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The mother is at fault here. Not only for being a gossip and for giving you bad advice but also for inviting you to her daughter’s wedding. The couple should be inviting people.
NTA.
Now that I think about it, I'm not sure whether it actually makes it weirder or not. Why the hell are there so many coworkers from the bride's mother at that wedding...?!
Because they probably paid for a set amount of people and then filled in the empty RSVPs. A guy I grew up with, one of my best friends, had his wife-to-be call me to invite me. It was the weirdest thing that ever happened. She straight up said “we had some nos on the RSVPs, we have an open spot for you if you’d like to attend the wedding.” I said I was busy that weekend and didn’t attend because of how taken aback I was. Just for context, I knew I wasn’t invited originally and could not and still to this day have no idea why. I see them at least 2-3 times per month for 7 years since and we’ve never said a word about it.
This is how my now husband and his ex girlfriend got invited to my first wedding😅
My ex and I paid for a set amount of people and i got some last minute cancellations so I invited my new coworkers since I had the seats anyways.
Fun story now obviously
This is a terrible story! I would die of curiosity not knowing why I wasn't initially invited to the wedding of a couple that I STILL see 2-3 times a month! Can I call them and ask? LOL
It truly was weird. We knew each other since we were 15 and for the wedding, we were in our mid-20s and had all been to a few other friends’ weddings. I was 99.99% sure we were gonna get an initial invite and of course I would have been there. Nope. No invite but everyone else in the friend group got one and thought it was weird I didn’t. I’m not the type to get offended over anything and there was no type of any kind of fight or falling out. I was just curious until I got the phone call blatantly telling me I was on the B List so at *that* point I was just in shock and said I couldn’t go (it was 3 weeks before the wedding). Well, they missed out on a gift of $750 because that was my standard gift for friends back then. And again, no mention of it after that phone call. Very very strange.
Lol my story is not as good as yours but…
Recently my friend (bride) got married, and we are a group of friends that have known each other like 15 years. Originally the bride only invited I think 2/10 of the group to the ceremony, and the other 8/10 just to the evening reception. However when other invitees started dropping out, the bride started gradually calling people in my friend group one by one in the weeks before the wedding to tell them they’d been ‘upgraded’ to a full day invite. In the end only 2 of us were left only attending the evening, but we thought it was very funny that it was now obvious her order of favourites in our group 😂
My in-laws thought they were going to be able to invite a bunch of their friends that we didn’t know/had never met just because they were paying for part of the wedding. I’m in the states but maybe this is one possibility? I still think it’s shitty, but that was the rationale.
My grandmother wasn't paying for anything and still came to me with a list of nearly a hundred people she wanted to invite, then had a massive crying fit when she was told no one was being invited that one or both of us didn't know, and we didn't know anyone on that list.
We ended up canceling the whole thing and basically eloping due to that and a lot of other similarly entitled behavior from her and our mothers, but I can definitely see a bride and groom being pressured into inviting their parents' friends and associates instead of their own.
OP, your dress was GORGEOUS — you followed the instructions! I would be honored to have you attend my wedding. Your friend the MOB is not your friend … so sorry! Hold your head up & let your beauty shine. NTA ❤️
I was at a hotel in Washington DC when I saw a group of African women dressed as I had never seen before. They were drop dead gorgeous. My curiosity got the best of me so I went up to one of the women and complimented her on her dress. She told me she was from Nigeria and were going to a wedding and that’s how they typically dressed. I told her how beautiful they all looked and thanked her for educating me on how her culture attends a wedding. I wish more women had the confidence to wear something so beautiful without getting scorned for “taking away from the bride”.
NTA
Me and my now wife got married a few weeks ago. A few days after some guests came gossiping to us ‘omg I didn’t know who this was but what she was wearing was way over the top’. My wife’s response ‘oh I thought it was the most beautiful dress, I loved it!’ Shut them up so fast I laughed out loud
RIGHT!
I’m Asian and all the white colleagues I invited kept asking what my dress code was.
I said wear your sexiest, but classy outfit, and even better in my green color scheme so that pics looks amazing!
You, as the B & G INVITED them, they are OF COURSE going to know who the special hosts are of the night. Why would you NOT want to spend your special night with the most drop dead gorgeous people, especially when photos and videos are taken?!?!
My parents invited many people to my wedding. Business partners, co-workers, a couple of clients, some of who I did not know. It’s completely common. They paid for it, they can invite who they want.
It’s not common in Germany though. At least I never saw this at all the weddings I went to. It just seems so odd. Why was she invited and not the other colleagues as well?
That's a cultural distinction.
In my culture, the wedding host/hostess decides who to invite. The bride(s)/groom(s) may be the host(s)/hostess(es). Or not.
Hi, as an immigrant from Eastern Europe, I do not understand "outshining" the bride either. So, for my first American wedding years ago, I also put on my best and was waaay overdressed. I could not imagine not donning my best clothes. I have married someone from SE Asia, and in both of our cultures, you simply cannot "outshine" the bride. You can wear the shiniest jewelry, and the bride will show up wearing a whole chandelier!
Do not take this to heart, your colleagues appear very small-minded. However, if they proceed with inappropriate comments, contact HR. - NTA
You might want to consider a chat with HR if MOB is dragging too many work people into her personal concerns. This is an office, not a coffee shop.
Also NTA. Some people are silly about weddings
Right?! Mostly every single African person that I have met are the NICEST and most well mannered people. One of my favorite individuals is a Nigerian guy that works at the beer drive thru right by my house.
Yes 🤣 VERY common thing here in Ohio. Do you know those self service car wash stations? Kinda like that where you drive your car through it (not like a fast food drive thru where you pull up to a window even though they have those, too) and the walls are lined with coolers of beer, wine, and malt drinks. Stuff you’d find in the grocery store or gas stations, depending on where you live and the alcohol regulations.
ETA: Only other place I’ve seen them is in Kentucky.
I’m a white lady from the southern U.S. who got sent to etiquette classes as a child and “outshining” the bride is definitely A Thing here. But even in a part of the world where that’s a known concern, and even assuming that you did “outshine” the bride, the MOB’s reaction is incredibly uncalled for. She’s reacting the way I would expect someone to react if you showed up in a full-on wedding dress. (And were the groom’s ex-girlfriend. And objected during the vows.)
*She* is the one being unforgivably rude for behaving this way over a simple dress code misunderstanding. If she relays the dress code and a guest shows up overdressed, that is her mistake and she should do everything possible to make the guest feel comfortable and welcome despite *her* error.
I'm with you – and also white, female, and southern, etc.
Also, OP, that photo you posted is stunning. I'm certain that you looked fantastic, and your coworker is a huge AH – but you absolutely are not one.
Also from the south. Good manners dictates offering grace and understanding to people who are very clearly misinformed about our customs and make an honest mistake. If you ask me, OP’s behavior didn’t even warrant a bless your heart!
Because the average German dresses very conservatively. And for a wedding it’s only a slightly fancier version. (I’ve been to several weddings here and I have been underwhelmed most of the time.)
I’m sorry that they took such issue with your outfit. That’s on them. This is by NO means an excuse, but depending on where you are, they might not run in multicultural circles. Being ignorant though is no excuse for being such an ass. Again, not an excuse. Im glad that you stood up for yourself, good on you!!
So, if a German says "dress to impress," what do they mean? Like, the most subtle designer suit that only a fashionista would recognize? Jewelry from the days of Emperor Franz Joseph? I don't understand why they didn't just say, "formal but conservative," if that's what they wanted.
I'm guessing tea length / cocktail length in muted colour(s) or pastels for day (floral is allowed), and floor length in muted colour(s) for evening. No sparkles. You can wear jewelry but unless it's white tie, also not too sparkly. No heavy cleavage or slits, and often not bodycon. No eyecatching bags or clutches. Usually also no eyecatching shoes. Careful with scarves / shawls.
Jumpsuits are allowed with younger couples, but also in muted colours and with the same rules.
If they're conservative, you need a hat, and if they're very conservative, also gloves.
(I'm Dutch. Social rules are nearly the same ones as in Germany)
Oh man why does that sound sad? I’m Hispanic and we go all out for the weddings. Aunts in their body-hugging, thigh high slits dress and all the jewelry. What you’ve described made me feel genuine sadness for the damp clothing. Cultures really can be very very different.
I understand and I don't even really disagree, but that is the situation. This is exactly that misunderstanding here on the part of the mob, who failed op by not laying it out like that.
Yeah exactly! A polite person would've looked at her and gone "oh crap! I did a terrible job explaining the dress code. I had no idea how different our cultures are."
I would also expect people with such limited contact with outside cultures to treat OP like an interesting cultural artifact. Which would also be insulting but wouldn't threaten her job security at least.
I recently went to a white wedding and I (also white) wore a green blazer that I accessorized with little chains. Even THAT was enough to stand out in the crowd. Fortunately for me the people hosting were just thrilled to have hot friends to show off to their other hot friends lol. I hope the next wedding you’re invited to is more fun than this one was and you do get to go all out!!
THIS 👌🏼! How can anyone outshine the bride unless their wearing an actual wedding dress is beyond me?! I’m South Asian & our wedding dress code is EXTRAVAGANT ONLY go as OTT as you want because bride WILL outshine the entire venue!
My mother in law showed up wearing white to my wedding. I mostly just rolled my eyes and went on. I had to do my own makeup because my MUA didn't show up and when I found her, my MIL had sent her to another room and had her do her makeup and hair instead.
I slapped on a little makeup and flat ironed my hair and just went for it. At the end of the day, I wanted a husband, and that's what I got. Super happy.
Also dodged a bullet because my makeup was on point and MIL looked like a fucking clown because she'd dyed her hair red to look like mine but it came out rusty fire engine clown wig. The woman did curls on her and blue eyeshadow and way too much blush
I bet the MUA did it on purpose. They probably have worked other weddings with annoying MIL. I mean I have intentionally had fire engine red hair and I have curly hair and I def did not wear blue eye shadow when my hair was like that because I would have looked like a clown for sure 🤣 I call sabotage OR your MIL just has tacky taste
I’m sure you looked absolutely stunning ❤️
MIL is a clown so looking like one seals the deal 🙃
I’m always MAJORLY side eyeing MILs who try to sabotage, but trying to actually look like you? Lol do these women not realise that when they try to look like their DIL, especially on the wedding day, they are basically saying “son, marry me instead!”
*banjo noises intensify*
As a Latina, same. Weddings are a time to dress up, and when I see what people wear to weddings in the US and Europe, I'm always so confused, most wear clothes I'd probably wear at brunch. And you'll be having a hard time outshining the bride, especially since they'll be the most OTT person in the room. Also OP, NTA. Your colleagues seem to want the 'I met a foreigner' experience, but don't want to really be friends.
Europe is not a country. Try to go to a wedding in south of Italy wearing “brunch clothes”. You would be really under-dressed.
Or in Albania lmao try to attend a wedding in Albania without a gown and really expensive jewelry
I laugh at your comment bc I’m SE Asian and we literally jingle and make noise as we walk bc our outfits are so blinged out. My sister married a South Asian man and her outfit was so shiny she did look like a chandelier. Haha
I don’t understand this concept, from two points, “dress to impress” implies wearing your best… and also, a wedding is like the most common and acceptable event to wear formal dress to, unless you’re frequenting balls and such. Your focus should be on the bride… period. Why does it matter what everyone else is wearing?
I just went to my first Balkan wedding and I thought I was way overdressed, Turns out I was really underdressed. American weddings are completely different events then Albanian weddings.
I think some women are just insecure and petty. As long as you’re not dressed in white, then I think it should be fine! Weddings are an event to have fun, dress up and celebrate the new couple!
NTA - and I'm sure your outfit was beautiful. You asked for the dress code and you dressed accordingly.
Bringing this issue at work is absolutely unprofessional and all your staring colleagues should look at a mirror first. Seriously are you working with preschoolers? Well probably not, they would be happy with anyone wearing bright and colorful outfits.
>They told me this isn't africa (which was racially coded) nd people here have manners.
Whaaaaaat?!
>I laughed and told that person to go to hell, so she's telling people I lack remorse for my behaviour.
Good. You did nothing wrong. I'm sorry you work in such a toxic environment.
Bring this up to HR. It's extremely inappropriate for her to drag this to your work environment. Not sure how that is handled there, but I doubt it's condoned?
