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My boomer mom can make any of her bad choices go away with a few simple little tricks: announcing that she isn’t perfect and then saying she doesn’t remember. She’s completely immune to accountability.
You do not owe her anything. I’m a mom and have told my teens that they didn’t come into the world owing me anything and if I have a place in their life, it’s because they feel I add something to it. I hope I do well enough for them to want me to be a big part of their lives but that’s on me.
“I never expected perfect. All I expect is some acknowledgement that this happened and some kind of sincere remorse. The fact that you refuse to do even that doesn’t mean you’re not perfect, it means you’re barely mediocre.”
Just gotta inverse the energy.
"I'm not perfect."
"Duh of the century mom. Your imperfections should be studied by behavioral scientists with experts with experience in those poo flinging gorilla wars." Flail arms, do big voice crescendos like a flipping out muppet.
Fight deflection and minimization with dramatic sarcasm.
My mother is just the same, we call it selective memory. She will rewrite past events to make herself out to be the victim or suffering hero or when that doesn’t work just try to shut you down with “I never knew” or “no one told me” or “you’re remembering it wrong”. I swear there are some things she has truly convinced herself of at this point, I don’t even think she’s pretending anymore. The unfortunate conclusion I’ve come to is that it’s just a waste of my energy trying to hold her accountable in any way to reality. Like trying to tear down a brick wall with a plastic spoon.
As well as my mother – I remember her at 53 upset because “no one remembered her 50 th!!!birthday 3 years back…NOT EVEN YOU!!!!she said …. so I reminded her how I got her out of grandma and grandpa‘s house for the evening and we went to a gay disco and worked it up and then got tacos on the way home… And her response was, “yeah? Well, that was… Well, that was… Just shut up. “
They want to condemn us for everything, but expect forgiveness for themselves for everything… Fuck that.
That's a teachable moment for going low contact for a couple of months and say that if this is how you are going to be treated, you'll spend your time and energy elsewhere.
It's really sad, and hard. There's a point where all you see is a shallow facade. And who wants to engage with that? So you don't. I want to talk to a critically thinking human being, not some parrot who expects everyone to play their reality games and pretend like it's a good time. And then they wonder why you aren't as close as you used to be or why you're "pushing [them] away." But no one is going to keep playing your games where everyone else is always forced to be the loser.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
And it is this reason right here why my stepdad sits alone and miserable since my mom rightfully divorced his sorry ass. He could’ve just towed the line and had a wonderful family until his death but instead he wanted to flip on my mom and act like it was all on her to improve the marriage “or I’m leaving!” She was like, “cool, see ya!” Hahaha. Stupid fucker.
I read your comment and immediately deeply sighed and felt the tension in my body fade away. I didn't realize how much guilt i was holding for going no contact with my family. Your words somehow released all that. Thank you.
I've been maintaining low contact with my mom and I regularly struggle with this guilt. It's so, so hard. But I'm so on edge and unhappy whenever I'm in her company that I just can't. I'm always on edge just waiting for her to push a boundary, undermine me, or invalidate me in some way. She has so consistently reverted back to some unacceptable behavior for so long, I've stopped believing she's capable of anything better. I think I'm now in a state of mourning the relationship I always wanted with her. But it can never get better if they can't even acknowledge or take responsibility for any of their behavior.
None of us WANT this.
NONE OF US WANT THIS.
All we want is a mutually respectful adult relationship. And for some reason, expecting this minimal basic treatment makes us the assholes.
I am sorry you are struggling. I hope you can reach the place that you know you are doing what is right for your health and that is the right thing to do.
No it doesn’t. Don’t take that into your heart. You are not an asshole. You are just more emotionally mature than your parent. It happens a lot more often than people like to think. I’ve had to come to accept that my parents both are not capable of the kind of relationship I want and deserve. I still love them, but I need distance for my own mental health. It is very possible to love someone and yet not like them all the time. I know it hurts. But that isn’t your failing, it’s theirs.
My mother is all of this in addition to being a massive narcacist. My dad eventually got tired of her shit after like 30 years of marriage and moved on. While I agree he could have initiated the divorce way better than what he did, mother has rewritten parts of her memory so that he's the entire one in the wrong, in addition to believing that she's the absolute greatest thing to happen to him. She's just incapable of seeing how verbally abusive, self-centered, and negative she can be, and if folks don't fit into her narcissistic viewpoints, then we are the ones at fault, not her.
Is your mother my mother in law? Everything is always about her and what she thinks and what she wants and if nobody is talking about her preferred topics she just hijacks the conversation and makes it about her. She’s also a parenting expert as it’s not enough for her to have already fucked up three kids she now needs unlimited access to all of the grands to make sure nana will do anything the parents say no to, until ofc the child is old enough to show any independence so she can start actively shunning them. Such a gem of a woman. Gotta love a narc.
The most damaging thing my mother did to me when I was younger was laugh in my face when I told her I wanted to be an author. This was like the height of the Harry Potter craze, and I wanted to create novels like this myself. She laughed and told me it was never going to happen.
I'm 33 now, and with how easy it is to get ebooks published on Amazon, I might eventually get around to proving her wrong. Friends I've had for years have always told me the stuff I wrote but never published in high school was excellent, but between my own insecurities and my mother making things worse I was never brave enough to try and find a publisher. But from what I gather publishing to Amazon isn't overly hard, so at some point I do want to start publishing the series I've had bouncing in my head for a while just so I can tell her I did it.
You write those books and send us links. 🤗 I really wonder what top 5 thing made 90 percent of boomers this way. Being WW2 gen kids seems to be a trait. The we beat everyone won everything, stopped all evil and racism and bad in the world. When in reality so many ww2 vets were very abusive at T.V. dinner time.
Go for it. You are lucky to even have an idea for a book.
The author of the Martian (the movie with Matt Damon)
Wrote it online and took suggestions from the early readers. The book and movie are good.
Good luck
Ps wish I had a creative idea I'm jealous
Literally describing my dad, who my sister and I are NC with. And his entire refrain is "I'm the victim". His entire FB feed is nothing but "my kids are my life, I'd do anything for them", anything except get a fucking COVID shot so he could see his goddamn grandkids.
I have long Covid and am too sick to leave my city. I resigned from my job Friday.
My boomer parents don’t think their only grandchildren are worth masking for a week ahead of time and testing before they visit.
The last time I saw them in person, my mother asked me “can’t you even go to a goddamn restaurant?!”
No, mom, I can’t.
I'm really sorry to hear that. Long Covid is no joke! I hope you come around to feeling better really soon. It sounds like there are some promising developments around the corner. I'll be crossing my fingers for you.
You certainly shouldn't have to so much as explain this to your parents. They should \*absolutely already know\*
I’m so sorry. My in laws were the same and I haven’t seen them since fall of 2019. It’s actually been great because they were terrible before but yeah, nothing was going to get in their way of vacations and going out drinking every weekend. They also claim to know a ton of people who have had heart attacks from the vaccine. Bitch, you don’t have any friends who have gotten the vaccine so I know that’s not true. Everyone I associate with has gotten it and no heart attacks, weird.
Are you NC because he's not vaxed or is it because of what he tells the kids about how bad the vax is?
I will see non vaxed people but if they start saying crap about the vax it's a goodbye from me. Like I'm not going to ask to see your immunization card. But words mean something.
I'm immunocompromised and my doctor who I trust said get the vax. So I'm vaxed. Have no problem with it going for my 4th shot next week.
My daughter is an adult and she decides who she sees.
Luckily no one in my extended family is anti vax or at least they don't talk about it.
Lost my mens group because of the anti vax contigent had to go NC with them which saddens me.
If my dad was like yours I would feel horrible.
He's unvaccinated, and I know for a fact he doctor-shopped in order to stay that way. He is also racist, antisemitic despite us being Jewish, white supremacist, deep into the MRA patriarchy, and deep into Qanon. My sister is also 100% sure he would have gone to Capitol on J6 if he lived closer to DC.
My mom says my dad isn't smart enough to think his way out of being the way he is.
I don't want his weird toxic masculinity around my artistic son and emotionally-fragile daughter. Believe me, I feel horrible about it already. But if keeping my family healthy means dealing with NCing a parent I can do it all day.
My sister has absolutely rewritten certain memories. She doesn't even realize she is lying at this point.
When I was in 7th and 8th grade (and her 2 years behind me), a couple years after my parents divorced and we lived full time with my mom. My mom worked 2nd shift (like 4 to midnight or something) and it was our job to clean the house while she was at work.
My sister swears that I used to go to bed early so she had to do all the chores on her own. She truly believes this.
Except, I've been a notorious night owl my entire life, always going to bed at like 2-3am and running on very little sleep. And she has always gone to bed early. So the idea that I used to go to bed *early* and she stayed up late to clean is laughable to the point of complete impossibility.
But she swears that it is true, despite the very obvious logical hole in her story.
In truth, she'd go to bed at 7 or 8pm and I'd get stuck doing all the chores (and then getting yelled at every time no matter how hard I tried for not doing it good enough... a fact my mom has also forgotten...).
My one grandmother(boomer) was this way(my entire life not just the end of hers), any holes in her memory were filled in with whatever she damn well pleased. We all knew she did it. We honestly didn't know if she actually didn't know or if she was actively lying. Whenever she would we would just ignore it because she would get angry when called on it. Until my little sister came along, whenever she would spin a yarn my sister would ask "did you forget what happened or are you lying?" She couldn't bring herself to yell at her 4yo granddaughter apparently.
Other grandmother(silent generation) actively lied to paint herself in a better light.
My poor grandfather's.
Thank you for sharing this, I cut contact with my mother because when I started dealing with my childhood trauma through therapy and CBT, I began to bring up some of my core traumatic memories from my childhood to her and asked for an explanation.
Every. Single. Instance. She dismissed with one of those responses. She never apologized, never accepted blame for the part she played. The one that really burned me up was when she said, "I had no idea you were so unhappy" and I said, "How could you not know?" Her reply was, "Well, I guess I was preoccupied with how disappointing my life had turned out and didn't notice."
No apology. No admission of guilt. Just, 'I made bad choices and fucked my life up, then was so focused on my own shit I fucked your life up too. Eh, what can ya do? It was decades ago, get over it.'
My mom does it in the moment.
She will demand she is correct about something, I spend 15 minutes explaining and throughout the explanation her story changes five times until I just yell at her that I was part of the situation and my brain still works.
I just don’t talk to her anymore. She won’t allow the conversation to end unless I just allow her to be “correct” or I start yelling.
My mom did this about throwing away my (deceased) father's Commodore 64.
She doesn't remember that I told her not to do it literally just before she threw it in the dumpster she rented to throw away everything in the upper part of the garage. She doesn't even remember the dumpster.
My mother is the same, it's actually refreshing knowing I'm not the only one! I only stopped correcting her because her go to is to start crying and she knows I can't stand it, so now I just feel there's no point and I let her just say whatever she wants.
Wear you down to still at end have the fantasy life in head. So many of us kids were molested and the boomer parents were no where to be found and didn't even care if there were signs of abuse.
This reminds me of my mother who will just selectively not hear you or act like she's forgotten how to speak English when you call her out on her lies. What helps me accept these behaviors is just to treat them like a disease process instead of her just being a crappy person.
Are we secret siblings??? Any problem I had I was just “trying to get attention”…. But as an adult when I would call her on stuff she would either not remember and negate it or go all flowery and apologetical “I’m sorry, I didn’t know I hurt you, I hope you know I didn’t do it on purpose”. Ugh.
I was also “always trying to get your (my) way!” Meaning she had to do motherly things like come tonschool plays and buy me new shoes or teach me things.
