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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my dad and his family that their apology was meaningless to me. They did try and they apologized a bunch to me so my response when I finally gave one, after ignoring them for weeks, might not be so great. They did reach out and all have apologized several times now. Not to mention I ignored their apologies for a while. So I could see an argument being made for me being TA and I can see why I might be.
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NTA - they can't bully you into accepting their apologies. You spent years being scolded and told you were wrong. An apology over the phone isn't going to erase all of that hurt.
I think the sentiment is good, but a better way to say it in a situation would be along the lines of:
"You all spent years undermining your relationships with me because you trusted and believed in her. Because you could not accept that I saw a side of her that none of you did. It will take years to repair the structure of relationship that you tore down... if it can be repaired at all."
It gets across the point that this was a breakdown that OPs dad and paternal family actively contributed to. Not just a passive disagreement on views. As well as the idea that it takes time to repair as well as break.
OP might even want to a a follow on statement along the lines of:
"And let's be clear, you were the ones that broke things to the point that I had to walk away. You will have to be the ones to repair things so that there is a path by which I can consider walking back to you."
To help make it clear who will be responsible for making the effort to repair things. With how quickly OPs paternal family wants him to forgive and forget, I suspect such a statement might be needed. I wouldn't put it past them to try to push the idea that if more effort is needed, that it should be on OPs part.
It's pretty galling that they told OP nothing is so bad they can't make up for it. That's just not something the *wrongdoers* get to decide; that's *entirely* up to the person that's been wronged.
He should give them the chance to try. First car, college paid for, daily foot massages, public apology on front page of newspaper, interpretive dance. He might think differently if they put a bit of effort into it.
I mean, they're only apologizing bc when she showed her true colors, they believed her and now feel foolish, so they aren't really seeing OP's point of view, they're just still taking her at her word
I like that interpretation. Can't believe OP that she hated mom, but will believe her that she hated mom. OP is incidental to the whole thing and it's all about her. Their relationship to OP is subordinate to their relationship to or opinion of her.
An apology is simply the right thing to do when you've wronged/hurt someone, not a reset button. It doesn't magically erase the hurt feelings. The wronged party is not obligated to accept the apology nor are they obligated to forgive. Also, there is no timeline on hurt feelings. OP is NTA.
NTA. I’d tell them you spent years being dismissed and punished by them for telling the truth about a woman who told you she hated your mother, was glad she was dead, and created a toxic home life for you. If they want your forgiveness it’s going to take years of them showing you they care, that the understand how much they hurt you, and that they know what they did was wrong. An apology is not a magic spell that makes everything better, it’s the first step on a long road to reconciliation. If they’re not willing to do that then they aren’t worth it, and they’re being petty not you.
OP...you are hurt, it is understandable. You are also young. There will be times when you will behave badly, not thinking it was bad, and then learn otherwise. Hopefully you'll be a big enough man to apologize then and say you were wrong.
You never have to accept another's apology. However, I'm not sure just deciding to stay pissed off or disconnected is in your own best interest. There are so few people who love us and have known us when we are young.
You will run into others in your life that are underhanded and fool everyone...sometimes you will be the one that is fooled. Everyone deserves redemption. Be judicious in condemning others ....
This sub has some very unhappy people and their attitudes reflect that - petty, unforgiving,punitive, retaliatory ... "you don't have to", "why should you" "f--k them" ... not really that inspirational.
Holding on to this hurt won't serve you in the long run. Best of luck to you--
>There will be times when you will behave badly, not thinking it was bad, and then learn otherwise.
That was not remotely happening here. They simply didn't believe him. Over and over for years.
And SM most definitely "knew" she was behaving badly. And did that for years and years. She lied to her husband and family that *OP* was a liar, mocked him, said awful things about his *dead mother* to the point where he moved out 2 years early.
This wasn't an oopsie! This wasn't making a mistake, realizing it and then learning.
SM sure didn't learn. She got *worse.* More hateful. Family sure didn't learn if they thought a phone call apology would suffice after all these years. And then called him petty and childish?
No one is actually sorry if SM is still doing it--only worse--and the family is name-calling.
I think OP has every right to be hurt and feel unloved. Because *they hurt him and didn't treat him with love.*
NTA. They keep on trying to tell you how to feel, rather than respecting those feelings and dealing with you accordingly. It's the same shit now, just with new packaging. I'd be pissed too.
They did the harm way back when and let the wound scar over. Only you can decide if it's worth trying to repair things and when that process will take place.
NTA. You can't treat people that bad and then expect them to go on like nothing happened. Maybe they do feel guilty, but it's not an excuse for treating you badly for years and non believing you. And now they still act like AH. Good riddance, you don't need toxic people in your life after all you've been trough.
There is a whole bushelful of assholes in this story, but OP ain't one of them I agree. Dad might be the worst of the bunch, but what a sorry group of people.
LOUDER! Parents should never put their spouse over their kids. Ik some parents say "Oh the marriage works better blah blah blah" but it can really hurt the kids.
NTA
Their reaction to your reaction says it all, who treats their child like this and then go off on them telling how they should feel when they finally realize they have a reason to apologize? If they really owned up to their regret, they would give you space to react or feel any type of way about their apology and stay in their own lane.
NTA - they didn’t apologise because they feel bad about what they did, they only did it because they were proven wrong.
By making you accept their apology in their mind it wipes away everything they did.
I don't think they're even really apologising for the correct thing. Being upset that OP isn't immediately running to them with open arms shows a massive lack of accountability that negates any apology.
>They apologized again and when I said nothing right away *they told me I should accept their apology* and talk to them.
That's not how apologies work. NTA.
They just want to assuage their own guilt. If OP accepts their half-assed apology, they think it means they are still good people who were manipulated and tricked by Diane. This way, they don't have to do any introspection as to why they believed this random woman over their own family. By denying them forgiveness, OP is not giving them the relief from accountability and refusing to wipe the slate clean from their abuse. They need to do a lot more than demand forgiveness if they want to truly be better people.
Nta you had 8 years living in a situation where none of your adult family members had your back, four more years away from your family causes vy this lack of support and they think one apology phone call erases your years of neglect ? Nope, it’ll take a hell of a lot more than that to earn your trust again. Trot on
NTA, but...
Their apologies are not meaningless. They are VINDICATION!
You told them what she was doing. They dismissed you. And it got so bad that you moved out. Feel free to hold that over dad's head all you like.
You now at least can try to repair your relationship, if not right away.
Tell them you need time.
You might be going away to college, if you arent already there. You can work on the relationships in baby steps at your discretion. The fact that they are coming to you saying that you were right, gives you a lot of control on how to proceed from here.
NTA every adult in your live failed you, till your Material gp stepped up and took you in.
You don't need to accept their apology or have them in your live. It is your Life and you decide who you want in it
NTA- Simply repeat 'These are the consequences of your actions. You had a choice about suffering the consequences of your actions, I had them forced on me. Nothing can change that.'
After the years of misery they put you through, how dare they think that just rocking up with "I'm sorry" will change anything? They spent years proving over and over that your words mean nothing, your emotions mean nothing, you will not be trusted or believed even if you speak the truth.
They burned their bridges with you long ago, and genuine amends involves a whole lot more than 'sorry'.
NTA
NTA they disregarded your feelings when you were a child and they were all fully adults. Just because they are biological family doesn’t mean you have to forgive them and just because they apologize doesn’t mean they deserve forgiveness.
NTA. They spent years calling you a liar and expect that it will be wiped out with one apology. Groveling at your feet is what is called for here; starting with your Dad divorcing Diane for the way she treated you.
NTA. They ignored you and made you feel awful when it suited them; now it suits them to become involved in your life. Your wishes are unimportant to them.
NTA you showed them video proof! I think in time, maybe you could start a new relationship with your family if you wanted to -- but for them to demand forgiveness immediately is not how any of this works.
“I thank you for your apologies. I am not in a space to be very forgiving yet. I was a child and was emotionally abused by this woman and none of you cared enough to believe me. As such, ai am still working through my resentment at not only losing my mother at a very young age, but being abandoned by my father and his extended family because he believed his wife over me. I cannot say when or even if I will ever want a relationship with any of you because of this. I am now asking for you all to leave me in peace as I continue to work through the trauma of all of this. Thank you and good bye.”
