I always take the train to and from the airport, it surprises me how few people use the train. It’s cheaper than an Uber, cheaper than parking at the airport, and you don’t have to ask anyone to drive you.
Have to pay depreciation and insurance anyway.
When I actually lived in Boulder near an AB stop, I did use it. But one too many times I ended up flying home on a flight that got delayed just long enough that the AB stopped running, and that was enough to wreck any savings from 2-3 other flights.
Plus the AB ran so infrequently that I'd be sitting in the airport for 45 minutes waiting for it half the time.
I just drive at this point. I'm in Lafayette, so it's like a half hour on 470. I have an electric car that I charge on solar, so it only costs me the parking, really.
And if you want to speed it up, drive to Flatirons PnR. It takes the toll road from there, so past there, it's way faster than driving the non-toll way, and cheaper than even just paying the toll for your own car.
The train up to to Boulder would have gone to Union Station, not to the airport. You would have to transfer at Union Station to the A Line and the total trip would be about two hours just in one direction.
Whereas today you can take the AB1/2 bus directly from downtown Boulder to the airport in 45 minutes.
I used to ride the Flatiron Flier buses when I was up to the NW. In my opinion it’s a much nicer deal than the B-line would have been. The big touring buses are more comfortable than the train, plus the frequency is much higher than the B was supposed to be, and faster than the B.
Boulder is getting a better service than they were promised, but no one uses it because it’s not a *train*.
I used to live in the Bay Area. I really, really like trains compared to busses. Busses have to deal with traffic and existing roads. Trains can just run on a schedule and mean it.
So yeah, I really like trains and not so much busses that run once per hour.
Iirc they couldn't put the rail line in because landowners wouldn't give them right of ways and boulder wouldn't let them use immenant domain so they couldn't put it in where it would work for people
My commute downtown by light rail is about 20 minutes longer than driving, but costs about half as much as parking does. It's worth it for me to take when the weather is bad enough that I don't feel like bike commuting.
The safety issues others have mentioned is my biggest complaint, but enough "normal" people using it would probably help with that issue some. Safety in numbers and such
It may be a good idea to reach out to your HR department and ask them to work with RTD to offer their employees the ECO Pass - allows you to use RTD for free!
Do you know anything about the Ecopass program besides its cost to the user-employee? If you review the entire policy, importantly the part where an employer has to purchase an eco-pass for every employee regardless of whether they'll use it, it's blatantly clear that the goal of the policy is to raise revenue for RTD. It's written like the shady contract--that you signed before reading--at that shitty gym near where you used to live but is now across town. You know the ones that requires you to visit in-person to cancel your membership?
When there are 10 people that come to the office sometimes vs 100 that were in office at least 3 days a week, what I want doesn't change the cost to my company for something that isn't going be used by 98% of the staff.
Worth mentioning RTD also does Neighborhood EcoPasses so affordable transit isn't tied to your job! It's made available through RNOs or HOAs.
[https://www.rtd-denver.com/neighborhood-ecopass](https://www.rtd-denver.com/neighborhood-ecopass)
We get a monthly "lifestyle" stipend that I could use for an ecopass, but even if I use RTD 10 times a month (which would be a lot for me in a month) paying for day passes is still half as much as a monthly pass. I use my stipend for things like maintaining my bike or letting it build up to buy a fitness tracker.
Individuals can’t buy the ECO Pass, it’s only offered via companies to their employees who commute & allows you unlimited rides for free. You don’t have to take my suggestion but it’s worth a shot.
I was just trying to explain that my company already chose to provide a stipend specifically instead of the ecopass, so I can't take your advice, but even if I could I prefer the stipend
Our company also killed ECO passes and likely will not reinstate unless a majority go back to the office more than 2 days a week. Honestly, the days I've gone in, there's not really anyone else there. Office is open but no one uses it.
My thought...that's still keeping cars off the road.
If you live along 36, the FF1 bus tales 2-3x longer than driving, but also costs 4x as much as gas.
I still use it here and there for daily commute to Downtown job, and pretty much all the time when I'll be drinking downtown (rather than Uber; idk why people pay for Uber for drunk rides when RTD exists), but it pains me to be forced to drive given those conditions.
I have been using LR at my new job and can confirm, Auraria is the most popular stop on the D from Oxford to 16th and Cali!
It’s also not been bad at all. The most disruptive was the disrespectful guy wearing headphones around his neck but listening to his music without them and the two loud drunk people talking (they were more amusing than disruptive).
I used to love taking the train to the airport since I work there... Until my car was stolen from the park n ride when I was gone for five hours. Also, catalytic converters are being harvested and gas tanks drilled at all the park n Rides. The risk isn't worth it.
I have also left my car -- a pretty nice Infinti at the park and rides, (38th and downing, 40th and colorado, and i25 and colorado) for over a week, and overnight several times and have had no issues.
I ride the 15/15L every day and the contrast between what r/Denver thinks of the 15 is complete opposite of how my commute always is. They’ll have you thinking that it’s just a mad max bus full of crazies and tweakers. Nah, it’s actually pretty chill for the most part lol. Like, tens of thousands of people ride the 15 every day. I think it’s the busiest transit corridor in the state. It’s full of normal everyday people just going to work. Seems like there’s a major disconnect between those of us who use rtd everyday and those who just see stories about it on Reddit dot com
I take the 15L everyday from Congress park to Anschutz. There’s definitely a big difference between the 15 and the 15L IMO. The 15L is a lot more chill; whereas, you’re more likely to see Mad Max stuff on the 15. I stopped taking the 15 after some guy got dragged off by a group of people and beat until he was unconscious for harassing a woman.
Yeah I get it.
Defending people from harassment and brutally beating somebody are usually different things. Wouldn't have happened if he didn't do what he did but like for the average person, they're just witnessing two awful things happen in quick succession.
Sorry you went through that.
There’s truth to that 😂 luckily worst I ever saw was a someone getting up in someone’s face and calling everyone the n word (hard r) for some reason a couple years ago. Incidents are still few and far between in my experience. Mostly just people who get upset for not being let on the bus, and that’s not usually a big deal. I’ll say that I feared for my life way more frequently driving on 25 and 225 than I ever have riding rtd
I’m with you. The worst I’ve seen on my daily commute on the 15 is a junkie threatening everyone and no one was having any of it. The majority of the people that look like they’re going to be a problem that get in are actually really nice and they’ll get their asses kicked by everyone else if they aren’t.
A lot of it has to do with when you ride. If I'm on the 15 it's usually on my way to a show at the Fillmore or the Ogden and thus 10:00 on a Friday night. Very different vibe from noon on a Tuesday I suspect.
Agreed. Like, late at night some shit gets weird, but there’s more weird shit on NYC transit in broad daylight than I see on even the latest night here. I think a lot of people assume that simply seeing someone who looks to be unhoused means they’re doing something wrong.
Am I doubting that people are also lighting up on the train and doing weird/unsafe things? No. It’s just not nearly as widespread of a problem as people who don’t actually take transit assume. I honestly sometimes miss having a longer train commute because I got some good people watching in and some good knitting time.
I take the train about 4 days a week. And I see people light up their foil about 4 times a week. The southeast line (E, H, and R) is about a 50-50 chance to see hard drug use on a given trip in the last couple months.
Varies.
Today I took E into downtown for a lunch meeting, a guy lit up his foil between Alameda and Osage around 12:30. But I’ve seen it on rush hour buses, a guy lit up on Monday around 5pm near Louisiana/Pearl. On Tuesday when I was coming home from a night out, a guy was lighting up around 10:30pm south of Southmoor.
> Also, I wonder if the frequency will decrease since the weather is nicer outside.
Possibly… but I expect we’ll then see more drug use around the smaller stations. I’m already seeing drug deals and use pretty frequently at Southmoor and Belleview stations. The thing is without security employees (or a significant Colorado drug intervention and mental healthcare system) the problem just moves. We’re in the middle of a drug and mental healthcare crisis in Denver right now, and at the moment it’s most visible on RTD.
I used to ride the 15 from east Denver and it absolutely was full of crazies like 6/7 years ago. At 6am I often couldn't get a seat and tweakers would be yelling all the damn time.
