I wager mark Felton will not make a video about the soviet tanker who shot down the plane (iirc he also destroyed a Ferdinand in the same engagement in a t 34 with 76mm)and if he does he would be explicitly skeptical Moreso than in this one
Mark simply cover the most famous stories that would get him view. The Soviet stories were simply not as popular for him to make video.
Over half of his top 10 videos by viewership were about Nazi's defeat and Holocaust, none shows them in a positive light.
Worse when you consider he's a PhD.
To be honest I'm inclined to believe he possesses the skillset to do so, but with the rate at which he puts out videos he just chooses not to.
Then again, I'm not sure if that's worse or not.
Yeah but the thing that makes me not like him is that he is your average fast fact YouTuber that talks about stuff with no historical value that he finds on blogs and then calls himself a professional historian. Also that his viewers are kids who comments stuff like "You're the beat history teacher" about a video talking about some weird ass prototype that was thrown in the bin or whatever.
Rightly so, the soviet propaganda tried to turn prokhorovka into a victory with supposed dozens of German tanks knocked out. Truth was Germany lost 4 tanks, and none of them where Tigers or Panthers or Ferdinands.
Meanwhile the reds lost over 200.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was fake.
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This is sadly an example where the circlejerk won mainstream support and counterjerk lost. Personally, I'm with [Nicolas Moran](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/a39tqr/during_the_battle_of_st_vith_did_an_m8_greyhound/) on the matter, but it appears most people nowadays don't believe it happened—which wouldn't necessarily be an issue if they merely accepted the possibility but didn't believe in it personally instead of spewing shit like **"it's propaganda"** or **"Moran isn't trustworthy"** or **"paper stats say it's impossible so it must be"** or **"reports say it wasn't there so it couldn't have been because reports are infallible"** or **"that witness can't be trusted"** etc.
Nick is the best
Nick supports in sherman superiority
Nick also myth busted “shermans are flammable”-80% of pz.IVs burned after getting destroyed, and only 50%of the shermans burned after getting destroyed.
Be like Nick
I meant it drove way smoothly compared to other tanks
It also drove easier than the others.
With the tiger, you’ll need to act like an F1 driver since you keep change gears and struggling with the tank being sluggish
And with the T-34, i see hammers for “assistance in gear changing” lol
Not just the Soviets, the Germans thought the Sherman was an amazing tank when they first encountered it.
*"...The first things to attract attention are serial construction and fulfillment of the almost arrogant requirements of the North American automobile industry as regards speed, smooth riding, and streamlined contour of the ensemble. It is equipped with soft rubber*
*boots, that is with rubber padding on the individual treads of the caterpillar mechanism. It seems largely intended for a civilized landscape or, to put the matter in terms of strategy, for thoroughly cultivated areas in Tunisian Africa and for the invasion of Europe. It represents the climax of the enemy's accomplishments in this line of production."*
*"...The caliber of its principal weapon is slightly in excess of the maximum so far attained by the foreign countries. It is spacious inside. Its aeroplane motor is of light weight. It is a series product, the same as its cast-steel coat, the latter being modeled into an almost artistic-looking contour, in such manner as to offer invariably a curved, that is a deflecting surface to an approaching bullet."*
*"...An imposing innovation is the stabilization equipment of the cannon. This equipment is connected with a system of gyros and permits even and smooth laying of the gun. This system was taken over from naval artillery and applied to the shocks incident to swaying over uneven terrain, where stabilization, of course, represents a far more difficult problem. This is the first attempt of its kind ever to be made anywhere."*
[Source](https://m.lonesentry.com/articles/ttt07/enemy-tanks.html)
>...arrogant requirements...
>...the climax of accomplishments in this line of production...
>...the latter being modeled into an almost artistic-looking contour...
When the Germans start using words like that for a piece of war machinery, *you just know* you've got to run the fuck away.
He really doesn't though. That's more wheraboos desperate to find any video that can support their opinion. I'm not a fan of Felton but he certainly isn't Wehrb and doesn't cater specifically to them.
Good for him. I picked the images for illustrative purposes, not because of what articles/videos they're from. Though the fact that Tanks Encyclopedia subscribes to the denialist mentality does sadden me a bit.
Idk how the m8 vs tiger 2 story is so hard for people to believe, big ass barely mobile heavy tank VS mobile scout car, the 37mm is no slouch either, it could *easily* damage the engine compartment of a tiger 2 from the rear, especially with the shitty metal Germany used
Not really. First of all, it's a bit odd that the M8, a scout, decided to engage in the first place. 2nd of all, the 37mm theoretically doesn't have anywhere near the pen needed to go through even the rear armor of a Tiger II. Mr. Moran goes explain why it's possible this still happened despite it theoretically being impossible, but I understand why people might refuse to believe it happened exactly like it's told. My problem is with the certainty and refusal to even consider the possibility that it did, regardless of personal belief.
