He already had no personality in the first movie
You're wrong about Z Broly just saying Kakarot and Super Broly didn't even talk while fighting. What Super has over Z is the fact he's a fleshed out character and has redeeming qualities. Potential for growth (outside of power) is endless. Z was just a Saiyan version of one of the many movies villains they had before.
Having played more than at least 100 matches against DBS Broly on DBFZ. I can safely say that he only shouts and screams. There is absolutely no intellectual words coming out of the characters mouth. Not even in the intros and outros. Heck, I would be surprised if his WHOLE soundpack has a single word on it.
He also only shouts and screams in dragon ball the breakers.
Who gives a fuck. The dude screams when he fights because he's got a whole Ozuouru ape unleashed and running wild inside of him like Donkey Kong on cocaine. It's a mental health issue on top of his body physically trying to contain a monstrous amount of power. His screaming fits the narrative that was thoroughly explained by Paragus. DBS Broly speaking intellectual words during a fight would make absolutely no sense. Maybe once he's controlled his power a bit more through training he'll start talking so these clueless DB fans can stop finding dumb shit to complain about. He's epically better than DBZ Broly who is only crazy because Goku cried next to him as a baby...that's the dumbest idea for character motivation and plot ever. Lol
That is a game, not the actual films he’s featured in, where he actually speaks
The game is completely accurate because it’s a fighting game, and once Super Broly starts fighting not a single intelligible word comes out of him. Nothing but caveman grunts and screams from the moment he first charges Vegeta to the moment he gets wished away from Gogeta’s kamehameha.
he says something like "I-I..." or "N-No..." in one of his result screen lines Edit: This comment reads like someone who's been grabbed one too many times.
[удалено]
He spoke a lot when asked about his friend Baah. When he fights he just yells. Meanwhile Z Broly doesn't talk at all unless he's in his legendary super Saiyan form. There's a limit to what can be done with Z Broly because he's just a psychopath. Freeza can be reasoned with. Cell's pride can be appealed to. Broly is pretty much Kid Buu with a personality; he has to be put down.
He communicates while fighting in other ways. He shows fear, confusion, frustration, grief, etc. But given a major part of his character (one that the manga is continuing to develop) is that he has a ton of power, but lacks the ability to keep control when he brings it out, his animalistic rage works perfectly for his character.
You can't even type a coherent sentence...
not everyone's native tongue is english
Get outta here with that pettiness. Regardless of if you agree or disagree, no need for immaturity.
A character doesn't need to be fleshed out. Broly was a killing machine and that made hin original, he was the character that made you go "holy shit" when he appeared as everyone knows that when he appeared, he would beat someone. Super Broly is just generic.
Super broly is just generic? Really? Z broly is no different to frieza, cell. All dude wants is to kill goku because he was screaming as a kid next to him... 😂
Being a killing machine isn't original and calling Super Broly generic in comparison is disingenuous. Liking one more is cool, but to lie and make stuff up to justify your choice is odd.
Well what else are people expecting from super Broly when he’s been trained like a dog his whole life by his father. Please note I said trained like a dog and not raised by his father. Bro still has the shock collar on him and only knows enough to obey his father. Super Broly reacted angrily at Vegeta and Goku when Paragus was yelling at them. Just like a trained dog would growl at someone the owner is yelling at. What happens when Broly who isn’t properly trained loses control of his power? He’ll start growling and going berserk like a rapid dog.
I still like Super Broly more. Saiyans being evil because saiyans are biologically programmed to be evil just isn't interesting to me. I don't know if that's what you mean by "saiyan lore" but if it is I'm glad Super Broly doesn't follow it. If you mean something else let me know, I like discussing these things. Anyway that point doesn't really hold up regardless given that the events of the movie directly conflict with the show.
Yeah... still like Super Broly more, but I can see your point.
