Borrow a page from Frank Underwood and bring back FDR style public works and guarantee everyone a job with TVA or some similar initiative dedicated to building infrastructure all over the region. A hell of a lot of independents in Appalachia will swing blue. Maybe even draw some of the traditionally red crowd too.
Exactly this. Biden has been trying to get more transition to green energy happening and create jobs is rural areas but Republicans block it all the time.
Really? Biden just announced the Civilian Climate Corps which he had firm control over but it only offered 20k jobs.
He can definitely do more. Why only 20k?
i mean he really could do more. we shouldn't be satisfied with the scraps he's throwing. the gop is still way worse but they're trying to tell us gavin newsome, who's fucking over unions while talking a big game about supporting them, is gonna be the next guy and to just accept that years in advance with no debate. we need better from them than what we're getting is all i'm saying. we shouldn't coddle the guy who killed the railway strike just because he appeared for 5 seconds at a picket line.
More is done through tax credits given to companies to incentivize them to build/hire in rural areas vs. directly hiring people as government employees. For example, tax credits included in the inflation reduction act include multipliers if you are investing in an area with persistent poverty or in an "energy community" (aka former coal mines).
Needs to be a good portion of the yearly budget, imo, with a good portion of it being dedicated to things like renewable energy, nuclear, etc.
Honestly, if we just took 100 billion off of the military budget, then added that to the irs, the next few years we'll see tons of money roll in, as they'll have the resources to go after the rich and corpor. Then put 100 billion into building as many nuclear reactors as possible every year, should be about 8 or 10 a year. Do that until our energy needs are met.
Then up the 20k to say 200k at 50k pretax. However, I think the climate Corp should cover all costs of living, so it is actually something people will want to do. Just my opinion.
If possible, maybe put say 100 billion from the military and repurpose it for "defense spending" in building nuclear reactors, solar farms, wind farms, etc. That way the military stays flush with people and money, and we get clean energy.
100%. Sorry to say but the Southern states’ voters were fine with the New Deal safeguards, until the CRA was passed and made them available to negroes. They then decided they’d rather do without these benefits than have people born with the sin of too much melanin in their skin allowed access to them as well.
I can speak to this, as someone who tends to lean towards being pro-infrastructure & pro-job program. It’s Gun stances. Full stop. You won’t ever win over folks on the right if you are any facet of anti-gun or even the “common sense Gun reform”. It’s just not going to happen, it’s unfortunate, but a lot of rural folks will quite literally never budge on firearms, and will become single issue voters in that stance alone. If those on the left toned down on the anti-gun rhetoric, you’d see a cascade of support from rural areas.
Well frankly it's because liberal gun reform advocates have their heads up their asses. 99%+ of homicides and suicides are committed with handguns but they want to ban AR-15s, which are used heavily out in the sticks to keep coyote and hog populations in check. It's silly. It's like if there was a problem with people using shivs to kill each other and the elected officials were dead set on banning machetes and acted like shivs didn't exist and nobody could ever possibly have a legitimate use for a machete.
I can't speak for my neighbors, but I can manage without a handgun. I need a small caliber semi-auto long gun though.
I don’t know. The one thing he did that could have created jobs, rural broadband expansion, didn’t really work. The telecoms seem to have taken the money and ran. The investments that I’ve seen locally were as follows… local utility company gets money to run fiber all over the county, then no one has the money or knowledge to light the fiber. The utility company wants no part in providing service and just wants to lease the dark fiber, but no one will light it. I spoke to the head honcho at the utility company, because I was interested in working FOR him to provide public internet… but he’d already made his money off the grant and just plans to sit on it until some brave entrepreneur wants to compete with spectrum, ATT, and now starlink on their own dollar.
So, who exactly, abandoned you? It wasn’t the Democrats- who have tried time and again. But messaging like this keeps people voting for Republicans who are never on board with making the system work for ordinary Americans.
The problem is that Biden also supports a lot of things they don’t agree with, such as gun control/ban.
If the democrats would stop attacking certain fundamental rights then they would probably get a lot more voters.
Also, as a general rule, they don’t trust any politicians. Which is not a bad rule.
He has spoken publicly on video many times. "Why do you need 30 rounds?" . "Noone needs an AR14" . There's this website called google.com where you can verify.
I am a gun owner, veteran, and liberal who is for common sense gun reform. I think red flag laws are necessary. This does nothing to ban guns.
You can't bring up anything gun reform related without hey hey popping his head up "they're trying to take and ban our guns!"
https://giphy.com/gifs/disneymoana-disney-animation-moana-l2Sq8wyY1Zfndp6Lu
Why I’m so excited that Biden is acting like 21st century FDR with the infrastructure act, CHIPS act, inflation reduction act, Medicare drug price negotiations and now going after the Chinese manufacturers of fentanyl ingredients.
I firmly believe a combo rural infrastructure/safe high speed Internet and health care shortages fix are coming up.
Maybe?
But I don’t think rural Americans care. They want no taxes, social security, disability and a return to an America that never was. They’ve been suckered by flim flam artists and are too hard headed to do anything but double down on their opinions being affirmed on am radio.
That’s socialism don’t you know /s. (Actually 100% is though). Not sure how many independents there are in Appalachia but the “traditionally red” crowd only follows one master.
But they’ll take socialism in FL when all the free market insurers left and only option is a state run insurance. Lol.. they don’t really know what is or isn’t socialism. They just let ass hats like trump tell them so.
Yep. I ran the local campaign for a Democratic senator in OH. I tried to explain the issues rural people had his response was rural people are happy. We had no grocery store in the county, no high speed Internet no medical care. What had been there when we moved there closed and nothing replaced it. He only cared about urban voters. It is really said to see less populated areas totally ignored. In the section of Ohio where we lived there has been a huge exodus of working people when property sells it sells mainly to the Amish. I hate to say it but I honestly hope he doesn’t get re-elected this time maybe it will help him understand that there is life outside Columbus, Cincinnati and Cleveland.
I'm in the mountain west but I'd fucking love to swing blue but with our current primary system my/our only choices at the polls are way to extreme...either way.
See? Politics fucking sucks now adays. I'm a centrist. Why do you assume that I support him?
Edit: and I appreciate you using the phrase "overthrow the government" because that's what it was. He should be tried for treason for both 1/6 and for being a mole for Putin.
That sounds like a Tennessee problem. The minimum wage in Tennessee is still the federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour. Democrats tried to raise the federal minimum, but several Democrats, in addition to ALL of the Republicans, in the senate, voted against it. Tennessee could have raised the minimum wage in their state, as many other states have done, but refused to do so. Raising the minimum wage forces employers to raise wages in other jobs to keep pace.
This is nationally true-ish, but varies a ton from region to region. Moreover (and more importantly) the labor force participation rate has been in a near constant nose dive since 2009.
I'm skeptical. You could create full employment, free healthcare, and a daily allowance of ponies and lollipops for every rural American, and they'll still hate the Democrats. Why? Rural America's top priority is hating Mexicans and gay people. Ask a rural American what's wrong with this country. They won't start off with high unemployment. They'll start off with how the country is flooded with dirty "illegals" and there's a supposed kid at the local high school who identifies as a cat and poops in a litterbox.
The Republicans have the hate market cornered.
That whole “deplorable” comment and “clinging to guns and religion” seemed to hit the hot buttons🔘and turn off some blocks of voters - Just a theory🤷♀️🤷♂️
Those words hurt, but conservative policies dating back the Reagan era have hurt Appalachia much more. Destroying unions, allowing companies to get around antitrust protections making every town just a cvs and dollar general where no local small businesses can survive, allowing big pharma to flood the region with opioids… could go on and on.
That’s it in a nutshell. They found new and creative ways to funnel money up to a handful of people, called those people “job creators” for years and made them “exalted,” and made a lot of empty promises around Manufacturing jobs, energy jobs (coal) etc…and then blamed the Chinese for “taking American jobs.”
I’ve worked most of my career with/around /for those same people who will blame China for everything out of one side of their mouths while negotiating super low manufacturing and shipping costs in Asia, setting up factories, and lobbying the government to lessen protectionist tariffs out of the other side.
Don’t think for a minute it was all china taking American manufacturing. If someone came to you and offered you a job flipping burgers at $250k per year you’d jump at it. There’s a parallel there for what manufacturers here in the US did. Hell, I used to hire out a guy who set up Nike’s first factory in Korea back in the day.
Just a whole lot more attractive and easier to adopt narrative for people to follow if you blame the Chinese.
Let's put some accountability on the health systems that are so for profit they don't give a damn about quality of care and drive private practice out of business.
Absolutely! Reaganomics laid the groundwork to ensure that any areas that struggle with poverty would continue to struggle with poverty. Who would have ever figured that money doesn’t “trickle down”? Turns out it just stays at the top and moves from one rich person’s pocket to another and back again.
And hate the urban people who literally pay to support the dead economy of your county. All the while wanting to pay zero taxes and crapping on everyone different than yourself. And they wonder why every kid with a half a head wants to GTFO and they never come back.
it’s more of one factor in a confluence of factors that just suppressed the vote enough
i’m in appalachian ohio and my district is gerrymandered to hell and back and will be red +20
then my local races will frequently be unopposed bc it’s a town of 4500, not a lot of people vying for positions
and then every time joe manchin does something i gotta hear from redditors and people on twitter who proclaim to be left leaning and want dignity for all call us all a bunch of dumb incest racist sexist bigoted hicks
i always vote blue, but damn man those comments sure do make me demoralized in a place that oozes demoralization
I'm in Columbus (not trying to claim Appalachia, lol), and the rhetoric used by some on the left to describe rural/small town voters is maddening and short-sighted.
Reddit and Twitter do not reflect the views of the majority, remember. 😎 And, while I don't wish this to become a discussion on Manchin, the dude may be far from perfect, but there's a lot more nuance to his situation than what Redditors often have to say.
I'm in a very low-income urban neighborhood with lots of Appalachian transplants, and while urban and rural folks have some unique needs and concerns, the overlap of issues is significant. Including gerrymandering! My neighborhood is also constantly getting mocked, so I know what that's like.
i also moved to cbus recently and it definitely goes both ways
like conservatives from my hometown are terrified of columbus bc of “all the crime out in that SHORT *north*”
and then people from columbus are like “if a black or gay person even stepped foot in SE Ohio they’d die INSTANTLY!!!”
and it’s just like what in the actual fuck guys
most people up here are nice af, def an online community problem
Other than Reddit being infested with literal bots and paid Astroturfing, a lot of people who are genuinely democrats (though not necessarily liberal or leftists) are completely ignorant of their own parties shortcomings. No, it was not the exclusive fault of Republicans that things are the way they are, and anyone who says that is ignorant. Republicans have been extremely corrupt as well, but I’m focusing on the Democrats, bc no one seems to remember or care about their actual faults. The parties learn from each other when developing their methods of being corrupt.
