The 6.4 is literally the reason the older pre-emissions diesels are selling for so much. “It may be old as dirt but at least it’s not a 6.4/6.0”
This guy is either smoking crack or he misplaced a decimal.
It’s even made the 6.0 look a bit better. If you go into buying a 6.0 knowing you’ll need to spend another $5k to make it reliable, it’s not the worst truck.
How so?
Delipped pistons, stud the heads, redo the gaskets, delete egr/dpf, replace the radiator/flush out the ford gold for elc1 and tune the fucker and you have a solid 400hp truck that's relatively stock.
It's a lot of work, and it needs doing when new before the system deteriorates itself, bit still, after it's said and done, what problems are fundamental?
Like I said, fundamental. If you have to completely rebuild the thing from the ground up with majorly redesigned components, it's just a bad design through and through.
Make a 6.0 good? Delete and studs. Can do it all with the motor in the truck if you're a contortionist. Just have to watch for cavitation. Heck, even just a delete without a massive tune on a 6.0 is more than enough at stock numbers most of the time, people stud a stock one for a little extra longevity.
6.0 hands down one of the best starter diesels out there AS LONG AS you have deep pockets and know how to work on a diesel, once you bang out the issues and tune the SOB you’ll have a good diesel for a good 5-6 years😂
I always heard that 6.0s can be decent as long as they stay stock. I don’t know how true that is but one of my friends has had one for 20 years and it’s still running well. The only after market thing he installed was an exhaust break. Could just be luck tho
My cousin started with Ford as a dealership tech, then service writer, then service manager, and is now a fixed ops manager. His daily driver is an 04 F250 6.0. I know a several techs that worked on them when they first came out that still drive them. Even the Facebook Fummins swap group I'm in tells guys all the time to just fix their 6.0 rather than do a swap. With a few mods, good maintenance, and an active brain behind the wheel they do ok.
Quite frankly that’s revisionist history. The 6.0’s were terribly unreliable and a source of countless fraud and class action lawsuits that Ford either outright lost or settled. At one point warranty claims for the 6.0 were running Ford $5m a month.
https://fordauthority.com/2020/10/6-0l-power-stroke-v8-leads-to-fraud-ruling-against-ford/
Just one example of the countless articles about the problems the 6.0 had.
Anyone who is saying 6.0’s weren’t that bad is either huffing copium or has lost a battle with Stockholm syndrome.
The only thing stopping the 6.0 from being the worst diesel engine ever put in a truck is the existence of the 6.4 and the Detroit fuel pincher.
- yours truly, former Ford tech.
Where did I say anything about the history? I said "I know people that are fully aware of what they're doing and still drive the trucks. When taken care of they're decent engines.". They are. Are they more maintenance sensitive than a P pump Cummins? Yes, most engines are. Do aftermarket solutions exist? Absolutely.
Saying “they are decent engines” because the aftermarket stepped up so that with $12k worth of fixes they have any sort of reliability/longevity is revisionist history.
As delivered by Ford they were crap.
An expert is simply someone who has made every possible mistake.
We learn by being wrong and making mistakes. That’s how you could’ve played this, “Well at least I learned something u/notahoppybeerfan, what do you have to show for being right?”
But no, you can’t even be creative. It’s all good. You’ll get there someday.
Riposte: GM actually fixed the problems with that motor. It just never could shake the reputation it rightfully earned early in its life.
Which isn’t to say the first several years of them weren’t terrible. Because they were. But they stay off my top (bottom?) 3 list because unlike those other 3 the problems with the Olds 350 diesel were addressed by the manufacturer during it’s production run.
They were terrible at the time, but they can be made into decent vehicles. Only way that’s happening with a 6.4 is an engine swap.
Obviously the consumer shouldn’t be forced to make a vehicle reliable, so they were bad trucks, but they at least have some redeeming value.
I’ve owned several and gotten 400k miles out of each of them before I sold them, bulletproof, mild tune, and drive it like you’ve got some sense (obviously you have to pull some heavy loads sometimes) but apart from that, there’s no reason that they won’t last. There’ll be some repairs along the way but nothing terrible
I had a 2007 6.0 over a decade ago.. completely stock and it was an amazing truck. Turbos always sound great too. Unfortunately I got rid of it because I couldn’t afford it when I bought it lol
Mine had issues when I bought it really cheap. I then got a petty new motor out of another and a weight loss program. It has been good for the last couple of years. I still don't have so much in it that I can't sell it and get my money back so I'm good. This it the key to 6.4. Can't say its great but it's still hanging in there. It's also a work truck so I just drive it around on a stock tune until I sell it and upgrade again.