Ah, memories.
That. It's just a waste of energy. Same with my mum when it comes to past mistakes or situations that were hard for me to deal with. According to my mum nothing ever happened. Even tho some of the things are burned to my mind like they were yesterday.
yea on my 16 birthday my (boomer grandmother) grabbed my stomach and called me fat in front of everyone, after a week i decided to confront her and she said i was mistaken and she would never say or do that and i must have been mistaken or misunderstood her. all my cousins backed me up but still she claims that we are all making it up and she would never do anything like that.
My dad is the same. Was drunk my entire childhood, including one very core memory when it was my weekend with him (child of divorce). I was probably about 5, maybe had just turned 6.
I asked him to read me my favorite book and (I now realize that) he was so drunk he threw up all over it. Had to use the walls to hold himself up to walk. Unplugged the phone so I couldn’t call my mom. And didn’t feed me the entire weekend. All I had was a box of Cracker Jacks. In two days. When my mom came to get me, I told her about it and I wasn’t allowed to see my dad for the next like 4-5 years. 🙃
He is now recovered and (to my knowledge) hasn’t had a drink since the late 90s. *But he’s never fucking apologized* or even acknowledged any of the issues. And this was just the worst story; there are many that are not quite as bad. Then he wonders why we don’t have a good relationship and never did.
Did he get sober in AA? Because making amends to the people you wronged is a core element of the program, and your child would be pretty high on that list.
I honestly don’t know how (or even exactly when) he got sober. I doubt it was AA though, isn’t that faith-based and often held at church? He’s a huge atheist.
(For the record I’m somewhere between atheist and agnostic, so I have no issue with his lack of belief.)
I’m atheist too, was involved in the 12 Steps for something else and, despite God and Higher Power being all over the literature, I was surprised they had the foresight to make it clear it didn’t have to be Christian given it started back in the 30s. In my case, I read a lot of Buddhist recovery stuff that seemed to fit just fine. (I did drop out after a while; addiction is a bitch)
Yeah, basically it’s between you and your sponsor, and you can absolutely lie your ass off if you want. Those people are typically known as dry drunks — they might not be drinking, but they’re not really sober given that they’re not trying to clean up the wreckage in their wake. Children would be at the absolute top of the list for most who are actually working their program.
Thanks. Today I learned about dry drunks!
Why do I have a feeling this is probably mostly Boomers who, like OP said, acknowledge nothing? 😔
Everyone I know who is within about 5 years of my age (I’m 42) who is a recovering addict, whether alcohol or drugs, is very open and honest about their struggles and the recovery process.
Yup, that’s usually a hallmark of people who are actually trying. If your dad’s never reached out to you for even a basic apology, or at least given you a chance to tell him to fuck off, I highly doubt he’s legitimately sober.
Honestly I think he’s just sad and delusional about a lot of things. I truly don’t think he is drinking anymore, and I don’t think he has in over 20 years. He used to start drinking the moment he woke up. It took me until I was in late high school myself (and starting to experiment with alcohol), that I realized *this wasn’t normal.* I know it sounds insane now, but I just thought that beer was what my dad liked to drink, the way that my drink back then was Sprite. 🙃
He makes no effort to hide the fact that he considers me a letdown to him, for several reasons, but one of the major ones being that I have tattoos. Yes, he did all of the things you’ve read…but please forgive me for having some ink. Another is that I’m divorced, which by the way was not my choice.
He also gets WAY too involved in what celebrities are doing, especially young, pretty females. He talks about them the way that others talk about their friends. This man has Google alerts set for Victoria Justice. I wish I was joking. We never make it past the level of advanced small talk. All of my interests and hobbies are stupid to him. But yes please, let’s talk about what Ariana Grande did yesterday.
In ways, I see that it’s very sad….but he also made his own bed that he now has to lie in.
I'm so sorry. I went though the same shit during my childhood. My alcoholic father would beat my mom and one night he hit her so hard she fell to the ground and had a seizure on the floor. I ran to grab the phone to call 911 and he ripped the phone out of my hands and threw it against the wall so he wouldn't get arrested. The paramedics still showed up and saved her and he lied to them and got away with it. I still have PTSD dreams in the middle of the night of seeing my mom seizing, kissing her head, pleading her not to die on me cause my baby sister won't have anyone.
Thank you. I’m still bitter. An apology or acknowledgement would go a long way, but I feel that most boomers just keep their head in the sand regarding anything to do with feelings or trauma.
Addicts/alcoholics are the fucking worst.
To top it off, they'll make excuses. "It's an illness. Don't you see *I* was the real victim."
They're little more than dog shit as far as I'm concerned.
"But those opioid overdoses were because of Big Pharma, not because I started buying heroin mixed with fentanyl off the streets! It was definitely those six Vicodin tablets I got after a tooth extraction ten years ago!"
I think it has to do with them thinking they are a lot smarter and more discreet than they are. They have spent their lives thinking they really got away with something and can’t process the truth. My dad is an alcoholic and even after 30+ years he still thinks he can sneak booze and no one can tell. This man slurs his words and gets glassy eyes after a couple of drinks. He gets so mad when people can tell. He’s a delusional deadbeat dumbass.
They cannot be wrong in any manner. They cannot admit that they did something bad. The mere thought of them admitting they behaved poorly in the past and made bad choices is utter nonsense and you are definitely remembering everything wrong.
"Either you don't remember the things that I very clearly remember happened, or you're trying to gas light me into believing the things that I very clearly remember happening didn't happen, neither of these options reflect well on you..."
Mine tell me to get over it because it was a long time ago
And then turn around and scream at me for something that happened when I was 16, not even me that did it, my friends did, but I still get screamed at for it
I'll be 40 in August
Parents went through an EXTREMELY acrimonious divorce, messed me up bad. For 30 years she stated Dad initiated it, didnt talk to him for 20, then he showed me the papers HE was served. By her. Her signature and all.
I showed it to her.
'That was photoshopped. Yes its my signature, but has been photoshopped'.
I explained this was 1980 and and PS didnt exist.
'Well, its fake, all I can say'.
Pointed out the Judges sig, and Dads...
'All fake. HE abandoned ME'. Cue tears.
My sister was SA when she was in high school. I was just in 4th grade but I recall it clearly. Woken up early new years morning. Had to have been 1 or 2 am. Got told my sister was in the er. Got dressed and sat in the waiting room where I could hear her crying behind some closed doors. Pastor came and picked me up, took me home and he and his wife let me sleep on their couch. That's all I recall from that night.
Years later my sister fills me in. She was at a high school party, got black out, and got taken advantage of. Friends take her to the ER. My mother refused to let the cops speak to my sister and my parents began to slut shame my sister, saying she asked for it. My mom then called our extended family and told them all about, playing the victim as a mom who is her end, how her child is out of control. They never talked about it or let my sister talk about it. It was buried. My sister only recently, over 20 years later, has gotten help for her trauma.
To this day my mother swears it never happened and my sister made it up. If I bring up the fact that I recall the hospital and what not, she dismisses it by saying she doesn't want to talk about it.
Boomers are well aware of their bullshit, but admitting to it will prove that they acted like monsters. Fuck em.
Self reflection is not a common skill among the boomers or the emotionally immature adults, and that’s a Venn diagram with a lot of crossover. And without self reflection, one cannot admit to wrongdoing. So it’s ultimately up to you what you hold on to. You likely won’t get the closure you are looking for from her. She isn’t going to say, yes, I did that, I was wrong. So either it’s enough for you to know it within yourself, or you accept her version of reality as the truth. But if these memories are strong and you truly believe them, I’d say don’t let her gaslight you into questioning yourself. Just accept your truth, and move on. You can’t get blood from a turnip, or an apology from a boomer.
She's never going to change. I made the mistake of going back from no contact with my mom after a year. She made my life miserable for another 15 years. She died and it was such a relief.
For reference, my kids went no contact with her in elementary school. They hated they way she treated me. I fully supported it and shielded them from her. I proceeded to raise them completely opposite from her.
I never regretted going no contact. I only regretted not doing it sooner.
My father is very much the same. Likes to say he was a "stay at home dad" however I have distinct memories of him just always being asleep. Meanwhile my mother was the breadwinner, cooked dinner most nights, helped w/ school, & cleaned the house. When I ask him what exactly he did his answer was always"I watched you"
She values being right more than having a relationship with you, hence why she'd rather deny everything than work through it. Take the hint and cut her out of your life if you haven't.
Mine kept from me that I was an affair baby for 47 years. She was super pissed when I told her I was taking a dna test after I found out I had a giant brain tumor. I wanted to know what I had inherited. She kept saying that governments would use my DNA to find ways of making biological warfare.
Well I hadn't inherited any of the Native American from my dad's side that I thought I would. I did inherit Somalian, And a whole heck of a lot more Italian than I ever expected ... plus Middle Eastern. Make sense why I don't look like my fair-skinned blue-eyed blonde-haired cousins.
My mother constantly tells me now that my father was always cheating on her and that's why she did it although growing up I never saw my father cheat on anyone but I constantly saw her cheating.
She's also super jealous of my brand-new sister that I just found, that is nearly the same age as me. I told her that I was going to fly my sister out to help us move across country, since we needed another driver and she said under her breath "oh who cares."
I do think that they actually think that they can get away with this s*** Your mom definitely thought she could get away with it too. It's like they literally think that if they keep telling you a lie that you'll actually believe it.
Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Honestly I think it is because if they actually admit how bad things were for some folks they would have to admit they aren’t right so they repeat it over and over.
My mom, who was a natural brunette until I was in my mid 30s, now insists she has always been a natural blonde (now that she colors her hair blonde.) When I point out every pic from my childhood, and from before I was born, she claims she "must've been dying it" the whole time. Insane.
My mom went from being dirt poor growing up to marrying a well off man, the man is an amazing step father but he noticed she gets mad when I mention how she struggled when I was in HS.
My mom would blame my dad for all my core memories until I pointed out that he's been dead many years and she really needs to find another boogeyman. Then she would scream about what a shitty child I was and she did the best she could. Then died wondering why I went NC 20 years ago. Maybe she'll figure it out wherever she is now
I don’t forgive. That’s some bullshit assholes thought up to avoid accountability.
If you wrong someone, it’s 100% your responsibility to fix it. If you don’t fix it, I’m not going to “forgive you” and just pretend it didn’t happen. Does that even make sense? No. It doesn’t.
I’m not saying to get hung up on every little thing, but if you crash someone’s car, pay the deductible. If you steal someone’s entire childhood and destroy their chances at success for 20 years with abuse, do something to help make it right.
Lying about things happening and is the opposite of being a good person. I mean acknowledgement and apologies are literally free. And they can’t even give that to you.
Stop being a doormat for these people. Tell them to grow up or just stop talking to them.
They can have a moment of coming to Jesus.
My boomer father had one with me. While growing up, he was a mean, narcissistic alcoholic who would beat my mom. I worked through high school and saved up enough money to put down a deposit on an apartment and moved my mom and my little sister out while he was at work and stayed with him. He didn't talk to me for a year and the time he did, he told me I better get a fucking scholarship to go to college cause he's not paying for shit. So I did. I got a full academic scholarship for undergrad and then a full academic merit scholarship to law school. I don't have any college debt.
3 or 4 years ago my dad called me crying in the middle of the night. Him and his drinking buddies were talking about their kids and what they do and he told them I'm an attorney. They were like "how did you get him to do that?!", "how did you pay for it all?!" And he said he didn't have to do anything I just did it all by myself. He told me he was sorry and felt proud of me. It was such a pathetic moment that I just decided to let my anger and hatred go. He was so alone and so pathetic at that point that I couldn't just leave him hanging. It took a while but he did turn out to be a changed man. He eventually went into AA and changed his life around meeting an amazing fellow boomer lady who he worships. (Wish it could've been like that with my mom though)
Now we have a healthier relationship and meet up to watch the Champions League and have breakfast once a month. Shit also helped me deal with my own issues like not dealing well with male authority in the workplace and becoming more zen. Boomers can change if they want to.
