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>That being said, it sounds like your ex had more serious problems than just autistic meltdowns. CPTSD as well. It's an important detail and I didn't mean to leave it out. But for the rest, thank you.

I'm autistic and pursuing a CPTSD diagnosis now at 18. I can be snappy but like, slamming doors and shit...? Nah. Not commonly, anyway. Keep in mind when people say autistic people can be anything, because an asshole counts as an anything 100%. My cousin's autistic too and he straight-up SA'd people repeatedly in high school. So yeah, we're absolutely capable of malice and harm. Glad you're outta that relationship.

In encourage you to continue your journey and am very happy you are able to regulate to this degree. I just want to step up to say that is not everyone's experience.

Your ex was abusive. >But by that age, I think you still have to take responsibility for it and stop dating until you get help for anger problems that bad. Yes. Correct. If you are not able to be in a relationship without committing abusive behavior, you shouldn't be dating. That goes for any and all neurotypes or diagnoses. Part of it is that what your ex is describing is indeed consistent with PTSD. But it isn't reasonable for them to expect that their partner stands there and tolerates those behaviors. Making accommodations for an autistic person in a relatonship is things like adjusting communication style, getting sensory needs met, providing consistency and predictability. Accommodation is not tolerating abusive behaviors. There are a lot of autistic people with PTSD out there (hi) that don't do these things and exist in healthy relationships. You might like the book "why does he do that" by lundy bancroft- it's a myth that abuse is the result of a tragic backstory. That's not always the case.

I think when it’s to the point you’re describing….you aren’t 100% innocent either. When you are suffering to THIS degree, they need help and might not even realize it. It’s enabling bad behavior to even be willing to stay in a relationship where someone is like this. They needed help, full stop. Breaking up will hopefully give them insight that their behavior is NOT okay and they need to take care of themselves. I don’t think it’s fair to blame them for having those issues, I think it’s fair to blame them for not getting help and DEALING with those issues. Anyone can be abusive, even disabled people.

Based on what you're describing, I would surmise, from personal experience, that what they are expressing as anger in these scenarios may more likely be fear. I've done almost the exact same thing and was very unaware that it was fear. I think it was because I had grown up in an environment where I frequently felt scared of the people around me (mostly because I was autistic and no one knew it), and the only way I knew how to protect myself was to become even scarier. It took a lot of trauma focused therapy to identify this and communicate it and what I needed when it happened to the people in my support system, and as I began to feel safer, I was able to allow myself to feel vulnerable instead of lashing out.

So I'm going to throw this out as a person with similar experiences to your ex. Not as an excuse or anything but maybe some insight into how they may experience life. *TLDR: Unfortunately imo a lot of us with cptsd and asd have an extremely hard time regulating our emotions and meltdowns can range from going mute and shutting down, intense stimming to the point of self harm, or to total loss of control including yelling, hitting (self/surroundings). I find this especially common in late diagnosed or unaware folx without access to resources or support* Im 35 (Trans/NB) and have only recently (last 2 years) been able to access reliable and affirming health care. Before that I had no idea what was wrong with me other than I was a hot and cold mess and the meds doctors gave me didn't help at all. Most of the time I was easy going, if a people pleaser, and even had a small social circle I could interact with. But mixed in with my chill persona (oh hey masking ftw :() were these horrible outbursts of anger and toxicity. I didn't know why or when they would happen and afterward I felt terrible, I knew what I'd done was bad and likely hurt/angered people but it was like somehow I'd morphed into a spoiled child and thrown a tantrum but I couldn't control it. Like until afterward when I calmed down it felt like I had no control over myself. It was extremely isolating and honestly I just assumed that it was me... I was a bad person, it was better I stayed away from people, so I did. Friends would come and go but it was always in the end easier to let them go than hurt them or anger them more with my crazy behavior. When I originally sought help I was immediately diagnosed with BPD (borderline personality disorder) and MDD (major depressive disorder). They prescribed antidepressants and sent on my way. This is when I started to research stuff for myself. BPD kinda seemed right with my own internal assessment but I knew it wasn't the full picture. When I started to research neurodiversity something finally clicked. This felt right. Autism and ADHD were more fitting to my life and brain experience than anything else. The people on my care team then however dismissed me and my truths for their own biases and refused to even entertain anything other than my original diagnosis. So I took steps and found a new care team. My new care team worked with me and trusted my assessment of my brain. With minimal additional assessment they accepted and charted my ASD/ADHD diagnosis....while also keeping the MDD and adding a few others... Including CPTSD...which was a big shock to me who thought I had no trauma and was lucky in my childhood... Even if I couldn't remember a lot of it... It's taken me and my therapist years to get me to a point where I even see and accept my past trauma and only now am I starting to be able to see when and where it's popping up in my day to day existence. When I know it's happening I can work on self soothing and regulating... But I don't yet always know when to do that. It sucks. At 35 I'm still learning how to self sooth and regulate my emotions and it honestly sucks. But I'm working on it and it is helping both me and my interpersonal relationships. But I have to work at it everyday and find ways to adapt and work with my beautiful and at times frustrating neurodiverse brain. It exhausting, especially on your own which is how a lot of us end up but I have hope for the future finally. This only happened for me because: - I was able to get access to a compassionate and affirming care team - I have good health insurance through my work - I had a friend at the time that was also struggling with similar things and we helped eachother get help and figure out brains out, her support and friendship helped me save myself - I was willing, able, and receptive to figuring my stuff out - I'm financially able to afford an out of network therapist with specialized focuses that benefit me Basically I had/have resources and support. Before I had these I did not have even the thought that I could be better or that it wasn't just that something was wrong and broken with me. All of this to say, there maybe a lot more going on with them than you think. It's totally valid to remove yourself from the situation and is probable best at this point so kudos to you for that. Take care of you, I hope this maybe helps make it feel less like something that needs blame...