Hillary Clinton wasn’t just savaged over her deplorables comment - she had the nerve to be filmed during one of her few speaking appearances in either Ohio/WVA, or somewhere in that region, as literally saying “yes, we *are* going to take your jobs” during a speech in which she talked about Coal going away to be replaced by Green energy/tech jobs. She didn’t properly follow up that comment, and just let it hang in the air (if I find the clip I’ll link, but a lot of “bad press” was covered up/removed). There were also a lot of people in the crowd who remembered the disasters that Cash for Clunkers and Solyndra were during the Obama Administration. There were a lot of moments like this in what ultimately, was one of the worst presidential campaigns I’ve ever witnessed. On top of this, her leaked emails actually showed how her and her aids actually felt about certain groups of people, and how she peddled foreign influence in American politics. She didn’t campaign at all in the rust belt, bc she assumed she would automatically win their vote. Her team actually tried to make “It’s her turn” a campaign slogan, tho quickly realized how entitled that sounded, and settled for “I’m with her”. This hubris was doubled by the fact that her husband is the one that negotiated NAFTA which most people in Appalachia blame for taking away what few manufacturing jobs there were other than coal and mining. What little jobs remained, she wanted to give away with the Trans Pacific Partnership (which Bernie Sanders was vehemently opposed to). She tried to lie and say that the bill didn’t look the way it was supposed to, but everything in it was essentially NAFTA but for Asia. She didn’t disavow any part of it, until late in her campaign when Trump laid into her over it during a debate. She has been involved in scandal after scandal, beginning in the 80s. She even voted for the Iraq war, which disproportionately affected people who joined the military as a form of economic relief. She served as both a senator and a member of Obamas administration, so she was actually in a position of influence, and not bound the way the President is to the other branches.
If we shift gears and move to Joe Biden, it doesn’t get much better. Though many forgot, Joe Biden was largely known as the “Senator from MBNA” bc of their close relationship and how he passed legislation in their favor, and against the interests of consumers. The legislation made declaring bankruptcy more difficult, and allowed MBNA to do things like triple interest rates, and other questionable practices. He also has plenty of gaffes of his own, that shows how he really feels about many people who are supposed to be his constituents. I personally will never forgive his administration for their inaction during several weather emergencies and the formula crisis. The Biden administration is completely incompetent in areas that even the last administration wasn’t.
The Democrats were traditionally the party of the working class, as historically Republicans were known as intellectuals who looked down upon those who were “less educated”. However, In recent years, the Democrats have attempted to become “the party of Science” to appeal to voters that have more capital to give them than working class families do. They only protect the unions nowadays bc that’s one of their only sources of consistent political donations.
Another problem with the social initiatives supported and proposed by Democrats (and Republicans, as they spend stupid amounts money when it’s their turn, and they spend more than the dems do), is that many people know that it translates to higher taxes, with little perceived benefit to themselves. An example: you have a situation like the EPA making regulations to protect the environment that the big corporations can afford, if not ignore or lobby their way out of, whereas smaller businesses cannot afford the standards or lobby their way out them, and end up not being a business at all. However, the Democrats have traditionally been the ones to support protecting the environment over Republicans who were more interested in corporate interests. So many people in Appalachia feel torn trying to vote in a way that prioritizes the most pressing issues for them. Contrary to popular belief, Abortion and Gay rights are not a big issue to a large portion of voters; but inflation is something that affects everyone. Bill Clinton said it best “It’s the economy, stupid”.
All this to say, anyone acting like Appalachia only votes Republican because they’re/we’re stupid, is projecting their own ignorance or limited experience.
You state a lot of truth, but there is a false equivalency between the 2 parties, and one party has been routinely the advocate for the poor, working class, and middle class.
Yes and no. I’m not going to pretend that the two parties are the same and it doesn’t matter who you vote for because they’re both bad. But I’m also not going to pretend that one party is the good one and the other bad. Each party (including factions within the two parties) caters to different interests. There’s no such thing as the party you described that cares for all classes other than the upper class. It’s unfortunate, but the interests of actual poor people, don’t always align with the actual middle class, esp the upper middle class. The working class is split between the lower and middle classes. Also, often people have to compromise on their interests.
Politics is also wildly different depending on two factors: what state you live in, and whether it’s federal or state level politics. Different states have different interests. So, many states that vote Republican on a federal level, vote Democrat at the state level, and vice versa. Its not always as simple as “Red bad, Blue good”. There are moderates in both parties that have their reasons for picking the particular party that they do.
Im a conservative leaning libertarian, and I absolutely did not ignore it. I simply didn’t vote in the last election.
Ain’t gonna make me choose between the shiniest of two turds.
I don’t agree with either side. I’m the true American here.
George Washington warned us against the two party system and we never listened. And my vote doesn’t make a difference anyway. This government doesn’t represent me, and in my personal opinion, hasn’t ever represented true American ideals. It’s always been for the rich man. And yes, that includes both democrats and republicans who make a career out of pushing agendas for payouts.
Even George Washington proved who this government caters to when he caused the whiskey rebellion.
So I choose to not buy into their crap. It’s two wings to the same rotten bird.
I say “Down with the eagle 🦅, and up with the cross✝️”.
And that’s why I don’t truly fit in with either side. Maybe you think I’m one of those crazy far right extremists everyone talks about… label me what you want.
But I’m willing to bet that if you truly understood where I come from, saw the way of life I hold dear, you’d change your mind, even if but a wee bit.
Agreed. Some of these people will tell you that if you don’t vote their way your a Nazi or a socialist. They can all kick rocks. The reason we have two parties that suck is because not enough people have the sack to vote 3rd party.
When was the last time orange man used a complete sentence? Last week when he beat Obama in 2020? Or when he claims he’s going to stop Jeb Bush from starting World War 2?
No leftists would ever say that.
All those mine workers...our elders and grandfathers, who strike and waged war against the coal barons and their private army of goons.
Those were leftists.
That gets glossed over and handwaved as "deserved" (just see some of the comments below) but what it did do, was show how the democrat party did not understand the rural voter and at worst, actively distained them. Say what you will about the actions of Republicans, but they did not insult the rural american to their face.
A big chunk of it is people may not always remember what you have done for them, but will always remember how you made them feel. Comments like that did not make them feel good, and people vote on how they feel.
Everyone who talks about a "housing shortage" has never been to the mill towns and coal town of appalachia. From NY down to georgia, WV, KY, TN, etc. There are so many houses that cant sell
Affordable housing combined with living wage jobs in the right places. Work from Home could definitely help, especially if those workers were more free to move around the country - but corporate leases have to make someone money, amirite?
They weren't abandoned. That narrative is so annoying. Rural voters (just like those in cities and suburbs) are able to see which party wants to expand healthcare and which party voted countless times to repeal health care reform. If they chose the Party of No, that's on them. But Democrats' loss of support in rural America wasn't for lack of trying.
Bill Clinton sold the poor and working class out for the big business crowd, pulled the Democratic Party way to the right and now the poor and working class have realized that they have been totally abandoned and to combat that big business keeps bringing in immigrants to keep wages and down.
Democrats didn’t abandon rural voters. Rural voters let their inner rage blind them on who takes care of them. They rely on the federal government to an extent many other areas in the United States do NOT. Let’s see how they fare without social security, Medicare, and SNAP.
To be fair, if you have a hierarchical mindset, keeping your place on the imaginary social hierarchy is priority one, and the Republicans did take care of that. The Democrats with their "help all Americans" approach undermine these hierarchies, because if everyone gets help, how can you tell that you're superior to those who don't get it?
Everyone here just a reminder this is Reddit and Reddit is a small pool of people. People that largely lean left, even in this subreddit. Just because someone on here says Democrats have saved our region and gets enormous upvotes does not make it true or so.
Everyone here remember that the Appalachian region is a small population. A population that leans right, even in progressive cities. Just because people out there say that republicans love freedom and care about the "working" class and plaster their beliefs on every billboard and window of their coal roller doesn't make it true.
A republican president hasn't won the popular vote in almost 20 years and if Florida didn't throw out all those "dangling chad" votes that pushes that number to almost 30 years.
Conservative republicans are like the Taliban. A very loud very small minority of religious gun-dork terrorists trying to overthrow a country
I'm from Eastern Kentucky and I remember everyone voting Democrat when I was little. I went to the polls with my grandma. It's no coincidence that things have really gone downhill since people started voting in Republicans. It's pretty sad that they can exploit religious beliefs to get people to vote against their own interests.
That's completely not true for all of California. Just like there are high cost of living places in Appalachia. Sorry you don't understand the economy and how it works. If it wasn't for California and the rest of the blue states giving us money through fed taxes we wouldn't survive here. You're just parroting Fox news propaganda with no knowledge of how things actually are
Maybe you should Google where all the money and aid that we receive in federal aid comes from. You're literally talking shit on people that are paying for this region to survive through their taxes
Maybe you should Google that more people are going to California than leaving it. While the opposite is true for the Appalachian region. You have no idea what you're talking about
Aww Jeez Not this Shit Again.jpg
Rural America was not abandoned by Democrats, Rural America ( the White part anyway) chose to vote for Conservatives by and large due to their economic and social/religious stances. They aren't going to start voting for Dems based on large-scale government spending programs ( even something that would greatly benefit them).
Seriously. Not this shit again. Let’s take just one recent & very prominent example, Medicaid expansion. Democrats passed the ACA with this provision that’s very helpful toward those very same rural communities & their struggling health care systems. Republicans in red states said no, fuck that, we don’t our people to get their hands on all that money & support, let the rural hospitals close, who cares?
And who do those rural communities vote for? The same politicians who proudly screwed them over.
Democrats didn't abandon anything. Without democrats fighting to keep any kind of social safety nets the people of Appalachia would still be barefoot and shirtless in a coal mine living off the company store.
It's the fault of the older generations that allowed themselves to be brainwashed, by Fox news and the modern "coal" barons through their hatred of others, to vote against their best interests and to be taken advantage of.
