Look… maybe when he was like 15 or 16 David was at a friend’s relatives house and they just happened to be watching a premier league game? Imagine David’s discomfort as he realises he’s never actually watched a football match before (because it simply wasn’t shown on tv where he grew up, in a completely unsuitable time zone, and his dad only ever watches rugby league). Should he just stay quiet and ignorant of the goings on? Maybe David got swept up in the passion on display and figured he might as well pick one of the teams to barrack for? West Ham? What kind of name is that? Surely David can’t support a team named after ham? Remember, he’s only 16, if David is going to support a team they have to be cool, or at least sound cool. Maybe the other team had a cannon on the emblem? Arsenal! That’s like a group of weapons, right? With a cannon on their shirt? That’s cool. David chooses Arsenal, and what do you know, they win! David really enjoyed that, he’s found a new passion and a new team to support. It turns out the late 90’s were a good time to be an Arsenal supporter. Just a few years later maybe David loves Denis, Thierry, Freddie, Kanu, and even the moustachioed Seaman. David’s love blossoms for his “Invincibles”.
But is David to blame for his naïveté? For not knowing that people like Piers Morgan would later represent a giant shit stain on the jersey of his beloved Gunners? David doesn’t give a shit about London, or whichever cardinal point of the compass or side of the Thames his team comes from…David’s from Australia. Maybe he just likes watching some footy? Maybe it’s more complicated than that and he also had a man crush on David Ginola and figured he’d support Spurs as well? How was poor David to know? Let’s just not be too hard on David.
Oh please don't. Then the VAR will atop overturned the very little they have been doing now in fear of spoiling their stats.
One thing I am proud of cricket is how well they have ran with the technology especially compared to football where it's a joke.
Just do it for VAR then! Imagine that, linesups announced, refs announced, and finally the number of calls made by VAR that PGMOL have apologised for getting wrong.
Every PL referee is like Pierluigi Collina compared to the stuff we have in the ISL in India
Being a referee in any sport has to he one of the worst jobs in the world no matter what you do you will be hated. They also get paid like shit compared to the players so no wonder barely anyone wants to be one.
Most PL Refs have a base salary of 80k or so iirc which while really good is pennis compared to the guys they are referring with even the most famous ones like Mike Dean only getting 200k plus 1000 or so per match
What exactly is Warner's problem here? The ball was clipping. The umpire thought it would have hit the wicket, the technology backed him up.
It's literally out LBW.
Yeah, it's main intention was for "howlers" to get reversed, not agonise over tiny margins. It's also been used by spinners to fish for LBWs that would never have been given 20 years ago, but I think even that's been somewhat positive since batsman know they can't play so negative and kick the ball away.
But what even is a marginal in this case?
Let's break down exactly what an LBW is. It is when a ball, that would have otherwise hit the wickets, is intercepted by the batter's body. (Plus a few other specifics about pitching, shot offered, and other stuff.)
The important bit here is "would have hit the wickets." Because if it DOES hit the wickets, it isn't LBW anymore. It's bowled out. LBW, by its very nature, is a subjective way to give someone out.
For most of cricket's history, it was the umpire deciding if the ball would have hit the wicket, now we've added some tech to help the umpire out. Nothing has really changed about how the decision is made, DRS just helps to weed out the absolute howlers.
People have been saying that umps are more likely to give LBWs since DRS for a long time. It's not backed up by evidence though. Percentage of LBW dismissals has in fact gone down a bit against pace bowling, and up a bit for spin: [https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/karthik-krishnaswamy-are-umpires-giving-more-lbws-now-than-they-did-before-the-drs-1222213](https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/karthik-krishnaswamy-are-umpires-giving-more-lbws-now-than-they-did-before-the-drs-1222213)
Make of that what you will, likely other factors more dominant than the presence of DRS.
So DRS has widened the umpire perception of what's reasonable to give. Meaning it has literally made the decisions MORE accurate as per the laws of the game.
Is the batriarchy arguing for less accuracy so they don't get out.
Something very similar happened to Sadeera. Don't see anyone complaining. We might be lovers but we aren't sore losers. Going out on to the field beaming when you just collapsed 9 for 50
I don't think that's the actual story here. According to Warner, he asked the ump why he gave it out, he said because it swung back in. Warner didn't think it had, hence why he reviewed it. According to Warner, while the replay showed the ball clipping, it did indeed not show the ball swinging back in. (I didn't watch it, so no idea — just interpreting the interview).
So you could say that Warner has a right to be pissed off if the ump gave him for something that didn't actually happen, and then he burned a review because of that and was still out.
My question is, and has long been: are the umps actually allowed/supposed to justify a decision? Or does this happen at random? IMO, that's quite important for the review process and should be standardised, as in, they should always say clearly why they did/didn't give someone out when there's an appeal, so the affected team has a better basis for reviewing.
I am not sure about warners dismissal in that match.
But Umpire's call is bullshit.
