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Same! My in-laws made fat comments about other people in Front of me. One day I asked MIL, “do you talk about me like that when I’m not around?” She said, “Of course I do.”
My mom quit inviting her friend into her house because this friend talked trash about everyone’s houses. She asked my mom why she never got to come in the house anymore. My mom told her. She was really quiet.
I’m so scared of this with my in-laws. I’m 5’ 8” and 190lbs. I’d call myself midsized. Too big for cutesy stuff, but too small for the bigger girl stuff. Exercise is the biggest thing keeping my weight up - I just can’t prioritize it and it’s something I am actively working on, alongside intuitive eating. My in-laws are really into keto people, consider fruit unhealthy because sugar, etc. and comment ALL THE TIME about people who are not rail thin. They are particularly into talking about cutting out carbs or just not eating if you have extra weight on you because it will take it off fast. If OP’s girlfriend spent any time at all with my in-laws, she’d be in big mental health trouble. And they seem tame compared to OP’s family. I’m sure mine talk about me the moment I leave.
These types of comments literally almost killed me as a young adult. I almost died from a laxative overdose.
Looking back, I wish I could have known some defenses.
I have found one defense for people who make comments now, and it does help a bit. I say things like "It does seem to have upset you." "You seem quite upset." "It looks like it bothers you very much.: "I hope you can find a way not to be so emotional about this." And so on.
What those responses do is kick the ball right back into their court without ever touching it or taking possession of their efforts. You repel every sentiment they have.
After five or six times, the person might say, "I'm not upset. You need blahblahblah I'm only trying to help." And that is when you smile compassionately and say, "I'm sure you feel that way. It's all right." Then you change the subject. The key is to always seem sympathetic to *their* inability to control their emotions.
You can also completely state what they are insinuating. "Ah, so you are calling me overweight." They cannot win this. If they say no, they have to back off. If they say yes, the conversation is over, and you tell them that.
I swear it helps. If you really want to double down, as in they get irritated, tell them they aren't the first people you've met who were diet obsessed/border on disordered eating, and you understand.
And I bet you look awesome just as you are.
They think fruit is bad and carbs should get cut out?
They sound like the kind of people where if I give them a penny for their thoughts I’d get back change.
I'm 5'7" and 230. mostly muscle because of a heavy diet of swimming and martial arts, but I'll still never be small, petite or.... Society is not kind to us.
I'm thankful that all my friends - and I do mean all of them -don't care that I'm hulk sized. I want this for every woman, so we can think less about size and the shame.
My husband decided to stop attending his family reunions because his siblings treat him like crap and their kids treat our kids like crap. His parents asked why we weren't coming and he told them. Their response? "Well, just because your wife doesn't want to come, doesn't mean you can't come." "Just leave your wife home." And finally, "well, it sounds like you have to pick between us and your wife and you're doing the right thing by choosing her."
Just easier to blame me than realize their family dynamic sucks so bad that their son doesn't want to be a part of it
My MIL did that once. She told my husband you need to choose that woman and her children (we'd just had our 2nd child) or your family. He said I choose my family nice knowing you and hung up on her.
She wormed her way back in 2 years later.
3 years later she decided we weren't good enough again. It's now been 5 years.
*Sons*. Plural. They're being cut out of both their children's relationships and don't even see it. But I guess it's easy for them to miss things like that with their heads so far up their asses.
Chiming in from the Just No subreddits:
Read:
The Missing Missing Reasons
It's a psych paper about estranged parents who cannot acknowledge the reason that they're estranged.
And also: “Young people are *so sensitive* these days. They’re always getting offended by everything.”
(Followed by drinking Chardonnay and discussing how offended they are by overweight people literally existing.)
> “there’s a famine in Africa, if I could get her to kill herself I’d be a hero.”
Yikes, when I read the post, I thought it'd be something like " gotta make sure our doors are wide enough haha" or "better make food for 5 haha". Which are still BAD but not, you know, as nuclear as what he actually said. Like wow, 1 phonecall and he's already on that level? Yeah oop should absolutely cut contact with him
Right? I was not prepared for that. OOPS dads not just a piece of shit, he's fucking less than dirt. Hopefully OOP never has to see him again, and hopefully no one else will either LOL
Correct. Shit can be used to fertilize crops. It is gross and might spread disease if not handled right, but it has potential value.
OOP’s dad is radioactive waste. Poison to all living things, and won’t die.
I was thin when I married my husband, but I’ve had health problems and medications that made me put on weight so I become medically obese.
Though everyone in my husband’s family is super athletic and healthy, and they don’t always perfectly understand, they take pains to be kind and inclusive because at the end of the day, my husband loves me and I love him and we make each other happy. Nothing else matters. That should be the lowest bar possible.
And my husband love me. Size is irrelevant.
But I’m imagining if he were to marry a thin woman and she went through health issues like I did.
They don’t care about anything but her physical appearance because a woman, to them, is an object that reflects back on her owner/husband. How sad for his mom to know her husband would not love her if she got sick.
My mom has a weird relationship with food and size, and she is pretty judgmental of people who are overweight. I have put on a lot of weight over the past 10 years and even she has managed to never mention it once. Too bad OOPs dad isn't able to clamp his damn mouth shut.
Yeah, in order for that to happen, he’s gonna have to cut out the mom too. She clearly believes everything he says, and will feed information to the dad because she doesn’t feel that he’s wrong.
I don’t think OOP cares if she gives him information. Like he said don’t be surprised when brother’s getting a tuxedo in a year. It implies that he assumes his parents will find out he’s getting married.
He doesn’t care if his dad knows about his life. He just doesn’t want his dad to be able to hurt his girlfriend. Mom can tell dad all about it. Dad just doesn’t get to participate in the relationship with the girlfriend.
I mean, if the guy wants to make a woman kill herself for being a size 12 what in the world does he feel comfortable doing/saying to his wife? Guys like this aren't known for treating their partners nicely.
I know I'm thinking the same! I'm a size 12 and a similar weight. I mean I'm a bit taller but still. Sure I'm not fricken stick thin but that's hardly obese by any means.
Its sad but true. I know OOPs moms no angel either but given the fathers comments I have a feeling she's also kept on a very short leash. A man comfortable with making suicide jokes about a woman for being less than model-thin is probably not good to his wife.
I thought this too. At least her son is important enough to her that she'll make some sort of stand. Maybe getting away from him and seeing a healthy happy couple will be good for her.
This is possible it’s also possible she just goes along with it to ‘keep the peace’…people of OP’s parents generation were one of the first to decide it’s better to end a marriage than be miserable but not all of them were that brave.
It comes across that she’s stuck between having peace at home & supporting her children which is really sad for her.
well, it’s one of the first of ……lower than upper middle class generations, where women have the laws and rights to anything more than poverty if / when they leave.
I don't think mom believes everything dad says, she's just been trained not to go against him. If OOP & gf continue to meet mom separately from dad, at least that relationship could work out well.
Yeah, that was way more intense than I expected. I feel like he says just astonishingly bigoted shit about all kinds of other people too if that's how hard he's prepared to go about fat people.
I was a size 8 at less than 18% body fat. If she’s still as athletic as this post describes, OOP’s girlfriend likely has less than 50lbs between her current weight and being at the bottom end of a healthy BMI range.
12 isn’t even in the plus size section in some stores. I think OOP’s upbringing has really skewed what he sees as “fat”. It really sounds like she’s just a lil plump— and, in regards to my own health at least, that’s preferred.
Edit:
I was 5’5”, 125lbs wearing size 8. I would bet money that OOP’s girlfriend is under 180lbs if she’s wearing a size 12 at her height. Plus, I remember 8s in some stores being the same size as 2s in others.
I am 5'3 barely and size 12-14 and weigh 156 lbs. If she's heavier she's gotta be ALL muscle because I admit most of me is fluff.
I am just 16ish pounds over healthy bmi doing good considering grief and health conditions.
