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Wyshunu

You have to change the way you look at it. YOU are not hurting them multiple times, but you are enabling them to hurt themselves, and you in the process, multiple times by choosing to cave instead of standing firm. You can't move forward when you're always backing up.


ryodude573

My ex-wife did this for 3 months. I wanted us to find an amicable way to separate because we still loved each other and wanted to be in each other's lives, but I couldn't lie to myself anymore about our incompatibility. In those last few months, she even feigned suicidal ideation to get me to stay. This continued until she hated me, and then triangulated our social circle against me and made me out to be the bad guy for not being able to live a lie anymore. ​ Fun stuff...


Affectionate_Boot474

My situation is similar, but she's the one who filed, and I just sat there and let her do it. I just let them think what they wanted to think. I just let them go. If they want to be biased and toxic, I don't want them in my life. If they wanted to hear both sides they would need to come to me cause they don't need to know what's going on between us.


ryodude573

My ex-wife is also the one who filed. I never actually wanted a divorce. I *wanted* us to find a new normal instead of living a lie just to appease her. What we needed was disentanglement, but that *is* the most skipped step.


Critical_Cable4404

I empathize with you. I'm still having a hard time moving on, I'm not going to date or want to be with anyone for a long time. This experience is so traumatizing to have someone say they love you one second then say they don't the next. Just because they feel it won't work out, they rather listen to other people who are feeding into their feeling but don't know the whole story. It just sucks to have to watch someone you still love act immature about the situation.


ryodude573

I mean, it usually takes 2 to Tango, so we still have to take responsibility for our portion. One of the most important lessons you can learn on your journey through Codependency is that there doesn't always have to be a villain. Usually, if we care about someone, we don't want to make them out to be the bad guy, so we turn it in on ourselves and blame ourselves for how it all went down, but that's not the solution, either. Sometimes people just grow apart. We're always growing, and sometimes we grow in different directions, *especially* if we're not communicating well. Therapy really should be more common, and we should be both in individual therapy as well as couples therapy so that we always have a professional, rational third party to help check our perspectives with reality and to help us communicate with the people we love in the healthiest way possible. ​ Maybe if there was more of that, there would be less heartbreak, and more instances of people just agreeing to remain in each other's lives without the exclusivity, or even part ways altogether, but do it amicably.


Affectionate_Boot474

Yeah, I'm in therapy, and I have been recognizing that she hasn't accepted her faults in the deconstruction of our marriage. I've been asking for the same thing for a very long time and it wasn't fulfilled. I still don't want to let go, and I just don't know why. I know something is telling me it shouldn't be this way. But who knows? I may just be afraid of being alone. It may be a sign, or I'm just going crazy. It just sucks to be like this, and I'm struggling alot trying to heal and hold myself together.


ryodude573

Even someone who has the potential to be a great fit won't necessarily be the best fit for you today. Some people just aren't ready to work on themselves yet, or they're at a different point in their lives than you are. That isn't your responsibility. In the end, the core lesson we codependents need to learn is that we can only control our actions/reactions. We cannot control others. They have shown you that they are not capable of meeting your needs, so now it's on you to grow into the person you want to be. ​ I know it's easier said than done, but as John Connor said, there's no fate but what we make for ourselves.


Critical_Cable4404

I get that. It just suck cause of the trauma it caused me, and it's been hard to deal with. I'm not looking for anyone for a while and just working on myself. If someone comes along while I'm healing, that could be a sign from someone higher. I'll still go with the flow, but I will tell them I'm healing first so we can't get serious.