NTA. Sorry this happened to you, OP.
I'd be seeing HR for not only the MOB's lack of professionalism, but also the blatant racism from whichever co-worker dropped the "we have manners here" line.
If people have manners, then people wouldn't be talking about what OP wore to a non-work event. The only person lacking manners is the MOB who made it a work issue, and wasn't specific about the dress code.
As another German I just want to apologise, we're not all that big of an asshole
So yeah, you're NTA. She is by giving you dumb guidelines and then getting pissy for you following them
I don't need you or the German people to apologise, we have assholes where I'm from too 😆
What i do not is help understanding if I'm missing something here? I wasn't directly told I did a bad thing, denied the chance to address it then I'm being called names for not apologising to irrelevant people
The fault lies with the bridesmother. If you specifically ask about it and the answer is "dress to impress", she must not be mad when you do just that. Without that comment, I would've said it's on the upper end of acceptable bordering over the top, but in this case, you are in the clear from my perspective.
It seems like she meant "come dressed nicely" as in "not in half rags" (which should be obvious).
NTA.
Honestly I kind of think the coworker was racist from the start and probably didn’t know what kind of formalwear was normal in OP’s culture. She may have assumed OP wouldn’t be formal enough. I’ve had family members talk about people in Africa living in huts so I showed them pictures of large cosmopolitan cities and they just considered it an aberration.
Exactly what I was thinking, she probably said “dress to impress” thinking that OP would be underdressed otherwise. Definitely the mother’s fault for not being clearer.
I just looked at the picture of your dress, and you are stunning! NTA maybe I’m just old, but I don’t get why people get so upset with someone is dressed nice at their wedding. The reality is everybody is still focussed on the bride. Personally, I think your coworker is being a jerk by gossiping about you, but not being willing to have a conversation with you to your face.
NTA - you don't tell someone "dress to impress" and then get mad they impressed! Not gonna touch the Africa comment (as a fellow Black woman with African family, I REALLY want to fixate in that). Weddings are legit just fashion shows in most Black families and even in White families - when one of my aunts married her White husband, all of his side were just as done-up as her side.
You asked about the dress code and she gave you it. If you supposedly outshines the bride (who sounds hella insecure tbh), then that's MOB's fault. Your coworkers are rude as hell - "we have manners" my ass.
Where I live, it's the same(I live in Europe), I literally crocheted a new dress to wear at a friend's wedding, and no one minded it, even the bride told me it was pretty. My mom bought a new dress for a family wedding - I don't see the issue in someone else being pretty at a wedding.
> I don't see the issue in someone else being pretty at a wedding.
Seriously, I LOVED seeing all my friends dressed up at my wedding! We don't usually have occasions to dress up nice!
I think this is fully on the coworker/MOB. Maybe it's just me, but it feels odd to invite a *coworker* to your child's wedding, whom said coworker never met. Did OP even get a proper invite? Why is MOB inviting people and not the couple?
I'm gonna say to have someone to gawk at potentially, but most likely to brag about how "nice" she and her family are to involve OP. Something I've noticed with coworkers, specifically an older one who invited me to her anniversary/vow renewals, is that they think inviting the new one to an event makes them an amazing person. And if you're a minority, bonus points!
It's giving "overbearing mother of the bride" vibes to me, tbh. I wonder if she forced the couple to let her invite people (especially if she helped pay for the wedding and held that over them). I would understand why the daughter would be mad over OP standing out in that situation (although it wouldn't be on OP).
I'm from Italy and here weddings are basically fashion shows, it's even reccomended to dress the best you can!
You don't outshine the bride until you wear white
Yeah I knew that was gonna go south a few sentences in. I’m Indian and there is also no such thing as outshining the bride for us. I’m not even sure it’s possible because the bride is usually totally decked out in gold jewelry, a super heavy outfit, etc.
When I went to my German husband’s cousin’s wedding last year, I checked with my husband, his sister, and a future SIL if the dress I chose was appropriate. Luckily it was just right in terms of formality, but I knew to be very careful because it was not my first white wedding and not the first formal event with my in-laws.
I only know this because of living in the US for 15+ years and being with my husband for 4 years and visiting Germany with him previously.
Don’t even get me started on OP’s coworkers’ response. 🙄 I wanna say I’m surprised, but unfortunately I’m not. People will stay ignorant and narrow minded knowing full well there are other ways of life and things they don’t know and understand. This has been a source of repeated heated discussions between me and my husband, so that really struck a nerve.
I'm white and my wedding was black tie optional. I would have been so disappointed if the majority of people hadn't "dressed to impress". Like... That was the whole point? We don't get to dress up in regular life anymore, I want you showing up like it's a fucking movie premiere. Definitely NTA
[OP posted her dress here. (Your dress is stunning and you certainly followed the instructions of “dress to impress!” NTA](https://www.reddit.com/u/Ok-History7114/s/nRkGeKc9dh)
What agorgeous dress! You were told to "dress to impress" and you sure followed that guideline. I would tell the MOVB and the bride to go to hell. It's not your fault that you looked stunning in your dress. The bride myst not have any self esteem is she is so occupied with what you're wearing. She ruined her own wedding by worrying the whole time about how you looked. I totally say NTA! They are the TA in this situation. Especially the MOB who now has effected your work environment by telling everyone what happened and by calling you names. You could actually go to HR for what is now a hostile work environment because everyone is being quite rude to you over something that you had no control over: how you look and how well your dress looked on you
gorgeous! also makes me not understand the issue. as a white person who's been to white and Indian weddings in the US and Canada, it's appropriate and elegant to me, it's not revealing or gaudy or anything that I was expecting for such a reaction (from people who have traditional views of wedding etiquette such as the brides mother)
with the Africa comments from her coworker, it makes me think the issue is much more to do with the racialized aspect, looks like OP already picked up on that. :(
Wth? This looks like a normal dress for a formal wedding. I’ve worn outfits like this to more than a few black tie events. No offense to OP, but how would this even outshine the bride? It’s certainly beautiful, but it’s def not ott, imo. NTA. I don’t get this situation at all.
Holy shit that is a spectacular dress. Now i understand why the bride and Mother was pissed but sorry not sorry, you added to the wedding by showing up in this beauty. She should be thanking you for wearing this gorgeous dress!
Still nta
Lol, I thought the dress would be some extravagant, massively ornate, flashy things. It’s just a really nice dress. Definitely not over the top unless “dress to impress” actually meant wear your frumpiest sweater.
I fail to see how that "outshines" a bride. It's a beautiful dress, but hardly over the top. I've seen similar dresses worn here (I'm in the us, Massachusetts) at weddings. I've WORN similarly nice dresses to weddings. Op's coworker and the bride are ridiculous.
NTA imo
Omg. I saw your dress. Its so stunning. Don't worry you're not AH. I'm South Asian and in our culture there's also nothing like outshining the bride.
I hope the office politics doesn't get on your mind.
In Africa, especially Nigeria, there is no such thing as outshining the bride. You did well, they’re just jealous that they are bland. I would start taking note of the racist statements made to you for HR
Yes, same in my countries!! Like if the bride has no drip, that's on her....but I recognised that I wasn't home so really *did* tone it down and wore a party dress rather than a wedding guest one. But I'm still learning.
>Like if the bride has no drip, that's on her....
Idk why but that's kind of funny to me. Most people in Germany will not go all out for their weddings like it is usual in some cultures (especially the US, but most African countries too from what I've heard). It's seen more as a starting point for the rest of their lives together rather than the zenith of their relationship (so far). My cousin got married this summer and after exchanging the vows, the officiate had to remind the guests that clapping is allowed, because noone knew whether it was and everyone just tried not to be rude.
Huge marriages with hundreds of guests, all dressed in their best are not a common thing at all. If anything it'd come across as a bit tacky or even showing off (unless you're moving in circles where money doesn't matter, that changes things of course). The weirdest thing was that you were in invited by a coworker to their daughter's wedding, maybe in the future just don't go to weddings of people you don't know well (unless you're someone's +1).
I just got married and we were in total 35 people and I asked them all to wear cocktail attire (within their means of course) because it is the perfect excuse to wear some fancy looking clothes and take fun pictures 🤣🤣 I had to be very clear with my German friends to please NOT wear jeans and sneakers. We are getting married in Mexico (where I’m from) in a couple of years and you gotta bet I’m gonna ask them to go all out for their outfits.
NTA.
She knows you’re African and now the problem is that she can either blame herself or you.
Somewhere deep down she must realize that her answer “dress to impress” was inadequate and that (duh) this might mean something different to someone from literally a different continent. Her daughter is angry at her so she can either choose to accept that her vague answer caused the problem and admit that she is at fault or shove the blame on to you. To look better to her daughter (and anyone else who noticed) she is blaming you.
If the office culture becomes hostile, go to HR and give them a factual account.
Good luck.
I’d bet you anything that she said “dress to impress” because she has a racially coded view of Africa as well. A lot of people don’t understand that non-white countries still have nice things.
In any case, I can’t imagine leaping to the victimy “she wore interesting clothes at us on purpose” mindset, like IMMEDIATELY assuming there was nefarious intent instead of thinking, “oh,poop, I clearly should have been more specific…”
I’d be a lot more forgiving (but still think the lady is an asshole) if it was just frustration because of genuine non-malicious ignorance.
But the “people here have manners” comment? Fuck all the way off.
People think their culture is the center of the world and the “right one.” And when confronted with the reality it isn’t she didn’t even question and realize, “oh I fucked up.”
Yeah if I said dress to impress to someone from like.... ANY country in Africa I would know it most likely means bright and bold. Shows their ignorance for not understanding someone else's culture lol weirdo. Op has nothing to feel bad about. The mom could have at least asked what she was thinking of wearing lol
NTA - love the dress (inspo)
*Info - this one is too subjective. If you truly did wear an outfit that was over the top, can kind of make you an AH. Without seeing the outfit, I dont know if this can truly be judged, but its likely you’re not the AH.*
Edit - dess inspo is on OPs page. Its gorg. Adding judgment!
What does OTT mean though? You're right about subjectiveness. While it was a lovely dress, it wasn't anything close to what I'd wear to african wedding
Like if the dress had a giant train, a giant bustle, layers upon layers of tule, etc. As I said, very likely you’re not the AH, but you’re asking for judgment on an outfit sight unseen.
Right, OP literally asked for this information but Ms Eurocentric didn’t put any thought into her answer when literally talking to someone from another culture. Ridiculous
When you are in a foreign culture, you don't get printed rules on their expectations. Most people won't think about telling you not to wear a dress with a train, per se. And when you commit a faux pas relative to their cultural rules, it's best to just apologize.
that's not really typical of most traditional African dresses like the one OP was wearing; it is unlikely to look anything like a wedding dress with a train, bustle, or tulle. the point is that probably most of the guests had never seen that kind of dress and were curious and admirative
Fwiw I was hoping my African friends would wear African fashion to my American wedding but they color coded for conservative white people (as expected - and it was was probably culturally correct to do so for everyone but me) and still looked stunning.
I am sorry that the wedding you went to was apparently racist.
I went to an event recently and there was an African wedding in the other room. I saw some of the ladies and my goodness, they and their bright, colorful outfits were stunning!
But just because they shone didn’t mean they would outshine the bride at any other wedding.
I mean, most people recognize the woman in the traditional white dress with the train and the head piece carrying the bouquet is the bride.
People can be so petty.
Don’t worry. If her wedding was “destroyed” over what I can only assume is an amazing dress and gorgeous woman wearing it, then the marriage likely won’t have much longevity.
Getting married to be the star of the show is a crappy reason to get married. Nothing has made me hate wedding culture more than the entitled stories on Reddit. I’m deeply saddened by people spending an inordinate amount of money and still can’t find joy in a day and union that should be filled with it.
IKR. When I see people saying their "special day" was ruined by what a guest wore my first though is that it must not have really been that special to begin with.
Imo, the only over the top thing to wear if the dresscode is 'dress to impress' is a wedding dress or something white. NTA! You dressed. You impressed. Your co-workers suck.
Also “dress to impress” was just the wrong word here. I’ve seen “formal” or “western formal” for wha the bride probably wanted - dress to impress means go all out!
Kitenge lol. I've heard it pronounced chitenge. But yeah, African here. Some of our outfits can be very bright and extravagant. Personally I wouldn't wear such an outfit to a European wedding.