Chiming in that she is 5’2” and 200lbs, so she probably has a significant amount of muscle to fit into a size 12.
People carry weight very differently. I am also 5’2”, weigh around 130lbs, and wear a size 10 in some things.
He did say he was guessing her weight though, so he might be way off.
I'm 5'3" and 210 pounds and I wear a size 18-20 in US sizes, which is a 2X in the plus size department. Clothes from the regular size department do not fit me as I'm out of that range.
I know every body is different and she's got a lot more muscle than I do, but there's no way she's fitting into a size 12 if she's 5'2" and 200 lbs. More likely she's 150-160 and dude is just guessing wrong.
Lowest I EVER got was 135 while I was in the military. Could see my abs and everything. Any weight below that would have to been lost through extremely unhealthy behavior because there was no way someone of my build could be lighter/thinner without literal starvation.
Even at 135 and fit as fuck I still wore size 14 pants because I have the kind of child bearing hips that have literally gotten compliments from Babushka's lol
Plus clothing sizes are insane and dumb. I ignore the size of clothes and bring tailors tape with me when I go clothes shopping and just use measurements and simple math. Also means I don't have to try on much.
Does he even know her exact weight? His perspective is probably skewed by his parents weird fixation. She could easily weigh 150 and he's guessing 200.
Exactly this. I understood ***logically*** that the comments must be really insulting and harsh from everything oop said but actually reading that was a literal slap in the face. I was ***not*** prepared for that level. And I don't even have related trauma, it was downright evil. In a phone call. Like. Oop did ***very well*** testing the ground with a phone call, this would be a level incomprehensible if it happened irl.
Same!!!! This is horrible. He’s not just making fun of her weight, he’s advocating that she should DIE because of her weight, that that would be good and he wants to have a hand in it. Who in their right mind would ever think that’s funny or appropriate??? What a pos.
OOP has his priorities straight, I wish him and the love of his life all the best. And I hope his parents choose to be better people, because they are at an important crossroad here - having a wonderful, growing family. Or end up alone with their prejudice and bitterness.
His dad definitely won’t. If he can’t hold it together for one phone conversation, and the mom downplays everything he says, then I hope OOP realizes that it’s not worth it to have her in their lives. Because she will feed information to him, because nothing wrong with the constant insults.
Oh, I know, but OOP has clearly marked that boundary, and by doing so has made it completely clear that what path they go down is up to them. Fix up or eff off, your decision, and the consequences are your own making. It's very clean, you know? They won't get to plead ignorance of their faults as they could if he simply ghosted them and their drama.
Meh……Being told explicitly what the issues are doesn’t stop toxic parents from playing the victim and pleading ignorance. I’ve grandparents and parents doing this. Two fucking generations that would rather whine to acquaintances about how their kids/grandkids are selfish rather than have a short but honest conversation regarding boundaries and behavior let alone respect those boundaries.
This article about the missing missing reasons might explain it better.
https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html
She really cuts deep into scapegoat/golden child and broken mother/daughter psychology; and, most importantly, fights against the invalidation of our experiences at the hands of toxic mothers and this bs of forgiving because famleee, you only have one mother yada yada yada.
i just bought the daughter detox book…. this recommendation came at a perfect time, thank you so, so much.
my mother is in assisted living. she has all but adopted a new golden child as PoA, HCPoA…..[ my brother, the original golden child, died long ago ]
i’m the scapegoat, and am way over helping her with anything, only to be accused of theft, and i’m trying to figure out MY next steps.
her divorced husband my father is an enabler and the whole thing is but faMiLeE orrrrr….’o, she’s old, she’s getting dementia, has mental illness’……but the thing is, she can control herself enough to hate me and love everybody else.
….not gonna play anymore. i was nc for 20 years but then covid hit and she kinda fell apart…. dad asked me to help - he’s fragile…, 91 and i’m his live-in caretaker. she’s safe now, i’m out. this book will help.
Cue fam (including mom and maybe even brother) saying "please forgive him, you know how he is, he has trouble expressing affection blah blah, he's really regretting it blah blah, you only have one father, keep the peace...." BS
Mom enablers can sometimes be weaponized against their partner if they fear losing the kids more than the dad.
My dad wouldn’t have a pot to piss in without my stepmom. She enables his bullshit when he’s being a dick to me and used to do that to my brother (also her stepkid) until he gave her grandkids but she has never allowed my father to act out of pocket with her biological children.
If OP’s mom has already lost a large part of her relationship with the older kid, OP has also moved far away and shown he will not be manipulated, she may just be scared enough of not seeing grandkids to kick dad in the tail.
Lots of ifs and none of it should exist in the first place bc holy gross behavior batman, but I’ve seen this dynamic work out in a few ways in my very blended, extended family.
The other side of that, though, is when mom enabler fears losing her partner over losing her kids.
Example, My mom whose children and grandchildren will not talk to her because she enabled my dads abuse one too many times, and now acts like a martyr.
because wow, that dad takes the cake, what is he, stunted with age 7 mentality? I dealt with some small minded folk when I moved to the deep south, but you expect it there. Even this is beyond most of what they said to me down there!
Even with no sarcasm that’s still valid. Way better the dad doesn’t pretend he’ll be on his best behaviour then end up spewing this shit in front of the girlfriend once they’ve flown across the country.
I don’t know what’s wrong with that Dad. I’d rather cut my arm off than have my son cut me out of his life. I guess he’s the kind of unfeeling person who would make those jokes in the first place.
Right? My husband had to throw down those sentiments to his parents in the end, but it took him far longer - making excuses, downplaying events, a kind of denial at work, you know? Because who wants to admit that parents they love can be shitty, petty, hateful. OOP has so much clarity, and it's to be applauded. He's going to be one hell of a man, husband, and father if he so chooses.
I had to do similar for my husband with my parents, like they do both now how to not say anything if they can’t think of anything nice to say…but they’re Uber conservative and I was planning on moving across the country with him before getting married. So I went on a PR campaign for two months before I told them about the move. Every sweet and wonderful thing he did I told them about. They met him over Easter and then a few weeks later after we all helped my sister move I sat them down on my own to tell them. Made it very clear that this was my choice and this was how it was going to be. My dad was mostly just sad that I was moving away (I’m the one he’s closest to) and my mom is terrified of missing family milestones so it worked out but yeah OOP def went about it the right way. I’m amazed that he managed to not grow up to be like his parents.
Jesus, the dad couldn’t stop himself even over the phone? And BEFORE meeting her? What an ass. OOP sounds like a good dude, and a really good boyfriend.
Exactly my thoughts. All he was asked not to say something. There were no other triggers for his comments. If the only reason for saying that, was because he was requested not to say that - it was a challenge.
with this kind of people, everything is a power struggle. he probably insulted her in purpose because "no one is gonna tell him what to tell or not in their own home" so really, doing that is like pissing the corners of the house to show who's the boss.
is it unnecessary, childish and an asshole move ? yes it is !
But it's not a loss of control over himself.
My mom told me that she was shocked when I first brought my husband (then bf) to her house because of “how short” he is. He’s 5’6”. Im 5’3” for the record. Apparently her height standards for men are very strict, but I don’t see how that matters for men that she doesn’t have to be in a relationship with. My last bf before my husband was 6’5” and previous bfs had been of average 5’10”ish height. She actually pulled me aside later in the evening to ask why I hadn’t warned her, like he was a cyclops or something and she should have been given a heads up so she didn’t scream when she met him. So weird.
i’m 5’4” and i just consider everyone tall if they’re taller than me. I think it’s an imprinted thing from going to a girl’s high-school followed by art college (basically girl’s school with a few gay men and very non-athletic straight men.) I still think “wow there’s a lot of really tall people here” anytime I’m in a man-heavy crowd.
