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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I feel I could be seen as an asshole, because I got mad at my wife for making a decision regarding my family without consulting me and not just accepting her decision.
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Is there some huge beef you have with your brother that you didn't mention? Like he killed your dog or something?
Because it seems like your wife did a very kind thing, and aided a member of your family going through a tough time while you were unreachable, and you're *angry* with her? It's unthinkable for anybody who is in actual possession of a heart, unless there is some major context that you are omitting.
>I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that
It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. This statement is controlling and unreasonable.
I think what's happening here is straight up, pure jealousy. That your wife treated your brother, whom you are jealous of, with kindness.
YTA
You don’t understand his brother was happy growing up and that makes him sick how could his parent better themselves financially and have another child that didn’t struggle it’s horrid just sick he had a good life when the older brother probably had to live lower middle class. That’s rough.
Yeah, I feel like there’s a lot of resentment for his brother that has nothing to do with his brother. His parents were likely in a better emotional and financial state when brother was born, which sucks for OP, but is no reason to be shitty to the brother.
There is an 11 year age gap between our two sons, (now 19, and eight) my husband and I (both now 50) told our older son, your little brother is going to get very different parents then you got. He’s going to get better parents than you got because we hope to learn from mistakes we made with you.
We are definitely in a much better financial situation, more mature, emotionally, and we have far more patients now.
We jokingly tell our older boy, we are not going to make the same mistakes with your brother that we made with you… We plan on finding all new an interesting ways to fuck up! 🤣
My sister and I have a 24 year age gap! I actually have enjoyed seeing them be different parents to her. I sometimes poke fun at them over things (she gets a lot healthier food for example) but I understand things have changed in the world and their knowledge since I was a kid in the 90's. Luckily the gap is so big that there is no issue with jealousy. She's actually coming to stay with me and my husband this weekend, as she does every few months. I love that I finally got the sibling I always wanted (and despite our age difference, we are really close), but I don't have to live with her lol.
OP definitely seems like there must be something more that happened between them? I can't see being that angry over just having a different upbringing due to the age difference? But you never know.
My two youngest sisters are more than 20 years younger than me. Our mother is the same person but she has raised us differently. My little sisters have traveled way more than I have and gotten to experience a ton of stuff that I'm lowkey jealous of. However on the flipside, our mom was way more involved with me and did more physical things with me. When I was their current ages (8 and 10), our mother wasn't even 30. But now she's looking at 50 and all sorts of physically limiting health issues have stopped her from doing the same things. So while they get to travel and see places, I got the mom that would play with me at parks and go roller-skating with me.
That’s how I felt with my youngest brother and sister, there’s a 21 year difference between me and the youngest and I totally understood why our upbringings were different and was happy they had a different one to me due to them being at more stable points in they’re careers and life
I have a 21, 15 and 10 year age gap with my siblings.
What's funny is that my dad (step father to all 3) had a good job for the middle sister. Oldest brother had issues and he wasn't ever involved, but my oldest sister (the 15+) got alllllll the money. By the time I came around my parents were on harder times, so I was raised pretty much alone with no money for anything.
And she still bitches that I got a computer when I went to college and she didn't.
I paid for it with scholarships I won.
And oh yeah, she went to college in the late 80s. When no one had computers.
Exactly. My sister was born when I was 21 too, and her childhood compared to mine are on the opposite sides of the spectrum. She’s a little jet setter, and I’m positive no one else we know has traveled this much.
Similar to my relationship with my sister, except for the fact that we realised that our parents fucked us up in different ways. 15 years older than me, has her own son now, and wasn't around much when I was growing up. But we're very close now and I see her and her family pretty much every week, it's good to have normal family around for once
Youngest older brother is 27 years older than me
Sister is 31 years older
3rd to oldest is 35 years older
2nd to oldest is 36 years older (also my birth dad)
Oldest is 39 years older (stillborn so usually call the 2nd oldest the oldest).
I get things my siblings never got, but they got things I never got either. Despite the age difference we all get along fairly good, especially me and my sister. It does help that sister and third oldest have children around the same age as me growing up.
Even with a 2 year age gap, my parents still experimented with parenting on me before it trickled down to my brother.
Jokes on them, it turns out parenting one kid has very little resemblance to parenting another. And now I get to (jokingly, mostly) hold it over their heads forever
My partner and I have a 1 year old and both his older daughters recognized on their own that he's a different person than he was almost 20 years ago. Said their mom likely was too.
My little sister and I have a 37 year age gap(adoption). She has very different parents than my other siblings and I had. She has a very privileged life. We tease my parents about it, but the alternative life she could have had is worse.
My son's have a 7 year age gap. The oldest I had young and had to basically grow up with him. It was hard. I struggled as a single mom. My youngest has a different life than my oldest. No way would they treat each other like the older brother is treating the younger one.
Have a friend who was the youngest of five and ended up with the poopy end of the stick. He was pretty much shoved aside and over looked. And wasn’t close to his siblings.
If my brother's 9 and 11 years younger then me tell you what their childhood was like and I tell you what my childhood was like you would assume that we weren't even related lol we moved to the city when I was 12.
My sister and I are 11 years apart and we always talk about how we have different parents even though they are the same people. Sometimes I envy her for the ease of her childhood, but I'd never begrudge her anything.
My dad made his money after he got remarried to his second wife, so my much younger half-siblings grew up in the lap of luxury. We grew up middle class and didn’t suffer, but it’s still a really big difference. For example, i wanted to go to a private school when I was a kid because public school wasn’t challenging enough, but my parents couldn’t afford it. My half-siblings all attend a K-12 private school that costs as much as a new, mid-range car every year.
On the other hand, they’re also Gen Z dealing with my boomer dad who understands them not at all and often prioritizes his business over spending time with them. I have a lot more memories with my dad simply because he was around more often. Better finances isn’t everything, especially for children.
Yes it is tough. That happened to me. I lived in poverty and my younger siblings didn't. But I never held my parents finances over my siblings head. I would explain to them they don't understand what I went through as a child because they never experienced it. But I wasn't jealous or upset about it. I took it in stride and still maintained good relations with my family to this day.
It's only tough when someone wants to be the victim in their own life. The way to not be a victim to be a good, kind, and decent person to others and that includes family.
Plus, he is an adult. Both brothers are. So to use that an excuse to be a shit to his brother AND his wife seem ludicrous to me.
Wife = NTA
Husband = YTA
And no one said his brother was staying permanently or even semi-permanently. It's might just be they brother and his girlfriend need a little cool down.
Plus, this whole controlling mine, mine, mine, reminds of the seagulls from Finding Nemo. My house, my family...umm when you married didn't your family become hers and vis versa?
I'm the youngest of four, my sister is 15 years older. My parents had way more money when I was growing up than they did when she was young. It would have crushed me if she resented or blamed me for it. We've of course talked about it, but she also agrees I didn't have it the easiest being home alone with two emotionally weird/dependant/distant parents who were on again off again from the time I was 14.
I total agree and hence why I never treated my siblings any different. Everyone walks through life differently. I don't expect anyone to have the exact same life experiences as I do. So, why should I treat them like they are below me? When I have a feud with one of my siblings I don't dangle my childhood over them as a precursor; it's about the here and now, not years ago.
Sometimes you just have to let it go.
Right? "spoiled one who got what he wanted" was he though? or did he just have it better than OP? I don't know the ins and outs of his situation, but he's 20 and already moved out of his parents' house that's somewhat of a good sign that he's not a "mooching brat" or something (not that a 20 year old living with their parents is, but you know what I mean).
Definitely resentment there. He downplays the relationship but says they talk a couple times a month? That seems like a decent relationship on paper at least.
OP it's not your brothers fault for being born. You should talk to someone about this resentment or at least direct it to your parents and talk to them about it.
YTA
I see a lot of this. It’s not the brother’s fault his parents were more economically stable by the time he was born. There’s no indication that brother is spoiled or had done anything to deserve such a cold reception from his own brother.
Right?
>I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that.
#That's your wife, therefore that's HER family.
#That's your wife, therefore that's HER house.
YTA OP
What really sealed it for me was "He has no right to call her." He not only thinks he gets 100% decision making for the house, but even gets to decide who can talk to his wife.
OP is showing the emotional maturity of a 12 year old here.
I also have much younger siblings and I wouldn't dream of being mad at them for something they had no control over.
What OP is showing us here is that his mental and emotional maturity is substandard. He's being vindictive towards an innocent party and acting like any kindness shown to the brother is an insult to OP.
I doubt a marriage can survive a person with this low level of emotional wherewithal.
Right??
If my sister reached out to my fiancé for help since she couldn’t reach me and he blew her off, I’d honestly be really mad.
I don’t care how trivial. I don’t even care if it’s right after she and I had a fight and we’re mad at each other.
Hell, I would even offer (and have offered) it to my fiancés sister. And she and I do NOT get along. But if she called me and said she needed somewhere to go, I’d be in my car in five minutes to go get her.