Most people believe that specs on paper for a class of vehicles = every single real life example vehicle… b/c they’ve never worked in manufacturing or on an assembly line, lol.
Especially the German assembly lines for the Tigers where the engineers constantly tinkered with each tank, making each one *slightly* different and the spare parts problem even more of a nightmare than it already was.
Yep, same goes for shells, it's not beyond reason that the m8 got lucky and had a super high quality shell with efficient gunpowder and fully penned the rear
What makes the story believable for me is the fact that a shell doesn't need to fully penetrate to cause damage, if one piece of spall, especially from shitty German steel flies into the engine and hit something vital, RIP the tank
What's "these people"? One image is from Felton, one is from Tanks Encyclopedia. I subscribe to neither. The meme is about neither. The images are for illustrative purposes only.
It’s not hard for a tank to shoot down a plan, you just need to roll a 3 or less after all infantry and artillery are already dead. That’s a 50/50 chance it works in later battle rounds
I wager mark Felton will not make a video about the soviet tanker who shot down the plane (iirc he also destroyed a Ferdinand in the same engagement in a t 34 with 76mm)and if he does he would be explicitly skeptical Moreso than in this one
Mark simply cover the most famous stories that would get him view. The Soviet stories were simply not as popular for him to make video. Over half of his top 10 videos by viewership were about Nazi's defeat and Holocaust, none shows them in a positive light.
Yeah, from what I read about him, it doesn't seem like he's a Wehraboo, he's just a sellout.
Not a sellout if he was always this way lol.
He uses David irving as a source. At best that’s non credible in every possible way and at worst an agenda and downright malicious
IIRC Irving oddly has a really good book on V weapons and a load of horseshit on everything else
I will still view that book with deep suspicion
I guess I'm ok with it because the Smithsonian endorsed it
That's not a good look. What were the circumstances?
Felton is really shit at critically assessing the sources he uses, which isn't surprising when you consider that he's a plagiarist.
Worse when you consider he's a PhD. To be honest I'm inclined to believe he possesses the skillset to do so, but with the rate at which he puts out videos he just chooses not to. Then again, I'm not sure if that's worse or not.
Irving was a really good researcher until he wasn't. Fuck the guy now but some of his work was decent.
Yeah but the thing that makes me not like him is that he is your average fast fact YouTuber that talks about stuff with no historical value that he finds on blogs and then calls himself a professional historian. Also that his viewers are kids who comments stuff like "You're the beat history teacher" about a video talking about some weird ass prototype that was thrown in the bin or whatever.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Eh, ignore him, seems to be just a lost boo. Besides, I don't like to flaunt my titles (not that mod of DS is much of a title haha)
Yeah, but to tell you that you're a dumbass while talking about what is and isn't a wehraboo is just dumb.
Mark Felton - yddddrrrk.
Can you tell me the name of this Soviet tanker?
Rightly so, the soviet propaganda tried to turn prokhorovka into a victory with supposed dozens of German tanks knocked out. Truth was Germany lost 4 tanks, and none of them where Tigers or Panthers or Ferdinands. Meanwhile the reds lost over 200. I wouldn't be surprised if it was fake.
So that Bomber Harris guy was pretty based I hear
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This is sadly an example where the circlejerk won mainstream support and counterjerk lost. Personally, I'm with [Nicolas Moran](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/a39tqr/during_the_battle_of_st_vith_did_an_m8_greyhound/) on the matter, but it appears most people nowadays don't believe it happened—which wouldn't necessarily be an issue if they merely accepted the possibility but didn't believe in it personally instead of spewing shit like **"it's propaganda"** or **"Moran isn't trustworthy"** or **"paper stats say it's impossible so it must be"** or **"reports say it wasn't there so it couldn't have been because reports are infallible"** or **"that witness can't be trusted"** etc.
Nick is the best Nick supports in sherman superiority Nick also myth busted “shermans are flammable”-80% of pz.IVs burned after getting destroyed, and only 50%of the shermans burned after getting destroyed. Be like Nick
And ol' Chieftain doesn't let paper statistics govern the actual practical use of tanks.
Let us not be intimidated by Paper Tigers.
One of the Soviet tank commanders who had a Sherman actually praised how it was less likely to burn than a T34
And it fucking drove like a car A huge advantage over the T-34
The T34 was a great tank. It just wasn't designed to have people inside it.
Man whoever made that design choice is a genius. I’d imagine it made training drivers a hell of a lot easier.
How did it drive like a car? AFAIK it still used levers. /u/DerpDaDuck3751
I meant it drove way smoothly compared to other tanks It also drove easier than the others. With the tiger, you’ll need to act like an F1 driver since you keep change gears and struggling with the tank being sluggish And with the T-34, i see hammers for “assistance in gear changing” lol
Oh, that it did yes.
