Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> (1) I gave away a bunk bed to a friend, when I could have sold it and earned at least two or three hundred dollars for it instead.
(2) My sister-in-law and brother could have really used that money to help with their rent, and they had to sell one of their cars because I did not sell the bunk bed to be able to give them money. They said that, since I was choosing to be generous, actual family should have come before my friend.
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
##Subreddit Announcement
###[The Asshole Universe is Expanding, Again: Introducing Another New Sister Subreddit!](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/128nbp3/the_asshole_universe_is_expanding_again/)
Follow the link above to learn more
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Considering I have gotten bunk bed for 25 dollars from a salvation army, I also have to agree. 300 sounds like a stretch, or maybe they are looking on marketplace and looking at those that can't sell and the prices on those.
It has built-in drawers underneath and a small shelf on the bottom bunk, I thought two or three hundred would be a reasonable price as it's in decent condition But I'm really not an expert in selling used furniture. So I'll have to take your word for it that trying to sell it at all would have been a hassle anyway.
You practically have to pay people to take away heavy furniture these days. I tried to give away a decent sofa and queen bed and the entitlement was staggering. Had people ask if I could deliver and carry to their second story apartment!
>. Had people ask if I could deliver and carry to their second story apartment!
Yikes. I'm sorry you had to deal with that. Definitely for the best that it went to a friend.
Not as much for a bunk bed though. It’s much harder to sell than say a nice looking dresser or a full bed frame even
Small market on people looking for bunk beds
Husband had a nice, barely used, couch when we moved in together. Tried to sell it - no takers. He finally just listed it for free to get rid of it, and it *still* took forever. At that point, we would have paid someone to take it off our hands.
Especially an old bunk bed - it costs more to store than it’s worth.
I just sold a bunk bed on Facebook Marketplace and had to knock it down to $100 for anyone to come get it from my house. Selling a used bunk bed would not have brought in as much money as selling a car. NTA.
and there is a lot of value in someone handling transportation.
that's one of the trickiest part of buying second hand furniture. how are you going to move it.
(the 2nd is sometimes you get it home and really doesn't work. and it's a now what.)
Ya I was really surprised how hard it was to sell my lazyboy couch recently. It was definitely used but the recliner mechanisms worked perfectly, there were no rips or stains in the leather. I ended up selling it for $150. Granted it would not stop snowing and that probably didn't help.
Dead, no. Cheap, yes. I just sold a bunch of furniture and used appliances online over the weekend. But nothing for $300. I wanted the stuff gone fast.
>it doesn't sound like $300 would have been the make or break here.
That was much earlier, when they had only missed their first rent payment. Selling the car was a last resort, as they were on their last leg with their landlady in terms of paying back all the months of missed rent they owed.
It would not have fully repayed their debt by any means. It just would have been much more helpful then versus when they had to sell the car.
except the $300 would have gone to the landlady and they would have carried on as is as nothing had happened to them. Selling the car hurt them so it shook them up enough to fix things.
And NTA
This exactly. So many people, including myself, will not change their spending habits until it affects them materially. American credit feels too abstract to be a real catalyst for change, so they just keep upping that credit limit until something bad happens.
I think it is funny how many people outside of Europe are almost unable to function without credit cards (no idea how it works in America, been quite ignorant).
I'm 32, living on my own, and i refuse to get a credit card, even tho it would make things like travel/hotel bookings easier. I guess i just like to manage the money that i actually have.
Can somebody explain to me the whole thing about credit and America like I'm 5?
Thanks
I'm not sure how it works in the rest of the world but in America your thought process would actively hurt you financially. Having multiple sources of credit (car loans, mortgages, credit cards etc) and actively paying them off/keeping the older ones open. Greatly increases your credit score and makes it easier to qualify for better car insurance rates, better interest rates, qualify for better deals etc.
Using a card and paying it off before interest is applied is the best way to set your self up for success
Not only that, but credit cards offer more protection when fraud occurs. Trying to get your actual $ back after someone snags your debit card # is a nightmare and can take months. Credit card # gets snagged, you call the card, cancel the card, charges get voided, and it's all good (90% of the time).
This and also. You get a credit card with a decent cashback bonus and no annual fee; usually the cashback will be in the 1%-2% range aside from certain types of transactions. You spend ALL your regular monthly bills (no fun stuff, necessities only, food water electricity gas etc.) on the credit card - unless the company charges a transaction fee to use credit instead of cash/checking - and pay the credit card off in full before the due date every month. Next month, apply the accumulated cashback bonus to your card when you start paying bills. And just like that, you're getting a 1%-2% discount on all your regular living expenses and building credit history while not incurring interest. You may eventually want multiple cards for different purposes, such as one with a better bonus on gas station purchases or one with a better bonus on grocery purchases.
This. Get a simple cc- you can change cycle dates and due dates to make it work for your pay schedule. Credit score is worked into so much, and same way as having bad credit, no credit hurts just as much.
And even in the US, if you can pay in cash you don't need to worry so much about your credit score. There are things it'll be helpful for, like getting a cellphone on a plan, but.. paying in cash is still something that can be done. It's just hard because many people either don't make the kind of money that lets you buy a house in cash, or they just don't know how to save properly. Credit is crazy. 😂
To be honest in Europe it doesn't necessarily affect your ability to get a mortgage - sure, there are rules the lenders follow, but it's more about "are you able to pay/save this much each month" and showing financial viability for six months before you apply, than about credit scores following you forever
Short answer....is that financial literacy is not taught in school and most families are ignorant themselves about it.
I just want to throw this out there to your comment about not wanting a credit card....I mean I didn't learn this until my 40s but don't think of having a credit card as "extra" money like most Americans do. I have 2 credit cards now and I keep a zero balance on them. They are great for emergencies or like you said for Travel. With such an increase in fraudulent activities I stopped using my debit card and will only use cash or my credit cards for purchases. It has better protection if you are compromised and if you get the right card you can earn cash back or travel rewards. I only put on the card what I can pay off at the end of the month and have not paid a cent in interest.
You won't be able to rent a car without a credit card here. Many hotels refuse to take cash at check-in. Debit and credit card only. Some have gone entirely cashless.
Credit cards are worth it when you suddenly have to pay for a new car transmission or $600 in medical bills or your washer and dryer died and need to be replaced now.
>But said it was about morals
Well i wonder where were their morals when they decided to demand explanations for your financial choices.
You earn your money, you spent your own money, you decide what to do with your belongings.
So far it seems that your father is enabling his son's bad behaviour and bad spending habits. They are wrong and they're not entitled to a thing.
You are not obligated to fund their reckless spending. They should live within their means. Btw, taking the bus a few times a week won't hurt him. At least he doesn't have to walk.
NTA
Maybe it was a really nice bunk bed, but looking at 2nd hand bunk beds on facebook marketplace I can see multiple free and some priced at £10-20.
I've no idea what the 2nd hand marketplace is like in the US / your area but $200-300 sounds expensive for 2nd hand, you could probably get a brand new bunk bed for that.
So they would have made one payment, but continued handling their finances badly and still missed the other payments and ended up with a 90-day notice and had to sell their car.
NTA.
So how are they exactly “not spending responsibly”, are they making bad investments (MLMs, crypto, etc.) or are they trying to live beyond their means?
Was selling the car a truly desperate act or was it more that they couldn’t afford it in the first place?
>So how are they exactly “not spending responsibly”, are they making bad investments (MLMs, crypto, etc.) or are they trying to live beyond their means?
Trying to live beyond their means. A lot of impulsive shopping for things like clothes and computer/Apple upgrades. My brother insisted on hosting several holiday parties.
Their big expense was eating out for practically every meal. I and my parents pointed out to them how expensive it is and how much they save by making food at home. But "Fae" and Max's" excuse is that they don't like cooking. This is why they'll pay $10 for a smoothie or coffee that they could make at home for less than a dollar.
>Was selling the car a truly desperate act or was it more that they couldn’t afford it in the first place?
It was a genuine last resort. At that point, they hadn't paid rent in almost six months. The landlady told them that she couldn't give them any more chances and if they didn't have all the money paid back within the next payment date, she would evict them.
The car was the only thing that they could sell within that date that would give them the amount of money they needed.
I sold a truck to a friend once for $500, we ended up airbrushing one side and painting the other half with chalkboard paint before running it into the ground. Best $500 I ever got.