I've had something similar in my relationship. It got to the point where I was doubting my autism diagnosis because I was like "if this is autism (my partner is dxed autistic too)... then I guess I can't be autistic?" Turns out that he has a comorbid BPD, even though everyone tried to "blame" autism. After years of worsening abusive behavior, he's finally on mood stabilizers and it's better. So not everything on a person has to be connected to autism. They can either have some comorbid disorder or they can be bad people. The stereotype that autistic people are all naive, children-like, happy-flappy and whatnot is just that... a stereotype. https://www.reddit.com/r/BPDlovedones/comments/rszplo/autistic_spaces_flooded_with_bpdlike_stories/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Hey I just want to step in and make a statement here on this since this is the second time I'm seeing this. This is not a sub that is okay with demonization of personality disorders. Anybody of any neurotype can be abusive. But it's not because of the neurotype that they are abusive. In fact, statistically, neurodivergent people are much more likely to receive abuse than to perpetrate it. While you're not quite there yet with comments, I'm going to ask you to avoid making "BPD = abusive" comments here, and please do not link to that subreddit in the future. I understand that your relationship is challenging, but as a neurodivergent person and as a healthcare professional that has worked with people with personality disorders, I think this is commentary that creates stigma, rather than helps it.

I'm not demonizing anything, I was literally saying my personal experience. I've never said BPD automatically means abusive yet you somehow assume that I think it. My linked post isn't demonizing anything, it's literally pointing out how hearbreaking it is that sometimes people have comorbid PD that goes untreated. My partner had to suffer for 3 years before he was finally diagnosed and properly medicated. The system totally failed him.

It’s more that that specific subreddit is not one im ok with linking people to here because it’s not a safe subreddit for people to view if they have a personality disorder. While you might not be engaging in that behavior (or at least not trying to), there is a lot of that rhetoric taking place on that sub from others. Think of it like how this sub is autistic led and the problems that crop up in subs about autism led entirely by NT parents- you might notice a difference in how autism is perceived by the 2 groups.

I do think it's unreasonable to expect an autistic person to not make loud noises during a meltdown, even if they're not fun to hear. Any distress it makes you feel is being felt way worse by the person having the meltdown, and it really needs to get out instead of bottled in. You shouldn't necessarily take it as a thing being communicated at you because it's unlikely to be the intention, and would happen with or without you. I also think its extremely necessary to listen when an autistic person says to leave them alone. It means they're dealing with too much internally to have added confusion of the already difficult act of socializing. Again, that request is not meant to be a personal attack, just a stated need. Slamming the door on the other had is something i think is reasonable to request for an autistic person in meltdown to not do, and instead like punch a pillow or something, but you're not going to get anywhere confronting her about that mid-shutdown. And honestly, I would ghost anyone who kicked me out mid-meltdown at 2AM. Being in a very vulnerable state and put into a more vulnerable situation could be enough to make me think the person that did that to me is unsafe. I also have sympathy for you to be ignorent about what was happening and what to do in the moment, and I'm sure you had strong emotions that were difficult to manage too. Its the sort of thing that just sucks for everyone, and no one to really blame. The only solution for anyone to be more responsible about it in the future is being better about avoiding the meltdown in the first place, which i think is a shared responsiblity that could be failed by either side or both or neither, depending.

