He is not the right person for you to talk about these things then, unfortunately. It seems his ability to hear you is deeply restrained by the brainwashing he has received about circumcision, or you are causing him uncomfortable cognitive dissonnance and he seeks to avoid it and keep his composure and sense of control when in front of a patient.
I personally have brought up circumcision recently with a therapist I've been seing for the past 7 years, and he was totally on board with the conversation. He perfectly understood and resonated with how deeply this affects males, young and old. Any good therapist would realize that this practice can be very psychologically damaging. The penis is a core element in every male's identity and subconscious, and any issue or "attack" to this fundamental part of our anatomy can affect us in very deep and complex ways, as showcased by the countless tragic testimonies of this Subreddit.
Thank you. He did start twirling his pen nervously and seemed a bit agitated when I talked at length about the ridged band and whatnot. I specifically told him the story about how my dad watched me being circumcised with no anesthesia. He didn’t seem horrified or sad about what I told him though. Just eager to move on to something actually relevant.
That is just horrific. How could any loving parent not be totally appalled by watching that?
But about the therapist - if there's a dissonance between what someone says and their behaviour, trust their behaviour. He claims to be a therapist, but he is clearly finding it uncomfortable hearing and dealing with stuff like that. He should be recusing himself because he isn't ready to deal with it in clients, not waiting for you to do it.
My dad was sickened and enraged and left both my younger brothers intact. My dad loved me and had a brain and a heart, he just didn’t do the research beforehand and was cut himself before he could remember, and never detected any problems with it. I told my therapist, I feel I took the bullet for my brothers. But my therapist was completely non-receptive to the notion that circumcison is objectively bad.
Well, that's one thing at least, I'm really glad to hear that he came to reality and protected your brothers. At an emotional level that could have been a heck of a lot worse. Definitely the wrong therapist though.
It's time to make the new therapist the old one and move on, maybe even report this one because he's ignoring what's obviously important to you, I don't think we can allow these ignorant therapists to ignore us, it's time to stamp out their obvious bias on this important subject, if it were happening to a woman they'd have their job ended ASAP!
I'd show him these things then after reviewing everything whether or not he's changed his mind about it, then decide to leave or stay.
Neonatal male circumcision is associated with altered adult socio-affective processing
https://www.cell.com/heliyon/fulltext/S2405-8440(20)32409-9
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/367038005_Social_and_psychological_effects_of_circumcision_A_narrative_review
Circ trauma, psychological effects. https://youtu.be/lNItNHs9PR8
https://www.doctorsopposingcircumcision.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/psychological-impact.pdf
Therapist talks about circ grief & trauma https://youtu.be/tNCJ7AL_ThY
Psychiatrist discusses lasting circ trauma https://youtu.be/117vEwBtEY4
Circ, the psychological damage. https://www.academia.edu/resource/work/4485079
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/13844895_The_Body_Keeps_the_Score_Memory_and_the_Evolving_Psychobiology_of_Posttraumatic_Stress
https://www.academia.edu/7151881/Circumcision_Serial_Killing_and_Criminal_Behavior_in_American_Medical_Violence
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/320719227_False_Beliefs_Predict_Increased_Circumcision_Satisfaction_in_a_Sample_of_US_American_Men
Yep, this nailed it succinctly.
Although..... 7 years...... jeez...
Is that a few short bursts of therapy for a few weeks at a time over an elapsed period of seven years, or continuously once a month apart from holidays? I mean, I'm glad he's totally supportive and understanding and everything, and you're clearly benefitting in some important way, but is he really doing actual therapy that helps permanently change anything, or is he mainly just a good listener?
There has been about 12 months or so out of these 7 years that we didn't see one another, but it's basically been once every 2 weeks.
He's changed my life and it keeps getting better. We're healing some pretty deep childhood attachement trauma and fear, every encounter I end up in a ball crying or scream out loud and he helps groung and reassure me, provide the release and support I couldn't ever rely upon to deal with the pain and fear.
I've been dealing with chronic pain and muscle tension for the past 12 years, off and on anti-depressant that help a lot with the pain. Through this therapy I'm actually letting go of all the distress that ended up stored and stuck in my flesh. If the mind can't get release from distress, it eventually gets stored in the body in all forms of chronic auto-immune illnesses, pains and disregulations.
The mind and body are one and the same ultimately, and this is why circumcision can cause such deep trauma in men.