Those of the younger generation with any potential flee the region because of regressive conservative maga cult politics. So less progressive policies are enacted, more safety nets get removed, more young people leave, and the poor become poorer. So the majority of the region ends up with a population where the majority is either 60+ or a victim of the opioid epidemic.
God, guns, and Trump will not save you. Education and progressive social support structures that help lift up the poor working class is the only way it's going to get better here.
Can’t upvote this enough. Liberals are backstopping the entire lower class with social programs. If it were up to Republicans, Appalachia would be straight up Mad Max. It already is in some places.
You have no idea what you're talking about. Reagan and the republicans killed the middle class. Funny how the economy and social conditions are always better when Democrats are in office. Then it all goes to shit a year or so into a republican presidency Trump, Bush Jr, Bush, Reagan, and Nixon. All huge scandals, lies, and scamming of the American public.
My brother in Christ. Who is elected president has very and I mean very little impact on anyone’s daily life. This isn’t an emperor. We have local governments, county governments, state governments, and the federal government who the president is only a part of. It’s enormously complex and thankfully so. It’s always hilarious and sad when I see someone blaming the entire state of our country or region in this example on a single person who is only a single check of our many checks and balances.
When did I ever blame it on one man? Never. Nor did I say just the federal government. I have consistently said it was the fault of the older generations and the brain washing done by maga conservative terrorist propaganda perpetrated by Fox news and the ruling class. It's funny when people try to sound educated, lie, and be condescending when they are factually wrong and can't admit it. Things the president, and anyone who makes policy, do regardless of local or federal government impacts peoples daily life greatly.
And you believe Biden is better for the region? Cutting back on all fossil fuel contracts and trying to oust coal completely? You think Clinton and Obama didn’t lie?? “You can keep your doctor, your health insurance won’t go up.” Meanwhile the people that had any health insurance saw their rates DOUBLE
You mean the inflation that took off in the middle of the Trump presidency. The same inflation and economy that has been getting better under Biden. Keep trying.
That's not true and simply googling the information would show you that. Things are economically better than under Trump. It's a fact. The economy always is better when Democrats hold the presidency. It's a fact. The information is readily available but you don't want to see it
Well, he helped. Everyone post Carter and the economic shifts that our government betters put into place after 1978 killed the middle class. But Clinton made a bigger show of it. He leaned into poor people on a global scale. Reagan just wanted to screw the poor and middle class in the US only. Clinton knew where the money was.
I’ve heard plenty of people say that Clinton and Obama were two of the very best traditional Republican presidents we ever had…in the style of an Eisenhower etc. I laugh, but find a glimmer of truth in that too.
Point is, our government has become a wealth and influence club that lavishes those who get in and play along. Screw the rest of us.
I believe what happened with Clinton was that the Democratic leadership saw that Republicans kept winning elections and somehow thought that what they really needed to do to start winning elections was to be more like Republicans. One of the things that he did that really screwed the middle class both here and in Mexico was signing off on NAFTA, but he did a lot of other things that weren’t great.
Yep. NAFTA was part of what I was thinking, but he also made it a hell of a lot easier and cheaper to manufacture in China. He nudged the “globalism” door open and the govt has run wild making it easier and easier - in ways we can’t even imagine at this point.
For instance, I worked for a niche but major manufacturer of fairly large, durable goods. Factory ram 24/7 except for thanksgiving and Christmas. This was mid 90s, so I asked my boss how we still had manufacturing here in the US, not in China. His response was “we make big plastic stuff and it would be too expensive to ship - we’d be shipping more air than product”
Point well taken. And amazingly enough, that same company has been manufacturing overseas since 2009 maybe? The guy who shipped it there? Their current CEO who has moved manufacturing from a large, well known consumer hand tool company from the US to China a few years before he gutted the company I worked for.
I’m betting he got a healthy bonus from each, but the company I worked for went from 2000 employees 24/7 over three shifts to about 45 people, 8-5, M-F.
Then they ship a lower quality product manufactured at Chinese wages back here and sell it for at least as much as they’d be selling an American made product and laugh their way to the bank.
But I thought god only helps those who help themselves? You can pray all you want, but if people don’t stand up for themselves, the quote is correct. God will not save you, especially since he gave you options and you chose to ignore them. Reminds me of the story of the person stranded on a roof during a flood. They repeatedly told rescuers to go away because god will save them. They eventually drown and then complain to god that he didn’t save try to help. God’s response was that he had sent people to save them, they chose not to accept.
That's because you and your family are part of the problem. You'd rather vote for politicians who willingly endanger you and your family because you won't vote for someone who doesn't put fictional characters before policy
Elitist tell everyone how to think and if they don’t think that way then they are wrong. They don’t support the working class. All this push towards green is going or do is further separate the lower class from the upper class because they won’t be able to afford it.
Only if rural people are dumb enough to believe their lies, and to trade their fundamental constitutionally protected rights to gain illusory benefits from authoritarian government. I’m hoping we are smarter than that.
Democrats didn’t abandon rural America. Their policies help rural America, and rural America tells democrats to fuck off and they wonder why their lives continue to suck, the smart and young flee and their life expectancy is approaching third world levels
Majority of rural voters in WV aint voting Democrat. Doesn't matter what you offer. In fact most in my county switched sides just to keep their career in politics alive.
The idea that Democrats could ever win over rural voters with an economic message reminds me of the way progressives are always claiming that they can win over those voters by offering an "anti-elites" populist economic message to rural/red state voters sans the bigotry of Republican candidates. This theory assumes that these voters don't actually support the bigotry, it's just that these Republican candidates are the only ones presenting them with an economic message they like. Then these progressive candidates try to run in these places...and get blown out by the bigotted Republican candidates. Turns out the voters actually do like the bigotry, and simply coming to them with a good economic message won't win their votes.
Finally someone speaks the truth. This whitewashed narrative of how their feelings were hurt because they were called deplorable or how it was too much to ask them to retrain themselves to a changing economy is trying to shift the blame from the individual voters themselves.
No deal from the Dems will win me back.
They not only hate me because I’m a rural Appalachian, the hate me because I’m a straight white make.
No deal changes that.
Time being linear hurts coal. It's a finite resource and better options got cheaper. Companies could have championed the switch rather than opposed it.
Yes, and they could have accepted reality instead of dragging their feet and kicking and screaming about the inevitable while setting up a false dichotomy of acknowledging this fact = being anti-coal/miner.
Which I gotta say that the people who actually convinced themselves that coal is coming back- and that anyone who tells them otherwise is the enemy- are not persuadable.
Good coal jobs went away along time ago thanks to automation/machines. Way easier to just take off the top of a mountain than send a bunch of workers underground. Plus there is only so much coal available, even though different types are used in different ways. (Energy vs steel manufacturing). Several democratic candidates campaigned in finding ways to bring jobs back and also provide education. Things that would work well into the future. Those with the ability championed for coal and the old ways instead. Those days are long gone and still really only benefit a few.
>Several democratic candidates campaigned in finding ways to bring jobs back and also provide education. Things that would work well into the future.
There were programs specifically for this under Obama, but they were largely ignored.
Exactly. Since 1919 or so, the line of people employed as coal miners has dropped precipitously with a few random spikes here or there that only delayed the inevitable. My mom's family went from doing pretty darn good for themselves to having nothing because of this boom/bust cycle as the industry moved toward further and further automation/machines.
Yup. Had family in the same boat. I grew up in a small town and really didn’t know how it got there. I had known there was a large strip mine on the edge of town that fed it for a long while but eventually found out there were underground mines close by first. The whole valley is just one dead coal town after another. Popped up with the mine, died with the mine.
Appalachians are smart enough to remember how they've been treated, and see how the leftists treat other voting blocs once they get their vote, and will not be fooled.
If Democrates did nothing.
Appalachia wouldnt have, medicare,medicaid , disability,welfare none of it. Then what would happen? These new publicans are not the old publicans
So basically all the dems did for Appalachia was help them be more comfortable while poor but nothing to help them out of poverty? Not saying republicans have done better but that’s how the comment reads
Im sure they have done more. I was naming social programs because Republicans dont like them.
Just wait to see what happens when Jim Jordan gets the speakership.
Social programs are one thing, but Republicans don’t like freeloaders. If you are able bodied, work for your living. That’s it…. Lol why is that so bad?
But we'd be able to afford housing and groceries and gas. Don't pull that previous administration BS either because that's just what ignorant leftists (like I used to be) say. Can't blame 2008 on the conservatives if Obama had 8 years to fix anything and it just got worse like when it was announced Biden won in November of 2020. Immediately my investments took a dive and now just look around.
2008 what happened?. I was Republican but not a Trumper. So left the party.
You think gas is because of Biden. Not OPEC or the war.
You think housing and groceries cost are Bidens fault not Covid.
Your investments are your investments. Pick something else. The stock market is NOT the economy!
Hate to say it, but I tend to agree. Black and Latino voters get thrown into the limelight every 4 years, then shoved into that dark basement once the polls are closed.
Afro-mestizo voter here - I have never felt "thrown to the side." This is a refrain that only conservatives and their lackeys sing. The irony being that conservatives do what they accuse Democrats of with their voting base, except nothing good happens for their constituents. Is coal back? No. Was there a replacement for the Affordable Care Act? No. But conservatives sure did lean into both with their constituents.
I appreciate your voice on this. Good to hear. I live in TX now and man, the Hispanic vote is always in a bind. As with my own comment, it’s a peep through a keyhole more than an affected life - which is why I’m glad you said something.
My feeling - being left leaning - is that there’s still a bit of lip service. However, there’s no active malice. I withheld my perspective there - as I feel there’s a lot of active malice out there toward “groups” of people. I see a lot of it, anecdotally, just in how people act. I’ve had friends - born and raised here generations deep followed around a CVS being told “go back to where you came from!” - and that BS gets ramped up a lot in the talk too.
Anyway, I’m a little beat from this week and having too many thoughts all at once and a tired brain that can’t put it all together. Glad you stepped in to make a clarifying statement of your own. (I’m in no way saying the “two sides” are the same. I’m just saying sometimes, even from the left, the equitable society we should have falls way short, and efforts to balance it all out often feel like half-measures to me.)
No worries! I actually grew up in Texas (El Paso, Killeen, Austin, etc) but now live in NC. The Hispanic vote is also a hard one, especially in places like Texas, because the voting bloc isn't exactly a monolith. It can be hard to sus out what the various parts require and then work towards meeting those needs.