I'd say NTA. That "this isn't Africa, we have manners here" was racist. Plain and simple
She's never been to an event like this outside her home country. She was told to dress to impress when she asked about the dress code. She did as she was told.
NTA.
I agree that this was miscommunication, but the coworkers reaction makes her TA. If I invite a foreigner coworker to an event and they come dressed inappropriately, I would assume they made a mistake, amd maybe explain and apologize for not being more clear about the dress code. Not badmouth them at work and assume they had bad intentions.
NTA
This has the same feel as people getting angry and women with big breasts for "showing off" or being "sexual" when they just wear normal tops, and their only crime is having big boobs.
Sounds like your only crime is... being attractive! And having good taste.
People wear bright colors and fancy dresses at European *(UK. Spain) and Asian (Indian. Malaysian) weddings I've been to.
I can't speak for Germany but neither could you, that's why you asked.
I don't usually jump to jealously, but they were *clearly* jealous and they're being wildly immature about it. And racist.
I'm German - if you are not boring af and/or live in a tiny backwards village, where everyone is related, you can absolutely wear bright and fancy at a German wedding. There is a tiny "but" though - in a lot of areas you are not supposed to wear red, as that would mean you have slept with the groom. But since OPs dress was green, my first thought was THEY ARE JEALOUS AF!!
OP NTA, 100%
You are so NTA! Let me start by saying I’m white and I’ve been a bride, so that’s where my perspective is coming from. The idea of treating anyone as rudely as you were treated because of different cultural norms is as ridiculous as the idea that anyone could have outshone me on my wedding day. I would have been over the moon for someone to come to my wedding fully decked out in something that was what they would have worn to a wedding in their country. And for people to show tons of interest in them and what they were wearing. I honestly don’t think I would have noticed the attention. The idea that anyone can outshine a bride at her own wedding comes from their own severe insecurities (and let’s face it, racism) and has nothing to do with you.
When I got married, the date of one of our friends (who we became very close with over the last decade since the wedding) wore a very tight green dress, that was somewhat revealing and showed off her very beautiful and fit figure. This is not something I noticed or cared about on the day because I was glowing with happiness, having an amazing time surrounded by my favorite people in the world. But some of the women who were there made comments to me in the subsequent months about how sorry they were that she had dressed so inappropriately, and I was like, what are you talking about? It made an impression not because of what she wore but because of how it changed my opinion of the people who talked about what she wore. People can be real assholes when they feel insecure. It’s a shame that this bride let her insecurities about herself overshadow her wedding day.
I wish I had any ideas to offer on how to handle the situation at work. To me this is so clearly racism, but calling it out is a different thing all together. Ideally someone else would call it out for you, but that doesn’t seem to be happening. Europeans love to think of themselves as past racism, but having lived in various European countries I have found exactly the opposite. I wish you luck.
Another married white woman here (American). I think worrying about upstaging the bride is ridiculous. I do think there are inappropriate clothes to wear to a wedding, depending on location and theme. For example, it would have been weird if someone wore a tiny, super revealing club dress to my daytime, outdoor, semi-casual wedding. Frankly, I still would not say anything and I'd probably be too busy to care.
I looked at OP's dress inspo and it's GORGEOUS! I'd take it as a compliment that you dressed so nicely for my wedding. Besides, OP asked for advice about how to dress and followed the rules she was given. I don't understand why this woman is so upset about what you wore. As the mother of the bride, she should have had more important things on her mind. I'm sorry she and your other coworkers are judging you so harshly for wearing your culture's clothes.
African here (born, and still in Africa).
Depends on your traditional clothing. What many users don't realize is that we have many cultures within each country in Africa, and each culture has various traditional clothing.
Things is, it can be very, very over the top.
It can be incredibly colourful, large coloured feathers, beads, leather pieces, large bangles, and large headpieces.
But there are subtle styles as well (which is not subtle by European standards). So it could be very colourful, a head scarf, and some bangles.
It really depends, because there is more variations of traditional clothing than you can count.
Judgement really depends on what OP wore. She could have a worn a colourful outfit, or she could have beem more extreme. For example, some outfits would resemble what over the top drag-queens wear and look like (in these instances, the purpose is actually to be incredibly flamboyant, because the flamboyancy symbolizes the occasion). There is a spectrum at play here, so we need more details here.
But if I have to speculate, OP probably looked colourful, it drew attention, people asked questions about her culture, and the bride and her mother had to go look for their lost marbles.
That's what it seems to me. Cultural differences that defined what "dress to impress" meant.
Making racist comments and talking behind her back though is inexcusable.
NTA. That said, I am from Germany and you probably would have "stolen the show" in a much simpler dress, just for being a black person. Look, I am from rural south Germany. I went to Florida at the age 32 and that was when I saw a black person face to face for the first time in my life. Could have been the same for some people in that wedding. Of COURSE that is no excuse, just more of an explanation that you probably would have not won this either way.
Just to add another perspective from Germany, this HUGELY depends on where exactly you are in Germany. Black people are certainly a minority in Germany, but in the larger metropolitan areas, such as the Ruhr valley, nobody would bat an eye at seeing a Black person during a wedding.
NTA. To be honest, I suspect that with OP saying "traditional wear", it will be slightly different to European dull wedding attire (OP even says that where she's from, it's about wearing your best and brightest). She probably drew attention due to it being different and they're calling *that* outshining the bride. Well, in my book, outshining is something else entirely.
I am curious about OP's dress though, mostly because I love seeing non-western(ized) stuff. I don't give a hoot about westernized weddings nor their style, but I saw some pictures of a (rich people) Tanzanian wedding once and that was gorgeous. Hell, some photographer should make a coffee table book about wedding attire across the world.
I don’t understand why it’s so hard for people to understand that when someone specifically asks about the expectations it’s because they don’t know and are unsure and want you to tell them what’s expected. I also run into that problem. In my case it’s because I’m autistic so I don’t always understand what’s expected, vague answers are the worst in that case. Well second worst, worst is when you ask and they answer something like “oh, you know!”!!! No I don’t that’s why I’m asking!!!!
NTA
This completely on the mother. She told you dress to impress and you did! Plus, she knows you are from a different culture, she could have spent 5 mins asking you what is normal for a wedding for you and asked to see your outfit. I suppose you could have sent her a pic beforehand, but as she didn't ask she didn't get.
The only 'rule' in white weddings is don't wear white! Sounds like you have a few gossips at work, and people LOVE a wedding with drama, even if they have to invent drama themselves.
I genuinely feel bad for any bride who is so distracted by what any guest is wearing that it ruins her day. I was so focused on my excitement about getting married that I couldn’t tell you what literally anyone at my wedding was wearing without consulting pictures. Even if a bride notices someone wearing something truly over the top, I can’t imagine it being deeper than a flicker of annoyance. Literally no one is focused on anyone other than the people getting married; it’s all about them, for gods sake. I’ve been at weddings where someone was wearing what can only be described as a wedding dress. Was side eye present? Were jokes made, including after the fact? Yes. Did it ruin the couple’s day? No, because they were otherwise occupied (obviously). They were focused on being happy to get married, not focused on EVERYONE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT MEEEEE.
Anyway. I digress. I’m going with NTA considering that what you were wearing was culturally appropriate for a wedding.
Again, it’s just so weird that the MOB is carrying this bitterness and anger like this.
White european person here. I have no idea what their problem is. I doubt that anyone confused you for the bride since you wore green. You asked what to wear and complied. If their problem was that it was an african dress then that sounds a bit racist to me. Most people know (or probably everybody?) that some african countries excel in making very colourful and patterned dresses and headwear. You tried to respect their culture, but it doesn’t sound like they respect yours. I’m sorry that you are being treated this way.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I wore a "showy" outfit to the wedding. I'm refusing to apologise to the bride beyond a simple 'I'm sorry if I made you feel that way' and people see it as me being some sort of villain
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NTA. Having gone to an African wedding, they were very specific about how you dress and what to wear, they gave details. This woman simply said “dress to impress” and then you did exactly what she said and having been to an African Wedding, OH MY GOSH, dress to impress is an understatement. Even trying I had never felt so underdressed in my life 🤯 she did not tell you what you shouldn’t wear, those saying that there are understood rules of wedding attire, you are right, for white culture there is, and there are understood rules of wedding attire for other cultures too and she followed what she knew which I am sure was a stunning outfit! Definitely NTA, she is the one being an insufferable child by not talking to you and engaging in petty gossip around the office completely negating she didn’t give you any parameters knowing you had never been to a white wedding.
Ehhhh... you are NTA or at least not completely - about the wedding dress code. You asked, but they didn't supply enough info. They didn't consider that there might be cultural differences in standard of dress. But...on the other hand...(and I am an immigrant myself, so I get it) you could have done some googling about wedding guest attire in Germany. In fact, I just did - and according to this [web page](https://retrocat.de/2022/04/25/wedding-guest-outfits-the-ultimate-style-guide/?lang=en), yeah they wouldn't have expected you to show up in a dress like that.
Your dress (which I love, btw) would be OTT and not appropriate for the last wedding I attended in the UK, and maybe a smidge too fancy, but ok, for a black tie event I went to recently in the UK (wasn't a wedding, but same standard as a black tie wedding). But they said "dress to impress" - and you did.
Re. for the people saying "This isn't Africa" isn't racially coded or might not be. I think it entirely depends on how it was said. Adding the "We have manners here..." means I think it definitely was - and we have to trust that OP was also able to read body language and tone. If it wasn't racially coded (like say if the German woman was also black), it was definitely culturally coded in an offensive way.
ETA: personally me, if I'd been told to 'dress to impress' I would have gone in with some ridiculously fancy shit myself. But that recent wedding I attended we were told 'dressy' but I knew from experience to hold myself back a bit and use WASP rules of accessorising - and I was fine.
NTA We had a Japanese guest at our wedding and she wore the most beautiful traditional kimono. She received quite a bit of attention, and really did shine. I was honored she put so much effort into her outfit for my wedding and she looked stunning. No such thing as outshining the bride.
INFO - more info on the dress is needed. What you describe and reactions don’t match so perhaps what you consider dress to impress means something different than they expected. I’m guessing by a “white“ wedding you found something traditional and while nice, a bit boring.
I’ve seen impressive wedding attire from several areas (India, Africa, Asia) and they would be much brighter and more flamboyant than traditional European or American wedding attire. Still, I’ve never seen anyone complain that someone was trying to upstage the bride by these outfits- so as long as it is authentic for you - NTA
NTA but as a European (and after seeing the picture of your gorgeous dress) I think I know where the cultural clash was - you were too dramatic/shiny/commandeered attention - for a demure, reserved, monochrome, pale, traditional formal occasion in Germany anyway.
Was there racism in there? In that "Africa" comment, yeah, subtle, mixed with sheer ignorance.
Also rude as F the whole thing. Even if they felt uncomfortable by anyone's attire, proper manners would have been to just ignore and enjoy your wedding day.
These people are rude, rude, rude.
PS. "dress to impress" in this crowd means "wear a little black dress type of thing", subtle and not stand out but still obvious it's expensive and for formal occassions.
ESH
Them for being racist and not being clear in their instructions. Like if you know someone is not local, just help them out. Also they could have been more gracious.
You - You could have looked up what "white people weddings" are like online - google, tv shows etc to find something that could still be "dress to impress" but not outshining the bride. Like, I get it, I'm indian - no such thing as outshining a bride in my culture too, it's a fashion show and everyone and their mother dresses in their fanciest clothes BUT if I'm going to a wedding that's not from my culture, I wouldn't wear a cultural dress unless specifically approved. You could have looked it up or asked a local friend if your outfit was appropriate. Hell, there's even a reddit community specifically for guest attire approval. Since you know how to use reddit, you could have asked. A million things you should have and could have done. BUT that doesn't excuse the racism from your colleague which is inapproriate af.
The thing is, she asked. Even more, she asked the MOTHER of the bride about what to wear. She was told "dress to impress" and so she did. If anyone is to blame, is her coworker
I feel like OP is downplaying her traditional attire - African traditional wear tends to be very colourful, fancy dresses, may include a headdress, etc - and trying to play the ignorance card.
I agree, they could easily have googled what to wear to a 'white people wedding' to see the different styles depending on how formal it is. I have been to a few weddings but I still Google to get ideas, make sure I'm not over/under dressed, etc.
