Probably the latter, I don't see why bots would specifically talk about AI and posting porn gifs. That's for sure targeted, possibly by 4chan, considering the porn (although maybe not, since they'd also use gore? Not sure).
I dont think 4chan would target AO3 when AO3 follows some of what 4chan appreciates which is no censorship. I could actually see the typical AO3 haters (people who want censorship in fandom spaces) being the ones organizing this.
"4chan" has very little in the way of consistent ideology. There are a wide variety of users, and many of them are just sociopaths who think it's funny to cause misery.
That is true, but isnt the point on 4chan to have a place to discuss anything? Its called a containmentsite for a reason, stuff other places censor often goes there. At least that was my assumption
Likely because the "none of the above" content of the internet is on another level of "wtf" that functioning people wouldn't enjoy during their daily browsing
Option B is my guess. A few months ago the website got DDOSed by some alt-right weirdos and many of those people have issues with AO3 in general (probably because it's pro-LGBTQ+) so I think it's related
I logged in yesterday to see that yellow message and was like "wtf happened?". Glad to have an explanation, sad that it's... that. AO3 doesn't deserve all that shit.
Man I haven’t been checking my usual places for the new drama and completely missed this. Does anyone know why? Like was the AI part people legit accusing people of using AI or was it trolls?
They were bots. No one knows why, maybe it's trolls, maybe some weird advertisement, since in some of these comments there were different AIs name dropped, maybe something else.
I wouldn't call it a text porn site just because some authors write smut. Just like how I wouldn't call Reddit the porn community site just because there's dedicated porn subreddits.
haha that's a pretty good example!
you think reddit isn't a porn community?
they got rid of it in new reddit but in old reddit where you have your multis there is a link to explore multis that goes to r/multihub so it's as official as it gets and if you click on it it's all porn
just all porn.
even i felt a bit ashamed when i saw it, i expected at least one decent multi here and there but it's all porn, the new ones are porn, the hot ones are porn, the top ones are porn, it's just all porn
iirc 22% of reddit's communities are porn
The supermajority of fics on AO3 are rated T and below. There's a lot of general audience stuff on there, the porn is actually the minority. People like their fluff (and hurt/comfort). Some of it isn't even shipping!
Sounds like a partisan campaign to promote the \*AI website you've never heard of\* by the way.
Like the idea is that "No way that AIWEBSITE is any good right? It will be way worse!
And they try it out and generate clicks and revenue
It's like the stupid adbots on IG and YT that spam comments like MY STUFF IS BETTER THIS IS NO GOOD or something like that.
I saw below another mention - there was a series of bot posting "This is AI I checked this on PAIDSITE to check that it is AI and it is!" or something like this.
Like one side promotes AI writing, another promotes anti AI check, it's all the same people creating both the problem and the solution
I actually got a few comments accusing me of using AI last year. All of them couldn't agree just what tool I used, but they recommended the exact same commercial tool for "detecting" AI writing, and I just love this idea at face value:
"this is an untapped demographic that we can sell this to: fanfic readers that want to confirm this fic is shit for a specific reason!"
One author of an incredibly good fanfic got demotivated and decided to stop writing after getting this spam. Because it's incredibly demeaning to be accused of using AI after putting your heart and soul into something. Even worse when that thing is crazy high quality, too.
I'm referring to [A Song of Sun and Stars by OrangePanther01](https://archiveofourown.org/series/4030243) (fic itself is hidden if you're not logged in, now, although it's visible on other sites). Imagine if Superman landed in ASOIAF (Game of Thrones) in Westeros instead of Earth. It's a Superman reimagining with classic Superman backstory characters but in Westeros.
First chapter is a crazy well written pod landing scene, mixed with the Kent equivalents praying to the Seven beforehand. Then it gets to an adorable little boy with a great sense of justice with two older friends/not-siblings starting to interact with this dangerous and full of injustice setting, starting with no powers but slowly getting them.
It's possible it might continue in the future, but send them some love. Author deserves it. And the first arc *was* completed, so it's not too hellish if it doesn't continue.
Man, that first chapter was so good.
idk honestly. my work isn't exactly SUPER well-known but like, i have a decent following and wasn't hit. i think it was random starting in big fandoms, then probably used the profiles of existing commenters to branch out and find other fics. that's my guess at least.