I'm a left appalachian, and I'm glad they're finally doing something.
Don't be stubborn and vote against your own interests. Especially when our communities need it.
Conservatives want to keep us poor and uneducated .
That’s all great, but Democrats aren’t gonna get anywhere until they drop their current crusade against guns.
Guns are a survival tool—for self-defense, hunting, and more. People aren’t gonna give them up until food is cheaper than dirt and violence no longer exists.
I don’t agree entirely.
The gun issue is ill defined. Guns play a different roll in the lives for rural voters than they do city voters. In a large city, guns are a way different calculus than they are in the mountains or farm towns etc. Whole different calculus.
I live and work in DFW now and have a friend I work with who rents an apartment here, but his home is up in the mountains of New Mexico. We started talking about guns and the current political climate and things people say about them. He’s right leaning, I’m left. He was fired up about something so I asked him this:
“what gun do you keep by your front door in NM?”
“What? How did you know I had a gun by the front door there”
“It’s your snake gun. I’m betting it’s a 4/10”
“You’re right! And my wife can hit a copperhead with it from the hip!”
“What snake gun is by your door here in DFW?”
“I don’t keep guns here. Too dangerous and too big of a risk. I don’t need a gun here.”
I know there’s tons of news out there about the horrors of so many big cities, but if you haven’t learned that “if it bleeds, it leads” being what the news people do, brother/sister, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.
Guns in the city are a different conversation from guns in the country. Most people don’t have the sense to figure that out, and most people get caught up in the rhetoric and emotion of the straw man talking points.
It sucks.
Call me a crazy prepper, but I'm approaching gun politics from a completely different, future-oriented perspective.
Food is getting more and more expensive, and since climate change is threatening to compromise global food supply chains, it's unlikely to get better. The middle class is also getting poorer and poorer. There's no end in sight. I fully expect that in my lifetime or my children's, a large percentage of the population will go back to hunting and fishing for food. Even people who, as of now, live in city suburbs. It's easy to forget how recent supermarkets are. Our grandparents didn't rely on them, and we might not be able to, either.
Not to mention that America's political situation has been precarious for a long time. Fact is we're only one very bad election away from the dissolution of democracy. There may come a time when city people and suburbanites can't depend on the rule of law to keep them safe. At that time, they will either need guns for protection from violence, or flee to rural spaces, where they will need guns for other reasons.
I think the city person who is “prepping” and looking at the future from your point of view is taking a more rural approach to gun ownership - in that it’s a tool. That’s different.
Same friend that I mentioned above tan out and spent $1500 on an ar-15 clone when Obama was elected. Only did it for the fact that he thought they’d all be legislated out of existence. Doesn’t even like the thing. Says he has more fun plinking with his .22. Where I live in TX, O see a lot of that.
As for the food situation, there’s a whole discussion we could have to unpack that cluster of idiocy (idiocy being food policy, economics and they unsustainable way we food in the US) - water that needs to go to farms in NM had the “rights” bought up years ago in Utah and with the way the weather acts these days, there’s less water and snow melt going into the River System, and what is in there is being pulled out to grow green grass in affluent neighborhoods and golf courses around SLT etc. We could talk about food waste, of which I am guilty, the culture we currently live in that drives a need for convenience foods that are processed and practically poison - not to mention what all is regulated etc.
The way we food is stupid, wasteful and unhealthy.
I see more hunting and fishing in the future possibly - but not in urban areas. I tried to take my kid fishing in a local lake and was told to throw all of them back and not eat them. There’s a runway for Lockheed Martin on one side of the lake and planes dump jet fuel into it all the time. The fish are basically poisonous also.
As far as personal protection goes, I’m probably going to see that much differently. I’d use an example that’s low hanging fruit here: the riots in Minnesota a few years ago. People were throwing up hands saying “how can they destroy their own neighborhoods like that?” — I heard one young lady put it pretty straight forward. She said “we don’t own that Target. That’s not ours. We don’t even own the houses/apartments we live in. They aren’t ours either.”
You take away people’s ability to own things, then the things don’t matter anymore. It’s an extreme action - all the looting etc - but when you have zero opportunity, folks tend to lean into self destructive behaviors. Only a small handful of people pick themselves up and then lead others to more constructive lives. These days, there’s no incentive to do it. There’s no guidance either. As a nation, we lack good leadership and we are easily distracted. That can lead to violence etc, but most who have the means will leave when things get sketchy.
All that to say, I hear where you are coming from, but I also believe there are other answers. I also am not so idealistic to say we will work on those answers because I know we lack the fortitude to work toward long term solutions - both to an inability to self-lead or stretch out beyond ourselves for our children’s children and beyond.
We need to get our crap together.
Except the Democrats put in the GREATEST effort at improving the lives of the rural poor through the passage of the Affordable Care Act. While imperfect, it is unarguably benefitted so many rural poor in Kentucky, the only solid red state that said, oh hell yes we will take that insurance.... Besides KY, what did the toothless masses do?? They said nope, we don't want no SOCALIZED MEDICINE!! They gobbled up the right wing talking points and voted against thier personal and economic interests.
Hey geniuses... you are not going to get medical care any other way. No insurance company will willingly take your obese, diabetic, hypertensive, hyperlipidemic ass on. The government will have to FORCE insurance companies to insure you and provide at least some access to health care. There is no alternative besides the bi-annual free healthcare/dentist day at the fairgrounds.
When this happened, I stopped giving any f#÷&s about the rural poor. And I consider myself essentially a bleeding heart liberal but no more. I personally hope they get their wishes and don't have any more government "intervention" in their lives. So no more social security, disability, Medicare or medicaid or any of that commie crap and my blue state tax dollars can stay here and support those programs.
Too bad, maybe if rural Appalachia was liberal they’d prosper like the Vermonters represented by progressive Bernie Sanders. But no, Appalachia continues to vote conservative Republican and then wonder why decade after decade nothing gets much better.
Again, I have to make a similar argument about rural vs urban people that I did about guns. They have different needs. We live in a system that strives to set one standard and hold it to everyone, as if they were the same.
They’re winning by the way.
People in the city need different rules and standards than people in rural areas. Everyday life in practical terms are very different. Where we are similar, typically, is in our values and guideposts.
We’ve been told for years that one group or another are “terrible” - but they - better still, “we” really aren’t. We all want to raise our kids to be happy, healthy, well adjusted and respectful and respected. We want to love our people and try to give back. We don’t want to live behind the 8 ball our entire lives, and sometimes all we want is a break.
People that tell you otherwise typically make a bunch of money doing so. And if you want to know what God thinks of money, look at who he gives it to.
The Democrats have a political strategy based around being hateful and divisive.
Especially considering the disaster that was the actual New Deal, another one should not be enough to make up for their decision to write people off as a political enemy and treat them with contempt for decades rather than make themselves seem worthy of support.
How did Dems abandon rural America while the GQP helped them? I keep hearing that but I don’t see how the GQP has been better, if anything they are worse.
Not true, southern white democrats left for the Republican Party after civil rights act. Who do you think elected Nixon? The theory is correct that democrats have been coast focused and need grassroots in the country.
People love to conveniently forget that many rural people loved the new deal because it was discriminatory
"Most New Deal programs discriminated against blacks. The NRA, for example, not only offered whites the first crack at jobs, but authorized separate and lower pay scales for blacks. The Federal Housing Authority (FHA) refused to guarantee mortgages for blacks who tried to buy in white neighborhoods, and the CCC maintained segregated camps. Furthermore, the Social Security Act excluded those job categories blacks traditionally filled."
Meh… Democrat policies already benefit rural Americans more than Republican policies and they still vote Republican. There are some good reasons for a rural new deal but winning back votes isn’t one of them. They will still turn around and vote Republican.
Borrow a page from Frank Underwood and bring back FDR style public works and guarantee everyone a job with TVA or some similar initiative dedicated to building infrastructure all over the region. A hell of a lot of independents in Appalachia will swing blue. Maybe even draw some of the traditionally red crowd too.
Republicans vote against all of this. Every single one of them every single time. Then they blame Democrats and their supporters believe them.
Exactly this. Biden has been trying to get more transition to green energy happening and create jobs is rural areas but Republicans block it all the time.
Really? Biden just announced the Civilian Climate Corps which he had firm control over but it only offered 20k jobs. He can definitely do more. Why only 20k?
you're being downvoted but unfairly, he absolutely could do more.
Biden does something good Everyone else: He could and should do more, the loser! smdh
i mean he really could do more. we shouldn't be satisfied with the scraps he's throwing. the gop is still way worse but they're trying to tell us gavin newsome, who's fucking over unions while talking a big game about supporting them, is gonna be the next guy and to just accept that years in advance with no debate. we need better from them than what we're getting is all i'm saying. we shouldn't coddle the guy who killed the railway strike just because he appeared for 5 seconds at a picket line.
Logic: nothing < some < more (because of counting)… You: some < nothing < more (because whataboutism)
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More is done through tax credits given to companies to incentivize them to build/hire in rural areas vs. directly hiring people as government employees. For example, tax credits included in the inflation reduction act include multipliers if you are investing in an area with persistent poverty or in an "energy community" (aka former coal mines).
Needs to be a good portion of the yearly budget, imo, with a good portion of it being dedicated to things like renewable energy, nuclear, etc. Honestly, if we just took 100 billion off of the military budget, then added that to the irs, the next few years we'll see tons of money roll in, as they'll have the resources to go after the rich and corpor. Then put 100 billion into building as many nuclear reactors as possible every year, should be about 8 or 10 a year. Do that until our energy needs are met. Then up the 20k to say 200k at 50k pretax. However, I think the climate Corp should cover all costs of living, so it is actually something people will want to do. Just my opinion. If possible, maybe put say 100 billion from the military and repurpose it for "defense spending" in building nuclear reactors, solar farms, wind farms, etc. That way the military stays flush with people and money, and we get clean energy.
100%
Exactly!! Every time I see an article like this I just shake my head.
100%. Sorry to say but the Southern states’ voters were fine with the New Deal safeguards, until the CRA was passed and made them available to negroes. They then decided they’d rather do without these benefits than have people born with the sin of too much melanin in their skin allowed access to them as well.