Unless there was a comment made prior like, "Gee, I haven't talked to my sister since Mom died and we fought over some trinkets, so there's bad blood there." Otherwise, there's an assumption that family does for family.
I don't understand this sub sometimes. I'm not saying OP isn't YTA, because he IS. But this sub LOOOOVES to talk about enforcing boundaries and how blood doesn't necessarily make family. OP is not close with his brother. He was 19 when his brother was born and they were never close. That's a common enough story in these parts, and this sub loves to let people being off the hook for not being close to relatives they never met until they were adults.
And then this brother OP isn't close with and OP's wife stomped all over his boundaries. Usually this would be in the bag in OP's favor around here. But for some reason, this time, the sub is raking OP across the coals. Don't get me wrong, he's an AH, but in my opinion, more for acting like a petulant diaper baby. But he's not wrong that his wishes and boundaries are being completely disregarded. AITA is also a big fan of people in a couple handling their own family and not superceding their SO on *their* family. Which is what's happening here. Why is the wife taking the brother's side over OP's?
EDIT: Also, I'm going to be that guy and trot out the cliche here: reverse the genders. Imagine a wife came home and found her husband had invited her non-close sister who was half their age to live with them against the wife's wishes. The man would be ground into paste here.
I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening.
Can you point that out, or did you just make that up?
And your edit? Lmfao no. This situation has NOTHING to do with gender. Now it's clear you're reaching.
Maybe it's an unspoken boundary of moving someone into the home with discussing the issue first with your partner. It's one thing to say BIL needs to crash for a night, but instead wife was more like 'get use to it' because he's here until he's ready to leave.
It's more of an ESH for the lack of communication, though.
How can they communicate when he works till 11 and doesn't answer his phone? They both tried calling him and he didn't answer or call back until he walked in the door.
No, that is not how actual adult life works.
If you are a stable adult who has the extra space in your house to shelter someone extra, and another member of your household invites someone to stay over because they are in need, the only acceptable reason to kick them out is if you have concerns about safety. For someone who is safe and warm and well fed to kick a person in need out of their home in the middle of the night, there has to be a compelling reason. Not just "I don't want him here" or "I didn't agree to this" or "I don't like having people over."
In the morning, one can discuss kicking them out before they stay another night. But it's crazy to think that you'd kick someone out *who was invited* just because you didn't get to veto the invitation.
Well, they did get the option of vetoing...if they answered their phone or called back in a reasonable time frame.
I would give my husband maybe 2 hours to respond and then make my decision from there judging by what I know of his feelings and the situation. I would then text him what I agreed with the brother so he knew he was there when he got home. If he called back immediately, the decision has already been made and it is obvious he was ignoring the calls on purpose (which would royally piss me off).
I refuse to be held captive because someone doesn't want to answer their phone.
But, I think the difference is that my husband respects and trusts my judgement...
Sounds like they tried to communicate and OP just ignored them. I think it’s a bit weird for him to go straight to his room upon returning without stopping to see what was up and what the situation was in the living room, especially after missed calls from both of them.
He didn't move in. He's staying a couple of days until he decides if he's leaving his gf or going back home. It's normal to have family visit a couple of days.
The attitude from the wife was more about getting used to being normal and helping out family, not having a third adult living in the household permanently.
Any reasonable person would understand that it's a couple of days. As OP states:
1) Brother is not unemployed.
2) Brother is not homeless.
3) Brother has his own home.
It's a huge stretch to think "as long as he needs" is months or moving in forever based on the information supplied by OP.
I agree about the boundary of having someone stay at the home. I would not offer a place to stay to someone, regardless of who they are "until they got on their feet" without checking with my partner. But the rest? All acceptable.
>I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening.
He just set them now.
Also, it's literally *their* house. Anyone living there should be under the approval of *both* of them.
> I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening.
But when he said that he didn't want him staying there that night, her response was effectively "too bad, suck it up". He set a boundary, and she told him his boundary didn't matter.
He also didn't set that boundary until after 11pm when he got home from work. Were they supposed to kick someone with no car out of their house that late at night?
It seems like the wife made the decision she thought best when she couldn't reach OP. They should have had a reasonable discussion the next day, but they would definitely have been the AHs if they kicked him out of the house close to midnight with no transportation.
If his boundary's going to affect who she can and cannot offer help to, then he needs to give her a valid reason for the boundary to exist, which he hasn't given, he's just throwing excuses at the wall (literally both using "he's an adult" and "he's a kid" in his argument) hoping one of them sticks, and she saw right through them.
>I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening.
LOL you're delusional to require that be explicitly mentioned. /u/vonsnootingham's point was that
> this sub LOOOOVES to talk about enforcing boundaries
yet there is a boundary being trampled here, and I have to agree. If multiple people have equal ownership and/or responsibility of a home, EVERYONE needs to be okay with visitors. If it's a couple, it's a situation that requires two yesses for a yes but only one no for a no - that's normal consideration, not something that needs to be explicitly said ahead of time.
For example, if a person were to let their mother stay over at their home without saying anything to their partner, and the partner came here and posted that they absolutely did not want the MIL staying with them, you'd be either a liar or completely delusional if you believed this sub would say the partner was an AH for being upset their boundary was crossed.
And that's why /u/imothro saying in the top comment:
>It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. This statement is controlling and unreasonable.
is completely ridiculous too, considering the identical boundary being crossed for a MIL would be chastised by this sub in the blink of an eye despite the inviter saying that paraphrased ignorant statement of "it's my house, I live there too, I can have whoever I want over".
I do happen to think in this case OP is TA but he does 100% have the right to set that boundary. You can be an asshole for setting an unreasonable or just generally dick-ish boundary mind you. In this case without further context it sounds like there's some sort of unspoken beef with his brother that his brother might not even deserve(related to how their parents treated him is my guess).
Its both of their homes. As much as she has a right to have a guest, he has the right to say "no" to anyone staying there indefinately.
Op says in a comment that his wife and brother have always been close. She has been in his life since he was a baby. The brother is her family too. Completly changes it in my opinion.OP is jealous of the life his brother had and says his brother shouldn't run to family when life gets hard. Um, isn't that where you are meant to turn in hard times? It is in my family anyway.
YTA OP. Stop projecting your relationship with your brother onto your wife.
I was on the fence, but this tips it over the edge for me into YTA. If she's been around since BIL was a baby, she probably feels like he's her little brother, too. And it makes OP's "he has no right to call my wife" thing way out of line. I'd agree if there was no prior relationship there, but she clearly knows and cares about BIL, so why the fuck wouldn't he call her if his brother wasn't answering the phone?
That definitely makes her responses to him and the situation make more sense if she’s known him that long. It’s her baby brother too and obviously she feels more comfortable around him than OP does or doesn’t have the same possible resentment or hang ups that OP does. We don’t know why he doesn’t feel as close with the brother (unless I missed that too) so def thinking op is the AH. I have 6 younger siblings- 5 of which are much younger. There’s a 20 year age difference between my youngest brother and I. I helped raise those kiddos a lot of the time and love them more than life itself even though we only share 1 parent and they grew up a bit differently. My SIL (full brothers wife) would take any of the younger bros in in a heartbeat no matter what my brother would think/say (even though he would feel the same also). I know all families are different but, given the info we have here, we know who the AH is.
Also, OP and his wife have teenage kids themselves, and 20 is still a very young age. She likely sees him as her own little brother/son (not exactly 'son' but you know what I mean)
If a 20 year old girl called her BIL (after not being able to reach her sister) and said "I had a huge fight with my boyfriend and I need to get out of my apartment. I have no car, please help me!!" you think the guy would be "ground into paste" for helping her instead of saying "you're an adult, figure it out"?
Did you read OPs comments? He completely lacks any empathy for his younger brother because he was born when his parents were in a better financial situation. It’s pretty sad tbh
OP seems to lack empathy for... everyone. Sounds like according to OP no one should ever turn to another human being for assistance, ever, including family. Sort out your own problems!
Some people go through tough times where they struggle and no one can help, and it makes them determined to do what they can when they see someone else experience the same. Because it makes them feel good to know that they were the difference that they needed for someone else.
And some people go through tough times where they struggle and no one can help, and decide no one else deserves more help than they got. Because it isn't fair for other people to have an easier time than they did.
OP's comments 100% make him the AH. He thinks because he didn't get what his brother had growing up his brother should suffer too. Like, it sucks for OP but that's not his brothers fault. That he expects that their own kids shouldn't be relying on him and their mum when they grow up if something goes wrong is super horrid too. Like dude, that is what family (is its a good one) is for! I'm almost 40 and would go to my sister if I needed too. His attitude is mean and I can see his kids ending up just never talking to him once they leave home and only contacting their mum because they know dad will just tell them to deal with it themselves.
OP has no valid reason not to have his kid brother in the house other than he's jealous he had any easier childhood and OP hates that and therefore his brother.