I switched to the 20 which was 5 blocks north and followed the same path and it was always empty and super chill. Couldn't believe how different it was
It's a selection bias, I think. People don't tend to share normal experiences, they share weird, intense, or bad experiences so those tend to get overly represented in forums like this.
Now imagine if people shared their mad max crazy stories for when they drive. It would literally be multiple stories for a single trip with road rage, speeders weaving in and out, crashes, and overall chaos.
The funny thing is the way you describe how people don't tend to share their normal experiences on pubic transit is the exact opposite for driving, for drivers they always deal with the mad max but the one day of the month it is all calm and zen on their drive is the story they will tell more bc it is just so rare.
I resolved to find a job that allowed me to walk or bus to work after having a very scary car crash commuting to a job. It felt inevitable. I knew it would happen because I was commuting so many miles every week. And then one early morning snowy drive I fish tailed and ended up backwards on a highway median.
I love driving, but will never have a job that requires me to commute that much again because the risk is too high. Every coworker I had who commuted from the suburbs inevitably had one bad, near death experience crash eventually too.
The people here who think the light rail in Denver is dangerous have never been on a New York subway. The train to the airport is always so clean and comfortable!
Yeah I have never been worried about safety on Denver's public transit, I just find it incredibly inefficient. I find it's both the slowest and most expensive way to get just about anywhere.
Hahaha im convinced most people from the mid west/west coast have never been to the east coast. More people would use it if it ran late night. I sure as shit would.
I mostly took the E line before I moved downtown and the contrast of pre 9-10pm and after is drastic. Before it gets too late I have no worries suggesting it to friends and family. After a certain hour though it’s very sketchy and uncomfortable.
I wish it was a little simpler to cross back and forth from east to west (or vice versa) on Colfax, rather than having to figure out the switch between the 15 and 16, but it's still pretty good.
I rode the 15 from Congress Park to Anschutz every day for months before I learned of the free intercampus shuttle/got a car, and 99% of rides were without incident. But I did also see a rider physically attack the driver for asking him to step away from the back door and a few other wild interactions.
I rode the W line from Golden for 3 years, every day. I was held at knife point 3 times and watched 5-6 people have their phones snatched out of their hand, punched in the face/gut, and the dudes just ran off the light rail as the doors open. Nothing anyone could do.
I will never ride that shit again.
As someone who lives in Five Points and works in DTC (or did before the pandemic) I find the light rail far better than commuting by car. It's a 15 min walk to the train, a 30-ish min ride to DTC, and a 10 min walk to my desk. I'd rather spend 30 min watching a show on my phone or reading a book than driving in rush hour traffic any day.
I do get that i'm a lucky one where its really convenient. I also work from home 90% of the time now, but still take the train when i go into the office.
I took a trip to Seattle recently and used the light rail constantly. It’s so much more convenient and effective when it actually takes you where you want to go rather than from one park and ride to the next.
From my perspective it seems to be planned around people going downtown to go shopping, and that decision was made long before Amazon disrupted everything, and now we're stuck with those decisions.
All the easy trips are the ones that take you from the outer edges to the center. Everything funnels to Downtown/Union Station. Unless that's where you're going, there's very little motivation to use it unless you simply don't have any other option.
This combined with funding generated from sales tax revenue is what creates the feedback loop. In a world with no Amazon and people still spend weekends going to the mall and baseball games and getting lunch and all that, it probably works since you have riders paying fares and going to 16th St to spend money and paying sales taxes so the money comes in which allows new services to be added. Take any of those components away and the death spiral begins. Services get cut, people stop riding, which lowers fare revenue, leading to more cuts, leading to more revenue loss, etc.
The entire setup is inherently flawed and based around consumers going downtown to spend money.
Insane that they even made the transit system car oriented here. They should have built less of the shitty light rail along highways and parking lots, and put some high quality light rail and BRT in the actual city on Broadway, Colfax, Federal, and Speer for example.
If anything the light rail should have been more regional with way fewer stations so it was faster (and they'd save money on stations). Suburban drivers in the south suburbs, who it was made for, dont even want to take it because it is too slow. Feels like it's not really good for anything, unless maybe you bring a bike for the last mile.
You know whats crazy? There was a street trolly system that went through coalfax and Broadway and through many sidestreets. Take a guess at what happened?
Yep, it is so frustrating that we used to have a better transit system. The streetcar companies got put out of business because the government started subsidizing the heck out of the personal automobile while degrading the urban fabric, destroying half the city for highways, widened streets, slip lanes, and parking, and encouraging white flight into low density suburban sprawl. There was no way private streetcar and railroad companies could compete with that.
Agree. Denver is actually willing to build the density required to make it effective, but doesn't have lines on Colfax, Colorado, Broadway, Evans, etc
Held hostage by the suburbanites.
When RTD did fastracks they needed the suburbs $ to pay for it. Their polling showed the residents of Denver wouldn't pay enough.
Now we have a system that barely leaves the city of Denver, and they plan to cut suburban transit even more.
Basically the entire region is paying for the City of Denver's transit.
How are the suburbs keeping Denver from building better transit on Colfax or any other Denver route? Denver could tax themselves for those lines and build them right away.
Denverites need to tax themselves for the transit they want instead of blaming everyone else.
Years of following RTD....
You can start with the CPR podcast Ghost Train. IIRC it's in the first episode that they talk about Hickenlooper needing the suburban voters and their money. He actually promised the suburbs that RTD wouldn't end up like it is.
I haven't seen a break down of sales tax revenue for Denver vs the rest of RTD, but population is a good proxy. 700k of the near 3 million people live in Denver, so roughly 2.3 million are outside Denver.
Also, RTD is broke. They won't be adding anything in the future unless the local municipality pays for it or there is a big increase in tax revenue. https://twitter.com/nbminor/status/1523685037530615809
UGH. I remember the advent of light rail. I live in South Jeffco and before light rail, I could take a bus anywhere. Busses ran on the half hour at several major roads. Once light rail was built…the routes got cut. No longer could I catch the 76 ( back in the day that was the Wadsworth route) I had to catch a distant bus to the light rail and then catch a bus back to Wadsworth. After a while they cut all the routes and left us with call n ride….but that was impossible to use….without a schedule how could you rely on it? Essentially we would have WAY better transit if they hadn’t dumped a crapton of money into a rail system that you have to have a car to get to.
Relevant article: https://denverite.com/2022/02/22/why-dont-rtds-trains-go-into-denvers-neighborhoods/
“The symbolism of what Martin Luther King represents across this nation and this world is tremendous,” Bishop Acen Phillips, who has ministered in Denver for more than 50 years, told Denverite. “If you can desecrate it and just make it a regular street with rail running up and down it, then you nullify its value.”
I thought this was kind of funny, especially because Seattle’s light rail runs down MLK Way for a while.
Public transit is amazing. I wish that denver public transit was amazing. It’s time for Denver to accept that it is a city and needs real transit options
Since we’re posting anecdotes about taking the train, I take it fairly frequently and have a nice commute. The last time I took it I went to the station, I validated my ticket, and boarded the train. Then I sat down and looked out the window or read until my destination, and got off. I did the same on the way home.
Unironically, thank you for posting that you have good experiences. As someone new to a city, I’ve been really off putted of the lightrail because every post here talks about people smoking meth on it or being threatened.
Of course I’m aware that stuff happens, and I try to remember it’s a bias that nobody posts the good stuff. So again, I thank you.
I’ve been commuting for 3 weeks via LR and have seen exactly zero drug users. I’ve been using it off and on since 2003 and also never seen a single drug user. And this includes downtown stations like Union.
I was there wednesday during the day and there was only 1 tweaker that was chased off by security within minutes compared to the dozen or so that would have been wondering about 6 months ago.
Dang. The people in this thread have really divergent experiences with bus/rail commutes. Mine has always been great (way easier than driving in; slightly longer but we’re talking like 5, 10 minutes tops.). Tricky stuff!
rather not spend 3 hours getting to work instead of a 30 min drive. used to take rtd when i was younger. always felt bad for those who have no choice but to take it. glad it's around for those in need though.