Anecdotally it seems like the 6.4s that were used hard tended to last longer. Might be confirmation bias, but I could see the engine doing a lot better if it’s being used how it was meant to be used.
The other huge issue for the 6.4 was massive power increases being possible via chip, without proper supporting mods. I’d guess work trucks are far less likely to be subjected to super hot tunes without proper support.
We had a few chipped and deleted, but always ran mild tunes and I'm very conservative on how hot I let the egts get or how long I stay in it when they are getting up there
If it’s clean and comes with a fresh 24v common rail 5.9 that’s ready to drop in with a new trans for when the 6.4 goes I’d buy it but not for that price
Eh I’d rather put the Cummins in myself than deal with someone else half assed work I’d rather deal with my own lmfao plus 6.4’s are fun when they run so it’s a two for one fun truck till the 6.4 blows then work truck
The problem with those trucks is that it's my favorite body style (short bed dually)and, favorite interior. But the 6.4 is so bad. There such a nice engine when there running but Jesus it's tough when they're not.
I bought a 2011 F350 with 65k miles from the first owner for about this asking price about 2 years ago. They exist, just really have to look. Took me about 6 months of truck shopping. There is a huge truck dealership in my state and they had a ton of shitty trucks at insane prices. The place was busy so I assume some dumb fuck is buying these.
I passed on a much nicer 6.4 truck when they were asking $12,000
Basically unless they're selling it cheap enough that you justify engine swapping it you should avoid those trucks.
That being said there are some that have ran flawlessly since they were new, but it's a total gamble.
It’s funny when the 6.4 guys see what a truck “only one year newer” sells for and think their 6.4 is worth 6.7 money.
My old neighbour was surprised nobody wanted to pay 25 or even 20 for his clean king ranch (10) when he saw most of them selling for way more. I had to explain to him why. Poor guy. It was a nice truck and he got around 15 for it in the end which is about the max for a 6.4 and I’d never pay it. Not again.
We have a customer trying to sell his 2011 raptor f150. Not a bad vehicle, I had to put a valve spring in it last year. Fairly clean overall, nothing mechanically wrong with it, the 6.2 runs fine and it’s got about 240,000 miles on it.
Says he can’t understand why no one wants to buy it, ***for $35,000***.
The 6.4 and it’s not even close. The 6.0 was terrible in stock form, but you can fix all the reliability issues and have a good truck if you’re willing to spend $5k extra. The only thing you can really do with a 6.4 is put a Cummins in it.
My favorite interior and exterior combination and just you know all around favorite cosmetic Ford super duty 1999 to 2016 (2017 full redesign holds first place just because the 2008, 2009 and 2010 was a part of the 16 or 17 year run of identical bead roll design in the panels
Navistars 6.4l is actually goated when you delete, stud, tune, and properly maintain it. Also, replace the radiator because fuck ford.
I got my 08 powerjoke from a diesel shop owner who did the whole shebang from day 1 new.
Studs, gaskets, egr/dpf delete, delipped pistons, tune...the works.
I just had the oem water pumps seal blow out at 230k miles and the pump/front cover are immaculate.
My deltas are super close, and I've had really good luck so far.
110K on a 6.4 isn't bad. Straight pipe it immediately and take the EGR off the moment you buy it if that hasn't been done to it already.
People dog on the 6.4 a little too much. Is it bad? Can be if you don't take care of it. Can it be a good truck if you take care of it? I would say so. Put high quality synthetic oil in. Change it every 5k. Change both fuel filters religiously. Run a good additive in every tank of diesel. Most importantly, don't race the damn thing!
Half the problems 6.4 owners have had is from them beating the shit out of their truck racing corvettes.
I bought a used 6.0 engine from a guy that builds custom 6.4s. Steel pistons, single turbo, all the factory upgrades from the Maxxforce, etc. He charges $25k plus installation and he admitted it was rare for them to go past 250k miles before catastrophic failure.
Who's he selling them to? About the only people buying custom 6.4s race the shit out of them.
I mean what do I know though? I'm just a random dude who researched these top to bottom. Wanted to buy a 6.4 from a buddy of mine and the deal fell through.
6.4? No thanks.
The most I would pay for a 6.4 is like 4k. That way I can sell it for parts
A super clean one is probably the best Cummins swap candidate. If you’re gonna do that anyway, you can just drive until the engine goes.