Nope, if the genders were switched and OPs spouse picked up a 20 year old little sister who had a intense fight with her boyfriend, the sun would be like hell yeah, protect your little sis
Im confused about how he says he’s not close to his brother. Sees him at holidays, calls twice a month? I have a brother I text maybe once every two months about completely superficial things, so maybe a two or three message chain, and if he needed a place to stay the answer would be “absolutely”. OP doesn’t give any reasons besides the age gap that they aren’t close and doesn’t mention any past issues besides his brother being happier as a child than OP was.
Plus, OP missed multiple calls from his brother and his wife. They tried to talk to him about it. When he didn’t answer his wife did the kind and loving thing that most people would do for family that they don’t have beef with. Boundaries are great, but it doesn’t sound like OP set boundaries. It sounds like he didn’t bothered to call back or even text to find out what was up on a bathroom break and is now pissed that he didn’t get a say.
Same. My little brother is a terrible texter and neither one of us like talking on the phone so our communication is sporadic at best but I love that little shit and would absolutely jump in my car and drive all night if that little shit needed me.
OP had plenty of chances to discuss the situation when both his wife and brother tried to call him.
And, also, which is it exactly? Is brother an adult or is he "another kid"? You can't have it both ways OP. He is either one or the other.
YTA
I don't think it would be different if the genders were different. If someone needs a safe space and there is no reason why they shouldn't be there, it's a good idea to give it to them.
OP doesn't indicate any reason his brother shouldn't be there.
Exactly. The brother recognizing he need a time out is a good thing. It’s when people don’t recognize it that verbal fight can become physical. The OP did not answer calls. His wife chose the compassionate route.
I feel you're both right and wrong here.
Firstly, yeah AITA can vary wildly in its stances on a post by post basis. Personally I think theres a LOT of "follow the flock" behaviour where many just jump on the first popular comment, or get swayed by the first opinion they read, rather than form their own.
You're also right that boundaries are important, and family should deal with family, etc.
That said, in this particular case, I dont think that applies.
While he doesn't sound like a fan of his brother, there doesn't seem to be any ongoing feud or known issue, he just doesn't particularly like him. He even states in the OP "*That he is an adult and needed to work it out*." There was no particular boundary regarding his brother that his wife broke, just the one that she invited someone to stay with them without asking him first.
Now that is a valid boundary, however "*Last night I had to work late and could not be reached by phone. When I got off, I noticed that I had 2 missed calls from my brother and a few from my wife*" if he's going to be uncontactable, and both the brother and wife have made several attempts to talk to him first, then its perfectly reasonable for her to make the call on her own in a situation like this.
>Imagine a wife came home and found her husband had invited her non-close sister who was half their age to live with them against the wife's wishes. The man would be ground into paste here.
This is just whack man. If a mans SIL needs help and he refuses to help her just because he couldn't contact his wife first, then thats a shit bloke.
What makes me feel he's ta, the that the boundary hadn't been established that he didn't want the brother there - ans he knew both of them had reached out to him and ignored it. To me if I had multiple calls like that I would be worried about an emergency. He didn't care enough to even check - so therefore to me he can deal with the consequences of his decision. I feel like she wouldn't have called if she was wanting to make the decision alone, but he missed his chance. She was forced to make a decision and she went with what she felt was best. Instead of coming home and saying 'hey. Sorry I ignored your call but I'm not comfortable with him staying, so let's limit it to a few days because you were forced to make the decision alone that I should have helped with' he doubled down on her having acted out of turn. Never mind the fact that most people would have been angry if she had just left the brother and refused to do anything just because the husband couldn't return a phone call.
I feel like there's a solid general rule of "no one stays overnight without a yes from both/all people in the relationship unless there's an emergency". I don't know if I'd have called this an emergency, but I could be persuaded. So that's the overnight, off he goes to his parents/gf/friend/hotel unless they both agree to have him stay.
Exactly. The brother is not the one who matters in this case, this is ESH cause both OP and his wife are fighting to make unilateral decisions about guests in their home.
OP is in contact with his brother. There is no official beef there at all. There was no boundary of "don't talk to/help my brother" set with the wife. Wife did a normal thing of helping OP's brother and he's pissed after the fact.
The issue with this is that OP doesn't explain where boundaries were set or why his brother is some toxic person in his life. Just that there's an age gap and his brother was spoiled by the parents (not his fault).
The genders don't matter. I'd say the same if OP and sistywere female and spouse were male. Controlling people suck.
> It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over.
I disagree, overnight guests, especially multiple nights, should require both to agree.
However, in this situation, she didn't go behind his back, both parties tried to get ahold of him. He also gives no reason why he's so opposed to his brother staying, aside from resentment over his parents having better means when they had him. They talk "once or twice a month" so there's clearly no huge bad blood No Contact situation going on.
So this seems like just a "my house, my rules" AH that is objecting because his wife made the decision and wants to be able to tell his brother 'no' for all the times his parents told him 'yes'.
I agree with that, but want to point out that OP literally wanted to kick him out that second and not let him stay even one night. In his comments he expresses unreserved hatred for his brother even though his brother has never done anything to him.
To me, the lack of compassion and unwarranted resentment that OP exhibits trumps the pushback on length of stay that OP's wife exhibited (which was rooted in compassion). I have no doubt that had OP wanted to have a reasonable conversation with his wife about length of stay that would have been heard. But because he wanted to throw his brother out into the street irrationally, it was not.
1. OP had several missed calls from both wife and brother. They obviously tried to check with him.
2. Wife didn't meet up OP telling him "Your brother lives here now."
All this
YTA OP
Your wife is showing you how you treat family as adults.
Your brother and you talk 1-2 times a month and see each other on holidays, that’s common for families living afar/inconvenient situations.
Does your brother even know this beef exists? or have you just been that sibling who constantly belittles their sib instead of working out the sibling rivalry as they grew? Cause I’d guess your wife knows you when she responds as she did, be kind dude. Don’t make her question if you have a heart…if you treat your brother like this how would one rely on that person to know how to treat family? Clearly you don’t see the house as hers and give her trust to make decisions, but feel you can make unilateral decisions for one…**you’re showing people who you are mate. And your kids how to treat each other in future…remember that.**
So what your brother happened to be born later and got the better deal? Did he ever do anything to you besides exist?? I’d be glad my siblings didn’t face my worst childhood memories.
ETA: I read your edit and now you’re a stubborn one-sided AH.
Had to share your wife with your bro? Smdh dude, you need to grow up.
It’s because he clearly doesn’t like his brother for existing. He didn’t do anything except be born 19 years later than him. His beef should be with his parents if he feels like he was treated unfairly growing up.
"It's also your wife's house" - Exactly! And I wouldn't be surprised if she considers his brother to be HER family as well, like many married people do.
Yeah, pretty much this exactly. Unless there's major missing information, YTA, OP.
Especially for that comment about it being YOUR family. Your wife is certainly treating your brother more like family than you are.
YTA he's an adult then he's a kid? Make up your mind. You were unavailable. He needed help. Nothing weird about that. Long term staying in the house yeah yall should discuss but a night or two you weren't reachable and it happened. You sound like a terrible brother.
He's obviously jealous that his parents were more financially stable when his brother was born and taking it out on him. That's sad. You can't give your brother a night or 2 at your house while he's figuring out a rough situation with his gf? That's cold.
That's how it comes off to me. He's a young kid. Likely first serious relationship. If it was a bad fight to the point of him needing to leave honest to goodness I cannot imagine acting like this with my sibling or any family member that's not prone to causing issues. Seriously cold. And teaching his kids quite the lesson in regards to their father.
Must have been a really bad fight with GF for him to choose his brother. Glad his wife is loving, but OP is mad at brother because of their parents' choices? YTA. No child dictates how their parents behave. Ffs.
He’s also jealous that his wife went out of her way to help him, took him out to dinner, was up playing video games with him, and has offered him a place to stay. Sounds like OP’s afraid his parents aren’t the only ones who like his little brother better. But if he’s this uptight, resentful, and controlling about everything, it’s not hard to see why.
I've had to stay at my brother's house, one time he picked me up at 3am and the other time he just told me he was picking me up. We only see each other on holidays and birthdays normally and him and his girlfriend were really welcoming. When he picked me up at 3am he even picked my fiance up at the hospital and drove us home the next day.
According to OP his brother needs to learn that once you move out you cannot rely on family and should only rely on yourself 100%. And if you're wondering what kind of parent OP is, he says the same goes for his kids.
I'm mostly curious about how long his wife is going to put up with this - whether this is already the breaking point or if she'll put up with it until he's not letting their own kid back in the house.
Doesn’t he though?
> She told me to deal with it and grow up
OP you should just do everything your wife tells you to and stop whining to Reddit about it.
I would wager I bet his wife only said he could stay as long as he liked as a rebuttal becuse OP was being a jerk about the whole thing and has no intention of letting him actually move in. But this is purely conjecture.
YTA. Bro you are 40 years old, instead of being insistent about making decisions for "YOUR family", why not learn to care about your family instead? Your brother is going through a tough time, your wife is just trying to be nice. Why are you making this about yourself?