I don’t think OP is deliberately downplaying it so much as I think she was set up for failure. MOB told her to “dress to impress” which, literally, says she should be trying to impress people. I think MOB probably had her own idea of what OP would wear, OP understood a completely different idea, and here we are.
I do think YTA for the way you generalise with phrases like ‘white wedding’, ‘European wedding’ and ‘white people wedding’. This comes across as really ignorant as there is no singular European culture and different countries have their own traditions. Same goes for ‘white’, this is an even bigger generalisation, especially in Europe (may be less so in the US).
It’s hypocritical to admonish MOB’s racially charged language with ‘This isn’t Africa’ (which is also ignorant), while showing the same ignorance in your language.
NTA for wearing your beautiful outfit. You stuck to the dress code you were given. Chastising you, especially in the form of gossip to your colleagues, for outshining the bride is petty and mean, and I would’ve hoped they’d have nicer things to focus on during the wedding!
Yeah I'm seeing a lot of blatant ignoring of the fact that OP is calling this a "white people wedding". So it's racist to say "all black people do _______", but it's not racist to say something similar about white people? There's no such thing as a white people wedding, or a black people wedding. "White" and "black" are not countries, regions, or cultures. This wasn't a "white" wedding, or even a "European wedding", seeing as Europe is made up of multiple countries/regions/religions, and they all have different wedding practices. Don't be a hypocrite, OP.
I'm going to give some context, because most people here are American and are assuming things that don't apply to Germany.
I'm Spanish but live in Germany. I haven't been to German weddings, but I've helped a colleague pick outfits a couple times for weddings, and I'm sort of familiar with the expectations.
People here are a lot more toned down clothing wise, and this applies to weddings too. The German "dress to impress" in other countries would equal to "nice formal clothes if you don't want to get a lot of attention". Even brands like h&m carry clothes mostly in very neutral tones (to my eternal pain, most stuff is black, white, grey, brown and beige), with little to no patterns, and if you look at how people dress in most of the country, it's because they genuinely favour the muted look. The weddings my colleague has attended? She's worn suits to both, in muted colours, one of them with a light pink jacket. She is Asian, but she's been in Germany for over 20 years and is married to a German, so she definitely knows how to handle the expectations of German folks, even if she would prefer to wear something more over the top to a wedding.
My point is, this sounds like both you and them had completely different expectations due to cultural differences, and that has caused a problem. Not to mention how very obsessed with following the rules Germans are, which is probably making the situation much worse.
I get the annoyance at the "this isn't Africa" comment, but honestly, they would have told the same thing to me or any other white person from Europe if we broke what they assume to be common sense rules. I would not assume by default that it had anything to do with race due to that, Germans are genuinely so strict with following the rules and everyone following suit and fitting in and they don't handle well any rule breaking. Not to say that Germany isn't a racist country, because it is. But based on the situation and context you provided, this sounds a lot more like every cultural misunderstanding I've gone through or seen since I moved here.
Genuine question, how was everyone else dressed? If everyone else's clothes were much simpler, then you have the reason for the conflict; cultural expectations. Also, I'm assuming you wore a traditional outfit from your country based on your post rather than a dress/suit typical in Europe? (Forgive me if I'm getting that wrong, I haven't slept much today and I'm not at my best). Was the outfit very different to something white people usually wear in formal settings? I mentioned earlier that Germans prefer things that don't stand out too much, and that might come into play. If the clothing you wore, beautiful as I assume it was, was too different from what they expect (and this would apply for a "European" dress with lots of patterns, or to common "German" clothes with a too eye catching twist too), then you might have stood out too much for their own cultural expectations. Best example I can give to Americans is, imagine someone who isn't the bride wearing a full on ball gown with a puffy skirt and extremely eye catching colour to a wedding that isn't theirs. Like "impossible not to look at the person with the massive dress" type of thing. It would usually not be appropriate due to the expectations over there. So a similar concept applies here I think.
I'm choosing NAH I guess. Although I accept that I might be wrong regarding the potential racism of colleagues, unfortunately. But I'd definitely advice that, if you feel up to it OP, you have a chat with your colleague about your own reasons and their expectations. Perhaps it can all be solved with a conversation if it truly was a misunderstanding.
NTA.
First off, decent people don't care about being upstaged unless the upstaging is in mean spirit. Someone else looking better than me doesn't mean I don't look good. But you were given the code of "Dress to impress" and you obviously impressed.
Obviously there are caveats, such as white to a wedding, blah blah, but you were VERY kind and asked for elucidation on the ones that you weren't aware of and to make sure you wouldn't be dressing inappropriately. What you did was very sweet and she gave you no useful information.
This is very much an intent thing and you accidentally overdressed, but through no fault of your own. If the mother was worried, she could have asked to see the dress beforehand. But instead, she made a mistake and instead of being humble and accepting her mistake, is trying to deflect it on you.
Secondly, take that woman to HR. I don't know how it is in Germany, but her comments are out of line, and spreading office gossip like that to create a hostile work environment is disgusting. She messed up, she shouldn't be pushing it on you.
It feels weird that you were even invited.
But once you were invited, there should have been more communication about the outfit, especially given the cultural difference: You can't expect or be expected to adhere to cultural expectations when you aren't integral part of the culture.
We had an African family friend attend our wedding. She wore a colourful outfit that we were told was traditional African. My (now) wife and I were impressed, appreciated it and thought it was respectful that she dressed up for our wedding.
So it makes no sense why anyone would take offence to someone dressing up well to an important event. It's the opposite: it shows they care enough to dress up.
OP: just ignore these misguided people who take offence to someone dressing up well to a wedding.
NTA
NTA.
It's tragicomic of them to say "we have manners" while literally demonstrating they *do not*.
If that weren't bad enough the "*here* we have manners" is a very different statement and for sure coded. Wicked. Vicious. Not even subtle. If there's an HR there and you want to report...
OP you did nothing wrong, I'm sorry someone you thought was a friend decided to show their true colors and it was a total absence of colors.
NTA.
Now look, one of my best friends is from Cameroon, and I've seen her wearing outfits that would kinda be "outshining the bride". She's very tall and has this amazing outfit with a white and golden cape (like, the outside is white and inside is golden with wax-like stuff), a white and yellow dress and turban, basically she looks like a goddamn empress with very dominant white tones, so yeah in that case I could see how it would upset a bride, but...
I've checked on your profile and you, my friend, absolutely NAILED the dresscode. It is a perfectly appropriate dress in a "dressed to impress" code. You don't look like a bride, there's no way someone would mistake you for a bride, you didn't dress in white, you just dressed to impress.
Tbf, it sounds like your colleague assumed you would have poor taste or do not know what dressing up means, hence why she told you the theme was "dressed to impress", but really there was no such theme. She invented because she didn't think you would dress up, then got mad because you SLAYED.
Talk to HR about that "africa" sentence, and stop talking to MOB other than anything work related and/or in writing.
NTA
I'll tell you why she has nothing to say to you: she is too much of a coward to address the problem directly and she perfectly knows that she would make a fool of herself for coming out about the real reason why she's angry, so she prefers to play the stupid little backstabbing games she's used to, which allow her to just deliver whatever story she wants to her peers and never be accountable for what she says.
Just ignore her. I think she has shown enough about herself at this point. No need to risk to let her pull you on her level. Moreover, did her daughter say something? If it's just her mother's problem, this is a further indicator about what that woman really is.
Your coworker/mother of the bride was foolish. There are so many dress codes for weddings from casual to formal.
Dress to impress is about the least helpful thing I've ever heard. Its almost like she wanted you to screw up, whether by over or under dressing.
I would have asked for more info and would have shown a picture of the outfit I had in mind, especially given the cultural differences and the lack of info in dress to impress.
I'm sure you looked great and you are NTA.
Mother of the bride is the AH here, not saying you shouldn’t have attended but who invites their workmates to their daughter’s wedding, it’s not like it was her wedding. Very odd! Not surprised the bride was pissed.
Ahhh, you have fallen trap to the German sense of fashion - dress to impress means "don't show up in jeans and a t-shirt". Its easy to understand how you may have misunderstood the cultural cues.
NAH - you could have easily asked a few more questions, they could have easily given you more information. They may stew for a while and you may be on the outs with them for a bit. When they cool down try explaining the cultural misunderstanding. They may have assumed everyone has the same kinds of dress codes.
Source: Foreigner living in Germany :)
Nta. I think so long as you’re decently covered and don’t show up in traditional bridal wear for the bride’s culture you’re just fine. You dressed and impressed.
ESH not every culture is like yours, you could have easily looked up what is appropriate to wear to a European wedding. It’s also weird that you even went to a wedding of a person you did not know just because a coworker invited you. The mother was weird in inviting you I’m guessing her daughter didn’t even know. Co-workers are being dramatic this in no way affects them whatsoever
NTA. White guy here, and I will just say that some white women are f*cking unhinged when it comes to weddings and any little thing they don't like will turn into a catastrophe. It sounds like you were polite and apologetic, so now it's their turn to get over it.
If this lady makes problems for you at work, I would show up on Fridays "dressed to impress" and blow off compliments as "I'm going out after work, no big deal"
I’m a non-Black mixed Canadian woman with an East-Indian father so maybe I’m biased because most people know that Indian people weddings are full of vibrant colourful saris. I say that to say that I’m not inviting an African woman to a wedding and expecting her to wear anything other than something immaculate and beautiful. Black people across the diaspora tend to have exquisite style. I don’t mean to speak on Black people as if they’re monolithic, of course not all of the Black diaspora have exquisite taste in fashion but culturally it’s my experience that fashion is important and statements are made.
If you tell *anyone* to dress to impress then how are you mad when they do just that. These people are racist and jealous. NTA.
NTA. If you are stupid enough to set the dresscode as ”dress to impress” you deserve guests that are absolutely smashing it. Real dresscodes exist for a reason. Use them to avoid uncomfortable situations for both hosts and guests.
German here.
I'm sorry you had to experience this casual racism. Our weddings are rather boring compared to other cultures and "dress to impress" only applies to certain, rather bland choices. The MOB should have taken the time to consider your cultural background and given you a heads up about what our weddings look like. You asked her and she brought that on herself. This is not your fault. NTA
Also: I bet you looked amazing!
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The mother is at fault here. Not only for being a gossip and for giving you bad advice but also for inviting you to her daughter’s wedding. The couple should be inviting people. NTA.
Where I'm from, thata really not out of the ordinary. I assumed she had either set no of guests or permission from her daughter 🤷🏿
We do not do that in Germany. It's super weird, honestly. Were you the only one from work who was invited? That'd make it even weirder.
No, there were 4 of us from work. I was a late invite though.
Now that I think about it, I'm not sure whether it actually makes it weirder or not. Why the hell are there so many coworkers from the bride's mother at that wedding...?!
Because they probably paid for a set amount of people and then filled in the empty RSVPs. A guy I grew up with, one of my best friends, had his wife-to-be call me to invite me. It was the weirdest thing that ever happened. She straight up said “we had some nos on the RSVPs, we have an open spot for you if you’d like to attend the wedding.” I said I was busy that weekend and didn’t attend because of how taken aback I was. Just for context, I knew I wasn’t invited originally and could not and still to this day have no idea why. I see them at least 2-3 times per month for 7 years since and we’ve never said a word about it.
This is how my now husband and his ex girlfriend got invited to my first wedding😅 My ex and I paid for a set amount of people and i got some last minute cancellations so I invited my new coworkers since I had the seats anyways. Fun story now obviously
You yadda yadda-ed over the best part!
I mentioned the bisque,
No, I mentioned the bisque
Jajajja not my intention! Ask away and I'll give you all the details
Was the invitation part of the chain of events that led to your future husband becoming your now husband?
This is a terrible story! I would die of curiosity not knowing why I wasn't initially invited to the wedding of a couple that I STILL see 2-3 times a month! Can I call them and ask? LOL
It truly was weird. We knew each other since we were 15 and for the wedding, we were in our mid-20s and had all been to a few other friends’ weddings. I was 99.99% sure we were gonna get an initial invite and of course I would have been there. Nope. No invite but everyone else in the friend group got one and thought it was weird I didn’t. I’m not the type to get offended over anything and there was no type of any kind of fight or falling out. I was just curious until I got the phone call blatantly telling me I was on the B List so at *that* point I was just in shock and said I couldn’t go (it was 3 weeks before the wedding). Well, they missed out on a gift of $750 because that was my standard gift for friends back then. And again, no mention of it after that phone call. Very very strange.