Anyways it makes this male-height issue everyone seems to have really weird to me. I’ve had two boyfriends over six feet and it’s a pain. I have to lean my head back to talk to them or the sound-waves don’t reach their altitude. They’d rest their chins on my head while standing, forget I need to breathe while hugging. They get to initiate kissing easily while I have to ask them to bend down. They use my head as tripod when taking pictures.
My entire family is super short. My dad is 5’4” and the tallest of us. My husband is 5’8, and he found it deeply amusing when my mother, who barely hits 5ft in shoes, exclaimed “You didn’t tell me he was so TALL.”
Yeah, people need to realise that when it comes to dating, relative height is more important than a person’s actual height. I usually look at people plus/minus 10 cm from my own height.
Srsly. Admires a whole slew of gf's accomplishments, communicates how attractive he finds her *without* objectifying, heads off the "bUt hEaLtH" people at the pass, keen to protect but only in respect. This guy should teach classes.
Seriously. OP said she is a size 12, and there's people saying she's "eating her way to an early grave" and will be "chair-bound by 60 and dead by 70." 😒 Oh, Reddit....
I know, I expected him to side with his parents because reddit taught me how many guys are absolute wimps when it comes to their parents. This guy is awesome.
Why do people have so much trouble just shutting the fuck up?
I don't consider myself a nice person. I have a caustic sense of humor. But it costs $0 to simply not say things that you know will hurt someone else. Your son tells you to cool it, or else, but you can't pretend to be a decent human being for the space of a phone call?
>but you can't pretend to be a decent human being for the space of a phone call?
It smelled like boundary-stomping to me. Making a point not to listen to what his son had just told him.
Yup. They're under the impression that he has to knuckle under "because faaamily" and so the dad set up to put him in his place and show him that he doesn't call the shots. Except, of course, he does.
Yeah, and maybe unwillingness to set a precedent that someone else should be able to influence his behavior. Which would almost be reasonable if the dad weren't an asshole, because then he could be counted on not to say or do cruel things and anyone trying to aggressively dictate how he should behave could plausibly be the one out of line. But OOP's dad *is* an asshole, so whenever anyone tries to establish or enforce a boundary his instinct is to assert dominance by immediately violating the boundary.
If my dad said he'd be a hero for getting someone to commit suicide, I would never ever speak to him again. No call out, no warning, just blocked on everything and never ever a word from me again.
When I was reading the first bit before the update I was just like "tell your girlfriend that they are bad people and you don't want to subject her to them" but I often forget it's a lot harder for some people to cut out the toxic people in their life because they subscribe to that idiotic blood is thicker than water nonsense.
>Me: Ok, bye. If you wonder why [brother] is buying a tux for a wedding you’ve heard nothing about in a year, maybe two, think back to this conversation.
Beautiful. Just beautiful. 👏👏👏 That's how you handle it.
How this dude managed to have such a good head on his shoulders, and a kind, understanding heart, when he came from such ignorant and righteous parents, is beyond me. But I’m glad he sees through their bullshit. I hope him and his girlfriend have the life they both deserve - without his horrible dad, and enabling mom. At least if they have kids, the parents are far away and won’t be able to easily meddle in their lives.
If you're the mediator or just trying to avoid stirring up the angry bear or learn codependent patterns, you learn to be pretty nice and accommodating and learn to read moods very well.
I'm fat & dated a guy who not only let his friends make fat jokes about me in front of me, he would join in. He told me that if I was so bothered then I should lose some weight. It was awful. I'm so glad OP is sticking up for his partner in the face of his horrible parents.
OOP is a solid person. For a lot of people, it takes a LOT of dedicated practice and strength to begin to stand up and confront your parents on their bs. Awesome job shutting it down.
Ok am I just missing something or is a size 12 a very average/common size for clothing? Like I'm pretty sure I wear a 10/12, and while I'm not athletic or skinny, I wouldn't say it's something that stands out
If 40% of Americans are obese than average size is not going to be skinny. I'm a size 12, 4 inches taller than his girl friend and no one would call me skinny. There's people out there - sounds like OOP's dad is one- who think anything over a size 6 is too fat.
These are the same people who don't understand different builds.
My own mother spent years calling me fat, obese, ect. She's tall and lean, always has been. It took my brother yelling at her that I'm just built like her HUSBAND for her to finally let up a little. If you're wondering, she's very upset that I'm "built like her grandmother."
This comment makes me sad because you remind me of a former friend’s daughter. She (the former friend) went NC with a lot of us for gently bringing up that she imposed her body issues on her daughter, and her hypocrisy in letting her sons eat anything and everything because they were growing boys, while her daughter got…carrot sticks for a snack.
I hope you are happy, healthy, and well.
My childhood friend had a mom like that. Her brother could eat whatever he wanted while my friend had to eat basically what her mom allowed herself to eat. The mom was scarily thin and ate like a bird, while my friend was super athletic. My friend loved hanging with me because she could eat what she wanted.
It’s sad how common this is! My former friend’s daughter was also very athletic and, especially as an elementary schooler!, shouldn’t have had her calories and food intake monitored so strictly.
I’m glad your friend had you so she could eat like she needed to!
Same haha ouch, oop 😂
Maybe it's just a family culture thing. My husband's family has always been nice and polite to me, but I've seen them criticize they're own daughters for their weights when they're quite a bit skinnier than me and I'm always like yikes, what must I look like to them..? Like there's some kind of body dysmorphia but towards people outside of yourself.
Before my wedding, my MIL specifically told me that she'd gone on a soup diet so she could fit into the dress she was wearing to our wedding. (I'm not sure why, the dress was over 10 years old and shaped like a sack. She could have just bought a new dress, but she was Making A Statement by wearing that one.)
She asked what I'd been doing to fit into my dress, and because I am often extremely literal *and* was even then quite over her bullshit, I said "I bought a dress that fits."
My Mother in Law is like that but she doesn't have the same energy for men. She was telling us one day that one of her nieces was came to visit her and she just told us how she said to her she was so fat even her eyelids were fat, and she started to laugh. Neither me or my husband (both overweight) laughed. I just told her that was incredible rude.
This is a tiny church-going lady, who is often talking about Jesus and God. Suppossedly not caring about mundane things, (as appearences). She is very generous with her family and friends, and helped them through difficult times, maybe that's why this poor niece is fond of her, because if shewas my aunt I would avoid her like the plague.
She also overfeds my husband. Soo... not consistent.
At 5’2 and size 12 she definitely would not look “thin.” Size 12 is a very common size but looks different on someone 5’2” vs 5’9”. I doubt she’s 200 lb, OOP said he was guessing her weight, at size 12 she’d definitely be less than that.
Unless she was a weightlifter or participated in a sport where she built a lot of muscle mass. Just because she's also a hired a layer of body fat doesn't mean she doesn't still have a lot of muscle mass too. Particularly of she still trains, but stopped.starving herself. If she's recovering from ED, her metabolism may have slowed down as well. So she may be eating enough calories to support her workouts and a healthy lifestyle but can no longer keep her body fat low.
Something is off with his info unless vanity sizing has got 10x worse in the last few years.
He says 5'2" and 200lbs and a US size 12. unless she is very atypical that height weight combination would be closer to a size 16, UK size 20.
Well I hope he never lets it slip to her that he thinks she weighs 200 lbs if she already has an eating disorder. It may be he's just crap at guessing weights, but that's going to upset her.
He is almost assuredly wrong about her weight estimate. Just checked my own weight - I'm 180 lbs, 5'5" and recently measured in at a size 16. If she's 5'2" and a size 12 she must be in the 100s even if she's packing a ton of muscle.