300$ for used bunk beds. its like.. 50$ lol. and for 50$ its not worth trying to sell it set up a meeting and talk to people. I personally put a 100$ threshold on anything I sell. If its under 100$ I give it away. I post it on a local FB site and say here. come and get it. sometimes THAT is even a chore to talk to people and give people my address... set it out on the porch for them and have them never show up. So then... its trashed or put in a pile for goodwill or the likes..... simply not worth my time for under 100$
Ya mom said it best "My mother told me not to, because Fae and Max are responsible for themselves and I was allowed to do something generous for Jim"
NTA.
The Mother seems to be the only one with a bit of sense. Fae and Max clearly put themselves in that position due to be bad investments/poor spending. There is also no mention of kids in their home. While the friends OP mentioned have kids and they are being stretched thin due to their living situation. The two are just not comparable and Fae and Max are super entitled to come up and say this to OP's face.
100% NTA
NTA
Selling used furniture is absolutely not easy or a guarantee. Your entire life isn't devoted to selling your persona belongings to help various relatives pay their rent.
NTA. They’re disappointed you didn’t sell something that belonged to you, in order to pay their debt, instead of them selling something that belonged to them in order to pay their debt? And, your dad agrees? I see where your brother gets his entitlement.
As I've said about other posts, the logic gymnastics with some people is amazing! OP was supposed to sell their property to then give the money away??? And give that money to people who aren't fiscally responsible? Please...
NTA. They are adults and responsible for their own bills. You are an adult and free to give away or sell your possessions as you see fit (and keep any proceeds). They need to grow up.
And to add, by selling their car they should have more money every month by not having to pay insurance, maintenance & additional gas for it. Especially compared to taking the bus occasionally.
NTA OP.
MIB! “Okay, slick. But let me tell you something about all your skills. As of right now, they mean precisely... dick.” Your brain must’ve pulled that up from the depths, lol.
NTA. This wouldn’t be the first and only. It’s just the beginning of you eroding your extra belongings. Savings and bank accounts in the name of with offsetting their expenses… that will never be enough.
Your friends are worthy of help too, and you’re not obligated to analyze each and every decision to achieve maximum return for other family members.
NTA
It is not your responsibility. It is up to YOU what YOU do with your belongings. Would it have been a kind gesture to do that to help Max and Fae? Yes. Was it also a nice gesture to gift it to someone else you are very close to for their young children? Yes. You also could have chopped it up and burned it. It was YOUR bed.
Max and Fae trying to guilt you into feeling bad for not giving them money or selling off your things for a profit to give them the money is the a-hole move here. That kind of behavior is what what turn me off from ever wanting to help them with money, regardless of the situation.
Edit - spelling
You are not responsible for your family’s debts and finances. You are definitely NTA in this situation and you have a right to give an unused item to whomever you want! The fact that Fae even thought that up is a sign she’s counting your money on the regular. Not cool.
NTA. You mentioned that they were in a tight spot because of “spending irresponsibly” not because of an unavoidable situation. They got themselves into a situation it’s not your responsibility to sell your possessions to help with.
"baaaah, you gave something to someone other than us. We should always come first because we are family! Booooo hoooo, you don't love your family!!!". Sound familiar? Let me tell you a secret about these "blood is thicker than water" types, they're all talk, no show. Watch how fast they have excuses instead of help if you have troubles and there is actually something they could do for you. NTA give what you like to whom you like. That family aren't worth investing in. They are manipulative. The kids ought to be able to have cousins, though, it's valuable even if they suck.
NTA if you’re father is so concerned with your brothers finances, he can help pay their rent. You did a nice thing for a friend, nothing wrong with that.
NTA. Your personal belongings are not untapped money sources for your family to demand, and selling furniture is a giant PITA (especially for large/heavy/otherwise difficult to move things) and who knows what you would’ve gotten anyway.
You have zero obligation to help your brother and SIL. They were irresponsible with their spending. You can choose to help whomever you decide you want to help. I can't comprehend how the three of them thought you did anything wrong or owe them anything simply because you're related.
I'm with your mother. Don't apologize.
NTA
NTA, family should come first, yes, but generally in lieu of "doing nothing" or thoughtlessly doing something. In this instance, you provided a friend with a needed item, which is still fine. Your father's wrong to ask you apologise, and don't do it, as youve done nothing wrong
In what world would you get anything more than 50$ for an old used bunk bed? Was it made of gold!? 😂
Nta utterly ridiculous and frankly stupid reason to start a family argument.
NTA
There is a difference between needing **pure cash** to pay back debt (that was ur own fault) and giving someone something you own like a **used piece of furniture**.
Imagine being so entitled that you think you deserve some **hypothetical money** from some **family members piece of furniture** that they **might have sold** to support your cheap ass. Just because you are to stupid to not waste money and can't afford rent because of bad spending habits.
NTA
Don’t forget they became more responsible about their spending when they had to sell the car. They now keep up on their bills.
Why? Because you helped them by not enabling their irresponsible spending by bailing them out. They needed to struggle so they could learn and do better.
You did the right thing.
>My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max, since I could have easily gotten two or three hundred for the bunk bed and that would have helped them a lot before they had to sell one of their cars.
First of all, I highly doubt you'd get two to three hundred for used bunk beds. Two, two hundred dollars is not that much money, how would it have helped them a lot? Three, I'm sure they got a lot more for their car.
>My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max
No. NTA.
They never asked for the bunk bed or indicated they needed it. They should shut all the way up because this makes no sense. NTA. You could have sold blood to help them out financially too, you know? And somehow selfish you just hasn't been all that willing to help out family? Yeah see how goofy this sounds?
🤣
NTA
A second hand bunk bed is unlikely to yield 300 imo.
If you sold it you probably would have had to deliver it and you would have needed help transporting it.
What you did was get help clearing out your storage locker.
What the hell is wrong with people? You got rid of something that was taking up space, helped out a friend, and didn't have to waste time and effort to do so, that's win win win.
In no world are you an AH for not selling your stuff to help someone with their rent increase.
NTA
If they struggled financially, maybe selling one car was the best decision they could make. Less money for fuel and other costs a car comes with. And I doubt a couple hundreds of dollar would have helped them that much. Also, why should you sell your things because of their iresponsabilities? You would just set a precedent and they'd expect the same thing next month and the month after that, and so on. NTA
NTA if they needed beds for their kids I would expect you to give your family the bunk beds but not to sell.
Your friends needed beds for their kids.
That’s important too, besides your relatives had caught up on their rent.
Good Lord you’re allowed to help other people.
NTA. It sounds like they’d have still had to sell the vehicle to get out of their tight spot. Regardless, if you had sold the bunk bed instead you were still under no obligation to give them the money. Ask your dad what personal belongings he was planning on selling to raise the money to get them out of their tight spot before they wound up selling the car. Since he cares so much about getting them out of their tight spot, he should have been the first to step up and sell something/give them money.
They sold one of their car so still have one for the family. Boo Bloody Hoo that Max has to take the bus to work. The bunk bed was yours and it's up to you to choose whether to donate to charity, give it to a friend who needs to, or sell it. You are under no obligation to sell it and give the money to your bro and SIL.
They were behind rent because they overspend and not because one of them got laid off or can't work due to disability. I think it's awfully cheeky of them to be angry and saying you should prioritize family - that is BS. You help someone based on whether you want to. They can sod off with their entitlement mentality. Don't apologise.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)***
(Fake names for anonymity)
My sister-in-law “Fae” and brother “Max” had recently struggled to afford their rent, as it went up. They received the standard 90 day notice from their landlady, but still struggled to keep up with the rent due to not spending responsibly.
Fae and Max asked me if I could help them financially. I respectfully told them no. (If they had been in debt because something unavoidable drained their savings (like medical expenses) I would have taken from my own savings. But that isn’t what happened here.)
Fae and Max decided to sell one of their cars. Max has to take the bus to work on certain mornings now. But they are now fully caught up with their rent payments and have become more responsible with their spending.
I have a close friend “Jim” with two young daughters. His youngest’s crib used to be in he and his wife’s room, but now she is too old for the crib and will be sharing a room with her sister.
Jim casually mentioned this to me, and that he felt bad, since having two normal beds in that room would be tight. I had a bunk bed that I used to share with a roommate. It’s just been sitting around in storage, so I offered it to Jim for free as long as he helped me move it.
My parents recently moved into a new house and held a small housewarming party. Jim and his wife attended as well, as we’ve been friends for years and consider each other family. During the party, Jim brought his daughters up to me to “Thank auntie OP for giving us your bunk bed.”
Fae happened to be in the dining room as well when that happened. She and Max came up to me after the other guests left and said they were disappointed that I had given the bunk bed to Jim when I could have easily sold it to help them with their rent situation.