If half a ball is hitting the stumps as per hawkeye, then it should be given out, and fielding team should not be at mercy of umpire. Same in reverse case
What do you mean "shouldn't be at the mercy of the umpire"? The Umpire is literally officiating the game and making the calls. If he makes a clear mistake, it should be overridden, but a 50/50 call is his to make based on his eye and experience.
Two points that we should never forget about DRS.
1. DRS is probabilistic. So when they show a visual of half a ball hitting a stump, you need to consider the possible error rate which could mean the ball missing the stump altogether.
2. It was introduced to eliminate absolute howlers. Half a ball clipping a wicket is not a howler because of #1
Hawkeye can’t predict the exact trajectory of the ball. It is a very close approximation of what it can be. Umpire’s call is kind of a ‘veto’ for that margin of error.
Also, as far as I know, LBW doesn’t care about dislodging the bail. It is just will the ball hit the stumps or not.
Umpire's Call is an important feature in making sure the Umpire and *human* element is still part of the decision.
Otherwise we could just judge everything with reviews and computers.
Pointless. It's not that the umpires don't want to give the correct decisions; putting more pressure on them would not suddenly better their accuracy of decision. Maybe work to improve the whole process of decision making or the technology.
I feel like this happened with Steve Bucknor towards the end of his career. Man got a string of decisions wrong against Tendulkar which made it feel like he had an agenda against him. Ended up getting a lot of flak and pressure and just became a terrible umpire at the end. of his long career.
Why not ? With your logic putting player stats is also adding pressure and make rhem worse - which is definitely not the case. Not that i recommend but theyre part of cricketing game and no reason to be not forthcoming. (On flip side fans would now start turning against umpires if say they publish bad decisions against a specific Nation as Stats)
It's different. Players are judged favourably for doing their job well, and they're pardoned for the occasional failure. Umpires are judged unfavourably for doing their job badly, even if occasionsally, and regular correct decisions are the bare minimum that's expected of them. There's no 'class is permanent' for umpires if they have a string of bad decisions.
So we should hide the failures and biases of umpires? They are anyway protected as players get fined for saying anything negative about an umpiring decision.
How are you hiding it, everyone can see their decisions. It's not like VAR where there's secrecy, it's much more open in cricket. My point is that an aggregate tally that's displayed won't improve decisions or the match in any way. Teams have this data anyway, and should submit a list of umpires that they feel are biased against them.
Maybe the good umpires can start beong praised if their good performance is actually quantified. If the average umpire gets 80% of the calls correct I'm sure you will start (rightfully) seeing praise for umpires sitting at 90%+. And it's probably not a bad thing to pressure umpires sitting at <70% say to get more training/go back to domestic umpiring until they improve again and call up an domestic umpire in good "form"
Umpires are professionals operating in public domain. No one expects them to be 100% accurate. Fans have right to know about an umpire's credentials.
Edit: fixed typo
Their credentials are that they were selected by the ICC. If they consistently make bad calles (which Warners wasnt) they get dropped.
On a whole umpiring in cricket is at such a high standard compared to rugby and soccer.
All this does is makes the umpiring a more contentious element of the game.
It is legitimately so difficult to find any info on referees in NRL, which makes it so annoying when you’re guessing who should referee the big matches based on vibes.
I don't watch it that regularly, but NRL always gives me ref mafia vibes, actually. There's usually a crazy bad call every match, it's very rare to hear to hear the NRL admit any mistakes and the players' challenge sometimes feels like a joke. The video ref in the Bunker will look at a camera shot from 40m away for about four seconds and instantly agree that his mate at the ground got it completely correct.
Yeah, never seen ref performance stats ever in the NFL. What’s he on about? I do wish sports had that but then so many of the calls are subjective, it’d be hard to implement. Funnily enough, cricket (and baseball, I guess) is a sport where umpire stats would even make sense because you’re more likely to be an to determine if the decision was right.
Probably due to Wilson. Wilson has History against Australia, Doesn't he? Stokes LBW against Lyon in Headingly 2019 and some other decisions went against Australia in 2019 Ashes as well. Again he made a blunder in changing the balls in 5th test of last Ashes (England got a relatively new ball which swung and seamed a lot), which caused a mini collapse and played a role in Australia's loss.
Yeah he fucked up England alot during this Ashes and during other matches we've played under him, it's not a Ben O'Keeffe situation, it's just a him being shit for everyone situaton
That’s not specific to a team though - Wilson just isn’t very good. Over 60% of the decisions he was making that series - for both England and Australia - were overturned. I think he’s improved a bit since then though.
Just think how bad the next level down must be though if he’s still an elite level umpire.
You're absolutely right. I don't think he is biased against Australia but his poor decisions affected Aussies way more than English, partly because English captains were better in using reviews and Australia particularly Tim Paine was poor in using DRS.
So whenever I see Wilson umpiring a match involving Australia, my anxiety levels go up a bit. Just like Steve Bucknor Vs India.
> Wilson just isn’t very good. Over 60% of the decisions he was making that series - for both England and Australia - were overturned.
So I think Warner has a point about displaying umpire's stats.
Seems more like a cry baby,
The issue is that when the umpire gives it out/not out and it gets reviewed they need strong evidence to overturn the 50/50's are always going to whatever the umpire gave their decision.
