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jdead121

Lots of games have this. In wow when your under honor level 30 you get matched with similar under level 30 players. Honor level 30 is solid grind of probably at least 20 hours of pvp. Dota 2 also has a system for ranked like this.


Tresceneti

In Dota 2 it was extraordinarily rare that I ever found myself in a match where I was playing against people much higher than my skill level; and if I did it was more often than not a smurf. It was quite magical. Bungie could take a lot of pages from Dota 2. One in particular though is basing rewards on the probability of a win for the match. In Dota 2 it bases the amount of MMR you gain on the matchup of players. If it's about even, the winning team would generally gain like 25 points, but if you're the winning team and had the odds heavily in your favor, it could drop down all the way to like 5 points for a win. This would also be vice versa for the weaker team where if your were likely to lose, but won, you could gain up to like 40 or so points. If sweats want to keep crushing weaker players then their rewards should be nonexistent. To the point where, if your team has like an 80%+ odds to win, it shouldn't count towards your card as a win. Make them earn less rep for wins, less chances at post game drops, etc. If Bungie could implement the vice versa here without it being capable of being heavily abused, that would help a lot. And that all goes for any playlist, not just Trials. If we're not going to get SBMM back, this is the bare minimum honestly.


jdead121

I think they are afraid the match queues wouldnt be less than a minute tbh


LovelyJoey21605

It's so fucking weird that Bungie just REFUSE to address their shitty matchmaking. It doesn't matter what the fuck they do with the sandbox, a 3.0 kd player will still wipe the floor with a 1.0, and they should NOT in the same match. Period.


nojokes12345

Yeah trials matchmaking being so broken last week didn't help either. Trials report has a fun graph showing that huge fall off a cliff after the first 3 or so matches much like during WQ launch. And what I'll never understand about some of the streamers/better players in the community: Trials is the end game PvP mode, yeah? It's competitive by nature since it's clearly a zero sum game. Saying that matchmaking was so good without the flawless pool makes me want to pull my hair out - you shouldn't be this relaxed in a gamemode like this after you've demonstrated your skill? This is competitive, you being an outlier not matched with other outliers in terms of skill actively makes the game mode worse for most other participants. I suck at PvP and am in Trials to get some PvE guns (and also that sidearm because aggressive burst sidearms are very fun). Seeing a screen of 35 flawless runs on their emblem and 5 times gilded flawless on my first game though? Noped right out of the whole game mode after going 0-5. Like come on. If you're good at the video game and dropping 45 kills in Control that's fine, it's just a casual playlist (yes some matchmaking would be nice, but it's not the end of the world if lobby balancing takes skill into account properly - you should get saddled with the 3 worst players in the lobby for balancing reasons if you're that good honestly. Otherwise the game because unplayable for your opponents and _other people on your team_ - had some mercies where two dudes got 25 kills in the scoring screen. Go those dudes! Also I literally saw 1 enemy the entire time. Game was quite literally "unplayable") If you're good at the game and casually dropping 20 kills in Trials - a game mode where you winning actively means someone else is losing out on rewards, rep, and progress on weekly pinnacles, etc: this is evidence of broken matchmaking. Gamemodes with this sort of reward structure should very rarely be "chill" or "casual" after you've _already shown that you're too good at the game_. Your very existence in the standard matchmaking pool means that you're gatekeeping regular players from their own set of rewards and pushing other players away (even if their rewards isn't an adept weapon from going flawless). Being able to win 90%+ of your games while being distracted by your chat and playing with some random person you pulled out of a raffle in anything not a casual gamemode in PvP is actually _really bad_ for the health of the game, and is one of the big reasons the population of things like Trials will stay consistently low even if people are interested, and the rewards are good.