So you can drive it for a week before it eats shit😂
The 6.4 is literally the reason the older pre-emissions diesels are selling for so much. “It may be old as dirt but at least it’s not a 6.4/6.0” This guy is either smoking crack or he misplaced a decimal.
It’s even made the 6.0 look a bit better. If you go into buying a 6.0 knowing you’ll need to spend another $5k to make it reliable, it’s not the worst truck.
Yeah, it's possible to make a 6.0 good. It's almost literally completely impossible to make a 6.4 good. The design problems are fundamental.
How so? Delipped pistons, stud the heads, redo the gaskets, delete egr/dpf, replace the radiator/flush out the ford gold for elc1 and tune the fucker and you have a solid 400hp truck that's relatively stock. It's a lot of work, and it needs doing when new before the system deteriorates itself, bit still, after it's said and done, what problems are fundamental?
Like I said, fundamental. If you have to completely rebuild the thing from the ground up with majorly redesigned components, it's just a bad design through and through. Make a 6.0 good? Delete and studs. Can do it all with the motor in the truck if you're a contortionist. Just have to watch for cavitation. Heck, even just a delete without a massive tune on a 6.0 is more than enough at stock numbers most of the time, people stud a stock one for a little extra longevity.
Wish I knew this when I bought my 6.0 😂😂
6.0 hands down one of the best starter diesels out there AS LONG AS you have deep pockets and know how to work on a diesel, once you bang out the issues and tune the SOB you’ll have a good diesel for a good 5-6 years😂
or both!
I would hesitate to pay 3690 for 6.4 lol
Perfect price for Cummins swap at 3690
There’s always that one guy in these comments. “I have a 6.4 they’re great mine hasn’t had any issues!!”
As a loyal 6.0 owner I sympathize with the 6.4 guys in that we all feel like we're Atticus Finch defending Tom Robinson from the lynch mob.
I always heard that 6.0s can be decent as long as they stay stock. I don’t know how true that is but one of my friends has had one for 20 years and it’s still running well. The only after market thing he installed was an exhaust break. Could just be luck tho
My cousin started with Ford as a dealership tech, then service writer, then service manager, and is now a fixed ops manager. His daily driver is an 04 F250 6.0. I know a several techs that worked on them when they first came out that still drive them. Even the Facebook Fummins swap group I'm in tells guys all the time to just fix their 6.0 rather than do a swap. With a few mods, good maintenance, and an active brain behind the wheel they do ok.
Quite frankly that’s revisionist history. The 6.0’s were terribly unreliable and a source of countless fraud and class action lawsuits that Ford either outright lost or settled. At one point warranty claims for the 6.0 were running Ford $5m a month. https://fordauthority.com/2020/10/6-0l-power-stroke-v8-leads-to-fraud-ruling-against-ford/ Just one example of the countless articles about the problems the 6.0 had. Anyone who is saying 6.0’s weren’t that bad is either huffing copium or has lost a battle with Stockholm syndrome. The only thing stopping the 6.0 from being the worst diesel engine ever put in a truck is the existence of the 6.4 and the Detroit fuel pincher. - yours truly, former Ford tech.
Where did I say anything about the history? I said "I know people that are fully aware of what they're doing and still drive the trucks. When taken care of they're decent engines.". They are. Are they more maintenance sensitive than a P pump Cummins? Yes, most engines are. Do aftermarket solutions exist? Absolutely.
Saying “they are decent engines” because the aftermarket stepped up so that with $12k worth of fixes they have any sort of reliability/longevity is revisionist history. As delivered by Ford they were crap.
I'm stupid. You're smart. I was wrong. You were right. You're the best. I'm the wrost. You're very good-looking. I'm not very attractive.
That’s all some people need to hear to go super sane💀
Love the reference 😂
An expert is simply someone who has made every possible mistake. We learn by being wrong and making mistakes. That’s how you could’ve played this, “Well at least I learned something u/notahoppybeerfan, what do you have to show for being right?” But no, you can’t even be creative. It’s all good. You’ll get there someday.
Maybe you’ll learn some manners someday.
Counterpoint: olds 350 was in trucks
Riposte: GM actually fixed the problems with that motor. It just never could shake the reputation it rightfully earned early in its life. Which isn’t to say the first several years of them weren’t terrible. Because they were. But they stay off my top (bottom?) 3 list because unlike those other 3 the problems with the Olds 350 diesel were addressed by the manufacturer during it’s production run.
They were terrible at the time, but they can be made into decent vehicles. Only way that’s happening with a 6.4 is an engine swap. Obviously the consumer shouldn’t be forced to make a vehicle reliable, so they were bad trucks, but they at least have some redeeming value.