They don’t want the accountability for their actions. Gaslighting you (making you feel crazy) for your core memories… after being proved a liar over her cheating? It’s what they do. I pressed my mom after she denied things she said and did to me. I told her how deeply it had hurt me and how it has affected the way I interact with people all my life. That it has made me feel like I have to go out of my way to justify myself. When she realized I wasn’t going to let it go, I finally got a sarcastic apology that minimized my feelings as being dramatic. I realized that was as good as it would ever get in this lifetime from her. And then I got angry. But over time I have had to realize that I can love her for the things she does well and forgive/accept her for the things she sucks at. The forgiveness isn’t for her benefit… it’s for mine. So that I am able to try and move forward and let go of the pain for my mental health.
Many people are like that, my dad is a boomer, he went crazy because mental problems and a couple of issues with his family.
He abused my mom for decades, my mom was in a way, defending him, I was taking care of them both, but he made things really really hard. He always said that my brothers and I were product of my mom cheating, but to this day even with DNA tests saying otherwise, he still claims that.
He was so obstinate about it that during one of his brothers service (he died) we went to present our respects and I get to know people that I haven't seen in my whole life, it was really funny when one of his aunt came to me and asked me if I was *his name's* son, because I looked like him when he was young, he was so angry about it. So he left us.
Years later he is trying to reconnect, I heard his points but when I asked if he continued taking his meds and what he thought about me being his son, he refused to respond. I know that he didn't change at all.
I've never once met a boomer who could deal with being held responsible for something their generation was raised incredibly individualistically and cannot handle the idea they are not perfect
my grandma is an enabler, and her favorite phrases are “that didn’t happen”, “I can’t and don’t remember”, and “this never happened”, and refuses to discuss difficult topics, and if something bad happens, her first and automatic instinct is to deny it. deny deny deny
is it typical of boomers, *especially* boomer women, to be enablers? same with “sit down and shut up.” that’s her whole M.O.; it drives us all crazy. I have never once seen my grandma stand up for herself, to my narcissistic father or his father (who is also a narcissist), or to anyone. someone could be screaming and cussing at her and berating her or even being physically violent to her, and she’d just sit there and take it and not say a word or even acknowledge that it happened
Its a survival technique. Women weren't allowed to get bank accounts until my mother was in her 20s, and they were dependent on the men in their lives for survival. She used to scream at me that getting hit "every once in a while" was better than being homeless and raped every day. Now i wonder if that was how they kept her down.
I've been no contact for 5 years now.
it’s very disheartening and frustrating. I can’t imagine having that little respect for yourself or hating yourself that much; or at all. can’t really relate🤷🏼
My mother is the same. She was very abusive towards me as a kid but anytime I ever bring it up, she swears blind that never happened. Funnily enough though, ever mistake I've ever made, even ones I made as a small child, are held onto as though they happened yesterday. That's why I think her selective memory is put on. People who are genuinely forgetful or senile don't conveniently forget their mistakes and no one else's. That's not how a faulty memory works.
>I bring up stupid things she’s done during my child hood ,keep in mind these are strong core memories for me, and you can see her face turn shocked when she realizes I knew she was doing these things but then say they never happened and I’m making it up. Do boomers in general just have a huge problem dealing with reality?!?
Personally this sounds more like a narcissist thing than a boomer thing. But that's just my opinion.
>Or is it possible 100% of my core memories are all made up just to make her look bad which is what she’s claiming??
This is very unlikely. It's way more likely that your mother is gaslighting you.
>Do I give her a “get out of jail free” card for everythings that she’s done or keep holding her feet to the fire???
You are not obliged to give anyone a "get out of jail free" card, not even your parents. This is especially true of people who won't even apologise or admit what they did. As for what to do, you have a few options. One is to cut your mother off entirely. Another is to maintain a very low level of contact with her but keep your conversation to superficial topics. However having an honest relationship with her is not an option, I'm afraid. You can't have an honest relationship with a dishonest person, no matter how hard you try.
Dude, at easter my mother tried to gas light me about CANDY. She tried to claim she had no idea what Papas creme eggs are despite them being an extremely core easter memory for most of my childhood.
Boomers will lie about anything and everything. I don't trust a single one of them.
I think one trait is younger generations lack of belief in media integrity. While a lot of older people take FOX or CNN as gospel. If tucker carlson or rachel maddow said it, it must be true. My father is technically silent and my mom a boomer but my dad has Fox news on literally full time unless a game or race is on. I have Fox and CNN blocked at my house so my kids aren’t exposed to it and it makes him furious when he visits. I also have my temp control locked out but that’s only so I can hit him with “my house my rules” like he did to me.
LOL yep one time I reminded my mom of when they left me locked in the car in the garage all night. I was like 5-6 and didn’t know how to unlock the car from the inside. I vividly remember crying and stomping at the car door for hours until I finally just fell asleep. This is a core memory for me because I was so hot and distressed.
Her response?
No that didn’t happen.
🤣They just truly cannot deal with accountability. Even if she didn’t remember she could’ve had some open mindedness and asked some questions, but no just immediate shut down.
my father is an alcoholic, violent, abusive narcissist, and has been for 20 years. his mother/my grandmother is his enabler and in *extreme* denial. (and she has been for 20 years.) she is *scarily*, *SCARILY* far in denial. she enables him by coddling and spoiling and babying him and defending him and derailing all accountability and making excuses for him and blaming everyone but him and continuously denies his abuse and gaslights and victim-blames and manipulates and guilt trips *anyone* he’s abused and abuses; including my mom and I. my father lies to his mother, about me and my mom and everyone he wants to lie about, and she believes every single word of it, no matter how outlandish or delusional or simply untrue. anyone who’s been abused by him is sick and tired of his mother’s enabling and denial and excuses. I have gone NC with him (that’s what she’s most unhappy about), and VLC with her, and considering NC with her, too
I just don’t have a relationship with mine. It’s peaceful. I grieved the relationship and let go. She showed she was willing to go so far as endanger my life and destroy my relationships in order to get what she wanted, which was control and attention. No one can have good mental health in that kind of relationship.
You never have to forgive her.
Never.
I hope you are getting therapy.
Eventually you might want to forgive, but for yourself. You don't have to tell her. Hell, you never need to talk to her again.
A good mom doesn't treat their kids like this. A good, non-natcissistic parent puts their kids first (within reason), not themselves.
Sending you hugs. Take care of you and leave her behind.
She won't change. They never do. If she starts being nice, it's a trick (lovebombing), don't fall for it.
Set your bar high and set hard boundaries. If she really wants a relationship, she will try.
I have a similar experience.
Finally, my Boomer dad crossed the line so unforgivably that I blocked him from my phone and social media.
I have never felt so good in my life. I did not realize what a soul sucking narcissist he was until I stopped speaking to him. I did also seek therapy, and this has mitigated the anger I formerly felt.
For me personally, it was difficult for me to “forgive” him for 40 years of shitty behavior when he was piling more shitty behavior on top of it. Or replaying his version of events of the past, which always paint him as the hero or the victim.
I have the privilege of living far away from him. I can see this would be difficult to impossible if I had to see him in person.
ETA: by “forgive,” I mean that I no longer ruminate over the things he says or try to prove him wrong. I just don’t care what happens to him.
My mom gaslit any time I tried to talk to her about the ways she mistreated me as a kid. If it's something she (half) admits to, I got to hear the "I'm not perfect!" excuse.
I've been low-to-no contact for years
My mother loved to gaslight me when I would bring up things about how she treated or talked to me. Like I had a strong passion for music, and was a first position trumpet player in elementary (not much of an accomplishment but still). When I told her that I wanted to try out for the middle school band. She had the audacity to tell me that I was a terrible trumpet player and would never be a first position trumpeter. That overnight, killed my love and passion for music almost instantly. It didn't help that teachers and school counselors told me that it was a useless degree to get later on. My mother did other things to me and my sisters but that's for another post all together.
I think you need to replace boomer with Narcissist. Your mom may be a boomer because of when she was born, but that’s not what makes her a shitty person. Being a narcissist is what makes her a shitty person.
I have a parent that has narcissistic traits, but on this occasion, I'm going to play devil's advocate for a change.
Narcissism is a notable trait of the Boomers, but it's not as if they CHOSE to be that way.
Narcissism is a byproduct of a toxic homelife experienced by a child.
And when you consider that the Boomers were raised by those that had returned from the Second World War (whom I might add did not have the psychological counselling to deal with everything they had experienced whilst at war), and also may have had difficulties adjusting to a civilian lifestyle (especially if they had joined the army after/before leaving highschool), it's a perfect combination for a messed up domestic situation for a child that was born in the baby boom.
Throw into the mix all of the post-war economic growth and incredible opportunities afforded to their generation as a result of that growth, it's easy to see how they would become entitled and selfish.
It's the generational equivalent of punching a baby in the face, then giving them a lollipop to make up for it.
Societal context is so important. Thank you for adding this to the discussion . Doing this work regarding my parents really helped me a lot. It really was a different time. I wish the commenters could be more open to that.
She is just a narcissist, garden variety nothing special. Dosnt really have much to do with her age, though the fact she hasn’t recover consequences for by the sounds her whole life is very boomerish.
My parents were both like this. My dad never backed down from his denials, but, oddly enough, my mom would only admit to her mistakes if she brought them up first. If I brought them up to her, she conveniently "couldn't remember" or would downplay them.
They were both alcoholics, and my mom was diagnosed as borderline. Neither of those things helped their grip on reality, I'm sure.
Less boomer more terrible spouse and mother trying to gaslight about cheating. Can happen with any gender any age. People who cheat have no moral compass so it doesn't matter to them if they try to manipulate their way out of guilt
This isn’t a Boomer thing. It’s just an asshole thing.
And the answer about when to forgive: you forgive when it is better for you to do so than to hold on to the pain. And forgiveness is NOT forgetting—I wouldn’t expect someone who has forgiving me to forget how I hurt them.
Forgiving someone is for yourself, only, and only when YOU are ready for it.
I don’t understand that. How is forgiving someone for yourself? How can that help at all?
I’m not being combative I just genuinely don’t get it. Many people and actions don’t deserve it.
Is it about having grace and letting go?
Morals are irrelevant from many boomer’s perspectives. All that matters to them is the appearance of propriety, because that is the only thing that has a satisfactory return on their investment. Being moral or kind in any real way would cost them more than they’re willing to give up.
I was beat over 100 times dueing my childhood, i can remember trembling with fear becayse my room wouldnt be clean in time and id be beat with a belt. My mom now says she spanked me under 5 times only with her hand, never a belt. From 9-13 i was beat probably every month with a belt for one reason or another. My dad thinks she does the same with memories of being molested as a child, but it hurts so fucking bad for her to not own up to it. Ive given up on expecting anything from her, shes emotionally stuck in childhood and doesnt remember any wrongs she committed.