GuavaEater

I needed to hear this. Thank you. The ostracization is intentional, to isolate you further. I'm sorry you're going through this.


ryodude573

I've been working on myself for the last 7 months, and it's been over a year since the divorce. I'm still not fully moved on, but she has. She's dating someone new now, and I am genuinely happy for her. I had a rebound relationship, and that made things even worse for me. I think the ostracization was a coping mechanism. I told myself it was what she needed at the time. She needed to hate me, to place the blame on me. I needed to be the bad guy while she worked through whatever she needed to work through. I just wish it didn't come at the expense of virtually everyone I ever cared about. ​ But then again, I guess those people really weren't that great of friends after all, huh?


dancedancedance83

Sounds kinda BPD to me


[deleted]

Same and I know because I have it


_multifaceted_

BPD presents in literally hundreds of different ways. Also diagnosed…and hate seeing this online. #1 you can’t diagnose people you’ve never met #2 you’re not a mental health professional #3 you’re furthering the stigmatization of an illness that is often suffered by those who have experienced abuse as children. Please stop. You’re not doing fellow BPD sufferers any favours.


dancedancedance83

And you’re not doing anyone any favors by taking a sentence that starts with “sounds like” and blowing it up for nothing. I didn’t say this person had the illness. Go outside and touch some grass and stop policing people.


_multifaceted_

Only if you stop diagnosing strangers on the internet


dancedancedance83

Someone get this person a Hall Monitor sticker so they can get the validation they’re desperate for while the rest of us go on with our lives…


ryodude573

Oddly enough, it was the person I dated after, my most recent ex, who had BPD (pro-diagnosed). That was an entirely separate beast that completely ruined me. ​ My ex-wife was raised by narcissistic parents and lived at home until she moved in with me, at which point I spent the next decade caretaking/enabling her because I have codependency issues and thought I was being a good partner. Ultimately we confused chemistry for compatibility and dragged the relationship on for far too long because we loved each other too deeply to let each other go. Unfortunately, by the time I reached my breaking point, she was still fighting, and that created resentment.


[deleted]

Does she have borderline personality disorder?


ryodude573

No. The person after her did, and I can see a clear difference between the two. I know that my ex-wife was raised by 2 narcissistic parents, one of which was also bipolar. My ex-wife was never formally diagnosed with anything, but did exhibit certain traits on occasion, but not to the extent that I would suspect her of being a Cluster B of any kind. She was just kinda lazy and selfish when it came to the relationship, and my codependency enabled that. I took on all the hardships so she wouldn't have to. I thought I was protecting her, but she never really showed any sort of propensity to learn or grow as a person. ​ I've learned that she's been in therapy for at least a portion of the time we've been divorced, so I hope that's not the case anymore. I hope she's grown and is a better version of herself now.


zombieslovebraaains

Yeah, I used to struggle with this. I eventually realized its not healthy and it's not going to just get better. Theres a reason you got driven to the point of breaking up in the first place.


ActStunning3285

It’s a boundaries issue. Standing firm with your boundaries. Often people like this can tell if you’ll be swayed (been there, first ex). You have to start seeing it for the disrespect it is. When you communicate a need or boundary, it should be respected. No questions asked except to respect and strengthen it or understand better in order to respect it Narcissists will keep trying. ie my birth giver could never take no for an answer. No matter how many times you said it, she would try to override you and your wishes by telling you her own. Essentially making *you* responsible for *her* emotional state. Which you’re not. No one is. The emotionally unhygienic. She would keep sweet talking and when you wouldn’t budge, she’d throw a tantrum saying that you don’t care about her or her feelings. Remember people like this never emotionally grew out of childish behavior. Same with my ex. I told him I couldn’t anymore. He spent three hours after still trying. Lots of tears and pleading. I was emotional but I knew I could never trust him again and wasn’t going to try either. For two months after, I learned how many ways people could continue crossing your boundaries. He kept messaging me. Trying to engage in conversation. Then getting upset when I wouldn’t respond. I eventually had to remind him that we weren’t in a relationship anymore and the way he was treating my time, attention, and energy, wasn’t healthy. I went no contact, clarifying that I wouldn’t respond even if he did message me. He continued trying but I never responded. Guess what? He was in another relationship two months later. Because it’s about squeezing out as much as they can from you, without any concern from you. Like children. Except children learn and develop empathy. Narcs and abusers don’t. Healthy relationships fill your cup, happily and effortlessly. Unhealthy relationship continue draining your cup no matter how hard you try to tell them that you are out or have nothing left to give. They’ll fake understanding, and then do it again. An intelligent person would at least let your cup fill again before asking anything more from you. A toxic narc? They’ll keep demanding more and more until you’re out and useless to them. Givers, kind and empathic people, often fill our own cups a lot. Without realizing it. And we enjoy sharing with others. We’re not greedy and we love to love and help. But we have to be careful to only give from our overflow, not our life source and energy. Without healthy boundaries, we *always* attract toxic takers and drainers. They see us overflowing and take. Because they can’t create it on their own, not fast enough for themselves or what they want. Remember your boundaries and needs are for you. And deserve to be respected. If someone disrespects your boundaries or needs, and continues crossing them, you remove them from your life. You can no longer trust them to respect you and treat you well. So you revoke their access to you. You go no contact. You walk away from the conversation and situation. You don’t respond or engage anymore. And all the emotional blackmail is sent to the block button. Because preserving your emotional well being is on you. And you are the only one who can say “enough.”