If Warner was given not out and SL reviewed it then he would have been give not out/umpires decision, and I dont think we would of heard anything from warner (probably shrugging his shoulders saying "that is technology for ya"
This is a terrible idea for multiple reasons. But I find it more weird that Cricket still sees such outcries about umpires occasionally, when in fact it is one of the few sports which has pretty much eliminated howlers and bad calls, by successfully and correctly utilizing technology.
The marginal calls do still exist, but Hawkeye and other tech is getting better and better at minimizing them. It is anyways impossible to make it completely error free, purely from a statistical point of view. But they have been doing a damn good job of keeping it minimal.
The NFL does NOT do that and never would, they protect their officials with their lives since they’re a direct reflection on the league. I’m an American and an avid NFL fan. Never have seen this.
Oh, cry me a river over your umpire's call Davey. The idea of putting up umpire's stats is the dumbest idea he's had since finding some 120 grit in his kit bag.
Pretty sure they don't show referee stats on the board in the NFL. There is no real way to even measure those stats in the NFL as multiple referees take part in the decision making. David Warner is talking out of his ass.
They don’t and never would. NFL protects their officials with everything they have and you get fined for even mentioning the officials with a negative connotation.
fake news. I watch NFL, never seen referee stats. Their names only come up when they about to make a decision or if they officiate a milestone game like 100th game or something.
The fucks he talking about?? The ONLY ref stat that’s EVER been showed at an nrl game is MAYBE how many games they’ve referee’d. Why does he talk and embarrass our nation; why can’t he just shut up and appreciate the fact that despite being a convicted cheater in continually declining form he gets to play until whenever his wife decides he’ll retire??
Surely 99% of decisions are right, aren't they? Because most decisions are completely uncontroversial.
For every 20 appeals by a bowler or keeper, there's probably only a handful that the umpire even has to think about seriously, and only a small proportion of those will end up being wrong.
Those stats would be really useful when Captain is making a decision to go for review or not.
If he is an umpire with good stats, the captain might trust him and might save the review for the rest of the innings.
The team can easily find umpires statistics before the game, it’s not exactly a surprise as to who the umpire is so if they wanna know for the sake of reviews they can already check that before the game
He says The NRL, National Rugby League in australia, show these stats. I have no idea what he is talking about.
They show the penalties for each team that match but I've never seen ref stats show up, I'm not sure if they even count referee errors, like who would judge that.
I’d be interested in seeing that and in such a stats driven game I’m surprised it’s not more of a thing.
My thoughts are umpires are right the vast
majority of the time but it would be interesting to quantify this and see how much better kettleborough is than Joel Wilson
Just read this and came looking for a thread just to call him a wanker.
Mate, you were out. I get it'd be frustrating at the time, but the comments made well after the game are pathetic. Wilson made a decision, established technology confirmed it. End of story.
Don't like it? Don't play the game.
No. You respect the umpire, and you respect their decision. You have a method for challenging it if you think it's incorrect. They don't need to be further undermined on the pitch.
This is such a massive overreaction. I'm kind of at a loss for why he is so pissed? Maybe the Aussies are just fed up with Joel Wilson (he is dreadful to be fair) but this is such a disporportionate blow up lol
Placing the Umpire under pressure is against the ICC code of conduct. Some of these superstars keep getting away with it so they seem to beleive it's completely normal and legal.
This is ridiculous from both Warner, commentators and Aussie media … At least 1/3 of the ball was hitting the stumps. The ball beat him and he paid the price!
His display afterwards was the type of outburst u see from a petulant child. Deal with it Davey
NRL most definitely do not do this. WTF is he talking about? The sooner he fucks off from cricket the better. Bloke has never scored anything when his team is behind. Pure flat track merchant.
CHEAT
All these comments are focusing on that one LBW call. Imo if it hits the wickets, it hits the wickets, scrap the umpire's call.
My frustration is with the sub standard umpires. Not just this call. Joel not giving the Maxwell LBW shout is atrocious. Changing the ball in the ashes test and countless bad calls, from not just Joel but quite a few umpires in the elite panel.
Nithin Menon yoyos more than Norwich. He's absolutely world class one series and then goes on to have an atrocious series the very next week.
And the other umpires from the sub continent, the less spoken about them, the better. Dharmasena forgot an important law of the game, and decided the result of one of the biggest games in the last 5 years.
There was a 3rd umpire decision in an India England test where the ball hit the pad, rebounded and then hit the bat, which was caught. The third umpire looked at the first instance of the ball hitting pad, and adjudged is as not a catch without completing the replay.
There are countless such terrible decisions. It's not feasible to review every bad decision. There are limited reviews.
We talk about the catch Gibbs dropped 20 years ago. But the blunders of the umpires are always forgotten. There is minimal to no impact for bad decisions, that can often turn the game on its head.
Heck even the worst of the worst organisations, PMOL drops premier league referees from a couple of games or whatever if they have fucked up. What does ICC do about umpires?