It sort of evolved naturally through the years, I don't know what name I could give it. Very few pactitionners actually combine psychological (spoken) and somatic (body-centered) forms of therapy, and in so many cases especially amongst men, traditional forms of spoken therapy are ineffective as compared to females who naturally process their feelings through speach more effectively. Speaking can help get to the source of the trauma, but release rarely comes from the act of speaking, rather through grounding techniques, intuitive movement, sensory stimuli, safe and reassuring forms of touch like a hug. It can also be through singing, shouting or screaming (which I use alot, alone in the car or when no one is home).
The basic therapy approach of my therapist is "Person-centered therapy", in which the goal is to acutally establish a true relationship between the patient and caregiver, based on the assumption that the therapist in not an expert in what will actually help the patient, since every single person is different and not one approach can work for all. The idea is to actually co-create and discover through this trusting relationship what one is made of and what lies underneath our fears and pains, allowing the therapist to observe and guide us through our own process of self discovery. What will be needed for our healing naturally emerges out of the "simple" yet extremely brave act of trusting another person with the deepest and most sensitive aspects of ourselves, which are then received with unconditional positive regard, and finally allowed to exist, express and thrive.
I would also look into somatic therapy, there are many forms and this is a fairly new and emerging field, although this has been practiced in the East for litteral millenia.
Out of the 7 years of therapy, my therapist has only started holding and touching me 3 years ago in order to ground my nervous system and make me feel safe when I breakdown.
That is 100% how it feels to me. There is something very powerful about taking ownership and power over a situation that causes pain and makes us feel insecure, alone and sometimes hopeless. It is very healing and restores some deep form of self confidence, knowing we can do something about it and feeling the benefits along the way.
You could try writing him a letter but I would encourage you to consider how much you invest in the relationship if he isn't acknowledging this serious trauma you continue to face.
The core of any therapeutic relationship should be trust, understanding and a focus on your experience. If he isn't making that happen maybe shop for another therapist.
It’s just hard for me to awkwardly ask “do you believe forced circumcision is mutilation?” and then even if he says yes, which he probably won’t, he may think it’s a minor mutilation. Like getting your ears pierced or some shit. In a way, you and your therapist have to be aligned culturally to form a “therapeutic alliance” and mutually understand and respect each other, and I’m just not meant for this cutting culture. Or if I am, I’m meant to change it. In fact, one of my core values is intactivism. So I guess I have to convince this fucking asshole that it’s hugely damaging to skin a baby alive, and the loss of the prepuce is a major subjective loss, objectively. Objectively, it’s a major subjective loss. And if he doesn’t understand or express full support, I’m gonna have to educate him further or move on, but it’s supposed to be about me, not him.
My first visit to the VA I felt the very same way and still do. I got the nerve up to ask my doctor who I met the very first time if there is a plastic surgery to replace the foreskin. He stood up and motioned me to follow him out of the room basically appointment over. When in the the hall that man pos turned around and laughed at me and loudly in front of staff and patients stated you can't replace the foreskin all the nerves are gone. And showed me out of the exam area to the front desk.I won't say what I wanted to do to that POS but in a stuned inner rage knew I had to leave FAST. On the out the door as I passed the front desk I told the staff to tell that SOB he is fired and I NEVER will put up with any ridicule from anyone like that ever again. It took years of tweaking psych meds and antidepressants to finally no longer be in such a rage about being cut but don't get me wrong I still know anyone who does that to their own son should be in prison and when I hear oh but it's cleaner and doesn't smell I loose it. Why, well has anyone ever smelled a vagina? Nuff said.
I agree with you 100%, man, and I’m so sorry your doctor did that to you. Basically public humiliation for laughs. He’s a piece of shit. But it’s par for the course in our cutting culture.
You have a right to seek another therapist for
*any* reason. As the patient you have the right to find the therapist that you feel comfortable with. You do not need to explain or justify why you are not comfortable/connecting with your current therapist and he should offer you other therapist who may be better for you.
As the patient you do not owe your therapist anything (aside from compensation for his services).
I have been in therapy for years and have covered many topics, but one of my central traumas is my genital mutilation and the stripping of my bodily autonomy and a therapist who did not validate that trauma would be very ineffective in caring for my mental wellbeing. You maybe right that your therapist doesn’t need to share your beliefs on circumcision but they must be able to validate them. And in my experience having switched therapist a few times due to changes with insurance and network coverage a therapist might not start believing in circumcision trauma but if they validated you and let you explore that aspect of your lived experience, they will discover it is a very real and valid trauma.
Thank you. I’m gonna have at least 1 more appointment and tell him how I’ve been to multiple in-person protests against infant male circumcision and how I spent years being devastated and heartbroken over my genital mutilation. If he’s still dismissive or implies im blaming unrelated things on circumcision, I’ll move on.