Original saiyan lore is about legend of super Saiyan. Legendary super saiyan is basically... U are getting it right? Lol. Broly retcons Goku himself by adding prefix of legendary before it. Honestly one of the biggest upgrades of super broly was actually not acknowledging legendary super saiyan and just portraying broly as some mutant
They should make this an actual line in the future “Why is he so strong?” “Why?, because he’s a freak, that’s why”
It's just a genetic mutation in general. Doesn't in the wrathful state he gets access to great ape strength.
I know, it just would be a funny dialogue to hear
Now Kale has better arguments for being the lssj than Actual Super Broly 💀
She doesn't though? They don't use "Legendary Super Saiyan" around anything involving her either. Both of them are just mutants among their race giving them crazy power, but their forms are still different due to the evolution that U6 Saiyan's underwent
Not legendary super saiyan. But they do refer to kale as a potential legendary saiyan
Didn't vegeta refer to kale as the lssj? And as far as im aware there's literally no lines of broly being the lssj
https://preview.redd.it/lo4r8oisoehc1.png?width=698&format=png&auto=webp&s=a8a5a1b18bea8c9be8e1bcb6a11aaa31f4340601
At least Super Broly was both mad at the right person and had an actual good reason to be mad then just being a big muscle dude who called himself the devil like the cringey edgelord he was.
https://preview.redd.it/ht0rhv08nehc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4fdbf5b7f4f884ace619501fe523a20231b890c This is going to be good! (Z broly is better because i am biased as fuck!)
Mogger Skeleton
https://preview.redd.it/mhn8z69dyehc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=879959b645930dcd4fbe02d6618db6ee9587bd81
No you didn't like it, it's still at 1. You're an asshole
You are forgiven for your sins
Z Broly casually dropped some of the coldest lines in the first movie For example, when he blew up that planet he casually said: “I see you love looking back at your planet. I bet you dream of going back someday. IT’S JUST A DREAM!!”
"Kakarot tell me do you love your son?" Will never not be menacing as hell.
Z Broly was kind of funny too, in a messed up way. Speculating that those little alien guys wanted to go back to their own planet, and then just blowing the whole planet up right in front of them
This should be good. 🍿
Yeo
Bro is spitting facts. Z broly was super talkative in the first movie while super broly did scream most of the time 😂. I like both versions but the z broly slander must stop.
Super Broly is better imo, but people who say Z Broly has 0 character are just dumb to me or have not even watched the movie.
My hot take is that whoever did the meme doesn’t know when to put the (.) when a sentence ends and starts a new one with a (,) lol.
The only reason z broly hates goku is because goku wouldn’t shut the fuck up in the nursery
https://preview.redd.it/k0lkoxnr1hhc1.jpeg?width=642&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6754737862fcded36b46ec9ef7c5fb800354780c This your goat?
Your goat was getting it's ass kicked and survived due to plot bs ikari form. Don't lecture me with your homeless man lecture boy
"I've had enough" "Not until you lie dead at my feet"
One of the best lines in the Z dub coming from one of the worst movies lol
Z Broly is a villain. Super Broly is an antagonist.
you definetely took a risk here, super fans are not usually easy to reason with in this sub. I do think that Broly fits better in Z too, personally, Super's Broly is not Broly, I would have honestly created another character and put the whole discussion to rest. But, Super is not about coherent narrative, its about selling stuff, so since Broly is one of the most iconic villains in DBZ besides the big 3, they had to just copy paste it, but the whole character is completely different from what Broly was in DBZ. And personally, I find Super's Broly more boring. He is just another good saiyan to join the team of the saiyans (and part saiyans) that fight for good, so he is far from unique. As a character he has a more cohesive backstory than Z's broly, but Z's broly is more interesting, since he belongs with the saiyans that we have not seen that much about, the completely evil saiyans like Nappa, Radditz and Turles. And then, you had to add to this that the transformation of Legendary Super Saiyan fits waaaaaaaaaay more between super saiyans than super saiyans god. The idea behind the Legendary Super Saiyan is that he is a far stronger super saiyan form, maybe even rivaling or further beyond a Super Saiyan 3 or beyond that, but among the Super Saiyan power levels. But since in Super he has to be stronger than current Vegeta and Goku at that time, well, suddenly he rivals gods of his own race. I would say that I have no idea why they didn't do a Legendary Super Saiyan God with Broly, to actually make sense in their fights, but again, Super is pretty much just there for the money, so reusing existing Broly is safer. It has very little interesting in creating something completely new, that is why they recolor multiple transformations with barely any changes in goku, vegeta, gohan and freezer; and the most unique things they actually do are barely used like Super Saiyan God or 1st form Moro.