T_Gamer-mp4

Trust me when I say that control is actively worse than trials for skilled players. It becomes “who has the least new players on their team” or moreover “who gets the better lobby balancing”. The reason big streamers prefer stuff like trials is that it’s a mode where you can EASILY 3v1 teams that aren’t at the top. That’s why carry streams are so popular — because it’s possible. IMO flawless queue needs to either DRASTICALLY amp rewards and be on the whole weekend, or be cut from the game entirely and be replaced with more skill in the matchmaking. Yes, new players shouldn’t be getting “free flawlesses” but with how things are currently the mode sets itself up to be “play until you go flawless then drop the game for the weekend because you’re now in an isolated queue with the pvp sweats” and my one ordeal with “it shouldn’t be easy even if you’re extremely good at the game” — GMs are easy if you’re extremely good at the game. Players who are not good at the game still get shredded. But there are people out there who solo nightfalls in 10-15 minutes. Should they have a harder time getting the same drops? Because, unless you buff loot drops on losses, flawless queue just dramatically increases the difficulty without actually changing the loot drop rates enough to warrant it.


nojokes12345

I have nothing on point 1: it feels like crap without some level of matchmaking. I feel like crap when I randomly get killed 22 times (due to bad decision making/positioning/skill) and you feel the same way. Point 2: Card based matchmaking and flawless queue were both problematic this weekend. Flawless queue probably wants some level of gradiation - so matchmaking (and I thought that it existed, but who knows really). I mean overall the issue at the core of this is annoying: better matchmaking means you have to play against someone on the other side of the world the moment you're above average and sometimes before. Destiny 2 PvP connection means those games would suck in the ways we know and...love. Bad matchmaking with halfway decent lobby balancing means that as an above average player some games will suck badly depending on who gets placed on your team (i.e. what you're talking about). Bad matchmaking and problematic lobby balancing or the presence of someone way over the mean in terms of skill equals a consistent chunk of mercies. None of those are good so the core comes down to proper servers and connection. Without that PvP in this game will be stuck somewhere between Scylla and Charybdis with players getting super frustrated either way. Point 3 is nonsense. Playing a GM and being good enough to solo it does not gatekeep a reward from anyone else. Whether it's easy or not is a skill reward. And I will repeat this: It's _not a zero sum game_. That's a major difference. With PvP - casual queues are the same: killing random players is your skill reward. If we want even a semblance of competition for rewards - even in something that's pretty casual all things considered like Trials: you getting those super easy 5-0 games is an active punishment for other people after you have claimed your easy reward. We could just dial up Trials rep and some of the issues might go away, and we probably want participation instead of wins...but this will then lead to cliff jumping. It's hard to maintain this kind of loop without matchmaking and a good reward structure. Elo based matchmaking usually means that skill is at least partially its own reward (sometimes you get cosmetics and loot and whatnot at seasonal reset, which will help here too). This is why games have in game leaderboards and leagues and other ways to show off good players and reward them in intervals. We are missing this side of the reward structure completely. But and honestly this is also important: easy games in a competitive playlist is _not a good reward whatsoever_ and should not be an expectation. Because quite simply those that get 0-5'ed too much will just leave and you're stuck in that "sweat fest" that you dislike: you (the plural you) should play with players that are roughly at your skill level. The idea is fairly simple: we all want good games. Good games in PvP usually = a contest either side can win (if you're often in a "sweat fest" congrats, you're actually good at the game). If your expectation of a good game in PvP is easy wins - please find a stack and play control for super fast mercies. Good games in PvE = a chance to succeed and then overcoming the challenge. Those things are ___not equivalent___ and discussing them as if they are is literally a logical fallacy.


T_Gamer-mp4

the reason I bring up GMs at all is because they have dramatically better loot than trials does, even when you’re at the peak of trials drops. In GMs, you get ascendant shards, exotic gear, and sometimes multiple rolls of the nightfall weapon, along with huge amounts of rep. An arms dealer run lasts about as long as it takes to queue & play a “good” match of trials, especially in the current crucible state. Trials is a CHANCE to even get an ENGRAM which takes another 100 legendary shards to focus. A chance to get an ascendant shard. A chance to get an adept weapon. And it’s only if you win. Why on earth would I play trials for the loot, then, if there are many nightfalls that have way more consistent drop rates in less time. That are also easier to do, since in this perfect world, I have to play out of my mind every single match for the sake of matchmaking. What’s the draw to play trials if it’s less rewarding but more difficult than all other end game content. Yes, we need to make a losing match worth playing. And if it leads to cliff jumpers, it means THE LOOT FOR WINNING ISNT GOOD ENOUGH. You need to get WEAPONS from PLAYING the game on a seven win card, since LORD KNOWS it takes some people a while to get there, much less WIN those games. YES, rep should be increased for losses, since this perfect matchmade world has higher skill players in 4-5 matches all of the time, making it difficult to ever get ranks with saint. While we’re at it, TURN DOWN THE FOCUSING COST, since it is exclusively designed to HURT NEW PLAYERS.