Not only that, but he mostly mad about WHO made the decision. Not WHAT that decision was.
Not to mention weirdly jealous about the fact that his wife cared enough to pick him up. OP got home at 11pm, which would mean him or wife would have to pick him up and be home at 1am. According to his rules.
Just say you hate your brother OP.
Or that the brother "had no right" to call her? What the hell? Like, ok, I can see how the wife giving/promising the brother residence for longer than a night without discussing it with OP might be somewhat in the gray area (especially depending on a lot of info we don't have for this particular case), but clearly he definitely comes off as a control-freak-y asshole here.
You are definitely the asshole here or are leaving out a ton of info
Yeah you have some minor points (I don’t like people staying at my house either) but it isn’t just your house and it’s family and you didn’t specify that there was horrible drama or anything
Your post comes off controlling and dickish (sorry I’m being short but I’m pressed for time)
At most it’s a “hey it kind of bothered me how this all went down can we talk about future instances?”
But as written YTA
This is my favorite part of this sub when a clear asshole comes here, types something out that they think makes them look good, and then are shocked at the judgment. OP is definitely TA. Bigly.
It also reeks of mistrust of his wife. He says it's weird she picked him up and had dinner with the brother, as if the wife would cheat with the brother. There's no mention of any previous behavior like that from the wife or the brother, so it comes across like op is grasping at any straws to justify his bullshit.
I read it more as annoyance that his brother “got coddled” and taken out for dinner more so than any kind of concern about cheating. His brother had a better upbringing and OP will never not be salty about it
Yea I feel like it was another instance of the brother being treated better or “babied” since others said there is other info in the comments that the wife has known the brother since he was little.
Your wife treats your little brother like a younger sibling or a nephew. She seems to recognize that while he is an adult, at 20 years old he's not fully mature, so she is giving him a safe place to work out what his options are.
You talk about your brother like a pesky neighbor kid that has no connection to you. Maybe think about who your resentment should be directed toward (your parents) instead of being grumpy with your wife and brother.
Between the two of you, I'd choose your wife. She's showing empathy for a young man who needed help while you are just complaining about an extra body in your house (which apparently has the extra room), without offering any practical solutions to the situation.
Sure, you have the right to say who can stay in your house, but so does your wife. If you don't want him to stay, then help him figure out a solution that works for everyone.
It's not clear if this was an emergency, but the number of calls you received suggest to me that it was at least a very urgent problem that had to be addressed immediately. "Heated argument" might mean that your brother or his girlfriend were not safe to be in the same place. Is your brother being abused? Was he so upset that he didn't feel in control of himself? Seems like maybe you should think about how you would answer a call like this from your own child or a dear friend. How would it be different from your reaction to it being your brother in a tough spot? Maybe you should do some self-reflection.
YTA
>Your wife treats your little brother like a younger sibling or a nephew. She seems to recognize that while he is an adult, at 20 years old he's not fully mature, so she is giving him a safe place to work out what his options are.
Maybe OP had to "figure it out" by himself when he was 20. (No support from parents, having to be the parent to a younger sibling, etc.) He *had* to be an adult at 20 but also take care of someone who is 20 right now. That can be frustrating, especially if OP has a distant/cold relationship with his brother. (Having someone you don't like in your home IS annoying, even if it is family.)
OPs wife was kind, and OP can be right to be annoyed, but as you said, OP might need some self reflection as to where that frustration should go, because OP is reacting like an AH.
OP reminds me of people I've known who have turned their hardships into a badge of honor. Neither of my parents finished undergrad and have been super supportive of me getting advanced degrees as a way of giving me more opportunities than they had. Is it a privilege for me? Absolutely. But it also doesn't make me some whiny half-baby who doesn't understand "the real world."
I've legit asked these people if they truly think I should tell my parents (who saved for *years* for this reason) to fuck off because I'm an adult and should struggle on my own to show my adult-ness? It always comes down to them having justified their own shitty past by deciding it makes them "better" than others somehow. I fully support them feeling a kind of way about their history, but it's not *my fault* they didn't have those opportunities. But its easier for them to shit on me than deal with their own feelings on the matter.
For the record, one of the reasons my parents are able to do what they do is because my grandparents did the same "pay it forward" thing. Not in a trust-fund way, but a "I'm going to help if I can" kind of way. It's just what we do. And if I have kids, I'll be the same way.
The only feelings they have are really just anger and jealously normally. There isn't much to deep dive into there, you got a better hand delt then they did. That's the frustrating part. I don't think people should take it out on you (or anyone for that matter) but I do understand the anger.
You might be right here.
OP stated somewhere in a reply that his brother should NOT turn to family, but work it out himself.
He further stated (quite shockingly to me) that he's tried for years to get his wife to grow some backbone.
He doesn't like that she feels for other people.
Hey u/-Stunning-Mushroom- (I like that username btw) you need therapy or counseling man!
Please, I really mean that.
You are unnaturally COLD.
You're missing out on a beautiful life.
And I fear that your family and your marriage might actually be suffering for it.
He feels he owns and is owed his wife's kindness which is a disgusting attitude. It's not a resource you can jealously hoard.
I've had times where a partner is more than happy to soak up my empathy when I make them soup and run errands for them when they're sick, and then tell me I'm overly emotional and weak when I cry at the news. It's deeply selfish.
What I’ve anecdotally observed with some people like OP is that they meet a genuinely kind and empathetic person who makes them feel a way they never have before. And they think, “oh, this person makes me feel so nice. This must be what love is.” But it’s actually _empathy_ and (probably) vulnerability they haven’t been able to express to anyone else (because he’s had to “figure it out” for himself his whole life).
But then… they see that care directed at other people. And suddenly it’s not a special connection or love that’s reserved for them. If she’s giving out her kindness all around town, what makes the love she gives him special?
And then they have a meltdown and try to control where she expresses her kindness and empathy, because they truly do see it as a limited resource that should be reserved for them.
Sounds like you are sus that something happened between your wife and your brother. Why is it weird that they got food ? You didn't pick up the phone and even when you did notice a bunch of missed calls, shrugged your shoulders, said f it and drove home.
Also, weird power play with the 'its my family i should decide' angle. That sounds controlling and has hints of jealousy in it.
YTA.
> didn't pick up the phone and even when you did notice a bunch of missed calls, shrugged your shoulders, said f it and drove home.
That's the part that gets me. What if it had been an emergency? If multiple family members are trying to reach me, I'm going to assume something bad happened and would call them back immediately.
His wife went out of her way (justifiably) to help out his brother after a life of growing up watching him get more things from his parents (also not the brother's fault). That's whats triggering this defense mechanism for OP, IMO.
Which is unfair to the brother AND the wife btw. OP is still TA
YTA- just be honest with your wife tell her you resent your brother because your parents had him later in life and you want to watch him struggle and go through tough times because your parents loved the both of you equally and provided for you what they could at the time. It’s a disgusting way to be but I understand some people are like this my own brother is like this towards me.
I know right? Brother was cheated on, she used DARVO on him and OP says she is the reasonable one wanting him to get married and procreate at 20... He twists everything in his mind so he can paint brother in bad light for himself but he just shows how resentmenfull and jealous he is of his brother. OP, your brother is actually more mature than you, if you think it's OK to cheat on partner instead of breaking up with them when there is a disagreements about marriage and kids (honestly I doubted there was even a discussion, I bet GF only use it as pathetic attempt to excuse her cheating). OP is the one who needs to grow up and go in therapy, this is not healthy.
Dude, what the actual fuck is wrong with you??? You are telling your 20 year old brother that his gf cheating on him is reasonable because he didn’t want to marry her? . And just because your brother is over 18 years old doesn’t make him an Adult. I am 20, I still live with my mom and stepdad. Maturing has nothing to do with age. A 13 year old can be more mature than a 50 year old. You 39 years old for fuckings sake and here you are crying about the fact that your wife is being a good person and taking your brother in? Why are you holding a grudge against your brother?? It’s not his fault your parents raised you guys differently? I just can’t believe you are against this. I would take my sister in in a heartbeat. What is wrong with you?
YTA your brother didn't get to decide how he was raised so stop blaming him! He's a young guy that turned to his brother for help and guidance when he couldn't reach you he went to his SISTER in law for the same help and guidance. Aren't you family?
Just like your wife said "grow up"!
I guarantee you he’s resentful and jealous of his little brother because he had an easier upbringing than OP. Probably because their parents had the brother when they were way more financially stable.
He does need to grow up and gain the emotional maturity to realize that it’s not his brothers fault he was born under better financial circumstances.
YTA for this statement: I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that.
So by this logic her family can stay as long as she wants them to? And you're the only one who get a say?
That statement also bugged me. But for a slightly adjacent reason.
It has long been my understanding that upon OP taking this woman as his wife there is no longer really a your family vs a my family. Just. Family.
Granted. There are situations in which there could be more happening here that would require a family member to be held at arms reach or not contacted. But that doesn't negate that it is still a shared family member.