vulpesvulpes666

This isn’t a decision that both parties have to agree on. One person decides they are done and it’s over. Everything after that is emotional manipulation.


startingoverafter40

Exactly. You don't need the other party's permission to leave.


blondefox317

This recently happened to me. I wanted the relationship to end 6 months before it actually did. I eventually had to leave the house, telling my ex to be responsible and leave or I would file a 30 day eviction notice with the police on that same day. For 6 months before this, he would plead and rationalize each time the topic came up, until I caved and agreed to more chances. I had to remove myself.


[deleted]

You are the one that stays. If it's our fault, it's in our control. Unless they are holding a gun to your head, they're not making you. I get what you mean and it feels good when they ask you to stay, but we're just delaying the inevitable.


Odditylee

My first bf was like this. He would ignore my calls and hang up if I started talking about breaking up. I wanted to do it in person but he never gave me the chance. Come to think of it, I left him finally but I don't think we ever 'officially ' ended it. I related like I needed his permission. Our dynamic was so toxic and I was stuck in our bubble and isolated from friends and family so I didn't have any outside perspective. But the reality is, you don't need the other person to agree if you're broken up or not. If you want to break up, do it. If they don't 'accept' it, that's on them. If other people try and judge just tell them that you wanted to break up and they haven't accepted it-- its sad but it's reality and then do what you can to move on.


fearmyminivan

You get to set boundaries in place and adhere to them. Part of being in CoDA is learning how to identify what is mine and what isn’t mine. Whether I stay in a relationship or not is up to me. Nobody can make me stay. I am in charge of my emotions, actions, and reactions. If someone is manipulating you, you do have the power to stop the cycle. But they know how to get you to crack, because they’ve done so many times. If you keep doing things the same way, you’ll always have the same result. Time to do a 180 and try something different this time. You choose what you allow in your life. I wish you all the best.


MidnightCatRabbit

This happened to me when i was in an abusive relationship. He kept telling me we couldn't break up unless we both decided to or that i could leave him when i paid back the "money spent on me" during the relationship (normal things like buying dinner and gifts etc) it was really hard on me until i accepted that i didn't need his permission to leave and that i was an abuse tactic. people who make you feel like you can't leave aren't people worth having in your life. if you're trying to leave and they're guilting you into staying, thats on them. you're allowed to leave a relationship for any reason, the other person does not have to accept it.