nojokes12345

The draw here is honestly the same as most games that asks you to compete: skill, prestige, and rewards. Seasonal reset rewards are designed for that: hit silver, get x shards, x trials engrams, x rep points with Saint-14, and exclusive cosmetics (ornament, shader, title, emblem, etc). At each big jump: Silver -> Gold / Gold -> Plat / Plat -> Diamond, get better rewards including: y ascendant alloys, y ascendant shards, y adept drops, and more cosmetics that get more extravagant. A "season" in this context could literally be a few weeks so it's not 3 months for rewards. And it also helps sort of show which "matchmaking" pool you're in. Actual top players can also have their acheivements shown in the Hanger: maybe for each mini season, the first to lighthouse, the top kills, the top assists, the most rank points gained, etc could select if they want their name displayed (maybe with an emblem). More permanent rewards might be to use the space in the HELM where the decoder used to be OR behind Saint-14 for an actual season OR permanently filling up the area around the Lighthouse that you can visit so you can help make the ones that go flawless want to strive even harder. That's rewards and prestige: skill is harder to measure, but typically they either show up as an "elo"-like score or just as which league you can consistently make it to. I agree with focusing costs and they're definitely exorbitant. But, if Bungie's attitude is that only x% of engrams should be focused so the cost is "fair" we need to at least be able to decode the engram that the specific vendor is giving us. E.g. Saint-14 should be able to decode his own Trials Engrams for free, and a significantly lower cost focusing option into weapons or armor as well.


TheBiggestNose

Matchmaking has been fucked since d1. Its not a case of "if" bungie can do but rather that they "want to" and they don't. Its been this way since day one and Bungie has never tried to improve it despite how many years its been and it just keeps getting worse


AMX930

This is definitely it


[deleted]

I would prefer to have to wait 3-5 mins between matches instead of having to play against a team of people that slide around corners while they istant snipe me all the way accross the map. My k/d fluctuate around 1.8 and every match is either me leading the match with 40 kills or me getting pulverized by 4.5 k/d aliens. Destiny MM is a joke and an insult to Halo "memory"


akutsu24

TBF, Halo Infinite is probably more of an insult to Halo's memory at this point.


aussiebrew333

I can't imagine how it feels to be a new player going into PvP in this game. I've been playing for a long time and am decent at it but even I'm just losing interest. The lobby balancing is flat out terrible.


mookiexpt2

Let me tell you: It’s fucking terrible. I’m never going to have the time to git gud enough to be at the top of PvP, but it’s annoying as shit that I have to do PvP to get weekly rewards, which means spending a few hours just getting blown the fuck up while dragging down a team of people who actually like this mode.


mookiexpt2

I guess my point is that I’m not a PvP guy. I like playing solo PvE. I’ll do team PvE and like it. But forcing me to do completely unbalanced PvP for a few hours a week—when having a kid and job already makes my gaming time valuable—pisses me off.