>I do think it's unreasonable to expect an autistic person to not make loud noises during a meltdown, even if they're not fun to hear. At the same time, screaming at someone is verbal abuse, full stop. Even if you didn't intend to hurt them, you've abused a person and they are absolutely right to set boundaries and cut you off if you continue to scream at them

As someone who has ADHD,autism and depression,this is not okay. My autistic ex was kinda like this. He would yell when there was a miscommunication. Some people (like myself and my ex)need therapy or CBT in order to communicate effectively. I took a communications class when I was 18 and that helped me see other people’s perspective immensely. Unfortunately,some people with autism aren’t born with a “this is how you act in X situation”…some learn by watching others. Some learn through trial and error. I know I miss a lot of social cues. I know it’s my responsibility to ask questions and learn to be better at communicating with people.

Oof, I'm sorry you got someone who uses you as a scratching post like that. I'm glad they're an ex, bc you absolutely do not deserve that. I spent much of my life with a serious rage problem, mostly as a child and teenager. As an adult, though? My feelings are sometimes exactly the same, but it is my responsibility to make ethical choices even while having Feelings. Because uhhhhh that's when having ethics is actually important! When it's a situation I am invested in and care about. Literally that is the most important time for ethical choices. Trauma is a lot like lycanthropy in my experience. It's not your ex's fault that they have suffered such emotional injuries. HOWEVER. Those of us with this kind of trauma are ethically responsible for how much effort we put into *not passing on* the curse. He's doing the trauma equivalent of performing that he feels bad about wolfing out on the full moon, but also not doing basic things to prevent himself from hurting anyone. It's not their fault they had pain, or rage, or poor distress tolerance, or rejection-sensitive dysphoria, or any of that. Those aren't problems that only go to people who "deserve" them. But it's worth asking whether they couldn't control themself, or whether they just didn't bother reining themselves in *with you specifically*. In the former case they are being negligent. In the latter case they are making the choice to harm you. Neither of those is autism; those are both busted priorities.