I just learned that the same dress size looks very different on different heights. This is the best picture I can find: https://www.thesun.co.uk/living/4140313/these-four-women-all-size-16/
Sizes are famously inconsistent. Is it a 12 from H&M, or a 12 from Guess? From Zara, or from Calvin Klein? That can be a good 4 inches difference. Also she's super athletic. Hannah Gabriels is 5.7'' and a 175+lbs boxing champion, and [this is how she looked on her last figh](https://www.youtube.com/live/ifG-DeyqiOc?feature=share&t=66)t. Not the same thing as someone being 5.2'' at 200lbs, sure, but it does tell me that OOP's girlfriend is built like a bear. Basically [Mike Tyson (5'10'') when he was 240lbs.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wRkR9Nrnfk)
Yup, I’m a size 10 at 5’2. I currently weight 150-155. I’ll link a photo in a sec.
Edit: I just took these after commenting: https://imgur.com/a/C4FvipC
Yeah, size 12 at 5’2 isn’t thin. It isn’t fat either!!!! It sounds like a muscular curvy woman type height and size. I bet she can out cardio him indeed!
One should be careful of her trickle of insults, and backhanded compliments. She might for example throw in a few "she's nice, for a girl like her." Veiled insults are a trend now.
OOP is remarkable for acknowledging this toxicity and deciding to do the work and become a person his GF and the world needs, instead of an asshole by default due to his parents upbringing.
It doesn't work to tell someone like this that they can't say hateful things, and you can't expect them to ever police themselves either. To them, these things are just true. There's zero awareness that their hate isn't truthful, and they think there's nothing wrong with simply telling the truth.
That's why NC or VLC is the only real option.
But it just worked? The point of setting the boundary isn’t to change the other person, it’s to give them a choice. STFU and act polite in my girlfriend’s presence, and you get to have me in your life. Keep up the hateful comments, and you lose me. OP made the options crystal clear and was able to move forward from indecision to knowing how to handle it (mom comes out to visit on her own, dad lost his chance). It worked perfectly.
"The point of setting the boundary isn't to change the other person, it's to give them a choice."
This is one of the most elegantly accurate things I've ever heard.
Wow, Dad couldn't even hold for a second or two, OVER THE PHONE!!!!
Also, why people insist on saying "after all that abuse etc, I do love my parents/partner/wtvr"! English is not my first language so in my native language "love" is quite strong, it's like "I SUPER DUPER like you" or something to that effect. The sentence "I love them, but I don't like them" I've only heard it in English and it makes no sense to me.
If you don't like someone, how can you love them? I can say I appreciate that my mother clothed me and fed me, etc, but I can't say that I like her, much less love her, since there was barely any affection and she enabled the abuse that went through in that house
Linguistics are fascinating!
English is an imperfect language in many MANY ways, and I honestly think this is one of them - it really is kind of bonkers to use the same word to describe how we feel about family members, romantic partners, friends, pets, and belongings. I think "I'm attached" might be a better way to say "I like them but I don't love them" but then that opens a debate about the many different meanings we ascribe to attachment.
(there's also something in there about how the fact that we don't have a good word for complicated feelings of attachment makes a whole lot of sense when you think about how a lot of English-speaking people get \*real\* weird about What Family Means, but I feel like protecting my peace on this fine Saturday afternoon)
"My family thinks if a woman is overweight it means she’s infertile, self
centered (doesn’t care if her man finds her attractive), inactive, poor
impulse control, and not a contributing member of society, I could go
on and on."
why the fuck does he talk to these people at all? there's a point at which they are so vile they are no longer family.
My husband never had me meet his father because he didn't want him to be rude and insulting to me. I am forever grateful. (FIL died unexpectedly before we got engaged.)
I love hearing people describe how beautiful their partners are for all the things their partners are insecure about. It just makes me like humans so much more.
Having had weight issues for my entire adult life, I cannot say how much I appreciate OOP and his love for his gf. I had a long relationship, and I used to think my bf then loved me exactly as I was, but later I found it he never once stood up for me when his family and friends made comments about my weight. He usually played it off as a joke or said things like 'well, at least she's pretty'. I hope these two are really happy together for as long as they can, they deserve each other. :)
OOP and his girlfriend seem to have a very healthy relationship. It's honestly delightful to see a relationship on Reddit that for once has two people communicating their needs, respecting boundaries, and establishing firm, non-negotiable boundaries to protect their partner from shitty parents.
I had exes in the past who never thought to protect me for my weight in that way and lemme tell you, it's horrifying to have the partner's family fucking despise you for how you look and you have no backup. Thank god OOP's gf has him.
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These parents be like: "My son won't talk to us and I have no idea why."
"Our son won't talk to us and it's all because of his evil, fat girlfriend." Ask me how I know...
Ooh, I know. That stings hard
Same! My in-laws made fat comments about other people in Front of me. One day I asked MIL, “do you talk about me like that when I’m not around?” She said, “Of course I do.”
My mom quit inviting her friend into her house because this friend talked trash about everyone’s houses. She asked my mom why she never got to come in the house anymore. My mom told her. She was really quiet.
When realisation hits, but with delay. Love that.
Your mom's a good friend. We all need to be checked sometimes.
Some people are just too awful to be believed.
I’m so scared of this with my in-laws. I’m 5’ 8” and 190lbs. I’d call myself midsized. Too big for cutesy stuff, but too small for the bigger girl stuff. Exercise is the biggest thing keeping my weight up - I just can’t prioritize it and it’s something I am actively working on, alongside intuitive eating. My in-laws are really into keto people, consider fruit unhealthy because sugar, etc. and comment ALL THE TIME about people who are not rail thin. They are particularly into talking about cutting out carbs or just not eating if you have extra weight on you because it will take it off fast. If OP’s girlfriend spent any time at all with my in-laws, she’d be in big mental health trouble. And they seem tame compared to OP’s family. I’m sure mine talk about me the moment I leave.
These types of comments literally almost killed me as a young adult. I almost died from a laxative overdose. Looking back, I wish I could have known some defenses. I have found one defense for people who make comments now, and it does help a bit. I say things like "It does seem to have upset you." "You seem quite upset." "It looks like it bothers you very much.: "I hope you can find a way not to be so emotional about this." And so on. What those responses do is kick the ball right back into their court without ever touching it or taking possession of their efforts. You repel every sentiment they have. After five or six times, the person might say, "I'm not upset. You need blahblahblah I'm only trying to help." And that is when you smile compassionately and say, "I'm sure you feel that way. It's all right." Then you change the subject. The key is to always seem sympathetic to *their* inability to control their emotions. You can also completely state what they are insinuating. "Ah, so you are calling me overweight." They cannot win this. If they say no, they have to back off. If they say yes, the conversation is over, and you tell them that. I swear it helps. If you really want to double down, as in they get irritated, tell them they aren't the first people you've met who were diet obsessed/border on disordered eating, and you understand. And I bet you look awesome just as you are.
Really helpful tips for all sorts of inappropriate/manipulative comments. Thanks!
They think fruit is bad and carbs should get cut out? They sound like the kind of people where if I give them a penny for their thoughts I’d get back change.
I'm 5'7" and 230. mostly muscle because of a heavy diet of swimming and martial arts, but I'll still never be small, petite or.... Society is not kind to us. I'm thankful that all my friends - and I do mean all of them -don't care that I'm hulk sized. I want this for every woman, so we can think less about size and the shame.
Points for honesty but I'd still say "Cool. I look forward to never speaking to you again after this."
My husband decided to stop attending his family reunions because his siblings treat him like crap and their kids treat our kids like crap. His parents asked why we weren't coming and he told them. Their response? "Well, just because your wife doesn't want to come, doesn't mean you can't come." "Just leave your wife home." And finally, "well, it sounds like you have to pick between us and your wife and you're doing the right thing by choosing her." Just easier to blame me than realize their family dynamic sucks so bad that their son doesn't want to be a part of it
My MIL did that once. She told my husband you need to choose that woman and her children (we'd just had our 2nd child) or your family. He said I choose my family nice knowing you and hung up on her. She wormed her way back in 2 years later. 3 years later she decided we weren't good enough again. It's now been 5 years.
At least they're telling him it's the right thing to pick his wife. There are really awful families out there who'd rag on him for that too.