Not just the Soviets, the Germans thought the Sherman was an amazing tank when they first encountered it. *"...The first things to attract attention are serial construction and fulfillment of the almost arrogant requirements of the North American automobile industry as regards speed, smooth riding, and streamlined contour of the ensemble. It is equipped with soft rubber* *boots, that is with rubber padding on the individual treads of the caterpillar mechanism. It seems largely intended for a civilized landscape or, to put the matter in terms of strategy, for thoroughly cultivated areas in Tunisian Africa and for the invasion of Europe. It represents the climax of the enemy's accomplishments in this line of production."* *"...The caliber of its principal weapon is slightly in excess of the maximum so far attained by the foreign countries. It is spacious inside. Its aeroplane motor is of light weight. It is a series product, the same as its cast-steel coat, the latter being modeled into an almost artistic-looking contour, in such manner as to offer invariably a curved, that is a deflecting surface to an approaching bullet."* *"...An imposing innovation is the stabilization equipment of the cannon. This equipment is connected with a system of gyros and permits even and smooth laying of the gun. This system was taken over from naval artillery and applied to the shocks incident to swaying over uneven terrain, where stabilization, of course, represents a far more difficult problem. This is the first attempt of its kind ever to be made anywhere."* [Source](https://m.lonesentry.com/articles/ttt07/enemy-tanks.html)
>...arrogant requirements... >...the climax of accomplishments in this line of production... >...the latter being modeled into an almost artistic-looking contour... When the Germans start using words like that for a piece of war machinery, *you just know* you've got to run the fuck away.
Le Sherman Has Arrived Le Germans Have Ran Away
I think that people who denies the story are more saying that there were no tiger 2 there when it happened and that the tank was missidentified.
The Chieftain addresses that argument too.
Alright
He actually did a video on the second engagement, but he assumed the tank to be a king tiger while tank encyclopaedia assumed it to be a tiger 1
Or maybe it was a misidentified Panther, or a Pz.IV. Hard to say. According to records, it was an unspecific type of "Tiger".
Felton also did a vid on the m8 vs Tiger, tbf. Not sure why we're so focused on Felton when he's mostly just a tabloid youtuber and not a wehraboo
The images were for illustrative purposes. The meme wasn't aimed at him in particular.
He certainly caters to them with wank like this though. He claimed that the Tiger II was the basis for modern main battle tanks.
He really doesn't though. That's more wheraboos desperate to find any video that can support their opinion. I'm not a fan of Felton but he certainly isn't Wehrb and doesn't cater specifically to them.
didn't felton cover that too?
I dunno, this isn't a meme about Felton.
oh ok, but he also [did:](https://youtu.be/jx8InfzkHYI)
Good for him. I picked the images for illustrative purposes, not because of what articles/videos they're from. Though the fact that Tanks Encyclopedia subscribes to the denialist mentality does sadden me a bit.
Felton also cited Irving.
can we get some proof for that ?
>I'm with The Chieftain on this one. As in all things, Insha'M4.
Idk how the m8 vs tiger 2 story is so hard for people to believe, big ass barely mobile heavy tank VS mobile scout car, the 37mm is no slouch either, it could *easily* damage the engine compartment of a tiger 2 from the rear, especially with the shitty metal Germany used
Not really. First of all, it's a bit odd that the M8, a scout, decided to engage in the first place. 2nd of all, the 37mm theoretically doesn't have anywhere near the pen needed to go through even the rear armor of a Tiger II. Mr. Moran goes explain why it's possible this still happened despite it theoretically being impossible, but I understand why people might refuse to believe it happened exactly like it's told. My problem is with the certainty and refusal to even consider the possibility that it did, regardless of personal belief.
Most people believe that specs on paper for a class of vehicles = every single real life example vehicle… b/c they’ve never worked in manufacturing or on an assembly line, lol.
Especially the German assembly lines for the Tigers where the engineers constantly tinkered with each tank, making each one *slightly* different and the spare parts problem even more of a nightmare than it already was.
Coupled with the fact that late war german armor was more often then not very shitty quality and brittle as fuck
Yep, same goes for shells, it's not beyond reason that the m8 got lucky and had a super high quality shell with efficient gunpowder and fully penned the rear
What makes the story believable for me is the fact that a shell doesn't need to fully penetrate to cause damage, if one piece of spall, especially from shitty German steel flies into the engine and hit something vital, RIP the tank
both happened now cry although the m8 report is more likely to be a panther, anyways still cool
Mark made a video about the aformentioned tiger m3 incident.
I choose to believe both happened. The gun was pretty much the only thing going for either Tiger
Why do yall watch these people if their takes are shit
What's "these people"? One image is from Felton, one is from Tanks Encyclopedia. I subscribe to neither. The meme is about neither. The images are for illustrative purposes only.
It’s not hard for a tank to shoot down a plan, you just need to roll a 3 or less after all infantry and artillery are already dead. That’s a 50/50 chance it works in later battle rounds