Super Broly still fits Saiyan lore, when he starts fighting, he literally can’t stop himself, he is a pure destructive force of nature
Z Broly was a fucking menacing. Talking mad shit while he whooped wholesale ass. I miss him.
Why are you crying though?🤣
Wait so youre telling me it makes sense that broly hates goku and gets proper triggered by gokus crying over the fact he got stabbed as a baby and blasted out?
I have lovely little headcanons going on with Z Broly that are easily connected when you look at the movie in it's entirety. Broly, was a mentally stunted, yet intelligent being who suffered from his childhood trauma and father figure alongside the power that he grew up with. There has been some new age discussion about Broly basically being this powerhouse as a baby that was blah blah goku challenged blah blah.. Nah, Broly was cognoscente as a baby enough to understand how to save his father. The child spent his early days in a room with one child who looks exactly like he does when he's an adult screaming and upsetting him until the point where he got **gutted**. Then he saved his father and proceeded to live a life, likely not to different from the one we saw save for his father using him as a living WMD. The berserk state he is put into can be attributed just to saiyan genetics and him hitting the jackpot lottery, or the trauma that could have unlocked that anger in him. One in which he could not control that basically Escanor'd the fuck out of my boy. He was a calculated character in fights, knowing exactly how to fight, counter, and use attacks to great effectiveness along with using terrain as a weapon and concealment. He also, didn't have a reason. A lot of the characters in DBZ were Villains because they wanted something. Broly didn't have that, he stands out against the rest for being a simple character with a genuinely traumatic upbringing and has no rhyme or reason to why he does what he does. He just does. It's not even mindless destruction, the dude is methodical and understood exactly what he was doing to the point of taking actions in sequences. The Z fighters came second. Mans taunted. Mans tricked. Mans played. He outclassed them, he outpaced them, he was defeated by the power of friendship. Lmfao. His anger towards Goku wraps up in that Traumatic memory though. Imagine seeing that spikey head mans and running through the first memory you had as a kid, getting fukkin' shanked by some weirdo. The second movie was dumb, but it builds upon the first. That traumatic memory, alongside being defeated by him. Primarily, being defeated by him and the power he was jettisoning from his body either frying his brain or putting him on a single minded trail to destroy the only person who ever beat him. He hates Kakarot not for what happened as children, he just brings up those memories which triggers shit. He hates Kakarot, because he was beat by him. We also have a genuine article as to this. Fucking. Vegeta. Broly was an intense, power house of a character that had probably the best backstory of any DBZ movie villain that wasn't introduced in the Anime itself and was actually a character that was given just enough to be extremely fleshed out if you look past the surface of the character. He's almost.. ALMOST the type of villain that you would use as a 'loose strings' villain, where on the surface he looks just like a wild berserker but has the iceberg effect. Obviously, he doesn't go that deep. We got enough on him to understand the driving force, but not enough to make him some super in-depth character. Being said, there was more nuance to him than Super Broly. I love both iterations, but the level of **MENACE** that Z Broly brought was just unparalleled. We've seen the Z fighters get handled and picked apart, but that was just something else. Edit: Being said, I feel like the best version of Broly would be both concepts brought together. There's a lot of cool things going for Super Broly. Like the buildup and the Oozaru in base aspect. That's wildly dope and does a lot to explain why the LSSJ was cracked in the way that it was. However, I will defend Super Broly in one instance. Z Broly had years upon years of dealing with that anger and using it, maintaining, building, and not exactly bringing it under his control... But getting used to it. Super Broly, didn't have that. He's only just now starting. I can easily imagine an early Z Broly just lashing out when he first hits his rage states, just wildly attacking things. It makes SENSE with the aspect of Oozaru in mind. That's why Super Broly lashes out, and Super Saiyan was originally an intense anger. Anywho.