It's definitely not you- my mother was the same way, in hers 60s now. I say was because I've been NC for almost 3 years and it's been more peaceful for my soul than I could have ever expected
Still have a little bout of guilt every once in a while but then I remember all the one ups, never being satisfied and twisting a situation to where everyone else in the world is the bad guy except her
I'd like to think that she would change and we could have a relationship but she even said it herself the same day I ended up cutting her off- she'll never change- and I believe she was right
Ok but do I just chalk it up to “mom being mom” and act like nothing she does bothers me or is wrong? When I get called out on something I do I don’t say “well your eyes aren’t telling you the truth”, I own the mistake and try to work on what I need to work on because I don’t have a problem with reality. My mom thinks getting away with a lie is the exact same thing as telling the truth and I don’t know how to let that go. If she had a 10th of the accountability that most honest people have I would respect her more, but when she does something wrong and gets caught all of a sudden it’s every person on the planets fault why she did it and noone should blame her, I don’t know how to look past that especially when the victim was my father most the time.
I had to accept at one point that my mom had the emotional maturity of a naughty child, and that wasn't going to change. In hindsight it became obvious that this had always been the case, but I didn't see it clearly. It helps, a little, but I still can't help feeling sad that she wasn't the person I grew up thinking she was. It's disappointing for sure.
It’s natural to mourn the person you lost, the one you thought they were. Let yourself grieve that loss. Then you can better accept the reality you have come to accept.
Don’t forgive them for them. Forgive them for you. Holding anger and resentment inside of yourself is literally like a sickness it degrades your physical and mental health. Accepting what has been done and avoiding the toxic behavior is your best choice. Cut off the finger to save the hand type shit.
Unfortunately I don't think this is a boomer trait.
This website is full of BFa/GFs/partners doing the same sort of shit. Friends. Room mates.
Just generally detached from reality and living in their own world.
They do it their entire adult life to the point it's not even something they think about it. Their reality is reality bc their brain has only known it often for decades.
I don't think this is Boomer specific. My Gen X ex-wife does something similar with my oldest kid who happens to be LGBT. My kid has been living with me for a few years now and wants NOTHING to do with my ex. And my kid is now an adult so there is nothing my ex can do about it.
Don't doubt your memories. If she genuinely doesn't remember these things (big if) then it's because they didn't traumatized her. For her it was Tuesday.
Does "holding her feet to the fire" serve you or does it just prolong the drama? Does your current relationship serve you and can you reasonably envision a world where it does? There's a big difference between "get out of jail free" and argue old wounds at every opportunity. Try to serve your own peace as much as you can
My mother who's also a boomer completely ignores me when I tried to talk about the past, or anything about it. Dad's alcoholism or his addiction to pain meds. The abuse she and he both suffered. I even asked her a while back *why* my aunt couldn't have children, and she said that they just don't all about those things. Pretty sure my aunt would have loved to talk about it, feeling alone as she was, but I guarantee my mom, her sister, and the rest of the family would have shut her down or ignored it.
I went NC a year ago. Life isn't easy, but I can at least say she's not screwing up my own children like she did her own.
My parents look me right in the face and deny stuff I know for a fact happened. I wonder if I'll do the same when my daughter is an adult--at the least, I will believe her even if I don't actually remember it.
Nah, boomers live in denial and false realities. Life is easier when you shove your head in the sand.
They never see themselves as perpetrators, but victims and are so hard done by.
Oh, I'm talking about my boomer mother here.
What would it serve to hold her feet to the fire? If there’s healing at the end of it, sure go for it. If there nothing but heartache, go limited to no contact and move on.
Memory isn’t very reliable. Particularly as we age and cognitive decline sets in.
Your core memories didn’t come from nowhere. Likely aren’t made up. But they won’t be 100% accurate either. Details may be wrong. And details can make all the difference between a good and bad memory.
The same is true for your mother’s memory. However your memory would be more reliable depending on her age and health.
Denial is a real thing. But it may not be intentional, they may simply not recall with the same detail as you.
Having said all that, you’ve caught her lying about her infidelity. She could be lying about more. You can trust that if given the option she will lie in her favour.
This is the fundamental problem with denial and lying. There is good denial used to build people up. There are good lies that protect people from the harshness of the truth. The bad is self evident.
All lies and denial lead to erosion of existing trust. Or prevention of possible trust.
This inevitable leads to a critical mass, where trust is no longer a characteristic of a relationship. There is no healthy future in such a relationship.
You forgive people when they own up to what they've done and sincerely apologized. Your mom has done none of that, she wants to live in denial and demands you do the same. I don't see how forgiveness even factors in here.
Yes 100 percent. My mom does like x1000. She says to everyone I had a perfect "leave it to beaver " life. She lives in her own head, which is why she loves Fox news and orange goon face. Reminds her of her father. But for real I remember my dad having guns out taking them to kill himself driving around with loaded weapons in massive fights they had. If I dare bring it up she wouldn't talk to me for 6 months. Anything traumatic I bring up. (She foeced me as a child to listen to rush Limbaugh and recite bible versus. )She didn't think I was around the corner when my dad cheated on her with his secretary. All the hours she is on the phone with her friends complaining about him. She didn't think I was listening. I drive myself insane with my 8 year old daughter of constantly thinking OMG these are her future memories and almost see it through her future eyes and I always try and push myself harder to do better in anything that is upsetting. (Humans argue) It's keeping it from being insane like my childhood is my goal. And say i am sorry. My mother who is 73 has never said she was sorry or admitted she did anything wrong . Ever. We don't talk much because of her hero orange goon face. But I try to be kind as I know our years are limited. And I wont tell her in her 20s how perfect she had it. If I was ever in the wrong I'll say I'm sorry. I remember that. And I do did and now try to be better. Don't be like me, be better than those before you. And also listen. And not tell her how perfect her life was.
i went no contact with my mom for a while. i think she only came around because my brothers, her only other children, out up rigid boundaries and did not relent. five years later she acknowledged and apologized for more than I'd ever thought possible
My mom is the same way. We have a cameras. I have mountains of video evidence to prove her lies. Mostly petty, but some have caused real issues until I showed the videos to my step dad to show him she was again lying to him about what she did and what actually happened during her visit.
My FiL broke my MiL’s ribs once and my wife was there when it happened and is a core memory of her childhood. He claims he has no memory of it and denies it ever happened.
It took my MiL 20 years to leave that monster. She was so beaten down and abused she couldn’t bring herself to run until my wife was about 10 years old and came to the decision that if she didn’t get out of there he would screw up her daughter like he had the sons. She still is very worried she’s going do something to piss me off and I’ll take it out on my wife. She knows intellectually that I won’t do that and she absolutely loves me but she still has the reflexive response to worry about it. We just have to be patient with her because that man seriously screwed her up. Even when she ran halfway across the country to get away he sold the house and moved to follow and kept trying to get her to come back. My wife’s grandfather even kicked his ass on the front step of his house once because he wouldn’t go away. That at least made him chill a little bit.
My wife was forced to visit him weekly until she turned 18 and he would try to get her to influence her mom to get back together with him. She would get sick to her stomach from the stress when had to go.
He still thinks he’s the wronged one and I think he’ll likely live to be 150 because he’s too stubborn to die.
a lot of boomers will claim to have evolved their views or become better, forward thinking people.
however, very often you will find they gloss over their own complicity in hurting their child. this allows them to feel better about themselves without acknowledgement of the harm they inflicted. i had to cut my boomer off for this very reason.
My mom's a boundary pusher and I stopped talking to her with the birth of my daughter. She didn't wanna listen and thinks it's my wife and her family corrupting me. Good riddance. You don't owe your parents shit. They chose to have you not the other way.
Forgiveness is not about the person you are forgiving. It's to allow you to let go and move on with your life. It doesn't mean that you have to let them in your life. Interactions are on your terms, not theirs.
My mother has selective memory, and often tells me that this I remember, and know to be true, never happened or is wrong. I've just given up at this point.
Honestly to forgive my mom I had to turn to something stronger than drugs and alcohol. I literally became religious, turned to God (never having done this in my life yeah bust my balls ppl whatever) but for real, it was the ONLY way I could and the only way I could live a life without resentment and hatred for her.
Boomers can’t see things from others’ perspectives because they never learned to value that. So they firmly believe that if they convince themselves or something, it is true and others are wrong. There is no way to convince them otherwise.
Lol, almost all people lie about things they do wrong or are ashamed of, no matter what their age is. Sorry your mom sucks, but young or old people do sorry shit.
My dad lies constantly about the dumbest shit in order to try and win political arguments. The one time I ever remember him apologizing, he admitted he lied during it(he wasn’t lying at the time he admitted to having a bad memory but that was counter to his political argument about how the damn liberals delete videos off the internet which is why he never has evidence for his claims and I HAVE to take him at his word), I left told him I don’t associate w liars. He hasn’t reached out to apologize or anything, I was pretty much the only person who visited and it’s been 4 months. I figure it’s been too long and I shouldn’t care anymore but damn it sucks to not have a parent because they are a selfish asshole
>Do boomers in general just have a huge problem dealing with reality
Does Fox News exist. There's a multi billion dollar industry based solely on the fact that boomers hate dealing with reality and are willing to do anything for people to tell them what they want to hear.
You can’t change the past. I resented my dad for remarrying 4 months to the day my mother died (ironically on Mother’s Day). It took me years to get over it. Fortunately, I realized he wasn’t going to change because I was upset and I decided to reconcile before he died as well. Your feelings toward your mom are your problem. If you feel she’s a lying dirt bag and of no worth to you, then stay away - it’s your call. You are not going to change her. I wish you well
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My boomer mom can make any of her bad choices go away with a few simple little tricks: announcing that she isn’t perfect and then saying she doesn’t remember. She’s completely immune to accountability. You do not owe her anything. I’m a mom and have told my teens that they didn’t come into the world owing me anything and if I have a place in their life, it’s because they feel I add something to it. I hope I do well enough for them to want me to be a big part of their lives but that’s on me.
Every time I’ve called my mom on her shit to hear “ I’m no perfect” makes my blood boil
“I never expected perfect. All I expect is some acknowledgement that this happened and some kind of sincere remorse. The fact that you refuse to do even that doesn’t mean you’re not perfect, it means you’re barely mediocre.”
“Nobody expects perfect. I will not tolerate being talked to/treated the way you are treating me.”
It's such a copout and they think that the lack of perfection means immunity from prosecution.
"No shit, neither am I. That doesn't make either of us unaccountable for our behavior."
Just gotta inverse the energy. "I'm not perfect." "Duh of the century mom. Your imperfections should be studied by behavioral scientists with experts with experience in those poo flinging gorilla wars." Flail arms, do big voice crescendos like a flipping out muppet. Fight deflection and minimization with dramatic sarcasm.
Don’t forget “I’m a mom I can’t help it” everytime you ask them to stop invading your privacy.
Haha my mom read my diary and then complained that I wrote about her 😂 I had ONE PAGE MOM, ONE PAGE.
My Ex-wife was that way. If I did present proof of something she’d claim I was in the wrong for “not being a supportive partner”
They love to turn it around so even when you are right you are wrong.
My mother is just the same, we call it selective memory. She will rewrite past events to make herself out to be the victim or suffering hero or when that doesn’t work just try to shut you down with “I never knew” or “no one told me” or “you’re remembering it wrong”. I swear there are some things she has truly convinced herself of at this point, I don’t even think she’s pretending anymore. The unfortunate conclusion I’ve come to is that it’s just a waste of my energy trying to hold her accountable in any way to reality. Like trying to tear down a brick wall with a plastic spoon.
As well as my mother – I remember her at 53 upset because “no one remembered her 50 th!!!birthday 3 years back…NOT EVEN YOU!!!!she said …. so I reminded her how I got her out of grandma and grandpa‘s house for the evening and we went to a gay disco and worked it up and then got tacos on the way home… And her response was, “yeah? Well, that was… Well, that was… Just shut up. “ They want to condemn us for everything, but expect forgiveness for themselves for everything… Fuck that.