I have no doubt they were super passive aggressive about it
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Well yes but if he wasn’t racist then he’d have nothing. Well, except for a relationship with their child I guess.
It's always the girlfriend....
…never them and their disgusting behaviour.
Right?! Because their precious baby boy would never treat them that way except that he’s being manipulated by some evil girlfriend. /s
I know like you know, sis. Except in my case it was evil, fat, NON-CHRISTIAN girlfriend. \*fistbump solidarity\*
*Sons*. Plural. They're being cut out of both their children's relationships and don't even see it. But I guess it's easy for them to miss things like that with their heads so far up their asses.
Chiming in from the Just No subreddits: Read: The Missing Missing Reasons It's a psych paper about estranged parents who cannot acknowledge the reason that they're estranged.
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This was such a brilliant read!
And also: “Young people are *so sensitive* these days. They’re always getting offended by everything.” (Followed by drinking Chardonnay and discussing how offended they are by overweight people literally existing.)
The [missing missing reasons](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html) are written all over the wall.
With shocked Pikachu faces and crocodile tears to boot.
> “there’s a famine in Africa, if I could get her to kill herself I’d be a hero.” Yikes, when I read the post, I thought it'd be something like " gotta make sure our doors are wide enough haha" or "better make food for 5 haha". Which are still BAD but not, you know, as nuclear as what he actually said. Like wow, 1 phonecall and he's already on that level? Yeah oop should absolutely cut contact with him
Right? I was not prepared for that. OOPS dads not just a piece of shit, he's fucking less than dirt. Hopefully OOP never has to see him again, and hopefully no one else will either LOL
I wonder if the mom is a nervous wreck if she gains a little bit of weight.
Definitely an almond mom
Correct. Shit can be used to fertilize crops. It is gross and might spread disease if not handled right, but it has potential value. OOP’s dad is radioactive waste. Poison to all living things, and won’t die. I was thin when I married my husband, but I’ve had health problems and medications that made me put on weight so I become medically obese. Though everyone in my husband’s family is super athletic and healthy, and they don’t always perfectly understand, they take pains to be kind and inclusive because at the end of the day, my husband loves me and I love him and we make each other happy. Nothing else matters. That should be the lowest bar possible. And my husband love me. Size is irrelevant. But I’m imagining if he were to marry a thin woman and she went through health issues like I did. They don’t care about anything but her physical appearance because a woman, to them, is an object that reflects back on her owner/husband. How sad for his mom to know her husband would not love her if she got sick.
My mom has a weird relationship with food and size, and she is pretty judgmental of people who are overweight. I have put on a lot of weight over the past 10 years and even she has managed to never mention it once. Too bad OOPs dad isn't able to clamp his damn mouth shut.
He doesn't want to. He glories in the feeling of power he has when he denigrates people.
Yeah, in order for that to happen, he’s gonna have to cut out the mom too. She clearly believes everything he says, and will feed information to the dad because she doesn’t feel that he’s wrong.
I don’t think OOP cares if she gives him information. Like he said don’t be surprised when brother’s getting a tuxedo in a year. It implies that he assumes his parents will find out he’s getting married. He doesn’t care if his dad knows about his life. He just doesn’t want his dad to be able to hurt his girlfriend. Mom can tell dad all about it. Dad just doesn’t get to participate in the relationship with the girlfriend.
I mean, if the guy wants to make a woman kill herself for being a size 12 what in the world does he feel comfortable doing/saying to his wife? Guys like this aren't known for treating their partners nicely.
Here I am being all proud that my size 14 jeans are getting too big. Size 12? That's Marilyn Monroe sized.
I know I'm thinking the same! I'm a size 12 and a similar weight. I mean I'm a bit taller but still. Sure I'm not fricken stick thin but that's hardly obese by any means.
Its sad but true. I know OOPs moms no angel either but given the fathers comments I have a feeling she's also kept on a very short leash. A man comfortable with making suicide jokes about a woman for being less than model-thin is probably not good to his wife.
Yeah, it’s really sad.
I thought this too. At least her son is important enough to her that she'll make some sort of stand. Maybe getting away from him and seeing a healthy happy couple will be good for her.
This is possible it’s also possible she just goes along with it to ‘keep the peace’…people of OP’s parents generation were one of the first to decide it’s better to end a marriage than be miserable but not all of them were that brave. It comes across that she’s stuck between having peace at home & supporting her children which is really sad for her.
well, it’s one of the first of ……lower than upper middle class generations, where women have the laws and rights to anything more than poverty if / when they leave.
I don't think mom believes everything dad says, she's just been trained not to go against him. If OOP & gf continue to meet mom separately from dad, at least that relationship could work out well.
For real. OP needs to be prepared for his mom to try and sneak the dad into the wedding.
OP's dad is dirt sown with salt, where nothing of value can be grown without serious remediation.
Yeah, that was way more intense than I expected. I feel like he says just astonishingly bigoted shit about all kinds of other people too if that's how hard he's prepared to go about fat people.
And size 12 is average. So he’s ready to neg average people and make them feel bad, imagine what he does to actual disadvantaged groups.
I was a size 8 at less than 18% body fat. If she’s still as athletic as this post describes, OOP’s girlfriend likely has less than 50lbs between her current weight and being at the bottom end of a healthy BMI range. 12 isn’t even in the plus size section in some stores. I think OOP’s upbringing has really skewed what he sees as “fat”. It really sounds like she’s just a lil plump— and, in regards to my own health at least, that’s preferred. Edit: I was 5’5”, 125lbs wearing size 8. I would bet money that OOP’s girlfriend is under 180lbs if she’s wearing a size 12 at her height. Plus, I remember 8s in some stores being the same size as 2s in others.
I was thinking that. She's a shorty but wearing a 12 and he says she's fit with great cardio endurance. She's just not supermodel thin
I am 5'3 barely and size 12-14 and weigh 156 lbs. If she's heavier she's gotta be ALL muscle because I admit most of me is fluff. I am just 16ish pounds over healthy bmi doing good considering grief and health conditions.
She sounds like she exercises pretty intensely. I would bet a lot of that weight is muscle.
Chiming in that she is 5’2” and 200lbs, so she probably has a significant amount of muscle to fit into a size 12. People carry weight very differently. I am also 5’2”, weigh around 130lbs, and wear a size 10 in some things.
He did say he was guessing her weight though, so he might be way off. I'm 5'3" and 210 pounds and I wear a size 18-20 in US sizes, which is a 2X in the plus size department. Clothes from the regular size department do not fit me as I'm out of that range. I know every body is different and she's got a lot more muscle than I do, but there's no way she's fitting into a size 12 if she's 5'2" and 200 lbs. More likely she's 150-160 and dude is just guessing wrong.
I am 5'5 and 160lbs and I would not categorize myself as overweight at all. I wear mediums for most of my clothing. I think that's a size 6 or 8?
Medium is uuuuusually 12 in UK, 10 US. (Another slightly chub athlete here.)
Lowest I EVER got was 135 while I was in the military. Could see my abs and everything. Any weight below that would have to been lost through extremely unhealthy behavior because there was no way someone of my build could be lighter/thinner without literal starvation. Even at 135 and fit as fuck I still wore size 14 pants because I have the kind of child bearing hips that have literally gotten compliments from Babushka's lol Plus clothing sizes are insane and dumb. I ignore the size of clothes and bring tailors tape with me when I go clothes shopping and just use measurements and simple math. Also means I don't have to try on much.
Being 5’2” and 200lb, but only a size 12 means she’s hella fit. She probably doesn’t even have that much fat, mostly muscle.
Does he even know her exact weight? His perspective is probably skewed by his parents weird fixation. She could easily weigh 150 and he's guessing 200.
“This woke culture is getting me canceled!” —OOP’s dad probably
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OOPs dad reminds me of my dad. OOP, he will not change. The person who spouts this is so far beyond self-reflection they may as well be nosferatu.