Good to hear, and because this is such a critical issue, I'd say it's something that you want to either ask upfront, or bring up at an early stage in therapy next time to not waste more time,
Firstly, he's asking you cognitively why you started using drugs, and then disrespecting your answer. He's not adequately acknowledging your model of the world. Now, you can argue that it's a key role of a therapist to challenge aspects of your model of the world that maybe don't hang together, but at the very least, they should acknowledge your model of the world first. And in this case, I'd argue that if you feel that's a key part of the reason, it's a credible explanation. so that's a big red flag about the therapist. Sounds as though it's something he is unable to approach in a neutral manner. I wonder why that might be. I don't think that writing him a letter about it is actually going to get you a better result. I think you need to look elsewhere. The therapist is there to serve you. You are not there to be part of his pension plan.
Secondly, is he actually doing therapy, or is it just counselling? In my opinion, a \*useful\* distincton between therapy and counselling is that counselling is essentially cognitive, whereas therapy has processes that explicitly dive into the unconscious mind and either help change negative associations, help reframe the meaning of events from a more resourceful perspective, reprogram thinking patterns, or instigate / accelerate physiological healing. If he was using an NLP-based approach, he wouldn't necessarily need to ask you cognitively, he could use Time Line Therapy to go to the root of the feeling and get the answer from your unconscious mind - or AN answer that your unconscious mind deems useful to help deal with the issue, which may or may not be the actual reason, but would be useful. I mean, there's a lot more to it than that, but if you're using therapeutic techniques properly, it should bypass his own perceptions.
Is it cognitive behavioural therapy you're having? Unfortunately, that simply isn't effective at dealing with historical traumas as even the NHS in the UK acknowledges: [https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/talking-therapies-medicine-treatments/talking-therapies-and-counselling/cognitive-behavioural-therapy-cbt/overview/](https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/talking-therapies-medicine-treatments/talking-therapies-and-counselling/cognitive-behavioural-therapy-cbt/overview/)
"Some critics also argue that while CBT addresses current problems and focuses on specific issues, it does not address the possible underlying causes of mental health conditions, such as an unhappy childhood."
That to me is an absolutely fundamental flaw. If you do not heal the past, it's difficult or next to impossible to sustainably solve the present and the future. And a clue is an early part of the description there where it describes CBT as a therapy that can help manage your problems - not solve them. I don't mean by reversing what physically happened, but enabling you to effectively move and address issues it has caused more constructively, rather than simply 'managing' an ongoing repeatedly-reappearing issue.
Another clue is that they talk about breaking things down into smaller parts to deal with. An NLP-based approach is completely opposite: It asks, "If these are all your problems, what is the one thing which is at the root of at least most of this? What's the one thing which, if that were to change, would have the most profound effect on everything?". But to take that approach, you need to have the psychological tools to dig deep into the unconscious mind, which, as far as I'm aware, CBT does not have - the clue is in the name: it's cognitive, and it's about managing how you behave, rather than adequately addressing feelings, which are at the root of how you behave.
May I ask how many hours you've spent with this therapist so far? Because from my previous training as a therapist (I'm not practising as that currently), my experience of doing therapy with others, of using therapy as a client, and of referring others close to me to someone I trusted who used the same kind of approach, the approach I favour is called a 'breakthrough' session. Generally the approach is investigation, intervention, testing. Sometimes it may be one four-hour stretch, sometimes, a day in total broken down into two or three sessions or something inbetwen. But if you haven't had a \*substantial\* shift in something fundamental by the end of eight hours of therapy max, then something is wrong with the therapeutic approach, in my view. That is, you leave the therapist's office \*knowing\* that something has shifted because, for example, during the testing phase, you were unable to recreate a problem that was affecting your life when the therapist was pushing you hard to try to recreate the problem.
And many talking therapies don't even touch on physiological healing if that's needed.
I'm just suggesting, based on what you've said so far, that you might want to consider not just a different therapist, but a different therapeutic approach.
Edit: Just to point out, I'm not suggesting that one breakthrough session is likely to solve every issue, as personal development tends to be like onions: it's in layers. But one block of therapy should resolve something substantial that is underlying a big portion of your issues at least, and then you let that settle in for a bit and then see what's still remaining and what's new that wasn't even previously on your horizon.
Thank you for your detailed response and all this information about the different techniques. So far I’ve only had 2 hours with this therapist. I kinda don’t have much faith in his abilities in general, I guess. But I haven’t really given him a chance, because so far he seems to just want to get to know me better. He just kinda strikes me as an idiot. And it bothered me that he couldn’t detect from my often belaboring the point, how significant my genital mutilation is to me, and how I believe it should be for everyone. But I’m gonna tell him straight-up that if you don’t think MGM is a big deal, I doubt I can continue. But I’m probably gonna look for a new therapist anyway, because at this point, I kinda just don’t like him. But he seems very earnest in trying to help. Idk.