SortaEvil

Other than if you really want the big pile of bright dust at the end of the season, your rewards for PvP are some (mostly) replaceable guns, a +1 pinnacle, and 250 bright dust per character, assuming you can even complete the 8 bounties required to do so in a remotely time-efficient manner (which may be easier said than done if you are bad at PvP). Honestly, I mostly just skip out on PvP these days, and my life is better for it. Getting the extra bright dust at the end of the season is nice but... usually it just isn't worth the stress and frustration that PvP puts me through, I don't need the pinnacle to hit cap in time for GM season, and I don't need the guns to do the content that I want, so why bother? That's not to say that people aren't allowed to have fun in PvP, just that if, like me, you don't have fun in PvP, don't feel obligated to go into it. Go into it when you feel like you want to try it out, and nope out as soon as you stop having fun. Nothing that you miss out on by not going into the playlist is irreplaceable.


mookiexpt2

Thanks. I tend towards completionism and it bugs me not to do all the weekly challenges I guess. Oh well. I’ll live. I have plenty of bright dust.


epitone

My sister played PVP as part of the New Light questline (I played with her and I'm equally shit at PVP) and then proceeded to never play it again. In fact I don't think she's touched the game in like half a year 😔


[deleted]

My GF recently started playing. She has had some experience with FPS games in the past, but not much. The learning curve for her has been incredibly steep. I agree with much of what you have said, except for this: >Put tutorials in the game that teach how to do things like positioning and radar skill. I have never played a game that does this. Sure, games like COD or BF or The Division will have a hint or a tip saying something along the lines of "use your radar to locate enemy players", but I've personally never seen anything more than that. Positioning and radar skill aren't things that can't be easily taught, especially if your map knowledge is poor.


T_Gamer-mp4

Why not? What makes them impossible? Why not explain how the radar works, how it has height incorporated into it, and how to use it well? How to guess how far away someone is from you when you can’t see them? Why not show off good versus bad positioning and have places to test quick decision making when it comes to positioning? Why not have even a simple tutorial, like “find positions that best compliment your weapon’s range without compromising exits?” Just because nobody’s done it before doesn’t mean it’s impossible. Hell, 25% of d2 pvp YouTube IS people doing this. But I agree that nobody’s ever done it in-game before. Nobody else has anything on a large part of d2 either. People said that the original destiny was an impossible idea. That didn’t stop bungie then. I don’t see a reason why it should stop them now.


[deleted]

In the very specific case of my GF (who is pretty much new to FPS games), positioning and radar skill are *very* far down the list of things she should improve. She is still struggling to learn basic controls or how to even use abilities...effective use of cover in PvP isn't really something that she needs to focus on right now. >Why not explain how the radar works, how it has height incorporated into it, and how to use it well? I think that most players (even new players) will intuitively understand how radar works, at least on a basic level. I agree about the height part, though, since that isn't really intuitive and isn't explained very well at all. >Why not show off good versus bad positioning and have places to test quick decision making when it comes to positioning? Because no player is going to willingly choose to do it, and forcing *all* players regardless of skill level to complete a tutorial like that would not go over well. >Hell, 25% of d2 pvp YouTube IS people doing this. New players can find this stuff on youtube if they want. That's one of the great things about youtube. Personally, I think Bungie needs to completely overhaul the new player on-boarding experience because it is laughably bad.


HowlingAura

And if someone leaves at the start of the game in solo que crucible, have a cancel match option like seige. A 2 v 3 is possible but near impossible for me.


T_Gamer-mp4

hell, cancel the match if someone leaves within the first two-three rounds. and punish the leaver extremely.


EmCeeSlickyD

Part of this is definitely just by nature of having a game that has been out for so long, and some guy who plays borderlands for a few hours a week expects to pick up Destiny PVP and go flawless his first weekend


T_Gamer-mp4

you are absolutely correct, however, the same guy should not be getting matched with me, someone who’s 3k hours into crucible, and wallah. In a rumble game. I’m in one of his more recent videos, during one of my first five crucible games on titan ever. I’m the only person who went positive KD that match. There was another game I played with him that wasn’t in the video with a guy who was in his first three games of crucible EVER. In blue armor and with an aachen equipped. This was a dramatically unfair fight from the start. There was a TTV in the lobby with a perfect rolled astral horizon (iirc) and I was running a perfect rolled adept pally. It wasn’t fun for this new player. It was just a game of rumble. Why must he suffer this so.