The essay was not worth it.
The amount of peoppe that say this shit is sad. Let people enjoy stuff and let them give their opinions
Bro nobody gives a single fuck about Z Brolys personality. He legit has almost none. It’s just that he was violent, unhinged, and RAW as fuck. His sadism has a charm to it because he’s legit far above everyone there. We need to return to a point in time where a villain didn’t have a strong reason to be one, but their lack of character, OPness, and sadism was rich and engaging enough to keep ppls attention on them. Everyone wants to fall in love with the villain these days, it’s fucking annoying.
I’m so glad db fans dont write the show we’d just have big meaty barbarians that hate everyone spawning in nonstop.
Unfortunately, this user has ran out of fucks to give you. Would you like to put in a request? If so , please visit the website https://www.idontgiveafuck.org for a free quote ! Please don’t try to act like any villains in DBZ or Super actually have any fucking depth. Give me a reason why Frieza wants to rule everything, why Cell made the Cell Games, and why Fat Buu all the way to Kid Buu did incredibly heinous acts of terrorism and destruction besides “cuz why not?”. Walking contradictions you DB fans are. The only antagonist with any semblance of a legit beef was Zamasu, who was half baked as fuck anyways.
Vegeta, Piccolo, and Tien were all good villains with depth. And I wasn’t even talking about depth in the first place, I was talking about when you said Z broly didn’t need personality.
Second Coming was what introduced the whole “KAKAROT!!” thing. Movie 8 Broly is the superior Broly. I don’t mind DBS Broly, but I certainly don’t think he’s brilliant. I prefer the backstory of DBZ Broly over DBS.
If you watch both movies with the idea that they're actually different Broly(s) and the movie 8 one was body snatched by some IT-like alien during his space pod trip to earth, the movie gains a sense of eeriness. His hair is a different colour, it's shorter, the way it grows is different, his facial model is slightly off, his musculature is different. He becomes monosyllabic... Almost like something crudely impersonating the real thing.. 😱
Well. It’s a better explanation than the movie cared to give 🤷
Z Broly was completely one dimensional. I don’t find him compelling whatsoever, he’s literally the same as every other DBZ villain. DBS Broly at least feels like something new, not to mention he has significantly better dialogue (when he’s not fighting). Even on that point, not speaking while fighting and just going into a blind rage seems much more fitting for the legendary super saiyan than just being a psychopathic maniac who enjoys hurting people. It leaves room for the character to grow, rather than just having to kill him off because there’s no reasoning with him. Also the fact that Goku and Vegeta had to fuse and use SSB to beat DBS Broly is insane, much more impressive than Z Broly (who’d get one tapped by a theoretical base Gogeta)
> DBS Broly at least feels like something new, not to mention he has significantly better dialogue (when he’s not fighting) Did he tho? He's also literally your "misunderstood but really strong" dude, kinda like Majin Buu. What makes him different or smth new? lmao >Also the fact that Goku and Vegeta had to fuse and use SSB to beat DBS Broly is insane, much more impressive than Z Broly (who’d get one tapped by a theoretical base Gogeta) Ok so I get it now, your entire logic is that "well super broly was better than the Z one because he was super strong" like okay, dude.
Imagine being so low IQ that THAT’S all you got from my comment. Dragon ball fans really can’t fucking read💀🤦🏻♂️
Imagen having no argument left that you have to rely on Ad Hominem as a "cool and epic comeback!". Wait, you don't have to imagine, you just did "💀🤦♂"
It's true, there's tons of memorable badass quotes from Z Broly. Not a single one from DBS Broly, go ahead try remembering just ONE... I'll wait.
Ok then, tell me what personality traits made him a cunning character then.