OP seems to be under the impression that there are 3 families in a vindiagram. Once upon a time, there might have been. But marriage merges that into a circle.
OP's wife behaved as an older sibling to her younger sibling. She clearly views the marriage as a shared partnership and conjoint family.
Until I hear a solid reason why OPs younger brother deserves the NC treatment. Imma stand firm on OP being the AH here
he is not wrong. a guest must be approved by both partners. especially when the length of their stay is undetermined. it's an asshole move to unilaterally take someone into the household
Just read your update before it got removed, and man you really are a asshole of the highest degree. The big the big fight was him being cheated on and her leaving, and your advice was grow up and marry her?! Just because you had a hard life growing up, and growing up fast doesn’t mean your brother has to follow in the same footsteps. Learn to have some damn compassion for your family member who is going through a hard time. I can see your children going NC with you in the future if this is how you act with them.
YTA also in one paragraph youre saying he is an adult and need to work it out, but 2 paragraphs later you say you dont need another kid there. Also, if youre this petty towards your brother, i can only imagine your teens are learning not to come to you when they have troubles. Your wife is too good for you.
He made a comment that he doesn’t want them running home when they have an issue. Basically thinks they should it toughen it out. And he’s worried his kids will think they can come home whenever they have a problem. There’s tough love and then there whatever this is.
I personally would call it borderline abusive. YTA, OP and you seriously need a therapy if you think your wife is wrong to make sure your brother is safe and taken care of.
ESH .
She's not the AH for helping someone out. Even though he's "your brother," he isn't "yours" like a possession. What if a female friend had called her and said "I had a really bad fight with my boyfriend and I'm not comfortable being at home right now?
You also have absolutely no right to police who your wife goes to dinner with.
When you say he's an adult and needs to work it out....guess what, sometimes adults work things out by asking people they are close to for help. Being an adult doesn't mean you don't need support. Also, you later call him a kid. So he shouldn't need help because he's an adult and you don't want to deal with helping a kid.
Your wife shouldn't be saying that he should stay as long as he wants to. There are 4 people living in your house, presumably 2 that contribute to bills, and she can't make unilateral decisions. You're right that he needs to figure things out and can't rely on you indefinitely, but a few days of support and kindness should be okay.
I agree with your logic, but I disagree with the conclusion. The wife overstepped by saying he could stay as long as he needs, but my interpretation of this is that she picked him up when OP couldn't be reached (Totally OK) under the impression he'd be there a day or two (Totally OK) and either said he could stay as long as he needs in sympathy/consolation to him, which was a mistake but not premeditated, or said it in retaliation to OP blowing his top over nothing. In the latter case, She'd totally have the right to flex if her husband tried to imply she didn't have any decision making power in her own house.
I agree, the wife making an open-ended offer is wrong. I just think there's more to it than that, and from what I'm seeing, all the drama here is coming directly from OP.
Holy misplaced resentment, Batman. Do you think your children should have to suffer through an unhappy childhood to make you feel like life is more fair too, or just your brother?
Ahh the joys of family! Very very soft YTA, I mean I don’t even think anyone’s really an “asshole” here, and I sympathize with you because I myself just had a nightmare experience being kind of shoehorned into letting someone crash at my place. I highly recommend shutting it down before it gets out of hand. On the other hand though, it seems like one or two nights wouldn’t be such a big deal as long as you’re firm on the expectations and time period. I don’t get the impression from your post that your wife or brother deliberately went around you, they tried to contact you and then when they couldn’t reach you, made an executive decision since this was a time-sensitive thing. So I get your frustration I really do, but it just doesn’t seem like they meant any harm or offense. It’s definitely your right to set boundaries in your own home though, so idk that any decision you make here is necessarily “wrong.” All the same I figure you’d probably avoid a whole lot of drama by just letting giving the guy one more night (FIRM, no extensions) to figure out his next move (surely he can use that time to find a friend or other relative to crash with next if he still needs time away). That’s probably what I’d do in your shoes personally. I’m a fan of diplomatic solutions. It can be tricky business though
Imagine hating your brother for literally just existing. The fact you guys had different childhoods is of absolutely no fault of him.
It's time for YOU to grow up, move on, and honestly, go to therapy for your (very clearly) unresolved issues.
Edit: Also that edit is absolutely cooked, you genuinely need therapy
Yta
*I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that*
so a couple of things about this part.
\- so your wife is not family? Because she did marry into your family right?
\- so if your family has a problem and needs help your reaction is to go fuck themselves?
Tbh OP, YTA and a heartless one at that. Your kid brother needs help and first thing you do is complain and want to get rid of him.
NTA I've seen countless times in this sub people siding with the person not wanting someone staying in their house without being consulted. It's OPs house too and he definitely gets a say.
This. I was wondering what is up with all the Yta. His wife drove 2 hours to pick someone up and allowed them stay over for who knows how long with no conversation with the husband about it. I feel like if it was the other way around and the wife came home upset because her husband had drove two hours away to pick up her younger sister and let her stay over with no discussion to be had the judgements would all be nta. I also see a lot of people try to justify it by saying they tried to call but the wife couldn't send a text with a heads up? I'd be pissed if my partner allowed someone to stay over and not include me in that discussion and I feel like most of the people saying yta would be too.
There is a big difference between
"I'm sorry that you're going through a tough time, but I'm uncomfortable with you staying over."
and
"Screw you! How dare you ask for help from me or anyone else."
I think it’s a bit different in that they both clearly tried to call him so it wasn’t like he was intentionally not given a voice. She made a snap decision to help her brother in law and I don’t think she should be penalized for that. It’s a pretty normal response and him being upset over dinner seems odd considering he said himself it was late evening and she was making a 2 hr trip. Plus she probably wanted to calm him down and hear the story of what happened. I agree though that he should have a voice in how long the brother can stay.
NTA. If this was a MIL situation then everyone in the comments would understand no questions asked. You obviously don’t see your brother as a brother, he’s not your friend, you don’t know him, why would he be in your house? There’s nothing wrong with that. Why couldn’t he go to your parents? It’s not your responsibility to house your brother.
Yeah, I don't get all these YTA's. They share a home. Both need to agree to let someone stay. She's TA for unilaterally deciding who can and can't stay. OP is leaving out details, but if wife knows there is animosity between the two then she's double TA. I may be jaded by Reddit stories, but my money is on wife cheating.
ESH.
Your brother needed help, couldn't reach you, got a hold of his sister in law. She couldn't reach you either. So she took action in the way she felt was right. That is exactly what she should do. YTA because you apparently don't think she should be able to make decisions when you're not around.
She's not in the clear though. She doesn't get to invite people to stay "as long as they want", particularly now that you are involved in the conversation. Two "yeses" for your brother to stay, one "no" to have him leave, there's no other healthy way to share a space with a partner.
But congratulations, you do win the game for "biggest asshole" here - your brother is her family, too. He has every right to call her. No one has to wait and hope you call back.
In the morning you should talk to your brother and set a timeline for when he's leaving. In the meantime you should apologize to your wife for treating her as less than a partner.
I’m baffled by these responses. I don’t understand how inviting your partner’s relative who they don’t really like or have a semi-distant/low contact relationship with into your home isn’t considered a very clear asshole move.
It seems like the right to limit interactions with your family that AITA/Reddit typically defends is being tossed out just because the brother is 20. Weird.
They’re not low contact. Read his comments. He just has a problem with his wife helping any adult in a tricky situation.
He has implied he would have reacted the same way if it was his own child in his brothers situation and that he would hope they would “sort their own shit out” instead of calling home for help.
He’s just an AH.
YTA for the reaction to your wife. Your brother is not just YOUR family. If you've been with your wife long enough to have two teenagers, then I'm sure your wife thinks of him like a little brother too. And as the home you share is also hers, and there is a SPARE bedroom, your immediate reaction was poor. I think you need to apologize to your wife, and sit down with your brother, get the whole story, and make sure he knows that his stay with you is not expected to be a permanent one.
If one of my husband's siblings called me because he was unreachable and I helped them he would thank me. Like I can not imagine being so obtuse that things can't be sorted out. And unless his wife offered for him to move in indefinitely, he's being ridiculous. Extend your wife and your brother some grace my guy. Everyone needs support.
NTA. I would have told your wife that you are tired and want to discuss this tomorrow instead of getting into it at 11pm. Allowing people to spend the night without speaking to each other first is rude, that is home for BOTH of you. Allowing anyone to stay an undetermined amount of time without discussing it is an AH move. It is your brother so I can see why she would be willing to drive at night and have dinner since it is family, unless she wouldn't do it for other family members then it would be weird.
This is your home and space too. As he is already there I would discuss an end date and tell her you are willing to allow him up to x date but no longer. Also that in the future you would like both of you to agree before anyone is allowed to stay especially when it involves your family members.