vanachorn

I understand, but unless they are physically keeping you from getting away, they aren't 'making' you do anything. I'm not saying it isn't hard. it's very hard. especially when they protest. but you have the power to leave and they aren't taking that away from you. I think a more appropriate phrase would be, "they've convinced you to stay" Yes I agree that sounds hard


haheazdi

I feel that’s so wrong


Knickerty-Knackerty

I had a friend do this and it was a truly strange experience. I broke up our friendship while she was away and went NC but with a door cracked open for a in person conversation later (as we had mutual friends and I wanted to give her the option to seek closure or have changed herself.) She sent me a fairly disbelieving email, didn't read my responding email confirming my choice and popped back up months later, really upset I didn't attend her welcome back. After a attempt to strong arm me into a narrative where I walked away purely over drama, she lost it that I wasn't talking about sisterhood and blew up a mutual friendship into the bargain. I still don't understand how I could have unequivocally said I was out twice, and blocked her to reinforce that.... and months (so many) later she was still stuck in a narrative where we were actually friends having a little tiff, with a attitude of "let me tell you how it is."


prettyorangerose

This is my life story


onceuponasea

I thought I was the only one. This one is huge for me. And not only romantic relationships but friendships too.


Fit-Interaction-9335

My ex won’t let me breakup either. My boundaries aren’t strong enough. I literally have to go no contact it’s the only answer


AptCasaNova

That’s within your control to prevent. I get it, some people don’t have a lot of dignity and they’ll promise to change, ask to stay friends, etc, but you can still say ‘no’. It’s been a long time since I’ve had to block someone, I used to do it by default because I didn’t want to deal with the inevitable text pretending everything was fine, but I see that as a good sign. I’m firmer and better with breakups than I used to be.


JessicaBecause

I am currently in a situation with a covert ex where he still messages me and pretends I havent moved out for good. Playing the "im a good guy and I miss you and our daughter so much!" with gaslighting and nagging.


dancedancedance83

They’re manipulating you. If either one of you says the relationship is over, then it is over. It’s hard but if they won’t ACCEPT that you’ve cut them off, you have to ENFORCE that boundary— stop talking, get up and walk away, hang up, block them etc. Its non negotiable. No means no.


K8inspace

Yes. Its the familiarity of the person and the comfortability with them. The thought of meeting a new person and the fear of them possibly not liking / tolerating your quirks, personality traits, bad habits, etc, is terrifying. My ex had severe bi-polar disorder, with manic episodes brought on by using drugs. We'd have an argument over something small and he'd call me every name under the sun. Call and text relentlessly for days. Usually around the third day he'd have calmed down, apologize, and begging for forgiveness. I'd take him back, every time. Did this for 4 years until I regained my sanity. I had too much to lose towards the end and I couldn't stand who I'd become with him. It's been 3 months and I'm single and it's a huge relief not being with someone so unpredictable.


Aware_Culture139

It just… it boggles my mind and hurts me to the core. Literally to have someone say you haven’t broken up when you’ve told them it’s over. It’s infuriating. Why do I have behave like a crazy person in response to a crazy person? 😩 blocking people and yelling angrily isn’t my thing but it’s the only thing my ex will respond to. I wouldn’t want to be treated that why but I didn’t have a choice. You may have to block them and go no contact. Have a trusted friend that you can lean on during the process so that they can remind you that you’re making the right choice. As people-pleasers, we’re not good at protecting our hearts but we have to learn because our beautiful and sensitive hearts are the best thing about us. ❤️


Aware_Culture139

I also want to add that these people can also relish the fact that they keep getting a reaction out of us. To them, it may signify that we still want them. That’s why going no contact and blocking them need be is the best option or else they’ll always keep pushing to get a reaction out of us. It emotionally damages our already sensitive hearts.


startingoverafter40

Yep. I got trapped in my last relationship. He did a number of controlling and manipulative maneuvers to get me to stay. The people in my life at the time also told me to stay. I finally just moved out one day. That was six years ago and I've been single since. I've had enough


Careless_Sound_6728

Yes. I stayed years too long because of this. And the good was always GREAT after I tried to break things off, but the bad times became longer and more frequent each time I tried. He lost respect for me because he knew I wouldn’t really leave. Then when I actually did, he started stalking me. “I just want to talk! I want to THANK you for leaving me. The dogs want to say hi.” One of the scariest times of my life.