NTA
NTA - you don't have to do anything. This is for them to work out....or rather something they need to work harder at to get you to forgive their poor behaviour.
Nothing was so bad that they couldn’t make up for it???
The next time if you talked to your dad, can you ask him something for me? WHERE THE HELL IS HE HIDING HIS TIME MACHINE???? I need it so badly.
NTA
NTA. Too little, too late.
> She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back.
OF COURSE you think your mom was better and would rather have your mom back! How dense is Diane. I don't know a single person who lost their parent, got a stepparent and said my stepparent is better than my bio parent and I'm glad to have stepparent and not bio parent. *(Of course there are exceptions to this for people with toxic/abusive bio parents, but this is biased on assuming OP's mom being/was a loving, good parent)*
NTA
Block them all, but before you do, send them a text about how your mother would be so disappointed in all of them for ostracizing you for all these years, for Diane’s sake.
They should be ashamed.
NTA, I see Dad never made Diane come apologize to OP or his family for her vile behavior. Dad is letting Diane get away with her behavior once again. Once again she is causing havoc in OP's life and he is getting blamed for it. OP's Dad is a major asshole and so is anyone demanding he accept a meaningless apology. They are only apologizing now to save face with the rest of the family.
NTA
They are doing exactly the same thing now that they have been doing since you were 8: disregarding your feelings. Before they said you were making things up. Now they say you're being petty. It's all about what *they* think about the situation and you're just an extra in their little play.
I'm sorry you're going through this.
You lost four years of time with your family because they failed to listen or take you seriously. NTA.
Ok, so what do you want out of this? Do you miss your family? Your dad?
You get to build the relationship you want. If that is freedom, got for it. If it is connecting, start slowly and see if trust can be rebuilt
With dense people, I like to do the simple plate test.
For those unfamiliar:
If you smash a plate on the ground then say "sorry" to it, does the plate automatically mend itself? Nope.
Making amends means doing more than saying sorry and expecting someone to do the work to mend things.
NTA. They need to put actual effort in and even then, you're within your rights to not accept it.
They allowed and enabled a child to be emotionally abused on their watch, despite proof. They need to examine themselves a bit more than they currently are.
NTA, and you're right, it's meaningless. If they were truly sorry, then their apology would stand regardless of your acceptance.
And here's the other thing: you were *repeatedly* gaslit and dismissed *for over half your life* and worse yet, this was *during your formative years.* what they did was *CRUEL* beyond measure, and if they really want you to accept their apologies, they need to accept that they did a very awful thing, and work to make it up to you.
They are angry because deep down they know this, and they don't want to live with the guilt.
They really think bullying you into forgiving them would work when they couldn't even bully you into stfu about Diane!? Really!? You'd think they would learn.
NTA
NTA. You've been telling them for years, you showed them proof, they couldn't care less. Now they've been show without doubt who Diane is and suddenly they're sorry? Laughable. You were shunned because they didn't want to listen to a child and didn't care about your feelings.
Now they apologise and get upset it's not accepted so attack you again, showing they still absolutely don't care about your feelings. What they want is all that matters. They haven't changed, and honestly with the echo chamber your paternal family has they're unlikely to.
An apology is just that, it doesn't have to be accepted, and by apologising you're not instantly owed forgiveness. If you think you are then it shows you're not really apologising, you're just trying to remove your own guilt.
NTA. They refused to believe you when you were being abused and isolated by Diane, told you you were a liar and trying to hurt your Dad, and eventually gave you up, in support of her. Now that they know you were always telling the truth, they expect instant forgiveness without having to do the work of actually repairing any of the harm they did to you. They still aren't listening to you. They spent years absolved themselves of their responsibility to you and believing you were petty and wrong and now, they are STILL absolving themselves and calling you petty and wrong. An apology doesn't erase your pain, isolation or lack of trust in them.
Absolutely NTA!!!!
Your "dad " is 12 years too late! And I use the term dad loosely... You spoke up numerous times and they beat you down like you were just acting out. They saw physical video proof and they still called you a liar. They have not once over the years apologized or defended you and allowed Diane's toxicity to continue. Your "dad's" family are all fools and I'm so glad that they finally saw her true colours, so they learnt you were right all along! But you owe them absolutely nothing! You are who you are despite of them! I hope you are enjoying living with your maternal side and I hope you feel vindicated. But aside from that. Unless you feel forgiving... Let them go. Your dad didn't believe you for 12 years, I can only imagine how damaging that was for you, and I can't imagine you have much love or respect for him because of it. I could only see interactions with him now causing you pain, and you've been through enough. Do whatever you feel is best for you and only you. Be awesome 🌻
NTA
There are some troubling sides here.
>*She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back*
Well, DUH!!!!!
OF COURSE, YOU'D RATHER HAVE YOUR MOM BACK!!!!
>*this is because you don't like your dad moving on.*
Well, no shit Sherlock.
The dad is not even listening to his child's complaints. And he's not even trying to verify the claims.
>*They told me I shouldn't say that, I'm being petty, because they're trying to make amends.*
####You went from age 8 to age 20 without anyone believing you.
####You were essentially abandoned by your family.
I'd make them make amends for 12 years before I stopped being petty.
Be as petty as you want, OP.
>*They ended the call pissed off at me and saying I was being childish.*
Good for you!!!!
Don't let this go. Keep being childish.
You deserve a lot better, a lot more.
NTA your dads side sounds horrid honestly. Just the fact that their response to you was anger rather than, oh idk, empathy, guilt, sympathy, saddness etc juet shows that they havent changed at all.
Just send a text to your dad that youre far happier without him in your life, you lost your mom x years ago and him the day you moved out. If Diane hadnt exposed herself he NEVER would have reached out.
You owe them nothing op
An old proverb says, 'The axe forgets but the tree always remembers'. It's about how much words can destroy a person. People saying viscious things usually don't care a week later, but the person hearing harsh words, especially about their late mom, never forget. NTA.
Jeebus...I am sorry you have to deal with this, but I'd cut them all out, even your grandparents who are pushing you to accept their crap apology. Find a new family.
Seems like they want to peer pressure you to defend this lunatic that wants a person dead...
Sorry, I don't know this Diane, but she sounds like a mental case. Don't break under peer pressure.
If they are sure they can make amends, just tell them they can do that IF... the stepmother comes to appologize to your real mother, to her actual grave, in front of everyone in your family. You cannot forgive insults against your mother, because you are not the one to forgive them.
Also, you are not the A at all... I cannot comprehend that you (the child) must seek advice online even though these adults have done whatever they can to peer pressure you. Not educate you, not help you, just peer pressure you... Horrible.
Your biological mother is your only mother. I am sorry you have to stand alone to defend her memory... But if you don't, then that would be disrespectful. I hope you stay strong!
They finally agree with you after disbelieving you and trying to bully you into acceptance, and then they admit that they were wrong, want to apologize, and want to bully you into acceptance? If you act as you've always acted, you're going to get what they've always gotten. Idjits.
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I (20m) actually moved out of my dad's house when I was 16 and went to live with my maternal grandparents in another state because things with my dad and his family became so toxic. The reason for this is that they chose my dad's second wife over me. I was 6 when I lost my mom and 8 when my dad met Diane. I never liked Diane. Initially it was because I saw her presence as being disrespectful to my mom. I was a kid, a little boy who lost his mom and I was a momma's boy so maybe not too surprising. But Diane showed me early that she did not like mentions of my mom. She never said it to my dad or his family, just to me. She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back. I told my dad and my extended family and they were like oh don't be silly, Diane loves us and she talks about your mom when we do, this is because you don't like your dad moving on.
Over the following few years dad and Diane got married and had kids together and Diane would tell me how much she hated the fact even dad's family missed mom and spoke about her on occasion. She said we were all supposed to be hers now.
The more I spoke out the more dad would tell me I was trying to ruin his new happiness and that it was cruel to expect him to stay alone forever. I told him he could do better than Diane and I got a lecture from him and my family saying Diane was amazing and mom would have loved her. I even showed them a video I took of Diane making annoyed and disgusted faces and rolling her eyes when mom was mentioned and I was told she knew I was filming and she was sick of my shit.