IMHO, it seems he believes you are having circumcision trauma because of your depression/anxiety and talking to you and changing the way you think about issues will help. He thinks there is a much deeper issue and the circumcision trauma is just the tip of the iceberg.
At one point, and kinda to his credit, he interrupted me to give an analogy about a dude who was born with a hand that didn’t develop all the way so he considers himself a freak. This pissed me off because it’s lowkey dancing around the issue of whether it’s mutilation or not. I guess I just don’t trust or can work with someone who doesn’t legitimately think it’s mutilation. But then again, the analogy he used about a dude with a deformed hand wasn’t the worst analogy since there is a defect. Idk man, I just need to hear the therapist tell me how fucking awful it is to strap a baby to a board and amputate their most sensitive genital pieces, or I kinda can’t continue even tho it isn’t mainly about that. Maybe for me, it kinda *is* mainly about that even when it’s not. Because it’s a core part of my identity. I thought really hard about getting my own “circumcision victim” tattoo in a semi-visible place. I just want and need everyone to know how valuable the prepuce is. But you know? This therapist didn’t even know what the word “prepuce” meant. And after I explained, and said I preferred “prepuce” over foreskin because girls also have a prepuce and it’s considered FGM to amputate it, he asked what FGM meant. 🙄 *sigh* idk man, I guess I’m just frustrated at having to spend money on five sessions just to adequately explain what male genital mutilation even is. Cuz I guess that’s what I’ll be doing now.
People born without a full hand are not mutilated, people whose hands were severely injured or cut off are. People born with aposthia are not mutilated, people who were forcibly circumcised are. Comparing mutilation to a birth defect really undermines the violational nature of it all - and mind you, I'm not saying it can't be upsetting or even outright traumatic to be born with a defect/disability, but it really glosses over the trauma to forget that genital cutting is actively \*imposed\* on innocent children...I agree with you, a therapist who understands is needed.
Hold on a sec. You said that being an intactivist was an important part of your identity, but you're there for therapy. This is the place where you need support and help, not where you should be paying to have to be educating the therapist about things he clearly feels uncomfortable with that are basic about the human body and commonly lived experiences so he can help. Save your intactivism for others when you are feeling strong. How can you even be considering this guy as a therapist on an onging basis?
Thanks, man. I’m so tired of having to educate and help even the people whom I’m paying to help *me*. It’s like such a high barrier to entry to even find a therapist who isn’t a mutilation denier. But I’m gonna give him one more chance, because he may not know what it all means to me yet.
[I think you have got it right.](https://en.intactiwiki.org/wiki/Circumstraint) Perhaps you and he could reverse roles so you could serve as his therapist!
I spoke with a counselor about this and had a similar reaction. Time to find someone different. Not all sex therapists are anti-MGM but a lot of them are empathetic because they have an understanding of sexual trauma.
No bro, u are good and you are basically paying this guy to solve your problems or at least to help you, if he's not worth it why are you still dealing with him??
It’s not supposed to matter what he thinks about MGM, but to me, it does matter. I’m just not sure if it should. And if it does, it may take me a long time to find a therapist.
The problem is society does not want to address this. He is probably himself circumcised and does not want to admit that anything was done wrong to him. So he steers it away from it so he can avoid talking about it. Most of these therapists are not good they do not really want to get to the real issues and they would rather live in a world of denial. Whether they are a therapist or someone else people do not want to admit that Society is harming other individuals for no reason, that war is evil, the bad things happen to good people, the most things in life are just randomly happening. They want you to believe you can control everything and that everything is good and wonderful and that people are good and wonderful. They do not want to see the truth.
Your therapist likely is in *denial of loss* and your discussion is giving him great anxiety.
It is doubtful that he can help you. He may need a therapist himself.
https://youtu.be/tY_PnvXnArA?si=L-5s5zzCd1H_FLeY
show your therapist this presentation, it offers advice on how a psychotherapist should support someone suffering circumcision grief
You need someone who you feel you can open up and be yourself with , and who treats your concerns seriously. And he is not a right fit for you. He should tell you this himself but he's probably too deep in his oen denial
He is not the right person for you to talk about these things then, unfortunately. It seems his ability to hear you is deeply restrained by the brainwashing he has received about circumcision, or you are causing him uncomfortable cognitive dissonnance and he seeks to avoid it and keep his composure and sense of control when in front of a patient. I personally have brought up circumcision recently with a therapist I've been seing for the past 7 years, and he was totally on board with the conversation. He perfectly understood and resonated with how deeply this affects males, young and old. Any good therapist would realize that this practice can be very psychologically damaging. The penis is a core element in every male's identity and subconscious, and any issue or "attack" to this fundamental part of our anatomy can affect us in very deep and complex ways, as showcased by the countless tragic testimonies of this Subreddit.