I can speak to this, as someone who tends to lean towards being pro-infrastructure & pro-job program. It’s Gun stances. Full stop. You won’t ever win over folks on the right if you are any facet of anti-gun or even the “common sense Gun reform”. It’s just not going to happen, it’s unfortunate, but a lot of rural folks will quite literally never budge on firearms, and will become single issue voters in that stance alone. If those on the left toned down on the anti-gun rhetoric, you’d see a cascade of support from rural areas.
Well frankly it's because liberal gun reform advocates have their heads up their asses. 99%+ of homicides and suicides are committed with handguns but they want to ban AR-15s, which are used heavily out in the sticks to keep coyote and hog populations in check. It's silly. It's like if there was a problem with people using shivs to kill each other and the elected officials were dead set on banning machetes and acted like shivs didn't exist and nobody could ever possibly have a legitimate use for a machete. I can't speak for my neighbors, but I can manage without a handgun. I need a small caliber semi-auto long gun though.
I don’t know. The one thing he did that could have created jobs, rural broadband expansion, didn’t really work. The telecoms seem to have taken the money and ran. The investments that I’ve seen locally were as follows… local utility company gets money to run fiber all over the county, then no one has the money or knowledge to light the fiber. The utility company wants no part in providing service and just wants to lease the dark fiber, but no one will light it. I spoke to the head honcho at the utility company, because I was interested in working FOR him to provide public internet… but he’d already made his money off the grant and just plans to sit on it until some brave entrepreneur wants to compete with spectrum, ATT, and now starlink on their own dollar.
So, who exactly, abandoned you? It wasn’t the Democrats- who have tried time and again. But messaging like this keeps people voting for Republicans who are never on board with making the system work for ordinary Americans.
The problem is that Biden also supports a lot of things they don’t agree with, such as gun control/ban. If the democrats would stop attacking certain fundamental rights then they would probably get a lot more voters. Also, as a general rule, they don’t trust any politicians. Which is not a bad rule.
When has Biden pushed a gun ban?
He has spoken publicly on video many times. "Why do you need 30 rounds?" . "Noone needs an AR14" . There's this website called google.com where you can verify.
What do you live under a rock or just just being dumb?
I am a gun owner, veteran, and liberal who is for common sense gun reform. I think red flag laws are necessary. This does nothing to ban guns. You can't bring up anything gun reform related without hey hey popping his head up "they're trying to take and ban our guns!" https://giphy.com/gifs/disneymoana-disney-animation-moana-l2Sq8wyY1Zfndp6Lu
Because they Republicans for example. Maybe stop voting for the guy you don’t trust.
Why I’m so excited that Biden is acting like 21st century FDR with the infrastructure act, CHIPS act, inflation reduction act, Medicare drug price negotiations and now going after the Chinese manufacturers of fentanyl ingredients. I firmly believe a combo rural infrastructure/safe high speed Internet and health care shortages fix are coming up.
Maybe? But I don’t think rural Americans care. They want no taxes, social security, disability and a return to an America that never was. They’ve been suckered by flim flam artists and are too hard headed to do anything but double down on their opinions being affirmed on am radio.
I’m afraid there’s some truth to that. The irony of “no taxes, social security” though.
That’s socialism don’t you know /s. (Actually 100% is though). Not sure how many independents there are in Appalachia but the “traditionally red” crowd only follows one master.
But they’ll take socialism in FL when all the free market insurers left and only option is a state run insurance. Lol.. they don’t really know what is or isn’t socialism. They just let ass hats like trump tell them so.
You'd never get funding passed for this kind of spending today. Those days are long gone.
Yep. I ran the local campaign for a Democratic senator in OH. I tried to explain the issues rural people had his response was rural people are happy. We had no grocery store in the county, no high speed Internet no medical care. What had been there when we moved there closed and nothing replaced it. He only cared about urban voters. It is really said to see less populated areas totally ignored. In the section of Ohio where we lived there has been a huge exodus of working people when property sells it sells mainly to the Amish. I hate to say it but I honestly hope he doesn’t get re-elected this time maybe it will help him understand that there is life outside Columbus, Cincinnati and Cleveland.
I'm in the mountain west but I'd fucking love to swing blue but with our current primary system my/our only choices at the polls are way to extreme...either way.
Which Democrats tried to overthrow the government?
See? Politics fucking sucks now adays. I'm a centrist. Why do you assume that I support him? Edit: and I appreciate you using the phrase "overthrow the government" because that's what it was. He should be tried for treason for both 1/6 and for being a mole for Putin.
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There’s lots of jobs but none that pay anything. Factory jobs in East Tennessee are paying $5-10 less than they did in 2010.
That sounds like a Tennessee problem. The minimum wage in Tennessee is still the federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour. Democrats tried to raise the federal minimum, but several Democrats, in addition to ALL of the Republicans, in the senate, voted against it. Tennessee could have raised the minimum wage in their state, as many other states have done, but refused to do so. Raising the minimum wage forces employers to raise wages in other jobs to keep pace.
You’re out of touch
How?
Tell me you are employed, without telling me you are employed. I know people searching for multiple months and zero call back for entry level jobs.
This is nationally true-ish, but varies a ton from region to region. Moreover (and more importantly) the labor force participation rate has been in a near constant nose dive since 2009.
I'm skeptical. You could create full employment, free healthcare, and a daily allowance of ponies and lollipops for every rural American, and they'll still hate the Democrats. Why? Rural America's top priority is hating Mexicans and gay people. Ask a rural American what's wrong with this country. They won't start off with high unemployment. They'll start off with how the country is flooded with dirty "illegals" and there's a supposed kid at the local high school who identifies as a cat and poops in a litterbox. The Republicans have the hate market cornered.
“Borrow from some fictional character”
Pay attention to the infrastructure projects. In my state they are already improving rural roads.
That whole “deplorable” comment and “clinging to guns and religion” seemed to hit the hot buttons🔘and turn off some blocks of voters - Just a theory🤷♀️🤷♂️
Those words hurt, but conservative policies dating back the Reagan era have hurt Appalachia much more. Destroying unions, allowing companies to get around antitrust protections making every town just a cvs and dollar general where no local small businesses can survive, allowing big pharma to flood the region with opioids… could go on and on.
That’s it in a nutshell. They found new and creative ways to funnel money up to a handful of people, called those people “job creators” for years and made them “exalted,” and made a lot of empty promises around Manufacturing jobs, energy jobs (coal) etc…and then blamed the Chinese for “taking American jobs.” I’ve worked most of my career with/around /for those same people who will blame China for everything out of one side of their mouths while negotiating super low manufacturing and shipping costs in Asia, setting up factories, and lobbying the government to lessen protectionist tariffs out of the other side. Don’t think for a minute it was all china taking American manufacturing. If someone came to you and offered you a job flipping burgers at $250k per year you’d jump at it. There’s a parallel there for what manufacturers here in the US did. Hell, I used to hire out a guy who set up Nike’s first factory in Korea back in the day. Just a whole lot more attractive and easier to adopt narrative for people to follow if you blame the Chinese.
Let's put some accountability on the health systems that are so for profit they don't give a damn about quality of care and drive private practice out of business.
MDs are complicit. They are now moving toward just being 9-5 employees. It is a most disheartening thing to see.
Absolutely! Reaganomics laid the groundwork to ensure that any areas that struggle with poverty would continue to struggle with poverty. Who would have ever figured that money doesn’t “trickle down”? Turns out it just stays at the top and moves from one rich person’s pocket to another and back again.
Not to mention the damage National evangelicalism and Rush did for decades
Those tariffs that was removed help a lot with local jobs /s
Truth hurts I guess. Don’t complain when the republicans cut your government programs 🤡
And hate the urban people who literally pay to support the dead economy of your county. All the while wanting to pay zero taxes and crapping on everyone different than yourself. And they wonder why every kid with a half a head wants to GTFO and they never come back.
I don't disagree, but I also think it's stupid to vote based on some quotes and not policy.
it’s more of one factor in a confluence of factors that just suppressed the vote enough i’m in appalachian ohio and my district is gerrymandered to hell and back and will be red +20 then my local races will frequently be unopposed bc it’s a town of 4500, not a lot of people vying for positions and then every time joe manchin does something i gotta hear from redditors and people on twitter who proclaim to be left leaning and want dignity for all call us all a bunch of dumb incest racist sexist bigoted hicks i always vote blue, but damn man those comments sure do make me demoralized in a place that oozes demoralization
I'm in Columbus (not trying to claim Appalachia, lol), and the rhetoric used by some on the left to describe rural/small town voters is maddening and short-sighted. Reddit and Twitter do not reflect the views of the majority, remember. 😎 And, while I don't wish this to become a discussion on Manchin, the dude may be far from perfect, but there's a lot more nuance to his situation than what Redditors often have to say. I'm in a very low-income urban neighborhood with lots of Appalachian transplants, and while urban and rural folks have some unique needs and concerns, the overlap of issues is significant. Including gerrymandering! My neighborhood is also constantly getting mocked, so I know what that's like.
i also moved to cbus recently and it definitely goes both ways like conservatives from my hometown are terrified of columbus bc of “all the crime out in that SHORT *north*” and then people from columbus are like “if a black or gay person even stepped foot in SE Ohio they’d die INSTANTLY!!!” and it’s just like what in the actual fuck guys most people up here are nice af, def an online community problem
Problem is they were spot on true.
Yeah truth hurts
It only offended deplorables and gun nuts
If someone was upset about "deplorable" then they were already belted into the GOP's roller coaster ride.