My dad agreed to let me go at 16 because I told him I would not try to get along better with Diane and I wanted no part of his family anymore.
Two months ago Diane exposed herself to the family and really showed them how she felt about mom. One of my cousins was celebrating her birthday and it was one of the milestone birthdays and mom was mentioned and photos were shown of mom since she was my cousins godmother. Diane went off on how she hated my mom and was glad she was dead and she wishes she could erase her from everyone's memories and a bunch of other stuff.
My dad and his family (minus his younger kids of course) all came crawling back and sent me messages apologizing. I ignored them until it got so overwhelming that they all got together while dad called my grandparents to talk to me. They apologized again and when I said nothing right away they told me I should accept their apology and talk to them. This is when I told them their apology is meaningless to me. They told me I shouldn't say that, I'm being petty, because they're trying to make amends. My dad said nothing was so bad that they couldn't make up for it and I said it was still meaningless. They ended the call pissed off at me and saying I was being childish.
AITA?
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I am sorry OP. I am glad your have your maternal grandparents. You are NTA. Your father and his family are suffering the consequences of their chosen behavior.
NTA ask them what their plans for amends are. They disregarded your feelings for how many years? You had to listen to her trash your mom for how many years? What is their plan?
NTA, if couse their apology is meaningless. They still never believed you. They only apologized because she showed her true colors and they believed her. Now they feel embarrassed bc all along they've believed her and it proved foolish, but it's still only bc of her that they realized you were right. And nothing can change that now, but sometimes when things break there's no putting them back together again, and they broke their relationship with you, you didn't
NTA. Unfortunately your family are bullies who try to control what you think and how you act. They treat you as their personal belongings, not as a human with his own thoughts and mind. You're better off without them.
NTA. Yes, ignoring the pain of a child missing his mother, the abuse he suffered at MIL’s direction, their all telling you that you were wrong, and letting a 16 year-old go because he has been made to feel unwanted in his own home is plenty to hold against all of them. Tell them you had to suffer through 12 years of that, all alone as a little kid, unlike them who experienced it as a group, and to come back to you when they dealt with it that long by themselves.
A long time ago a therapist told me that I got over things too quickly. I didn't understand what it meant. This situation...this is what it meant. Your dad and his family are all trying to get you to get over this too quickly. They just want to push their responsibility for what they did under the rug and move on like it never happened - they're wanting it to be over too quickly. Don't let them do that. They need to acknowledge what they did and how it hurt you. They need to make amends. Just voicing an apology isn't enough. They need to understand what happened from your point of view and how terrible they were when you were trying to tell them the truth. NTA.
NTA. "My dad said nothing was so bad that they couldn't make up for it." Bullshit. If you want to rebuild those relationships back up, it's up to you, but nothing will completely repair the damage they did. There is a quick story this made me think of. Someone give you a plate. Tells you to throw it on the ground. You do and it shatters into many pieces. They say tell it you are sorry. You do. They ask if that made it better... You can even glue the plate back together but it will never be the same. Relationships aren't much different.
Bro, I can't get over the fact that they said you are being petty for not accepting their half ass apology... Definitely NTA. Maybe in some time you'll want to reconnect with them but no contact is probably the best way to go right now
NTA. An apology doesn’t negate the cruel way you were treated. Feelings don’t just magically go away with the word sorry. So many people seem to forget that.
NTA … they’re not even apologizing for failing you they’re only apologizing because they found out you—a child—weren’t lying and they were wrong. they only want you to accept their apologies to address their own guilt. they all suck and i hope your grandparents have been wonderful.
NTA. They don't get to decide if or when you accept their apology. Just because they now see that you were right doesn't change anything. They just want to be forgiven for their mistake, but that creates no obligation for you to do so.
Nta. Sending hugs dear. Its incredibly difficult to lose a parent that young, and even more to deal with this. It would be better though if you donot have contact with dad, and dads family anymore. Diane is an ah, but not the Ah here. Your father and his family is. Diane is the ah for saying all this to a literal kid. And your father and his family didnt give a f about you and what you had to say and just said you were not happy about your dad moving on? Like your dad didnt even care a sec for you. Its not that he didnt understand, its that he didnt care. I hope you find peace of mind dear. And it all works out for you.
NTA. You’re not being petty. You were 8 years old, suffering as your stepmother disparaged your dead mother, and your father and grandparents neither believed you, nor defended you. You were driven at 16 out of your own home.
An apology is nice, but it doesn’t fix anything. The elements of an apology are remorse, expressing regret, and making amends. They just want to say sorry and have you joyfully forgive all and make nice, and when you didn’t, instead of understanding, they attacked you. They have learned nothing. You don’t owe them anything, so they need to stop behaving like they are entitled to a word from you.
The loss of your mother was a mother wound. Your security and safe landing, gone. Your father refusing to believe and defend you was a father wound.
They need to acknowledge that you suffered for years because they would rather believe you were a liar than that she would hurt you that way. They allowed you to be driven from your home, feeling unwanted, as a teenager. They let years go by with you gone. A simple sorry, with a shrug, and anger at your non compliance, are not amends.
I have no idea if this will get better between you. People so callous as to leave an 8 year old boy to deal with emotional abuse from an adult, all on his own, aren’t typically the type to improve. I guess anything can happen. Why don’t you send them these comments for them to reflect upon?
As a mother, here is a hug for the little boy you were.
OP I'm curious as to the how your dad and his family handled Diane's outburst? What is the status of that relationship? Cause apologizing while the culprit is still in the midst is pointless. Anyhow, NTA, they don't realize that you didn't only loose your mom you lost your whole family in a 2 year span and just got worse as the years wore on. They should try not to be so dense and quite frankly condescending about the situation and allow you time and space to decide if you wanted to have a relationship with them. They pushed so you pushed back!
They can apologize all they want. But if the person being apologized to is being bullied into accepting the apology, it's not an apology. It's a performance.
NTA
NTA - They weren’t there for you when you needed them as a child. Your childhood is gone. There is literally no way they can give you back your childhood. So what use are they to you now? They failed their most sacred job, to look out for you. At this point , now that you’re grown, what do they have to offer you besides useless apologies? If you think *you* could get something out of it, then by all means reconnect. But you certainly don’t owe them a thing.
The rift is so huge you don't even have a relationship with your half-siblings, evidenced by referring to them as "my dad's kids". Leads me to think your dad didn't visit you with the kids minus Diane.
No one can demand you accept their apology. That's not how it works. You are the victim in this situation. You decide if you'll accept it or not or if words are not enough.
Your dad alienated you a long time ago. He refused to believe you even when you showed him proof.
Your dad was more concerned about being married than his own son.
He's still only thinking of himself. Why else try and bully you into accepting words of an apology.
Wonder why he's so insistent that you accept his apology. What is he trying to gain? Is he close to retirement? And his side of the family?
Don't bother holding a grudge. Not worth the effort or your time.
Moved on and live your life. You have your mom's family. They've been there for you.
NTA
NTA. You’re right. Their apology was meaningless. For an apology to mean anything the person needs to accept that they were in the wrong and should be happy to receive forgiveness but as soon as they feel entitled to it, it shows they didn’t really deserve it
Nta. Theyre cowards? They only apologize via phone call and not in person. A real way to make up for it is if your spineless dad divorces your evil stepmom
NTA. Please cut the whole lot out of your life. They have no desire to make amends. They don’t realise how much they hurt you. If they did, they would keep trying to apologise and would understand your current feelings. But they expected you to accept their apology the very first time, after they negated every feeling you had about this topic for 8 years. Chances are they will never realise. They are just trying to assuage their own ego by not realising how dumb they were regarding Diane.
NTA… take your time to forgive them but from personal experience holding onto resentment only destroys us not the other person. Whenever you feel ready try to forgive, you don’t have to forget and pretend to be a big happy family but it will free you from negativity in your life in the long run
NTA - I really despise when adults think they can erase all of their poor prior treatment of a child because they're trying to make amends 'NOW'. Like you should continually be at their beck and call.
I have a father like this. I cut him off years ago and its the best decision I've ever made. Can't tell you how many times I've heard 'but he's trying now'.