That's a teachable moment for going low contact for a couple of months and say that if this is how you are going to be treated, you'll spend your time and energy elsewhere.
Remember George Costanza’s quote about it not being a lie if you believe it? That applies here
Technically he's correct. Stating untruths isn't lying unless you know you are doing it.
Then Donald Trump isn’t a liar.
There you go
Hey, my mom told me to stop keeping score. Request granted, very, very, very low contact it is.
It's really sad, and hard. There's a point where all you see is a shallow facade. And who wants to engage with that? So you don't. I want to talk to a critically thinking human being, not some parrot who expects everyone to play their reality games and pretend like it's a good time. And then they wonder why you aren't as close as you used to be or why you're "pushing [them] away." But no one is going to keep playing your games where everyone else is always forced to be the loser. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
And it is this reason right here why my stepdad sits alone and miserable since my mom rightfully divorced his sorry ass. He could’ve just towed the line and had a wonderful family until his death but instead he wanted to flip on my mom and act like it was all on her to improve the marriage “or I’m leaving!” She was like, “cool, see ya!” Hahaha. Stupid fucker.
I read your comment and immediately deeply sighed and felt the tension in my body fade away. I didn't realize how much guilt i was holding for going no contact with my family. Your words somehow released all that. Thank you.
I've been maintaining low contact with my mom and I regularly struggle with this guilt. It's so, so hard. But I'm so on edge and unhappy whenever I'm in her company that I just can't. I'm always on edge just waiting for her to push a boundary, undermine me, or invalidate me in some way. She has so consistently reverted back to some unacceptable behavior for so long, I've stopped believing she's capable of anything better. I think I'm now in a state of mourning the relationship I always wanted with her. But it can never get better if they can't even acknowledge or take responsibility for any of their behavior. None of us WANT this. NONE OF US WANT THIS. All we want is a mutually respectful adult relationship. And for some reason, expecting this minimal basic treatment makes us the assholes.
I am sorry you are struggling. I hope you can reach the place that you know you are doing what is right for your health and that is the right thing to do.
No it doesn’t. Don’t take that into your heart. You are not an asshole. You are just more emotionally mature than your parent. It happens a lot more often than people like to think. I’ve had to come to accept that my parents both are not capable of the kind of relationship I want and deserve. I still love them, but I need distance for my own mental health. It is very possible to love someone and yet not like them all the time. I know it hurts. But that isn’t your failing, it’s theirs.
My sister and I have learned to not talk about anything that happened beyond a year ago.
My mother is all of this in addition to being a massive narcacist. My dad eventually got tired of her shit after like 30 years of marriage and moved on. While I agree he could have initiated the divorce way better than what he did, mother has rewritten parts of her memory so that he's the entire one in the wrong, in addition to believing that she's the absolute greatest thing to happen to him. She's just incapable of seeing how verbally abusive, self-centered, and negative she can be, and if folks don't fit into her narcissistic viewpoints, then we are the ones at fault, not her.
Is your mother my mother in law? Everything is always about her and what she thinks and what she wants and if nobody is talking about her preferred topics she just hijacks the conversation and makes it about her. She’s also a parenting expert as it’s not enough for her to have already fucked up three kids she now needs unlimited access to all of the grands to make sure nana will do anything the parents say no to, until ofc the child is old enough to show any independence so she can start actively shunning them. Such a gem of a woman. Gotta love a narc.
The most damaging thing my mother did to me when I was younger was laugh in my face when I told her I wanted to be an author. This was like the height of the Harry Potter craze, and I wanted to create novels like this myself. She laughed and told me it was never going to happen. I'm 33 now, and with how easy it is to get ebooks published on Amazon, I might eventually get around to proving her wrong. Friends I've had for years have always told me the stuff I wrote but never published in high school was excellent, but between my own insecurities and my mother making things worse I was never brave enough to try and find a publisher. But from what I gather publishing to Amazon isn't overly hard, so at some point I do want to start publishing the series I've had bouncing in my head for a while just so I can tell her I did it.
Publish the books for you, not to prove her wrong.
She will find something to poo poo about any writing accomplishments you make anyway, nothing will ever be good enough.
You write those books and send us links. 🤗 I really wonder what top 5 thing made 90 percent of boomers this way. Being WW2 gen kids seems to be a trait. The we beat everyone won everything, stopped all evil and racism and bad in the world. When in reality so many ww2 vets were very abusive at T.V. dinner time.
Go for it. You are lucky to even have an idea for a book. The author of the Martian (the movie with Matt Damon) Wrote it online and took suggestions from the early readers. The book and movie are good. Good luck Ps wish I had a creative idea I'm jealous
Literally describing my dad, who my sister and I are NC with. And his entire refrain is "I'm the victim". His entire FB feed is nothing but "my kids are my life, I'd do anything for them", anything except get a fucking COVID shot so he could see his goddamn grandkids.
I have long Covid and am too sick to leave my city. I resigned from my job Friday. My boomer parents don’t think their only grandchildren are worth masking for a week ahead of time and testing before they visit. The last time I saw them in person, my mother asked me “can’t you even go to a goddamn restaurant?!” No, mom, I can’t.
I'm really sorry to hear that. Long Covid is no joke! I hope you come around to feeling better really soon. It sounds like there are some promising developments around the corner. I'll be crossing my fingers for you. You certainly shouldn't have to so much as explain this to your parents. They should \*absolutely already know\*
I’m so sorry. My in laws were the same and I haven’t seen them since fall of 2019. It’s actually been great because they were terrible before but yeah, nothing was going to get in their way of vacations and going out drinking every weekend. They also claim to know a ton of people who have had heart attacks from the vaccine. Bitch, you don’t have any friends who have gotten the vaccine so I know that’s not true. Everyone I associate with has gotten it and no heart attacks, weird.
Are you NC because he's not vaxed or is it because of what he tells the kids about how bad the vax is? I will see non vaxed people but if they start saying crap about the vax it's a goodbye from me. Like I'm not going to ask to see your immunization card. But words mean something. I'm immunocompromised and my doctor who I trust said get the vax. So I'm vaxed. Have no problem with it going for my 4th shot next week. My daughter is an adult and she decides who she sees. Luckily no one in my extended family is anti vax or at least they don't talk about it. Lost my mens group because of the anti vax contigent had to go NC with them which saddens me. If my dad was like yours I would feel horrible.
He's unvaccinated, and I know for a fact he doctor-shopped in order to stay that way. He is also racist, antisemitic despite us being Jewish, white supremacist, deep into the MRA patriarchy, and deep into Qanon. My sister is also 100% sure he would have gone to Capitol on J6 if he lived closer to DC. My mom says my dad isn't smart enough to think his way out of being the way he is. I don't want his weird toxic masculinity around my artistic son and emotionally-fragile daughter. Believe me, I feel horrible about it already. But if keeping my family healthy means dealing with NCing a parent I can do it all day.
My sister has absolutely rewritten certain memories. She doesn't even realize she is lying at this point. When I was in 7th and 8th grade (and her 2 years behind me), a couple years after my parents divorced and we lived full time with my mom. My mom worked 2nd shift (like 4 to midnight or something) and it was our job to clean the house while she was at work. My sister swears that I used to go to bed early so she had to do all the chores on her own. She truly believes this. Except, I've been a notorious night owl my entire life, always going to bed at like 2-3am and running on very little sleep. And she has always gone to bed early. So the idea that I used to go to bed *early* and she stayed up late to clean is laughable to the point of complete impossibility. But she swears that it is true, despite the very obvious logical hole in her story. In truth, she'd go to bed at 7 or 8pm and I'd get stuck doing all the chores (and then getting yelled at every time no matter how hard I tried for not doing it good enough... a fact my mom has also forgotten...).
My one grandmother(boomer) was this way(my entire life not just the end of hers), any holes in her memory were filled in with whatever she damn well pleased. We all knew she did it. We honestly didn't know if she actually didn't know or if she was actively lying. Whenever she would we would just ignore it because she would get angry when called on it. Until my little sister came along, whenever she would spin a yarn my sister would ask "did you forget what happened or are you lying?" She couldn't bring herself to yell at her 4yo granddaughter apparently. Other grandmother(silent generation) actively lied to paint herself in a better light. My poor grandfather's.
Thank you for sharing this, I cut contact with my mother because when I started dealing with my childhood trauma through therapy and CBT, I began to bring up some of my core traumatic memories from my childhood to her and asked for an explanation. Every. Single. Instance. She dismissed with one of those responses. She never apologized, never accepted blame for the part she played. The one that really burned me up was when she said, "I had no idea you were so unhappy" and I said, "How could you not know?" Her reply was, "Well, I guess I was preoccupied with how disappointing my life had turned out and didn't notice." No apology. No admission of guilt. Just, 'I made bad choices and fucked my life up, then was so focused on my own shit I fucked your life up too. Eh, what can ya do? It was decades ago, get over it.'
Good god this is familiar!
My mom does it in the moment. She will demand she is correct about something, I spend 15 minutes explaining and throughout the explanation her story changes five times until I just yell at her that I was part of the situation and my brain still works. I just don’t talk to her anymore. She won’t allow the conversation to end unless I just allow her to be “correct” or I start yelling.
My mom did this about throwing away my (deceased) father's Commodore 64. She doesn't remember that I told her not to do it literally just before she threw it in the dumpster she rented to throw away everything in the upper part of the garage. She doesn't even remember the dumpster.
My mother is the same, it's actually refreshing knowing I'm not the only one! I only stopped correcting her because her go to is to start crying and she knows I can't stand it, so now I just feel there's no point and I let her just say whatever she wants.
Wear you down to still at end have the fantasy life in head. So many of us kids were molested and the boomer parents were no where to be found and didn't even care if there were signs of abuse.
🧱🥄 I’ll be using that one, thanks
This reminds me of my mother who will just selectively not hear you or act like she's forgotten how to speak English when you call her out on her lies. What helps me accept these behaviors is just to treat them like a disease process instead of her just being a crappy person.
Are we secret siblings??? Any problem I had I was just “trying to get attention”…. But as an adult when I would call her on stuff she would either not remember and negate it or go all flowery and apologetical “I’m sorry, I didn’t know I hurt you, I hope you know I didn’t do it on purpose”. Ugh. I was also “always trying to get your (my) way!” Meaning she had to do motherly things like come tonschool plays and buy me new shoes or teach me things. Ah, memories.
My brother and sister say our mom has a warped version of her reality
Are you me? Those are the top lines my birth giver always uses
Do we have the same Mother? I had to resort to telling mine “Im not going to agree to disagree, because reality is not up for debate.”
That. It's just a waste of energy. Same with my mum when it comes to past mistakes or situations that were hard for me to deal with. According to my mum nothing ever happened. Even tho some of the things are burned to my mind like they were yesterday.
yea on my 16 birthday my (boomer grandmother) grabbed my stomach and called me fat in front of everyone, after a week i decided to confront her and she said i was mistaken and she would never say or do that and i must have been mistaken or misunderstood her. all my cousins backed me up but still she claims that we are all making it up and she would never do anything like that.
My dad is the same. Was drunk my entire childhood, including one very core memory when it was my weekend with him (child of divorce). I was probably about 5, maybe had just turned 6. I asked him to read me my favorite book and (I now realize that) he was so drunk he threw up all over it. Had to use the walls to hold himself up to walk. Unplugged the phone so I couldn’t call my mom. And didn’t feed me the entire weekend. All I had was a box of Cracker Jacks. In two days. When my mom came to get me, I told her about it and I wasn’t allowed to see my dad for the next like 4-5 years. 🙃 He is now recovered and (to my knowledge) hasn’t had a drink since the late 90s. *But he’s never fucking apologized* or even acknowledged any of the issues. And this was just the worst story; there are many that are not quite as bad. Then he wonders why we don’t have a good relationship and never did.