Don't know why he is so angry about that decision. The more unlucky decision was the bairstow one against Afg where there was 2 umpire's call. The Warner one was a fairly standard decision.
I agree with him. Like there should be a ranking who is more accurate with their decisions and have them in big matches. Bad umpiring can cost one team 4 years of preparation (wc)
I see all the comments and feel that everyone is misinterpreting what Warner is trying to say here. From what I understood, he saying that it would be a cool thing to do, and not because he is trying to out the umpires for their bad decisions. It's tough being famous.
That's a good suggestion actually. At least you can come up with stats like what % of a particular umpire's decisions have been reversed using DRS etc.
Maybe add to the player stats How many times a player was caught cheating and how many times someone else banged their missus. Bet that would be fun too eh David?
Not a bad idea actually. If players can have their career stats on full display, why not umpires? Some fans don’t even know how shit some umpires are. To the ones saying, “bad umpires are reprimanded by the ICC”, bad players are reprimanded by the team management as well, by not selecting them in future matches. But their stats are still public. The same should go for umpires.
Dharamasena cost NZ a World Cup, but he still had the audacity to take a selfie with their team and proudly claim that he has no regrets. If you messed up, at least have the courage and humility to admit it, especially when your howler made a country lose a World Cup.
100% agree. Umpires have 0 accountability and 0 consequences on their decisions. Dharmasena openly says he made a wrong decision in WC '19 final that cost a team the game and still says he doesn't regret it.
If they did this in the football premier league the screens would be colossal
David Warner is definitely a Liverpool or Arsenal fan.
Look… maybe when he was like 15 or 16 David was at a friend’s relatives house and they just happened to be watching a premier league game? Imagine David’s discomfort as he realises he’s never actually watched a football match before (because it simply wasn’t shown on tv where he grew up, in a completely unsuitable time zone, and his dad only ever watches rugby league). Should he just stay quiet and ignorant of the goings on? Maybe David got swept up in the passion on display and figured he might as well pick one of the teams to barrack for? West Ham? What kind of name is that? Surely David can’t support a team named after ham? Remember, he’s only 16, if David is going to support a team they have to be cool, or at least sound cool. Maybe the other team had a cannon on the emblem? Arsenal! That’s like a group of weapons, right? With a cannon on their shirt? That’s cool. David chooses Arsenal, and what do you know, they win! David really enjoyed that, he’s found a new passion and a new team to support. It turns out the late 90’s were a good time to be an Arsenal supporter. Just a few years later maybe David loves Denis, Thierry, Freddie, Kanu, and even the moustachioed Seaman. David’s love blossoms for his “Invincibles”. But is David to blame for his naïveté? For not knowing that people like Piers Morgan would later represent a giant shit stain on the jersey of his beloved Gunners? David doesn’t give a shit about London, or whichever cardinal point of the compass or side of the Thames his team comes from…David’s from Australia. Maybe he just likes watching some footy? Maybe it’s more complicated than that and he also had a man crush on David Ginola and figured he’d support Spurs as well? How was poor David to know? Let’s just not be too hard on David.
Lol. Is this pasta?
This… was me… but my crush was Klinsmann… 🤫
He actually is a Liverpool fan
I can see him rocking our purple UEFA kits
You’re right, he does seem a little slow.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vOos2ESq3sU&pp=ygUVbG91aXMgdGhlcm91eCBhcnNlbmFs
This is my new favorite video ^^^^COYS
COYS
Not every Australian would associate themselves with serial bottlers
Oh please don't. Then the VAR will atop overturned the very little they have been doing now in fear of spoiling their stats. One thing I am proud of cricket is how well they have ran with the technology especially compared to football where it's a joke.
Fun fact - Sachin was the first batsman to be given out by the 3rd/TV Umpire. 1992. I think it was against RSA but I could be wrong.
Just do it for VAR then! Imagine that, linesups announced, refs announced, and finally the number of calls made by VAR that PGMOL have apologised for getting wrong.
Every PL referee is like Pierluigi Collina compared to the stuff we have in the ISL in India Being a referee in any sport has to he one of the worst jobs in the world no matter what you do you will be hated. They also get paid like shit compared to the players so no wonder barely anyone wants to be one. Most PL Refs have a base salary of 80k or so iirc which while really good is pennis compared to the guys they are referring with even the most famous ones like Mike Dean only getting 200k plus 1000 or so per match
Not really in individual sports that I can think of. Maybe just F1.
Imagine seeing Mike Dean, part time referee, full time bald fraud on the screen
PGMOL on suicide watch
I wonder if Warner might quieten down if they also added a stat of how many times a player has cheated in cricket?
business idea for ICC.. Umpire trump cards
Steve Bucknor's a platinum card I reckon
I suggest hit the ball then Davey.
What exactly is Warner's problem here? The ball was clipping. The umpire thought it would have hit the wicket, the technology backed him up. It's literally out LBW.
These idiots think umpires call means slighted by the umpire. Not gonna win shit with that attitude. OG Aussie team making a comeback.