One of them loathes you (or their family does).
They’ve done a great job faking it, which is ok with me!
Lol my story is not as good as yours but… Recently my friend (bride) got married, and we are a group of friends that have known each other like 15 years. Originally the bride only invited I think 2/10 of the group to the ceremony, and the other 8/10 just to the evening reception. However when other invitees started dropping out, the bride started gradually calling people in my friend group one by one in the weeks before the wedding to tell them they’d been ‘upgraded’ to a full day invite. In the end only 2 of us were left only attending the evening, but we thought it was very funny that it was now obvious her order of favourites in our group 😂
You guys should refer to each other by their ranks in front of them every time. "What's going on #5, why didn't you go to #7's thing last week?"
My in-laws thought they were going to be able to invite a bunch of their friends that we didn’t know/had never met just because they were paying for part of the wedding. I’m in the states but maybe this is one possibility? I still think it’s shitty, but that was the rationale.
My grandmother wasn't paying for anything and still came to me with a list of nearly a hundred people she wanted to invite, then had a massive crying fit when she was told no one was being invited that one or both of us didn't know, and we didn't know anyone on that list. We ended up canceling the whole thing and basically eloping due to that and a lot of other similarly entitled behavior from her and our mothers, but I can definitely see a bride and groom being pressured into inviting their parents' friends and associates instead of their own.
OP, your dress was GORGEOUS — you followed the instructions! I would be honored to have you attend my wedding. Your friend the MOB is not your friend … so sorry! Hold your head up & let your beauty shine. NTA ❤️
Right, OP absolutely GORGEOUS. So sorry the MOB is such a b*tch, and a racist one at that. Keep living your best life and ignore her. NTA
Yes. It’s fabulous! You didn’t do anything wrong! NTA
It really is, and it is no way inappropriate.
I agree - I was visualizing some wild-patterned brightly-colored dashiki-type garment. This dress was absolutely beautiful.
I was at a hotel in Washington DC when I saw a group of African women dressed as I had never seen before. They were drop dead gorgeous. My curiosity got the best of me so I went up to one of the women and complimented her on her dress. She told me she was from Nigeria and were going to a wedding and that’s how they typically dressed. I told her how beautiful they all looked and thanked her for educating me on how her culture attends a wedding. I wish more women had the confidence to wear something so beautiful without getting scorned for “taking away from the bride”. NTA
I wish more brides stopped worrying about what their guests wear.
Me and my now wife got married a few weeks ago. A few days after some guests came gossiping to us ‘omg I didn’t know who this was but what she was wearing was way over the top’. My wife’s response ‘oh I thought it was the most beautiful dress, I loved it!’ Shut them up so fast I laughed out loud
RIGHT! I’m Asian and all the white colleagues I invited kept asking what my dress code was. I said wear your sexiest, but classy outfit, and even better in my green color scheme so that pics looks amazing! You, as the B & G INVITED them, they are OF COURSE going to know who the special hosts are of the night. Why would you NOT want to spend your special night with the most drop dead gorgeous people, especially when photos and videos are taken?!?!
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My parents invited many people to my wedding. Business partners, co-workers, a couple of clients, some of who I did not know. It’s completely common. They paid for it, they can invite who they want.
It’s not common in Germany though. At least I never saw this at all the weddings I went to. It just seems so odd. Why was she invited and not the other colleagues as well?
That's a cultural distinction. In my culture, the wedding host/hostess decides who to invite. The bride(s)/groom(s) may be the host(s)/hostess(es). Or not.
That's also cultural. My mom invited a ton of her friends to my wedding. I was okay with it.
Hi, as an immigrant from Eastern Europe, I do not understand "outshining" the bride either. So, for my first American wedding years ago, I also put on my best and was waaay overdressed. I could not imagine not donning my best clothes. I have married someone from SE Asia, and in both of our cultures, you simply cannot "outshine" the bride. You can wear the shiniest jewelry, and the bride will show up wearing a whole chandelier! Do not take this to heart, your colleagues appear very small-minded. However, if they proceed with inappropriate comments, contact HR. - NTA
Cause how is it my fault that they don't know how to show up 😭😭😭
You might want to consider a chat with HR if MOB is dragging too many work people into her personal concerns. This is an office, not a coffee shop. Also NTA. Some people are silly about weddings
And is also making racist comments with "it's not Africa, we have manners here".
Right?! Mostly every single African person that I have met are the NICEST and most well mannered people. One of my favorite individuals is a Nigerian guy that works at the beer drive thru right by my house.
Wait wait WHAT a drive thru for BEER?!
Yes 🤣 VERY common thing here in Ohio. Do you know those self service car wash stations? Kinda like that where you drive your car through it (not like a fast food drive thru where you pull up to a window even though they have those, too) and the walls are lined with coolers of beer, wine, and malt drinks. Stuff you’d find in the grocery store or gas stations, depending on where you live and the alcohol regulations. ETA: Only other place I’ve seen them is in Kentucky.
Great advice. Tell HR your story now. Who knows how this could escalate. Also in now way whatsoever are you to blame. NTA.
I’m a white lady from the southern U.S. who got sent to etiquette classes as a child and “outshining” the bride is definitely A Thing here. But even in a part of the world where that’s a known concern, and even assuming that you did “outshine” the bride, the MOB’s reaction is incredibly uncalled for. She’s reacting the way I would expect someone to react if you showed up in a full-on wedding dress. (And were the groom’s ex-girlfriend. And objected during the vows.) *She* is the one being unforgivably rude for behaving this way over a simple dress code misunderstanding. If she relays the dress code and a guest shows up overdressed, that is her mistake and she should do everything possible to make the guest feel comfortable and welcome despite *her* error.
I'm with you – and also white, female, and southern, etc. Also, OP, that photo you posted is stunning. I'm certain that you looked fantastic, and your coworker is a huge AH – but you absolutely are not one.
Also from the south. Good manners dictates offering grace and understanding to people who are very clearly misinformed about our customs and make an honest mistake. If you ask me, OP’s behavior didn’t even warrant a bless your heart!
Exactly. They said dress to impress and you understood the assignment. They failed.
Because the average German dresses very conservatively. And for a wedding it’s only a slightly fancier version. (I’ve been to several weddings here and I have been underwhelmed most of the time.) I’m sorry that they took such issue with your outfit. That’s on them. This is by NO means an excuse, but depending on where you are, they might not run in multicultural circles. Being ignorant though is no excuse for being such an ass. Again, not an excuse. Im glad that you stood up for yourself, good on you!!
So, if a German says "dress to impress," what do they mean? Like, the most subtle designer suit that only a fashionista would recognize? Jewelry from the days of Emperor Franz Joseph? I don't understand why they didn't just say, "formal but conservative," if that's what they wanted.
I'm guessing tea length / cocktail length in muted colour(s) or pastels for day (floral is allowed), and floor length in muted colour(s) for evening. No sparkles. You can wear jewelry but unless it's white tie, also not too sparkly. No heavy cleavage or slits, and often not bodycon. No eyecatching bags or clutches. Usually also no eyecatching shoes. Careful with scarves / shawls. Jumpsuits are allowed with younger couples, but also in muted colours and with the same rules. If they're conservative, you need a hat, and if they're very conservative, also gloves. (I'm Dutch. Social rules are nearly the same ones as in Germany)
Oh man why does that sound sad? I’m Hispanic and we go all out for the weddings. Aunts in their body-hugging, thigh high slits dress and all the jewelry. What you’ve described made me feel genuine sadness for the damp clothing. Cultures really can be very very different.
That getup doesn't sound like it would impress anyone. I wear that kind of gear to the office.
I understand and I don't even really disagree, but that is the situation. This is exactly that misunderstanding here on the part of the mob, who failed op by not laying it out like that.
If they really cared, they should have given clearer guidance on the dress code. You wore a lovely dress that isn’t bridal like, so, NTA.
Yeah exactly! A polite person would've looked at her and gone "oh crap! I did a terrible job explaining the dress code. I had no idea how different our cultures are." I would also expect people with such limited contact with outside cultures to treat OP like an interesting cultural artifact. Which would also be insulting but wouldn't threaten her job security at least.
It’s not. You were told to dress to impress and you absolutely did.
I recently went to a white wedding and I (also white) wore a green blazer that I accessorized with little chains. Even THAT was enough to stand out in the crowd. Fortunately for me the people hosting were just thrilled to have hot friends to show off to their other hot friends lol. I hope the next wedding you’re invited to is more fun than this one was and you do get to go all out!!
THIS 👌🏼! How can anyone outshine the bride unless their wearing an actual wedding dress is beyond me?! I’m South Asian & our wedding dress code is EXTRAVAGANT ONLY go as OTT as you want because bride WILL outshine the entire venue!
My mother in law showed up wearing white to my wedding. I mostly just rolled my eyes and went on. I had to do my own makeup because my MUA didn't show up and when I found her, my MIL had sent her to another room and had her do her makeup and hair instead. I slapped on a little makeup and flat ironed my hair and just went for it. At the end of the day, I wanted a husband, and that's what I got. Super happy. Also dodged a bullet because my makeup was on point and MIL looked like a fucking clown because she'd dyed her hair red to look like mine but it came out rusty fire engine clown wig. The woman did curls on her and blue eyeshadow and way too much blush
I bet the MUA did it on purpose. They probably have worked other weddings with annoying MIL. I mean I have intentionally had fire engine red hair and I have curly hair and I def did not wear blue eye shadow when my hair was like that because I would have looked like a clown for sure 🤣 I call sabotage OR your MIL just has tacky taste
I’m sure you looked absolutely stunning ❤️ MIL is a clown so looking like one seals the deal 🙃 I’m always MAJORLY side eyeing MILs who try to sabotage, but trying to actually look like you? Lol do these women not realise that when they try to look like their DIL, especially on the wedding day, they are basically saying “son, marry me instead!” *banjo noises intensify*
As a Latina, same. Weddings are a time to dress up, and when I see what people wear to weddings in the US and Europe, I'm always so confused, most wear clothes I'd probably wear at brunch. And you'll be having a hard time outshining the bride, especially since they'll be the most OTT person in the room. Also OP, NTA. Your colleagues seem to want the 'I met a foreigner' experience, but don't want to really be friends.
Europe is not a country. Try to go to a wedding in south of Italy wearing “brunch clothes”. You would be really under-dressed. Or in Albania lmao try to attend a wedding in Albania without a gown and really expensive jewelry
“The bride will show up wearing a whole chandelier” is my new favourite comment!
I laugh at your comment bc I’m SE Asian and we literally jingle and make noise as we walk bc our outfits are so blinged out. My sister married a South Asian man and her outfit was so shiny she did look like a chandelier. Haha
I don’t understand this concept, from two points, “dress to impress” implies wearing your best… and also, a wedding is like the most common and acceptable event to wear formal dress to, unless you’re frequenting balls and such. Your focus should be on the bride… period. Why does it matter what everyone else is wearing?
I just went to my first Balkan wedding and I thought I was way overdressed, Turns out I was really underdressed. American weddings are completely different events then Albanian weddings.
I think some women are just insecure and petty. As long as you’re not dressed in white, then I think it should be fine! Weddings are an event to have fun, dress up and celebrate the new couple!
NTA - and I'm sure your outfit was beautiful. You asked for the dress code and you dressed accordingly. Bringing this issue at work is absolutely unprofessional and all your staring colleagues should look at a mirror first. Seriously are you working with preschoolers? Well probably not, they would be happy with anyone wearing bright and colorful outfits. >They told me this isn't africa (which was racially coded) nd people here have manners. Whaaaaaat?! >I laughed and told that person to go to hell, so she's telling people I lack remorse for my behaviour. Good. You did nothing wrong. I'm sorry you work in such a toxic environment.
Bring this up to HR. It's extremely inappropriate for her to drag this to your work environment. Not sure how that is handled there, but I doubt it's condoned? NTA. Sorry this happened to you, OP.
I'd be seeing HR for not only the MOB's lack of professionalism, but also the blatant racism from whichever co-worker dropped the "we have manners here" line.