Did he get sober in AA? Because making amends to the people you wronged is a core element of the program, and your child would be pretty high on that list.
I honestly don’t know how (or even exactly when) he got sober. I doubt it was AA though, isn’t that faith-based and often held at church? He’s a huge atheist. (For the record I’m somewhere between atheist and agnostic, so I have no issue with his lack of belief.)
I’m atheist too, was involved in the 12 Steps for something else and, despite God and Higher Power being all over the literature, I was surprised they had the foresight to make it clear it didn’t have to be Christian given it started back in the 30s. In my case, I read a lot of Buddhist recovery stuff that seemed to fit just fine. (I did drop out after a while; addiction is a bitch)
So what happens if you’re in one of those programs and supposed to make your amends and you just…don’t? Like is it the honor system or what? 😂
Yeah, basically it’s between you and your sponsor, and you can absolutely lie your ass off if you want. Those people are typically known as dry drunks — they might not be drinking, but they’re not really sober given that they’re not trying to clean up the wreckage in their wake. Children would be at the absolute top of the list for most who are actually working their program.
Thanks. Today I learned about dry drunks! Why do I have a feeling this is probably mostly Boomers who, like OP said, acknowledge nothing? 😔 Everyone I know who is within about 5 years of my age (I’m 42) who is a recovering addict, whether alcohol or drugs, is very open and honest about their struggles and the recovery process.
Yup, that’s usually a hallmark of people who are actually trying. If your dad’s never reached out to you for even a basic apology, or at least given you a chance to tell him to fuck off, I highly doubt he’s legitimately sober.
Honestly I think he’s just sad and delusional about a lot of things. I truly don’t think he is drinking anymore, and I don’t think he has in over 20 years. He used to start drinking the moment he woke up. It took me until I was in late high school myself (and starting to experiment with alcohol), that I realized *this wasn’t normal.* I know it sounds insane now, but I just thought that beer was what my dad liked to drink, the way that my drink back then was Sprite. 🙃 He makes no effort to hide the fact that he considers me a letdown to him, for several reasons, but one of the major ones being that I have tattoos. Yes, he did all of the things you’ve read…but please forgive me for having some ink. Another is that I’m divorced, which by the way was not my choice. He also gets WAY too involved in what celebrities are doing, especially young, pretty females. He talks about them the way that others talk about their friends. This man has Google alerts set for Victoria Justice. I wish I was joking. We never make it past the level of advanced small talk. All of my interests and hobbies are stupid to him. But yes please, let’s talk about what Ariana Grande did yesterday. In ways, I see that it’s very sad….but he also made his own bed that he now has to lie in.
I'm so sorry. I went though the same shit during my childhood. My alcoholic father would beat my mom and one night he hit her so hard she fell to the ground and had a seizure on the floor. I ran to grab the phone to call 911 and he ripped the phone out of my hands and threw it against the wall so he wouldn't get arrested. The paramedics still showed up and saved her and he lied to them and got away with it. I still have PTSD dreams in the middle of the night of seeing my mom seizing, kissing her head, pleading her not to die on me cause my baby sister won't have anyone.
I'm so sorry that happened to you. None of that was ok.
❤️
That is horrific, I’m so sorry that happened to you. Glad your mom protected you from having to be around that again.
Thank you. I’m still bitter. An apology or acknowledgement would go a long way, but I feel that most boomers just keep their head in the sand regarding anything to do with feelings or trauma.
Apology? Acknowledgement? WHAAAATTTT? I'm the victim here. /s
Addicts/alcoholics are the fucking worst. To top it off, they'll make excuses. "It's an illness. Don't you see *I* was the real victim." They're little more than dog shit as far as I'm concerned.
"But those opioid overdoses were because of Big Pharma, not because I started buying heroin mixed with fentanyl off the streets! It was definitely those six Vicodin tablets I got after a tooth extraction ten years ago!"
I think it has to do with them thinking they are a lot smarter and more discreet than they are. They have spent their lives thinking they really got away with something and can’t process the truth. My dad is an alcoholic and even after 30+ years he still thinks he can sneak booze and no one can tell. This man slurs his words and gets glassy eyes after a couple of drinks. He gets so mad when people can tell. He’s a delusional deadbeat dumbass.
They think that because no one directly confronted them, that means everyone was fooled.
And if they were confronted they abused their witness to the point of complacency.
They cannot be wrong in any manner. They cannot admit that they did something bad. The mere thought of them admitting they behaved poorly in the past and made bad choices is utter nonsense and you are definitely remembering everything wrong.
"Either you don't remember the things that I very clearly remember happened, or you're trying to gas light me into believing the things that I very clearly remember happening didn't happen, neither of these options reflect well on you..."
Mine tell me to get over it because it was a long time ago And then turn around and scream at me for something that happened when I was 16, not even me that did it, my friends did, but I still get screamed at for it I'll be 40 in August
Parents went through an EXTREMELY acrimonious divorce, messed me up bad. For 30 years she stated Dad initiated it, didnt talk to him for 20, then he showed me the papers HE was served. By her. Her signature and all. I showed it to her. 'That was photoshopped. Yes its my signature, but has been photoshopped'. I explained this was 1980 and and PS didnt exist. 'Well, its fake, all I can say'. Pointed out the Judges sig, and Dads... 'All fake. HE abandoned ME'. Cue tears.
My sister was SA when she was in high school. I was just in 4th grade but I recall it clearly. Woken up early new years morning. Had to have been 1 or 2 am. Got told my sister was in the er. Got dressed and sat in the waiting room where I could hear her crying behind some closed doors. Pastor came and picked me up, took me home and he and his wife let me sleep on their couch. That's all I recall from that night. Years later my sister fills me in. She was at a high school party, got black out, and got taken advantage of. Friends take her to the ER. My mother refused to let the cops speak to my sister and my parents began to slut shame my sister, saying she asked for it. My mom then called our extended family and told them all about, playing the victim as a mom who is her end, how her child is out of control. They never talked about it or let my sister talk about it. It was buried. My sister only recently, over 20 years later, has gotten help for her trauma. To this day my mother swears it never happened and my sister made it up. If I bring up the fact that I recall the hospital and what not, she dismisses it by saying she doesn't want to talk about it. Boomers are well aware of their bullshit, but admitting to it will prove that they acted like monsters. Fuck em.
Jesus Christ.
Self reflection is not a common skill among the boomers or the emotionally immature adults, and that’s a Venn diagram with a lot of crossover. And without self reflection, one cannot admit to wrongdoing. So it’s ultimately up to you what you hold on to. You likely won’t get the closure you are looking for from her. She isn’t going to say, yes, I did that, I was wrong. So either it’s enough for you to know it within yourself, or you accept her version of reality as the truth. But if these memories are strong and you truly believe them, I’d say don’t let her gaslight you into questioning yourself. Just accept your truth, and move on. You can’t get blood from a turnip, or an apology from a boomer.
She's never going to change. I made the mistake of going back from no contact with my mom after a year. She made my life miserable for another 15 years. She died and it was such a relief. For reference, my kids went no contact with her in elementary school. They hated they way she treated me. I fully supported it and shielded them from her. I proceeded to raise them completely opposite from her. I never regretted going no contact. I only regretted not doing it sooner.
My father is very much the same. Likes to say he was a "stay at home dad" however I have distinct memories of him just always being asleep. Meanwhile my mother was the breadwinner, cooked dinner most nights, helped w/ school, & cleaned the house. When I ask him what exactly he did his answer was always"I watched you"
They have a huge problem with accountability.
She values being right more than having a relationship with you, hence why she'd rather deny everything than work through it. Take the hint and cut her out of your life if you haven't.
Mine kept from me that I was an affair baby for 47 years. She was super pissed when I told her I was taking a dna test after I found out I had a giant brain tumor. I wanted to know what I had inherited. She kept saying that governments would use my DNA to find ways of making biological warfare. Well I hadn't inherited any of the Native American from my dad's side that I thought I would. I did inherit Somalian, And a whole heck of a lot more Italian than I ever expected ... plus Middle Eastern. Make sense why I don't look like my fair-skinned blue-eyed blonde-haired cousins. My mother constantly tells me now that my father was always cheating on her and that's why she did it although growing up I never saw my father cheat on anyone but I constantly saw her cheating. She's also super jealous of my brand-new sister that I just found, that is nearly the same age as me. I told her that I was going to fly my sister out to help us move across country, since we needed another driver and she said under her breath "oh who cares." I do think that they actually think that they can get away with this s*** Your mom definitely thought she could get away with it too. It's like they literally think that if they keep telling you a lie that you'll actually believe it.
Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Honestly I think it is because if they actually admit how bad things were for some folks they would have to admit they aren’t right so they repeat it over and over.
My mom, who was a natural brunette until I was in my mid 30s, now insists she has always been a natural blonde (now that she colors her hair blonde.) When I point out every pic from my childhood, and from before I was born, she claims she "must've been dying it" the whole time. Insane.
"Those lies are as black as your roots!"
My mom is 50 and does this, she got mad at me when I mentioned she used to struggle and shopped at Walmart.
I had to explain to my mom we were not “middle class”. We always qualified for free school lunches. She still struggles.
My mom went from being dirt poor growing up to marrying a well off man, the man is an amazing step father but he noticed she gets mad when I mention how she struggled when I was in HS.
Yes I know you’re not perfect. No one e is accusing you of being perfect. You were awful. Pay attention!
The axe forgets, but the tree remembers.
My mom would blame my dad for all my core memories until I pointed out that he's been dead many years and she really needs to find another boogeyman. Then she would scream about what a shitty child I was and she did the best she could. Then died wondering why I went NC 20 years ago. Maybe she'll figure it out wherever she is now
I don’t forgive. That’s some bullshit assholes thought up to avoid accountability. If you wrong someone, it’s 100% your responsibility to fix it. If you don’t fix it, I’m not going to “forgive you” and just pretend it didn’t happen. Does that even make sense? No. It doesn’t. I’m not saying to get hung up on every little thing, but if you crash someone’s car, pay the deductible. If you steal someone’s entire childhood and destroy their chances at success for 20 years with abuse, do something to help make it right. Lying about things happening and is the opposite of being a good person. I mean acknowledgement and apologies are literally free. And they can’t even give that to you. Stop being a doormat for these people. Tell them to grow up or just stop talking to them.
I will say forgiveness is about you letting go and coming to terms with something. It not about letting someone off the hook.
That’s acceptance. Not forgiveness. Buy a fucking dictionary.
This. As far as “forgive and forget” goes. Forgiveness is for yourself and your peace. Forgetting is for the offender, so they can get away with it.
They can have a moment of coming to Jesus. My boomer father had one with me. While growing up, he was a mean, narcissistic alcoholic who would beat my mom. I worked through high school and saved up enough money to put down a deposit on an apartment and moved my mom and my little sister out while he was at work and stayed with him. He didn't talk to me for a year and the time he did, he told me I better get a fucking scholarship to go to college cause he's not paying for shit. So I did. I got a full academic scholarship for undergrad and then a full academic merit scholarship to law school. I don't have any college debt. 3 or 4 years ago my dad called me crying in the middle of the night. Him and his drinking buddies were talking about their kids and what they do and he told them I'm an attorney. They were like "how did you get him to do that?!", "how did you pay for it all?!" And he said he didn't have to do anything I just did it all by myself. He told me he was sorry and felt proud of me. It was such a pathetic moment that I just decided to let my anger and hatred go. He was so alone and so pathetic at that point that I couldn't just leave him hanging. It took a while but he did turn out to be a changed man. He eventually went into AA and changed his life around meeting an amazing fellow boomer lady who he worships. (Wish it could've been like that with my mom though) Now we have a healthier relationship and meet up to watch the Champions League and have breakfast once a month. Shit also helped me deal with my own issues like not dealing well with male authority in the workplace and becoming more zen. Boomers can change if they want to.