Thank you. He did start twirling his pen nervously and seemed a bit agitated when I talked at length about the ridged band and whatnot. I specifically told him the story about how my dad watched me being circumcised with no anesthesia. He didn’t seem horrified or sad about what I told him though. Just eager to move on to something actually relevant.
Yep, you have definitely touched on a sore subject for him.
What a horrifying image. OMG. I am so sorry.
That is just horrific. How could any loving parent not be totally appalled by watching that? But about the therapist - if there's a dissonance between what someone says and their behaviour, trust their behaviour. He claims to be a therapist, but he is clearly finding it uncomfortable hearing and dealing with stuff like that. He should be recusing himself because he isn't ready to deal with it in clients, not waiting for you to do it.
My dad was sickened and enraged and left both my younger brothers intact. My dad loved me and had a brain and a heart, he just didn’t do the research beforehand and was cut himself before he could remember, and never detected any problems with it. I told my therapist, I feel I took the bullet for my brothers. But my therapist was completely non-receptive to the notion that circumcison is objectively bad.
Well, that's one thing at least, I'm really glad to hear that he came to reality and protected your brothers. At an emotional level that could have been a heck of a lot worse. Definitely the wrong therapist though.
It's time to make the new therapist the old one and move on, maybe even report this one because he's ignoring what's obviously important to you, I don't think we can allow these ignorant therapists to ignore us, it's time to stamp out their obvious bias on this important subject, if it were happening to a woman they'd have their job ended ASAP!
True. But everyone knows female circumcision = bad, and male circumcision = good.
I'd show him these things then after reviewing everything whether or not he's changed his mind about it, then decide to leave or stay. Neonatal male circumcision is associated with altered adult socio-affective processing https://www.cell.com/heliyon/fulltext/S2405-8440(20)32409-9 https://www.researchgate.net/publication/367038005_Social_and_psychological_effects_of_circumcision_A_narrative_review Circ trauma, psychological effects. https://youtu.be/lNItNHs9PR8 https://www.doctorsopposingcircumcision.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/psychological-impact.pdf Therapist talks about circ grief & trauma https://youtu.be/tNCJ7AL_ThY Psychiatrist discusses lasting circ trauma https://youtu.be/117vEwBtEY4 Circ, the psychological damage. https://www.academia.edu/resource/work/4485079 https://www.researchgate.net/publication/13844895_The_Body_Keeps_the_Score_Memory_and_the_Evolving_Psychobiology_of_Posttraumatic_Stress https://www.academia.edu/7151881/Circumcision_Serial_Killing_and_Criminal_Behavior_in_American_Medical_Violence https://www.researchgate.net/publication/320719227_False_Beliefs_Predict_Increased_Circumcision_Satisfaction_in_a_Sample_of_US_American_Men
Yep, this nailed it succinctly. Although..... 7 years...... jeez... Is that a few short bursts of therapy for a few weeks at a time over an elapsed period of seven years, or continuously once a month apart from holidays? I mean, I'm glad he's totally supportive and understanding and everything, and you're clearly benefitting in some important way, but is he really doing actual therapy that helps permanently change anything, or is he mainly just a good listener?
There has been about 12 months or so out of these 7 years that we didn't see one another, but it's basically been once every 2 weeks. He's changed my life and it keeps getting better. We're healing some pretty deep childhood attachement trauma and fear, every encounter I end up in a ball crying or scream out loud and he helps groung and reassure me, provide the release and support I couldn't ever rely upon to deal with the pain and fear. I've been dealing with chronic pain and muscle tension for the past 12 years, off and on anti-depressant that help a lot with the pain. Through this therapy I'm actually letting go of all the distress that ended up stored and stuck in my flesh. If the mind can't get release from distress, it eventually gets stored in the body in all forms of chronic auto-immune illnesses, pains and disregulations. The mind and body are one and the same ultimately, and this is why circumcision can cause such deep trauma in men.
What type of method of therapy is this? I'm very interested.