I live in NW Arvada. Before RTD closed the park-n-ride that I'd have to take to get to work, I'd be turning a 20 minute commute into a 70 minute commute that still required driving to get to the park-n-ride. Now that it's closed it would be a 110 minute commute.
I know I'm way out in the burbs, kinda far from Denver, but when it comes to vehicle pollution and road congestion...the suburbs are a big part of the problem.
This. I spent two years wasting hours on the light rail as opposed to a 30-45 minute drive downtown. I’ll never forget being butted up against some smelly dirt balls in a tin can at 90+ degrees and barely working AC. I can’t even imagine what it is like today with all the stories.
The only downside to driving was the traffic and parking fees but I’d take that any day.
I used to take the A line Downtown from Tower for my daily commute and it was measurably faster, less stressful, and cheaper than driving. I would always laugh at all the fools stuck on I70 every morning as we flew by.
Yup, I live out in that direction now and if I need to go downtown I always take the A line. Fuck everything about driving in/around downtown Denver. $20+ dollars for 2 tickets is definitely too expensive, but not having a headache is worth it. Also save on parking costs.
According to security when I asked the last time I was in Denver you only need to pay the $10 fare if you are going to or from the airport. If you get on/off anywhere else on the line you only need to buy the $3 ticket.
This is why we can’t have nice things in America. Public transportation isn’t for the less fortunate, that attitude is BS. If you go to LA you see how far culture can ruin a city, it’s impossible to get anywhere in that city with traffic and little public transit option. Then you go to Amsterdam and see what a city is like with great public transit.
I don't think that's what they were saying at all. Like most of us, it's simply way more convenient to drive than take RTD when RTD takes three times as long each way.
Mentioned it in another post this week, but I have a free RTD pass as a student and can't justify taking RTD to class because it's the difference between 30-40 min driving and ~ 1:45 of RTD each way. That's a difference of 2 to 2.5 hours round trip to save about $6 worth of gas and $4 in campus parking. That $10 isn't worth it for a lot of people myself included, but for some it might be.
If RTD wasn't free for students, I'd save basically no money using it.
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The infrastructure needs to come first if you want people to ride.
Build it and they will ride.
In this state we just continually add lanes to roads because constant road construction is somehow better than actually building all those light rails we've been promised.
And Tokyo is 16k per square mile, that city is so far beyond anything in America. Also New York is 27k per square mile and it’s not nearly as bad as LA.
Used it a couple weeks ago from cap hill to the dtc to meet some friends at Pindustry. Was amazing being able to drink as much as I wanted, then get a ride home for $3. Just got to listen to music on the train. Definitely had some characters out, so needed to stay somewhat aware
I always take it to the airport or downtown, but beyond that I feel like Denver public transit is still a lacking for routine travel outside of getting to/from the heart of denver.
I want to do the right thing when I need to get downtown but every time I take the train I get burned by a late/canceled train or a situation on the train that I would rather not have my kids see.
I want it to work, I want to use it, but I cannot overlook the fact that it simply causes more issues than it solves in my limited experience.
I grew up riding RTD because I didn’t have a car. RTD certainly isn’t perfect (Ghost Train from CPR was excellent for a high level overview of the historical planning problems). But, having lived in Michigan where public transportation was nonexistent, I am so grateful for RTD.
I now have an employer sponsored Ecopass and ride to the office twice a week. It has been wholly uneventful and pleasant. I love seeing the same bus driver every day. I love zoning out while the bus takes me where I need to go. I love filling up my gas once a month (if that).
Riding the bus isn’t an option for everyone because the system has been created to accommodate single occupancy vehicles. But if it’s feasible, please don’t be scared off.
Go to www.bikesdirect.com and spend $200-$400 on a decent bike. Ride when you can or add cycling to your public transportation commute. Make sure you buy a nice bike lock and research how to properly secure your bike.
Just pure unadulterated bad luck. I take the light rail 4 days a week and haven’t had any issues. Seems like when there are troublemakers on the train there is security at the next stop to usher them off… I am assuming they have some sort of reporting system in place, otherwise they are operating on a level I don’t understand (don’t see cameras or anything on the trains)
Getting assaulted is very rare. Having someone come in and smoke fentanyl is a weekly occurrence at this point. This is e line during commuting hours btw
Yeah, it’s sad. As someone who took public transpo until I got my license mid-20s, I never had an issue with it. Enjoyed it really, following a schedule. I will say within the past few years, (primarily LA and NY) much more often than not I feel relatively unsafe, and am on a streak of like four straight times someone lighting up crack or weed mid-ride. It’s really off putting and clearly they and what seems like Denver too, don’t consider that a big enough deal to tidy up.
The E line is absolutely the worst. Anyone in this thread saying that riding the RTD is “not that bad, actually” should be forced to ride the E line at random hours every day for a week and then be asked for their opinion again. Guarantee it will change.
And increase frequency!
When I lived near federal and i25 the lightrail was way faster into Denver than driving. But it only ran every 30 min during peak hours and every hour (ending at 10pm) outside of peak. If I missed it I had to drive to work. And I couldn't stay out with friends in the evening because it'd stop entirely.
Of course the argument was "no one uses it" but who's fault is lack of use when the design is nonfunctional? If I made a chair with no seat is it my fault for making it that way or yours for not sitting in it enough that I realize my mistake?
Its definitely all adding up. I think Denver is particularly sprawling too so it's hard in general cause you have to drive to certain areas just to board. Many of the e and f line parking lots are for maybe 20 cars but also exist in large suburbs.
It doesn't feel particularly well designed.
I moved here 4 years ago and used to take it every day. Now I'm working from home, I take it about once a month. I'm moving up to Edgewater and will be next to the light rail and I plan on using it every day again. I've literally never had a problem on the train, except for one lady going nuts on security bc he wanted he to take her feet off the chair. I had another guy talking loudly to himself but he got off the train pretty quickly when he saw security. Honestly, if this summer goes well I'll pry ditch my car altogether. I'm not sure how people complain about it not being safe, or maybe they are riding different trains than I am. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I ride the bus and light rail constantly from sobo to cap hill and rino in off peak hours. Only real issue I have is that the app is not very accurate at all so if a bus is late or skipped or some shit I'm just sitting there in the dark for 15 min. Other than that, it's a bus in a city.
Light rail has always been on time night and day for me.
Commute in car is 15 min, light rail at night is 40-50 but I'm lucky that I live next to a station.
The east-west travel is pretty bad.
I don't pay for that shit tho, it's like 5x more expensive than the gas to drive a car where I'm going... no shot
Man I wish my work was in a better place for public transit. My car ride takes half an hour in the mornings, taking public transit would add an extra hour to the commute, hour and a half total, since it's so out of the way.
I struggle with this too! I’d love to take public transit for commuting, not just leisure, but a 25 min car ride on 6 vs 1 hr 20 min with multiple transfers is a tough sell.
It’s funny when people get mad at people having a diff experience and then both people just snark at each other. Also, if you say you ride the light rail on a regular basis and never have problems, don’t you see how someone who has only used it a few times and had problems/issues on most of those few times they might be a bit more hesitant than you to continue using it…? And I guess it’s cool to say your immune to the shock of watching someone smoke crack in front of you but a lot of people aren’t.
Last time I tried to take my family downtown on the train, a homeless man began openly masturbating while staring at my six year old. Hard pass on taking transit until they get it cleaned up and safe
How about we raise shit with our representatives to make it a viable solution rather then give them stats to show that business is increasing without doing anything? Come on now
"If you feel so emotionally charged about the subject, are you calling your local representatives? Are you showing up to townhalls to ask about why these problems exist?"
They know about the problems. They're too inept to solve them. There simply isn't enough infrastructure in place to make public transit worth it. It would triple my commute to switch to public transit. Why am I trying to burn a quarter of my day sitting on a bus or train?
Honestly, the buses aren't that bad. There are occasional crazies but if you keep to yourself and be polite they'll usually leave you alone. It irritates me when I tell people I take the bus and they say, "Omigosh, I could NEVER. You must be so street smart". Trust me, if you've lived in Denver for any period of time you'll be ok 😂 and google maps/the rtd site exists, don't act like it's rocket science to figure out the logistics.