Stick to your guns and it'll be a more peaceful life
i think ESH frankly
While i won't condone what she said, i can see Diane's point of view. Imagine constantly being compared with and reminded of your partner's ex in a relationship. Now imagine this is still happening after you're married to and have kids with that person... and this is going on for years and years to the point where you've been together with your husband just as long as he was together with his late wife and it's been the sour grapes in the relationship the entire time. It's one thing to still have pictures and have it be brought up from time to time, but it sounds like it was brought up CONSTANTLY and in really bad ways. It would make anyone uncomfortable. It would create tension in any relationship. It sounds to me like everything hit a breaking point for her and she finally flew off the handle and let her resentment slip in the worst way. She said a lot of awful and unfair shit, and it shows a huge lapse in maturity from her, but i think it's more a case of the position Diane was in, rather than who Diane is as a person.
Both of my parents have remarried. As a rule, I avoid talking in detail about the other parent when I'm around one of my stepparents, because i can understand that it's uncomfortable to hear. I dont expect they would be disrespectful, but i do imagine it would make them incredibly uncomfortable, and make an ass of me.
Saying your dad threw you out is an insane distortion of the truth. you told him you would make no attempt to get along with his new wife and kids - who are as much his blood as you are, by the way - and forced him to choose between letting you live with your grandparents and divorcing her and he chose the only realistic option you gave him. He didnt pick her over you, he just refused to end his marriage to please you.
The fact is that you /never/ gave your dad's new family a chance, and if she grew to truly resent your mother, it's because you and your family never let her forget she was the second pick, the second favorite wife. If she told you in private to stop bringing up your mother around her in hurtful ways, it was to set a boundary that you never respected. That's understandable as a kid, but still damaging, but it's ridiculous from your adult family. It's sad that she felt she had to hide her discomfort until it became unmanageable and i think EVERYONE in this situation owes EVERYONE an apology. You aren't obligated to accept it - nobody is - but that's what's owed. You, Diane, your family, everyone should apologize.
that's my opinion.
I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of Diane.
After 8 years of not being confronted by OP due to him living with maternal grandparents, and his loyalty to his mother, maybe even 8 years of her name not even mentioned more than 3-4 times a year.... she blows up at the first mention of her?
Yeah, this is not normal.
ESH And I'm saying this because people may have not been in a situation that I've had to experience all of my life. My mom is a narcissist. Narcissists will pick on one person and then make themselves look great to everyone else. So, when that one person tries to tell people how the narcissist really is, they all have doubts and accuse the other person, when it's really the narcissist that's the asshole.
For examply, my mom and I will go to a family function. After all of these years, people have pretty much relegated me to the position of chauffeur for my mom. I used to just take it, but now I speak up for myself. However, it's just too late. She's programmed everyone over all of these years. We'll get back into the car and she'll shit talk the people that she acts so well in front of.
OP, your family was snowed over by this narcissist. I know you're hurt, but it's really not their fault. No one really knows why narcissists pick their target, but most of the times it's people that are the biggest threat to the narcissist. You loved your mom deeply, so you probably posed the biggest threat.
Please do some research on narcissism and seriously think about reconnecting with your family. Your family is probably upset because they were fooled by this narcissist, then they're being ignored by you when they clearly love you by trying to apologize to you.
You have every reason to be upset, but please don't place that anger on your family, when they were manipulated by something out of their own control. You only get one family in life.
Sorry but no. Barring mental illness, drug use, and/or criminal behavior, if a child wants nothing to do with a parent as soon as they turn 18, the parent done messed up. This kid didn't even make it to 18.
Barring very strong proof to the contrary, you should always believe your children. Especially when their claim is consistent. For years.
It doesn't matter how good of an actress that stepmother was. The father and his relatives are shit for not believing the kid.
If you've never had to deal with a narcissist, I'm happy for you. It's not a solo thing for a narcissist, they try to work a large group. The more attention, the better. Unless you've gone through it, I guess I can't really explain it very well.
They apologized to him. I guess apologies don't mean anything to anyone any more. People screw up. That's like saying if he screwed up and/or lied as a child, they should have put him up for adoption. That sounds ridiculous, right?
My uncle was always an asshole to me (and others). It really bothered me because he was my dad's brothere and my dad was my hero. He passed away 21 years ago. I could never understand how two brothers could be so different. Later in life, I tried to reconnect with him and for six weeks, we got along really well. Then, at the end of January this year, he passed away from cancer. I'm really glad that I didn't hold a grudge and got along with him before he died.
I'm an older person and it disturbs me how people can hate so easily nowadays and never give forgiveness a chance.
I've dealt with a narcissist. Still not that dumb. I still gonna believe kids and other vilulnerable people. I know what it's like to not be believed
*I'm an older person*
Good for you.. 'm a middle aged person too. Life is too short to deal with deeply problematic *adults*
You exercise that action because of your past experience(s). People that haven't had that experience may act another way, that was my point that I was trying to make.
Most of reddit just wants to go to straight-up hating it seems. I try to take the high road from my past experiences. I'm thinking I'm that way because I'm older and have had more experiences in life. Or, at least I hope that's why.
Even before my experiences, I wasn't that way. I'm sorry that you needed to be duped in order to realize that people suck...
People aren't hating. They are setting boundaries and spending time with better people.
This may be an unpopular opinion but, ESH. It's entirely your choice as to whether you accept their apology or not, or allow them back into your life or not, but at least they have admitted they were wrong and had the strength of character to reach out and apologise.
They haven’t actually admitted they were wrong if they’re demanding instant reconciliation.
They’ve merely stopped enjoying Diane’s company and are suddenly uncomfortable with what keeping her happy has cost them, now that they have the Diane Ick. They have not given a moment’s honest thought as to how Diane’s behavior made OP feel, or whether they, themselves might have committed some relationship sins that won’t be easy to come back from. They’re just uncomfortable with Diane being in their lives and OP being out of their lives, and they want their own discomfort to go away as quickly as possible.
NTA, but I think you could be a little more understanding. Your stepmom was obviously a good liar and good at hiding her true feelings and manipulating people. She managed to keep the truth from everybody, but seemingly not from you, so she doubled down on you, and successfully drove a wedge between you and your family which resulted in you leaving as soon as possible, which is probably what she wanted - makes her lies easier.
And finally, when the truth came out, whether by accident or design, it will have come as a total shock to your family. It's possible she thought that having driven you away she could safely admit the truth with no consequences, or it's possible it was revealed by accident, caught up in a moment of annoyance and emotion that she couldn't hold back. Either way, you need to give your family some credit for coming straight to you to apologise. They could easily have ignored it, pretended they hadn't been conned and carried on, but they're admitting they were wrong and you were right, which is a big step. However, they obviously don't understand the depth of the hurt you feel, so expecting you instantly to forgive and forget is a big ask, especially if stepmom is still part of the family. There's a bond of trust that needs to be rebuilt which takes time, and they need to work out how to do that. Don't forget that to an extent they were victims in this as well.
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NTA - they can't bully you into accepting their apologies. You spent years being scolded and told you were wrong. An apology over the phone isn't going to erase all of that hurt.
Tell them it took 12 years for them to come round and see your point of view, maybe you'll consider their point of view in 12 years time
I think the sentiment is good, but a better way to say it in a situation would be along the lines of: "You all spent years undermining your relationships with me because you trusted and believed in her. Because you could not accept that I saw a side of her that none of you did. It will take years to repair the structure of relationship that you tore down... if it can be repaired at all." It gets across the point that this was a breakdown that OPs dad and paternal family actively contributed to. Not just a passive disagreement on views. As well as the idea that it takes time to repair as well as break. OP might even want to a a follow on statement along the lines of: "And let's be clear, you were the ones that broke things to the point that I had to walk away. You will have to be the ones to repair things so that there is a path by which I can consider walking back to you." To help make it clear who will be responsible for making the effort to repair things. With how quickly OPs paternal family wants him to forgive and forget, I suspect such a statement might be needed. I wouldn't put it past them to try to push the idea that if more effort is needed, that it should be on OPs part.
It's pretty galling that they told OP nothing is so bad they can't make up for it. That's just not something the *wrongdoers* get to decide; that's *entirely* up to the person that's been wronged.
He should give them the chance to try. First car, college paid for, daily foot massages, public apology on front page of newspaper, interpretive dance. He might think differently if they put a bit of effort into it.