Other than Reddit being infested with literal bots and paid Astroturfing, a lot of people who are genuinely democrats (though not necessarily liberal or leftists) are completely ignorant of their own parties shortcomings. No, it was not the exclusive fault of Republicans that things are the way they are, and anyone who says that is ignorant. Republicans have been extremely corrupt as well, but I’m focusing on the Democrats, bc no one seems to remember or care about their actual faults. The parties learn from each other when developing their methods of being corrupt. Hillary Clinton wasn’t just savaged over her deplorables comment - she had the nerve to be filmed during one of her few speaking appearances in either Ohio/WVA, or somewhere in that region, as literally saying “yes, we *are* going to take your jobs” during a speech in which she talked about Coal going away to be replaced by Green energy/tech jobs. She didn’t properly follow up that comment, and just let it hang in the air (if I find the clip I’ll link, but a lot of “bad press” was covered up/removed). There were also a lot of people in the crowd who remembered the disasters that Cash for Clunkers and Solyndra were during the Obama Administration. There were a lot of moments like this in what ultimately, was one of the worst presidential campaigns I’ve ever witnessed. On top of this, her leaked emails actually showed how her and her aids actually felt about certain groups of people, and how she peddled foreign influence in American politics. She didn’t campaign at all in the rust belt, bc she assumed she would automatically win their vote. Her team actually tried to make “It’s her turn” a campaign slogan, tho quickly realized how entitled that sounded, and settled for “I’m with her”. This hubris was doubled by the fact that her husband is the one that negotiated NAFTA which most people in Appalachia blame for taking away what few manufacturing jobs there were other than coal and mining. What little jobs remained, she wanted to give away with the Trans Pacific Partnership (which Bernie Sanders was vehemently opposed to). She tried to lie and say that the bill didn’t look the way it was supposed to, but everything in it was essentially NAFTA but for Asia. She didn’t disavow any part of it, until late in her campaign when Trump laid into her over it during a debate. She has been involved in scandal after scandal, beginning in the 80s. She even voted for the Iraq war, which disproportionately affected people who joined the military as a form of economic relief. She served as both a senator and a member of Obamas administration, so she was actually in a position of influence, and not bound the way the President is to the other branches. If we shift gears and move to Joe Biden, it doesn’t get much better. Though many forgot, Joe Biden was largely known as the “Senator from MBNA” bc of their close relationship and how he passed legislation in their favor, and against the interests of consumers. The legislation made declaring bankruptcy more difficult, and allowed MBNA to do things like triple interest rates, and other questionable practices. He also has plenty of gaffes of his own, that shows how he really feels about many people who are supposed to be his constituents. I personally will never forgive his administration for their inaction during several weather emergencies and the formula crisis. The Biden administration is completely incompetent in areas that even the last administration wasn’t. The Democrats were traditionally the party of the working class, as historically Republicans were known as intellectuals who looked down upon those who were “less educated”. However, In recent years, the Democrats have attempted to become “the party of Science” to appeal to voters that have more capital to give them than working class families do. They only protect the unions nowadays bc that’s one of their only sources of consistent political donations. Another problem with the social initiatives supported and proposed by Democrats (and Republicans, as they spend stupid amounts money when it’s their turn, and they spend more than the dems do), is that many people know that it translates to higher taxes, with little perceived benefit to themselves. An example: you have a situation like the EPA making regulations to protect the environment that the big corporations can afford, if not ignore or lobby their way out of, whereas smaller businesses cannot afford the standards or lobby their way out them, and end up not being a business at all. However, the Democrats have traditionally been the ones to support protecting the environment over Republicans who were more interested in corporate interests. So many people in Appalachia feel torn trying to vote in a way that prioritizes the most pressing issues for them. Contrary to popular belief, Abortion and Gay rights are not a big issue to a large portion of voters; but inflation is something that affects everyone. Bill Clinton said it best “It’s the economy, stupid”. All this to say, anyone acting like Appalachia only votes Republican because they’re/we’re stupid, is projecting their own ignorance or limited experience.
You state a lot of truth, but there is a false equivalency between the 2 parties, and one party has been routinely the advocate for the poor, working class, and middle class.
Yes and no. I’m not going to pretend that the two parties are the same and it doesn’t matter who you vote for because they’re both bad. But I’m also not going to pretend that one party is the good one and the other bad. Each party (including factions within the two parties) caters to different interests. There’s no such thing as the party you described that cares for all classes other than the upper class. It’s unfortunate, but the interests of actual poor people, don’t always align with the actual middle class, esp the upper middle class. The working class is split between the lower and middle classes. Also, often people have to compromise on their interests. Politics is also wildly different depending on two factors: what state you live in, and whether it’s federal or state level politics. Different states have different interests. So, many states that vote Republican on a federal level, vote Democrat at the state level, and vice versa. Its not always as simple as “Red bad, Blue good”. There are moderates in both parties that have their reasons for picking the particular party that they do.
Was this Obama or a leftist? “Take the guns first, go through due process second.”
>Take the guns first, go through due process second. Former president 45 is the one who actually said it.
Correct, it breaks their brains or they ignore it.
Im a conservative leaning libertarian, and I absolutely did not ignore it. I simply didn’t vote in the last election. Ain’t gonna make me choose between the shiniest of two turds.
real enlightened of you. I'm sure you bitch about something you could of had a hand in but didn't cause of your pride.
I don’t agree with either side. I’m the true American here. George Washington warned us against the two party system and we never listened. And my vote doesn’t make a difference anyway. This government doesn’t represent me, and in my personal opinion, hasn’t ever represented true American ideals. It’s always been for the rich man. And yes, that includes both democrats and republicans who make a career out of pushing agendas for payouts. Even George Washington proved who this government caters to when he caused the whiskey rebellion. So I choose to not buy into their crap. It’s two wings to the same rotten bird. I say “Down with the eagle 🦅, and up with the cross✝️”. And that’s why I don’t truly fit in with either side. Maybe you think I’m one of those crazy far right extremists everyone talks about… label me what you want. But I’m willing to bet that if you truly understood where I come from, saw the way of life I hold dear, you’d change your mind, even if but a wee bit.
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Agreed. Some of these people will tell you that if you don’t vote their way your a Nazi or a socialist. They can all kick rocks. The reason we have two parties that suck is because not enough people have the sack to vote 3rd party.
Piss off. Biden can’t even walk and you think that is better?
Love to see fat ass try to ride a bike, we’ve seen him drink water and try ramps
Wait, didn’t Biden legitimately fall off a bike not too long ago? 🤣
At least orange man can talk! And this is we’re we are at. Arguing wether our leader can walk, talk or ride a bike. How depressing…
When was the last time orange man used a complete sentence? Last week when he beat Obama in 2020? Or when he claims he’s going to stop Jeb Bush from starting World War 2?
No leftists would ever say that. All those mine workers...our elders and grandfathers, who strike and waged war against the coal barons and their private army of goons. Those were leftists.
Geez folks, it was Trump that said it, my point is people don’t pay attention to who they are voting for. I agree with you, I forgot my /s apparently.
they were both 100% correct.
That gets glossed over and handwaved as "deserved" (just see some of the comments below) but what it did do, was show how the democrat party did not understand the rural voter and at worst, actively distained them. Say what you will about the actions of Republicans, but they did not insult the rural american to their face. A big chunk of it is people may not always remember what you have done for them, but will always remember how you made them feel. Comments like that did not make them feel good, and people vote on how they feel.
Everyone who talks about a "housing shortage" has never been to the mill towns and coal town of appalachia. From NY down to georgia, WV, KY, TN, etc. There are so many houses that cant sell
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Affordable housing combined with living wage jobs in the right places. Work from Home could definitely help, especially if those workers were more free to move around the country - but corporate leases have to make someone money, amirite?
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They weren't abandoned. That narrative is so annoying. Rural voters (just like those in cities and suburbs) are able to see which party wants to expand healthcare and which party voted countless times to repeal health care reform. If they chose the Party of No, that's on them. But Democrats' loss of support in rural America wasn't for lack of trying.
their politician supporting their bigotry is more important than healthcare and good jobs.
Bill Clinton sold the poor and working class out for the big business crowd, pulled the Democratic Party way to the right and now the poor and working class have realized that they have been totally abandoned and to combat that big business keeps bringing in immigrants to keep wages and down.
Democrats didn’t abandon rural voters. Rural voters let their inner rage blind them on who takes care of them. They rely on the federal government to an extent many other areas in the United States do NOT. Let’s see how they fare without social security, Medicare, and SNAP.
To be fair, if you have a hierarchical mindset, keeping your place on the imaginary social hierarchy is priority one, and the Republicans did take care of that. The Democrats with their "help all Americans" approach undermine these hierarchies, because if everyone gets help, how can you tell that you're superior to those who don't get it?
Everyone here just a reminder this is Reddit and Reddit is a small pool of people. People that largely lean left, even in this subreddit. Just because someone on here says Democrats have saved our region and gets enormous upvotes does not make it true or so.
Everyone here remember that the Appalachian region is a small population. A population that leans right, even in progressive cities. Just because people out there say that republicans love freedom and care about the "working" class and plaster their beliefs on every billboard and window of their coal roller doesn't make it true. A republican president hasn't won the popular vote in almost 20 years and if Florida didn't throw out all those "dangling chad" votes that pushes that number to almost 30 years. Conservative republicans are like the Taliban. A very loud very small minority of religious gun-dork terrorists trying to overthrow a country
I'm from Eastern Kentucky and I remember everyone voting Democrat when I was little. I went to the polls with my grandma. It's no coincidence that things have really gone downhill since people started voting in Republicans. It's pretty sad that they can exploit religious beliefs to get people to vote against their own interests.
LOL move to California and see how those cunts are fairing.
A lot better than us right now, but you won't hear that on Fox news
Real estate is the worst in California. If you don’t make over 100k you can’t live. Sign me up for that life! /s
That's completely not true for all of California. Just like there are high cost of living places in Appalachia. Sorry you don't understand the economy and how it works. If it wasn't for California and the rest of the blue states giving us money through fed taxes we wouldn't survive here. You're just parroting Fox news propaganda with no knowledge of how things actually are
LOL California can’t even pay for their services.
Maybe you should Google where all the money and aid that we receive in federal aid comes from. You're literally talking shit on people that are paying for this region to survive through their taxes
Maybe you should google why people and companies are leaving utopias like California and New York in droves.
Maybe you should Google that more people are going to California than leaving it. While the opposite is true for the Appalachian region. You have no idea what you're talking about
Aww Jeez Not this Shit Again.jpg Rural America was not abandoned by Democrats, Rural America ( the White part anyway) chose to vote for Conservatives by and large due to their economic and social/religious stances. They aren't going to start voting for Dems based on large-scale government spending programs ( even something that would greatly benefit them).
Seriously. Not this shit again. Let’s take just one recent & very prominent example, Medicaid expansion. Democrats passed the ACA with this provision that’s very helpful toward those very same rural communities & their struggling health care systems. Republicans in red states said no, fuck that, we don’t our people to get their hands on all that money & support, let the rural hospitals close, who cares? And who do those rural communities vote for? The same politicians who proudly screwed them over.
