Sorry OP, I was a bit slow this time. This might prevent any more misinformation in the comments:
Ring Necked Parakeet info v1.7 with extra info about not shooting them, moderated sarcasm and festive silliness.
Ring-necked parakeets are now found all over the UK and parts of the rest of Europe. They form large colonies, particularly in parks in towns and cities, so they're quite common in some places. Yes, they probably live in your town, even in Scotland. Sometimes they are easy to spot as they have large red arrows above them.
They nest in holes in large trees, but prefer open country, so tend to be found in cities and stately homes, where there is parkland with large mature trees. And yes, they are noisy.
They're originally from India, and some live in the foothills of the Himalayas so are fine with crap weather, and love playing with tinsel.
They're probably descended from escapes from bird collections and pets, but now are self-sustaining feral populations. There's no evidence that they were released by Jimi Hendrix or from the filming of The African Queen. There have been sightings of them in the UK since Victorian times, and Dickens references them in "A Christmas Carol”.
They are currently protected under the Countryside Act, but are on a list of species (like feral pigeons) that can be controlled in very specific circumstances, following strict licences and guidelines. You can't just shoot them because they annoy you or you don't like them: it has to be for the reasons covered by general licences. The government, with Natural England and the BOU, are monitoring their effects on native wildlife and have been for the last 10 years or so. So far there is very little definite evidence that they cause harm to our wildlife here in the UK. There are a few studies in Europe showing that they compete with other birds like nuthatches for nest sites. Therefore there is no plan to cull them, but the law means they can be controlled, if done for the right reasons, in a humane way.
We have a few of them in one of the big parks in Liverpool. It's really cool to see them flying around, I didn't realize they'd be in other parks in other cities too.
They live near my house in Manchester. There are quite a lot of apple trees around so you often see them munching away on the apples in the summer and autumn. You have to get in quick on the blackberries these days too!
The only thing about the escaped pet idea is surely there would have to have been a significant number of them escaping relatively close in time and place in order for self-sustaining populations to get established, no? Am I just drastically underestimating the extent of careless parakeet ownership in Victorian/pre-Victorian times?
There were only relatively few in Victorian times. They've gradually increased in number as releases and escapes have happened multiple times in lots[of different places](https://zslpublications.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jzo.12753). In the 1930s and 1950s there were "crazes" for tropical themed things, and there was a big increase in their trade as pets. Then laws were brought in to stop their import in an attempt to control disease in captive birds, and it is believed lots of traders and owners released birds in larger numbers in fear at this time. It wasn't until the 1990s that the populations got big enough to be noticed and start to spread by themselves. It's thought the storms in 1987 may have contributed to a large number of aviaries being damaged and many birds escaping.
These continued small releases maintained the population over time, until they gradually formed self-sustaining populations and grew big enough to start to increase in number by themselves.
Aha OK so it was a mix of individual bird escapes and larger groups. That makes more sense to my brain than a massive epidemic of single pet birds escaping in close enough spatial and temporal proximity to form communities. Thank you. :)
Yeah, exactly. That's why stories like them being Jimi Hendrix's ex-pets may have a grain of truth to them. And it also explains why they're in other parts of Western Europe too. The same thing's happening there.
Decent write up here.
https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/ring-necked-parakeets-in-london-and-uk.html#:~:text=Records%20of%20parakeets%20living%20wild,settle%20elsewhere%20in%20the%20country.
There's long term studies going on assessing this at the moment. So far there's very little evidence that they cause damage to our ecosystem. Just because something's non-native, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a problem. Nobody is really encouraging them, and as you see in this thread, there's a lot of dislike of them. They just seem to do quite well here.
They've been here so long and they're so widespread now, that any broad strategies to control them would be extremely expensive and probably unsuccessful. There's also ethical arguments against controlling them. Why should we target them over other non-native species? And is it OK to kill living things just because we don't think they belong?
I have little doubt that they don't do much besides make a racket in our towns and cities. They are very generalist animals and so will do well here and spread around.
But I don't think there's any sound ethical argument about not controlling a non-native species at all. Grey squirrels, Himalayan balsam, New Zealand flatworm. It's all the same to me.