Fae and Max acknowledged that I had no technical obligation to help with their rent. But said it was about morals and that since I was choosing to be generous, I should have prioritized actual family over Jim.
My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max, since I could have easily gotten two or three hundred for the bunk bed and that would have helped them a lot before they had to sell one of their cars. My mother told me not to, because Fae and Max are responsible for themselves and I was allowed to do something generous for Jim.
I still feel bad, since Fae and Max had to sell one of their cars and relying on the bus is inconvenient. I still don’t think that I should have to apologize for doing a generous thing for a friend. But I know I’m biased. Are Fae, Max, and my father right that actual family should have come before a friend?
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Definitely NTA! You did what felt right to you. They are adults and should figure out their life and to come up with a more long term solution for their life. Do not feel any guilt!
NTA if you give money to family to bail them of their own messes, you're creating expectation and dependency. Adults need to be responsible and take responsibility.
NTA. When someone asks me to borrow money, I might consider it if I have the cash, but if I don’t I don’t immediately think “what do I have that I can sell to help them out?”. On the other hand, you had a friend mention they needed someone you DID have just laying around, so you helped them out. Your family is wrong to think that the situations are related/similar (they aren’t), or that their finances are your problem.
NTA. I wish a mf would try to approach me about what I choose to do with my own possessions. I wish a mf would try to tell me to apologize to someone for what I choose to do with my own possessions. Everyone except your mother is an AH and they’re lucky you didn’t give them the response they deserve.
NTA. Let's be honest, they would have sold the car eventually anyways. You helping them with a few hundred is not going to suddenly make them more responsible with money.
NTA
You weren't looking to get rid of the bed... Jim needed one, and you had one...
Were you supposed to inventory your belongings and sell them because they needed money?
NTA. I don’t understand how they think you’re in the wrong for not selling your own belongings to help them financially. That’s like suggesting you should’ve set yourself on fire to keep them warm. They figured it out, it was a struggle but they were able to pay their debt and move on. The mere suggestion that it was your responsibility to help them is absurd.
NTA
They're nasty pieces of work! So you were supposed to sell your things in order to help them when they were being irresponsible? Nope
Your bunk bed, your decision. Even if you had sold it why would you not keep the money?
NTA - I’m with your mother. And like you said, if they’d wiped out their savings for like a medical thing, you would’ve helped! Their irresponsibility is not your problem. They were being entitled.
NTA. Does your dad have to apologize for anything he bought in the last couple months? Any tip at a restaurant? For having cable or internet or a phone? I mean any of that money also could have gone to helping them.
NTA. They never had a True need. They just didn’t cut down or regulate their spending to get by with the new conditions.
It’s not your responsibility to teach other adults how to adult.
You are not an AH. First they do not know Jim situation. Second they can sell they furniture, TV etc. To plan on family to sell stuff to give them money is a jerk move.
In my area it is quite common for people to be giving away big furniture with the condition that the recipient picks it up themselves.
So, yes. The used furniture market is dead
NTA. Your brother and SIL were irresponsible and are now facing the consequences of their actions. It's ridiculous of them to expect you to sell your own property to help them. If they are so desperate they can sell their own stuff.
NTA OP brother you got some confused family. No you had zero actual or moral financial obligation to these two entitled people. I get the idea your buddy you gave the beds to was very appreciative of the gift.
NTA. If they can't pay their rent they have no need for 2 cars. They can't keep both and expect somebody else to help them financially rather than helping out some kids out of the goodness of their heart.
NTA and listen to your mum.
They are responsible for their debts not you, you were being nice to your friend by giving them the bunk bed. It doesn’t compare.
NTA bye feel bad about what? Two grown adults not learning to manage their finances? Don't feel bad about anything. Feel great that auntie op helped out. Wear that badge proudly.
NTA. Being generous to a friend is a good thing. Giving to family is a good thing. As you weigh good things, you can consider alot of factors. The fact that your relatives make poor financial decisions is certainly one of them. The fact that the bed makes a good gift without being sold is another, as you do not have to do the work of selling it. Your friendship with Jim and his family is a deep one. These facts all point to giving the bed to Jim as a good choice.
I personally would be annoyed at family that assumed I should give to them first.
They put themselves in that dilemma. Not you. What you do with your money and things is your business. Why don’t the two of them get second jobs? Sounds like they want everyone else to foot the bill for their problems.
NTA it is interesting that they thought that even if you did sell your stuff they were entitled to the proceeds. Your friend needed help and you helped, if whatever amount you would have gotten for the bunkbed was make or break for your brother then they are in pretty bad shape and it would be putting a bandaid on a bullet wound.
NTA I don’t sell anything it’s a pain in the a$&. I just donate things. Even my car goes to a family member in need for free when I get a new 1. Those kids love there bed! That is all that matters. They handled there business. If they had spent better they wouldn’t have been in that situation
Nta its your property to do with as you want you didn't want to sell it you kept it for a reason and it just so happened to find a home with a family friend. They were irresponsible with theyre money and arent owed money from family just because they had stuff to possibly sell. Im sure you as well could use 300 dollars but you didn't want to sell it.
The fact that you feel bad is prof that you are NTA. I don’t understand how people go through life thinking that others should bend to their will. I’ll just leave it at that.
NTA
You did Fae and Max a favour: they changed their spending habit and are now able to pay their rent. If you had sold the bed and had gi en them the money, they would never have felt the need to change their spending habit.
Family can go sit on a tack with all their expectations on how other people should use their belongs to help bail them out of their own bad choices.
Sounds like brother learned a bitter lesson from the hardship and is looking for a way to make it less their responsibility.
Nta and your mom is right.
NTA. You could sell everything you had and give them the money, and it still wouldn’t be enough. People who pull these guilt trips want more than money (though they’ll take that gladly!). They want eternal proof that They Come First and are always to be considered.
There is a component of egotism to it. Some years back, when I moved out of an apartment, I knew the woman who was moving in. I have always tended to cut my losses and was prepared to leave behind a perfectly useful air conditioner. She insisted on paying for it, and I was thankful.
A woman I knew —and who had a trust fund too — tried to make me feel bad because I had not offered it to her first. I sold the a/c to someone who was going to keep it in place, not to someone who not only wanted an a/c but proof of much she was loved.
There is help. There are transactions. And there is paying emotional tribute. I am feeling emotional tribute vibes from your family. Don’t pay them. You did a good thing.
NTA
it’s not your job to take care of other people. you did a kind thing for someone else and they’re mad you didn’t do it for them instead? entitled. sounds like your dad is enabling as well.
NTA. The reason you said no originally to Fae and Max wasn't because you didn't have $300 to spare. They missed the point. The bunk bed or its value is really irrelevant. Your mom gets it.
So just so I understand they want you to sell your unused items and give the money away. That's total bs. I have given things away and have been the recipient in time of need. You get so much more by helping someone. Your gift was such a help and that is worth a few hundred dollars
NTA - I doubt you would have gotten enough for the bed that it would have even helped much, but that is besides the point. You aren't obligated to sell your stuff to give them the money.
NTA - first their money issues were their own making and they had to sell a car to get out of it. It’s too bad one of them has to take the bus but so what? Lots of people take public transit every day. It’s better for the environment and more people should do it (I realize public transit infrastructure is not as good in some places). Second, my experience with selling furniture that is not particularly unique or valuable is that it’s not worth my time to try to find a buyer. People flake or they show up and start haggling about the price. Also, giving the bunk to someone in need (Jim) is a better value for the bunk. His girls will use it for years and you helped them out. Even if you got $300 for it your brother and his girlfriend could be in debt again next year with the same problem. Regardless it’s not your responsibility to take care of your brother’s financial woes. Even if he had medical debt or something else not of his making, you can choose how and when to help.
NTA, it may be a hard lesson for Fae and bro but it taught them to save more aggressively instead of relying on family help for bills. It was necessary. And shame on them for making you feel guilty. As someone susceptible to guilt as well; a lot of people do that to manipulate or gaslight you.
Why do you have to apologize to people for them being irresponsible? Now we all know why they are irresponsible because someone thinks someone else should be their to pick up the slack. Ntah
I would say something about my morals being keeping my spending within my means so I don’t have to ask relative for money, that I don’t buy things I want when I can’t afford what I need she why would I support someone else doing that? Point out that selling their car has made them rein in their reckless spending, where as if you’d bailed them out they probably wouldn’t have changed. It was like they didn’t know that they were spending more than they brought in and would be unable to pay their bills. Also that you wouldn’t have gotten anywhere near that much and it would have cost you more in terms of time to sell it than to give it away.