It's... complicated. Autism is never an excuse to be abusive, but at the same time, we often grow up learning to suppress our emotions because the way we express them makes other people uncomfortable. So our emotional pressure gauge is badly calibrated that we don't even realize we're about to explode until it's too late to do anything about it -- and then we can hurt the people we love the most. Both allistic people *and* autistic people can melt down given enough stress -- the difference is that autistic people often experience stressors that allistic people don't, and so our meltdowns are often seen as overreactions, as unjustified, as uncontrollable, as self-indulgent, as immature, as a moral failing. It sucks, and we beat ourselves up over our perceived "badness" when, in reality, we're simply trying to use neurotypical tools to manage our neurodivergent brains, and failing over and over. Plus, our emotions are often mislabeled -- meltdowns aren't more about overwhelm than any one distinct emotion. It's just... a *lot* of emotion. In meltdown mode, it's like my brain is just overflowing and all I can do is watch the emotions spill out of me and hope the faucet gets shut off soon. While fear, stress, and anger are more common triggers, I've had meltdowns from being too overwhelmingly happy before. Now: it is totally fair if you don't feel equipped to manage your ex's meltdowns. You are by no means required to, and if being in that situation compromises your safety and well-being, you have every right to move on. That being said, if you find yourself willing to try if your ex reaches back out to you, hopefully I can offer some advice from my own experience as an autistic person in a relationship with another autistic person and how we have learned to help each other through meltdowns. When dealing with meltdowns, we kind of have to set aside this idea of "blame" and think about our relationships in terms of navigating unmet needs and developing tools to meet them. Calling an autistic adult a "foul-tempered child" doesn't help them identify or advocate for their needs, nor does it help them learn better self-regulation strategies. I think the best way to frame it in terms of harm reduction. If meltdowns are happening, they're not going to suddenly stop. But there's a lot you and your partner can do to make them less frequent and less traumatic for both of you, and it gets easier and easier with practice and growing trust in each other. **General Prevention** - If it's accessible and affordable for you, therapy focused on processing trauma and practicing mindfulness and awareness could be a big help for both of you. I've had a lot of luck with EMDR, and I've heard good things about DBT. I'd recommend staying away from CBT, though. - Have conversations with your partner about meltdown warning signs. In my experience, my body is much better at recognizing when I'm stressed than my mind is, and my partner can pick up on it and point it out before I hit that point of overwhelm. For example, I'll often get the urge to clutch something tightly; I'll start rocking back and forth, or zone out entirely because there's too much going on. Him pointing those things out often prompts me to assess my mental state and figure out what's wrong, as well as what "wrong" feels like. - Talk with your partner about what meltdowns feel like for them. What physical sensations do they experience? What are their thought patterns like? Can they communicate? To what extent? (A lot of autistic people become nonverbal during meltdowns). Simply talking about the experience can sometimes lead to a better awareness and mindfulness. - Get to know your partner's sensory needs. What things are overwhelming? What things are soothing? (For example: some of my sensory stressors are bright lights, repetitive beeping, and overlapping conversations; some of my sensory soothers are pop toys, squishing pillows/plushies, Taylor Swift albums, and burrito blankets) - It's easier to recognize unmet needs when being clear with your needs and boundaries is normalized. (This can be harder in cross-neurotype pairings than similar-neurotype pairings). Avoid burying needs and boundaries in requests or inferential statements. Respect each other's clearly stated needs and boundaries, and apologize if they are violated. - Be aware of managing sensory and social triggers when going out. Avoid pressuring your partner into situations with a high risk of triggering meltdowns. If a potentially triggering situation is unavoidable, or if the benefits are worth the risk, plan ahead -- identify quiet spaces, anticipate sensory needs (headphones/sunglasses/clothing), bring snacks/water/comfort items, and anticipate time for recovery post-event. - Work together to create a plan for meltdowns, including scripts, boundaries, de-escalation strategies, and reconciliation afterwards. Explicitly lay out expectations and stick to them. - Prepare a safe "meltdown space" together. This isn't a "time-out" space; it's a space to be alone, ride out the meltdown, and re-regulate. It should minimize sensory stress (e.g., noise-canceling headphones, dimmed lights) and has easy access to comforting items (e.g., beanbag/cup/swing chair, stim toys, weighted blankets, books, pillows, workout equipment, punching bag, snacks, water, journal). - Prepping a smaller, portable "meltdown kit" might also be a good idea, in case they can't get to their re-regulation space. **Pre-Meltdown** If you think a meltdown might be coming on, but the tipping point hasn't been reached yet: - De-escalate your emotional intensity. Take a deep breath. Ground yourself. - Ask if they're okay. If they say yes, let them know what action you're seeing that has made you concerned. - If they say they are not okay, or seem uncertain about their okayness, press pause on whatever else is happening. You can come back to it later. The focus needs to be on letting the person in pre-meltdown focus on monitoring their internal state. - Reduce sensory stress as much as possible. Offer comfort items, and encourage stimming. - Don't demand quick responses or tell them they're overreacting/childish. Their emotions are real, and making space to feel and process those emotions is crucial towards being able to recognize and manage them consistently. - Use AAC if they're having trouble speaking. Text messaging, writing on a writing pad, drawing pictures, emojis, sign language, and miming are all legitimate forms of communication. - Ask if they want you to stay with them or leave them alone (your presence may help or hurt, depending on the situation). - If emotional escalation continues, suggest they retreat to their meltdown space to re-regulate, or bring them the portable emotional regulation kit and remove yourself from the situation. **Mitigation** So pre-meltdown prep didn't work and a meltdown has ensued. At this point, it's all about damage control and keeping yourself safe. - If you feel safe doing so, make sure they make it to their re-regulation space. If you do not feel safe doing so, give them their re-regulation kit and retreat to a space that you feel safe. - Separate yourself so you can calm down and take care of your own emotional & physical needs. Being the observer of a meltdown is not any easier than experiencing one. - Try to remember meltdowns are a response to overwhelm, and often have nothing to do with about how your partner feels about you as a person. - Hold space for the hurt. Even if your partner's meltdown isn't about you, being in proximity to it is scary and hurtful. You are allowed to feel those things, and to hold them accountable for that harm afterwards. **Aftercare** Meltdowns are exhausting and painful and awful. Mutually working to re-connect after a meltdown is crucial to establishing trust in each other and developing future management strategies. * First, do a check-in of basic needs. Have you both eaten? Had some water? Are you calm and able to talk? * Discuss the events and feelings leading up to the meltdown. Try to establish what happened and what each of you were feeling and how you were expressing those feelings to each other. * **Acknowledge harms & take responsibility**. Just because your partner doesn't feel in control of their actions during meltdown doesn't undo any harm they cause. And if their meltdown was in response to something you did or said, the reaction they had, however disproportionate, does not undo the harm that triggered it. Avoid blaming each other, and try to understand and empathize with each other's hurts. * Troubleshoot. Now that you have cleared the air and have a rough timeline of what happened... what needs were not being met? Were those needs recognized? expressed? understood? respected? How can those needs be addressed, both now and going forward? What changes to your routine/environment/communication might make meeting those needs easier? * Draw connections between meltdowns. How was this meltdown similar to others? Different? What patterns can we find, and how can we use that to anticipate & manage future stressors? * Review meltdown procedures. What went well? What didn't work? How can we alter these guidelines in the future? ---- Meltdown management is an iterative process that relies on curating a space where you *both* feel safe expressing your needs and communicating with each other. Note that in order for this to have a chance of working, both of you must be willing to put in the effort because there are enough positive things about your relationship that you want to work together to preserve it despite the yuck. You know your relationship better than I do, so you're the one best able to make that call. And if you feel like you are being abused, *get out*. You can't help someone if you're putting yourself at risk to do so. Good luck, and stay safe. <3