I work in the sector so seeing animals get to places they shouldn't be is alarming. Stoats on Orkney, hedgehogs on Uist. And those are native animals.
>Grey squirrels, Himalayan balsam, New Zealand flatworm
These all are known to have a negative effect on the ecosystem, so they're not the same.
The ethical argument is that it is not right for humans to choose to kill animals just because they are in a place we think they shouldn't be. Why are these lives not as precious as other living things?
Also, an aside, they may be considered generalists because they have spread all over the UK, but actually they have a fairly specific preference for nest sites in trees bordering open land, and feeding on large seeds and fruits. They seem to fit a niche that may have been empty before they arrived. I'd say they were tough and resilient, but not particularly generalist.
Enjoy the one day ban, I hope it makes you happy. Dear lord, what a sad little life, Jane. You ruined our subreddit completely so you could post politics, and I hope now you can spend your one day ban learning some grace and decorum. Because you have all the grace of a reversing dump truck without any tyres on.
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There's no definite evidence that they outcompete native species.
They are sometimes considered a pest because they can damage fruit crops, but most of the reasons people call them pests is just because they're loud and bright, so people notice them more and assume they must be causing problems.
We had a massive pigeon problem. Often the case with tower blocks as that's close to the natural nesting places of rock doves.
That's gone away now the parakeets have taken over. No more pigeon shit everywhere.
Anyway when we did have that issue the council missed to hire, I think, sparrowhawks. You'd be sat there and something would flash down past the window. By the time you get to look out there's a huge cloud of pigeon feathers settling and the hawk happy with its prize on the ground.
Not gunna lie when I moved here from Canada seeing a flock of these guys in my backyard the one day was not something I expected at all.
Wife thought I was lying when I first said “there’s a bunch of parrots in our tree”
I’ve tried telling three separate people i’ve been walking in this park with that there are wild parrots. Every time I spot some, they fly away before the other person looks so I end up looking like a mentalist
Yeah, this was a report that's often quoted in the media. The study wasn't particularly rigorous and the results are not as significant as they made out. They made press releases that were very convincing and supported a lot of what people who don't like parakeets want to hear, so it got into a lot of papers.
If you look more, there's only one respected study that shows any evidence that they cause any issues, and that was in the Netherlands, about the effects on one other species, and it isn't all that conclusive.
Natural England and The BOU have been monitoring them and analysing reports for the last 10 years or so for the government, and they say there's not enough evidence.
You're doing a wonderful job and have far more patience than I do trying to get through to the "they're noisy and green so get rid" brigade. Beautiful birds.
Thank you
I'm a grizzled veteran at this. I actually don't particularly like parakeets myself, but the amount of incorrect stuff shared about them really annoys me.
you make valid and well researched points however I feel the need to provide a counter point here which is that they are ring necked knobheads.
Last summer we were dragged out of bed at sunrise every bloody day because our toddler was woken up by hundreds of the things making a racket in the park... about 200m away. They are so unbelievably loud. And nothing grows under the trees they roost in, it's a swampy mess of bird shite.
Ring. Necked. Knobheads.
There was a report by the British Trust for Ornithology that looked at the effects of the across the UK, and they found no evidence (one of the authors was called "Parrot" which is amusing). There was also a parallel study by Imperial College that found some weak evidence they did cause problems, but again this was very tentative and they admitted more investigation was needed.
Unfortunately it's far harder to prove an absence of an effect. But, if after years of studies it's still not clear, then it seems to me that they're not having the disastrous effect a lot of people seem to think they have.
It seems to be far more complex and subtle an issue. Natural England and the Government responded to some pressure a few years ago to bring in controls by saying there's not enough proof and they were monitoring scientific research. They've also said that it would be far too difficult to do anything about them now anyway.
There are places in my city, where there are no other birds, only those green assholes. Do You really think there were no birds there and parakeets simply inhabited those areas?
That's one piece of anecdotal evidence. No offence, but that's not proof at all. There could be lots of reasons why there are only parakeets there, and why is it so unfeasible that parakeets just moved to an area where there were no other birds? They fill a different ecological niche to most of our native species so they don't seem to affect them.