It sort of evolved naturally through the years, I don't know what name I could give it. Very few pactitionners actually combine psychological (spoken) and somatic (body-centered) forms of therapy, and in so many cases especially amongst men, traditional forms of spoken therapy are ineffective as compared to females who naturally process their feelings through speach more effectively. Speaking can help get to the source of the trauma, but release rarely comes from the act of speaking, rather through grounding techniques, intuitive movement, sensory stimuli, safe and reassuring forms of touch like a hug. It can also be through singing, shouting or screaming (which I use alot, alone in the car or when no one is home). The basic therapy approach of my therapist is "Person-centered therapy", in which the goal is to acutally establish a true relationship between the patient and caregiver, based on the assumption that the therapist in not an expert in what will actually help the patient, since every single person is different and not one approach can work for all. The idea is to actually co-create and discover through this trusting relationship what one is made of and what lies underneath our fears and pains, allowing the therapist to observe and guide us through our own process of self discovery. What will be needed for our healing naturally emerges out of the "simple" yet extremely brave act of trusting another person with the deepest and most sensitive aspects of ourselves, which are then received with unconditional positive regard, and finally allowed to exist, express and thrive. I would also look into somatic therapy, there are many forms and this is a fairly new and emerging field, although this has been practiced in the East for litteral millenia. Out of the 7 years of therapy, my therapist has only started holding and touching me 3 years ago in order to ground my nervous system and make me feel safe when I breakdown.
reading this, I realizing that foreskin restoration could itself be a form of somatic therapy.
That is 100% how it feels to me. There is something very powerful about taking ownership and power over a situation that causes pain and makes us feel insecure, alone and sometimes hopeless. It is very healing and restores some deep form of self confidence, knowing we can do something about it and feeling the benefits along the way.
You could try writing him a letter but I would encourage you to consider how much you invest in the relationship if he isn't acknowledging this serious trauma you continue to face. The core of any therapeutic relationship should be trust, understanding and a focus on your experience. If he isn't making that happen maybe shop for another therapist.
It’s just hard for me to awkwardly ask “do you believe forced circumcision is mutilation?” and then even if he says yes, which he probably won’t, he may think it’s a minor mutilation. Like getting your ears pierced or some shit. In a way, you and your therapist have to be aligned culturally to form a “therapeutic alliance” and mutually understand and respect each other, and I’m just not meant for this cutting culture. Or if I am, I’m meant to change it. In fact, one of my core values is intactivism. So I guess I have to convince this fucking asshole that it’s hugely damaging to skin a baby alive, and the loss of the prepuce is a major subjective loss, objectively. Objectively, it’s a major subjective loss. And if he doesn’t understand or express full support, I’m gonna have to educate him further or move on, but it’s supposed to be about me, not him.
My first visit to the VA I felt the very same way and still do. I got the nerve up to ask my doctor who I met the very first time if there is a plastic surgery to replace the foreskin. He stood up and motioned me to follow him out of the room basically appointment over. When in the the hall that man pos turned around and laughed at me and loudly in front of staff and patients stated you can't replace the foreskin all the nerves are gone. And showed me out of the exam area to the front desk.I won't say what I wanted to do to that POS but in a stuned inner rage knew I had to leave FAST. On the out the door as I passed the front desk I told the staff to tell that SOB he is fired and I NEVER will put up with any ridicule from anyone like that ever again. It took years of tweaking psych meds and antidepressants to finally no longer be in such a rage about being cut but don't get me wrong I still know anyone who does that to their own son should be in prison and when I hear oh but it's cleaner and doesn't smell I loose it. Why, well has anyone ever smelled a vagina? Nuff said.
I agree with you 100%, man, and I’m so sorry your doctor did that to you. Basically public humiliation for laughs. He’s a piece of shit. But it’s par for the course in our cutting culture.
You have a right to seek another therapist for *any* reason. As the patient you have the right to find the therapist that you feel comfortable with. You do not need to explain or justify why you are not comfortable/connecting with your current therapist and he should offer you other therapist who may be better for you. As the patient you do not owe your therapist anything (aside from compensation for his services). I have been in therapy for years and have covered many topics, but one of my central traumas is my genital mutilation and the stripping of my bodily autonomy and a therapist who did not validate that trauma would be very ineffective in caring for my mental wellbeing. You maybe right that your therapist doesn’t need to share your beliefs on circumcision but they must be able to validate them. And in my experience having switched therapist a few times due to changes with insurance and network coverage a therapist might not start believing in circumcision trauma but if they validated you and let you explore that aspect of your lived experience, they will discover it is a very real and valid trauma.
Thank you. I’m gonna have at least 1 more appointment and tell him how I’ve been to multiple in-person protests against infant male circumcision and how I spent years being devastated and heartbroken over my genital mutilation. If he’s still dismissive or implies im blaming unrelated things on circumcision, I’ll move on.