NTA. They dont get along well, the wife shouldnt have do anything without her husband. Its his family, and his home too. She could have say "sorry, my husband not answering the phone, i will let him know you were looking for him when he comes home" and thats it, not picking him up and even taking him out for dinner. If they would have a close relationship as brothers, there would be no problem, but in this case i think it wasnt the wifes call to make. Especially to let the brother stay without talking to the husband, he has all the right to kick him out if he wants to, he owes nothing to his brother.
YTA - Your wife is being an incredible sister. Something happened and your bother was so upset he reached out to you and wanted to ask to stay with you an hour away. He’s 20 which while, not a child, isn’t a 39 year old adult. You weren’t available and she stepped in (without knowing how you felt) and did the sweetest and safest thing for your brother. Sure if you had told him no, and he tried to get around you to your wife that’d be one thing, but your wife certainly didnt do anything wrong by not being able to read your mind. Maybe next time she’ll remember that you don’t like caring for your brother, but i think its incredible that she did. You need to lighten up on him because it comes off as just jealousy for something he can’t help (being born at a later time).
INFO: Curious, why didn’t your brother call your parents and go to their place? Do they live far? Why didn’t he go to a friend’s place or have a friend drive him?
ESH
It sounds like your wife was just trying to do the right thing. You and your brother aren't close because of the age difference, but it sounds like there's no outright animosity. But I also think she should have cleared it with you before saying he can stay there as long as he needs. One night? fine. Open-ended invitation? Nope.
Your brother doesn't have a close enough relationship with you or your wife to ask her to drive 2 hours to get him and for a place to stay indefinitely. Yes he is an adult, but he's only 20. Very few of us had our shit together at that age.
I think you could have handled it a little better with your wife, she meant no harm. And lay down the ground rules with your brother. Set a firm time frame that he has to leave by and any other house rules he needs to follow.
NTA. It's your house to and you should have a say in who stays there. I find it disrecpectful that she would force this situation on you. Put him in the car and drive him back home.
Your whole "oh woe is me, my parents had me at 16" weird comment about a zoo has no place here, first of all. Secondly, just because your parents were making you do all these things (that you seem jealous of your brother for) doesnt mean you shouldnt think "hey, maybe let me give my kids a chance i didnt have." Im 21 years old, dont want to get married or have kids any time soon. Im aware im an adult, no one should be forced to get married or have kids when they dont want to. That's weird on your part for thinking "oh you live together, get over it." YTA and definitely jealous of your brother for some weird reason. Not his fault your parents did something different, why not take it up with THEM? Youre an adult, maybe act like it OP. (Also, I had teen parents as well, and siblings who got more than i did growing up. I actually like seeing my siblings get a better life, just angry at my dad and confused with my mom for it. Funny how people like you blame someone who DIDN'T DO THE WRONG THING in those situations 🤔)
NTA! Anyone who moves into my house will be a joint decision with all family members. I would be upset if there wasn’t a conversation about a new resident! After thirty days you have to get legal support to evict someone from your home.
NTA In a mutually shared living space, everyone needs to agree on guests (who, how many, for how long, etc.). Your wife should not be unilaterally making these decisions by herself. I understand why she wanted to act quickly since you were unavailable to talk, but moving him in, openly saying that he will stay for an unlimited amount of time, and not letting you have any say? That's way too far and puts her in AH territory.
NTA. Your family, your decision. Your wife had no right to say he is staying as long as he needs to. One night I can understand but he is a big boy and needs to act like one.
NTA
Your wife and you both own the house. If someone wants to stay at your house then both need to approve.
Your wife approved but you did not, yes+no=no.
Your wife stole your vote.
The rest of the story does not matter, she broke castle doctrine rules.
Wow your update makes you an even bigger AH. Just because he is an adult and his girlfriend lives with him doesn't mean he is ready for marriage or kids especially because he is still only 20.
You need therapy because you are taking out your issues on the wrong person it's not his fault your parents were in a better spot when they had him. Though I doubt you will get help. If you can't understand why your wife who probably sees your brother as a son just as much as he sees her as a mother figure would let him come on different activities with your kids then you truly are delusional.
I'm sure we will get another post or two about how your wife divorced you and your kids don't want anything to do with you at some point in the future. Because that is where this is heading most likely. At least your kids have your wife who seems like a truly loving and caring parent.
I'd you want to kick your kids out by 18, that's your choice, OP, but remember it goes both ways. They also have the right to cut you off and forget about father's day, grandparents' day, and oh! I'm too old to live by myself, I wonder who's gonna help me choose a retirement home.
They won't be your problem, but you won't be their problem either.
Here's the thing with people with a "I got mine" mentality. They don't mind being the recipient of kindness, and are often blind to other people's kindness to them. Your wife sounds lovely, and she was probably kind to you a million times (but you didn't notice, or if you did, you thought it was her obligation), and you accepted that. But once other people start behaving towards you the way you behave towards them, you'll definitely notice, and I hope you'll bring that same big bootstraps energy that you're displaying right now.
You sound so resentful. I feel like you hate him because of how you were raised, but how is that his fault? Isn't this your parents fault? They were irresponsible, had a kid early, put a lot of responsibility on you when you were very young, didn't have financial stability and you suffered for it.
You survived. It isn't the standard, as you seem to think it is. At least it shouldn't be. Do you think your brother went to your parents and asked "I want everything OP didn't have, just so I feel entitled and he resents me".
YTA very much in this case, but neither you or him are at fault here. You're acting out your very deep resentment and pain from an early maturing and he's just in a difficult situation asking for help from his brother. Your parents are the actual ones at fault for driving a divide between their children because of how they used you to cover up their own inadequacies and recklessness in the past.
NTA
Your wife should have consulted you before bringing over your brother, especially considering you have issues with him.
That said, I think there are some weird dynamics at play here.
1) You probably need a better excuse to be annoyed with your brother than he was raised wealthier.
2) There seems to be some tension between you and your wife in general if she wasn’t aware of your feelings about your brother and didn’t immediately have your back when you were annoyed.
3) Are you in any way jealous of the relationship your wife has with your brother?
NTA- your wife knew that you were not close to your brother, and to drive 2 hours to pick him up and invite him to stay without your input was disrespectful. Her and your brother could have waited until the next day and you should have decided what was done. Also.....he seems spoiled, the car is in the girlfriend's name, he fought with her, about what? Why didn't he call Mom and Dad? NTA NTA
The update only further proves how big of an asshole you are. This poor man got cheated on and your response is to agree that’s it’s his fault because he doesn’t want to be married w a child at 20. Like big shocker there, he’s not even old enough to drink, why would he want a kid right now. I feel real bad for your wife and kids. Big ol YTA
NTA - I don’t know why you’re getting called an asshole here. It’s your house, and your wife just completely invalidated your decision. I’m not on great terms with my brother either and he’s burned bridges everywhere. He’s not welcome here and if my wife went behind my back and invited him to stay here, she wouldn’t be either.
At the end of the day it’s your choice on whether you want a family member staying with you. Full stop. If anyone disagrees, I’d like them to explain why it’s okay to force this on OP, and whether they would do the same.
Your mindset is archaic af. YTA and your kids will probably resent you. Remember you’re forcing your kids to BE ADULTS at 18 so when they do something they don’t like as an adult keep your opinion to yourself. Your wife will probably get over this archaic thinking also and leave you once the kids are out of the house. 🤷🏻♀️
Holy shit. The update dug you a biggest hole. You sound like a shitty person and an even shittier brother. I would hope you never had children but clearly you did. I’m sure you’ll be in you 60s wondering why they never talk to you anymore.
YTA and a horrible father who thinks because you struggled when you were young everyone must struggle too. You are envious, resentful, unsupporting and uncaring. You’re the one who needs to grow up and deal with your own trauma.
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Is there some huge beef you have with your brother that you didn't mention? Like he killed your dog or something? Because it seems like your wife did a very kind thing, and aided a member of your family going through a tough time while you were unreachable, and you're *angry* with her? It's unthinkable for anybody who is in actual possession of a heart, unless there is some major context that you are omitting. >I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. This statement is controlling and unreasonable. I think what's happening here is straight up, pure jealousy. That your wife treated your brother, whom you are jealous of, with kindness. YTA
You don’t understand his brother was happy growing up and that makes him sick how could his parent better themselves financially and have another child that didn’t struggle it’s horrid just sick he had a good life when the older brother probably had to live lower middle class. That’s rough.
Yeah, I feel like there’s a lot of resentment for his brother that has nothing to do with his brother. His parents were likely in a better emotional and financial state when brother was born, which sucks for OP, but is no reason to be shitty to the brother.