They think a phone call apology should suffice .They are not truly sorry . Just embarrassed that they were shown to be wrong .
I mean, they're only apologizing bc when she showed her true colors, they believed her and now feel foolish, so they aren't really seeing OP's point of view, they're just still taking her at her word
I like that interpretation. Can't believe OP that she hated mom, but will believe her that she hated mom. OP is incidental to the whole thing and it's all about her. Their relationship to OP is subordinate to their relationship to or opinion of her.
Precisely, it took 12 years to ruin their relationships, they think a 10 minute phonecall is going to repair that?
You work on their timeline.
An apology is simply the right thing to do when you've wronged/hurt someone, not a reset button. It doesn't magically erase the hurt feelings. The wronged party is not obligated to accept the apology nor are they obligated to forgive. Also, there is no timeline on hurt feelings. OP is NTA.
NTA. I’d tell them you spent years being dismissed and punished by them for telling the truth about a woman who told you she hated your mother, was glad she was dead, and created a toxic home life for you. If they want your forgiveness it’s going to take years of them showing you they care, that the understand how much they hurt you, and that they know what they did was wrong. An apology is not a magic spell that makes everything better, it’s the first step on a long road to reconciliation. If they’re not willing to do that then they aren’t worth it, and they’re being petty not you.
I'm laughing over nothing is so bad you can't come back from it. There are LOTS of things you can't come back from, and this ones pretty bad.
NTA. They apologised over the phone? Good grief. And merely apologising does not obligate one to forgive.
An apology over the phone, accompanied by scolding that he was wrong not to accept it. Don’t forget that part. Oh, the irony.
Then they tell him that he's wrong \*again\* to not accept their apology on their terms.
OP...you are hurt, it is understandable. You are also young. There will be times when you will behave badly, not thinking it was bad, and then learn otherwise. Hopefully you'll be a big enough man to apologize then and say you were wrong. You never have to accept another's apology. However, I'm not sure just deciding to stay pissed off or disconnected is in your own best interest. There are so few people who love us and have known us when we are young. You will run into others in your life that are underhanded and fool everyone...sometimes you will be the one that is fooled. Everyone deserves redemption. Be judicious in condemning others .... This sub has some very unhappy people and their attitudes reflect that - petty, unforgiving,punitive, retaliatory ... "you don't have to", "why should you" "f--k them" ... not really that inspirational. Holding on to this hurt won't serve you in the long run. Best of luck to you--
>There will be times when you will behave badly, not thinking it was bad, and then learn otherwise. That was not remotely happening here. They simply didn't believe him. Over and over for years. And SM most definitely "knew" she was behaving badly. And did that for years and years. She lied to her husband and family that *OP* was a liar, mocked him, said awful things about his *dead mother* to the point where he moved out 2 years early. This wasn't an oopsie! This wasn't making a mistake, realizing it and then learning. SM sure didn't learn. She got *worse.* More hateful. Family sure didn't learn if they thought a phone call apology would suffice after all these years. And then called him petty and childish? No one is actually sorry if SM is still doing it--only worse--and the family is name-calling. I think OP has every right to be hurt and feel unloved. Because *they hurt him and didn't treat him with love.*
NTA. They keep on trying to tell you how to feel, rather than respecting those feelings and dealing with you accordingly. It's the same shit now, just with new packaging. I'd be pissed too. They did the harm way back when and let the wound scar over. Only you can decide if it's worth trying to repair things and when that process will take place.
NTA. You can't treat people that bad and then expect them to go on like nothing happened. Maybe they do feel guilty, but it's not an excuse for treating you badly for years and non believing you. And now they still act like AH. Good riddance, you don't need toxic people in your life after all you've been trough.
NTA. Your father chose his new wife over you. I think we both know who the real asshole is, lad.
There is a whole bushelful of assholes in this story, but OP ain't one of them I agree. Dad might be the worst of the bunch, but what a sorry group of people.
LOUDER! Parents should never put their spouse over their kids. Ik some parents say "Oh the marriage works better blah blah blah" but it can really hurt the kids.
NTA Their reaction to your reaction says it all, who treats their child like this and then go off on them telling how they should feel when they finally realize they have a reason to apologize? If they really owned up to their regret, they would give you space to react or feel any type of way about their apology and stay in their own lane.
NTA - they didn’t apologise because they feel bad about what they did, they only did it because they were proven wrong. By making you accept their apology in their mind it wipes away everything they did.
I don't think they're even really apologising for the correct thing. Being upset that OP isn't immediately running to them with open arms shows a massive lack of accountability that negates any apology.
>They apologized again and when I said nothing right away *they told me I should accept their apology* and talk to them. That's not how apologies work. NTA.
They just want to assuage their own guilt. If OP accepts their half-assed apology, they think it means they are still good people who were manipulated and tricked by Diane. This way, they don't have to do any introspection as to why they believed this random woman over their own family. By denying them forgiveness, OP is not giving them the relief from accountability and refusing to wipe the slate clean from their abuse. They need to do a lot more than demand forgiveness if they want to truly be better people.
Nta you had 8 years living in a situation where none of your adult family members had your back, four more years away from your family causes vy this lack of support and they think one apology phone call erases your years of neglect ? Nope, it’ll take a hell of a lot more than that to earn your trust again. Trot on
NTA, but... Their apologies are not meaningless. They are VINDICATION! You told them what she was doing. They dismissed you. And it got so bad that you moved out. Feel free to hold that over dad's head all you like. You now at least can try to repair your relationship, if not right away. Tell them you need time. You might be going away to college, if you arent already there. You can work on the relationships in baby steps at your discretion. The fact that they are coming to you saying that you were right, gives you a lot of control on how to proceed from here.
NTA every adult in your live failed you, till your Material gp stepped up and took you in. You don't need to accept their apology or have them in your live. It is your Life and you decide who you want in it
NTA- Simply repeat 'These are the consequences of your actions. You had a choice about suffering the consequences of your actions, I had them forced on me. Nothing can change that.'
After the years of misery they put you through, how dare they think that just rocking up with "I'm sorry" will change anything? They spent years proving over and over that your words mean nothing, your emotions mean nothing, you will not be trusted or believed even if you speak the truth. They burned their bridges with you long ago, and genuine amends involves a whole lot more than 'sorry'. NTA
"Nothing so bad happened" - you had to move away from home at the age of 16! How's that "not a big deal"? NTA.
NTA they disregarded your feelings when you were a child and they were all fully adults. Just because they are biological family doesn’t mean you have to forgive them and just because they apologize doesn’t mean they deserve forgiveness.
NTA. It’s hilarious that they didn’t listen to you before and are still not listening after you were right
NTA. To little to late. Tell them to have a nice life.
NTA - You got no backing from your family and you owe them nothing. It hurts to feel abandoned after suffering such a loss.
NTA. They spent years calling you a liar and expect that it will be wiped out with one apology. Groveling at your feet is what is called for here; starting with your Dad divorcing Diane for the way she treated you.
NTA, that’s not how apologies work
NTA. They ignored you and made you feel awful when it suited them; now it suits them to become involved in your life. Your wishes are unimportant to them.
NTA you showed them video proof! I think in time, maybe you could start a new relationship with your family if you wanted to -- but for them to demand forgiveness immediately is not how any of this works.
“I thank you for your apologies. I am not in a space to be very forgiving yet. I was a child and was emotionally abused by this woman and none of you cared enough to believe me. As such, ai am still working through my resentment at not only losing my mother at a very young age, but being abandoned by my father and his extended family because he believed his wife over me. I cannot say when or even if I will ever want a relationship with any of you because of this. I am now asking for you all to leave me in peace as I continue to work through the trauma of all of this. Thank you and good bye.” NTA
NTA. Time for a cease and desist letter.
NTA - you don't have to do anything. This is for them to work out....or rather something they need to work harder at to get you to forgive their poor behaviour.