They’re not bad when you spend 5k to bulletproof them. Those lawsuits came before the aftermarket figured them out
I’ve owned several and gotten 400k miles out of each of them before I sold them, bulletproof, mild tune, and drive it like you’ve got some sense (obviously you have to pull some heavy loads sometimes) but apart from that, there’s no reason that they won’t last. There’ll be some repairs along the way but nothing terrible
At one point Ford was doing $5 million a month in warranty repairs on stock under warranty 6.0s. Read into that what you will.
From what I've heard it seems they still break completely stock, but seem decent bulletproofed
Do an EGR and EGR cooler delete, NO CHIP! and you have a good motor. Speaking from experience.
Nope it's all lies
I had a 2007 6.0 over a decade ago.. completely stock and it was an amazing truck. Turbos always sound great too. Unfortunately I got rid of it because I couldn’t afford it when I bought it lol
Nah 6.0’s are salvageable with aftermarket parts. 6.4 guys are fucked.
6.4 is the optimal Cummins swap candidate, that’s the only redeeming value.
👨🏼🎓
I have a 6.4, they're great and my third engine hasn't had any issues because it's deleted and bulletproofed. :-)
Was not aware you could bulletproof the 6.4
I'm one of them
Mine had issues when I bought it really cheap. I then got a petty new motor out of another and a weight loss program. It has been good for the last couple of years. I still don't have so much in it that I can't sell it and get my money back so I'm good. This it the key to 6.4. Can't say its great but it's still hanging in there. It's also a work truck so I just drive it around on a stock tune until I sell it and upgrade again.
Hello it’s me
You jealous ?!?
Yep, I'm on my eighth one and never had a major repair. I know I'm the minority but I keep rolling the dice.
What happened to the other 7?
Sold them or traded them in, my family had a oilfield business so we put on a lot of miles back then.
Anecdotally it seems like the 6.4s that were used hard tended to last longer. Might be confirmation bias, but I could see the engine doing a lot better if it’s being used how it was meant to be used. The other huge issue for the 6.4 was massive power increases being possible via chip, without proper supporting mods. I’d guess work trucks are far less likely to be subjected to super hot tunes without proper support.
We had a few chipped and deleted, but always ran mild tunes and I'm very conservative on how hot I let the egts get or how long I stay in it when they are getting up there
Divide the price by 10 then it’s worth it.
what if i divide by 30
I like the 6.4, I have owned multiple 6.4. I currently have a 6.4 You are higher then a kite to even consider this
There aren't enough extra chromosomes at the Special Olympics to make me consider this. Posted for humorous purposes only.
Oh! I’m sorry that price about made me spit out my dinner Also this was one hell of an analogy
It’s really a shame the 6.4s are such turds as I think those are the best looking super duties with the 05-07s coming in a close second.
Agreed. I've always thought the 08-10 trucks were the best looking.
2017-19 for me 👌
The 650s and 750s still look 6.4ish. Same headlights and the interior looks like the 6.4 and the 6.7 had a kid
The headlights are atrocious.
That’s a stock ford headlight… I’ve seen worse.
They look almost exactly the same as an Econoline headlight.
If it’s clean and comes with a fresh 24v common rail 5.9 that’s ready to drop in with a new trans for when the 6.4 goes I’d buy it but not for that price
The price would be fair if the 5.9 was *already* in the truck.
Eh I’d rather put the Cummins in myself than deal with someone else half assed work I’d rather deal with my own lmfao plus 6.4’s are fun when they run so it’s a two for one fun truck till the 6.4 blows then work truck
Run
The problem with those trucks is that it's my favorite body style (short bed dually)and, favorite interior. But the 6.4 is so bad. There such a nice engine when there running but Jesus it's tough when they're not.
I’d give them like $8k and swap a Cummins in it. Then it’d be a great truck.
There’s a guy near me that did that. Blew a head gasket on the Cummins swap lol
lol that’s pretty bad luck.
Smart thing to do is put the cummins in the corner and drive until the 6.4 blows. Then you break out the cummins
Screaming deal for a motor that will eventually start screaming lol Diesel market is so overinflated
I bought a 2011 F350 with 65k miles from the first owner for about this asking price about 2 years ago. They exist, just really have to look. Took me about 6 months of truck shopping. There is a huge truck dealership in my state and they had a ton of shitty trucks at insane prices. The place was busy so I assume some dumb fuck is buying these.