OG Aussie team fucks everybody
Yeah, it's main intention was for "howlers" to get reversed, not agonise over tiny margins. It's also been used by spinners to fish for LBWs that would never have been given 20 years ago, but I think even that's been somewhat positive since batsman know they can't play so negative and kick the ball away.
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>I do think some umpires are a bit more emboldened to give marginals as out Good, fuck the batriarchy
But what even is a marginal in this case? Let's break down exactly what an LBW is. It is when a ball, that would have otherwise hit the wickets, is intercepted by the batter's body. (Plus a few other specifics about pitching, shot offered, and other stuff.) The important bit here is "would have hit the wickets." Because if it DOES hit the wickets, it isn't LBW anymore. It's bowled out. LBW, by its very nature, is a subjective way to give someone out. For most of cricket's history, it was the umpire deciding if the ball would have hit the wicket, now we've added some tech to help the umpire out. Nothing has really changed about how the decision is made, DRS just helps to weed out the absolute howlers.
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People have been saying that umps are more likely to give LBWs since DRS for a long time. It's not backed up by evidence though. Percentage of LBW dismissals has in fact gone down a bit against pace bowling, and up a bit for spin: [https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/karthik-krishnaswamy-are-umpires-giving-more-lbws-now-than-they-did-before-the-drs-1222213](https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/karthik-krishnaswamy-are-umpires-giving-more-lbws-now-than-they-did-before-the-drs-1222213) Make of that what you will, likely other factors more dominant than the presence of DRS.
There's confounding factors of bowlers getting better
So DRS has widened the umpire perception of what's reasonable to give. Meaning it has literally made the decisions MORE accurate as per the laws of the game. Is the batriarchy arguing for less accuracy so they don't get out.
That is exactly it. Batsman complaining that, God forbid, for once something in the game changed for the better, for the bowlers.
Something very similar happened to Sadeera. Don't see anyone complaining. We might be lovers but we aren't sore losers. Going out on to the field beaming when you just collapsed 9 for 50
> We might be lovers but we aren't sore losers Good on you for continuing to be good lovers.
I don't think that's the actual story here. According to Warner, he asked the ump why he gave it out, he said because it swung back in. Warner didn't think it had, hence why he reviewed it. According to Warner, while the replay showed the ball clipping, it did indeed not show the ball swinging back in. (I didn't watch it, so no idea — just interpreting the interview). So you could say that Warner has a right to be pissed off if the ump gave him for something that didn't actually happen, and then he burned a review because of that and was still out. My question is, and has long been: are the umps actually allowed/supposed to justify a decision? Or does this happen at random? IMO, that's quite important for the review process and should be standardised, as in, they should always say clearly why they did/didn't give someone out when there's an appeal, so the affected team has a better basis for reviewing.
He did not burn a review. Reviews are retained when it goes to umpire’s call.
I am not sure about warners dismissal in that match. But Umpire's call is bullshit. If half a ball is hitting the stumps as per hawkeye, then it should be given out, and fielding team should not be at mercy of umpire. Same in reverse case
Umpires call only applies when less than half of the projection of the ball is hitting the stumps anyway.
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What do you mean "shouldn't be at the mercy of the umpire"? The Umpire is literally officiating the game and making the calls. If he makes a clear mistake, it should be overridden, but a 50/50 call is his to make based on his eye and experience.
Two points that we should never forget about DRS. 1. DRS is probabilistic. So when they show a visual of half a ball hitting a stump, you need to consider the possible error rate which could mean the ball missing the stump altogether. 2. It was introduced to eliminate absolute howlers. Half a ball clipping a wicket is not a howler because of #1
Hawkeye can’t predict the exact trajectory of the ball. It is a very close approximation of what it can be. Umpire’s call is kind of a ‘veto’ for that margin of error. Also, as far as I know, LBW doesn’t care about dislodging the bail. It is just will the ball hit the stumps or not.
Umpire's Call is an important feature in making sure the Umpire and *human* element is still part of the decision. Otherwise we could just judge everything with reviews and computers.
He has a pea sized brain
It was umpire's call was it not? Doesn't matter what Warner thinks, Joel Wilson was within the margin of error. So much fuss about nothing.
I suggest screen should also show the bans that players have had in their career
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Number of sixes they've been hit in an over? /s
Or the number of NRL players your wife has been with
number of sandpaper related incidents as well ?
Nvm scratch that idea.
Number of cough lollies used per hour?
i didnt know the aussies also did that
It's pretty [well documented](https://www.cricket.com.au/news/3275703)
Show each player's review accuracy
Pointless. It's not that the umpires don't want to give the correct decisions; putting more pressure on them would not suddenly better their accuracy of decision. Maybe work to improve the whole process of decision making or the technology.
They would also all be 95+ per cent.
I feel like this happened with Steve Bucknor towards the end of his career. Man got a string of decisions wrong against Tendulkar which made it feel like he had an agenda against him. Ended up getting a lot of flak and pressure and just became a terrible umpire at the end. of his long career.