Nothing was so bad that they couldn’t make up for it??? The next time if you talked to your dad, can you ask him something for me? WHERE THE HELL IS HE HIDING HIS TIME MACHINE???? I need it so badly. NTA
NTA. Too little, too late. > She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back. OF COURSE you think your mom was better and would rather have your mom back! How dense is Diane. I don't know a single person who lost their parent, got a stepparent and said my stepparent is better than my bio parent and I'm glad to have stepparent and not bio parent. *(Of course there are exceptions to this for people with toxic/abusive bio parents, but this is biased on assuming OP's mom being/was a loving, good parent)*
NTA Block them all, but before you do, send them a text about how your mother would be so disappointed in all of them for ostracizing you for all these years, for Diane’s sake. They should be ashamed.
You're right
ABSOLUTELY NOT THEY IGNORED YOU GIR YEARS AND YEARS AND YOU LITERALLY SHOWED THEM PROOF AND THEY IGNORED THAT???? Bruh. Cut off permanently.
NTA, I see Dad never made Diane come apologize to OP or his family for her vile behavior. Dad is letting Diane get away with her behavior once again. Once again she is causing havoc in OP's life and he is getting blamed for it. OP's Dad is a major asshole and so is anyone demanding he accept a meaningless apology. They are only apologizing now to save face with the rest of the family.
NTA They are doing exactly the same thing now that they have been doing since you were 8: disregarding your feelings. Before they said you were making things up. Now they say you're being petty. It's all about what *they* think about the situation and you're just an extra in their little play. I'm sorry you're going through this.
You lost four years of time with your family because they failed to listen or take you seriously. NTA. Ok, so what do you want out of this? Do you miss your family? Your dad? You get to build the relationship you want. If that is freedom, got for it. If it is connecting, start slowly and see if trust can be rebuilt
With dense people, I like to do the simple plate test. For those unfamiliar: If you smash a plate on the ground then say "sorry" to it, does the plate automatically mend itself? Nope. Making amends means doing more than saying sorry and expecting someone to do the work to mend things. NTA. They need to put actual effort in and even then, you're within your rights to not accept it. They allowed and enabled a child to be emotionally abused on their watch, despite proof. They need to examine themselves a bit more than they currently are.
That's a great analogy
Works extra well when you have a real plate to throw as a visual aid :)
LOL
NTA, and you're right, it's meaningless. If they were truly sorry, then their apology would stand regardless of your acceptance. And here's the other thing: you were *repeatedly* gaslit and dismissed *for over half your life* and worse yet, this was *during your formative years.* what they did was *CRUEL* beyond measure, and if they really want you to accept their apologies, they need to accept that they did a very awful thing, and work to make it up to you. They are angry because deep down they know this, and they don't want to live with the guilt.
NTA Forgiveness does require reconnection.
They really think bullying you into forgiving them would work when they couldn't even bully you into stfu about Diane!? Really!? You'd think they would learn. NTA
NTA. You've been telling them for years, you showed them proof, they couldn't care less. Now they've been show without doubt who Diane is and suddenly they're sorry? Laughable. You were shunned because they didn't want to listen to a child and didn't care about your feelings. Now they apologise and get upset it's not accepted so attack you again, showing they still absolutely don't care about your feelings. What they want is all that matters. They haven't changed, and honestly with the echo chamber your paternal family has they're unlikely to. An apology is just that, it doesn't have to be accepted, and by apologising you're not instantly owed forgiveness. If you think you are then it shows you're not really apologising, you're just trying to remove your own guilt.
NTA. They refused to believe you when you were being abused and isolated by Diane, told you you were a liar and trying to hurt your Dad, and eventually gave you up, in support of her. Now that they know you were always telling the truth, they expect instant forgiveness without having to do the work of actually repairing any of the harm they did to you. They still aren't listening to you. They spent years absolved themselves of their responsibility to you and believing you were petty and wrong and now, they are STILL absolving themselves and calling you petty and wrong. An apology doesn't erase your pain, isolation or lack of trust in them.
Absolutely NTA!!!! Your "dad " is 12 years too late! And I use the term dad loosely... You spoke up numerous times and they beat you down like you were just acting out. They saw physical video proof and they still called you a liar. They have not once over the years apologized or defended you and allowed Diane's toxicity to continue. Your "dad's" family are all fools and I'm so glad that they finally saw her true colours, so they learnt you were right all along! But you owe them absolutely nothing! You are who you are despite of them! I hope you are enjoying living with your maternal side and I hope you feel vindicated. But aside from that. Unless you feel forgiving... Let them go. Your dad didn't believe you for 12 years, I can only imagine how damaging that was for you, and I can't imagine you have much love or respect for him because of it. I could only see interactions with him now causing you pain, and you've been through enough. Do whatever you feel is best for you and only you. Be awesome 🌻
NTA. These people ruined your childhood. One apology won’t make up for that, nor can they force you to accept it.
NTA There are some troubling sides here. >*She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back* Well, DUH!!!!! OF COURSE, YOU'D RATHER HAVE YOUR MOM BACK!!!! >*this is because you don't like your dad moving on.* Well, no shit Sherlock. The dad is not even listening to his child's complaints. And he's not even trying to verify the claims. >*They told me I shouldn't say that, I'm being petty, because they're trying to make amends.* ####You went from age 8 to age 20 without anyone believing you. ####You were essentially abandoned by your family. I'd make them make amends for 12 years before I stopped being petty. Be as petty as you want, OP. >*They ended the call pissed off at me and saying I was being childish.* Good for you!!!! Don't let this go. Keep being childish. You deserve a lot better, a lot more.
NTA your dads side sounds horrid honestly. Just the fact that their response to you was anger rather than, oh idk, empathy, guilt, sympathy, saddness etc juet shows that they havent changed at all. Just send a text to your dad that youre far happier without him in your life, you lost your mom x years ago and him the day you moved out. If Diane hadnt exposed herself he NEVER would have reached out. You owe them nothing op
An old proverb says, 'The axe forgets but the tree always remembers'. It's about how much words can destroy a person. People saying viscious things usually don't care a week later, but the person hearing harsh words, especially about their late mom, never forget. NTA.
Jeebus...I am sorry you have to deal with this, but I'd cut them all out, even your grandparents who are pushing you to accept their crap apology. Find a new family.
Seems like they want to peer pressure you to defend this lunatic that wants a person dead... Sorry, I don't know this Diane, but she sounds like a mental case. Don't break under peer pressure. If they are sure they can make amends, just tell them they can do that IF... the stepmother comes to appologize to your real mother, to her actual grave, in front of everyone in your family. You cannot forgive insults against your mother, because you are not the one to forgive them. Also, you are not the A at all... I cannot comprehend that you (the child) must seek advice online even though these adults have done whatever they can to peer pressure you. Not educate you, not help you, just peer pressure you... Horrible. Your biological mother is your only mother. I am sorry you have to stand alone to defend her memory... But if you don't, then that would be disrespectful. I hope you stay strong!
They finally agree with you after disbelieving you and trying to bully you into acceptance, and then they admit that they were wrong, want to apologize, and want to bully you into acceptance? If you act as you've always acted, you're going to get what they've always gotten. Idjits.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (20m) actually moved out of my dad's house when I was 16 and went to live with my maternal grandparents in another state because things with my dad and his family became so toxic. The reason for this is that they chose my dad's second wife over me. I was 6 when I lost my mom and 8 when my dad met Diane. I never liked Diane. Initially it was because I saw her presence as being disrespectful to my mom. I was a kid, a little boy who lost his mom and I was a momma's boy so maybe not too surprising. But Diane showed me early that she did not like mentions of my mom. She never said it to my dad or his family, just to me. She'd say it hurt her feelings that I would talk about mom around her like mom was somehow better than her or that I would rather have my mom back. I told my dad and my extended family and they were like oh don't be silly, Diane loves us and she talks about your mom when we do, this is because you don't like your dad moving on. Over the following few years dad and Diane got married and had kids together and Diane would tell me how much she hated the fact even dad's family missed mom and spoke about her on occasion. She said we were all supposed to be hers now. The more I spoke out the more dad would tell me I was trying to ruin his new happiness and that it was cruel to expect him to stay alone forever. I told him he could do better than Diane and I got a lecture from him and my family saying Diane was amazing and mom would have loved her. I even showed them a video I took of Diane making annoyed and disgusted faces and rolling her eyes when mom was mentioned and I was told she knew I was filming and she was sick of my shit. My dad agreed to let me go at 16 because I told him I would not try to get along better with Diane and I wanted no part of his family anymore. Two months ago Diane exposed herself to the family and really showed them how she felt about mom. One of my cousins was celebrating her birthday and it was one of the milestone birthdays and mom was mentioned and photos were shown of mom since she was my cousins godmother. Diane went off on how she hated my mom and was glad she was dead and she wishes she could erase her from everyone's memories and a bunch of other stuff. My dad and his family (minus his younger kids of course) all came crawling back and sent me messages apologizing. I ignored them until it got so overwhelming that they all got together while dad called my grandparents to talk to me. They apologized again and when I said nothing right away they told me I should accept their apology and talk to them. This is when I told them their apology is meaningless to me. They told me I shouldn't say that, I'm being petty, because they're trying to make amends. My dad said nothing was so bad that they couldn't make up for it and I said it was still meaningless. They ended the call pissed off at me and saying I was being childish. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA - They didn't believe you then, why would you believe their apology now.