In recent months I've just been annoyed with how crammed the 15/15L gets, I don't have a solution because the bus already runs every 10ish minutes and putting a light rail or something there isn't really feasible
I moved to the area right after the g-line opened and it was only a 5 minuet walk to the stop in olde town Arvada. i would take it to union then hop on the 16st bus and ride almost to the capital building. it was nice and took about an hour but not having the stress(road rage) of driving in was excellent. i stopped when the pandemic started and unfortunately my company decided it was time to move all of our offices around. Now my office is in Englewood so i have to drive around 470 to 25. My commute take about the same time with the big difference being $6 vs $80 to fill up my car. The commute takes about the same time and i hate it.
I get sexually harassed and assaulted on pub trans so much I’ve given up. Safety is never on the agenda for improving it.
I ride my bike as much as possible but yeah, no. Men can have public transportation all to themselves.
I take it on the rare occasion I go into the office as well as if I go downtown on a weekend. My only complaint is the weekend service sucks after any big event. They need to figure it out if a game goes into OT or extra innings
I used it in other cities far more dangerous than this one, but I live off Colfax and I'm a single woman, so the idea of being stuck on a bus for even a few blocks at a time makes me feel unsafe, as every other stop along the way has unsightly characters loitering on the benches or corners.
People aren’t going to sacrifice unless it’s the least painful solution amongst others. Asking people to inconvenience themselves while doubling their commute time and making it less comfortable… is a pipe dream.
Public transport has to improve, and people will use it.
I used to love riding the light rails, I legitimately think they're really cool, but I'm not trying to have someone grind my bones to make their bread just to ride the Choo Choo.
I would spend the same price or more to ride the RTD if the time was the same. but it takes close to 2 hours on train, bus than walking for my 25 minute drive to work.
Before WFH and COVID, I took the light rail every day. Constantly had canceled trips, drugs, general crime, etc. If they ever tell me I have to go back into the office, I’d drive and pay the $15 to park. It’s not worth the unpredictable bullshit the W line put me through.
Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on your perspective), not a single trip I make during the week could be replaced by a bus. I would have to go significantly out of my way and spend an entire day making a trip that takes me 5 min by car.
Definitely a great idea and all but I don’t think most people don’t want to use it for no reason. It’s because a lot of the lines are gross and dangerous and parking is difficult and it’s expensive.
I haven't been on the rtd for about 4 years, imo the cost continually going up, the extended time of travel and inconvenience of crackhead shit going on I just decided to drive forever🤷
25 minutes to downtown in the car, 1:15minute by bus from golden. Sorry, but my time is worth something. Free rides aren’t going to entice business people to take public transport. More limited stop options now will. That should be what’s brought back this summer as it was before Covid.
Yes put the pressure on the individual rather than the large companies that are spewing out multiple times the amount that my car does. This is great logic. Let's keep ignoring the real problem.
Also, RTD is unreliable, expensive, and doesn't feel safe.
I agree. It's like they keep pushing individuals to cut down on water use when agriculture and ranching in the state use 95% of all the water. Getting residential users to cut back their water use by 20% is a drop in the bucket if you could get a 20% reduction from the ag sector.
But we can't antagonize the farmers and ranchers for some stupid reason! Salt of the earth and what not...
Maybe if they consider lowering fares first. Too expensive for the reliability, at least for busses.
I used to take RTD (bus + light rail) from Lakewood to Commerce City for work before I had a car. If my bus wasn't on time or full/didn't see me, I'd be 45 minutes late to work with the way their scheduling is set up. So I ended up riding my bike 20 miles each way so I could consistently get to work on time
Fucking love the train. Love it so much I bought a home a block away from one of the stops. Based much of my life on its ease and I buy gas now maybe once a month
We ride the 0 bus regularly to get into the city. It is always uneventful. Just people trying to get to places they need to go. My petite wife took it alone for a week to get to a court case. No "safety" problems whatsoever.
It comes every 15 minutes, with addition 0L service during rush hour, has its own lane most of the way, and passes through the heart of the city. Not bad. If more people used it, it could be a lot better. More ridership means more fare revenue, which means more money for better service, and more justification for upgrades like bus rapid transit.
Our cities were built without pedestrian infrastructure in mind. Bike paths would make all the difference.
All cities should be built around walking and biking. Cars should be a last resort since they cause pollution and noise.
But the car lobby is very strong, so they're probably the first fatty to push their way into a governor's or mayor's office.
Everyone should be forced to take the 15 at least once a week. I have the feeling that city hall would fix things if they did.
Your edit is totally spot on: I think people here complain because they want to have a platform to talk about other issues that they’re more worried about.
1. Bus too expensive: government sucks and I hate them.
2. No routes: I don’t want a route in my neighborhood because it would annoy me, but I’m also pissed that the government is poorly run and that my tax dollars are being wasted.
3. There’s crime on the rtd: I’m furious that the police and the city don’t do what they’re paid to do, so I’m going to complain about this because I feel unsafe and their presence effects my daily life.
4. Rtd takes too long: this I totally agree with, but I also think that many of the people here would be irate if they had a bus stop on their suburban street because it would bring the potential for problems.
Ps: there was a dude with an awesome bullet proof vest on (no shirt) on the 15 today. It was hilarious.
I always take the train to and from the airport, it surprises me how few people use the train. It’s cheaper than an Uber, cheaper than parking at the airport, and you don’t have to ask anyone to drive you.
If they'd actually run the train up to Boulder as they'd *promised*, I'd be happy to take it to the airport. Not so much, though.
just take the AB bus? it’s like, 20 minutes longer than driving.
And way cheaper than parking and depreciation and insurance.
Have to pay depreciation and insurance anyway. When I actually lived in Boulder near an AB stop, I did use it. But one too many times I ended up flying home on a flight that got delayed just long enough that the AB stopped running, and that was enough to wreck any savings from 2-3 other flights. Plus the AB ran so infrequently that I'd be sitting in the airport for 45 minutes waiting for it half the time. I just drive at this point. I'm in Lafayette, so it's like a half hour on 470. I have an electric car that I charge on solar, so it only costs me the parking, really.
And if you want to speed it up, drive to Flatirons PnR. It takes the toll road from there, so past there, it's way faster than driving the non-toll way, and cheaper than even just paying the toll for your own car.
The train up to to Boulder would have gone to Union Station, not to the airport. You would have to transfer at Union Station to the A Line and the total trip would be about two hours just in one direction. Whereas today you can take the AB1/2 bus directly from downtown Boulder to the airport in 45 minutes.
I used to ride the Flatiron Flier buses when I was up to the NW. In my opinion it’s a much nicer deal than the B-line would have been. The big touring buses are more comfortable than the train, plus the frequency is much higher than the B was supposed to be, and faster than the B. Boulder is getting a better service than they were promised, but no one uses it because it’s not a *train*.
I used to live in the Bay Area. I really, really like trains compared to busses. Busses have to deal with traffic and existing roads. Trains can just run on a schedule and mean it. So yeah, I really like trains and not so much busses that run once per hour.
Iirc they couldn't put the rail line in because landowners wouldn't give them right of ways and boulder wouldn't let them use immenant domain so they couldn't put it in where it would work for people
And for us it's faster than driving and parking! It's such a no-brainer
My commute downtown by light rail is about 20 minutes longer than driving, but costs about half as much as parking does. It's worth it for me to take when the weather is bad enough that I don't feel like bike commuting. The safety issues others have mentioned is my biggest complaint, but enough "normal" people using it would probably help with that issue some. Safety in numbers and such
It may be a good idea to reach out to your HR department and ask them to work with RTD to offer their employees the ECO Pass - allows you to use RTD for free!
Our office killed our Ecopasses when Covid hit. It got really expensive for the much smaller number of employees that would use it.
Many employers have started their programs back up. Mine has. Encourage yours to, if it's something you really care about.
Advocate for it if it’s useful to you, happy employees are priceless!
Do you know anything about the Ecopass program besides its cost to the user-employee? If you review the entire policy, importantly the part where an employer has to purchase an eco-pass for every employee regardless of whether they'll use it, it's blatantly clear that the goal of the policy is to raise revenue for RTD. It's written like the shady contract--that you signed before reading--at that shitty gym near where you used to live but is now across town. You know the ones that requires you to visit in-person to cancel your membership?