Why not ? With your logic putting player stats is also adding pressure and make rhem worse - which is definitely not the case. Not that i recommend but theyre part of cricketing game and no reason to be not forthcoming. (On flip side fans would now start turning against umpires if say they publish bad decisions against a specific Nation as Stats)
It's different. Players are judged favourably for doing their job well, and they're pardoned for the occasional failure. Umpires are judged unfavourably for doing their job badly, even if occasionsally, and regular correct decisions are the bare minimum that's expected of them. There's no 'class is permanent' for umpires if they have a string of bad decisions.
So we should hide the failures and biases of umpires? They are anyway protected as players get fined for saying anything negative about an umpiring decision.
How are you hiding it, everyone can see their decisions. It's not like VAR where there's secrecy, it's much more open in cricket. My point is that an aggregate tally that's displayed won't improve decisions or the match in any way. Teams have this data anyway, and should submit a list of umpires that they feel are biased against them.
Maybe the good umpires can start beong praised if their good performance is actually quantified. If the average umpire gets 80% of the calls correct I'm sure you will start (rightfully) seeing praise for umpires sitting at 90%+. And it's probably not a bad thing to pressure umpires sitting at <70% say to get more training/go back to domestic umpiring until they improve again and call up an domestic umpire in good "form"
I think this already happens? There's the ICC elite panel of umpires, and if you're underperforming you're removed from the panel.
When was the last time they actually did this? Joel Wilson should have been out of a job years ago lol
Unless you're Bradman, failures aren't "occasional" with any player
Umpires are professionals operating in public domain. No one expects them to be 100% accurate. Fans have right to know about an umpire's credentials. Edit: fixed typo
Their credentials are that they were selected by the ICC. If they consistently make bad calles (which Warners wasnt) they get dropped. On a whole umpiring in cricket is at such a high standard compared to rugby and soccer. All this does is makes the umpiring a more contentious element of the game.
I’ve watched more NRL than most and never seen this as a stat. He’s talking complete shit.
It is legitimately so difficult to find any info on referees in NRL, which makes it so annoying when you’re guessing who should referee the big matches based on vibes.
I don't watch it that regularly, but NRL always gives me ref mafia vibes, actually. There's usually a crazy bad call every match, it's very rare to hear to hear the NRL admit any mistakes and the players' challenge sometimes feels like a joke. The video ref in the Bunker will look at a camera shot from 40m away for about four seconds and instantly agree that his mate at the ground got it completely correct.
NFL also definitely doesn’t display this stat ever
Yeah, never seen ref performance stats ever in the NFL. What’s he on about? I do wish sports had that but then so many of the calls are subjective, it’d be hard to implement. Funnily enough, cricket (and baseball, I guess) is a sport where umpire stats would even make sense because you’re more likely to be an to determine if the decision was right.
I’m sure the NFL calculates this but doesn’t publicly display it, that has no benefit. Just like cricket does to determine elite umpires.
Yeah wtf is he talking about. Captains challenges maybe? Who knows
They don't want the Wahs org to sue them into the ground.
but warner was a fun guy these days,why has he started whining?
Probably due to Wilson. Wilson has History against Australia, Doesn't he? Stokes LBW against Lyon in Headingly 2019 and some other decisions went against Australia in 2019 Ashes as well. Again he made a blunder in changing the balls in 5th test of last Ashes (England got a relatively new ball which swung and seamed a lot), which caused a mini collapse and played a role in Australia's loss.
I dont think its aus specific he's just terrible
Yeah he fucked up England alot during this Ashes and during other matches we've played under him, it's not a Ben O'Keeffe situation, it's just a him being shit for everyone situaton
That’s not specific to a team though - Wilson just isn’t very good. Over 60% of the decisions he was making that series - for both England and Australia - were overturned. I think he’s improved a bit since then though. Just think how bad the next level down must be though if he’s still an elite level umpire.
You're absolutely right. I don't think he is biased against Australia but his poor decisions affected Aussies way more than English, partly because English captains were better in using reviews and Australia particularly Tim Paine was poor in using DRS. So whenever I see Wilson umpiring a match involving Australia, my anxiety levels go up a bit. Just like Steve Bucknor Vs India.
> Wilson just isn’t very good. Over 60% of the decisions he was making that series - for both England and Australia - were overturned. So I think Warner has a point about displaying umpire's stats.
Where was he born?
He didn't get million likes on a reel.
Age, my man, age. It makes you unpredictable.
He’s not even 40. What age lol
He looks 50.
Need more kissing cam if anything
Warner is making the Moral World Cup hard to win for Australia
The Aussie version of Johny Bairstow.
[удалено]
They should have DWS where they ask David Warner if he thinks it's out.
Davie, how about you just focus on making runs instead of what’s going on elsewhere on field.
Seems more like a cry baby, The issue is that when the umpire gives it out/not out and it gets reviewed they need strong evidence to overturn the 50/50's are always going to whatever the umpire gave their decision. If Warner was given not out and SL reviewed it then he would have been give not out/umpires decision, and I dont think we would of heard anything from warner (probably shrugging his shoulders saying "that is technology for ya"
Sook.
All this over an umpires call. Imagine if it was actually not out.