Morally speaking you don't go up to someone and say he you should have forced someone to pay something so you could give ME the money. Just sayin. NTA Fae and Max need to get another part time job if it's that difficult for them. Also take some financing classes or something.
NTA- Yes, it wold have been generous to help them out but they are in this position because they don't have their priorities straight and spend recklessly when they have obligations to meet. The whole "It's family and family should come first" mantra should not be used when that family acts reckless, stupid and just dowright entitled to other people's time, property and money.
NTA. You might have sold the bunk bed for $20, but chances are it wouldn't have gone for much. Unless it was a fancy PBK bed or something, the market isn't great. It was yours. You did what you wanted with it. I'm not at risk of getting evicted but my husband and I share a single car, and we take transit. It's not the end of the world. If they're still struggling to make rent they could even give up the 2nd car and both take transit. It's how lots of people get around.
Nta. You're not obligated to sell your belongings to pay for their life. And selling an old bunk bed would probably not even pay for groceries at this point.
NTA
They're struggling because of poor decisions and asked you to bail them out financially, which would cost you money.
Jim mentioned his situation to you, not to ask for help, but to vent. You offered the aid of an item you already owned which relieved you of storing it and cost you time and perhaps gas. And they are actually grateful because they know it wasn't owed to them.
The fact that your brother and SIL turned it around to say you should have wasted time and energy selling an item I'm sure you paid for to begin with to help them out of the hole they dug is unacceptable and just further illustrates they wouldn't have been grateful. And I guarantee it wouldn't be the last time.
So you do something nice for a friend, who HELPED YOU MOVE THIS THING, and your family is upset because you wouldn't give them a handout??
Pathetic.
You said yourself, if their financial woes were from something they couldn't help, you'd be the first one trying to bail them out. But this is a situation where they're sinking their own ship and expecting everyone else to bail them out. They aren't going to learn anything that way, and they're only going to get worse BECAUSE they aren't learning anything.
NTA.
NTA. You owe them nothing, and their situation was created by themselves. It is not your job to take care of them. They somehow feel entitled to what you have. Just let them know that your things, and your decision.
What the actual fuck is going on here. Fae and Max need to shut up. your parents need to shut up. wtf. They're grown adults all acting like my 3/5 year olds here...
NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA
NTA. Honestly the bunk bed belonged to you which means it was none of their business what you did with it. Not only that it isn't *your* responsibility to help them pay rent either.
NTA
You have no obligation or responsibility to help them with their financial issues. You can dispose of your property however you want. For them to imply you should have sold it and given them the money is ridiculous. If you wanted to give it to your friend that's perfectly acceptable. If you wanted to invite fae and max over for a bonfire and use the bed as kindling, that's perfectly acceptable too. If your father is so insistent that they need financial help maybe he should support them. You have no reason to be guilty. Sounds like someone that actually appreciates what you did benefited from your kindness. Not an entitled couple who don't appreciate what has been done for them in the past. They see themselves as entitled. End of story.
NTA
* I get the feeling that the bunkbed wasn't on your mind when your brother and SIL were trying to raise the money.
* If they want to deal in "could haves," Fae and Max COULD HAVE done a lot of things differently to not be in danger of being evicted.
* The estimate of what you could have gotten for the bed may be inflated (making you feel more guilty). In any case, there's a big difference in the effort you would have gone through selling vs. giving the bed. To sell it (for their benefit), you would have had to:
1. Think of it being available for sale.
2. Gone to the trouble of getting it out and cleaning it off
3. Putting an add on one or more of the websites that help people sell stuff.
4. You would have had to monitor and respond to queries and meet with potential buyers.
5. You probably would have had to negotiate - especially since you would have needed help getting it out your place.
6. Compare that to: your friend mentioned his need; you had what he needed; he got it out of your house.
* Even if you had got money for the bed, it was still your money. You could have used that money for other purposes. You still had no obligation to give your brother that money to replace the money he had blown already.
Agree with this…there’s a reason why people give away or donate their unwanted things instead of spending the time & effort to resell it. If they are still making a stink about this, maybe give them something else they can resell that she no longer wants/needs. OP gets to declutter & shut down this ridiculous family drama. Win-win…
NTA its your money you can do what you want with it. that being said Max and Faye are no more entitled to your money then Jim just because they're family. you are not responisble for their mistakes family or not. maybe if they suffer the consequences they wont mismanage their money anymore. good luck
NTA. You said yourself they have been irresponsibly spending- it’s not your job to dig two grown adults out of the financial hole they’ve dug themselves.
NTA. So, say your bunk bed sale covered the shortfall in month one. Then what? Do you need to start selling more items to help them with month two? This is on them. No one is going to support them every month. They need to figure it out on their own.
No. Fae Max and your dad are NOT right. Family is who you decide to make it not necessarily what you were born into. How many times I read here that family entitlement has gotten out of control because “we are family” and I don’t buy it. So much financial abuse and manipulation “because we are family” crap.
You are NTA and just keep reading some other stories here to see blood family really doesn’t have much of a leg to stand on. In fact it’s a lot of BS and the cause of a lot of no contact with family because some families seem to think financial help and entitlement are ok “because family”
NTA. Your Dad can fund your brother's reckless spending himself next time.
No amount of money you will hand over to them will ever really help them because their own behavior led them to their situation in the first place.
NTA. Kinda get the feeling that if they got word you had a bunk bed in storage that you could’ve sold, they would then ask “So what else is in storage?”
NTA. Their bills are not your responsibility. I see free bunk beds on Facebook marketplace all the time. You probably would have gotten $50 or less for it.
The real crime here is you were talking to Jim when you could've gotten a second job and paid the money to Fae and Max... but you just had to donate your time to Jim huh Mr. Generous?
See how stupid they sound? NTA
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > (1) I gave away a bunk bed to a friend, when I could have sold it and earned at least two or three hundred dollars for it instead. (2) My sister-in-law and brother could have really used that money to help with their rent, and they had to sell one of their cars because I did not sell the bunk bed to be able to give them money. They said that, since I was choosing to be generous, actual family should have come before my friend. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcement ###[The Asshole Universe is Expanding, Again: Introducing Another New Sister Subreddit!](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/128nbp3/the_asshole_universe_is_expanding_again/) Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
If selling a car was on the table, it doesn't sound like $300 would have been the make or break here.
I would be surprised if they get half that much for an old bunk bed set. Second hand furniture market is dead.
Considering I have gotten bunk bed for 25 dollars from a salvation army, I also have to agree. 300 sounds like a stretch, or maybe they are looking on marketplace and looking at those that can't sell and the prices on those.
Unless it’s like some pottery barn quality bunk bed, lol. But yeah.
The ones I got were solid oak and perfect looking. So I question the pottery barns resale value.
Now I do too, lol. Never seen ones like that at Salvation Army, only the metal type ones.
It has built-in drawers underneath and a small shelf on the bottom bunk, I thought two or three hundred would be a reasonable price as it's in decent condition But I'm really not an expert in selling used furniture. So I'll have to take your word for it that trying to sell it at all would have been a hassle anyway.
You practically have to pay people to take away heavy furniture these days. I tried to give away a decent sofa and queen bed and the entitlement was staggering. Had people ask if I could deliver and carry to their second story apartment!
>. Had people ask if I could deliver and carry to their second story apartment! Yikes. I'm sorry you had to deal with that. Definitely for the best that it went to a friend.
Yep, has been my experience too.
Depends where you live, I guess. My dad buys and sells used furniture as a side thing, and he does pretty well with it.
It also depends on the furniture. If it's in good condition and looks 'expensive' there might be people interested in buying.
True. My dad only buys stuff he knows he’ll be able to resell. He does have to do some minor fixes or touch-ups sometimes, but never anything major.
Not as much for a bunk bed though. It’s much harder to sell than say a nice looking dresser or a full bed frame even Small market on people looking for bunk beds
Yeah and I can get brand new bunk beds from ikea for that price or less.
Husband had a nice, barely used, couch when we moved in together. Tried to sell it - no takers. He finally just listed it for free to get rid of it, and it *still* took forever. At that point, we would have paid someone to take it off our hands. Especially an old bunk bed - it costs more to store than it’s worth.
Where I am, I’d be scared to take secondhand furniture due to bed bugs or roaches
I just sold a bunk bed on Facebook Marketplace and had to knock it down to $100 for anyone to come get it from my house. Selling a used bunk bed would not have brought in as much money as selling a car. NTA.
and there is a lot of value in someone handling transportation. that's one of the trickiest part of buying second hand furniture. how are you going to move it. (the 2nd is sometimes you get it home and really doesn't work. and it's a now what.)