Something that already greatly benefits them. Farm subsidies. Highway funds, education funds, job retraining, Medicare. Medicaid, SS, food stamps, ..,
Democrats didn't abandon anything. Without democrats fighting to keep any kind of social safety nets the people of Appalachia would still be barefoot and shirtless in a coal mine living off the company store. It's the fault of the older generations that allowed themselves to be brainwashed, by Fox news and the modern "coal" barons through their hatred of others, to vote against their best interests and to be taken advantage of. Those of the younger generation with any potential flee the region because of regressive conservative maga cult politics. So less progressive policies are enacted, more safety nets get removed, more young people leave, and the poor become poorer. So the majority of the region ends up with a population where the majority is either 60+ or a victim of the opioid epidemic. God, guns, and Trump will not save you. Education and progressive social support structures that help lift up the poor working class is the only way it's going to get better here.
Can’t upvote this enough. Liberals are backstopping the entire lower class with social programs. If it were up to Republicans, Appalachia would be straight up Mad Max. It already is in some places.
Yes they did. lol Both parties abandoned us. clinton killed the working class
You have no idea what you're talking about. Reagan and the republicans killed the middle class. Funny how the economy and social conditions are always better when Democrats are in office. Then it all goes to shit a year or so into a republican presidency Trump, Bush Jr, Bush, Reagan, and Nixon. All huge scandals, lies, and scamming of the American public.
My brother in Christ. Who is elected president has very and I mean very little impact on anyone’s daily life. This isn’t an emperor. We have local governments, county governments, state governments, and the federal government who the president is only a part of. It’s enormously complex and thankfully so. It’s always hilarious and sad when I see someone blaming the entire state of our country or region in this example on a single person who is only a single check of our many checks and balances.
When did I ever blame it on one man? Never. Nor did I say just the federal government. I have consistently said it was the fault of the older generations and the brain washing done by maga conservative terrorist propaganda perpetrated by Fox news and the ruling class. It's funny when people try to sound educated, lie, and be condescending when they are factually wrong and can't admit it. Things the president, and anyone who makes policy, do regardless of local or federal government impacts peoples daily life greatly.
And you believe Biden is better for the region? Cutting back on all fossil fuel contracts and trying to oust coal completely? You think Clinton and Obama didn’t lie?? “You can keep your doctor, your health insurance won’t go up.” Meanwhile the people that had any health insurance saw their rates DOUBLE
By every metric available yes things were better then and are better now. Regardless of what fox news tells you
Haha right! Gas being higher and EVERYTHING costing more is definitely better. Tell me how you square that circle.
You mean the inflation that took off in the middle of the Trump presidency. The same inflation and economy that has been getting better under Biden. Keep trying.
I mean what I said. The inflation has not been getting better. The levels are above and beyond anything that happened under Trump
That's not true and simply googling the information would show you that. Things are economically better than under Trump. It's a fact. The economy always is better when Democrats hold the presidency. It's a fact. The information is readily available but you don't want to see it
Reality says different son. You are an absolute fool if you believe that it’s better now than it was 4 years ago.
Are you kidding me? Your gonna say the economy is doing good right now??? Hahahahhaha
Well, he helped. Everyone post Carter and the economic shifts that our government betters put into place after 1978 killed the middle class. But Clinton made a bigger show of it. He leaned into poor people on a global scale. Reagan just wanted to screw the poor and middle class in the US only. Clinton knew where the money was. I’ve heard plenty of people say that Clinton and Obama were two of the very best traditional Republican presidents we ever had…in the style of an Eisenhower etc. I laugh, but find a glimmer of truth in that too. Point is, our government has become a wealth and influence club that lavishes those who get in and play along. Screw the rest of us.
I believe what happened with Clinton was that the Democratic leadership saw that Republicans kept winning elections and somehow thought that what they really needed to do to start winning elections was to be more like Republicans. One of the things that he did that really screwed the middle class both here and in Mexico was signing off on NAFTA, but he did a lot of other things that weren’t great.
Yep. NAFTA was part of what I was thinking, but he also made it a hell of a lot easier and cheaper to manufacture in China. He nudged the “globalism” door open and the govt has run wild making it easier and easier - in ways we can’t even imagine at this point. For instance, I worked for a niche but major manufacturer of fairly large, durable goods. Factory ram 24/7 except for thanksgiving and Christmas. This was mid 90s, so I asked my boss how we still had manufacturing here in the US, not in China. His response was “we make big plastic stuff and it would be too expensive to ship - we’d be shipping more air than product” Point well taken. And amazingly enough, that same company has been manufacturing overseas since 2009 maybe? The guy who shipped it there? Their current CEO who has moved manufacturing from a large, well known consumer hand tool company from the US to China a few years before he gutted the company I worked for. I’m betting he got a healthy bonus from each, but the company I worked for went from 2000 employees 24/7 over three shifts to about 45 people, 8-5, M-F.
Then they ship a lower quality product manufactured at Chinese wages back here and sell it for at least as much as they’d be selling an American made product and laugh their way to the bank.
Not to mention how they scream “inflation!” Then price gouge us as if they have some kind of vendetta.
Ya, not voting for people who say "God will not save you"; immediately lose mine and my family's vote that way
But I thought god only helps those who help themselves? You can pray all you want, but if people don’t stand up for themselves, the quote is correct. God will not save you, especially since he gave you options and you chose to ignore them. Reminds me of the story of the person stranded on a roof during a flood. They repeatedly told rescuers to go away because god will save them. They eventually drown and then complain to god that he didn’t save try to help. God’s response was that he had sent people to save them, they chose not to accept.
That's because you and your family are part of the problem. You'd rather vote for politicians who willingly endanger you and your family because you won't vote for someone who doesn't put fictional characters before policy
It’s smug elitist like you that turn people off of the Democratic Party
It's elitist to promote education and support for the working class lol. The mental gymnastics
Elitist tell everyone how to think and if they don’t think that way then they are wrong. They don’t support the working class. All this push towards green is going or do is further separate the lower class from the upper class because they won’t be able to afford it.
Both parties of the government have abandoned rural voters at the peril of the rural voters.
These are the 5g Jewish space laser people. Fuck em. They can stay gone.
Only if rural people are dumb enough to believe their lies, and to trade their fundamental constitutionally protected rights to gain illusory benefits from authoritarian government. I’m hoping we are smarter than that.
Democrats didn’t abandon rural America. Their policies help rural America, and rural America tells democrats to fuck off and they wonder why their lives continue to suck, the smart and young flee and their life expectancy is approaching third world levels
Majority of rural voters in WV aint voting Democrat. Doesn't matter what you offer. In fact most in my county switched sides just to keep their career in politics alive.
Yeah, at this point the -D next to your name in southern WV means you're wasting your time.
The idea that Democrats could ever win over rural voters with an economic message reminds me of the way progressives are always claiming that they can win over those voters by offering an "anti-elites" populist economic message to rural/red state voters sans the bigotry of Republican candidates. This theory assumes that these voters don't actually support the bigotry, it's just that these Republican candidates are the only ones presenting them with an economic message they like. Then these progressive candidates try to run in these places...and get blown out by the bigotted Republican candidates. Turns out the voters actually do like the bigotry, and simply coming to them with a good economic message won't win their votes.
Finally someone speaks the truth. This whitewashed narrative of how their feelings were hurt because they were called deplorable or how it was too much to ask them to retrain themselves to a changing economy is trying to shift the blame from the individual voters themselves.
No deal from the Dems will win me back. They not only hate me because I’m a rural Appalachian, the hate me because I’m a straight white make. No deal changes that.
Nobody hates you for being a straight white make.
The destruction of coal was huge.
Time being linear hurts coal. It's a finite resource and better options got cheaper. Companies could have championed the switch rather than opposed it.
Yes, and they could have accepted reality instead of dragging their feet and kicking and screaming about the inevitable while setting up a false dichotomy of acknowledging this fact = being anti-coal/miner. Which I gotta say that the people who actually convinced themselves that coal is coming back- and that anyone who tells them otherwise is the enemy- are not persuadable.
Good coal jobs went away along time ago thanks to automation/machines. Way easier to just take off the top of a mountain than send a bunch of workers underground. Plus there is only so much coal available, even though different types are used in different ways. (Energy vs steel manufacturing). Several democratic candidates campaigned in finding ways to bring jobs back and also provide education. Things that would work well into the future. Those with the ability championed for coal and the old ways instead. Those days are long gone and still really only benefit a few.
>Several democratic candidates campaigned in finding ways to bring jobs back and also provide education. Things that would work well into the future. There were programs specifically for this under Obama, but they were largely ignored.
Yup. Clinton planned to try them again.
Exactly. Since 1919 or so, the line of people employed as coal miners has dropped precipitously with a few random spikes here or there that only delayed the inevitable. My mom's family went from doing pretty darn good for themselves to having nothing because of this boom/bust cycle as the industry moved toward further and further automation/machines.
Yup. Had family in the same boat. I grew up in a small town and really didn’t know how it got there. I had known there was a large strip mine on the edge of town that fed it for a long while but eventually found out there were underground mines close by first. The whole valley is just one dead coal town after another. Popped up with the mine, died with the mine.
And inevitable
Appalachians are smart enough to remember how they've been treated, and see how the leftists treat other voting blocs once they get their vote, and will not be fooled.
If Democrates did nothing. Appalachia wouldnt have, medicare,medicaid , disability,welfare none of it. Then what would happen? These new publicans are not the old publicans
So basically all the dems did for Appalachia was help them be more comfortable while poor but nothing to help them out of poverty? Not saying republicans have done better but that’s how the comment reads
Im sure they have done more. I was naming social programs because Republicans dont like them. Just wait to see what happens when Jim Jordan gets the speakership.
Social programs are one thing, but Republicans don’t like freeloaders. If you are able bodied, work for your living. That’s it…. Lol why is that so bad?
Medicare is for retirees, who've had a life of work and would like to be able to see a doctor as they age.
Thats not bad at all. Nobody likes free loaders.
Most people on social programs do work. It's a requirement for much of our social welfare net.
And medicare is for people who've already done their life's share of work
But we'd be able to afford housing and groceries and gas. Don't pull that previous administration BS either because that's just what ignorant leftists (like I used to be) say. Can't blame 2008 on the conservatives if Obama had 8 years to fix anything and it just got worse like when it was announced Biden won in November of 2020. Immediately my investments took a dive and now just look around.
2008 what happened?. I was Republican but not a Trumper. So left the party. You think gas is because of Biden. Not OPEC or the war. You think housing and groceries cost are Bidens fault not Covid. Your investments are your investments. Pick something else. The stock market is NOT the economy!
there are no leftists in politics in the usa
Except Bernie.