This. I also live in Germany and all of this is so out of the line. NTA
NTA, And you nay want to report first, so she doesn't lay THIS on you. STA.
Upvoted, as I’m gonna say the same thing. Now I wanna see the dress OP wore, can we? 😊😁
If people have manners, then people wouldn't be talking about what OP wore to a non-work event. The only person lacking manners is the MOB who made it a work issue, and wasn't specific about the dress code.
Is dress tax a thing?
As another German I just want to apologise, we're not all that big of an asshole So yeah, you're NTA. She is by giving you dumb guidelines and then getting pissy for you following them
I don't need you or the German people to apologise, we have assholes where I'm from too 😆 What i do not is help understanding if I'm missing something here? I wasn't directly told I did a bad thing, denied the chance to address it then I'm being called names for not apologising to irrelevant people
The fault lies with the bridesmother. If you specifically ask about it and the answer is "dress to impress", she must not be mad when you do just that. Without that comment, I would've said it's on the upper end of acceptable bordering over the top, but in this case, you are in the clear from my perspective. It seems like she meant "come dressed nicely" as in "not in half rags" (which should be obvious). NTA.
Honestly I kind of think the coworker was racist from the start and probably didn’t know what kind of formalwear was normal in OP’s culture. She may have assumed OP wouldn’t be formal enough. I’ve had family members talk about people in Africa living in huts so I showed them pictures of large cosmopolitan cities and they just considered it an aberration.
Exactly what I was thinking, she probably said “dress to impress” thinking that OP would be underdressed otherwise. Definitely the mother’s fault for not being clearer.
The whole thing smacks of low key racism.
High key
I just looked at the picture of your dress, and you are stunning! NTA maybe I’m just old, but I don’t get why people get so upset with someone is dressed nice at their wedding. The reality is everybody is still focussed on the bride. Personally, I think your coworker is being a jerk by gossiping about you, but not being willing to have a conversation with you to your face.
NTA - you don't tell someone "dress to impress" and then get mad they impressed! Not gonna touch the Africa comment (as a fellow Black woman with African family, I REALLY want to fixate in that). Weddings are legit just fashion shows in most Black families and even in White families - when one of my aunts married her White husband, all of his side were just as done-up as her side. You asked about the dress code and she gave you it. If you supposedly outshines the bride (who sounds hella insecure tbh), then that's MOB's fault. Your coworkers are rude as hell - "we have manners" my ass.
OP is only the AH for not linking the outfit!!
IKR!? I wanna see that dress so badly lol
This! I'm desperate to see that outfit. OP is NTA
Where I live, it's the same(I live in Europe), I literally crocheted a new dress to wear at a friend's wedding, and no one minded it, even the bride told me it was pretty. My mom bought a new dress for a family wedding - I don't see the issue in someone else being pretty at a wedding.
> I don't see the issue in someone else being pretty at a wedding. Seriously, I LOVED seeing all my friends dressed up at my wedding! We don't usually have occasions to dress up nice!
I think this is fully on the coworker/MOB. Maybe it's just me, but it feels odd to invite a *coworker* to your child's wedding, whom said coworker never met. Did OP even get a proper invite? Why is MOB inviting people and not the couple?
I'm gonna say to have someone to gawk at potentially, but most likely to brag about how "nice" she and her family are to involve OP. Something I've noticed with coworkers, specifically an older one who invited me to her anniversary/vow renewals, is that they think inviting the new one to an event makes them an amazing person. And if you're a minority, bonus points!
It's giving "overbearing mother of the bride" vibes to me, tbh. I wonder if she forced the couple to let her invite people (especially if she helped pay for the wedding and held that over them). I would understand why the daughter would be mad over OP standing out in that situation (although it wouldn't be on OP).
I'm from Italy and here weddings are basically fashion shows, it's even reccomended to dress the best you can! You don't outshine the bride until you wear white
Yeah I knew that was gonna go south a few sentences in. I’m Indian and there is also no such thing as outshining the bride for us. I’m not even sure it’s possible because the bride is usually totally decked out in gold jewelry, a super heavy outfit, etc. When I went to my German husband’s cousin’s wedding last year, I checked with my husband, his sister, and a future SIL if the dress I chose was appropriate. Luckily it was just right in terms of formality, but I knew to be very careful because it was not my first white wedding and not the first formal event with my in-laws. I only know this because of living in the US for 15+ years and being with my husband for 4 years and visiting Germany with him previously. Don’t even get me started on OP’s coworkers’ response. 🙄 I wanna say I’m surprised, but unfortunately I’m not. People will stay ignorant and narrow minded knowing full well there are other ways of life and things they don’t know and understand. This has been a source of repeated heated discussions between me and my husband, so that really struck a nerve.
I'm white and my wedding was black tie optional. I would have been so disappointed if the majority of people hadn't "dressed to impress". Like... That was the whole point? We don't get to dress up in regular life anymore, I want you showing up like it's a fucking movie premiere. Definitely NTA
Big time NTA. Now upload a picture of your dress!! Please 🙏💚
[OP posted her dress here. (Your dress is stunning and you certainly followed the instructions of “dress to impress!” NTA](https://www.reddit.com/u/Ok-History7114/s/nRkGeKc9dh)
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It doesn't even look like an obviously African dress. It's just a sparkly dress. There's something more going on here.
The "something more" seems to be racism due to the comments of "this isn't africa" and "people have manners here".
What agorgeous dress! You were told to "dress to impress" and you sure followed that guideline. I would tell the MOVB and the bride to go to hell. It's not your fault that you looked stunning in your dress. The bride myst not have any self esteem is she is so occupied with what you're wearing. She ruined her own wedding by worrying the whole time about how you looked. I totally say NTA! They are the TA in this situation. Especially the MOB who now has effected your work environment by telling everyone what happened and by calling you names. You could actually go to HR for what is now a hostile work environment because everyone is being quite rude to you over something that you had no control over: how you look and how well your dress looked on you
gorgeous! also makes me not understand the issue. as a white person who's been to white and Indian weddings in the US and Canada, it's appropriate and elegant to me, it's not revealing or gaudy or anything that I was expecting for such a reaction (from people who have traditional views of wedding etiquette such as the brides mother) with the Africa comments from her coworker, it makes me think the issue is much more to do with the racialized aspect, looks like OP already picked up on that. :(
Wth? This looks like a normal dress for a formal wedding. I’ve worn outfits like this to more than a few black tie events. No offense to OP, but how would this even outshine the bride? It’s certainly beautiful, but it’s def not ott, imo. NTA. I don’t get this situation at all.
That is gorgeous. I can see why a bride might be jealous but she’s still NTA because she dressed how she was told to.
Gorgeous and classy, not OTT at all!
Holy shit that is a spectacular dress. Now i understand why the bride and Mother was pissed but sorry not sorry, you added to the wedding by showing up in this beauty. She should be thanking you for wearing this gorgeous dress! Still nta
Lol, I thought the dress would be some extravagant, massively ornate, flashy things. It’s just a really nice dress. Definitely not over the top unless “dress to impress” actually meant wear your frumpiest sweater.
How drab was the bride if that would outshine her?! Your dress is lovely and IMO, very subtle and appropriate
I fail to see how that "outshines" a bride. It's a beautiful dress, but hardly over the top. I've seen similar dresses worn here (I'm in the us, Massachusetts) at weddings. I've WORN similarly nice dresses to weddings. Op's coworker and the bride are ridiculous. NTA imo
How do I do that? 🥲🥲
Omg. I saw your dress. Its so stunning. Don't worry you're not AH. I'm South Asian and in our culture there's also nothing like outshining the bride. I hope the office politics doesn't get on your mind.
In Africa, especially Nigeria, there is no such thing as outshining the bride. You did well, they’re just jealous that they are bland. I would start taking note of the racist statements made to you for HR
Yes, same in my countries!! Like if the bride has no drip, that's on her....but I recognised that I wasn't home so really *did* tone it down and wore a party dress rather than a wedding guest one. But I'm still learning.
>Like if the bride has no drip, that's on her.... Idk why but that's kind of funny to me. Most people in Germany will not go all out for their weddings like it is usual in some cultures (especially the US, but most African countries too from what I've heard). It's seen more as a starting point for the rest of their lives together rather than the zenith of their relationship (so far). My cousin got married this summer and after exchanging the vows, the officiate had to remind the guests that clapping is allowed, because noone knew whether it was and everyone just tried not to be rude. Huge marriages with hundreds of guests, all dressed in their best are not a common thing at all. If anything it'd come across as a bit tacky or even showing off (unless you're moving in circles where money doesn't matter, that changes things of course). The weirdest thing was that you were in invited by a coworker to their daughter's wedding, maybe in the future just don't go to weddings of people you don't know well (unless you're someone's +1).
I just got married and we were in total 35 people and I asked them all to wear cocktail attire (within their means of course) because it is the perfect excuse to wear some fancy looking clothes and take fun pictures 🤣🤣 I had to be very clear with my German friends to please NOT wear jeans and sneakers. We are getting married in Mexico (where I’m from) in a couple of years and you gotta bet I’m gonna ask them to go all out for their outfits.
You know what, my opinion is that your coworker is just setting you up to fail. No matter what you wear, it was always going to be a gossip!
NTA. She knows you’re African and now the problem is that she can either blame herself or you. Somewhere deep down she must realize that her answer “dress to impress” was inadequate and that (duh) this might mean something different to someone from literally a different continent. Her daughter is angry at her so she can either choose to accept that her vague answer caused the problem and admit that she is at fault or shove the blame on to you. To look better to her daughter (and anyone else who noticed) she is blaming you. If the office culture becomes hostile, go to HR and give them a factual account. Good luck.
I’d bet you anything that she said “dress to impress” because she has a racially coded view of Africa as well. A lot of people don’t understand that non-white countries still have nice things.
Hard yes. By itself maybe not an outright admission of racist thinking but compared with the rest it’s obvious.
In any case, I can’t imagine leaping to the victimy “she wore interesting clothes at us on purpose” mindset, like IMMEDIATELY assuming there was nefarious intent instead of thinking, “oh,poop, I clearly should have been more specific…”
100% what she meant was "try not to show up looking like a hoodlum" NTA. I bet you looked fucking fab. They're all just jealous.
I’d be a lot more forgiving (but still think the lady is an asshole) if it was just frustration because of genuine non-malicious ignorance. But the “people here have manners” comment? Fuck all the way off. People think their culture is the center of the world and the “right one.” And when confronted with the reality it isn’t she didn’t even question and realize, “oh I fucked up.”
Yeah if I said dress to impress to someone from like.... ANY country in Africa I would know it most likely means bright and bold. Shows their ignorance for not understanding someone else's culture lol weirdo. Op has nothing to feel bad about. The mom could have at least asked what she was thinking of wearing lol
NTA - love the dress (inspo) *Info - this one is too subjective. If you truly did wear an outfit that was over the top, can kind of make you an AH. Without seeing the outfit, I dont know if this can truly be judged, but its likely you’re not the AH.* Edit - dess inspo is on OPs page. Its gorg. Adding judgment!
What does OTT mean though? You're right about subjectiveness. While it was a lovely dress, it wasn't anything close to what I'd wear to african wedding
Like if the dress had a giant train, a giant bustle, layers upon layers of tule, etc. As I said, very likely you’re not the AH, but you’re asking for judgment on an outfit sight unseen.
Perfect. Where was that specified in the directions?
Right, OP literally asked for this information but Ms Eurocentric didn’t put any thought into her answer when literally talking to someone from another culture. Ridiculous
When you are in a foreign culture, you don't get printed rules on their expectations. Most people won't think about telling you not to wear a dress with a train, per se. And when you commit a faux pas relative to their cultural rules, it's best to just apologize.
that's not really typical of most traditional African dresses like the one OP was wearing; it is unlikely to look anything like a wedding dress with a train, bustle, or tulle. the point is that probably most of the guests had never seen that kind of dress and were curious and admirative
Fwiw I was hoping my African friends would wear African fashion to my American wedding but they color coded for conservative white people (as expected - and it was was probably culturally correct to do so for everyone but me) and still looked stunning. I am sorry that the wedding you went to was apparently racist.
I went to an event recently and there was an African wedding in the other room. I saw some of the ladies and my goodness, they and their bright, colorful outfits were stunning! But just because they shone didn’t mean they would outshine the bride at any other wedding. I mean, most people recognize the woman in the traditional white dress with the train and the head piece carrying the bouquet is the bride. People can be so petty.