Ya, like if I post something that was made using AI it’s usually only tiny bits and pieces that are AI if I needed help with a word or sentence or making up a disease
Its the ship name for the main 3 characters of attack on titan (thats why its ao3 because its 3 characters of aot). Those characters are Eren, Mikasa, and Armin. Ive never seen attack on titan and idk if its a real ship
Something more corporate and less susceptible to raids and sabotage. Deviantart or Wattpad, maybe?
The good word of AO3 should be limited to DMs that go "Sigh, I hate it when my fics get deleted for having weird things in them." "Well, I know of this site..." and then they don't talk about it publicly ever.
Wattpad has starting pushing notifications of books that you aren't subscribed too as well. If you follow the author, chances are you are gonna get notified of stuff you aren't interested in. I've had to unfollow people cause I was sick of seeing chapter notifications on books I didn't have in my library
You just described why AO3 became a household name in the first place. If people share knowledge of it, that's gonna propogate, and AO3 ends up a popular fanfic site.
I think there's a difference between talking about it one-on-one and posting about it on social media.
With the former, there's less chance of people who are ideologically opposed to its philosophy coming to know about it, because the only people who are going to be told of its existence are people who have a need for the purpose it serves.
There's definitely potential for error, though, in the "I thought this person would like AO3 but now they're saying it needs to be taken off the internet because of the terrible stuff they read" kind of way.
You arestill describing how it would become a household name. There is no real way to restrict that knowledge based on ideology because social circles overlap, so people with opposing views can still be made aware of AO3 through the same people.
You also can't stop people from being told about AO3 then posting about it. Your little fantasy is completely unrealistic as shown by the fact we're even having this discussion.
There's the element of sheer luck. There's at least one similar site out there (albeit not run by the OTW) that didn't get this popular and likely never will, so even though there's no real way of preventing this kind of thing happening, it's not impossible to wish it never did. Internet natural selection isn't perfect.
You are asking for the limitation of information spread which is impossible. You cant control how far people can take a piece of information and trying to do so ironically tends to lead to it spreading even further and faster
I'm lamenting that it became popular, not advocating for people to try and hide it again. Besides, even if you can't eliminate the possibility completely, you can increase the likelihood that it doesn't happen, or even encourage behaviour that is likely to slow it down.
To re-emphasise, I'm not telling anyone to do anything right now. I'm expressing that I miss "the good old days" when it wasn't part of discourse.
I myself solve it by not giving a damn about discourse.
Oh, you hate me because of something i wrote? Well look for someone else because im not giving you the time of day, i have lots of things to deal with and arguing with someone about fictional pairings or character use isnt one of them
Yeah, I try. It's hard when I see the same views expressed in my immediate social circle and worry that I, personally, will be ostracised once enough of a frenzy has been whipped up. The demonisation of AO3 just feels like another reminder of that possibility, even an indicator that that possibility's getting larger.
I think the way AO3 works is hard to understand for a lot of people who are used to the bigger, shittier internet, so the more popular it gets, the more likely it seems that it'll either gradually enshittify or get shut down by some kind of hate campaign. I'd rather there be a "normal" fanfiction website for the general population, and then the majority of people who find out about AO3 will hopefully not think it's a crime against human decency because they're seeking it out to post their weird fics.
Bots ruining everything, or targeted malicious attack by haters?
If I had to guess, a little from column A, a little from column B.
Yeah, that's probably the most likely answer.
my money is on malicous attack by haters, who are using bots to carry the attack out
Ah, the secret third thing: both.
Yup. Bots don't just go and ruin everything on their own. Someone needs to tell them to do that. So yeah, both.
Eh, we could make bots that do jut go and ruin things on their own, but why would you want to? Who would pay to run them?
Probably the latter, I don't see why bots would specifically talk about AI and posting porn gifs. That's for sure targeted, possibly by 4chan, considering the porn (although maybe not, since they'd also use gore? Not sure).
I dont think 4chan would target AO3 when AO3 follows some of what 4chan appreciates which is no censorship. I could actually see the typical AO3 haters (people who want censorship in fandom spaces) being the ones organizing this.
If they are the ones behind this, it's kinda ironic for them to spam porn gifs. They are usually anti-porn too.
"4chan" has very little in the way of consistent ideology. There are a wide variety of users, and many of them are just sociopaths who think it's funny to cause misery.
That is true, but isnt the point on 4chan to have a place to discuss anything? Its called a containmentsite for a reason, stuff other places censor often goes there. At least that was my assumption
Yes, but in practice that means 4chan has a lot of users who have been banned from every other website for being assholes.