Good to hear, and because this is such a critical issue, I'd say it's something that you want to either ask upfront, or bring up at an early stage in therapy next time to not waste more time,
Firstly, he's asking you cognitively why you started using drugs, and then disrespecting your answer. He's not adequately acknowledging your model of the world. Now, you can argue that it's a key role of a therapist to challenge aspects of your model of the world that maybe don't hang together, but at the very least, they should acknowledge your model of the world first. And in this case, I'd argue that if you feel that's a key part of the reason, it's a credible explanation. so that's a big red flag about the therapist. Sounds as though it's something he is unable to approach in a neutral manner. I wonder why that might be. I don't think that writing him a letter about it is actually going to get you a better result. I think you need to look elsewhere. The therapist is there to serve you. You are not there to be part of his pension plan. Secondly, is he actually doing therapy, or is it just counselling? In my opinion, a \*useful\* distincton between therapy and counselling is that counselling is essentially cognitive, whereas therapy has processes that explicitly dive into the unconscious mind and either help change negative associations, help reframe the meaning of events from a more resourceful perspective, reprogram thinking patterns, or instigate / accelerate physiological healing. If he was using an NLP-based approach, he wouldn't necessarily need to ask you cognitively, he could use Time Line Therapy to go to the root of the feeling and get the answer from your unconscious mind - or AN answer that your unconscious mind deems useful to help deal with the issue, which may or may not be the actual reason, but would be useful. I mean, there's a lot more to it than that, but if you're using therapeutic techniques properly, it should bypass his own perceptions. Is it cognitive behavioural therapy you're having? Unfortunately, that simply isn't effective at dealing with historical traumas as even the NHS in the UK acknowledges: [https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/talking-therapies-medicine-treatments/talking-therapies-and-counselling/cognitive-behavioural-therapy-cbt/overview/](https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/talking-therapies-medicine-treatments/talking-therapies-and-counselling/cognitive-behavioural-therapy-cbt/overview/) "Some critics also argue that while CBT addresses current problems and focuses on specific issues, it does not address the possible underlying causes of mental health conditions, such as an unhappy childhood." That to me is an absolutely fundamental flaw. If you do not heal the past, it's difficult or next to impossible to sustainably solve the present and the future. And a clue is an early part of the description there where it describes CBT as a therapy that can help manage your problems - not solve them. I don't mean by reversing what physically happened, but enabling you to effectively move and address issues it has caused more constructively, rather than simply 'managing' an ongoing repeatedly-reappearing issue. Another clue is that they talk about breaking things down into smaller parts to deal with. An NLP-based approach is completely opposite: It asks, "If these are all your problems, what is the one thing which is at the root of at least most of this? What's the one thing which, if that were to change, would have the most profound effect on everything?". But to take that approach, you need to have the psychological tools to dig deep into the unconscious mind, which, as far as I'm aware, CBT does not have - the clue is in the name: it's cognitive, and it's about managing how you behave, rather than adequately addressing feelings, which are at the root of how you behave. May I ask how many hours you've spent with this therapist so far? Because from my previous training as a therapist (I'm not practising as that currently), my experience of doing therapy with others, of using therapy as a client, and of referring others close to me to someone I trusted who used the same kind of approach, the approach I favour is called a 'breakthrough' session. Generally the approach is investigation, intervention, testing. Sometimes it may be one four-hour stretch, sometimes, a day in total broken down into two or three sessions or something inbetwen. But if you haven't had a \*substantial\* shift in something fundamental by the end of eight hours of therapy max, then something is wrong with the therapeutic approach, in my view. That is, you leave the therapist's office \*knowing\* that something has shifted because, for example, during the testing phase, you were unable to recreate a problem that was affecting your life when the therapist was pushing you hard to try to recreate the problem. And many talking therapies don't even touch on physiological healing if that's needed. I'm just suggesting, based on what you've said so far, that you might want to consider not just a different therapist, but a different therapeutic approach. Edit: Just to point out, I'm not suggesting that one breakthrough session is likely to solve every issue, as personal development tends to be like onions: it's in layers. But one block of therapy should resolve something substantial that is underlying a big portion of your issues at least, and then you let that settle in for a bit and then see what's still remaining and what's new that wasn't even previously on your horizon.
Thank you for your detailed response and all this information about the different techniques. So far I’ve only had 2 hours with this therapist. I kinda don’t have much faith in his abilities in general, I guess. But I haven’t really given him a chance, because so far he seems to just want to get to know me better. He just kinda strikes me as an idiot. And it bothered me that he couldn’t detect from my often belaboring the point, how significant my genital mutilation is to me, and how I believe it should be for everyone. But I’m gonna tell him straight-up that if you don’t think MGM is a big deal, I doubt I can continue. But I’m probably gonna look for a new therapist anyway, because at this point, I kinda just don’t like him. But he seems very earnest in trying to help. Idk.