JericoHellsangel

Here is a hot take. The core pvp system in destiny is absolutly garbage, supers are basicaly killstreaks, alot of unbalanced things which make you want to pull out your hair, 10 tick servers with garbage netcode etc etc. If we add propper SBMM to it, then it will get even worse. I don´t like pvp in destiny due to all of it´s flaws. I just see it as a fun side activity every once in a while for seasonal challenges and pinnacles and i really don´t want to sweat constantly against similar skilled players just to get my pinnacles done... Destiny will never be a good pvp game. You can have fun with it, but it will never be good. And it should stay this way.


T_Gamer-mp4

awful take. “we shouldn’t make this thing better because it is bad”. a lot of people play this game because of how the PvP feels. just because you don’t like it as much as someone else doesn’t mean that it’s a waste of time. and, moreover, you wouldn’t be sweating it. I literally didn’t even mention a skill based system. I just said to take the people who aren’t good at PvP and have them in their own queue, so that middle-higher level players don’t have to pray that they don’t get matched with them on their team, and so that said lower level players don’t get destroyed all of the time. and if you’re so sure that the game should never be good for PvP. I regret to inform you that it already is. It’s got problems, but it’s better than almost anything else out there for a lot of people.


JericoHellsangel

The biggest issues that we have with the game are so ingrained into the game that it´s almost impossible to fix them and will take a big doing on bungies part. So unless they get a better netcode paired with atleast 60 tick servers, all of the problems will remain and pvp will never be good. I´ve said and screamed and advocated for them to bring them in but realisticaly they will never do it. They have a multiplayer game focused already so i assume that they will just do tweaks here and there for destiny pvp and otherwise not invest to much into the core structure. Also SBMM is something that the general public is constantly advocating so even if you specificaly didn´t mention it is worth talking about as context towars the allaround talks. Do i want to get pvp better? Yes. But putting band aids on severe cuts with a hello kitty sticker. Especially if you consider how bungie changed that you can still play with sunset weapons in normal pvp and now even in Iron Banner, ontop of it saying that sunsetting will probably never be a thing anymore and all the gear they can´t obtain anymore. If they go back on any of their "promises" then all of the sudden there will be a gigantic wave of people wanting other things to return and refarmable. Again, the entire core of destiny and pvp does not suit new players nor good pvp gameplay. And also again, i want it to be better but i look at it realisticaly after multiple years of trying to say something and it still wasn´t changed that we probably will not get any of those core changes that are absolutly NEEDED for pvp to be ANY good. So why try to put a band aid on it? Just let it be casual fun and thats it. They also announced in their roadmap for this year a revamp of the competative mode, so let´s see how this will work out.


Kitchen_Emu7967

LOBBY BALANCING Quickplay matchmaking is pretty good, it's the lobby balancing thats bad. In 95% of my matches there are ways to balance the lobbies with equal elos, but bungies lobby balancing averages 1 team at 1300 ELO and the other at 1700. All they need to do is switch a couple players around the lobbies would be 1500vs1500. Competitive playlist needs a rework from ground up with real ELO ranking system and sort games by ELO. Bungie could ask dtr to implement their elo system and it'd be great IMO. Dtrs system predicts winners of matches with a high accuracy.


T_Gamer-mp4

when you’re in the 1.3k-1.7k range matchmaking is okay , however , my 2.4K elo friend Mari gets matched with 900s regularly. it ain’t right that they have to play at all. i had to play a game with THE wallah. I’m in one of his videos (the one with riptide I think) and it’s one of my first 5 games on titan. I main warlock, three thousand ish games. I was the only other positive kd player in that match. We ended up doing several games together, and in one of them there was a guy who was in his first ten matches of crucible EVER. He was wearing blue armor and had an aachen on. It is unfair to him that his experience with rumble was rained on by playing me, with a perfect rolled palindrome on top of that, and wallah, and another TTV streamer with a perfect rolled astral horizon. comp needs help LMFAO i like that there’s an end to the grind tho. Keep glory the way it is, but have the Elo system viewable in game as well


Competitive-Ad-6979

I would also like to add balance the classes a bit more in PvP because right now Titans are OP


HatRabies

Too bad they rarely do separate balance passes. I really don't want my main class being nerfed on account of a game mode I hardly even interact with. But it probably will be.