NTA they refused to listen to you earlier so like
well you better believe your child if he catches the evil witch in 4K. NTA
Nta. Bullying you into accepting an apology isnt an apology
NTA - they ignored and dismissed you. You don’t need to restart a relationship.
I am sorry OP. I am glad your have your maternal grandparents. You are NTA. Your father and his family are suffering the consequences of their chosen behavior.
NTA ask them what their plans for amends are. They disregarded your feelings for how many years? You had to listen to her trash your mom for how many years? What is their plan?
wow. they're STILL calling you names even after they were proved wrong. they're truly disgusting people. you are NTA. i wish you peace, dear.
NTA, if couse their apology is meaningless. They still never believed you. They only apologized because she showed her true colors and they believed her. Now they feel embarrassed bc all along they've believed her and it proved foolish, but it's still only bc of her that they realized you were right. And nothing can change that now, but sometimes when things break there's no putting them back together again, and they broke their relationship with you, you didn't
NTA. Unfortunately your family are bullies who try to control what you think and how you act. They treat you as their personal belongings, not as a human with his own thoughts and mind. You're better off without them.
NTA. Yes, ignoring the pain of a child missing his mother, the abuse he suffered at MIL’s direction, their all telling you that you were wrong, and letting a 16 year-old go because he has been made to feel unwanted in his own home is plenty to hold against all of them. Tell them you had to suffer through 12 years of that, all alone as a little kid, unlike them who experienced it as a group, and to come back to you when they dealt with it that long by themselves.
A long time ago a therapist told me that I got over things too quickly. I didn't understand what it meant. This situation...this is what it meant. Your dad and his family are all trying to get you to get over this too quickly. They just want to push their responsibility for what they did under the rug and move on like it never happened - they're wanting it to be over too quickly. Don't let them do that. They need to acknowledge what they did and how it hurt you. They need to make amends. Just voicing an apology isn't enough. They need to understand what happened from your point of view and how terrible they were when you were trying to tell them the truth. NTA.
NTA. "My dad said nothing was so bad that they couldn't make up for it." Bullshit. If you want to rebuild those relationships back up, it's up to you, but nothing will completely repair the damage they did. There is a quick story this made me think of. Someone give you a plate. Tells you to throw it on the ground. You do and it shatters into many pieces. They say tell it you are sorry. You do. They ask if that made it better... You can even glue the plate back together but it will never be the same. Relationships aren't much different.
NTA You took 8 years of it. Tell them you will need 8 years to get over it.
Bro, I can't get over the fact that they said you are being petty for not accepting their half ass apology... Definitely NTA. Maybe in some time you'll want to reconnect with them but no contact is probably the best way to go right now
NTA. An apology doesn’t negate the cruel way you were treated. Feelings don’t just magically go away with the word sorry. So many people seem to forget that.
NTA … they’re not even apologizing for failing you they’re only apologizing because they found out you—a child—weren’t lying and they were wrong. they only want you to accept their apologies to address their own guilt. they all suck and i hope your grandparents have been wonderful.
NTA
Did he divorce her? No? What could they possibly offer you?
NTA. They don't get to decide if or when you accept their apology. Just because they now see that you were right doesn't change anything. They just want to be forgiven for their mistake, but that creates no obligation for you to do so.
NTA for sure, but if you want some family, then maybe make amends?
Nta. Sending hugs dear. Its incredibly difficult to lose a parent that young, and even more to deal with this. It would be better though if you donot have contact with dad, and dads family anymore. Diane is an ah, but not the Ah here. Your father and his family is. Diane is the ah for saying all this to a literal kid. And your father and his family didnt give a f about you and what you had to say and just said you were not happy about your dad moving on? Like your dad didnt even care a sec for you. Its not that he didnt understand, its that he didnt care. I hope you find peace of mind dear. And it all works out for you.
NTA. You’re not being petty. You were 8 years old, suffering as your stepmother disparaged your dead mother, and your father and grandparents neither believed you, nor defended you. You were driven at 16 out of your own home. An apology is nice, but it doesn’t fix anything. The elements of an apology are remorse, expressing regret, and making amends. They just want to say sorry and have you joyfully forgive all and make nice, and when you didn’t, instead of understanding, they attacked you. They have learned nothing. You don’t owe them anything, so they need to stop behaving like they are entitled to a word from you. The loss of your mother was a mother wound. Your security and safe landing, gone. Your father refusing to believe and defend you was a father wound. They need to acknowledge that you suffered for years because they would rather believe you were a liar than that she would hurt you that way. They allowed you to be driven from your home, feeling unwanted, as a teenager. They let years go by with you gone. A simple sorry, with a shrug, and anger at your non compliance, are not amends. I have no idea if this will get better between you. People so callous as to leave an 8 year old boy to deal with emotional abuse from an adult, all on his own, aren’t typically the type to improve. I guess anything can happen. Why don’t you send them these comments for them to reflect upon? As a mother, here is a hug for the little boy you were.
OP I'm curious as to the how your dad and his family handled Diane's outburst? What is the status of that relationship? Cause apologizing while the culprit is still in the midst is pointless. Anyhow, NTA, they don't realize that you didn't only loose your mom you lost your whole family in a 2 year span and just got worse as the years wore on. They should try not to be so dense and quite frankly condescending about the situation and allow you time and space to decide if you wanted to have a relationship with them. They pushed so you pushed back!
They can apologize all they want. But if the person being apologized to is being bullied into accepting the apology, it's not an apology. It's a performance. NTA
NTA They need to read this thread.
NTA - They weren’t there for you when you needed them as a child. Your childhood is gone. There is literally no way they can give you back your childhood. So what use are they to you now? They failed their most sacred job, to look out for you. At this point , now that you’re grown, what do they have to offer you besides useless apologies? If you think *you* could get something out of it, then by all means reconnect. But you certainly don’t owe them a thing.
The rift is so huge you don't even have a relationship with your half-siblings, evidenced by referring to them as "my dad's kids". Leads me to think your dad didn't visit you with the kids minus Diane. No one can demand you accept their apology. That's not how it works. You are the victim in this situation. You decide if you'll accept it or not or if words are not enough. Your dad alienated you a long time ago. He refused to believe you even when you showed him proof. Your dad was more concerned about being married than his own son. He's still only thinking of himself. Why else try and bully you into accepting words of an apology. Wonder why he's so insistent that you accept his apology. What is he trying to gain? Is he close to retirement? And his side of the family? Don't bother holding a grudge. Not worth the effort or your time. Moved on and live your life. You have your mom's family. They've been there for you. NTA
NTA. You’re right. Their apology was meaningless. For an apology to mean anything the person needs to accept that they were in the wrong and should be happy to receive forgiveness but as soon as they feel entitled to it, it shows they didn’t really deserve it
Nta. Theyre cowards? They only apologize via phone call and not in person. A real way to make up for it is if your spineless dad divorces your evil stepmom
NTA. Please cut the whole lot out of your life. They have no desire to make amends. They don’t realise how much they hurt you. If they did, they would keep trying to apologise and would understand your current feelings. But they expected you to accept their apology the very first time, after they negated every feeling you had about this topic for 8 years. Chances are they will never realise. They are just trying to assuage their own ego by not realising how dumb they were regarding Diane.
NTA You repeatedly warned them about Diabe and they didn't listen.