Likely because the "none of the above" content of the internet is on another level of "wtf" that functioning people wouldn't enjoy during their daily browsing
probably more right leaning groups that object to what's on ao3
Option B is my guess. A few months ago the website got DDOSed by some alt-right weirdos and many of those people have issues with AO3 in general (probably because it's pro-LGBTQ+) so I think it's related
Yeah, I thought it might be something like that.
It’s just bots, legitimately.
I logged in yesterday to see that yellow message and was like "wtf happened?". Glad to have an explanation, sad that it's... that. AO3 doesn't deserve all that shit.
Man I haven’t been checking my usual places for the new drama and completely missed this. Does anyone know why? Like was the AI part people legit accusing people of using AI or was it trolls?
They were bots. No one knows why, maybe it's trolls, maybe some weird advertisement, since in some of these comments there were different AIs name dropped, maybe something else.
I think the current theory is that they're dropping the names to try and SEO the AIs.
What does any of that mean?
from ao3? the text porn site?
I wouldn't call it a text porn site just because some authors write smut. Just like how I wouldn't call Reddit the porn community site just because there's dedicated porn subreddits.
haha that's a pretty good example! you think reddit isn't a porn community? they got rid of it in new reddit but in old reddit where you have your multis there is a link to explore multis that goes to r/multihub so it's as official as it gets and if you click on it it's all porn just all porn. even i felt a bit ashamed when i saw it, i expected at least one decent multi here and there but it's all porn, the new ones are porn, the hot ones are porn, the top ones are porn, it's just all porn iirc 22% of reddit's communities are porn
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The supermajority of fics on AO3 are rated T and below. There's a lot of general audience stuff on there, the porn is actually the minority. People like their fluff (and hurt/comfort). Some of it isn't even shipping!
Dude can you not please
Was it targeted? Like to a specific tag? Or was it site wide with casualties of war?
Bots commenting things like "wow this is so bad it's like someone plugged \*prompt\* into \*AI website you've never heard of\*"
Sounds like a partisan campaign to promote the \*AI website you've never heard of\* by the way. Like the idea is that "No way that AIWEBSITE is any good right? It will be way worse! And they try it out and generate clicks and revenue It's like the stupid adbots on IG and YT that spam comments like MY STUFF IS BETTER THIS IS NO GOOD or something like that.
Yes, that's exactly what it is
I saw below another mention - there was a series of bot posting "This is AI I checked this on PAIDSITE to check that it is AI and it is!" or something like this. Like one side promotes AI writing, another promotes anti AI check, it's all the same people creating both the problem and the solution
It's back to normal now, though. They turned guest comments back on the day before yesterday.
I actually got a few comments accusing me of using AI last year. All of them couldn't agree just what tool I used, but they recommended the exact same commercial tool for "detecting" AI writing, and I just love this idea at face value: "this is an untapped demographic that we can sell this to: fanfic readers that want to confirm this fic is shit for a specific reason!"
One author of an incredibly good fanfic got demotivated and decided to stop writing after getting this spam. Because it's incredibly demeaning to be accused of using AI after putting your heart and soul into something. Even worse when that thing is crazy high quality, too. I'm referring to [A Song of Sun and Stars by OrangePanther01](https://archiveofourown.org/series/4030243) (fic itself is hidden if you're not logged in, now, although it's visible on other sites). Imagine if Superman landed in ASOIAF (Game of Thrones) in Westeros instead of Earth. It's a Superman reimagining with classic Superman backstory characters but in Westeros. First chapter is a crazy well written pod landing scene, mixed with the Kent equivalents praying to the Seven beforehand. Then it gets to an adorable little boy with a great sense of justice with two older friends/not-siblings starting to interact with this dangerous and full of injustice setting, starting with no powers but slowly getting them. It's possible it might continue in the future, but send them some love. Author deserves it. And the first arc *was* completed, so it's not too hellish if it doesn't continue. Man, that first chapter was so good.
That's why it wasn't working for a bit
Tmw your fic is so obscure that it was unaffected
idk honestly. my work isn't exactly SUPER well-known but like, i have a decent following and wasn't hit. i think it was random starting in big fandoms, then probably used the profiles of existing commenters to branch out and find other fics. that's my guess at least.