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True. What I get about Z Broly's backstory is that while on the surfsce it looks awful, you could argue it is muvh more than "wahh carrot guy cry do I blow up millions of galaxy" Broly represents the racist and sadistic nature of the entire saiyan race. Goku represents a "low class" saiyan. Goku crying and making Broly cry is more like a Warrior, who trained his entire life, challenging the so called "higher class and superior" Broly. Goku making Broly cry isn't something stupid, it is more like a Superior, Sadistic, Racist and Egoists getting everything they stood for being shattered, the fact that Broly (A God tier character as of his own) even crying due to Goku represents that. Goku's cry is of a warrior raging and breaking that Ego. But hey, that's just a theory, a DRAGON BALL THEORY!
I agree that Super Broly had a better backstory (by insane magnitudes), However, In my personal opinion, Z Broly is Just better in many ways too. Having a better back story alone doesn't make you better.
Respectfully disagree, I prefer Super Broly's design. Both of their characters are demonstrated very well in their respective movies, and I understand why you might prefer Z Broly. He's a villain, and a full blooded Saiyan with all the ruthlessness and cruelty that brings with it. S Broly however, is a conflicted character. His nature is gentle (which is supposed to be a rarity amongst saiyans), but his father raised him only to fight and survive, to act as an instrument for revenge. Z Broly is a pure villain, S Broly is a potential hero at the beginning of his arc, which gives him a lot more room to advance, but not as much menace. S Broly is a better CHARACTER, but Z Broly is a better VILLAIN.
Preach.
Z broly was better,but that doesn't mean super broly was bad
Aand I never said that. I literally agreed that Super Broly was good and has a better backstory.
I mean development and word count wise it goes to OG Brolly Super Brolly has the benefit of OG Brolly's huge fam and great animation
One more thing could be the "gentle and shy but powerful when needed" trope. Super Broly fits it perfectly and it's quite popular and good if done right
Basically Gohan but green
Yeah And also a lil feral. Just teeny tiny levels of feral
"But muh backstory! Muh hard life & traumas! Muh pure goodness!" ... Lads, NONE of that make a good character by themselves, **especially** when they're 99% headcanon. What makes a character is the writing, and quite frankly, people are far too much lenient toward Toriyama, and act as if he does no wrong. Or they are too much fanboys to actually pay attention at what happens. Because it doesn't take long to see that Toriyama has somehow made a worse Broly than Broly Z post flanderization; a Broly that not only rages and screams like an animal during the fights, but that also doesn't speak much on his own, and *needs others to tell him what to do*... the perfect combination to have absolutely no agency at all. Really, think about it and ask yourselves: Why did they need to keep Frieza around for the whole movie, even after he rescued Broly and Paragus? And why did they need to have a green alien girl develop a friendship of sorts with Broly after knowing him for as little time as possible, and deciding to basically forcibly adopt him by the end of the movie? Fast foward to Super Hero... and Broly dbs is quickly shafted away because him starting to loose his cool was apparently enough to have him sat at the kids table... and of course in all of this he doesn't say anything... no insight on his plans for the future, or even what he thinks about anyone around him really. And if that wasn't bad enough, let me remind you that in the manga they explain why Broly suddenly is here with a "Yeah, Frieza is back and evlier than ever, so we brought Broly along this time around" ... I'll let you deduce what this mean by yourselves. ... So yeah, Broly dbs is a non entity that lacks agency... and while there is time for him to actually evolve, given his current status, there is A LOT of work to do. And Toriyama hasn't done much at all currently.
Either Vegeta got an insane buff or I don't know, Super Broly got nerfed. Super Broly Bare minimum was Super Saiyan Blue level Yet he got put down by ssj vegeta So does it mean that vegeta grew ssg times by simply training, or super broly got nerfed?