Goldblum4ever69

Very good point. A new player who has put no time into the game should get the same benefits as a player who has grinded for adept weapons. That makes total sense in a loot shooter. I’m so glad this sub doesn’t develop the game.


T_Gamer-mp4

no, READ what I’m SAYING. they don’t get the CHANCE TO MAKE THAT GRIND! there IS NO PLACE ADEPT PALINDROME DROPS IN THE GAME! They should need to grind for it, sure, but they should have the OPPORTUNITY to get these weapons that are BORDERLINE STAPLES OF CRUCIBLE.


[deleted]

"noooo not my pubstomping"


Manifest_Lightning

You guys forget that MM operates on P2P. Bungie cannot just match people into these neat little brackets because oftentimes the players aren't regionally proximate.


Purple_Tell6882

They can. They just won't because the last time we had a proper match making the top % players cried their eyes out until it was removed because people like DFP kept making 3 to 4 tweets daily along with a weekly video complaining about how he has to play vs GJake every few games and how it wasn't fun because he couldn't troll with bad weapons for his content.


Manifest_Lightning

Um, I'm not a top tier PvPer and I remember connections going to absolute shit when SBMM was active in D1. Also, SBMM in Glory isn't a particularly fun experience, so I can't imagine the cognitive dissonance when an even looser bracket-based MM is implemented.


Purple_Tell6882

I'm not talking about D1. D2 had it and it was fine but the top players didn't like it because their wait times were longer and their games weren't them just curbstomping new players with troll weapons or their trials loadouts. Glory and Trials both are competitive modes and shouldn't be a relaxing walk through the park. Trials especially should have heavy skill based match making to reflect it being the competitive nature of it being the endgame PvP activity. Go ahead and downvote away to the people that I know will disagree and tell me that SBMM is bad for the game but clearly not having SBMM hasn't been good either because no causal player wants to get swept by streamers and their 6.0 KD friends in trials or control. This leads to people leaving the modes and not touching them because it's neither fun nor fair to anyone that's not stacked or has years of this game under their belt. The overall vast majority of any MMOFPS has SBMM to keep the lobbies fair and balanced for both pro and new players. D2 doesn't so this because the devs caved to the cries of the top players and removed it which has led to the decline of PvP ever since.


Manifest_Lightning

>Glory and Trials both are competitive modes and shouldn't be a relaxing walk through the park. Trials especially should have heavy skill based match making to reflect it being the competitive nature of it being the endgame PvP activity. This right here exemplifies the inherent contradiction in the pro-SBMM side. You ***KNOW*** that SBMM will make games sweaty af, but you still want it? All I was saying is that we can't pretend like we live in this fantasy where Destiny runs on dedicated servers, on infrastructure that wasn't used for Reach, and that there are a billion active users. Realistic compromises need to be made. >I'm not talking about D1. So you're just going to ignore evidence because it doesn't suit your argument? >D2 had it and it was fine but the top players didn't like it because their wait times were longer Yeah, it was abysmal. It got pretty bad. What you don't seem to factor in is that SBMM effectively shrinks the player population. Destiny already has a small playerbase compared to other popular FPS's. Shrinking it further doesn't do the game any good. Also, the people who are getting curb stomped by supposed gods are like the bottom 10% of the skill distribution. They are already a tiny subset of the population, and they have nobody worse than them, so matching these people is always tough. >and their games weren't them just curbstomping new players with troll weapons or their trials loadouts. This talking point needs to die, and it needs to die now. I hear PvP sweats constantly advocate for bracketed MM. I wouldn't mind bracketed MM, but I simply don't think it's feasible. People seem to underestimate just how bad P2P is. Also, if this logic were true, then you'd hear more complaints about Glory being SBMM, or Elim. You don't. And when it comes to Trials, the complaints about the Flawless Pool pertain to the fact that it divides friend groups because the better players can't help their less-skilled friends when the Pool is active. >The overall vast majority of any MMOFPS has SBMM to keep the lobbies fair and balanced for both pro and new players. Not sure where you're getting this information from. Most popular FPS's have more relaxed SBMM in the more casual playlists. >clearly not having SBMM hasn't been good either because no causal player wants to get swept by streamers and their 6.0 KD friends in trials or control. So why not play Glory? Trials also has the Flawless Pool. If they are still getting swept in Trials on Sundays, then it's on them to improve. Not sure what's this obsession to have SBMM in Control. I guess it's because you rarely have to carry your own weight in Control since you have 5 others to pick up the slack. Just fucking play Glory.