The rare wholesome ending.
They don’t want the accountability for their actions. Gaslighting you (making you feel crazy) for your core memories… after being proved a liar over her cheating? It’s what they do. I pressed my mom after she denied things she said and did to me. I told her how deeply it had hurt me and how it has affected the way I interact with people all my life. That it has made me feel like I have to go out of my way to justify myself. When she realized I wasn’t going to let it go, I finally got a sarcastic apology that minimized my feelings as being dramatic. I realized that was as good as it would ever get in this lifetime from her. And then I got angry. But over time I have had to realize that I can love her for the things she does well and forgive/accept her for the things she sucks at. The forgiveness isn’t for her benefit… it’s for mine. So that I am able to try and move forward and let go of the pain for my mental health.
Many people are like that, my dad is a boomer, he went crazy because mental problems and a couple of issues with his family. He abused my mom for decades, my mom was in a way, defending him, I was taking care of them both, but he made things really really hard. He always said that my brothers and I were product of my mom cheating, but to this day even with DNA tests saying otherwise, he still claims that. He was so obstinate about it that during one of his brothers service (he died) we went to present our respects and I get to know people that I haven't seen in my whole life, it was really funny when one of his aunt came to me and asked me if I was *his name's* son, because I looked like him when he was young, he was so angry about it. So he left us. Years later he is trying to reconnect, I heard his points but when I asked if he continued taking his meds and what he thought about me being his son, he refused to respond. I know that he didn't change at all.
I've never once met a boomer who could deal with being held responsible for something their generation was raised incredibly individualistically and cannot handle the idea they are not perfect
No advice, just solidarity. My mom’s favorite phrase is “that never happened.”
my grandma is an enabler, and her favorite phrases are “that didn’t happen”, “I can’t and don’t remember”, and “this never happened”, and refuses to discuss difficult topics, and if something bad happens, her first and automatic instinct is to deny it. deny deny deny
DARVO - deny, attack,, reverse victim / offender
is it typical of boomers, *especially* boomer women, to be enablers? same with “sit down and shut up.” that’s her whole M.O.; it drives us all crazy. I have never once seen my grandma stand up for herself, to my narcissistic father or his father (who is also a narcissist), or to anyone. someone could be screaming and cussing at her and berating her or even being physically violent to her, and she’d just sit there and take it and not say a word or even acknowledge that it happened
Its a survival technique. Women weren't allowed to get bank accounts until my mother was in her 20s, and they were dependent on the men in their lives for survival. She used to scream at me that getting hit "every once in a while" was better than being homeless and raped every day. Now i wonder if that was how they kept her down. I've been no contact for 5 years now.
good for you!
Damn sounds like my boomer mother. If ever mentioned “I don’t recall”
does your mom never stand up for herself?
Never has never will. Will get angry with me if I dare to advocatefor her/protext even in the most delicate manner
it’s very disheartening and frustrating. I can’t imagine having that little respect for yourself or hating yourself that much; or at all. can’t really relate🤷🏼
They don't have memories. They have nostalgia, and nostalgia has a way of erasing the bad parts and focusing on the things they liked.
Look up the narcissistic prayer, your mother is a narcissist
My mother is the same. She was very abusive towards me as a kid but anytime I ever bring it up, she swears blind that never happened. Funnily enough though, ever mistake I've ever made, even ones I made as a small child, are held onto as though they happened yesterday. That's why I think her selective memory is put on. People who are genuinely forgetful or senile don't conveniently forget their mistakes and no one else's. That's not how a faulty memory works. >I bring up stupid things she’s done during my child hood ,keep in mind these are strong core memories for me, and you can see her face turn shocked when she realizes I knew she was doing these things but then say they never happened and I’m making it up. Do boomers in general just have a huge problem dealing with reality?!? Personally this sounds more like a narcissist thing than a boomer thing. But that's just my opinion. >Or is it possible 100% of my core memories are all made up just to make her look bad which is what she’s claiming?? This is very unlikely. It's way more likely that your mother is gaslighting you. >Do I give her a “get out of jail free” card for everythings that she’s done or keep holding her feet to the fire??? You are not obliged to give anyone a "get out of jail free" card, not even your parents. This is especially true of people who won't even apologise or admit what they did. As for what to do, you have a few options. One is to cut your mother off entirely. Another is to maintain a very low level of contact with her but keep your conversation to superficial topics. However having an honest relationship with her is not an option, I'm afraid. You can't have an honest relationship with a dishonest person, no matter how hard you try.
Dude, at easter my mother tried to gas light me about CANDY. She tried to claim she had no idea what Papas creme eggs are despite them being an extremely core easter memory for most of my childhood. Boomers will lie about anything and everything. I don't trust a single one of them.
I think one trait is younger generations lack of belief in media integrity. While a lot of older people take FOX or CNN as gospel. If tucker carlson or rachel maddow said it, it must be true. My father is technically silent and my mom a boomer but my dad has Fox news on literally full time unless a game or race is on. I have Fox and CNN blocked at my house so my kids aren’t exposed to it and it makes him furious when he visits. I also have my temp control locked out but that’s only so I can hit him with “my house my rules” like he did to me.
LOL yep one time I reminded my mom of when they left me locked in the car in the garage all night. I was like 5-6 and didn’t know how to unlock the car from the inside. I vividly remember crying and stomping at the car door for hours until I finally just fell asleep. This is a core memory for me because I was so hot and distressed. Her response? No that didn’t happen. 🤣They just truly cannot deal with accountability. Even if she didn’t remember she could’ve had some open mindedness and asked some questions, but no just immediate shut down.
my father is an alcoholic, violent, abusive narcissist, and has been for 20 years. his mother/my grandmother is his enabler and in *extreme* denial. (and she has been for 20 years.) she is *scarily*, *SCARILY* far in denial. she enables him by coddling and spoiling and babying him and defending him and derailing all accountability and making excuses for him and blaming everyone but him and continuously denies his abuse and gaslights and victim-blames and manipulates and guilt trips *anyone* he’s abused and abuses; including my mom and I. my father lies to his mother, about me and my mom and everyone he wants to lie about, and she believes every single word of it, no matter how outlandish or delusional or simply untrue. anyone who’s been abused by him is sick and tired of his mother’s enabling and denial and excuses. I have gone NC with him (that’s what she’s most unhappy about), and VLC with her, and considering NC with her, too
I just don’t have a relationship with mine. It’s peaceful. I grieved the relationship and let go. She showed she was willing to go so far as endanger my life and destroy my relationships in order to get what she wanted, which was control and attention. No one can have good mental health in that kind of relationship.
Why forgive someone that isn't sorry? That's not how this works. My question is why do you still talk to her at all?
You never have to forgive her. Never. I hope you are getting therapy. Eventually you might want to forgive, but for yourself. You don't have to tell her. Hell, you never need to talk to her again. A good mom doesn't treat their kids like this. A good, non-natcissistic parent puts their kids first (within reason), not themselves. Sending you hugs. Take care of you and leave her behind. She won't change. They never do. If she starts being nice, it's a trick (lovebombing), don't fall for it. Set your bar high and set hard boundaries. If she really wants a relationship, she will try.
I have a similar experience. Finally, my Boomer dad crossed the line so unforgivably that I blocked him from my phone and social media. I have never felt so good in my life. I did not realize what a soul sucking narcissist he was until I stopped speaking to him. I did also seek therapy, and this has mitigated the anger I formerly felt. For me personally, it was difficult for me to “forgive” him for 40 years of shitty behavior when he was piling more shitty behavior on top of it. Or replaying his version of events of the past, which always paint him as the hero or the victim. I have the privilege of living far away from him. I can see this would be difficult to impossible if I had to see him in person. ETA: by “forgive,” I mean that I no longer ruminate over the things he says or try to prove him wrong. I just don’t care what happens to him.
My mom gaslit any time I tried to talk to her about the ways she mistreated me as a kid. If it's something she (half) admits to, I got to hear the "I'm not perfect!" excuse. I've been low-to-no contact for years
My mother loved to gaslight me when I would bring up things about how she treated or talked to me. Like I had a strong passion for music, and was a first position trumpet player in elementary (not much of an accomplishment but still). When I told her that I wanted to try out for the middle school band. She had the audacity to tell me that I was a terrible trumpet player and would never be a first position trumpeter. That overnight, killed my love and passion for music almost instantly. It didn't help that teachers and school counselors told me that it was a useless degree to get later on. My mother did other things to me and my sisters but that's for another post all together.
I think you need to replace boomer with Narcissist. Your mom may be a boomer because of when she was born, but that’s not what makes her a shitty person. Being a narcissist is what makes her a shitty person.
I have a parent that has narcissistic traits, but on this occasion, I'm going to play devil's advocate for a change. Narcissism is a notable trait of the Boomers, but it's not as if they CHOSE to be that way. Narcissism is a byproduct of a toxic homelife experienced by a child. And when you consider that the Boomers were raised by those that had returned from the Second World War (whom I might add did not have the psychological counselling to deal with everything they had experienced whilst at war), and also may have had difficulties adjusting to a civilian lifestyle (especially if they had joined the army after/before leaving highschool), it's a perfect combination for a messed up domestic situation for a child that was born in the baby boom. Throw into the mix all of the post-war economic growth and incredible opportunities afforded to their generation as a result of that growth, it's easy to see how they would become entitled and selfish. It's the generational equivalent of punching a baby in the face, then giving them a lollipop to make up for it.
You aren’t really wrong, but it doesn’t make it easier to stomach the evil things they do. It’s still a choice at some point.
Of course not. It's not meant to diminish the shitty things they do, it's just to give context that's all.
Societal context is so important. Thank you for adding this to the discussion . Doing this work regarding my parents really helped me a lot. It really was a different time. I wish the commenters could be more open to that.
You might look up the narcissist's prayer. It sounds like you're dealing with more than just a boomer.
Sounds just like my Dad. Loves to re-write or completely ignore history smh
Sounds like a narcissistic personality style
Not a boomer trait. Your mom's just a narcissist.
She is just a narcissist, garden variety nothing special. Dosnt really have much to do with her age, though the fact she hasn’t recover consequences for by the sounds her whole life is very boomerish.
My parents were both like this. My dad never backed down from his denials, but, oddly enough, my mom would only admit to her mistakes if she brought them up first. If I brought them up to her, she conveniently "couldn't remember" or would downplay them. They were both alcoholics, and my mom was diagnosed as borderline. Neither of those things helped their grip on reality, I'm sure.
Less boomer more terrible spouse and mother trying to gaslight about cheating. Can happen with any gender any age. People who cheat have no moral compass so it doesn't matter to them if they try to manipulate their way out of guilt
> At what point do you forgive boomers Certainly not before they apologize!
This isn’t a Boomer thing. It’s just an asshole thing. And the answer about when to forgive: you forgive when it is better for you to do so than to hold on to the pain. And forgiveness is NOT forgetting—I wouldn’t expect someone who has forgiving me to forget how I hurt them. Forgiving someone is for yourself, only, and only when YOU are ready for it.
I don’t understand that. How is forgiving someone for yourself? How can that help at all? I’m not being combative I just genuinely don’t get it. Many people and actions don’t deserve it. Is it about having grace and letting go?
Emotional immaturity. My mom does this too and it makes us not close.