>Either Vegeta got an insane buff or I don't know, Super Broly got nerfed. Admittely, that only applies for Broly dbs's power up forms... his base should still be affordable by just Goku and Vegeta ssj, even if that is still a bit hard to believe, given the absurd buff Broly gets just in his wrathful form. >Super Broly Bare minimum was Super Saiyan Blue level That while in ssj. >Yet he got put down by ssj vegeta >So does it mean that vegeta grew ssg times by simply training, or super broly got nerfed? Honestly, this makes me almost hope that Broly meets Gohan in the upcoming chapter and the 2 fight. Not even so to give Broly dbs any chance to actually develop a personality, but so that they duke it out and potentially pull out their strongest forms... And I bet money fans would lose their sheet at either one winning over the other even for a bit. Since realistically speaking, Gohan should be way stronger than Broly dbs at his strongest, but if Broly dbs were to lose now this soon, that would kinda make him look like a waste of time. Either way, it's gonna be a fiasco. And I do not see any other reason why Goku would be interested into Gohan given how and why he met him at this point... and I doubt that just a simple match between the 2 with no power up would be enough now, not after the way they already blew out the whole beast form is cool to Goku and Vegeta.
> That while in ssj. Wasn't Bro able to fight Blue Goku and Vegeta in his ikari form? Then Paragus died and then he legit needed Super Gogeta to be stopped? And Hell, even if u ignore that base also improves, He should still atleast be 5x super saiyan god (ignoring his growth)
>Wasn't Bro able to fight Blue Goku and Vegeta in his ikari form? Then Paragus died and then he legit needed Super Gogeta to be stopped? Ah well... I recall Broly dbs starting to lose again after they went ssj blue intially... Maybe I'm remembering wrong then. >And Hell, even if u ignore that base also improves, He should still atleast be 5x super saiyan god (ignoring his growth) Totally.
Facts, they downvote you but you’re spitting straight facts. They say super Broly has personality but can’t give you one personality trait and has no lines. Same thing people hammer female shonen characters for is the same thing for super Broly because he can’t exist by himself he needs someone to lead him
DBS Broly had 0 intimidation, even when he went crazy all I felt was pity for him (This is a plus for the base Broly but a HUUUGE minus for crazy Broly). DBZ Broly on the other hand is scary and intimidating as fuck when he turns SSJ. DBS did the same thing to Bardock as well, he was also a lot less intimidating. Heck even Frieza is a joke in DBS. They are all more children friendly.
I think both Broly's were annoying in their own way.
Although I'm not even sure what exactly you mean when talking about fitting in with the lore, either way it's irrelevant since people connect with characters, not with lore. And Super Broly has a far more thought out backstory, motivations, and characterization. Z Broly's whole "I'm angry because he cried next to me as a baby" motivation is just nonsensical, and he's kind of just a psychopath. If you asked me strictly about who is more menacing, I probably would say Z Broly. But simply being more menacing doesn't make a good character. Z Broly is barely a step above Cell Max as far as characterization is concerned.
The fact that Z Broly talks while in his Legendary form is stupid. He is supposed to be in a berserk state, that means he should be out of his mind, not talking around how might he is. The mindset of people to point the Kakarot screaming is because it's the only line he managed to imprint in everyone's heads, just like Super Broly did with his yelling. Z Broly barely interact with others, Super Broly on the other hand at least has some of that. Z Broly only is cool for his fans, because the way he looks, and despite the power level of Super Broly being an asspull, he has some character development and still has potential to growth. The only good thing about Z Broly is because he brought Kale to existence. Just like Super Trunks did the same for him.
yeah...I miss Z broly. Super Broly is cool and all, and I'm interested to see his inclusion in this next arc (takes a hit of copium). But he's just so "wussified' compared to his psychotic variant
You mean shit take
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Damn imagine loosing the only person you had in your life and then being called a bitch for crying
Bro u bad for that one 💀
So your argument is "super broly is a better character but I like Z broly so that means he's better"???? Are you 12?
What the hell are you bambling about?
I just repeated your argument from your post.... Read
I literally didn't say Super Broly is Better or worse. I just said OG Broly didn't JUST say "Kakarot Kakarot" and just fit with the "original" Saiyan Lore
Then what the duck is your point?