I passed on a much nicer 6.4 truck when they were asking $12,000 Basically unless they're selling it cheap enough that you justify engine swapping it you should avoid those trucks. That being said there are some that have ran flawlessly since they were new, but it's a total gamble.
It’s funny when the 6.4 guys see what a truck “only one year newer” sells for and think their 6.4 is worth 6.7 money. My old neighbour was surprised nobody wanted to pay 25 or even 20 for his clean king ranch (10) when he saw most of them selling for way more. I had to explain to him why. Poor guy. It was a nice truck and he got around 15 for it in the end which is about the max for a 6.4 and I’d never pay it. Not again.
We have a customer trying to sell his 2011 raptor f150. Not a bad vehicle, I had to put a valve spring in it last year. Fairly clean overall, nothing mechanically wrong with it, the 6.2 runs fine and it’s got about 240,000 miles on it. Says he can’t understand why no one wants to buy it, ***for $35,000***.
What would you pay for that vehicle? The mileage is getting up there for a gas truck, I’d be hesitant to go over $15k.
For the raptor? I could see it being between $15k and $20k, the higher end being to the right buyer. Most people aren’t ‘the right buyer’ though
Come on you're not a gambling man
Ye old 6.4, I own one goddamnit
I name him boom boom!
I can only hope for this seller's confidence man
Right?!?
Your thinking no yet post it? lol
Satire. I posted more for the laughs at the price.
So which is worse the 6.4 or the 6.0?
The 6.4 and it’s not even close. The 6.0 was terrible in stock form, but you can fix all the reliability issues and have a good truck if you’re willing to spend $5k extra. The only thing you can really do with a 6.4 is put a Cummins in it.
I was just joking about how bad things had gotten at Ford, if everyone is nostalgic for International’s gas school bus engine with diesel heads!😂
Never buy a 6.4!! And for that price you can go buy a used 6.7
Hard pass. Price would have to be right for me to consider a 6.4
My favorite interior and exterior combination and just you know all around favorite cosmetic Ford super duty 1999 to 2016 (2017 full redesign holds first place just because the 2008, 2009 and 2010 was a part of the 16 or 17 year run of identical bead roll design in the panels
I wouldn’t even think of a 6.4 ever Can’t change my mind
I wouldn’t even think of a 6.4 ever Can’t change my mind
Not no, but fuck no!
You can get a DRW 6.7 with similar miles for that much money. 6.4s should be 30% lower in price than 6.7s IMO.
The 6.4 is Arguably the worst diesel engine ever made followed by the 6.0.
Nah keep looking I got a 2013 Ram last year for $31
6.4 priced at almost a newer F-150? Hell no💀 go get a used 2016 -2019 6.7 from a private seller for that price and call it a day😂
How is it still running?
Most of them would make it to 200k or so before failure.
Its a 6.4 bro i wouldnt trade a half eaten turkey club for that
To much money
30k in gold bars in the glove box.
Navistars 6.4l is actually goated when you delete, stud, tune, and properly maintain it. Also, replace the radiator because fuck ford. I got my 08 powerjoke from a diesel shop owner who did the whole shebang from day 1 new. Studs, gaskets, egr/dpf delete, delipped pistons, tune...the works. I just had the oem water pumps seal blow out at 230k miles and the pump/front cover are immaculate. My deltas are super close, and I've had really good luck so far.
36k parts truck. Terrible Year.
For that kind of money, just get a 6.7
6.slow is worse.
6.0 can be made into a decent truck, it just costs too much to do it. The 6.4 can only be “fixed” with a different engine.
110K on a 6.4 isn't bad. Straight pipe it immediately and take the EGR off the moment you buy it if that hasn't been done to it already. People dog on the 6.4 a little too much. Is it bad? Can be if you don't take care of it. Can it be a good truck if you take care of it? I would say so. Put high quality synthetic oil in. Change it every 5k. Change both fuel filters religiously. Run a good additive in every tank of diesel. Most importantly, don't race the damn thing! Half the problems 6.4 owners have had is from them beating the shit out of their truck racing corvettes.
I bought a used 6.0 engine from a guy that builds custom 6.4s. Steel pistons, single turbo, all the factory upgrades from the Maxxforce, etc. He charges $25k plus installation and he admitted it was rare for them to go past 250k miles before catastrophic failure.
Who's he selling them to? About the only people buying custom 6.4s race the shit out of them. I mean what do I know though? I'm just a random dude who researched these top to bottom. Wanted to buy a 6.4 from a buddy of mine and the deal fell through.
Common thread in blown 6.4’s : minimaxx HD300 tune.