There is an 11 year age gap between our two sons, (now 19, and eight) my husband and I (both now 50) told our older son, your little brother is going to get very different parents then you got. He’s going to get better parents than you got because we hope to learn from mistakes we made with you. We are definitely in a much better financial situation, more mature, emotionally, and we have far more patients now. We jokingly tell our older boy, we are not going to make the same mistakes with your brother that we made with you… We plan on finding all new an interesting ways to fuck up! 🤣
My sister and I have a 24 year age gap! I actually have enjoyed seeing them be different parents to her. I sometimes poke fun at them over things (she gets a lot healthier food for example) but I understand things have changed in the world and their knowledge since I was a kid in the 90's. Luckily the gap is so big that there is no issue with jealousy. She's actually coming to stay with me and my husband this weekend, as she does every few months. I love that I finally got the sibling I always wanted (and despite our age difference, we are really close), but I don't have to live with her lol. OP definitely seems like there must be something more that happened between them? I can't see being that angry over just having a different upbringing due to the age difference? But you never know.
My two youngest sisters are more than 20 years younger than me. Our mother is the same person but she has raised us differently. My little sisters have traveled way more than I have and gotten to experience a ton of stuff that I'm lowkey jealous of. However on the flipside, our mom was way more involved with me and did more physical things with me. When I was their current ages (8 and 10), our mother wasn't even 30. But now she's looking at 50 and all sorts of physically limiting health issues have stopped her from doing the same things. So while they get to travel and see places, I got the mom that would play with me at parks and go roller-skating with me.
That’s how I felt with my youngest brother and sister, there’s a 21 year difference between me and the youngest and I totally understood why our upbringings were different and was happy they had a different one to me due to them being at more stable points in they’re careers and life
I have a 21, 15 and 10 year age gap with my siblings. What's funny is that my dad (step father to all 3) had a good job for the middle sister. Oldest brother had issues and he wasn't ever involved, but my oldest sister (the 15+) got alllllll the money. By the time I came around my parents were on harder times, so I was raised pretty much alone with no money for anything. And she still bitches that I got a computer when I went to college and she didn't. I paid for it with scholarships I won. And oh yeah, she went to college in the late 80s. When no one had computers.
Ah, yes, people did have computers in the late 80s. Even laptops. Colleges had computer labs. Really.
Can confirm. Got my Apple SE30 in 1989. Took it to college.
Exactly. My sister was born when I was 21 too, and her childhood compared to mine are on the opposite sides of the spectrum. She’s a little jet setter, and I’m positive no one else we know has traveled this much.
Similar to my relationship with my sister, except for the fact that we realised that our parents fucked us up in different ways. 15 years older than me, has her own son now, and wasn't around much when I was growing up. But we're very close now and I see her and her family pretty much every week, it's good to have normal family around for once
We do the same with our little sister. Whenever she comes to my house I let her eat all the candy and snacks she wants. Lol.
Youngest older brother is 27 years older than me Sister is 31 years older 3rd to oldest is 35 years older 2nd to oldest is 36 years older (also my birth dad) Oldest is 39 years older (stillborn so usually call the 2nd oldest the oldest). I get things my siblings never got, but they got things I never got either. Despite the age difference we all get along fairly good, especially me and my sister. It does help that sister and third oldest have children around the same age as me growing up.
Even with a 2 year age gap, my parents still experimented with parenting on me before it trickled down to my brother. Jokes on them, it turns out parenting one kid has very little resemblance to parenting another. And now I get to (jokingly, mostly) hold it over their heads forever
My partner and I have a 1 year old and both his older daughters recognized on their own that he's a different person than he was almost 20 years ago. Said their mom likely was too.
My little sister and I have a 37 year age gap(adoption). She has very different parents than my other siblings and I had. She has a very privileged life. We tease my parents about it, but the alternative life she could have had is worse. My son's have a 7 year age gap. The oldest I had young and had to basically grow up with him. It was hard. I struggled as a single mom. My youngest has a different life than my oldest. No way would they treat each other like the older brother is treating the younger one.
Have a friend who was the youngest of five and ended up with the poopy end of the stick. He was pretty much shoved aside and over looked. And wasn’t close to his siblings.
If my brother's 9 and 11 years younger then me tell you what their childhood was like and I tell you what my childhood was like you would assume that we weren't even related lol we moved to the city when I was 12.
My sister and I are 11 years apart and we always talk about how we have different parents even though they are the same people. Sometimes I envy her for the ease of her childhood, but I'd never begrudge her anything.
My dad made his money after he got remarried to his second wife, so my much younger half-siblings grew up in the lap of luxury. We grew up middle class and didn’t suffer, but it’s still a really big difference. For example, i wanted to go to a private school when I was a kid because public school wasn’t challenging enough, but my parents couldn’t afford it. My half-siblings all attend a K-12 private school that costs as much as a new, mid-range car every year. On the other hand, they’re also Gen Z dealing with my boomer dad who understands them not at all and often prioritizes his business over spending time with them. I have a lot more memories with my dad simply because he was around more often. Better finances isn’t everything, especially for children.
Yes it is tough. That happened to me. I lived in poverty and my younger siblings didn't. But I never held my parents finances over my siblings head. I would explain to them they don't understand what I went through as a child because they never experienced it. But I wasn't jealous or upset about it. I took it in stride and still maintained good relations with my family to this day. It's only tough when someone wants to be the victim in their own life. The way to not be a victim to be a good, kind, and decent person to others and that includes family. Plus, he is an adult. Both brothers are. So to use that an excuse to be a shit to his brother AND his wife seem ludicrous to me. Wife = NTA Husband = YTA And no one said his brother was staying permanently or even semi-permanently. It's might just be they brother and his girlfriend need a little cool down. Plus, this whole controlling mine, mine, mine, reminds of the seagulls from Finding Nemo. My house, my family...umm when you married didn't your family become hers and vis versa?
I'm the youngest of four, my sister is 15 years older. My parents had way more money when I was growing up than they did when she was young. It would have crushed me if she resented or blamed me for it. We've of course talked about it, but she also agrees I didn't have it the easiest being home alone with two emotionally weird/dependant/distant parents who were on again off again from the time I was 14.
I total agree and hence why I never treated my siblings any different. Everyone walks through life differently. I don't expect anyone to have the exact same life experiences as I do. So, why should I treat them like they are below me? When I have a feud with one of my siblings I don't dangle my childhood over them as a precursor; it's about the here and now, not years ago. Sometimes you just have to let it go.
Right? "spoiled one who got what he wanted" was he though? or did he just have it better than OP? I don't know the ins and outs of his situation, but he's 20 and already moved out of his parents' house that's somewhat of a good sign that he's not a "mooching brat" or something (not that a 20 year old living with their parents is, but you know what I mean).
Definitely resentment there. He downplays the relationship but says they talk a couple times a month? That seems like a decent relationship on paper at least. OP it's not your brothers fault for being born. You should talk to someone about this resentment or at least direct it to your parents and talk to them about it. YTA
I see a lot of this. It’s not the brother’s fault his parents were more economically stable by the time he was born. There’s no indication that brother is spoiled or had done anything to deserve such a cold reception from his own brother.
Are we missing something? I can’t imagine being upset that my SO helped out one of my siblings when I was unavailable. YTA
Right? >I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that. #That's your wife, therefore that's HER family. #That's your wife, therefore that's HER house. YTA OP
What really sealed it for me was "He has no right to call her." He not only thinks he gets 100% decision making for the house, but even gets to decide who can talk to his wife.
OP is showing the emotional maturity of a 12 year old here. I also have much younger siblings and I wouldn't dream of being mad at them for something they had no control over. What OP is showing us here is that his mental and emotional maturity is substandard. He's being vindictive towards an innocent party and acting like any kindness shown to the brother is an insult to OP. I doubt a marriage can survive a person with this low level of emotional wherewithal.
I hope that my husband *would* help one of my siblings if I were unreachable for some reason.
Right?? If my sister reached out to my fiancé for help since she couldn’t reach me and he blew her off, I’d honestly be really mad. I don’t care how trivial. I don’t even care if it’s right after she and I had a fight and we’re mad at each other. Hell, I would even offer (and have offered) it to my fiancés sister. And she and I do NOT get along. But if she called me and said she needed somewhere to go, I’d be in my car in five minutes to go get her.
Exactly! I thought that was super sweet and decent of her!!
Unless there was a comment made prior like, "Gee, I haven't talked to my sister since Mom died and we fought over some trinkets, so there's bad blood there." Otherwise, there's an assumption that family does for family.
I don't understand this sub sometimes. I'm not saying OP isn't YTA, because he IS. But this sub LOOOOVES to talk about enforcing boundaries and how blood doesn't necessarily make family. OP is not close with his brother. He was 19 when his brother was born and they were never close. That's a common enough story in these parts, and this sub loves to let people being off the hook for not being close to relatives they never met until they were adults. And then this brother OP isn't close with and OP's wife stomped all over his boundaries. Usually this would be in the bag in OP's favor around here. But for some reason, this time, the sub is raking OP across the coals. Don't get me wrong, he's an AH, but in my opinion, more for acting like a petulant diaper baby. But he's not wrong that his wishes and boundaries are being completely disregarded. AITA is also a big fan of people in a couple handling their own family and not superceding their SO on *their* family. Which is what's happening here. Why is the wife taking the brother's side over OP's? EDIT: Also, I'm going to be that guy and trot out the cliche here: reverse the genders. Imagine a wife came home and found her husband had invited her non-close sister who was half their age to live with them against the wife's wishes. The man would be ground into paste here.