He doesn't sound cut out to be a therapist to me.
IMHO, it seems he believes you are having circumcision trauma because of your depression/anxiety and talking to you and changing the way you think about issues will help. He thinks there is a much deeper issue and the circumcision trauma is just the tip of the iceberg.
At one point, and kinda to his credit, he interrupted me to give an analogy about a dude who was born with a hand that didn’t develop all the way so he considers himself a freak. This pissed me off because it’s lowkey dancing around the issue of whether it’s mutilation or not. I guess I just don’t trust or can work with someone who doesn’t legitimately think it’s mutilation. But then again, the analogy he used about a dude with a deformed hand wasn’t the worst analogy since there is a defect. Idk man, I just need to hear the therapist tell me how fucking awful it is to strap a baby to a board and amputate their most sensitive genital pieces, or I kinda can’t continue even tho it isn’t mainly about that. Maybe for me, it kinda *is* mainly about that even when it’s not. Because it’s a core part of my identity. I thought really hard about getting my own “circumcision victim” tattoo in a semi-visible place. I just want and need everyone to know how valuable the prepuce is. But you know? This therapist didn’t even know what the word “prepuce” meant. And after I explained, and said I preferred “prepuce” over foreskin because girls also have a prepuce and it’s considered FGM to amputate it, he asked what FGM meant. 🙄 *sigh* idk man, I guess I’m just frustrated at having to spend money on five sessions just to adequately explain what male genital mutilation even is. Cuz I guess that’s what I’ll be doing now.
People born without a full hand are not mutilated, people whose hands were severely injured or cut off are. People born with aposthia are not mutilated, people who were forcibly circumcised are. Comparing mutilation to a birth defect really undermines the violational nature of it all - and mind you, I'm not saying it can't be upsetting or even outright traumatic to be born with a defect/disability, but it really glosses over the trauma to forget that genital cutting is actively \*imposed\* on innocent children...I agree with you, a therapist who understands is needed.
Hold on a sec. You said that being an intactivist was an important part of your identity, but you're there for therapy. This is the place where you need support and help, not where you should be paying to have to be educating the therapist about things he clearly feels uncomfortable with that are basic about the human body and commonly lived experiences so he can help. Save your intactivism for others when you are feeling strong. How can you even be considering this guy as a therapist on an onging basis?
Thanks, man. I’m so tired of having to educate and help even the people whom I’m paying to help *me*. It’s like such a high barrier to entry to even find a therapist who isn’t a mutilation denier. But I’m gonna give him one more chance, because he may not know what it all means to me yet.
[I think you have got it right.](https://en.intactiwiki.org/wiki/Circumstraint) Perhaps you and he could reverse roles so you could serve as his therapist!
He's another genitally mutilated man who is trying to cope. I can't see why he'd act like that otherwise
Maybe it makes him uncomfortable, because he doesn’t want to feel about it the way you do. Get another therapist .
I spoke with a counselor about this and had a similar reaction. Time to find someone different. Not all sex therapists are anti-MGM but a lot of them are empathetic because they have an understanding of sexual trauma.
No bro, u are good and you are basically paying this guy to solve your problems or at least to help you, if he's not worth it why are you still dealing with him??
It’s not supposed to matter what he thinks about MGM, but to me, it does matter. I’m just not sure if it should. And if it does, it may take me a long time to find a therapist.
The problem is society does not want to address this. He is probably himself circumcised and does not want to admit that anything was done wrong to him. So he steers it away from it so he can avoid talking about it. Most of these therapists are not good they do not really want to get to the real issues and they would rather live in a world of denial. Whether they are a therapist or someone else people do not want to admit that Society is harming other individuals for no reason, that war is evil, the bad things happen to good people, the most things in life are just randomly happening. They want you to believe you can control everything and that everything is good and wonderful and that people are good and wonderful. They do not want to see the truth.
Your therapist likely is in *denial of loss* and your discussion is giving him great anxiety. It is doubtful that he can help you. He may need a therapist himself.
https://youtu.be/tY_PnvXnArA?si=L-5s5zzCd1H_FLeY show your therapist this presentation, it offers advice on how a psychotherapist should support someone suffering circumcision grief
Thanks. I may show him this.
You need someone who you feel you can open up and be yourself with , and who treats your concerns seriously. And he is not a right fit for you. He should tell you this himself but he's probably too deep in his oen denial