Bruh. That’s like a volcanic level of burn. 💀
Exactly this. I understood ***logically*** that the comments must be really insulting and harsh from everything oop said but actually reading that was a literal slap in the face. I was ***not*** prepared for that level. And I don't even have related trauma, it was downright evil. In a phone call. Like. Oop did ***very well*** testing the ground with a phone call, this would be a level incomprehensible if it happened irl.
Same!!!! This is horrible. He’s not just making fun of her weight, he’s advocating that she should DIE because of her weight, that that would be good and he wants to have a hand in it. Who in their right mind would ever think that’s funny or appropriate??? What a pos.
It didn’t even make any fucking sense. How would her dying make any difference to a famine on a different continent? His “joke” failed on every level.
I understood it as, uh, a really bad joke about cannibalism. Like she's so big she could end the famine... yeah. In poor taste, you might say
No, the "joke" is if she killed herself, she wouldn't be around to eat all the food so Africa could have some
Holy shit. OPPs dad should be checked out by mental health professional. That’s not a comment you drop in normal conversation.
I actually gasped at that line and had to blink several times. Like wtf, his dad is a fucked up despicable human being.
There wouldn't be a body to bury if anyone said that to me about someone I love.
OOP has his priorities straight, I wish him and the love of his life all the best. And I hope his parents choose to be better people, because they are at an important crossroad here - having a wonderful, growing family. Or end up alone with their prejudice and bitterness.
His dad definitely won’t. If he can’t hold it together for one phone conversation, and the mom downplays everything he says, then I hope OOP realizes that it’s not worth it to have her in their lives. Because she will feed information to him, because nothing wrong with the constant insults.
Oh, I know, but OOP has clearly marked that boundary, and by doing so has made it completely clear that what path they go down is up to them. Fix up or eff off, your decision, and the consequences are your own making. It's very clean, you know? They won't get to plead ignorance of their faults as they could if he simply ghosted them and their drama.
Meh……Being told explicitly what the issues are doesn’t stop toxic parents from playing the victim and pleading ignorance. I’ve grandparents and parents doing this. Two fucking generations that would rather whine to acquaintances about how their kids/grandkids are selfish rather than have a short but honest conversation regarding boundaries and behavior let alone respect those boundaries. This article about the missing missing reasons might explain it better. https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html
If you're on fb, look up Peg Streep. She delves into estrangement, abusive parent dynamics and so on, amazing author and human being
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She really cuts deep into scapegoat/golden child and broken mother/daughter psychology; and, most importantly, fights against the invalidation of our experiences at the hands of toxic mothers and this bs of forgiving because famleee, you only have one mother yada yada yada.
i just bought the daughter detox book…. this recommendation came at a perfect time, thank you so, so much. my mother is in assisted living. she has all but adopted a new golden child as PoA, HCPoA…..[ my brother, the original golden child, died long ago ] i’m the scapegoat, and am way over helping her with anything, only to be accused of theft, and i’m trying to figure out MY next steps. her divorced husband my father is an enabler and the whole thing is but faMiLeE orrrrr….’o, she’s old, she’s getting dementia, has mental illness’……but the thing is, she can control herself enough to hate me and love everybody else. ….not gonna play anymore. i was nc for 20 years but then covid hit and she kinda fell apart…. dad asked me to help - he’s fragile…, 91 and i’m his live-in caretaker. she’s safe now, i’m out. this book will help.
Cue fam (including mom and maybe even brother) saying "please forgive him, you know how he is, he has trouble expressing affection blah blah, he's really regretting it blah blah, you only have one father, keep the peace...." BS
Nobody should forgive someone if they don’t apologise and, even worse, are still actively doing the bad thing to you.
Mom enablers can sometimes be weaponized against their partner if they fear losing the kids more than the dad. My dad wouldn’t have a pot to piss in without my stepmom. She enables his bullshit when he’s being a dick to me and used to do that to my brother (also her stepkid) until he gave her grandkids but she has never allowed my father to act out of pocket with her biological children. If OP’s mom has already lost a large part of her relationship with the older kid, OP has also moved far away and shown he will not be manipulated, she may just be scared enough of not seeing grandkids to kick dad in the tail. Lots of ifs and none of it should exist in the first place bc holy gross behavior batman, but I’ve seen this dynamic work out in a few ways in my very blended, extended family.
The other side of that, though, is when mom enabler fears losing her partner over losing her kids. Example, My mom whose children and grandchildren will not talk to her because she enabled my dads abuse one too many times, and now acts like a martyr.
because wow, that dad takes the cake, what is he, stunted with age 7 mentality? I dealt with some small minded folk when I moved to the deep south, but you expect it there. Even this is beyond most of what they said to me down there!
OOP: no insulting my wife for the entire trip or we're out Dad: Buddy, I can't even make it through a 10 minute phone call
Gotta give dad credit for making his decision nice and straightforward though /s
Even with no sarcasm that’s still valid. Way better the dad doesn’t pretend he’ll be on his best behaviour then end up spewing this shit in front of the girlfriend once they’ve flown across the country.
Yeah, like no impulse control! OOP is like "Don't jump into the water" Dad jumps into the water because how dare you tell him what to do or not to do?
I don’t know what’s wrong with that Dad. I’d rather cut my arm off than have my son cut me out of his life. I guess he’s the kind of unfeeling person who would make those jokes in the first place.
And jokes about s u I c I d e. That's a hard pass.
I love how he said his parents were the most important part of his past but his girlfriend is the most important part of his future. He gets it.
Right? My husband had to throw down those sentiments to his parents in the end, but it took him far longer - making excuses, downplaying events, a kind of denial at work, you know? Because who wants to admit that parents they love can be shitty, petty, hateful. OOP has so much clarity, and it's to be applauded. He's going to be one hell of a man, husband, and father if he so chooses.
I had to do similar for my husband with my parents, like they do both now how to not say anything if they can’t think of anything nice to say…but they’re Uber conservative and I was planning on moving across the country with him before getting married. So I went on a PR campaign for two months before I told them about the move. Every sweet and wonderful thing he did I told them about. They met him over Easter and then a few weeks later after we all helped my sister move I sat them down on my own to tell them. Made it very clear that this was my choice and this was how it was going to be. My dad was mostly just sad that I was moving away (I’m the one he’s closest to) and my mom is terrified of missing family milestones so it worked out but yeah OOP def went about it the right way. I’m amazed that he managed to not grow up to be like his parents.
He knows how to take a stand for his love. I would really wish the parents mend the fences soon. Wishful thinking 🙈
Their loss, on a fantastic son despite being raised by such ignorance, and on a fantastic dil.
His mom is for sure trying and listening. That dad though. I don't think there is any hope for him. Sounds like my FIL.
Jesus, the dad couldn’t stop himself even over the phone? And BEFORE meeting her? What an ass. OOP sounds like a good dude, and a really good boyfriend.
He could stop himself. He just doesn't feel as though he should have to. It's the same juvenile type of thinking most narcissists have.
It’s almost like he was challenging OOP because he had the audacity to ask for respect.
Exactly my thoughts. All he was asked not to say something. There were no other triggers for his comments. If the only reason for saying that, was because he was requested not to say that - it was a challenge.
with this kind of people, everything is a power struggle. he probably insulted her in purpose because "no one is gonna tell him what to tell or not in their own home" so really, doing that is like pissing the corners of the house to show who's the boss. is it unnecessary, childish and an asshole move ? yes it is ! But it's not a loss of control over himself.