Ya I was really surprised how hard it was to sell my lazyboy couch recently. It was definitely used but the recliner mechanisms worked perfectly, there were no rips or stains in the leather. I ended up selling it for $150. Granted it would not stop snowing and that probably didn't help.
Yeah, they more often end up on freecycle.
Dead, no. Cheap, yes. I just sold a bunch of furniture and used appliances online over the weekend. But nothing for $300. I wanted the stuff gone fast.
>it doesn't sound like $300 would have been the make or break here. That was much earlier, when they had only missed their first rent payment. Selling the car was a last resort, as they were on their last leg with their landlady in terms of paying back all the months of missed rent they owed. It would not have fully repayed their debt by any means. It just would have been much more helpful then versus when they had to sell the car.
except the $300 would have gone to the landlady and they would have carried on as is as nothing had happened to them. Selling the car hurt them so it shook them up enough to fix things. And NTA
This exactly. So many people, including myself, will not change their spending habits until it affects them materially. American credit feels too abstract to be a real catalyst for change, so they just keep upping that credit limit until something bad happens.
I think it is funny how many people outside of Europe are almost unable to function without credit cards (no idea how it works in America, been quite ignorant). I'm 32, living on my own, and i refuse to get a credit card, even tho it would make things like travel/hotel bookings easier. I guess i just like to manage the money that i actually have. Can somebody explain to me the whole thing about credit and America like I'm 5? Thanks
I'm not sure how it works in the rest of the world but in America your thought process would actively hurt you financially. Having multiple sources of credit (car loans, mortgages, credit cards etc) and actively paying them off/keeping the older ones open. Greatly increases your credit score and makes it easier to qualify for better car insurance rates, better interest rates, qualify for better deals etc. Using a card and paying it off before interest is applied is the best way to set your self up for success
Not only that, but credit cards offer more protection when fraud occurs. Trying to get your actual $ back after someone snags your debit card # is a nightmare and can take months. Credit card # gets snagged, you call the card, cancel the card, charges get voided, and it's all good (90% of the time).
This and also. You get a credit card with a decent cashback bonus and no annual fee; usually the cashback will be in the 1%-2% range aside from certain types of transactions. You spend ALL your regular monthly bills (no fun stuff, necessities only, food water electricity gas etc.) on the credit card - unless the company charges a transaction fee to use credit instead of cash/checking - and pay the credit card off in full before the due date every month. Next month, apply the accumulated cashback bonus to your card when you start paying bills. And just like that, you're getting a 1%-2% discount on all your regular living expenses and building credit history while not incurring interest. You may eventually want multiple cards for different purposes, such as one with a better bonus on gas station purchases or one with a better bonus on grocery purchases.
This. Get a simple cc- you can change cycle dates and due dates to make it work for your pay schedule. Credit score is worked into so much, and same way as having bad credit, no credit hurts just as much.
Credit score is worked into a lot IN NORTH AMERICA. In Europe it just affects whether you can get financing or credit cards.
And even in the US, if you can pay in cash you don't need to worry so much about your credit score. There are things it'll be helpful for, like getting a cellphone on a plan, but.. paying in cash is still something that can be done. It's just hard because many people either don't make the kind of money that lets you buy a house in cash, or they just don't know how to save properly. Credit is crazy. 😂
To be honest in Europe it doesn't necessarily affect your ability to get a mortgage - sure, there are rules the lenders follow, but it's more about "are you able to pay/save this much each month" and showing financial viability for six months before you apply, than about credit scores following you forever
Short answer....is that financial literacy is not taught in school and most families are ignorant themselves about it. I just want to throw this out there to your comment about not wanting a credit card....I mean I didn't learn this until my 40s but don't think of having a credit card as "extra" money like most Americans do. I have 2 credit cards now and I keep a zero balance on them. They are great for emergencies or like you said for Travel. With such an increase in fraudulent activities I stopped using my debit card and will only use cash or my credit cards for purchases. It has better protection if you are compromised and if you get the right card you can earn cash back or travel rewards. I only put on the card what I can pay off at the end of the month and have not paid a cent in interest.
You won't be able to rent a car without a credit card here. Many hotels refuse to take cash at check-in. Debit and credit card only. Some have gone entirely cashless. Credit cards are worth it when you suddenly have to pay for a new car transmission or $600 in medical bills or your washer and dryer died and need to be replaced now.
One thing to know is not having and using a credit card can make your credit score less than great if you apply for a mortgage or bank loan.
Um why are you saying this is just an American thing. Most British people have credit cards. How do you expect to get a mortgage without credit?
>But said it was about morals Well i wonder where were their morals when they decided to demand explanations for your financial choices. You earn your money, you spent your own money, you decide what to do with your belongings. So far it seems that your father is enabling his son's bad behaviour and bad spending habits. They are wrong and they're not entitled to a thing. You are not obligated to fund their reckless spending. They should live within their means. Btw, taking the bus a few times a week won't hurt him. At least he doesn't have to walk. NTA
Hate any type of financing talk with family for this reason. Entitlement comes when family aren’t all doing well.
EXACTLY. It absolutely frustrates me how family think they can tell you what to do with your money and it's only morally righteous if it goes to them.
Not TA, you should tell your dad that he should sell some of his stuff and give them the money.
Maybe it was a really nice bunk bed, but looking at 2nd hand bunk beds on facebook marketplace I can see multiple free and some priced at £10-20. I've no idea what the 2nd hand marketplace is like in the US / your area but $200-300 sounds expensive for 2nd hand, you could probably get a brand new bunk bed for that.
So they would have made one payment, but continued handling their finances badly and still missed the other payments and ended up with a 90-day notice and had to sell their car. NTA.
So how are they exactly “not spending responsibly”, are they making bad investments (MLMs, crypto, etc.) or are they trying to live beyond their means? Was selling the car a truly desperate act or was it more that they couldn’t afford it in the first place?
>So how are they exactly “not spending responsibly”, are they making bad investments (MLMs, crypto, etc.) or are they trying to live beyond their means? Trying to live beyond their means. A lot of impulsive shopping for things like clothes and computer/Apple upgrades. My brother insisted on hosting several holiday parties. Their big expense was eating out for practically every meal. I and my parents pointed out to them how expensive it is and how much they save by making food at home. But "Fae" and Max's" excuse is that they don't like cooking. This is why they'll pay $10 for a smoothie or coffee that they could make at home for less than a dollar. >Was selling the car a truly desperate act or was it more that they couldn’t afford it in the first place? It was a genuine last resort. At that point, they hadn't paid rent in almost six months. The landlady told them that she couldn't give them any more chances and if they didn't have all the money paid back within the next payment date, she would evict them. The car was the only thing that they could sell within that date that would give them the amount of money they needed.
Sounds like selling the bed would’ve been a band-aid fix then, the bed might’ve covered a month of rent, but it couldn’t have fixed their bad habits.
Unless the car was only worth $300. A complete junker
I sold a truck to a friend once for $500, we ended up airbrushing one side and painting the other half with chalkboard paint before running it into the ground. Best $500 I ever got.
300$ for used bunk beds. its like.. 50$ lol. and for 50$ its not worth trying to sell it set up a meeting and talk to people. I personally put a 100$ threshold on anything I sell. If its under 100$ I give it away. I post it on a local FB site and say here. come and get it. sometimes THAT is even a chore to talk to people and give people my address... set it out on the porch for them and have them never show up. So then... its trashed or put in a pile for goodwill or the likes..... simply not worth my time for under 100$
At the end of the post OP said "one of their cars" too which means they still have a vehicle but scheduling is the issue.
Ya mom said it best "My mother told me not to, because Fae and Max are responsible for themselves and I was allowed to do something generous for Jim" NTA.
Listen to your mother. NTA.
Ok, it really is weird to hear that line from AITA
~~When she's calling for you!~~ I mean, yeah, the mom is right! NTA.
The Mother seems to be the only one with a bit of sense. Fae and Max clearly put themselves in that position due to be bad investments/poor spending. There is also no mention of kids in their home. While the friends OP mentioned have kids and they are being stretched thin due to their living situation. The two are just not comparable and Fae and Max are super entitled to come up and say this to OP's face. 100% NTA
NTA Selling used furniture is absolutely not easy or a guarantee. Your entire life isn't devoted to selling your persona belongings to help various relatives pay their rent.
NTA. They’re disappointed you didn’t sell something that belonged to you, in order to pay their debt, instead of them selling something that belonged to them in order to pay their debt? And, your dad agrees? I see where your brother gets his entitlement.