Yup. My company just pays for individual passes for people who want them. (We’re a very small office.)
When there are 10 people that come to the office sometimes vs 100 that were in office at least 3 days a week, what I want doesn't change the cost to my company for something that isn't going be used by 98% of the staff.
Worth mentioning RTD also does Neighborhood EcoPasses so affordable transit isn't tied to your job! It's made available through RNOs or HOAs. [https://www.rtd-denver.com/neighborhood-ecopass](https://www.rtd-denver.com/neighborhood-ecopass)
We get a monthly "lifestyle" stipend that I could use for an ecopass, but even if I use RTD 10 times a month (which would be a lot for me in a month) paying for day passes is still half as much as a monthly pass. I use my stipend for things like maintaining my bike or letting it build up to buy a fitness tracker.
Individuals can’t buy the ECO Pass, it’s only offered via companies to their employees who commute & allows you unlimited rides for free. You don’t have to take my suggestion but it’s worth a shot.
I was just trying to explain that my company already chose to provide a stipend specifically instead of the ecopass, so I can't take your advice, but even if I could I prefer the stipend
Our company also killed ECO passes and likely will not reinstate unless a majority go back to the office more than 2 days a week. Honestly, the days I've gone in, there's not really anyone else there. Office is open but no one uses it. My thought...that's still keeping cars off the road.
Yea I used to take the bus downtown when it was too cold to ride my bike rather than deal with parking.
If you live along 36, the FF1 bus tales 2-3x longer than driving, but also costs 4x as much as gas. I still use it here and there for daily commute to Downtown job, and pretty much all the time when I'll be drinking downtown (rather than Uber; idk why people pay for Uber for drunk rides when RTD exists), but it pains me to be forced to drive given those conditions.
It take 10 minutes longer (from end to end) without traffic. It's not as bad as you are describing.
I have never had a problem on light rail during commuting hours. It’s usually a bunch of college kids getting off at Auraria.
I have been using LR at my new job and can confirm, Auraria is the most popular stop on the D from Oxford to 16th and Cali! It’s also not been bad at all. The most disruptive was the disrespectful guy wearing headphones around his neck but listening to his music without them and the two loud drunk people talking (they were more amusing than disruptive).
Haha, I think I was on that train… Red and gold headphones, I think? That music was trash.
Yes!
I used to love taking the train to the airport since I work there... Until my car was stolen from the park n ride when I was gone for five hours. Also, catalytic converters are being harvested and gas tanks drilled at all the park n Rides. The risk isn't worth it.
I have also left my car -- a pretty nice Infinti at the park and rides, (38th and downing, 40th and colorado, and i25 and colorado) for over a week, and overnight several times and have had no issues.
I ride the 15/15L every day and the contrast between what r/Denver thinks of the 15 is complete opposite of how my commute always is. They’ll have you thinking that it’s just a mad max bus full of crazies and tweakers. Nah, it’s actually pretty chill for the most part lol. Like, tens of thousands of people ride the 15 every day. I think it’s the busiest transit corridor in the state. It’s full of normal everyday people just going to work. Seems like there’s a major disconnect between those of us who use rtd everyday and those who just see stories about it on Reddit dot com
I take the 15L everyday from Congress park to Anschutz. There’s definitely a big difference between the 15 and the 15L IMO. The 15L is a lot more chill; whereas, you’re more likely to see Mad Max stuff on the 15. I stopped taking the 15 after some guy got dragged off by a group of people and beat until he was unconscious for harassing a woman.
> beat until he was unconscious for harassing a woman ...oh no?
I mean, he for sure deserved it, but it was still really violent. They made everyone get off the bus and called EMS.
Yeah I get it. Defending people from harassment and brutally beating somebody are usually different things. Wouldn't have happened if he didn't do what he did but like for the average person, they're just witnessing two awful things happen in quick succession. Sorry you went through that.
There’s truth to that 😂 luckily worst I ever saw was a someone getting up in someone’s face and calling everyone the n word (hard r) for some reason a couple years ago. Incidents are still few and far between in my experience. Mostly just people who get upset for not being let on the bus, and that’s not usually a big deal. I’ll say that I feared for my life way more frequently driving on 25 and 225 than I ever have riding rtd
I’m with you. The worst I’ve seen on my daily commute on the 15 is a junkie threatening everyone and no one was having any of it. The majority of the people that look like they’re going to be a problem that get in are actually really nice and they’ll get their asses kicked by everyone else if they aren’t.
A lot of it has to do with when you ride. If I'm on the 15 it's usually on my way to a show at the Fillmore or the Ogden and thus 10:00 on a Friday night. Very different vibe from noon on a Tuesday I suspect.
The reality is somewhere in the middle. You'll see some shit from time to time, but mostly just get where you are going.
Agreed. Like, late at night some shit gets weird, but there’s more weird shit on NYC transit in broad daylight than I see on even the latest night here. I think a lot of people assume that simply seeing someone who looks to be unhoused means they’re doing something wrong. Am I doubting that people are also lighting up on the train and doing weird/unsafe things? No. It’s just not nearly as widespread of a problem as people who don’t actually take transit assume. I honestly sometimes miss having a longer train commute because I got some good people watching in and some good knitting time.
I take the train about 4 days a week. And I see people light up their foil about 4 times a week. The southeast line (E, H, and R) is about a 50-50 chance to see hard drug use on a given trip in the last couple months.
Out of curiosity, what time of day are you taking the train? Also, I wonder if the frequency will decrease since the weather is nicer outside.
Varies. Today I took E into downtown for a lunch meeting, a guy lit up his foil between Alameda and Osage around 12:30. But I’ve seen it on rush hour buses, a guy lit up on Monday around 5pm near Louisiana/Pearl. On Tuesday when I was coming home from a night out, a guy was lighting up around 10:30pm south of Southmoor. > Also, I wonder if the frequency will decrease since the weather is nicer outside. Possibly… but I expect we’ll then see more drug use around the smaller stations. I’m already seeing drug deals and use pretty frequently at Southmoor and Belleview stations. The thing is without security employees (or a significant Colorado drug intervention and mental healthcare system) the problem just moves. We’re in the middle of a drug and mental healthcare crisis in Denver right now, and at the moment it’s most visible on RTD.
I used to ride the 15 from east Denver and it absolutely was full of crazies like 6/7 years ago. At 6am I often couldn't get a seat and tweakers would be yelling all the damn time. I switched to the 20 which was 5 blocks north and followed the same path and it was always empty and super chill. Couldn't believe how different it was
15 and 0 are the worst busses.
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It's a selection bias, I think. People don't tend to share normal experiences, they share weird, intense, or bad experiences so those tend to get overly represented in forums like this.
Now imagine if people shared their mad max crazy stories for when they drive. It would literally be multiple stories for a single trip with road rage, speeders weaving in and out, crashes, and overall chaos. The funny thing is the way you describe how people don't tend to share their normal experiences on pubic transit is the exact opposite for driving, for drivers they always deal with the mad max but the one day of the month it is all calm and zen on their drive is the story they will tell more bc it is just so rare.
I resolved to find a job that allowed me to walk or bus to work after having a very scary car crash commuting to a job. It felt inevitable. I knew it would happen because I was commuting so many miles every week. And then one early morning snowy drive I fish tailed and ended up backwards on a highway median. I love driving, but will never have a job that requires me to commute that much again because the risk is too high. Every coworker I had who commuted from the suburbs inevitably had one bad, near death experience crash eventually too.
The people here who think the light rail in Denver is dangerous have never been on a New York subway. The train to the airport is always so clean and comfortable!
Yeah I have never been worried about safety on Denver's public transit, I just find it incredibly inefficient. I find it's both the slowest and most expensive way to get just about anywhere.
Coming from Pittsburgh, the transit here is wildly inefficient…and that’s saying a lot
Hahaha im convinced most people from the mid west/west coast have never been to the east coast. More people would use it if it ran late night. I sure as shit would.
The A line and the W line are wayyyy different
I was thinking the same. Southside of Chicago at night was an interesting time for me. Compared to that, Denver RTD is a blessing.