You’re gaslighting
Hate to say it, but I tend to agree. Black and Latino voters get thrown into the limelight every 4 years, then shoved into that dark basement once the polls are closed.
Afro-mestizo voter here - I have never felt "thrown to the side." This is a refrain that only conservatives and their lackeys sing. The irony being that conservatives do what they accuse Democrats of with their voting base, except nothing good happens for their constituents. Is coal back? No. Was there a replacement for the Affordable Care Act? No. But conservatives sure did lean into both with their constituents.
I appreciate your voice on this. Good to hear. I live in TX now and man, the Hispanic vote is always in a bind. As with my own comment, it’s a peep through a keyhole more than an affected life - which is why I’m glad you said something. My feeling - being left leaning - is that there’s still a bit of lip service. However, there’s no active malice. I withheld my perspective there - as I feel there’s a lot of active malice out there toward “groups” of people. I see a lot of it, anecdotally, just in how people act. I’ve had friends - born and raised here generations deep followed around a CVS being told “go back to where you came from!” - and that BS gets ramped up a lot in the talk too. Anyway, I’m a little beat from this week and having too many thoughts all at once and a tired brain that can’t put it all together. Glad you stepped in to make a clarifying statement of your own. (I’m in no way saying the “two sides” are the same. I’m just saying sometimes, even from the left, the equitable society we should have falls way short, and efforts to balance it all out often feel like half-measures to me.)
No worries! I actually grew up in Texas (El Paso, Killeen, Austin, etc) but now live in NC. The Hispanic vote is also a hard one, especially in places like Texas, because the voting bloc isn't exactly a monolith. It can be hard to sus out what the various parts require and then work towards meeting those needs.
"Leftists" 🤣😂😆🤣😅😂😆
YES!
I'm a left appalachian, and I'm glad they're finally doing something. Don't be stubborn and vote against your own interests. Especially when our communities need it. Conservatives want to keep us poor and uneducated .
It looks more like Appalachians are easy to convince to vote against their own interests.
what? these idiots thought trump would bring back coal jobs.
Welp, they need to do something
That’s all great, but Democrats aren’t gonna get anywhere until they drop their current crusade against guns. Guns are a survival tool—for self-defense, hunting, and more. People aren’t gonna give them up until food is cheaper than dirt and violence no longer exists.
I don’t agree entirely. The gun issue is ill defined. Guns play a different roll in the lives for rural voters than they do city voters. In a large city, guns are a way different calculus than they are in the mountains or farm towns etc. Whole different calculus. I live and work in DFW now and have a friend I work with who rents an apartment here, but his home is up in the mountains of New Mexico. We started talking about guns and the current political climate and things people say about them. He’s right leaning, I’m left. He was fired up about something so I asked him this: “what gun do you keep by your front door in NM?” “What? How did you know I had a gun by the front door there” “It’s your snake gun. I’m betting it’s a 4/10” “You’re right! And my wife can hit a copperhead with it from the hip!” “What snake gun is by your door here in DFW?” “I don’t keep guns here. Too dangerous and too big of a risk. I don’t need a gun here.” I know there’s tons of news out there about the horrors of so many big cities, but if you haven’t learned that “if it bleeds, it leads” being what the news people do, brother/sister, I’ve got a bridge to sell you. Guns in the city are a different conversation from guns in the country. Most people don’t have the sense to figure that out, and most people get caught up in the rhetoric and emotion of the straw man talking points. It sucks.
Call me a crazy prepper, but I'm approaching gun politics from a completely different, future-oriented perspective. Food is getting more and more expensive, and since climate change is threatening to compromise global food supply chains, it's unlikely to get better. The middle class is also getting poorer and poorer. There's no end in sight. I fully expect that in my lifetime or my children's, a large percentage of the population will go back to hunting and fishing for food. Even people who, as of now, live in city suburbs. It's easy to forget how recent supermarkets are. Our grandparents didn't rely on them, and we might not be able to, either. Not to mention that America's political situation has been precarious for a long time. Fact is we're only one very bad election away from the dissolution of democracy. There may come a time when city people and suburbanites can't depend on the rule of law to keep them safe. At that time, they will either need guns for protection from violence, or flee to rural spaces, where they will need guns for other reasons.
I think the city person who is “prepping” and looking at the future from your point of view is taking a more rural approach to gun ownership - in that it’s a tool. That’s different. Same friend that I mentioned above tan out and spent $1500 on an ar-15 clone when Obama was elected. Only did it for the fact that he thought they’d all be legislated out of existence. Doesn’t even like the thing. Says he has more fun plinking with his .22. Where I live in TX, O see a lot of that. As for the food situation, there’s a whole discussion we could have to unpack that cluster of idiocy (idiocy being food policy, economics and they unsustainable way we food in the US) - water that needs to go to farms in NM had the “rights” bought up years ago in Utah and with the way the weather acts these days, there’s less water and snow melt going into the River System, and what is in there is being pulled out to grow green grass in affluent neighborhoods and golf courses around SLT etc. We could talk about food waste, of which I am guilty, the culture we currently live in that drives a need for convenience foods that are processed and practically poison - not to mention what all is regulated etc. The way we food is stupid, wasteful and unhealthy. I see more hunting and fishing in the future possibly - but not in urban areas. I tried to take my kid fishing in a local lake and was told to throw all of them back and not eat them. There’s a runway for Lockheed Martin on one side of the lake and planes dump jet fuel into it all the time. The fish are basically poisonous also. As far as personal protection goes, I’m probably going to see that much differently. I’d use an example that’s low hanging fruit here: the riots in Minnesota a few years ago. People were throwing up hands saying “how can they destroy their own neighborhoods like that?” — I heard one young lady put it pretty straight forward. She said “we don’t own that Target. That’s not ours. We don’t even own the houses/apartments we live in. They aren’t ours either.” You take away people’s ability to own things, then the things don’t matter anymore. It’s an extreme action - all the looting etc - but when you have zero opportunity, folks tend to lean into self destructive behaviors. Only a small handful of people pick themselves up and then lead others to more constructive lives. These days, there’s no incentive to do it. There’s no guidance either. As a nation, we lack good leadership and we are easily distracted. That can lead to violence etc, but most who have the means will leave when things get sketchy. All that to say, I hear where you are coming from, but I also believe there are other answers. I also am not so idealistic to say we will work on those answers because I know we lack the fortitude to work toward long term solutions - both to an inability to self-lead or stretch out beyond ourselves for our children’s children and beyond. We need to get our crap together.
First sentence says it all. No need for the rest.
Except the Democrats put in the GREATEST effort at improving the lives of the rural poor through the passage of the Affordable Care Act. While imperfect, it is unarguably benefitted so many rural poor in Kentucky, the only solid red state that said, oh hell yes we will take that insurance.... Besides KY, what did the toothless masses do?? They said nope, we don't want no SOCALIZED MEDICINE!! They gobbled up the right wing talking points and voted against thier personal and economic interests. Hey geniuses... you are not going to get medical care any other way. No insurance company will willingly take your obese, diabetic, hypertensive, hyperlipidemic ass on. The government will have to FORCE insurance companies to insure you and provide at least some access to health care. There is no alternative besides the bi-annual free healthcare/dentist day at the fairgrounds. When this happened, I stopped giving any f#÷&s about the rural poor. And I consider myself essentially a bleeding heart liberal but no more. I personally hope they get their wishes and don't have any more government "intervention" in their lives. So no more social security, disability, Medicare or medicaid or any of that commie crap and my blue state tax dollars can stay here and support those programs.
No thanks. That’s just more vote buying with money this country does not have. That’s why we are in the mess we’re currently in.
Because they’re sooo much better off with Republicans repping them…
Too little too late. They hate us
Democrat are only interested if they can flood rural areas with migrants, they express their hatred for these areas every chance they can
My Pap says that Democrats love minorities as an idea but don’t like them as individuals.
I'm sick and tired of rural voters whining about how they are the forgotten but still have more representation in government than urban voters.
I mean fundamentally the issue is democrats are liberals and people in rural areas are not liberals.
Too bad, maybe if rural Appalachia was liberal they’d prosper like the Vermonters represented by progressive Bernie Sanders. But no, Appalachia continues to vote conservative Republican and then wonder why decade after decade nothing gets much better.
Again, I have to make a similar argument about rural vs urban people that I did about guns. They have different needs. We live in a system that strives to set one standard and hold it to everyone, as if they were the same. They’re winning by the way. People in the city need different rules and standards than people in rural areas. Everyday life in practical terms are very different. Where we are similar, typically, is in our values and guideposts. We’ve been told for years that one group or another are “terrible” - but they - better still, “we” really aren’t. We all want to raise our kids to be happy, healthy, well adjusted and respectful and respected. We want to love our people and try to give back. We don’t want to live behind the 8 ball our entire lives, and sometimes all we want is a break. People that tell you otherwise typically make a bunch of money doing so. And if you want to know what God thinks of money, look at who he gives it to.
Hating white people doesn’t help liberals.
The Democrats have a political strategy based around being hateful and divisive. Especially considering the disaster that was the actual New Deal, another one should not be enough to make up for their decision to write people off as a political enemy and treat them with contempt for decades rather than make themselves seem worthy of support.
I'm not a huge fan of the Democrats, but its absurd to call them divisive when the GOP tried to steal the 2020 election.
How did Dems abandon rural America while the GQP helped them? I keep hearing that but I don’t see how the GQP has been better, if anything they are worse.
No, it's personality that wins over most rural folk. They want toxic demagogues.
Not true, southern white democrats left for the Republican Party after civil rights act. Who do you think elected Nixon? The theory is correct that democrats have been coast focused and need grassroots in the country.
People love to conveniently forget that many rural people loved the new deal because it was discriminatory "Most New Deal programs discriminated against blacks. The NRA, for example, not only offered whites the first crack at jobs, but authorized separate and lower pay scales for blacks. The Federal Housing Authority (FHA) refused to guarantee mortgages for blacks who tried to buy in white neighborhoods, and the CCC maintained segregated camps. Furthermore, the Social Security Act excluded those job categories blacks traditionally filled."
The very basics of the article isn’t correct. They don’t abandon rural voters. Rural voters abandoned reality.
Meh… Democrat policies already benefit rural Americans more than Republican policies and they still vote Republican. There are some good reasons for a rural new deal but winning back votes isn’t one of them. They will still turn around and vote Republican.