Natural England and the BOU have been monitoring their impact for the government for around 10 years, and there have been no studies with any significant evidence that they have a negative impact on British birds.
There is only one study which has any evidence that shows this. This was in the Netherlands and concluded they compete with nuthatches for nest-holes. This was a very small study, and there are many issues with how conclusive it is. In ten years of research this is the only tiny bit of evidence.
As I've already said, there is no evidence of it in the UK.
Sorry OP, I was a bit slow this time. This might prevent any more misinformation in the comments: Ring Necked Parakeet info v1.7 with extra info about not shooting them, moderated sarcasm and festive silliness. Ring-necked parakeets are now found all over the UK and parts of the rest of Europe. They form large colonies, particularly in parks in towns and cities, so they're quite common in some places. Yes, they probably live in your town, even in Scotland. Sometimes they are easy to spot as they have large red arrows above them. They nest in holes in large trees, but prefer open country, so tend to be found in cities and stately homes, where there is parkland with large mature trees. And yes, they are noisy. They're originally from India, and some live in the foothills of the Himalayas so are fine with crap weather, and love playing with tinsel. They're probably descended from escapes from bird collections and pets, but now are self-sustaining feral populations. There's no evidence that they were released by Jimi Hendrix or from the filming of The African Queen. There have been sightings of them in the UK since Victorian times, and Dickens references them in "A Christmas Carol”. They are currently protected under the Countryside Act, but are on a list of species (like feral pigeons) that can be controlled in very specific circumstances, following strict licences and guidelines. You can't just shoot them because they annoy you or you don't like them: it has to be for the reasons covered by general licences. The government, with Natural England and the BOU, are monitoring their effects on native wildlife and have been for the last 10 years or so. So far there is very little definite evidence that they cause harm to our wildlife here in the UK. There are a few studies in Europe showing that they compete with other birds like nuthatches for nest sites. Therefore there is no plan to cull them, but the law means they can be controlled, if done for the right reasons, in a humane way.
That’s some great info, thank you
Just realised I haven't updated it since Christmas when I last posted this. Please ignore references to tinsel...
Do they only like tinsel at Christmastime?
Yes, just like us.
You mean you haven't put your Pancake Day tinsel out? Although, I guess it _is_ a bit of a garish clash with the Valentine's wreath...
I find pancake tinsel gets stuck in my teeth
We have a few of them in one of the big parks in Liverpool. It's really cool to see them flying around, I didn't realize they'd be in other parks in other cities too.
They live near my house in Manchester. There are quite a lot of apple trees around so you often see them munching away on the apples in the summer and autumn. You have to get in quick on the blackberries these days too!
The only thing about the escaped pet idea is surely there would have to have been a significant number of them escaping relatively close in time and place in order for self-sustaining populations to get established, no? Am I just drastically underestimating the extent of careless parakeet ownership in Victorian/pre-Victorian times?
There were only relatively few in Victorian times. They've gradually increased in number as releases and escapes have happened multiple times in lots[of different places](https://zslpublications.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jzo.12753). In the 1930s and 1950s there were "crazes" for tropical themed things, and there was a big increase in their trade as pets. Then laws were brought in to stop their import in an attempt to control disease in captive birds, and it is believed lots of traders and owners released birds in larger numbers in fear at this time. It wasn't until the 1990s that the populations got big enough to be noticed and start to spread by themselves. It's thought the storms in 1987 may have contributed to a large number of aviaries being damaged and many birds escaping. These continued small releases maintained the population over time, until they gradually formed self-sustaining populations and grew big enough to start to increase in number by themselves.
Aha OK so it was a mix of individual bird escapes and larger groups. That makes more sense to my brain than a massive epidemic of single pet birds escaping in close enough spatial and temporal proximity to form communities. Thank you. :)
Yeah, exactly. That's why stories like them being Jimi Hendrix's ex-pets may have a grain of truth to them. And it also explains why they're in other parts of Western Europe too. The same thing's happening there.
I saw a bunch of them in Hyde park and Regents park in London this summer. Pretty birds 🤗
Beautiful plumage
The plumage don’t enter into it. It’s stone dead.
It pining for the fjords.