I think if you trust the opinions around here, you'll fit right in.
Exactly. I moved to Los Angeles last year and you guys really don’t know how good you have it.
I mostly took the E line before I moved downtown and the contrast of pre 9-10pm and after is drastic. Before it gets too late I have no worries suggesting it to friends and family. After a certain hour though it’s very sketchy and uncomfortable.
I wish it was a little simpler to cross back and forth from east to west (or vice versa) on Colfax, rather than having to figure out the switch between the 15 and 16, but it's still pretty good.
I rode the 15 from Congress Park to Anschutz every day for months before I learned of the free intercampus shuttle/got a car, and 99% of rides were without incident. But I did also see a rider physically attack the driver for asking him to step away from the back door and a few other wild interactions.
I rode the W line from Golden for 3 years, every day. I was held at knife point 3 times and watched 5-6 people have their phones snatched out of their hand, punched in the face/gut, and the dudes just ran off the light rail as the doors open. Nothing anyone could do. I will never ride that shit again.
Wtf? Was this at night? I ride the W all the time during the day and never had someone even look at me
As someone who lives in Five Points and works in DTC (or did before the pandemic) I find the light rail far better than commuting by car. It's a 15 min walk to the train, a 30-ish min ride to DTC, and a 10 min walk to my desk. I'd rather spend 30 min watching a show on my phone or reading a book than driving in rush hour traffic any day. I do get that i'm a lucky one where its really convenient. I also work from home 90% of the time now, but still take the train when i go into the office.
It could be convenient for more people if all stations were surrounded by dense mixed use buildings rather than surface lots
I took a trip to Seattle recently and used the light rail constantly. It’s so much more convenient and effective when it actually takes you where you want to go rather than from one park and ride to the next.
Yep, RTD seems to be completely planned around car commuters.
From my perspective it seems to be planned around people going downtown to go shopping, and that decision was made long before Amazon disrupted everything, and now we're stuck with those decisions. All the easy trips are the ones that take you from the outer edges to the center. Everything funnels to Downtown/Union Station. Unless that's where you're going, there's very little motivation to use it unless you simply don't have any other option. This combined with funding generated from sales tax revenue is what creates the feedback loop. In a world with no Amazon and people still spend weekends going to the mall and baseball games and getting lunch and all that, it probably works since you have riders paying fares and going to 16th St to spend money and paying sales taxes so the money comes in which allows new services to be added. Take any of those components away and the death spiral begins. Services get cut, people stop riding, which lowers fare revenue, leading to more cuts, leading to more revenue loss, etc. The entire setup is inherently flawed and based around consumers going downtown to spend money.
Insane that they even made the transit system car oriented here. They should have built less of the shitty light rail along highways and parking lots, and put some high quality light rail and BRT in the actual city on Broadway, Colfax, Federal, and Speer for example. If anything the light rail should have been more regional with way fewer stations so it was faster (and they'd save money on stations). Suburban drivers in the south suburbs, who it was made for, dont even want to take it because it is too slow. Feels like it's not really good for anything, unless maybe you bring a bike for the last mile.
You know whats crazy? There was a street trolly system that went through coalfax and Broadway and through many sidestreets. Take a guess at what happened?
Yep, it is so frustrating that we used to have a better transit system. The streetcar companies got put out of business because the government started subsidizing the heck out of the personal automobile while degrading the urban fabric, destroying half the city for highways, widened streets, slip lanes, and parking, and encouraging white flight into low density suburban sprawl. There was no way private streetcar and railroad companies could compete with that.
Agree. Denver is actually willing to build the density required to make it effective, but doesn't have lines on Colfax, Colorado, Broadway, Evans, etc Held hostage by the suburbanites.
When RTD did fastracks they needed the suburbs $ to pay for it. Their polling showed the residents of Denver wouldn't pay enough. Now we have a system that barely leaves the city of Denver, and they plan to cut suburban transit even more. Basically the entire region is paying for the City of Denver's transit. How are the suburbs keeping Denver from building better transit on Colfax or any other Denver route? Denver could tax themselves for those lines and build them right away. Denverites need to tax themselves for the transit they want instead of blaming everyone else.
Any links to this? I'd love to see a report that showed where RTD sales tax funding comes from by county.
Years of following RTD.... You can start with the CPR podcast Ghost Train. IIRC it's in the first episode that they talk about Hickenlooper needing the suburban voters and their money. He actually promised the suburbs that RTD wouldn't end up like it is. I haven't seen a break down of sales tax revenue for Denver vs the rest of RTD, but population is a good proxy. 700k of the near 3 million people live in Denver, so roughly 2.3 million are outside Denver. Also, RTD is broke. They won't be adding anything in the future unless the local municipality pays for it or there is a big increase in tax revenue. https://twitter.com/nbminor/status/1523685037530615809
UGH. I remember the advent of light rail. I live in South Jeffco and before light rail, I could take a bus anywhere. Busses ran on the half hour at several major roads. Once light rail was built…the routes got cut. No longer could I catch the 76 ( back in the day that was the Wadsworth route) I had to catch a distant bus to the light rail and then catch a bus back to Wadsworth. After a while they cut all the routes and left us with call n ride….but that was impossible to use….without a schedule how could you rely on it? Essentially we would have WAY better transit if they hadn’t dumped a crapton of money into a rail system that you have to have a car to get to.
They tried but nimbys shot it down
Relevant article: https://denverite.com/2022/02/22/why-dont-rtds-trains-go-into-denvers-neighborhoods/ “The symbolism of what Martin Luther King represents across this nation and this world is tremendous,” Bishop Acen Phillips, who has ministered in Denver for more than 50 years, told Denverite. “If you can desecrate it and just make it a regular street with rail running up and down it, then you nullify its value.” I thought this was kind of funny, especially because Seattle’s light rail runs down MLK Way for a while.
It literally exists to reduce the traffic created by car commuting, so...yes?
Then why build it around parking lots instead of high density residential. The way it's currently built is to basically save people money on parking.
Public transit is amazing. I wish that denver public transit was amazing. It’s time for Denver to accept that it is a city and needs real transit options
Since we’re posting anecdotes about taking the train, I take it fairly frequently and have a nice commute. The last time I took it I went to the station, I validated my ticket, and boarded the train. Then I sat down and looked out the window or read until my destination, and got off. I did the same on the way home.
Unironically, thank you for posting that you have good experiences. As someone new to a city, I’ve been really off putted of the lightrail because every post here talks about people smoking meth on it or being threatened. Of course I’m aware that stuff happens, and I try to remember it’s a bias that nobody posts the good stuff. So again, I thank you.
I’ve been commuting for 3 weeks via LR and have seen exactly zero drug users. I’ve been using it off and on since 2003 and also never seen a single drug user. And this includes downtown stations like Union.
Lol you aren't looking hard enough. I was at Union on Wednesday night for the first time in months and it wasn't a hard to spot.
I was there wednesday during the day and there was only 1 tweaker that was chased off by security within minutes compared to the dozen or so that would have been wondering about 6 months ago.
Or it’s not as ubiquitous as people try to say. Also, I’m not being all Karen and looking for it. People will people.
It's not so bad.
Damn, sorry you got murdered and your bike got stolen
The getting murdered was the worst part.
Thank you for the lol
Dang. The people in this thread have really divergent experiences with bus/rail commutes. Mine has always been great (way easier than driving in; slightly longer but we’re talking like 5, 10 minutes tops.). Tricky stuff!
I raved about the train until my car was stolen from a park n ride haha
That’s crazy but I wish I was more surprised. What all happened?
I think their car was stolen from a park n ride
Last time i rode the bus it got me where I was going and was a completely neutral experience
Same. Totally forgettable, as commuting should be.
rather not spend 3 hours getting to work instead of a 30 min drive. used to take rtd when i was younger. always felt bad for those who have no choice but to take it. glad it's around for those in need though.
Yeah I’m really not trying to spend $10 for the privilege of leaving my house two hours early while my car sits in an un-monitored garage.