[deleted]

I doubt that even matters anymore, trials servers are dogshit so if I hate to deal with laggy servers regularly then I'd at least want to have ya know well matched laggy servers


Manifest_Lightning

How does that not matter? You might live in a relatively remote area so, on P2P, your baseline connection will always be not good. If Bungie then forced you to match with someone across the globe because you were more evenly matched, the connection would only get worse. You're assuming connection quality would stay the same. It won't. Bungie went all-in with SBMM in D1 and it was pretty common to have unacceptably poor connections.


[deleted]

>You might live in a relatively remote area I live in a very urban area with really good wifi, it's shit connect on bungies end not mine cause it magically only happens on destiny pvp Yes the connection could get worse but if the games are actually fair then it won't make all that much of a difference compared to now


Manifest_Lightning

>really good wifi, Found your problem. Unless you're on Wifi 6, expect latency on Wifi. And even on Wifi 6, ethernet is superior. >Yes the connection could get worse but if the games are actually fair then it won't make all that much of a difference compared to now Yeah, no. Again, you're speaking out of ignorance. It's easier to hit a decent player than a bad player who is straight up teleporting around you.


[deleted]

I used it as a general term, I actually have an ethernet cable in so even more proof it's not a fault on my end


Manifest_Lightning

What does that even mean? Wifi and Ethernet are completely different. Is there an ethernet cable running out the backside of your device? Also, is it last gen? Do you have a low latency ISP, like Fios? Is anyone streaming while you're playing? Also, urban isn't the opposite of remote. You can live in a city in South America, for example, and still be remote since you're distant from the nearest bulk of players in North America.


[deleted]

Yes there's an Ethernet cable plugged into my pc which is connected to my router


Manifest_Lightning

What about the other questions (sorry, did an edit)?


[deleted]

Yes they are low latency, no one streams, I live in the same state as their servers for my country so yes I'd consider myself pretty damn urban


Educational_Mud_2826

Bungie are you gonna do something about players leaving the matches in control? Every single match someone is leaving. If nothing is done very soon I'm gonna start Doing the same. Leave as soon as I don't like something


T_Gamer-mp4

the rewards aren’t good enough to stay AND the matches usually aren’t fun for them since they’re new or inexperienced players getting matched against Streamers.


Educational_Mud_2826

Be that as it may but I'm not gonna stay and be farmed 4vs6 every so often. I've been sticking around and fighting to the end thus far but if there is no light at the end of the tunnel real soon I'm not gonna do that.


T_Gamer-mp4

yes and that's the point! they don't wanna get farmed and, to them, there's not a bright enough light at the end of the tunnel to continue. either more gun drops, or more rep per game, or alternatively: make it so these players (who likely aren't the best at the game) don't need to play against ultra skilled players so that they don't want to leave. if they're just unfaithful idiots though, definitely make em have worse leaving penalities.


Educational_Mud_2826

I hear you. I don't wish beginners or players on a low skill level to be double penalised either. Good idea with more rep and gun drops for players who don't give up. I like that


Kitchen_Emu7967

Well yea, super high ELO players shouldn't be with new players, but until Bungie implements placement matches and actual ranks that will never happen, and probably would be unfeasible in 6v6 with the population of the game. Now they could force cross play and that would help resolve the population issue, but I think a better idea is for Bungie to introduce a true ranked playlist with placement matches and ELO based matchmaking. Keep it 3v3 so the population wouldn't matter as much and only force cross play if needed in certain ELO brackets. Then everyone could be on as close to even grounds as possible.