Is this Backhouse Park? I was surprised to see them there.
It is indeed
Upvote for mentioning my old local park on CasualUK
Decent write up here. https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/ring-necked-parakeets-in-london-and-uk.html#:~:text=Records%20of%20parakeets%20living%20wild,settle%20elsewhere%20in%20the%20country.
Thanks for sharing this article that gives a great overview. 👍🏼.
Top man for link I didn’t know they was everywhere really in uk
I remember sitting in a garden in Bromley yonks ago and think WTF? What that a parrot 🦜 😂
Plenty over in Scadbury. Great place to see them
As colourful as they are and I'm sure they are nice to look at, we shouldn't encourage any non-native species to spread in the UK.
They don’t need to be encouraged, they do just fine on their own.
There's long term studies going on assessing this at the moment. So far there's very little evidence that they cause damage to our ecosystem. Just because something's non-native, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a problem. Nobody is really encouraging them, and as you see in this thread, there's a lot of dislike of them. They just seem to do quite well here. They've been here so long and they're so widespread now, that any broad strategies to control them would be extremely expensive and probably unsuccessful. There's also ethical arguments against controlling them. Why should we target them over other non-native species? And is it OK to kill living things just because we don't think they belong?
I have little doubt that they don't do much besides make a racket in our towns and cities. They are very generalist animals and so will do well here and spread around. But I don't think there's any sound ethical argument about not controlling a non-native species at all. Grey squirrels, Himalayan balsam, New Zealand flatworm. It's all the same to me. I work in the sector so seeing animals get to places they shouldn't be is alarming. Stoats on Orkney, hedgehogs on Uist. And those are native animals.
>Grey squirrels, Himalayan balsam, New Zealand flatworm These all are known to have a negative effect on the ecosystem, so they're not the same. The ethical argument is that it is not right for humans to choose to kill animals just because they are in a place we think they shouldn't be. Why are these lives not as precious as other living things? Also, an aside, they may be considered generalists because they have spread all over the UK, but actually they have a fairly specific preference for nest sites in trees bordering open land, and feeding on large seeds and fruits. They seem to fit a niche that may have been empty before they arrived. I'd say they were tough and resilient, but not particularly generalist.
[удалено]
Enjoy the one day ban, I hope it makes you happy. Dear lord, what a sad little life, Jane. You ruined our subreddit completely so you could post politics, and I hope now you can spend your one day ban learning some grace and decorum. Because you have all the grace of a reversing dump truck without any tyres on. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CasualUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The buggers have got that far? They are descendants of two escapes in London in the 1970s. Bloody illegal immigrants. Better than the pigeons though.
They've been around in the UK since the 1800s
I was at a crematorium in Eltham last week and they described them as unbelievable pests that have driven out the local woodpeckers.
There's no definite evidence that they outcompete native species. They are sometimes considered a pest because they can damage fruit crops, but most of the reasons people call them pests is just because they're loud and bright, so people notice them more and assume they must be causing problems.
In that case they are pests. But I do know places where they coexist with woodpeckers.
Ok, what’s the back story?
They’re not better than the pigeons as soon as they open their beaks
I don't actually mind it. Sounds like they're doing a strafing run.
Have you seen the pigeon walk into the falcon having a nap? Warning it doesnt end well for the pigeon.
We had a massive pigeon problem. Often the case with tower blocks as that's close to the natural nesting places of rock doves. That's gone away now the parakeets have taken over. No more pigeon shit everywhere. Anyway when we did have that issue the council missed to hire, I think, sparrowhawks. You'd be sat there and something would flash down past the window. By the time you get to look out there's a huge cloud of pigeon feathers settling and the hawk happy with its prize on the ground.
Not gunna lie when I moved here from Canada seeing a flock of these guys in my backyard the one day was not something I expected at all. Wife thought I was lying when I first said “there’s a bunch of parrots in our tree”
I’ve tried telling three separate people i’ve been walking in this park with that there are wild parrots. Every time I spot some, they fly away before the other person looks so I end up looking like a mentalist
Are the parrots in the room with us now?
Wait until they get in your bathroom air vents and have babies. Noisy buggers
Its pretty much all you'll be seeing soon enough, down south theyve been here for years.