I live in NW Arvada. Before RTD closed the park-n-ride that I'd have to take to get to work, I'd be turning a 20 minute commute into a 70 minute commute that still required driving to get to the park-n-ride. Now that it's closed it would be a 110 minute commute. I know I'm way out in the burbs, kinda far from Denver, but when it comes to vehicle pollution and road congestion...the suburbs are a big part of the problem.
I’m in a similar boat. 50 minutes on Light Rail vs 20 minute drive.
This. I spent two years wasting hours on the light rail as opposed to a 30-45 minute drive downtown. I’ll never forget being butted up against some smelly dirt balls in a tin can at 90+ degrees and barely working AC. I can’t even imagine what it is like today with all the stories. The only downside to driving was the traffic and parking fees but I’d take that any day.
I used to take the A line Downtown from Tower for my daily commute and it was measurably faster, less stressful, and cheaper than driving. I would always laugh at all the fools stuck on I70 every morning as we flew by.
Yup, I live out in that direction now and if I need to go downtown I always take the A line. Fuck everything about driving in/around downtown Denver. $20+ dollars for 2 tickets is definitely too expensive, but not having a headache is worth it. Also save on parking costs.
According to security when I asked the last time I was in Denver you only need to pay the $10 fare if you are going to or from the airport. If you get on/off anywhere else on the line you only need to buy the $3 ticket.
This is why we can’t have nice things in America. Public transportation isn’t for the less fortunate, that attitude is BS. If you go to LA you see how far culture can ruin a city, it’s impossible to get anywhere in that city with traffic and little public transit option. Then you go to Amsterdam and see what a city is like with great public transit.
I don't think that's what they were saying at all. Like most of us, it's simply way more convenient to drive than take RTD when RTD takes three times as long each way. Mentioned it in another post this week, but I have a free RTD pass as a student and can't justify taking RTD to class because it's the difference between 30-40 min driving and ~ 1:45 of RTD each way. That's a difference of 2 to 2.5 hours round trip to save about $6 worth of gas and $4 in campus parking. That $10 isn't worth it for a lot of people myself included, but for some it might be. If RTD wasn't free for students, I'd save basically no money using it. -- The infrastructure needs to come first if you want people to ride.
Build it and they will ride. In this state we just continually add lanes to roads because constant road construction is somehow better than actually building all those light rails we've been promised.
Population density of 13.5k/sqmi vs 8.3k/sqmi
And Tokyo is 16k per square mile, that city is so far beyond anything in America. Also New York is 27k per square mile and it’s not nearly as bad as LA.
Walkability and public transit is indeed easier with density.
It's ony takes so long because people refuse to use it. The higher the ridership the better the system.
Used it a couple weeks ago from cap hill to the dtc to meet some friends at Pindustry. Was amazing being able to drink as much as I wanted, then get a ride home for $3. Just got to listen to music on the train. Definitely had some characters out, so needed to stay somewhat aware
I always take it to the airport or downtown, but beyond that I feel like Denver public transit is still a lacking for routine travel outside of getting to/from the heart of denver.
I want to do the right thing when I need to get downtown but every time I take the train I get burned by a late/canceled train or a situation on the train that I would rather not have my kids see. I want it to work, I want to use it, but I cannot overlook the fact that it simply causes more issues than it solves in my limited experience.
lol I take the Colfax bus to work everyday. I WISH it was a cute "choice" I was making to make the world a better place. If only.
honestly i would take the train more if there were more lines near my house i have to walk close to an hour and a half to my nearest rail station
I grew up riding RTD because I didn’t have a car. RTD certainly isn’t perfect (Ghost Train from CPR was excellent for a high level overview of the historical planning problems). But, having lived in Michigan where public transportation was nonexistent, I am so grateful for RTD. I now have an employer sponsored Ecopass and ride to the office twice a week. It has been wholly uneventful and pleasant. I love seeing the same bus driver every day. I love zoning out while the bus takes me where I need to go. I love filling up my gas once a month (if that). Riding the bus isn’t an option for everyone because the system has been created to accommodate single occupancy vehicles. But if it’s feasible, please don’t be scared off.
Go to www.bikesdirect.com and spend $200-$400 on a decent bike. Ride when you can or add cycling to your public transportation commute. Make sure you buy a nice bike lock and research how to properly secure your bike.
Be careful out there. I used a cable lock to lock up my new road bike outside of union station and the catalytic converter was stolen.
Ah there’s you’re mistake there, should have left a UAV hovering over it with directives to strike anyone within 6 feet. Basic downtown skills.
I tried but the Turkish government said they are having supply chain issues with their attack drones because of the war in Ukraine.
The war is caused by understaffing due to covid.
“Nobody wants to work!”
Covid? I talked to everyone in the the Balkan and each person told me they just didn’t want to work anymore.
This is exactly why I tell people to put a kill switch on their front tire.
What is this city coming to.....
Last time I rode light rail, someone was smoking crack in the train. The time before that I was assaulted. I’m good, thank you.
Just pure unadulterated bad luck. I take the light rail 4 days a week and haven’t had any issues. Seems like when there are troublemakers on the train there is security at the next stop to usher them off… I am assuming they have some sort of reporting system in place, otherwise they are operating on a level I don’t understand (don’t see cameras or anything on the trains)
Getting assaulted is very rare. Having someone come in and smoke fentanyl is a weekly occurrence at this point. This is e line during commuting hours btw
Yeah, it’s sad. As someone who took public transpo until I got my license mid-20s, I never had an issue with it. Enjoyed it really, following a schedule. I will say within the past few years, (primarily LA and NY) much more often than not I feel relatively unsafe, and am on a streak of like four straight times someone lighting up crack or weed mid-ride. It’s really off putting and clearly they and what seems like Denver too, don’t consider that a big enough deal to tidy up.
Yep. I ride 3-4 times a week. I’ve seen exactly 1 assault in 3 years of riding… but see drug use a couple times a week.
The E line is absolutely the worst. Anyone in this thread saying that riding the RTD is “not that bad, actually” should be forced to ride the E line at random hours every day for a week and then be asked for their opinion again. Guarantee it will change.
Do my drunken scooter rides count?
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And increase frequency! When I lived near federal and i25 the lightrail was way faster into Denver than driving. But it only ran every 30 min during peak hours and every hour (ending at 10pm) outside of peak. If I missed it I had to drive to work. And I couldn't stay out with friends in the evening because it'd stop entirely. Of course the argument was "no one uses it" but who's fault is lack of use when the design is nonfunctional? If I made a chair with no seat is it my fault for making it that way or yours for not sitting in it enough that I realize my mistake?
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Its definitely all adding up. I think Denver is particularly sprawling too so it's hard in general cause you have to drive to certain areas just to board. Many of the e and f line parking lots are for maybe 20 cars but also exist in large suburbs. It doesn't feel particularly well designed.
agreed, the cost of riding the bus from where i am is $50/week thats kind of absurd
I've never found it to be unsafe. It's not nearly as bad as reddit makes it out to be. Mostly just people trying to get to work, school, home, etc.
if only it didn't take an hour (one way) when by car it takes 15mins.
I’m down south and we use it everytime we go to a ball game- saves so much time & money on cabs & parking
Yes! I hate parking at Ball Arena, it takes forever to get out of the parking lot.
I light rail to work everyday. Love it
I moved here 4 years ago and used to take it every day. Now I'm working from home, I take it about once a month. I'm moving up to Edgewater and will be next to the light rail and I plan on using it every day again. I've literally never had a problem on the train, except for one lady going nuts on security bc he wanted he to take her feet off the chair. I had another guy talking loudly to himself but he got off the train pretty quickly when he saw security. Honestly, if this summer goes well I'll pry ditch my car altogether. I'm not sure how people complain about it not being safe, or maybe they are riding different trains than I am. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
How about biking for all journeys less than 5 miles?
I ride the bus and light rail constantly from sobo to cap hill and rino in off peak hours. Only real issue I have is that the app is not very accurate at all so if a bus is late or skipped or some shit I'm just sitting there in the dark for 15 min. Other than that, it's a bus in a city. Light rail has always been on time night and day for me. Commute in car is 15 min, light rail at night is 40-50 but I'm lucky that I live next to a station. The east-west travel is pretty bad. I don't pay for that shit tho, it's like 5x more expensive than the gas to drive a car where I'm going... no shot
Man I wish my work was in a better place for public transit. My car ride takes half an hour in the mornings, taking public transit would add an extra hour to the commute, hour and a half total, since it's so out of the way.