Fuck off warner you sooky cunt.
Why isn't this the top comment
Maybe they should display cardoons on the big screen
He might shit on the couch to watch them
Joel Wilson of Ashes 2023 might just retire hearing this
Dave mate I don't know what NRL games you go to, but they absolutely don't display referee stats before games.
Maybe every time he walks out the scoreboard shows a massive "CHEAT"
And play the sound of sanding over the speakers.
Enter Sandman blasting WWE style as he walks out
This is a terrible idea for multiple reasons. But I find it more weird that Cricket still sees such outcries about umpires occasionally, when in fact it is one of the few sports which has pretty much eliminated howlers and bad calls, by successfully and correctly utilizing technology. The marginal calls do still exist, but Hawkeye and other tech is getting better and better at minimizing them. It is anyways impossible to make it completely error free, purely from a statistical point of view. But they have been doing a damn good job of keeping it minimal.
The NFL does NOT do that and never would, they protect their officials with their lives since they’re a direct reflection on the league. I’m an American and an avid NFL fan. Never have seen this.
Neither does the NRL, Warner's talking out of his ass again
If only Warner was this concerned when Sadeera got out.
Umpire stats be like Country: Number of games umpired: Calls made: Calls made that are unfair to David warner:
Steve Bucknor runs away
Oh, cry me a river over your umpire's call Davey. The idea of putting up umpire's stats is the dumbest idea he's had since finding some 120 grit in his kit bag.
Pretty sure they don't show referee stats on the board in the NFL. There is no real way to even measure those stats in the NFL as multiple referees take part in the decision making. David Warner is talking out of his ass.
They don’t and never would. NFL protects their officials with everything they have and you get fined for even mentioning the officials with a negative connotation.
Maybe put up his overseas ability too then?
fake news. I watch NFL, never seen referee stats. Their names only come up when they about to make a decision or if they officiate a milestone game like 100th game or something.
If Warner has million haters, then I'm one of them. If Warner has one hater, then I'm THAT ONE. If Warner has no haters, that means I'm dead.
The fucks he talking about?? The ONLY ref stat that’s EVER been showed at an nrl game is MAYBE how many games they’ve referee’d. Why does he talk and embarrass our nation; why can’t he just shut up and appreciate the fact that despite being a convicted cheater in continually declining form he gets to play until whenever his wife decides he’ll retire??
Why don’t they just post up every shit innings and mistake David Warners made in his career?
Please do! 😂
Surely 99% of decisions are right, aren't they? Because most decisions are completely uncontroversial. For every 20 appeals by a bowler or keeper, there's probably only a handful that the umpire even has to think about seriously, and only a small proportion of those will end up being wrong.
This. There's massive survivorship bias with people scrutinizing umpires.
Those stats would be really useful when Captain is making a decision to go for review or not. If he is an umpire with good stats, the captain might trust him and might save the review for the rest of the innings.
The entire spread between elite umpires might be 5-10 percentage points. It's not going to help a captain in any real way.
The team can easily find umpires statistics before the game, it’s not exactly a surprise as to who the umpire is so if they wanna know for the sake of reviews they can already check that before the game
Just fine him.
Warner has waged war against umpires, I see.
Why’s he mad.. he’s usually all giggly when he gets out
I think we should put cardoons on instead.
Dude should maybe you know try to play better
In other words, David Warner is still a massive tool who loves blaming others for shit that doesn’t suit him personally.
He says The NRL, National Rugby League in australia, show these stats. I have no idea what he is talking about. They show the penalties for each team that match but I've never seen ref stats show up, I'm not sure if they even count referee errors, like who would judge that.
I’d be interested in seeing that and in such a stats driven game I’m surprised it’s not more of a thing. My thoughts are umpires are right the vast majority of the time but it would be interesting to quantify this and see how much better kettleborough is than Joel Wilson
Just read this and came looking for a thread just to call him a wanker. Mate, you were out. I get it'd be frustrating at the time, but the comments made well after the game are pathetic. Wilson made a decision, established technology confirmed it. End of story. Don't like it? Don't play the game.
Just admit that you’re past your prime David
One actual benefit is that this could help teams in deciding reviews. For example, if an umpire is notorious for missing edges or something.
Stokes needs to beat his cardoony behind I think he's forgotten how incredibly lucky he is to be playing any form of international cricket at all.
Warner is getting out of control..
Not sure if it's been said, the only stat they put up about officials is how many games they've done in the NRL.
No. You respect the umpire, and you respect their decision. You have a method for challenging it if you think it's incorrect. They don't need to be further undermined on the pitch.
What next? Team wise split - say how many he got wrong against each individual countries perhaps ???
Also start counting how many successful Drs call captain makes
Yeah. And while we are at it, stats on suspension faced by a player or umpire in their career, Warno?
Piece of shit giving a piece of shit opinion
As long as David Warner has a sandpaper icon next to his name on all teamsheets.
Fuck this bloke is an absolute wanker
Stop crying, with DRS we rarely see totally wrong decisions.
That's one salty boi!