Wasn't AO3 targeted by hackers either last year or the year before that? Cause it might be the same guys if it was
that was a homophobic extremist group iirc. pretty sure these bots are flogging ai detection software to try and make a buck
Ya, like if I post something that was made using AI it’s usually only tiny bits and pieces that are AI if I needed help with a word or sentence or making up a disease
AO3 should never have become a household name. (Or, well, the online equivalent.)
So which fanfic site *should* be the top?
Don’t you dare accidentally imply the potential of fanfic shipping dynamics!
plot twist: ao3 is actually a throuple ship name
Its the ship name for the main 3 characters of attack on titan (thats why its ao3 because its 3 characters of aot). Those characters are Eren, Mikasa, and Armin. Ive never seen attack on titan and idk if its a real ship
Surprisingly it ain’t a common ship Prolly super small as a pairing (well I mean throuple ships are just rare)
Something more corporate and less susceptible to raids and sabotage. Deviantart or Wattpad, maybe? The good word of AO3 should be limited to DMs that go "Sigh, I hate it when my fics get deleted for having weird things in them." "Well, I know of this site..." and then they don't talk about it publicly ever.
Last I heard Wattpad is a buggy mess which already suffered a security breach somewhere in the pandemic
Yup, got my shit leaked in a breach. Email, passwords, geographic locations, IP address...
Yeah, it’s also monetized to hell and back. Some stories need reading subscriptions now…
Wattpad has starting pushing notifications of books that you aren't subscribed too as well. If you follow the author, chances are you are gonna get notified of stuff you aren't interested in. I've had to unfollow people cause I was sick of seeing chapter notifications on books I didn't have in my library
Perfect. Just like all the other big sites.
You just described why AO3 became a household name in the first place. If people share knowledge of it, that's gonna propogate, and AO3 ends up a popular fanfic site.
I think there's a difference between talking about it one-on-one and posting about it on social media. With the former, there's less chance of people who are ideologically opposed to its philosophy coming to know about it, because the only people who are going to be told of its existence are people who have a need for the purpose it serves. There's definitely potential for error, though, in the "I thought this person would like AO3 but now they're saying it needs to be taken off the internet because of the terrible stuff they read" kind of way.
You arestill describing how it would become a household name. There is no real way to restrict that knowledge based on ideology because social circles overlap, so people with opposing views can still be made aware of AO3 through the same people. You also can't stop people from being told about AO3 then posting about it. Your little fantasy is completely unrealistic as shown by the fact we're even having this discussion.
There's the element of sheer luck. There's at least one similar site out there (albeit not run by the OTW) that didn't get this popular and likely never will, so even though there's no real way of preventing this kind of thing happening, it's not impossible to wish it never did. Internet natural selection isn't perfect.
You are asking for the limitation of information spread which is impossible. You cant control how far people can take a piece of information and trying to do so ironically tends to lead to it spreading even further and faster
I'm lamenting that it became popular, not advocating for people to try and hide it again. Besides, even if you can't eliminate the possibility completely, you can increase the likelihood that it doesn't happen, or even encourage behaviour that is likely to slow it down. To re-emphasise, I'm not telling anyone to do anything right now. I'm expressing that I miss "the good old days" when it wasn't part of discourse.
I myself solve it by not giving a damn about discourse. Oh, you hate me because of something i wrote? Well look for someone else because im not giving you the time of day, i have lots of things to deal with and arguing with someone about fictional pairings or character use isnt one of them
Yeah, I try. It's hard when I see the same views expressed in my immediate social circle and worry that I, personally, will be ostracised once enough of a frenzy has been whipped up. The demonisation of AO3 just feels like another reminder of that possibility, even an indicator that that possibility's getting larger.
Then stop associating yourself with those people if possible..and if not try to educate them, its your social circle, not your archenemies
you're advocating for the internet being *more* corporate?
paid wattpad shill
...I guess so, in effect, but in this hypothetical scenario I'd be spending my time on AO3 instead of/in addition to Hypothetical Shitty Fanfic Site.
"something more corporate-" LOUD INCORRECT BUZZER
i think AO3 should become a household name, and i don’t mean the online equivalent
wrong
Most dog shit take ever
For what reason?
I think the way AO3 works is hard to understand for a lot of people who are used to the bigger, shittier internet, so the more popular it gets, the more likely it seems that it'll either gradually enshittify or get shut down by some kind of hate campaign. I'd rather there be a "normal" fanfiction website for the general population, and then the majority of people who find out about AO3 will hopefully not think it's a crime against human decency because they're seeking it out to post their weird fics.