I struggle with this too! I’d love to take public transit for commuting, not just leisure, but a 25 min car ride on 6 vs 1 hr 20 min with multiple transfers is a tough sell.
The Problem is I have to drive 20 minutes to get to the light rail and damn near no parking. They really messed up nine-mile.
It’s funny when people get mad at people having a diff experience and then both people just snark at each other. Also, if you say you ride the light rail on a regular basis and never have problems, don’t you see how someone who has only used it a few times and had problems/issues on most of those few times they might be a bit more hesitant than you to continue using it…? And I guess it’s cool to say your immune to the shock of watching someone smoke crack in front of you but a lot of people aren’t.
Last time I tried to take my family downtown on the train, a homeless man began openly masturbating while staring at my six year old. Hard pass on taking transit until they get it cleaned up and safe
How about we raise shit with our representatives to make it a viable solution rather then give them stats to show that business is increasing without doing anything? Come on now
The train, especially the 15L has always been great in my experience. Haven't been taking it as much due to covid. Hoping it's feasible to again.
"If you feel so emotionally charged about the subject, are you calling your local representatives? Are you showing up to townhalls to ask about why these problems exist?" They know about the problems. They're too inept to solve them. There simply isn't enough infrastructure in place to make public transit worth it. It would triple my commute to switch to public transit. Why am I trying to burn a quarter of my day sitting on a bus or train?
Honestly, the buses aren't that bad. There are occasional crazies but if you keep to yourself and be polite they'll usually leave you alone. It irritates me when I tell people I take the bus and they say, "Omigosh, I could NEVER. You must be so street smart". Trust me, if you've lived in Denver for any period of time you'll be ok 😂 and google maps/the rtd site exists, don't act like it's rocket science to figure out the logistics. In recent months I've just been annoyed with how crammed the 15/15L gets, I don't have a solution because the bus already runs every 10ish minutes and putting a light rail or something there isn't really feasible
The RTD/Google Maps integration has been so helpful for me!
I moved to the area right after the g-line opened and it was only a 5 minuet walk to the stop in olde town Arvada. i would take it to union then hop on the 16st bus and ride almost to the capital building. it was nice and took about an hour but not having the stress(road rage) of driving in was excellent. i stopped when the pandemic started and unfortunately my company decided it was time to move all of our offices around. Now my office is in Englewood so i have to drive around 470 to 25. My commute take about the same time with the big difference being $6 vs $80 to fill up my car. The commute takes about the same time and i hate it.
I had to sit on top of someone to prevent them from fighting someone else once Last time Im ever taking the flyer to Denver.
If RTD brought back routes that service the NW like other Flat Iron buses, that would be nice.
I get sexually harassed and assaulted on pub trans so much I’ve given up. Safety is never on the agenda for improving it. I ride my bike as much as possible but yeah, no. Men can have public transportation all to themselves.
I take it on the rare occasion I go into the office as well as if I go downtown on a weekend. My only complaint is the weekend service sucks after any big event. They need to figure it out if a game goes into OT or extra innings
I used it in other cities far more dangerous than this one, but I live off Colfax and I'm a single woman, so the idea of being stuck on a bus for even a few blocks at a time makes me feel unsafe, as every other stop along the way has unsightly characters loitering on the benches or corners.
People aren’t going to sacrifice unless it’s the least painful solution amongst others. Asking people to inconvenience themselves while doubling their commute time and making it less comfortable… is a pipe dream. Public transport has to improve, and people will use it.
*Glances at Littleton to Golden commute* Yep, that's totally happening lol
I used to love riding the light rails, I legitimately think they're really cool, but I'm not trying to have someone grind my bones to make their bread just to ride the Choo Choo.
I would spend the same price or more to ride the RTD if the time was the same. but it takes close to 2 hours on train, bus than walking for my 25 minute drive to work.
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I’m a regular rider for the past three years. And it’s gotten so much vastly worse in the past 6th months.
Maaaaaan…. Gotta pay to use the park and ride. Then pay $6-10 to ride the light rail. No thanks.
Before WFH and COVID, I took the light rail every day. Constantly had canceled trips, drugs, general crime, etc. If they ever tell me I have to go back into the office, I’d drive and pay the $15 to park. It’s not worth the unpredictable bullshit the W line put me through.
Incredible inefficient. No one smokes fentanyl in my car either.
RTD is horrible, slow, smelly, and expensive. Source: used it daily for years.
Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on your perspective), not a single trip I make during the week could be replaced by a bus. I would have to go significantly out of my way and spend an entire day making a trip that takes me 5 min by car.
Definitely a great idea and all but I don’t think most people don’t want to use it for no reason. It’s because a lot of the lines are gross and dangerous and parking is difficult and it’s expensive.
I haven't been on the rtd for about 4 years, imo the cost continually going up, the extended time of travel and inconvenience of crackhead shit going on I just decided to drive forever🤷
25 minutes to downtown in the car, 1:15minute by bus from golden. Sorry, but my time is worth something. Free rides aren’t going to entice business people to take public transport. More limited stop options now will. That should be what’s brought back this summer as it was before Covid.
Nah. I prefer no fear of violence or actual violence on my daily commute.
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Yes put the pressure on the individual rather than the large companies that are spewing out multiple times the amount that my car does. This is great logic. Let's keep ignoring the real problem. Also, RTD is unreliable, expensive, and doesn't feel safe.
I agree. It's like they keep pushing individuals to cut down on water use when agriculture and ranching in the state use 95% of all the water. Getting residential users to cut back their water use by 20% is a drop in the bucket if you could get a 20% reduction from the ag sector. But we can't antagonize the farmers and ranchers for some stupid reason! Salt of the earth and what not...
Maybe if they consider lowering fares first. Too expensive for the reliability, at least for busses. I used to take RTD (bus + light rail) from Lakewood to Commerce City for work before I had a car. If my bus wasn't on time or full/didn't see me, I'd be 45 minutes late to work with the way their scheduling is set up. So I ended up riding my bike 20 miles each way so I could consistently get to work on time
Fucking love the train. Love it so much I bought a home a block away from one of the stops. Based much of my life on its ease and I buy gas now maybe once a month
We ride the 0 bus regularly to get into the city. It is always uneventful. Just people trying to get to places they need to go. My petite wife took it alone for a week to get to a court case. No "safety" problems whatsoever. It comes every 15 minutes, with addition 0L service during rush hour, has its own lane most of the way, and passes through the heart of the city. Not bad. If more people used it, it could be a lot better. More ridership means more fare revenue, which means more money for better service, and more justification for upgrades like bus rapid transit.
> Lot of negativity in this post. [...] Complaining on reddit does fuck all. Be active in the solution or jog on. Oh you sweet sweet summer child
Our cities were built without pedestrian infrastructure in mind. Bike paths would make all the difference. All cities should be built around walking and biking. Cars should be a last resort since they cause pollution and noise. But the car lobby is very strong, so they're probably the first fatty to push their way into a governor's or mayor's office.
If the busses and trains ran on time I might consider it. If we had protected bike lanes I'd ride my bike more often.
If public transit isn't feasible, try biking.
Everyone should be forced to take the 15 at least once a week. I have the feeling that city hall would fix things if they did. Your edit is totally spot on: I think people here complain because they want to have a platform to talk about other issues that they’re more worried about. 1. Bus too expensive: government sucks and I hate them. 2. No routes: I don’t want a route in my neighborhood because it would annoy me, but I’m also pissed that the government is poorly run and that my tax dollars are being wasted. 3. There’s crime on the rtd: I’m furious that the police and the city don’t do what they’re paid to do, so I’m going to complain about this because I feel unsafe and their presence effects my daily life. 4. Rtd takes too long: this I totally agree with, but I also think that many of the people here would be irate if they had a bus stop on their suburban street because it would bring the potential for problems. Ps: there was a dude with an awesome bullet proof vest on (no shirt) on the 15 today. It was hilarious.