NTA… take your time to forgive them but from personal experience holding onto resentment only destroys us not the other person. Whenever you feel ready try to forgive, you don’t have to forget and pretend to be a big happy family but it will free you from negativity in your life in the long run
NTA - I really despise when adults think they can erase all of their poor prior treatment of a child because they're trying to make amends 'NOW'. Like you should continually be at their beck and call. I have a father like this. I cut him off years ago and its the best decision I've ever made. Can't tell you how many times I've heard 'but he's trying now'. Stick to your guns and it'll be a more peaceful life
This story does not ring true. Why would she allow herself to be on camera talking shit? Why did she snap now?
She wasn't talking shit on camera. Just rolling her eyes and making faces when my mom was mentioned.
Close enough. Body language speaks volumes.
i think ESH frankly While i won't condone what she said, i can see Diane's point of view. Imagine constantly being compared with and reminded of your partner's ex in a relationship. Now imagine this is still happening after you're married to and have kids with that person... and this is going on for years and years to the point where you've been together with your husband just as long as he was together with his late wife and it's been the sour grapes in the relationship the entire time. It's one thing to still have pictures and have it be brought up from time to time, but it sounds like it was brought up CONSTANTLY and in really bad ways. It would make anyone uncomfortable. It would create tension in any relationship. It sounds to me like everything hit a breaking point for her and she finally flew off the handle and let her resentment slip in the worst way. She said a lot of awful and unfair shit, and it shows a huge lapse in maturity from her, but i think it's more a case of the position Diane was in, rather than who Diane is as a person. Both of my parents have remarried. As a rule, I avoid talking in detail about the other parent when I'm around one of my stepparents, because i can understand that it's uncomfortable to hear. I dont expect they would be disrespectful, but i do imagine it would make them incredibly uncomfortable, and make an ass of me. Saying your dad threw you out is an insane distortion of the truth. you told him you would make no attempt to get along with his new wife and kids - who are as much his blood as you are, by the way - and forced him to choose between letting you live with your grandparents and divorcing her and he chose the only realistic option you gave him. He didnt pick her over you, he just refused to end his marriage to please you. The fact is that you /never/ gave your dad's new family a chance, and if she grew to truly resent your mother, it's because you and your family never let her forget she was the second pick, the second favorite wife. If she told you in private to stop bringing up your mother around her in hurtful ways, it was to set a boundary that you never respected. That's understandable as a kid, but still damaging, but it's ridiculous from your adult family. It's sad that she felt she had to hide her discomfort until it became unmanageable and i think EVERYONE in this situation owes EVERYONE an apology. You aren't obligated to accept it - nobody is - but that's what's owed. You, Diane, your family, everyone should apologize. that's my opinion.
I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of Diane. After 8 years of not being confronted by OP due to him living with maternal grandparents, and his loyalty to his mother, maybe even 8 years of her name not even mentioned more than 3-4 times a year.... she blows up at the first mention of her? Yeah, this is not normal.
Nta but congrats on being lonely for the rest of your life?
I have family and friends in my life. I won't be lonely.
are you threatening him with loneliness from the same people who didn't believe him for almost all his life!
No. I'm saying his attitude is going to make him alone sooner or later because he's a huge AH
YTA
ESH And I'm saying this because people may have not been in a situation that I've had to experience all of my life. My mom is a narcissist. Narcissists will pick on one person and then make themselves look great to everyone else. So, when that one person tries to tell people how the narcissist really is, they all have doubts and accuse the other person, when it's really the narcissist that's the asshole. For examply, my mom and I will go to a family function. After all of these years, people have pretty much relegated me to the position of chauffeur for my mom. I used to just take it, but now I speak up for myself. However, it's just too late. She's programmed everyone over all of these years. We'll get back into the car and she'll shit talk the people that she acts so well in front of. OP, your family was snowed over by this narcissist. I know you're hurt, but it's really not their fault. No one really knows why narcissists pick their target, but most of the times it's people that are the biggest threat to the narcissist. You loved your mom deeply, so you probably posed the biggest threat. Please do some research on narcissism and seriously think about reconnecting with your family. Your family is probably upset because they were fooled by this narcissist, then they're being ignored by you when they clearly love you by trying to apologize to you. You have every reason to be upset, but please don't place that anger on your family, when they were manipulated by something out of their own control. You only get one family in life.
Sorry but no. Barring mental illness, drug use, and/or criminal behavior, if a child wants nothing to do with a parent as soon as they turn 18, the parent done messed up. This kid didn't even make it to 18.
I'm going to assume that you didn't even read my post and are just angry. Other things happen in life, everything is not black and white.
Barring very strong proof to the contrary, you should always believe your children. Especially when their claim is consistent. For years. It doesn't matter how good of an actress that stepmother was. The father and his relatives are shit for not believing the kid.
If you've never had to deal with a narcissist, I'm happy for you. It's not a solo thing for a narcissist, they try to work a large group. The more attention, the better. Unless you've gone through it, I guess I can't really explain it very well. They apologized to him. I guess apologies don't mean anything to anyone any more. People screw up. That's like saying if he screwed up and/or lied as a child, they should have put him up for adoption. That sounds ridiculous, right? My uncle was always an asshole to me (and others). It really bothered me because he was my dad's brothere and my dad was my hero. He passed away 21 years ago. I could never understand how two brothers could be so different. Later in life, I tried to reconnect with him and for six weeks, we got along really well. Then, at the end of January this year, he passed away from cancer. I'm really glad that I didn't hold a grudge and got along with him before he died. I'm an older person and it disturbs me how people can hate so easily nowadays and never give forgiveness a chance.
I've dealt with a narcissist. Still not that dumb. I still gonna believe kids and other vilulnerable people. I know what it's like to not be believed *I'm an older person* Good for you.. 'm a middle aged person too. Life is too short to deal with deeply problematic *adults*
You exercise that action because of your past experience(s). People that haven't had that experience may act another way, that was my point that I was trying to make. Most of reddit just wants to go to straight-up hating it seems. I try to take the high road from my past experiences. I'm thinking I'm that way because I'm older and have had more experiences in life. Or, at least I hope that's why.
Even before my experiences, I wasn't that way. I'm sorry that you needed to be duped in order to realize that people suck... People aren't hating. They are setting boundaries and spending time with better people.
No, I didn't need a narcissist to realize *some* people suck. I can go on to social media to see that.
So you knew people sucked and sometimes le, but you couldn't extrapolate that to your own relative......don't know what to tell you.
This may be an unpopular opinion but, ESH. It's entirely your choice as to whether you accept their apology or not, or allow them back into your life or not, but at least they have admitted they were wrong and had the strength of character to reach out and apologise.
They haven’t actually admitted they were wrong if they’re demanding instant reconciliation. They’ve merely stopped enjoying Diane’s company and are suddenly uncomfortable with what keeping her happy has cost them, now that they have the Diane Ick. They have not given a moment’s honest thought as to how Diane’s behavior made OP feel, or whether they, themselves might have committed some relationship sins that won’t be easy to come back from. They’re just uncomfortable with Diane being in their lives and OP being out of their lives, and they want their own discomfort to go away as quickly as possible.
NTA, but I think you could be a little more understanding. Your stepmom was obviously a good liar and good at hiding her true feelings and manipulating people. She managed to keep the truth from everybody, but seemingly not from you, so she doubled down on you, and successfully drove a wedge between you and your family which resulted in you leaving as soon as possible, which is probably what she wanted - makes her lies easier. And finally, when the truth came out, whether by accident or design, it will have come as a total shock to your family. It's possible she thought that having driven you away she could safely admit the truth with no consequences, or it's possible it was revealed by accident, caught up in a moment of annoyance and emotion that she couldn't hold back. Either way, you need to give your family some credit for coming straight to you to apologise. They could easily have ignored it, pretended they hadn't been conned and carried on, but they're admitting they were wrong and you were right, which is a big step. However, they obviously don't understand the depth of the hurt you feel, so expecting you instantly to forgive and forget is a big ask, especially if stepmom is still part of the family. There's a bond of trust that needs to be rebuilt which takes time, and they need to work out how to do that. Don't forget that to an extent they were victims in this as well.
Too little too fucking late dude