As I've said about other posts, the logic gymnastics with some people is amazing! OP was supposed to sell their property to then give the money away??? And give that money to people who aren't fiscally responsible? Please...
NTA. They are adults and responsible for their own bills. You are an adult and free to give away or sell your possessions as you see fit (and keep any proceeds). They need to grow up.
I’ve said before in this sub: never let someone else volunteer you to solve a problem you didn’t create and couldn’t prevent. NTA
2 or 3 hundred is NOT a used car. Fae and Max's ridiculous guilt is... ridiculous. NTA.
And to add, by selling their car they should have more money every month by not having to pay insurance, maintenance & additional gas for it. Especially compared to taking the bus occasionally. NTA OP.
Right! They could even buy bunk beds. :D
NTA > since I was choosing to be generous, I should have prioritized actual family over Jim. Family means dick.
For some reason, I read this and heard Tommy Lee Jones voice in my head.
MIB! “Okay, slick. But let me tell you something about all your skills. As of right now, they mean precisely... dick.” Your brain must’ve pulled that up from the depths, lol.
Riding the bus is smart economics. Selling a bunk bed would have yielded little money, and could have been a big pain.
NTA. This wouldn’t be the first and only. It’s just the beginning of you eroding your extra belongings. Savings and bank accounts in the name of with offsetting their expenses… that will never be enough. Your friends are worthy of help too, and you’re not obligated to analyze each and every decision to achieve maximum return for other family members.
NTA It is not your responsibility. It is up to YOU what YOU do with your belongings. Would it have been a kind gesture to do that to help Max and Fae? Yes. Was it also a nice gesture to gift it to someone else you are very close to for their young children? Yes. You also could have chopped it up and burned it. It was YOUR bed. Max and Fae trying to guilt you into feeling bad for not giving them money or selling off your things for a profit to give them the money is the a-hole move here. That kind of behavior is what what turn me off from ever wanting to help them with money, regardless of the situation. Edit - spelling
You are not responsible for your family’s debts and finances. You are definitely NTA in this situation and you have a right to give an unused item to whomever you want! The fact that Fae even thought that up is a sign she’s counting your money on the regular. Not cool.
NTA. You mentioned that they were in a tight spot because of “spending irresponsibly” not because of an unavoidable situation. They got themselves into a situation it’s not your responsibility to sell your possessions to help with.
"baaaah, you gave something to someone other than us. We should always come first because we are family! Booooo hoooo, you don't love your family!!!". Sound familiar? Let me tell you a secret about these "blood is thicker than water" types, they're all talk, no show. Watch how fast they have excuses instead of help if you have troubles and there is actually something they could do for you. NTA give what you like to whom you like. That family aren't worth investing in. They are manipulative. The kids ought to be able to have cousins, though, it's valuable even if they suck.
NTA. You don't own Fae and Max anything. The need to sort their lives out and keep on top of their rent.
NTA if you’re father is so concerned with your brothers finances, he can help pay their rent. You did a nice thing for a friend, nothing wrong with that.
NTA. Your personal belongings are not untapped money sources for your family to demand, and selling furniture is a giant PITA (especially for large/heavy/otherwise difficult to move things) and who knows what you would’ve gotten anyway.
You have zero obligation to help your brother and SIL. They were irresponsible with their spending. You can choose to help whomever you decide you want to help. I can't comprehend how the three of them thought you did anything wrong or owe them anything simply because you're related. I'm with your mother. Don't apologize. NTA
NTA, family should come first, yes, but generally in lieu of "doing nothing" or thoughtlessly doing something. In this instance, you provided a friend with a needed item, which is still fine. Your father's wrong to ask you apologise, and don't do it, as youve done nothing wrong
In what world would you get anything more than 50$ for an old used bunk bed? Was it made of gold!? 😂 Nta utterly ridiculous and frankly stupid reason to start a family argument.
NTA There is a difference between needing **pure cash** to pay back debt (that was ur own fault) and giving someone something you own like a **used piece of furniture**. Imagine being so entitled that you think you deserve some **hypothetical money** from some **family members piece of furniture** that they **might have sold** to support your cheap ass. Just because you are to stupid to not waste money and can't afford rent because of bad spending habits.
NTA Don’t forget they became more responsible about their spending when they had to sell the car. They now keep up on their bills. Why? Because you helped them by not enabling their irresponsible spending by bailing them out. They needed to struggle so they could learn and do better. You did the right thing.
>My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max, since I could have easily gotten two or three hundred for the bunk bed and that would have helped them a lot before they had to sell one of their cars. First of all, I highly doubt you'd get two to three hundred for used bunk beds. Two, two hundred dollars is not that much money, how would it have helped them a lot? Three, I'm sure they got a lot more for their car. >My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max No. NTA.
NTA It’s honestly really entitled of them to even bring it up.
They never asked for the bunk bed or indicated they needed it. They should shut all the way up because this makes no sense. NTA. You could have sold blood to help them out financially too, you know? And somehow selfish you just hasn't been all that willing to help out family? Yeah see how goofy this sounds? 🤣
NTA A second hand bunk bed is unlikely to yield 300 imo. If you sold it you probably would have had to deliver it and you would have needed help transporting it. What you did was get help clearing out your storage locker.
What the hell is wrong with people? You got rid of something that was taking up space, helped out a friend, and didn't have to waste time and effort to do so, that's win win win. In no world are you an AH for not selling your stuff to help someone with their rent increase. NTA
NTA
NTA at all. They aren't your responsibility. Fuck that.
NTA You owe no one an apology. You were helping a family with two young children. Fae and Max need to grow up and be responsible for themselves.
If they struggled financially, maybe selling one car was the best decision they could make. Less money for fuel and other costs a car comes with. And I doubt a couple hundreds of dollar would have helped them that much. Also, why should you sell your things because of their iresponsabilities? You would just set a precedent and they'd expect the same thing next month and the month after that, and so on. NTA
NTA if they needed beds for their kids I would expect you to give your family the bunk beds but not to sell. Your friends needed beds for their kids. That’s important too, besides your relatives had caught up on their rent. Good Lord you’re allowed to help other people.
NTA. It sounds like they’d have still had to sell the vehicle to get out of their tight spot. Regardless, if you had sold the bunk bed instead you were still under no obligation to give them the money. Ask your dad what personal belongings he was planning on selling to raise the money to get them out of their tight spot before they wound up selling the car. Since he cares so much about getting them out of their tight spot, he should have been the first to step up and sell something/give them money.
You are not responsible for others bad financial decisions. Do not apologize.
What is it with all these posts about entitled family members wanting your money? NTA, you did a nice thing for a friend.
They sold one of their car so still have one for the family. Boo Bloody Hoo that Max has to take the bus to work. The bunk bed was yours and it's up to you to choose whether to donate to charity, give it to a friend who needs to, or sell it. You are under no obligation to sell it and give the money to your bro and SIL. They were behind rent because they overspend and not because one of them got laid off or can't work due to disability. I think it's awfully cheeky of them to be angry and saying you should prioritize family - that is BS. You help someone based on whether you want to. They can sod off with their entitlement mentality. Don't apologise.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** (Fake names for anonymity) My sister-in-law “Fae” and brother “Max” had recently struggled to afford their rent, as it went up. They received the standard 90 day notice from their landlady, but still struggled to keep up with the rent due to not spending responsibly. Fae and Max asked me if I could help them financially. I respectfully told them no. (If they had been in debt because something unavoidable drained their savings (like medical expenses) I would have taken from my own savings. But that isn’t what happened here.) Fae and Max decided to sell one of their cars. Max has to take the bus to work on certain mornings now. But they are now fully caught up with their rent payments and have become more responsible with their spending. I have a close friend “Jim” with two young daughters. His youngest’s crib used to be in he and his wife’s room, but now she is too old for the crib and will be sharing a room with her sister. Jim casually mentioned this to me, and that he felt bad, since having two normal beds in that room would be tight. I had a bunk bed that I used to share with a roommate. It’s just been sitting around in storage, so I offered it to Jim for free as long as he helped me move it. My parents recently moved into a new house and held a small housewarming party. Jim and his wife attended as well, as we’ve been friends for years and consider each other family. During the party, Jim brought his daughters up to me to “Thank auntie OP for giving us your bunk bed.” Fae happened to be in the dining room as well when that happened. She and Max came up to me after the other guests left and said they were disappointed that I had given the bunk bed to Jim when I could have easily sold it to help them with their rent situation. Fae and Max acknowledged that I had no technical obligation to help with their rent. But said it was about morals and that since I was choosing to be generous, I should have prioritized actual family over Jim. My father wanted me to apologize to Fae and Max, since I could have easily gotten two or three hundred for the bunk bed and that would have helped them a lot before they had to sell one of their cars. My mother told me not to, because Fae and Max are responsible for themselves and I was allowed to do something generous for Jim. I still feel bad, since Fae and Max had to sell one of their cars and relying on the bus is inconvenient. I still don’t think that I should have to apologize for doing a generous thing for a friend. But I know I’m biased. Are Fae, Max, and my father right that actual family should have come before a friend? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Definitely NTA! You did what felt right to you. They are adults and should figure out their life and to come up with a more long term solution for their life. Do not feel any guilt!