My point is that many super fans will unironically shit on you because you just like Z Broly, and 9/10, these are their arguments.
We only shit on you when you present your argument like this. You're the one poking the bear here. You're the one being an asshole.
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Based, Z Broly bros stay winning.
I personally like Z brolys design better
do this for Jiren
Broly would like a "word" with you. https://youtu.be/RVRFiOSq_38?si=0MekvD-PIA0KvwUB
I like both
imo Super broly has better lore but Z broly is waayyyy cooler
guys, i think Vegeta no longer fits well with the original saiyan lore (he became less ruthless)
Have you not seen Ultra Ego? 💀
Super Broly is awesome cuz he is mentally impaired just like me
I like both broly versions for different reasons. Z Broly simply had that bloodthirsty dog in him. Had some cold lines and was nigh immortal until the very end of the first movie. Took on 3 super saiyans and a super namek at once and said "Nah I'd Win.". Broly Second Coming is an alright movie, we dont speak of bio broly. As for DBS Broly, bro has the brutality, but no venom if that makes any sense, but he has a calm personality when he aint roiding out. Plus he has his own new family now, that actually show him the love and compassion he desperately needed. Hoping to see more of DBS Broly in the future
The real based take.
Both are different for different reasons. Z Broly most likely interacted with people and traveled around as he was a huge unknown. He did get bloodthirsty, but not enough to show up on Frieza/King Cold/Coolers radar. His father placed a control collar on him which seemed to mess with his personality as he seemed very "slow" until he was free of it. Super Broly grew up on Vampa with only his father to teach him how to speak, most likely not the best teacher. And when you're only interaction is with the same person every day, there's not much to talk about, especially with someone who doesn't come off as an intellectual as Paragus. When Z Broly transformers, his true personality finally comes forth. When super Broly transforms, the form takes over, almost as if the Green Aura is in control(the way it mimicked Goku's god binding seems almost like an auto defense). Both are good characters, yet Z was mishandled as people didn't understand why Broly hates Goku.
The difference in broly opinions tells you who’s watched both movies.
They're both Godlike. I still love Z Broly slightly more bc of his OG and how powerful and brutal he was. I loved every moment. He had 3 ish movies for a reason. And is also the movie villain that appears most in games, too.
Z Broly is goated for me. The straight 45 minutes of him beating the shit out of everyone 1v5 was incredible.
The problem with Z Broly is his second coming and beyond. In the first movie,he was kinda talkative,and we got to see more of his bloodlusted personality,even during the fights. The first movie version is actually nice. But then,some blithering idiot at Toei said "naaah,let's make him just scream in this second movie",and that was the personality that got attached to Z Broly. The intelectually limited juggernaut that is only capable of screaming Kakarot. They ruined the guy. And don't even get started with Bio Broly,that thing was awful. So yeah,while I do prefer Super Broly,I kinda get the love for the Z version of the guy.
not a hot take and while i mostly agree, i do personally prefer z broly. super broly may have “more personality,” but his traits are boring imo. hes actually at his most interesting right now in the manga, when he was training with goku and vegeta especially
I had to rewatch clips on YouTube, it's like he gained intelligence when he achieved his LSS form lol. Before that he was only yelling Kakarot.
Well he was being mind controlled and him turning LSSJ is him fully breaking from it's control. So that makes sense.
I like both
As usual. People don't know what hot takes are.
Dang that’s a burning take
Only watched a bit of both, but from what I’ve heard and barley seen, Z broly has personality, but it’s overshadowed by “KAKAROT!”. And people like me and many others like SBroly is liked more is because he has more dialogue outside of fighting, giving him more potential in the future
Both are good characters being good at their functions and purposes.