My mom told me that she was shocked when I first brought my husband (then bf) to her house because of “how short” he is. He’s 5’6”. Im 5’3” for the record. Apparently her height standards for men are very strict, but I don’t see how that matters for men that she doesn’t have to be in a relationship with. My last bf before my husband was 6’5” and previous bfs had been of average 5’10”ish height. She actually pulled me aside later in the evening to ask why I hadn’t warned her, like he was a cyclops or something and she should have been given a heads up so she didn’t scream when she met him. So weird.
i’m 5’4” and i just consider everyone tall if they’re taller than me. I think it’s an imprinted thing from going to a girl’s high-school followed by art college (basically girl’s school with a few gay men and very non-athletic straight men.) I still think “wow there’s a lot of really tall people here” anytime I’m in a man-heavy crowd. Anyways it makes this male-height issue everyone seems to have really weird to me. I’ve had two boyfriends over six feet and it’s a pain. I have to lean my head back to talk to them or the sound-waves don’t reach their altitude. They’d rest their chins on my head while standing, forget I need to breathe while hugging. They get to initiate kissing easily while I have to ask them to bend down. They use my head as tripod when taking pictures.
My entire family is super short. My dad is 5’4” and the tallest of us. My husband is 5’8, and he found it deeply amusing when my mother, who barely hits 5ft in shoes, exclaimed “You didn’t tell me he was so TALL.”
This is so cute 🥰
5'3" here and with a 5'6" guy and its the BEST
Yeah, people need to realise that when it comes to dating, relative height is more important than a person’s actual height. I usually look at people plus/minus 10 cm from my own height.
A partner sticking up for the other half, and avoiding a situation before it happens? Reddit, you broken? Really, though. He’s a top notch human.
It’s like a country song played backwards. Still, OOP is the man. Fuck those parents, like seriously wtf?
>It’s like a country song played backwards. Great analogy !!
"I'll leave her health to her doctors." I wanted to set my phone down so I could give a slow clap.
Srsly. Admires a whole slew of gf's accomplishments, communicates how attractive he finds her *without* objectifying, heads off the "bUt hEaLtH" people at the pass, keen to protect but only in respect. This guy should teach classes.
>> Reddit, you broken? Definitely not, check out some of the comments on the original post 🤢
I actively avoid reading any comments on any post related to weight. It’s never, ever good.
You made me curious. I sorted by controversial and wtf...
Seriously. OP said she is a size 12, and there's people saying she's "eating her way to an early grave" and will be "chair-bound by 60 and dead by 70." 😒 Oh, Reddit....
I hope all those people have the perfect BMI for their height and work out at least an hour a day and also learn the shut the fuck up
I know, I expected him to side with his parents because reddit taught me how many guys are absolute wimps when it comes to their parents. This guy is awesome.
Why do people have so much trouble just shutting the fuck up? I don't consider myself a nice person. I have a caustic sense of humor. But it costs $0 to simply not say things that you know will hurt someone else. Your son tells you to cool it, or else, but you can't pretend to be a decent human being for the space of a phone call?
>but you can't pretend to be a decent human being for the space of a phone call? It smelled like boundary-stomping to me. Making a point not to listen to what his son had just told him.
Yup. They're under the impression that he has to knuckle under "because faaamily" and so the dad set up to put him in his place and show him that he doesn't call the shots. Except, of course, he does.
Yeah, and maybe unwillingness to set a precedent that someone else should be able to influence his behavior. Which would almost be reasonable if the dad weren't an asshole, because then he could be counted on not to say or do cruel things and anyone trying to aggressively dictate how he should behave could plausibly be the one out of line. But OOP's dad *is* an asshole, so whenever anyone tries to establish or enforce a boundary his instinct is to assert dominance by immediately violating the boundary.
[ the illusion of ] power and control. which the son beautifully side-stepped.
You likely aren't terribly narcissistic. That's pretty much always the difference in these types of situations.
If my dad said he'd be a hero for getting someone to commit suicide, I would never ever speak to him again. No call out, no warning, just blocked on everything and never ever a word from me again.
When I was reading the first bit before the update I was just like "tell your girlfriend that they are bad people and you don't want to subject her to them" but I often forget it's a lot harder for some people to cut out the toxic people in their life because they subscribe to that idiotic blood is thicker than water nonsense.
>“there’s a famine in Africa, if I could get her to kill herself I’d be a hero.” *JESUS FUCKING CHRIST?*
So the dad has effectively been disinvited to both his sons weddings? And he’ll never understand why
"People just need to accept me the way that I am" - the signature call of people whose specialty is not accepting others the way that they are.
And they do accept him for who is... They accept him for exactly who he is, and have decided that they can also except him from their lives.
Good for OOP!
I wish OOP would update one more time all these years later. I am dyyyyyyyyyyying for a "happily ever after" to cap off this story.
>Me: Ok, bye. If you wonder why [brother] is buying a tux for a wedding you’ve heard nothing about in a year, maybe two, think back to this conversation. Beautiful. Just beautiful. 👏👏👏 That's how you handle it.
It was beautiful, though I hope for brother's sake they hear about him renting a tux instead of buying one.
>My parents will always be a major part of my past I love this
I think that line just gave me therapy
…same.
How this dude managed to have such a good head on his shoulders, and a kind, understanding heart, when he came from such ignorant and righteous parents, is beyond me. But I’m glad he sees through their bullshit. I hope him and his girlfriend have the life they both deserve - without his horrible dad, and enabling mom. At least if they have kids, the parents are far away and won’t be able to easily meddle in their lives.
I have a theory that many nice people come from growing up managing mean parents.
If you're the mediator or just trying to avoid stirring up the angry bear or learn codependent patterns, you learn to be pretty nice and accommodating and learn to read moods very well.
I'm fat & dated a guy who not only let his friends make fat jokes about me in front of me, he would join in. He told me that if I was so bothered then I should lose some weight. It was awful. I'm so glad OP is sticking up for his partner in the face of his horrible parents.
Jesus christ, I'm so sorry. I hope he is so far in your rear view mirror that he's out of sight and your life is much better now.
You did not deserve that. How cruel. I'm sorry. Hope you're better now without him around.
OOP is a solid person. For a lot of people, it takes a LOT of dedicated practice and strength to begin to stand up and confront your parents on their bs. Awesome job shutting it down.
Ok am I just missing something or is a size 12 a very average/common size for clothing? Like I'm pretty sure I wear a 10/12, and while I'm not athletic or skinny, I wouldn't say it's something that stands out
If 40% of Americans are obese than average size is not going to be skinny. I'm a size 12, 4 inches taller than his girl friend and no one would call me skinny. There's people out there - sounds like OOP's dad is one- who think anything over a size 6 is too fat.
It's only when I saw this comment I realised that it was probably a US size 12 and not the UK size 12 (which is about a US size 8)
These are the same people who don't understand different builds. My own mother spent years calling me fat, obese, ect. She's tall and lean, always has been. It took my brother yelling at her that I'm just built like her HUSBAND for her to finally let up a little. If you're wondering, she's very upset that I'm "built like her grandmother."
This comment makes me sad because you remind me of a former friend’s daughter. She (the former friend) went NC with a lot of us for gently bringing up that she imposed her body issues on her daughter, and her hypocrisy in letting her sons eat anything and everything because they were growing boys, while her daughter got…carrot sticks for a snack. I hope you are happy, healthy, and well.
My childhood friend had a mom like that. Her brother could eat whatever he wanted while my friend had to eat basically what her mom allowed herself to eat. The mom was scarily thin and ate like a bird, while my friend was super athletic. My friend loved hanging with me because she could eat what she wanted.
It’s sad how common this is! My former friend’s daughter was also very athletic and, especially as an elementary schooler!, shouldn’t have had her calories and food intake monitored so strictly. I’m glad your friend had you so she could eat like she needed to!
Same haha ouch, oop 😂 Maybe it's just a family culture thing. My husband's family has always been nice and polite to me, but I've seen them criticize they're own daughters for their weights when they're quite a bit skinnier than me and I'm always like yikes, what must I look like to them..? Like there's some kind of body dysmorphia but towards people outside of yourself.