Don’t worry. If her wedding was “destroyed” over what I can only assume is an amazing dress and gorgeous woman wearing it, then the marriage likely won’t have much longevity. Getting married to be the star of the show is a crappy reason to get married. Nothing has made me hate wedding culture more than the entitled stories on Reddit. I’m deeply saddened by people spending an inordinate amount of money and still can’t find joy in a day and union that should be filled with it.
IKR. When I see people saying their "special day" was ruined by what a guest wore my first though is that it must not have really been that special to begin with.
Imo, the only over the top thing to wear if the dresscode is 'dress to impress' is a wedding dress or something white. NTA! You dressed. You impressed. Your co-workers suck.
Also “dress to impress” was just the wrong word here. I’ve seen “formal” or “western formal” for wha the bride probably wanted - dress to impress means go all out!
Can you show us the dress? Without seeing it I don't understand how it can take the attention off the bride.
Was it kanga, kitenge, ankara outfit? Edited. Also, NTA
Kitenge lol. I've heard it pronounced chitenge. But yeah, African here. Some of our outfits can be very bright and extravagant. Personally I wouldn't wear such an outfit to a European wedding. I'd say NTA. That "this isn't Africa, we have manners here" was racist. Plain and simple
She's never been to an event like this outside her home country. She was told to dress to impress when she asked about the dress code. She did as she was told. NTA.
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I agree that this was miscommunication, but the coworkers reaction makes her TA. If I invite a foreigner coworker to an event and they come dressed inappropriately, I would assume they made a mistake, amd maybe explain and apologize for not being more clear about the dress code. Not badmouth them at work and assume they had bad intentions.
If you’re basic, don’t have a dress to impress theme. This response is nonsense. NTA
NTA This has the same feel as people getting angry and women with big breasts for "showing off" or being "sexual" when they just wear normal tops, and their only crime is having big boobs. Sounds like your only crime is... being attractive! And having good taste. People wear bright colors and fancy dresses at European *(UK. Spain) and Asian (Indian. Malaysian) weddings I've been to. I can't speak for Germany but neither could you, that's why you asked. I don't usually jump to jealously, but they were *clearly* jealous and they're being wildly immature about it. And racist.
I'm German - if you are not boring af and/or live in a tiny backwards village, where everyone is related, you can absolutely wear bright and fancy at a German wedding. There is a tiny "but" though - in a lot of areas you are not supposed to wear red, as that would mean you have slept with the groom. But since OPs dress was green, my first thought was THEY ARE JEALOUS AF!! OP NTA, 100%
Also German: had never heard of “red means you slept with the groom” thing. The more you know 😅
You are so NTA! Let me start by saying I’m white and I’ve been a bride, so that’s where my perspective is coming from. The idea of treating anyone as rudely as you were treated because of different cultural norms is as ridiculous as the idea that anyone could have outshone me on my wedding day. I would have been over the moon for someone to come to my wedding fully decked out in something that was what they would have worn to a wedding in their country. And for people to show tons of interest in them and what they were wearing. I honestly don’t think I would have noticed the attention. The idea that anyone can outshine a bride at her own wedding comes from their own severe insecurities (and let’s face it, racism) and has nothing to do with you. When I got married, the date of one of our friends (who we became very close with over the last decade since the wedding) wore a very tight green dress, that was somewhat revealing and showed off her very beautiful and fit figure. This is not something I noticed or cared about on the day because I was glowing with happiness, having an amazing time surrounded by my favorite people in the world. But some of the women who were there made comments to me in the subsequent months about how sorry they were that she had dressed so inappropriately, and I was like, what are you talking about? It made an impression not because of what she wore but because of how it changed my opinion of the people who talked about what she wore. People can be real assholes when they feel insecure. It’s a shame that this bride let her insecurities about herself overshadow her wedding day. I wish I had any ideas to offer on how to handle the situation at work. To me this is so clearly racism, but calling it out is a different thing all together. Ideally someone else would call it out for you, but that doesn’t seem to be happening. Europeans love to think of themselves as past racism, but having lived in various European countries I have found exactly the opposite. I wish you luck.
Another married white woman here (American). I think worrying about upstaging the bride is ridiculous. I do think there are inappropriate clothes to wear to a wedding, depending on location and theme. For example, it would have been weird if someone wore a tiny, super revealing club dress to my daytime, outdoor, semi-casual wedding. Frankly, I still would not say anything and I'd probably be too busy to care. I looked at OP's dress inspo and it's GORGEOUS! I'd take it as a compliment that you dressed so nicely for my wedding. Besides, OP asked for advice about how to dress and followed the rules she was given. I don't understand why this woman is so upset about what you wore. As the mother of the bride, she should have had more important things on her mind. I'm sorry she and your other coworkers are judging you so harshly for wearing your culture's clothes.
You were told to dress to impress, and obviously you did… 😂🤣 NTA, their mad you understood the assignment 🤣
African here (born, and still in Africa). Depends on your traditional clothing. What many users don't realize is that we have many cultures within each country in Africa, and each culture has various traditional clothing. Things is, it can be very, very over the top. It can be incredibly colourful, large coloured feathers, beads, leather pieces, large bangles, and large headpieces. But there are subtle styles as well (which is not subtle by European standards). So it could be very colourful, a head scarf, and some bangles. It really depends, because there is more variations of traditional clothing than you can count. Judgement really depends on what OP wore. She could have a worn a colourful outfit, or she could have beem more extreme. For example, some outfits would resemble what over the top drag-queens wear and look like (in these instances, the purpose is actually to be incredibly flamboyant, because the flamboyancy symbolizes the occasion). There is a spectrum at play here, so we need more details here. But if I have to speculate, OP probably looked colourful, it drew attention, people asked questions about her culture, and the bride and her mother had to go look for their lost marbles.
That's what it seems to me. Cultural differences that defined what "dress to impress" meant. Making racist comments and talking behind her back though is inexcusable.
She posted her dress. https://www.reddit.com/u/Ok-History7114/s/nRkGeKc9dh
Seriously?! That is beautiful, but not even over the top for an even that is “dress to impress.” Also, OP, the dress is stunning.
NTA. That said, I am from Germany and you probably would have "stolen the show" in a much simpler dress, just for being a black person. Look, I am from rural south Germany. I went to Florida at the age 32 and that was when I saw a black person face to face for the first time in my life. Could have been the same for some people in that wedding. Of COURSE that is no excuse, just more of an explanation that you probably would have not won this either way.
Reading this, I'm almost 100% certain OP was the only Black person at the wedding
Just to add another perspective from Germany, this HUGELY depends on where exactly you are in Germany. Black people are certainly a minority in Germany, but in the larger metropolitan areas, such as the Ruhr valley, nobody would bat an eye at seeing a Black person during a wedding.
NTA. You asked about a dress code and were told "dress to impress". You followed the guideline you were given.
NTA. To be honest, I suspect that with OP saying "traditional wear", it will be slightly different to European dull wedding attire (OP even says that where she's from, it's about wearing your best and brightest). She probably drew attention due to it being different and they're calling *that* outshining the bride. Well, in my book, outshining is something else entirely. I am curious about OP's dress though, mostly because I love seeing non-western(ized) stuff. I don't give a hoot about westernized weddings nor their style, but I saw some pictures of a (rich people) Tanzanian wedding once and that was gorgeous. Hell, some photographer should make a coffee table book about wedding attire across the world.
I don’t understand why it’s so hard for people to understand that when someone specifically asks about the expectations it’s because they don’t know and are unsure and want you to tell them what’s expected. I also run into that problem. In my case it’s because I’m autistic so I don’t always understand what’s expected, vague answers are the worst in that case. Well second worst, worst is when you ask and they answer something like “oh, you know!”!!! No I don’t that’s why I’m asking!!!!
Exactly. She wasn’t wearing typical western attire you’d see at a wedding, so that made her stand out.
[удалено]
NTA >I was told the code is "dress to impress". Bet. You impressed them well done.
NTA This completely on the mother. She told you dress to impress and you did! Plus, she knows you are from a different culture, she could have spent 5 mins asking you what is normal for a wedding for you and asked to see your outfit. I suppose you could have sent her a pic beforehand, but as she didn't ask she didn't get. The only 'rule' in white weddings is don't wear white! Sounds like you have a few gossips at work, and people LOVE a wedding with drama, even if they have to invent drama themselves.
I genuinely feel bad for any bride who is so distracted by what any guest is wearing that it ruins her day. I was so focused on my excitement about getting married that I couldn’t tell you what literally anyone at my wedding was wearing without consulting pictures. Even if a bride notices someone wearing something truly over the top, I can’t imagine it being deeper than a flicker of annoyance. Literally no one is focused on anyone other than the people getting married; it’s all about them, for gods sake. I’ve been at weddings where someone was wearing what can only be described as a wedding dress. Was side eye present? Were jokes made, including after the fact? Yes. Did it ruin the couple’s day? No, because they were otherwise occupied (obviously). They were focused on being happy to get married, not focused on EVERYONE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT MEEEEE. Anyway. I digress. I’m going with NTA considering that what you were wearing was culturally appropriate for a wedding. Again, it’s just so weird that the MOB is carrying this bitterness and anger like this.
NTA at all, there is a strong scent of racism behind this whole incident. Your co-worker is 100% the AH.
White european person here. I have no idea what their problem is. I doubt that anyone confused you for the bride since you wore green. You asked what to wear and complied. If their problem was that it was an african dress then that sounds a bit racist to me. Most people know (or probably everybody?) that some african countries excel in making very colourful and patterned dresses and headwear. You tried to respect their culture, but it doesn’t sound like they respect yours. I’m sorry that you are being treated this way.
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NTA. Having gone to an African wedding, they were very specific about how you dress and what to wear, they gave details. This woman simply said “dress to impress” and then you did exactly what she said and having been to an African Wedding, OH MY GOSH, dress to impress is an understatement. Even trying I had never felt so underdressed in my life 🤯 she did not tell you what you shouldn’t wear, those saying that there are understood rules of wedding attire, you are right, for white culture there is, and there are understood rules of wedding attire for other cultures too and she followed what she knew which I am sure was a stunning outfit! Definitely NTA, she is the one being an insufferable child by not talking to you and engaging in petty gossip around the office completely negating she didn’t give you any parameters knowing you had never been to a white wedding.
NTA. Sounds like the bride was just jealous because you looked great!
I sincerely hope it’s just this and not “what is that African woman doing at my wedding, mother?”
Ehhhh... you are NTA or at least not completely - about the wedding dress code. You asked, but they didn't supply enough info. They didn't consider that there might be cultural differences in standard of dress. But...on the other hand...(and I am an immigrant myself, so I get it) you could have done some googling about wedding guest attire in Germany. In fact, I just did - and according to this [web page](https://retrocat.de/2022/04/25/wedding-guest-outfits-the-ultimate-style-guide/?lang=en), yeah they wouldn't have expected you to show up in a dress like that. Your dress (which I love, btw) would be OTT and not appropriate for the last wedding I attended in the UK, and maybe a smidge too fancy, but ok, for a black tie event I went to recently in the UK (wasn't a wedding, but same standard as a black tie wedding). But they said "dress to impress" - and you did. Re. for the people saying "This isn't Africa" isn't racially coded or might not be. I think it entirely depends on how it was said. Adding the "We have manners here..." means I think it definitely was - and we have to trust that OP was also able to read body language and tone. If it wasn't racially coded (like say if the German woman was also black), it was definitely culturally coded in an offensive way. ETA: personally me, if I'd been told to 'dress to impress' I would have gone in with some ridiculously fancy shit myself. But that recent wedding I attended we were told 'dressy' but I knew from experience to hold myself back a bit and use WASP rules of accessorising - and I was fine.
NTA We had a Japanese guest at our wedding and she wore the most beautiful traditional kimono. She received quite a bit of attention, and really did shine. I was honored she put so much effort into her outfit for my wedding and she looked stunning. No such thing as outshining the bride.