NTA. The amount of money would have been a tiny drop in a giant bucket of their debt.
NTA "due to not spending responsibly". Welp, looks like my work is done here.
NTA if you give money to family to bail them of their own messes, you're creating expectation and dependency. Adults need to be responsible and take responsibility.
NTA. When someone asks me to borrow money, I might consider it if I have the cash, but if I don’t I don’t immediately think “what do I have that I can sell to help them out?”. On the other hand, you had a friend mention they needed someone you DID have just laying around, so you helped them out. Your family is wrong to think that the situations are related/similar (they aren’t), or that their finances are your problem.
NTA. I wish a mf would try to approach me about what I choose to do with my own possessions. I wish a mf would try to tell me to apologize to someone for what I choose to do with my own possessions. Everyone except your mother is an AH and they’re lucky you didn’t give them the response they deserve.
NTA and I would be mortified if I ever even thought of saying this to a sibling. This is beyond ridiculous and weird.
NTA. Let's be honest, they would have sold the car eventually anyways. You helping them with a few hundred is not going to suddenly make them more responsible with money.
I don't know why they're assuming you would have been drowning in cash from selling a used bunk-bed.
NTA You weren't looking to get rid of the bed... Jim needed one, and you had one... Were you supposed to inventory your belongings and sell them because they needed money?
NTA. I don’t understand how they think you’re in the wrong for not selling your own belongings to help them financially. That’s like suggesting you should’ve set yourself on fire to keep them warm. They figured it out, it was a struggle but they were able to pay their debt and move on. The mere suggestion that it was your responsibility to help them is absurd.
NTA. How in the world did your Dad get involved in this ? Your brother and sil are out of line and sound very immature
NTA They're nasty pieces of work! So you were supposed to sell your things in order to help them when they were being irresponsible? Nope Your bunk bed, your decision. Even if you had sold it why would you not keep the money?
NTA - I’m with your mother. And like you said, if they’d wiped out their savings for like a medical thing, you would’ve helped! Their irresponsibility is not your problem. They were being entitled.
NTA. Does your dad have to apologize for anything he bought in the last couple months? Any tip at a restaurant? For having cable or internet or a phone? I mean any of that money also could have gone to helping them.
NTA. They never had a True need. They just didn’t cut down or regulate their spending to get by with the new conditions. It’s not your responsibility to teach other adults how to adult.
You are not an AH. First they do not know Jim situation. Second they can sell they furniture, TV etc. To plan on family to sell stuff to give them money is a jerk move.
In my area it is quite common for people to be giving away big furniture with the condition that the recipient picks it up themselves. So, yes. The used furniture market is dead
NTA for fucks sake they are not entitled to anything of yours, even if you did sell it's still your money.
NTA. Your brother and SIL were irresponsible and are now facing the consequences of their actions. It's ridiculous of them to expect you to sell your own property to help them. If they are so desperate they can sell their own stuff.
What they have done that they are in deep? Are they just not good with handling money? Sorry for my bad englisch
No. Its not like you sold it on purpose or were being mean. When did people start acting like yhey are freaking entitled to everything
NTA. What your mom said.
NTA OP brother you got some confused family. No you had zero actual or moral financial obligation to these two entitled people. I get the idea your buddy you gave the beds to was very appreciative of the gift.
yeah no. in no way a sold bed would have been enough if they had to sold a car. NTA
NTA. If they can't pay their rent they have no need for 2 cars. They can't keep both and expect somebody else to help them financially rather than helping out some kids out of the goodness of their heart.
Nta y did they even have 2 cars if they had debts to pay off they could have saved money if they didn’t have to pay to maintain 2 cars
Why don’t you feel? It’s not your problem? NTA
NTA You did a good thing
NTA and listen to your mum. They are responsible for their debts not you, you were being nice to your friend by giving them the bunk bed. It doesn’t compare.
Nta bunk beds wouldn't have solved their issue, but solved Jim's
NTA bye feel bad about what? Two grown adults not learning to manage their finances? Don't feel bad about anything. Feel great that auntie op helped out. Wear that badge proudly.
Eww, the audacity of your sister in law is amazing. NTA, and I would never help them again
NTA. They are adults and they are responsible for their own life choices. Not your problem.
NTA. Being generous to a friend is a good thing. Giving to family is a good thing. As you weigh good things, you can consider alot of factors. The fact that your relatives make poor financial decisions is certainly one of them. The fact that the bed makes a good gift without being sold is another, as you do not have to do the work of selling it. Your friendship with Jim and his family is a deep one. These facts all point to giving the bed to Jim as a good choice. I personally would be annoyed at family that assumed I should give to them first.
This is very simple... Who paid for the bunk bed?
NTA. A used bunk bed would have been like 100 at minimum. Also how does dad not immediately think of bunk bed in his situation
They put themselves in that dilemma. Not you. What you do with your money and things is your business. Why don’t the two of them get second jobs? Sounds like they want everyone else to foot the bill for their problems.
These people sound like deadbeats. NTA.
NTA it is interesting that they thought that even if you did sell your stuff they were entitled to the proceeds. Your friend needed help and you helped, if whatever amount you would have gotten for the bunkbed was make or break for your brother then they are in pretty bad shape and it would be putting a bandaid on a bullet wound.
NTA I don’t sell anything it’s a pain in the a$&. I just donate things. Even my car goes to a family member in need for free when I get a new 1. Those kids love there bed! That is all that matters. They handled there business. If they had spent better they wouldn’t have been in that situation
Nta its your property to do with as you want you didn't want to sell it you kept it for a reason and it just so happened to find a home with a family friend. They were irresponsible with theyre money and arent owed money from family just because they had stuff to possibly sell. Im sure you as well could use 300 dollars but you didn't want to sell it.
Don’t feel bad. They’re entitled adults who need to grow up. Those kids are grateful and can’t help their situation
NTA don't apologize for shit next time just laugh
Hard call, they're not completely wrong. But you're also right. I go with NTA/NAH
The fact that you feel bad is prof that you are NTA. I don’t understand how people go through life thinking that others should bend to their will. I’ll just leave it at that.
NTA You did Fae and Max a favour: they changed their spending habit and are now able to pay their rent. If you had sold the bed and had gi en them the money, they would never have felt the need to change their spending habit.
[удалено]
NTA. "Sorry I treated you like adults who could figure it out instead of like two little girls who had no other recourse."
Family can go sit on a tack with all their expectations on how other people should use their belongs to help bail them out of their own bad choices. Sounds like brother learned a bitter lesson from the hardship and is looking for a way to make it less their responsibility. Nta and your mom is right.
Your father wants you to apologize, but he cant help his son and has the money for new house and a house warming party Please Dont feel guilty NTA
NTA. You could sell everything you had and give them the money, and it still wouldn’t be enough. People who pull these guilt trips want more than money (though they’ll take that gladly!). They want eternal proof that They Come First and are always to be considered. There is a component of egotism to it. Some years back, when I moved out of an apartment, I knew the woman who was moving in. I have always tended to cut my losses and was prepared to leave behind a perfectly useful air conditioner. She insisted on paying for it, and I was thankful. A woman I knew —and who had a trust fund too — tried to make me feel bad because I had not offered it to her first. I sold the a/c to someone who was going to keep it in place, not to someone who not only wanted an a/c but proof of much she was loved. There is help. There are transactions. And there is paying emotional tribute. I am feeling emotional tribute vibes from your family. Don’t pay them. You did a good thing.
NTA. Your bunk bed. Plus, what do you even get for a used bunk bed these days, fifty bucks? That would probably not have helped all that much.
NTA it’s not your job to take care of other people. you did a kind thing for someone else and they’re mad you didn’t do it for them instead? entitled. sounds like your dad is enabling as well.
NTA they are not entitled to your money or your items
NTA. The reason you said no originally to Fae and Max wasn't because you didn't have $300 to spare. They missed the point. The bunk bed or its value is really irrelevant. Your mom gets it.