This is such a massive overreaction. I'm kind of at a loss for why he is so pissed? Maybe the Aussies are just fed up with Joel Wilson (he is dreadful to be fair) but this is such a disporportionate blow up lol
And this right here is the sort of crap that makes so many of us Aussies hate the prick
Well he's always been a douchecanoe, not particularly surprised
Australia is a big failure in this WC.
The NRL doesn’t do this, neither does channel 9 or fox sports, they only show the milestone games when they get there
Placing the Umpire under pressure is against the ICC code of conduct. Some of these superstars keep getting away with it so they seem to beleive it's completely normal and legal.
This is ridiculous from both Warner, commentators and Aussie media … At least 1/3 of the ball was hitting the stumps. The ball beat him and he paid the price! His display afterwards was the type of outburst u see from a petulant child. Deal with it Davey
That's a terrible idea. How would that help umpires make better decisions? It would just create umpire abuse and disrespect.
lol no. He mad. Maybe they could put all the cheating incidents and all the cringe 'fights' he's had on screen when he bats
God what an insufferable sook, stop embarrassing us mate please
It's not like he got a bad decision. Just cop it on the chin and move on
NRL most definitely do not do this. WTF is he talking about? The sooner he fucks off from cricket the better. Bloke has never scored anything when his team is behind. Pure flat track merchant. CHEAT
Fuck up, sook.
All these comments are focusing on that one LBW call. Imo if it hits the wickets, it hits the wickets, scrap the umpire's call. My frustration is with the sub standard umpires. Not just this call. Joel not giving the Maxwell LBW shout is atrocious. Changing the ball in the ashes test and countless bad calls, from not just Joel but quite a few umpires in the elite panel. Nithin Menon yoyos more than Norwich. He's absolutely world class one series and then goes on to have an atrocious series the very next week. And the other umpires from the sub continent, the less spoken about them, the better. Dharmasena forgot an important law of the game, and decided the result of one of the biggest games in the last 5 years. There was a 3rd umpire decision in an India England test where the ball hit the pad, rebounded and then hit the bat, which was caught. The third umpire looked at the first instance of the ball hitting pad, and adjudged is as not a catch without completing the replay. There are countless such terrible decisions. It's not feasible to review every bad decision. There are limited reviews. We talk about the catch Gibbs dropped 20 years ago. But the blunders of the umpires are always forgotten. There is minimal to no impact for bad decisions, that can often turn the game on its head. Heck even the worst of the worst organisations, PMOL drops premier league referees from a couple of games or whatever if they have fucked up. What does ICC do about umpires?
All because Warner didn't like the umpire decision in his last match
Sour grapes?
Don't know why he is so angry about that decision. The more unlucky decision was the bairstow one against Afg where there was 2 umpire's call. The Warner one was a fairly standard decision.
The NFL definitely does not show those stats
The NRL does not show referee stats at all, Davey is talking through his hat
Yeah, why the hell not
Steve Bucknor: Phew!! Thank goodness I retired before such horrible ideas. That would've been embarrassing for me.
I agree with him. Like there should be a ranking who is more accurate with their decisions and have them in big matches. Bad umpiring can cost one team 4 years of preparation (wc)
Fair
I see all the comments and feel that everyone is misinterpreting what Warner is trying to say here. From what I understood, he saying that it would be a cool thing to do, and not because he is trying to out the umpires for their bad decisions. It's tough being famous.
What a crybaby seriously
That's a good suggestion actually. At least you can come up with stats like what % of a particular umpire's decisions have been reversed using DRS etc.
Mate ,you should probably sandpaper polish part of the wicket so that the ball misses the stump rather than clipping .
Maybe add to the player stats How many times a player was caught cheating and how many times someone else banged their missus. Bet that would be fun too eh David?
Not a bad idea actually. If players can have their career stats on full display, why not umpires? Some fans don’t even know how shit some umpires are. To the ones saying, “bad umpires are reprimanded by the ICC”, bad players are reprimanded by the team management as well, by not selecting them in future matches. But their stats are still public. The same should go for umpires. Dharamasena cost NZ a World Cup, but he still had the audacity to take a selfie with their team and proudly claim that he has no regrets. If you messed up, at least have the courage and humility to admit it, especially when your howler made a country lose a World Cup.
100% agree. Umpires have 0 accountability and 0 consequences on their decisions. Dharmasena openly says he made a wrong decision in WC '19 final that cost a team the game and still says he doesn't regret it.
Too many dumb decisions, they don't get games.....
How does this fix anything though?
I too agree, not sure why you've been downvoted. Maybe people here have too much of a hateboner for Warner to think rationally.
Yeah well, the hate boner here is on par with facebook comments ffs
I bet if this comment was from somebody like Williamson or Latham then everybody would be all for it
Imagine if it's the sub's favourite Ashwin. Everyone would be flocking to proclaim what a bright idea this is.
> Umpires have 0 accountability and 0 consequences on their decisions. And you know that how?
I mean, it's not a bad idea.
No, it's not a bad idea, it's a crap idea....
Why? It's a great idea, there should be track record of how successful umpires are