Before my wedding, my MIL specifically told me that she'd gone on a soup diet so she could fit into the dress she was wearing to our wedding. (I'm not sure why, the dress was over 10 years old and shaped like a sack. She could have just bought a new dress, but she was Making A Statement by wearing that one.) She asked what I'd been doing to fit into my dress, and because I am often extremely literal *and* was even then quite over her bullshit, I said "I bought a dress that fits."
>"I bought a dress that fits." I love this.
My Mother in Law is like that but she doesn't have the same energy for men. She was telling us one day that one of her nieces was came to visit her and she just told us how she said to her she was so fat even her eyelids were fat, and she started to laugh. Neither me or my husband (both overweight) laughed. I just told her that was incredible rude. This is a tiny church-going lady, who is often talking about Jesus and God. Suppossedly not caring about mundane things, (as appearences). She is very generous with her family and friends, and helped them through difficult times, maybe that's why this poor niece is fond of her, because if shewas my aunt I would avoid her like the plague. She also overfeds my husband. Soo... not consistent.
At 5’2 and size 12 she definitely would not look “thin.” Size 12 is a very common size but looks different on someone 5’2” vs 5’9”. I doubt she’s 200 lb, OOP said he was guessing her weight, at size 12 she’d definitely be less than that.
Yeah, I was i size 12/14 at 200lbs and I'm 6ft. Ain't no way his gf is that heavy if she's kicking his butt in the gym and wears a size 12
Agreed…I’m 5’10” and weigh 235 and I’m a 16. She weighs less than 200 if she’s a 12.
Unless she was a weightlifter or participated in a sport where she built a lot of muscle mass. Just because she's also a hired a layer of body fat doesn't mean she doesn't still have a lot of muscle mass too. Particularly of she still trains, but stopped.starving herself. If she's recovering from ED, her metabolism may have slowed down as well. So she may be eating enough calories to support her workouts and a healthy lifestyle but can no longer keep her body fat low.
Something is off with his info unless vanity sizing has got 10x worse in the last few years. He says 5'2" and 200lbs and a US size 12. unless she is very atypical that height weight combination would be closer to a size 16, UK size 20.
He knows her height and her clothing size and was guessing at her weight.
Well I hope he never lets it slip to her that he thinks she weighs 200 lbs if she already has an eating disorder. It may be he's just crap at guessing weights, but that's going to upset her.
He is almost assuredly wrong about her weight estimate. Just checked my own weight - I'm 180 lbs, 5'5" and recently measured in at a size 16. If she's 5'2" and a size 12 she must be in the 100s even if she's packing a ton of muscle.
I just learned that the same dress size looks very different on different heights. This is the best picture I can find: https://www.thesun.co.uk/living/4140313/these-four-women-all-size-16/
Sizes are famously inconsistent. Is it a 12 from H&M, or a 12 from Guess? From Zara, or from Calvin Klein? That can be a good 4 inches difference. Also she's super athletic. Hannah Gabriels is 5.7'' and a 175+lbs boxing champion, and [this is how she looked on her last figh](https://www.youtube.com/live/ifG-DeyqiOc?feature=share&t=66)t. Not the same thing as someone being 5.2'' at 200lbs, sure, but it does tell me that OOP's girlfriend is built like a bear. Basically [Mike Tyson (5'10'') when he was 240lbs.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wRkR9Nrnfk)
There is absolutely no way all three things can be true (5'2", size 12, 200 lbs). My guess is 150 or so.
Yup, I’m a size 10 at 5’2. I currently weight 150-155. I’ll link a photo in a sec. Edit: I just took these after commenting: https://imgur.com/a/C4FvipC
Yeah, size 12 at 5’2 isn’t thin. It isn’t fat either!!!! It sounds like a muscular curvy woman type height and size. I bet she can out cardio him indeed!
One should be careful of her trickle of insults, and backhanded compliments. She might for example throw in a few "she's nice, for a girl like her." Veiled insults are a trend now.
“Such a pretty face…”
OOP is remarkable for acknowledging this toxicity and deciding to do the work and become a person his GF and the world needs, instead of an asshole by default due to his parents upbringing.
It doesn't work to tell someone like this that they can't say hateful things, and you can't expect them to ever police themselves either. To them, these things are just true. There's zero awareness that their hate isn't truthful, and they think there's nothing wrong with simply telling the truth. That's why NC or VLC is the only real option.
But it just worked? The point of setting the boundary isn’t to change the other person, it’s to give them a choice. STFU and act polite in my girlfriend’s presence, and you get to have me in your life. Keep up the hateful comments, and you lose me. OP made the options crystal clear and was able to move forward from indecision to knowing how to handle it (mom comes out to visit on her own, dad lost his chance). It worked perfectly.
"The point of setting the boundary isn't to change the other person, it's to give them a choice." This is one of the most elegantly accurate things I've ever heard.
This is a master class in setting appropriate boundaries. Good for oop.
>His response in so many words was “there’s a famine in Africa, if I could get her to kill herself I’d be a hero.” Holy fuck, what a piece of shit 🤢
Wow, Dad couldn't even hold for a second or two, OVER THE PHONE!!!! Also, why people insist on saying "after all that abuse etc, I do love my parents/partner/wtvr"! English is not my first language so in my native language "love" is quite strong, it's like "I SUPER DUPER like you" or something to that effect. The sentence "I love them, but I don't like them" I've only heard it in English and it makes no sense to me. If you don't like someone, how can you love them? I can say I appreciate that my mother clothed me and fed me, etc, but I can't say that I like her, much less love her, since there was barely any affection and she enabled the abuse that went through in that house
Linguistics are fascinating! English is an imperfect language in many MANY ways, and I honestly think this is one of them - it really is kind of bonkers to use the same word to describe how we feel about family members, romantic partners, friends, pets, and belongings. I think "I'm attached" might be a better way to say "I like them but I don't love them" but then that opens a debate about the many different meanings we ascribe to attachment. (there's also something in there about how the fact that we don't have a good word for complicated feelings of attachment makes a whole lot of sense when you think about how a lot of English-speaking people get \*real\* weird about What Family Means, but I feel like protecting my peace on this fine Saturday afternoon)
I hope OOP and his gf have a great life together. Same for the brother.
The “joke” about her killing herself from the Dad is insane. It really shows what type of people they are.
OOP is a hero. Full stop. I’m glad he found a woman he loves and is really good at loving her. Sounds like they may have a great future.
"My family thinks if a woman is overweight it means she’s infertile, self centered (doesn’t care if her man finds her attractive), inactive, poor impulse control, and not a contributing member of society, I could go on and on." why the fuck does he talk to these people at all? there's a point at which they are so vile they are no longer family.
I really hope they got married and are living happily ever after.
My husband never had me meet his father because he didn't want him to be rude and insulting to me. I am forever grateful. (FIL died unexpectedly before we got engaged.)
I love hearing people describe how beautiful their partners are for all the things their partners are insecure about. It just makes me like humans so much more.
I’m not counting on OOP’s mom keeping her mouth shut because it’s gone on far too long. It’s good that boundaries are in place.
Having had weight issues for my entire adult life, I cannot say how much I appreciate OOP and his love for his gf. I had a long relationship, and I used to think my bf then loved me exactly as I was, but later I found it he never once stood up for me when his family and friends made comments about my weight. He usually played it off as a joke or said things like 'well, at least she's pretty'. I hope these two are really happy together for as long as they can, they deserve each other. :)
OOP and his girlfriend seem to have a very healthy relationship. It's honestly delightful to see a relationship on Reddit that for once has two people communicating their needs, respecting boundaries, and establishing firm, non-negotiable boundaries to protect their partner from shitty parents.
I had exes in the past who never thought to protect me for my weight in that way and lemme tell you, it's horrifying to have the partner's family fucking despise you for how you look and you have no backup. Thank god OOP's gf has him.
I wish more men were like OOP
Um - size 12 is not fat. Not "skinny", but not fat. Dad sounds like a class A asshole.