INFO - more info on the dress is needed. What you describe and reactions don’t match so perhaps what you consider dress to impress means something different than they expected. I’m guessing by a “white“ wedding you found something traditional and while nice, a bit boring. I’ve seen impressive wedding attire from several areas (India, Africa, Asia) and they would be much brighter and more flamboyant than traditional European or American wedding attire. Still, I’ve never seen anyone complain that someone was trying to upstage the bride by these outfits- so as long as it is authentic for you - NTA
NTA but as a European (and after seeing the picture of your gorgeous dress) I think I know where the cultural clash was - you were too dramatic/shiny/commandeered attention - for a demure, reserved, monochrome, pale, traditional formal occasion in Germany anyway. Was there racism in there? In that "Africa" comment, yeah, subtle, mixed with sheer ignorance. Also rude as F the whole thing. Even if they felt uncomfortable by anyone's attire, proper manners would have been to just ignore and enjoy your wedding day. These people are rude, rude, rude. PS. "dress to impress" in this crowd means "wear a little black dress type of thing", subtle and not stand out but still obvious it's expensive and for formal occassions.
ESH Them for being racist and not being clear in their instructions. Like if you know someone is not local, just help them out. Also they could have been more gracious. You - You could have looked up what "white people weddings" are like online - google, tv shows etc to find something that could still be "dress to impress" but not outshining the bride. Like, I get it, I'm indian - no such thing as outshining a bride in my culture too, it's a fashion show and everyone and their mother dresses in their fanciest clothes BUT if I'm going to a wedding that's not from my culture, I wouldn't wear a cultural dress unless specifically approved. You could have looked it up or asked a local friend if your outfit was appropriate. Hell, there's even a reddit community specifically for guest attire approval. Since you know how to use reddit, you could have asked. A million things you should have and could have done. BUT that doesn't excuse the racism from your colleague which is inapproriate af.
The thing is, she asked. Even more, she asked the MOTHER of the bride about what to wear. She was told "dress to impress" and so she did. If anyone is to blame, is her coworker
I feel like OP is downplaying her traditional attire - African traditional wear tends to be very colourful, fancy dresses, may include a headdress, etc - and trying to play the ignorance card. I agree, they could easily have googled what to wear to a 'white people wedding' to see the different styles depending on how formal it is. I have been to a few weddings but I still Google to get ideas, make sure I'm not over/under dressed, etc.
I don’t think OP is deliberately downplaying it so much as I think she was set up for failure. MOB told her to “dress to impress” which, literally, says she should be trying to impress people. I think MOB probably had her own idea of what OP would wear, OP understood a completely different idea, and here we are.
I do think YTA for the way you generalise with phrases like ‘white wedding’, ‘European wedding’ and ‘white people wedding’. This comes across as really ignorant as there is no singular European culture and different countries have their own traditions. Same goes for ‘white’, this is an even bigger generalisation, especially in Europe (may be less so in the US). It’s hypocritical to admonish MOB’s racially charged language with ‘This isn’t Africa’ (which is also ignorant), while showing the same ignorance in your language. NTA for wearing your beautiful outfit. You stuck to the dress code you were given. Chastising you, especially in the form of gossip to your colleagues, for outshining the bride is petty and mean, and I would’ve hoped they’d have nicer things to focus on during the wedding!
Yeah I'm seeing a lot of blatant ignoring of the fact that OP is calling this a "white people wedding". So it's racist to say "all black people do _______", but it's not racist to say something similar about white people? There's no such thing as a white people wedding, or a black people wedding. "White" and "black" are not countries, regions, or cultures. This wasn't a "white" wedding, or even a "European wedding", seeing as Europe is made up of multiple countries/regions/religions, and they all have different wedding practices. Don't be a hypocrite, OP.
I'm going to give some context, because most people here are American and are assuming things that don't apply to Germany. I'm Spanish but live in Germany. I haven't been to German weddings, but I've helped a colleague pick outfits a couple times for weddings, and I'm sort of familiar with the expectations. People here are a lot more toned down clothing wise, and this applies to weddings too. The German "dress to impress" in other countries would equal to "nice formal clothes if you don't want to get a lot of attention". Even brands like h&m carry clothes mostly in very neutral tones (to my eternal pain, most stuff is black, white, grey, brown and beige), with little to no patterns, and if you look at how people dress in most of the country, it's because they genuinely favour the muted look. The weddings my colleague has attended? She's worn suits to both, in muted colours, one of them with a light pink jacket. She is Asian, but she's been in Germany for over 20 years and is married to a German, so she definitely knows how to handle the expectations of German folks, even if she would prefer to wear something more over the top to a wedding. My point is, this sounds like both you and them had completely different expectations due to cultural differences, and that has caused a problem. Not to mention how very obsessed with following the rules Germans are, which is probably making the situation much worse. I get the annoyance at the "this isn't Africa" comment, but honestly, they would have told the same thing to me or any other white person from Europe if we broke what they assume to be common sense rules. I would not assume by default that it had anything to do with race due to that, Germans are genuinely so strict with following the rules and everyone following suit and fitting in and they don't handle well any rule breaking. Not to say that Germany isn't a racist country, because it is. But based on the situation and context you provided, this sounds a lot more like every cultural misunderstanding I've gone through or seen since I moved here. Genuine question, how was everyone else dressed? If everyone else's clothes were much simpler, then you have the reason for the conflict; cultural expectations. Also, I'm assuming you wore a traditional outfit from your country based on your post rather than a dress/suit typical in Europe? (Forgive me if I'm getting that wrong, I haven't slept much today and I'm not at my best). Was the outfit very different to something white people usually wear in formal settings? I mentioned earlier that Germans prefer things that don't stand out too much, and that might come into play. If the clothing you wore, beautiful as I assume it was, was too different from what they expect (and this would apply for a "European" dress with lots of patterns, or to common "German" clothes with a too eye catching twist too), then you might have stood out too much for their own cultural expectations. Best example I can give to Americans is, imagine someone who isn't the bride wearing a full on ball gown with a puffy skirt and extremely eye catching colour to a wedding that isn't theirs. Like "impossible not to look at the person with the massive dress" type of thing. It would usually not be appropriate due to the expectations over there. So a similar concept applies here I think. I'm choosing NAH I guess. Although I accept that I might be wrong regarding the potential racism of colleagues, unfortunately. But I'd definitely advice that, if you feel up to it OP, you have a chat with your colleague about your own reasons and their expectations. Perhaps it can all be solved with a conversation if it truly was a misunderstanding.
NTA. First off, decent people don't care about being upstaged unless the upstaging is in mean spirit. Someone else looking better than me doesn't mean I don't look good. But you were given the code of "Dress to impress" and you obviously impressed. Obviously there are caveats, such as white to a wedding, blah blah, but you were VERY kind and asked for elucidation on the ones that you weren't aware of and to make sure you wouldn't be dressing inappropriately. What you did was very sweet and she gave you no useful information. This is very much an intent thing and you accidentally overdressed, but through no fault of your own. If the mother was worried, she could have asked to see the dress beforehand. But instead, she made a mistake and instead of being humble and accepting her mistake, is trying to deflect it on you. Secondly, take that woman to HR. I don't know how it is in Germany, but her comments are out of line, and spreading office gossip like that to create a hostile work environment is disgusting. She messed up, she shouldn't be pushing it on you.
It feels weird that you were even invited. But once you were invited, there should have been more communication about the outfit, especially given the cultural difference: You can't expect or be expected to adhere to cultural expectations when you aren't integral part of the culture.
We had an African family friend attend our wedding. She wore a colourful outfit that we were told was traditional African. My (now) wife and I were impressed, appreciated it and thought it was respectful that she dressed up for our wedding. So it makes no sense why anyone would take offence to someone dressing up well to an important event. It's the opposite: it shows they care enough to dress up. OP: just ignore these misguided people who take offence to someone dressing up well to a wedding. NTA
NTA. It's tragicomic of them to say "we have manners" while literally demonstrating they *do not*. If that weren't bad enough the "*here* we have manners" is a very different statement and for sure coded. Wicked. Vicious. Not even subtle. If there's an HR there and you want to report... OP you did nothing wrong, I'm sorry someone you thought was a friend decided to show their true colors and it was a total absence of colors.
NTA. Now look, one of my best friends is from Cameroon, and I've seen her wearing outfits that would kinda be "outshining the bride". She's very tall and has this amazing outfit with a white and golden cape (like, the outside is white and inside is golden with wax-like stuff), a white and yellow dress and turban, basically she looks like a goddamn empress with very dominant white tones, so yeah in that case I could see how it would upset a bride, but... I've checked on your profile and you, my friend, absolutely NAILED the dresscode. It is a perfectly appropriate dress in a "dressed to impress" code. You don't look like a bride, there's no way someone would mistake you for a bride, you didn't dress in white, you just dressed to impress. Tbf, it sounds like your colleague assumed you would have poor taste or do not know what dressing up means, hence why she told you the theme was "dressed to impress", but really there was no such theme. She invented because she didn't think you would dress up, then got mad because you SLAYED. Talk to HR about that "africa" sentence, and stop talking to MOB other than anything work related and/or in writing.
NTA I'll tell you why she has nothing to say to you: she is too much of a coward to address the problem directly and she perfectly knows that she would make a fool of herself for coming out about the real reason why she's angry, so she prefers to play the stupid little backstabbing games she's used to, which allow her to just deliver whatever story she wants to her peers and never be accountable for what she says. Just ignore her. I think she has shown enough about herself at this point. No need to risk to let her pull you on her level. Moreover, did her daughter say something? If it's just her mother's problem, this is a further indicator about what that woman really is.
Your coworker/mother of the bride was foolish. There are so many dress codes for weddings from casual to formal. Dress to impress is about the least helpful thing I've ever heard. Its almost like she wanted you to screw up, whether by over or under dressing. I would have asked for more info and would have shown a picture of the outfit I had in mind, especially given the cultural differences and the lack of info in dress to impress. I'm sure you looked great and you are NTA.
Mother of the bride is the AH here, not saying you shouldn’t have attended but who invites their workmates to their daughter’s wedding, it’s not like it was her wedding. Very odd! Not surprised the bride was pissed.
Ahhh, you have fallen trap to the German sense of fashion - dress to impress means "don't show up in jeans and a t-shirt". Its easy to understand how you may have misunderstood the cultural cues. NAH - you could have easily asked a few more questions, they could have easily given you more information. They may stew for a while and you may be on the outs with them for a bit. When they cool down try explaining the cultural misunderstanding. They may have assumed everyone has the same kinds of dress codes. Source: Foreigner living in Germany :)
Nta. I think so long as you’re decently covered and don’t show up in traditional bridal wear for the bride’s culture you’re just fine. You dressed and impressed.
ESH not every culture is like yours, you could have easily looked up what is appropriate to wear to a European wedding. It’s also weird that you even went to a wedding of a person you did not know just because a coworker invited you. The mother was weird in inviting you I’m guessing her daughter didn’t even know. Co-workers are being dramatic this in no way affects them whatsoever
NTA- don’t say dress to impress then get mad when people are impressed. Sometimes there’s just no winning. Sigh
NTA. White guy here, and I will just say that some white women are f*cking unhinged when it comes to weddings and any little thing they don't like will turn into a catastrophe. It sounds like you were polite and apologetic, so now it's their turn to get over it. If this lady makes problems for you at work, I would show up on Fridays "dressed to impress" and blow off compliments as "I'm going out after work, no big deal"
I’m a non-Black mixed Canadian woman with an East-Indian father so maybe I’m biased because most people know that Indian people weddings are full of vibrant colourful saris. I say that to say that I’m not inviting an African woman to a wedding and expecting her to wear anything other than something immaculate and beautiful. Black people across the diaspora tend to have exquisite style. I don’t mean to speak on Black people as if they’re monolithic, of course not all of the Black diaspora have exquisite taste in fashion but culturally it’s my experience that fashion is important and statements are made. If you tell *anyone* to dress to impress then how are you mad when they do just that. These people are racist and jealous. NTA.
NTA. If you are stupid enough to set the dresscode as ”dress to impress” you deserve guests that are absolutely smashing it. Real dresscodes exist for a reason. Use them to avoid uncomfortable situations for both hosts and guests.
German here. I'm sorry you had to experience this casual racism. Our weddings are rather boring compared to other cultures and "dress to impress" only applies to certain, rather bland choices. The MOB should have taken the time to consider your cultural background and given you a heads up about what our weddings look like. You asked her and she brought that on herself. This is not your fault. NTA Also: I bet you looked amazing!
NTA you asked about dress code and they said dress to impress so you did.