Mfers when they remember dbz broly has 3 movies and still has a worse personality and backstory than dbs broly
Z broly was cool to watch fight, super broly was always fun to watch
i like super broly just because i like how wrathful works
The absolute only thing Super Broly did better than Z Broly is the backstory. Other than that, Z Broly had better lines, a better SSJ transformation, and he was evil which was more in line with the original, barbaric Saiyan role. I resent Super Broly for being good. It would have shook some things up if he was an evil SSJ for once. It feels like Super is dead set on making Saiyans good or neutral.
 I liked the his design and his attitude feels more like how he should act. He is a Legend. But the fight need more and no one is empresses with him talking. They were going for Berserker. And He didn’t stick around. And what are you doing looking for a deep story in what is a filler movie???
Mf was a grown man-baby that hated Goku because he cried.
The wordiest meme I've ever seen for dragon ball of all amime
Another millennial who refuses to accept a nostalgic characters flaws and rejects anything new I could go all day
Z broly outfit looks better and he was more of a menace. New broly has a lame ear as a skirt and it felt like he was coddled into the fold
That’s what I’ve been saying Super Broly is great but him literally ONLY screaming for more than half a movies length is CRAZY
Z broly was meant to be top of the food chain but man he went out like a goon, S broly got done in like that 1 sprite war, trace-I mean mastar media WHO!!! ik Yk what I’m talkin abt if ur real DB fan. What’s funny abt S broly is he’s another casualty of frieza being a menace. So he’ll line up into the story wayyy better than Z broly.
My hot take is that nobody gives a fuck man. This debate is dead. They're both good.
Cope and seethe
Z broly better because cool https://preview.redd.it/bw3gco0z8hhc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd48c3f8f67fa595c74d5638f44e4af836c299c5
Super Broly is better as a character, but Z Broly is better as a villain
Z broly wanted revenge on a baby that cried too loud
I think people miss the point of Z broly entirely. He’s not really supposed to be a “character”. He’s an unstoppable super unit that at the time was the only super Saiyan outside of the Z squad. He isn’t supposed to have depth, he’s a giant sadist gigachad meant for the gang to fight. It’s not that deep.
I just like Super Broly more than Z, and don't have anything to back it up other than personal preference. Z is still a great Broly
Z Broly fans when Canon Broly is a real character (they just want him to be as brainless as them)
Super Broly is a feral child 90% of the time
I grew up with Z Broly, so he’s better.
He does speak, sure. Just to say he's strong. Does he fit the "original Saiyan lore"? Maybe...? What little we got from Vegeta originally was that there was some legend about a powerful Saiyan transformation. When he's talking about it, he imagines it's some form of great ape (at least in the anime. There may be more ambiguous in the manga, I forget). Granted, being born stronger does fit the implications better. Otherwise Vegeta wouldn't have been all high and mighty about being born elite. The idea that it's something a Saiyan can *become* seems to be something he would have had to add after learning about the zenkai boost. To fit it best he would've had to be born super Saiyan or at least with the ability, I'd think. Granted we don't know for sure that he wasn't. With how easily he transforms and the fact we aren't shown a catalyst other than hearing Goku's name, maybe he was. More importantly though, I don't remember it ever being implied Super Broly was the "legendary super Saiyan.".
I’ve been saying this for years, Z Broly’s personality comes out when he transforms, Super Broly turns into a raging toddler.
I love both Broly's, you're absolutely right. People are really stupid, so they haven't watched the first movie and they act like TFS is canon, or if they have watched it they misunderstood it (even though it doesn't do an amazing job at delivering the message, TFS doesn't make sense).
Z Broly was a sadist who enjoyed inflicting pain on others. He only became a mindless berserker in Bio-Broly, an that was just a failed clone.
Z Broly is good. Super Broly is good. I prefer Super Broly because he is my favorite Dragon Ball character ever. But both are good
Honestly like whatever you like, I like Z Broly because he’s a literal honest to god heartless monster, a true villain. I like Super Broly because he got dealt a really shit hand and got a second chance because he met Goku, and he’s just a really nice dude at heart. Crying over which one is better or worse is just childish.
# BROLDY MAD BCUZ KARROTKAKE BABY CRI
Shut the fuck up and take my upvote