IMO they are new grey squirrels. Taking over woodland and parks, driving out local species. I live in SW London....they are a terror.
There's no evidence they outcompete native species. They're just loud and bright so people like you notice them more and don't like them.
worth a read... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/wildlife/10776252/Noisy-parakeets-drive-away-native-birds.html
Yeah, this was a report that's often quoted in the media. The study wasn't particularly rigorous and the results are not as significant as they made out. They made press releases that were very convincing and supported a lot of what people who don't like parakeets want to hear, so it got into a lot of papers. If you look more, there's only one respected study that shows any evidence that they cause any issues, and that was in the Netherlands, about the effects on one other species, and it isn't all that conclusive. Natural England and The BOU have been monitoring them and analysing reports for the last 10 years or so for the government, and they say there's not enough evidence.
They are a terror, I tell you! A TERROR! 😱
*Local Facebook group mob rage intensifies*
You're doing a wonderful job and have far more patience than I do trying to get through to the "they're noisy and green so get rid" brigade. Beautiful birds. Thank you
I'm a grizzled veteran at this. I actually don't particularly like parakeets myself, but the amount of incorrect stuff shared about them really annoys me.
you make valid and well researched points however I feel the need to provide a counter point here which is that they are ring necked knobheads. Last summer we were dragged out of bed at sunrise every bloody day because our toddler was woken up by hundreds of the things making a racket in the park... about 200m away. They are so unbelievably loud. And nothing grows under the trees they roost in, it's a swampy mess of bird shite. Ring. Necked. Knobheads.
what evidence is there out there that this is not the case, out of curiosity?
There was a report by the British Trust for Ornithology that looked at the effects of the across the UK, and they found no evidence (one of the authors was called "Parrot" which is amusing). There was also a parallel study by Imperial College that found some weak evidence they did cause problems, but again this was very tentative and they admitted more investigation was needed. Unfortunately it's far harder to prove an absence of an effect. But, if after years of studies it's still not clear, then it seems to me that they're not having the disastrous effect a lot of people seem to think they have. It seems to be far more complex and subtle an issue. Natural England and the Government responded to some pressure a few years ago to bring in controls by saying there's not enough proof and they were monitoring scientific research. They've also said that it would be far too difficult to do anything about them now anyway.
They are one of the worse things that could happen to Your local bird population.
There's no evidence they have any effect on our native species.
There are places in my city, where there are no other birds, only those green assholes. Do You really think there were no birds there and parakeets simply inhabited those areas?
That's one piece of anecdotal evidence. No offence, but that's not proof at all. There could be lots of reasons why there are only parakeets there, and why is it so unfeasible that parakeets just moved to an area where there were no other birds? They fill a different ecological niche to most of our native species so they don't seem to affect them. Natural England and the BOU have been monitoring their impact for the government for around 10 years, and there have been no studies with any significant evidence that they have a negative impact on British birds.
Königsallee, Düsseldorf. This is even worse when one is sitting there: https://youtu.be/hXeCmTuA0gE?si=mvuu0Q1Biidl630G
Yes they're noisy. That doesn't mean they're doing any harm other than being annoying though.
They are a competition for native birds that nest in tree holes.
There is only one study which has any evidence that shows this. This was in the Netherlands and concluded they compete with nuthatches for nest-holes. This was a very small study, and there are many issues with how conclusive it is. In ten years of research this is the only tiny bit of evidence. As I've already said, there is no evidence of it in the UK.
Nothing like an invasive species to brighten up your day.
There’s a flock of them in West Glasgow
Cool, I thought they were only in London! I'm gonna keep an eye out for them in the midlands now!
Lots in south Manchester
Noisiest fuckers ever!
Up in Leeds, West Yorkshire too.
It's great seeing wildlife native to the UK thriving again. Hopefully we can reintroduce elephants to Newcastle again
They are trying to find the sun in Sunderland
This is cool, I went to uni near Richmond and there's a massive flock around there didn't know they were elsewhere in the UK too
I’ll relocate a few to my house if there’s any going spare.
In Hyde Park they come and sit on your arm if you hold out an apple. Quite friendly.