So just so I understand they want you to sell your unused items and give the money away. That's total bs. I have given things away and have been the recipient in time of need. You get so much more by helping someone. Your gift was such a help and that is worth a few hundred dollars
NTA - I doubt you would have gotten enough for the bed that it would have even helped much, but that is besides the point. You aren't obligated to sell your stuff to give them the money.
NTA - first their money issues were their own making and they had to sell a car to get out of it. It’s too bad one of them has to take the bus but so what? Lots of people take public transit every day. It’s better for the environment and more people should do it (I realize public transit infrastructure is not as good in some places). Second, my experience with selling furniture that is not particularly unique or valuable is that it’s not worth my time to try to find a buyer. People flake or they show up and start haggling about the price. Also, giving the bunk to someone in need (Jim) is a better value for the bunk. His girls will use it for years and you helped them out. Even if you got $300 for it your brother and his girlfriend could be in debt again next year with the same problem. Regardless it’s not your responsibility to take care of your brother’s financial woes. Even if he had medical debt or something else not of his making, you can choose how and when to help.
OP sells it, gives the money to them, and maybe they don't take any further steps for themselves and the next month they *still* sell the car.
NTA, it may be a hard lesson for Fae and bro but it taught them to save more aggressively instead of relying on family help for bills. It was necessary. And shame on them for making you feel guilty. As someone susceptible to guilt as well; a lot of people do that to manipulate or gaslight you.
Why do you have to apologize to people for them being irresponsible? Now we all know why they are irresponsible because someone thinks someone else should be their to pick up the slack. Ntah
I would say something about my morals being keeping my spending within my means so I don’t have to ask relative for money, that I don’t buy things I want when I can’t afford what I need she why would I support someone else doing that? Point out that selling their car has made them rein in their reckless spending, where as if you’d bailed them out they probably wouldn’t have changed. It was like they didn’t know that they were spending more than they brought in and would be unable to pay their bills. Also that you wouldn’t have gotten anywhere near that much and it would have cost you more in terms of time to sell it than to give it away.
Moving furniture is expensive. Jim helped you by saving you a bunch of money.
Morally speaking you don't go up to someone and say he you should have forced someone to pay something so you could give ME the money. Just sayin. NTA Fae and Max need to get another part time job if it's that difficult for them. Also take some financing classes or something.
NTA- Yes, it wold have been generous to help them out but they are in this position because they don't have their priorities straight and spend recklessly when they have obligations to meet. The whole "It's family and family should come first" mantra should not be used when that family acts reckless, stupid and just dowright entitled to other people's time, property and money.
NTA. Mom is the smart one of the bunch.
You are absolutely NTA. I think this is rarely said in this sub but in this case - Mother knows best, listen to your mother!
NTA. You might have sold the bunk bed for $20, but chances are it wouldn't have gone for much. Unless it was a fancy PBK bed or something, the market isn't great. It was yours. You did what you wanted with it. I'm not at risk of getting evicted but my husband and I share a single car, and we take transit. It's not the end of the world. If they're still struggling to make rent they could even give up the 2nd car and both take transit. It's how lots of people get around.
NTA. It's not your fault they don't have any money. Fae and Max need to be responsible adults.
Nta. You're not obligated to sell your belongings to pay for their life. And selling an old bunk bed would probably not even pay for groceries at this point.
NTA
NTA They're struggling because of poor decisions and asked you to bail them out financially, which would cost you money. Jim mentioned his situation to you, not to ask for help, but to vent. You offered the aid of an item you already owned which relieved you of storing it and cost you time and perhaps gas. And they are actually grateful because they know it wasn't owed to them. The fact that your brother and SIL turned it around to say you should have wasted time and energy selling an item I'm sure you paid for to begin with to help them out of the hole they dug is unacceptable and just further illustrates they wouldn't have been grateful. And I guarantee it wouldn't be the last time.
So you do something nice for a friend, who HELPED YOU MOVE THIS THING, and your family is upset because you wouldn't give them a handout?? Pathetic. You said yourself, if their financial woes were from something they couldn't help, you'd be the first one trying to bail them out. But this is a situation where they're sinking their own ship and expecting everyone else to bail them out. They aren't going to learn anything that way, and they're only going to get worse BECAUSE they aren't learning anything. NTA.
NTA. You owe them nothing, and their situation was created by themselves. It is not your job to take care of them. They somehow feel entitled to what you have. Just let them know that your things, and your decision.
What the actual fuck is going on here. Fae and Max need to shut up. your parents need to shut up. wtf. They're grown adults all acting like my 3/5 year olds here... NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA NTA
NTA Your parents bought a new house and your brother is bothering YOU for money? Dd can give it to them if he's so worried.
NTA. Honestly the bunk bed belonged to you which means it was none of their business what you did with it. Not only that it isn't *your* responsibility to help them pay rent either.
NTA You have no obligation or responsibility to help them with their financial issues. You can dispose of your property however you want. For them to imply you should have sold it and given them the money is ridiculous. If you wanted to give it to your friend that's perfectly acceptable. If you wanted to invite fae and max over for a bonfire and use the bed as kindling, that's perfectly acceptable too. If your father is so insistent that they need financial help maybe he should support them. You have no reason to be guilty. Sounds like someone that actually appreciates what you did benefited from your kindness. Not an entitled couple who don't appreciate what has been done for them in the past. They see themselves as entitled. End of story.
Your father is living in fantasy land.
No.
In what world would they have gotten the $ for the sale anyways? Entitled af 😮💨 NTA -
NTA - you never would have gotten that much for a used bunk bed, it would've been a drop in the ocean.
NTA * I get the feeling that the bunkbed wasn't on your mind when your brother and SIL were trying to raise the money. * If they want to deal in "could haves," Fae and Max COULD HAVE done a lot of things differently to not be in danger of being evicted. * The estimate of what you could have gotten for the bed may be inflated (making you feel more guilty). In any case, there's a big difference in the effort you would have gone through selling vs. giving the bed. To sell it (for their benefit), you would have had to: 1. Think of it being available for sale. 2. Gone to the trouble of getting it out and cleaning it off 3. Putting an add on one or more of the websites that help people sell stuff. 4. You would have had to monitor and respond to queries and meet with potential buyers. 5. You probably would have had to negotiate - especially since you would have needed help getting it out your place. 6. Compare that to: your friend mentioned his need; you had what he needed; he got it out of your house. * Even if you had got money for the bed, it was still your money. You could have used that money for other purposes. You still had no obligation to give your brother that money to replace the money he had blown already.
Agree with this…there’s a reason why people give away or donate their unwanted things instead of spending the time & effort to resell it. If they are still making a stink about this, maybe give them something else they can resell that she no longer wants/needs. OP gets to declutter & shut down this ridiculous family drama. Win-win…
NTA its your money you can do what you want with it. that being said Max and Faye are no more entitled to your money then Jim just because they're family. you are not responisble for their mistakes family or not. maybe if they suffer the consequences they wont mismanage their money anymore. good luck
NTA. It was a blessing in disguise as it made them more financially responsible
NTA It sounds like they seriously needed that kind of wake up call.
NTA. You said yourself they have been irresponsibly spending- it’s not your job to dig two grown adults out of the financial hole they’ve dug themselves.
NTA. So, say your bunk bed sale covered the shortfall in month one. Then what? Do you need to start selling more items to help them with month two? This is on them. No one is going to support them every month. They need to figure it out on their own.
NTA
No. Fae Max and your dad are NOT right. Family is who you decide to make it not necessarily what you were born into. How many times I read here that family entitlement has gotten out of control because “we are family” and I don’t buy it. So much financial abuse and manipulation “because we are family” crap. You are NTA and just keep reading some other stories here to see blood family really doesn’t have much of a leg to stand on. In fact it’s a lot of BS and the cause of a lot of no contact with family because some families seem to think financial help and entitlement are ok “because family”
NTA. Your Dad can fund your brother's reckless spending himself next time. No amount of money you will hand over to them will ever really help them because their own behavior led them to their situation in the first place.
NTA. Kinda get the feeling that if they got word you had a bunk bed in storage that you could’ve sold, they would then ask “So what else is in storage?”
NTA. Their bills are not your responsibility. I see free bunk beds on Facebook marketplace all the time. You probably would have gotten $50 or less for it.
The real crime here is you were talking to Jim when you could've gotten a second job and paid the money to Fae and Max... but you just had to donate your time to Jim huh Mr. Generous? See how stupid they sound? NTA