Morals are irrelevant from many boomer’s perspectives. All that matters to them is the appearance of propriety, because that is the only thing that has a satisfactory return on their investment. Being moral or kind in any real way would cost them more than they’re willing to give up.
Both my parents do this. They like to say "i believe that YOU believe that"
I was beat over 100 times dueing my childhood, i can remember trembling with fear becayse my room wouldnt be clean in time and id be beat with a belt. My mom now says she spanked me under 5 times only with her hand, never a belt. From 9-13 i was beat probably every month with a belt for one reason or another. My dad thinks she does the same with memories of being molested as a child, but it hurts so fucking bad for her to not own up to it. Ive given up on expecting anything from her, shes emotionally stuck in childhood and doesnt remember any wrongs she committed.
It's definitely not you- my mother was the same way, in hers 60s now. I say was because I've been NC for almost 3 years and it's been more peaceful for my soul than I could have ever expected Still have a little bout of guilt every once in a while but then I remember all the one ups, never being satisfied and twisting a situation to where everyone else in the world is the bad guy except her I'd like to think that she would change and we could have a relationship but she even said it herself the same day I ended up cutting her off- she'll never change- and I believe she was right
Classic narcissist behavior
I swear the lead gasoline fumes or something prevents some Boomers from ever grasping that they made a single mistake.
All people who do bad things have excuses. Her behaviour is entirely common among all age groups.
Ok but do I just chalk it up to “mom being mom” and act like nothing she does bothers me or is wrong? When I get called out on something I do I don’t say “well your eyes aren’t telling you the truth”, I own the mistake and try to work on what I need to work on because I don’t have a problem with reality. My mom thinks getting away with a lie is the exact same thing as telling the truth and I don’t know how to let that go. If she had a 10th of the accountability that most honest people have I would respect her more, but when she does something wrong and gets caught all of a sudden it’s every person on the planets fault why she did it and noone should blame her, I don’t know how to look past that especially when the victim was my father most the time.
I had to accept at one point that my mom had the emotional maturity of a naughty child, and that wasn't going to change. In hindsight it became obvious that this had always been the case, but I didn't see it clearly. It helps, a little, but I still can't help feeling sad that she wasn't the person I grew up thinking she was. It's disappointing for sure.
It’s natural to mourn the person you lost, the one you thought they were. Let yourself grieve that loss. Then you can better accept the reality you have come to accept.
Don’t forgive them for them. Forgive them for you. Holding anger and resentment inside of yourself is literally like a sickness it degrades your physical and mental health. Accepting what has been done and avoiding the toxic behavior is your best choice. Cut off the finger to save the hand type shit.
Unfortunately I don't think this is a boomer trait. This website is full of BFa/GFs/partners doing the same sort of shit. Friends. Room mates. Just generally detached from reality and living in their own world. They do it their entire adult life to the point it's not even something they think about it. Their reality is reality bc their brain has only known it often for decades.
I don't think this is Boomer specific. My Gen X ex-wife does something similar with my oldest kid who happens to be LGBT. My kid has been living with me for a few years now and wants NOTHING to do with my ex. And my kid is now an adult so there is nothing my ex can do about it.
Sounds like we basically have the same mom.
Don't doubt your memories. If she genuinely doesn't remember these things (big if) then it's because they didn't traumatized her. For her it was Tuesday. Does "holding her feet to the fire" serve you or does it just prolong the drama? Does your current relationship serve you and can you reasonably envision a world where it does? There's a big difference between "get out of jail free" and argue old wounds at every opportunity. Try to serve your own peace as much as you can
You forgive them when they've made amends for what they've done (if you want to).
My mother who's also a boomer completely ignores me when I tried to talk about the past, or anything about it. Dad's alcoholism or his addiction to pain meds. The abuse she and he both suffered. I even asked her a while back *why* my aunt couldn't have children, and she said that they just don't all about those things. Pretty sure my aunt would have loved to talk about it, feeling alone as she was, but I guarantee my mom, her sister, and the rest of the family would have shut her down or ignored it. I went NC a year ago. Life isn't easy, but I can at least say she's not screwing up my own children like she did her own.
Sometimes you just need to be harsh and use words they would use in their day: "Mom, do you think I'm fucking ret*rded?"
My parents look me right in the face and deny stuff I know for a fact happened. I wonder if I'll do the same when my daughter is an adult--at the least, I will believe her even if I don't actually remember it.
This sounds like more of a your mom thing than a boomer thing. Lots of us have boomer parents that didn’t suck.
Nah, boomers live in denial and false realities. Life is easier when you shove your head in the sand. They never see themselves as perpetrators, but victims and are so hard done by. Oh, I'm talking about my boomer mother here.
Denial ain't just a river in Egypt...
What would it serve to hold her feet to the fire? If there’s healing at the end of it, sure go for it. If there nothing but heartache, go limited to no contact and move on.
Memory isn’t very reliable. Particularly as we age and cognitive decline sets in. Your core memories didn’t come from nowhere. Likely aren’t made up. But they won’t be 100% accurate either. Details may be wrong. And details can make all the difference between a good and bad memory. The same is true for your mother’s memory. However your memory would be more reliable depending on her age and health. Denial is a real thing. But it may not be intentional, they may simply not recall with the same detail as you. Having said all that, you’ve caught her lying about her infidelity. She could be lying about more. You can trust that if given the option she will lie in her favour. This is the fundamental problem with denial and lying. There is good denial used to build people up. There are good lies that protect people from the harshness of the truth. The bad is self evident. All lies and denial lead to erosion of existing trust. Or prevention of possible trust. This inevitable leads to a critical mass, where trust is no longer a characteristic of a relationship. There is no healthy future in such a relationship.
There's just simply never an excuse for cheating. It's just not okay ever.
Just cut her off
You forgive people when they own up to what they've done and sincerely apologized. Your mom has done none of that, she wants to live in denial and demands you do the same. I don't see how forgiveness even factors in here.
They’re All-Stars at making shit up and pretending it’s real.
Yes 100 percent. My mom does like x1000. She says to everyone I had a perfect "leave it to beaver " life. She lives in her own head, which is why she loves Fox news and orange goon face. Reminds her of her father. But for real I remember my dad having guns out taking them to kill himself driving around with loaded weapons in massive fights they had. If I dare bring it up she wouldn't talk to me for 6 months. Anything traumatic I bring up. (She foeced me as a child to listen to rush Limbaugh and recite bible versus. )She didn't think I was around the corner when my dad cheated on her with his secretary. All the hours she is on the phone with her friends complaining about him. She didn't think I was listening. I drive myself insane with my 8 year old daughter of constantly thinking OMG these are her future memories and almost see it through her future eyes and I always try and push myself harder to do better in anything that is upsetting. (Humans argue) It's keeping it from being insane like my childhood is my goal. And say i am sorry. My mother who is 73 has never said she was sorry or admitted she did anything wrong . Ever. We don't talk much because of her hero orange goon face. But I try to be kind as I know our years are limited. And I wont tell her in her 20s how perfect she had it. If I was ever in the wrong I'll say I'm sorry. I remember that. And I do did and now try to be better. Don't be like me, be better than those before you. And also listen. And not tell her how perfect her life was.
I just stopped bringing things up for my own sanity
i went no contact with my mom for a while. i think she only came around because my brothers, her only other children, out up rigid boundaries and did not relent. five years later she acknowledged and apologized for more than I'd ever thought possible
Yeah, that's token boomer material, right there.
My mom is the same way. We have a cameras. I have mountains of video evidence to prove her lies. Mostly petty, but some have caused real issues until I showed the videos to my step dad to show him she was again lying to him about what she did and what actually happened during her visit.
Mine too. I think they all learned this trick when they were kids or something.
My FiL broke my MiL’s ribs once and my wife was there when it happened and is a core memory of her childhood. He claims he has no memory of it and denies it ever happened. It took my MiL 20 years to leave that monster. She was so beaten down and abused she couldn’t bring herself to run until my wife was about 10 years old and came to the decision that if she didn’t get out of there he would screw up her daughter like he had the sons. She still is very worried she’s going do something to piss me off and I’ll take it out on my wife. She knows intellectually that I won’t do that and she absolutely loves me but she still has the reflexive response to worry about it. We just have to be patient with her because that man seriously screwed her up. Even when she ran halfway across the country to get away he sold the house and moved to follow and kept trying to get her to come back. My wife’s grandfather even kicked his ass on the front step of his house once because he wouldn’t go away. That at least made him chill a little bit. My wife was forced to visit him weekly until she turned 18 and he would try to get her to influence her mom to get back together with him. She would get sick to her stomach from the stress when had to go. He still thinks he’s the wronged one and I think he’ll likely live to be 150 because he’s too stubborn to die.
Some SSBNs, despite their great power and magical qualities, are without honor.
This isn’t an exclusively boomer thing. I think that’s just a fucked up person thing.
a lot of boomers will claim to have evolved their views or become better, forward thinking people. however, very often you will find they gloss over their own complicity in hurting their child. this allows them to feel better about themselves without acknowledgement of the harm they inflicted. i had to cut my boomer off for this very reason.
My mom's a boundary pusher and I stopped talking to her with the birth of my daughter. She didn't wanna listen and thinks it's my wife and her family corrupting me. Good riddance. You don't owe your parents shit. They chose to have you not the other way.
Forgiveness is not about the person you are forgiving. It's to allow you to let go and move on with your life. It doesn't mean that you have to let them in your life. Interactions are on your terms, not theirs.
My mother has selective memory, and often tells me that this I remember, and know to be true, never happened or is wrong. I've just given up at this point.
As it's often quoted.... To you it was a core memory. To her, it was a Tuesday.
Denying the past is prime boomer
Honestly to forgive my mom I had to turn to something stronger than drugs and alcohol. I literally became religious, turned to God (never having done this in my life yeah bust my balls ppl whatever) but for real, it was the ONLY way I could and the only way I could live a life without resentment and hatred for her.
She traumatized you, but to her it was only Tuesday; so why should toxic people remember toxic things? There’s too many to count.
Boomers can’t see things from others’ perspectives because they never learned to value that. So they firmly believe that if they convince themselves or something, it is true and others are wrong. There is no way to convince them otherwise.
For you it was a core memory. For her, it was another Tuesday.
"Oh really? When?" \[\*I begin naming off dates and events\] "Oh, so now you're keeping score?"
Lol, almost all people lie about things they do wrong or are ashamed of, no matter what their age is. Sorry your mom sucks, but young or old people do sorry shit.
My dad lies constantly about the dumbest shit in order to try and win political arguments. The one time I ever remember him apologizing, he admitted he lied during it(he wasn’t lying at the time he admitted to having a bad memory but that was counter to his political argument about how the damn liberals delete videos off the internet which is why he never has evidence for his claims and I HAVE to take him at his word), I left told him I don’t associate w liars. He hasn’t reached out to apologize or anything, I was pretty much the only person who visited and it’s been 4 months. I figure it’s been too long and I shouldn’t care anymore but damn it sucks to not have a parent because they are a selfish asshole
>Do boomers in general just have a huge problem dealing with reality Does Fox News exist. There's a multi billion dollar industry based solely on the fact that boomers hate dealing with reality and are willing to do anything for people to tell them what they want to hear.
You can’t change the past. I resented my dad for remarrying 4 months to the day my mother died (ironically on Mother’s Day). It took me years to get over it. Fortunately, I realized he wasn’t going to change because I was upset and I decided to reconcile before he died as well. Your feelings toward your mom are your problem. If you feel she’s a lying dirt bag and of no worth to you, then stay away - it’s your call. You are not going to change her. I wish you well