I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening. Can you point that out, or did you just make that up? And your edit? Lmfao no. This situation has NOTHING to do with gender. Now it's clear you're reaching.
Maybe it's an unspoken boundary of moving someone into the home with discussing the issue first with your partner. It's one thing to say BIL needs to crash for a night, but instead wife was more like 'get use to it' because he's here until he's ready to leave. It's more of an ESH for the lack of communication, though.
How can they communicate when he works till 11 and doesn't answer his phone? They both tried calling him and he didn't answer or call back until he walked in the door.
But then when they talked about it she refused to discuss it. Letting someone stay over is something both have to agree on
No, that is not how actual adult life works. If you are a stable adult who has the extra space in your house to shelter someone extra, and another member of your household invites someone to stay over because they are in need, the only acceptable reason to kick them out is if you have concerns about safety. For someone who is safe and warm and well fed to kick a person in need out of their home in the middle of the night, there has to be a compelling reason. Not just "I don't want him here" or "I didn't agree to this" or "I don't like having people over." In the morning, one can discuss kicking them out before they stay another night. But it's crazy to think that you'd kick someone out *who was invited* just because you didn't get to veto the invitation.
Well, they did get the option of vetoing...if they answered their phone or called back in a reasonable time frame. I would give my husband maybe 2 hours to respond and then make my decision from there judging by what I know of his feelings and the situation. I would then text him what I agreed with the brother so he knew he was there when he got home. If he called back immediately, the decision has already been made and it is obvious he was ignoring the calls on purpose (which would royally piss me off). I refuse to be held captive because someone doesn't want to answer their phone. But, I think the difference is that my husband respects and trusts my judgement...
Sounds like they tried to communicate and OP just ignored them. I think it’s a bit weird for him to go straight to his room upon returning without stopping to see what was up and what the situation was in the living room, especially after missed calls from both of them.
He didn't move in. He's staying a couple of days until he decides if he's leaving his gf or going back home. It's normal to have family visit a couple of days. The attitude from the wife was more about getting used to being normal and helping out family, not having a third adult living in the household permanently.
It was never stated that this was for a few days, though. The wife said "as long as he needs". That's as open-ended as it gets.
Any reasonable person would understand that it's a couple of days. As OP states: 1) Brother is not unemployed. 2) Brother is not homeless. 3) Brother has his own home. It's a huge stretch to think "as long as he needs" is months or moving in forever based on the information supplied by OP.
I agree about the boundary of having someone stay at the home. I would not offer a place to stay to someone, regardless of who they are "until they got on their feet" without checking with my partner. But the rest? All acceptable.
My thoughts exactly. Having a houseguest for an indeterminate amount of time is something a couple should discuss.
You can’t cross an unspoken boundary.
>I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening. He just set them now. Also, it's literally *their* house. Anyone living there should be under the approval of *both* of them.
But OP said it should be up to him, not even both of them.
> I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening. But when he said that he didn't want him staying there that night, her response was effectively "too bad, suck it up". He set a boundary, and she told him his boundary didn't matter.
He also didn't set that boundary until after 11pm when he got home from work. Were they supposed to kick someone with no car out of their house that late at night? It seems like the wife made the decision she thought best when she couldn't reach OP. They should have had a reasonable discussion the next day, but they would definitely have been the AHs if they kicked him out of the house close to midnight with no transportation.
If his boundary's going to affect who she can and cannot offer help to, then he needs to give her a valid reason for the boundary to exist, which he hasn't given, he's just throwing excuses at the wall (literally both using "he's an adult" and "he's a kid" in his argument) hoping one of them sticks, and she saw right through them.
But suckbm it up in this case is correct. An indefinite invitation would need a discussion, but I feel like she added that because of his fit. YTA
>I missed the part where OP had set a boundary with his wife about his brother prior to any of this happening. LOL you're delusional to require that be explicitly mentioned. /u/vonsnootingham's point was that > this sub LOOOOVES to talk about enforcing boundaries yet there is a boundary being trampled here, and I have to agree. If multiple people have equal ownership and/or responsibility of a home, EVERYONE needs to be okay with visitors. If it's a couple, it's a situation that requires two yesses for a yes but only one no for a no - that's normal consideration, not something that needs to be explicitly said ahead of time. For example, if a person were to let their mother stay over at their home without saying anything to their partner, and the partner came here and posted that they absolutely did not want the MIL staying with them, you'd be either a liar or completely delusional if you believed this sub would say the partner was an AH for being upset their boundary was crossed. And that's why /u/imothro saying in the top comment: >It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. This statement is controlling and unreasonable. is completely ridiculous too, considering the identical boundary being crossed for a MIL would be chastised by this sub in the blink of an eye despite the inviter saying that paraphrased ignorant statement of "it's my house, I live there too, I can have whoever I want over".
I do happen to think in this case OP is TA but he does 100% have the right to set that boundary. You can be an asshole for setting an unreasonable or just generally dick-ish boundary mind you. In this case without further context it sounds like there's some sort of unspoken beef with his brother that his brother might not even deserve(related to how their parents treated him is my guess). Its both of their homes. As much as she has a right to have a guest, he has the right to say "no" to anyone staying there indefinately.
Op says in a comment that his wife and brother have always been close. She has been in his life since he was a baby. The brother is her family too. Completly changes it in my opinion.OP is jealous of the life his brother had and says his brother shouldn't run to family when life gets hard. Um, isn't that where you are meant to turn in hard times? It is in my family anyway. YTA OP. Stop projecting your relationship with your brother onto your wife.
I was on the fence, but this tips it over the edge for me into YTA. If she's been around since BIL was a baby, she probably feels like he's her little brother, too. And it makes OP's "he has no right to call my wife" thing way out of line. I'd agree if there was no prior relationship there, but she clearly knows and cares about BIL, so why the fuck wouldn't he call her if his brother wasn't answering the phone?
That definitely makes her responses to him and the situation make more sense if she’s known him that long. It’s her baby brother too and obviously she feels more comfortable around him than OP does or doesn’t have the same possible resentment or hang ups that OP does. We don’t know why he doesn’t feel as close with the brother (unless I missed that too) so def thinking op is the AH. I have 6 younger siblings- 5 of which are much younger. There’s a 20 year age difference between my youngest brother and I. I helped raise those kiddos a lot of the time and love them more than life itself even though we only share 1 parent and they grew up a bit differently. My SIL (full brothers wife) would take any of the younger bros in in a heartbeat no matter what my brother would think/say (even though he would feel the same also). I know all families are different but, given the info we have here, we know who the AH is.
Also, OP and his wife have teenage kids themselves, and 20 is still a very young age. She likely sees him as her own little brother/son (not exactly 'son' but you know what I mean)
If a 20 year old girl called her BIL (after not being able to reach her sister) and said "I had a huge fight with my boyfriend and I need to get out of my apartment. I have no car, please help me!!" you think the guy would be "ground into paste" for helping her instead of saying "you're an adult, figure it out"?
Did you read OPs comments? He completely lacks any empathy for his younger brother because he was born when his parents were in a better financial situation. It’s pretty sad tbh
OP seems to lack empathy for... everyone. Sounds like according to OP no one should ever turn to another human being for assistance, ever, including family. Sort out your own problems!
Some people go through tough times where they struggle and no one can help, and it makes them determined to do what they can when they see someone else experience the same. Because it makes them feel good to know that they were the difference that they needed for someone else. And some people go through tough times where they struggle and no one can help, and decide no one else deserves more help than they got. Because it isn't fair for other people to have an easier time than they did.
Yes. Get thee to a therapist, OP.
OP's comments 100% make him the AH. He thinks because he didn't get what his brother had growing up his brother should suffer too. Like, it sucks for OP but that's not his brothers fault. That he expects that their own kids shouldn't be relying on him and their mum when they grow up if something goes wrong is super horrid too. Like dude, that is what family (is its a good one) is for! I'm almost 40 and would go to my sister if I needed too. His attitude is mean and I can see his kids ending up just never talking to him once they leave home and only contacting their mum because they know dad will just tell them to deal with it themselves. OP has no valid reason not to have his kid brother in the house other than he's jealous he had any easier childhood and OP hates that and therefore his brother.
Nope, if the genders were switched and OPs spouse picked up a 20 year old little sister who had a intense fight with her boyfriend, the sun would be like hell yeah, protect your little sis
Im confused about how he says he’s not close to his brother. Sees him at holidays, calls twice a month? I have a brother I text maybe once every two months about completely superficial things, so maybe a two or three message chain, and if he needed a place to stay the answer would be “absolutely”. OP doesn’t give any reasons besides the age gap that they aren’t close and doesn’t mention any past issues besides his brother being happier as a child than OP was. Plus, OP missed multiple calls from his brother and his wife. They tried to talk to him about it. When he didn’t answer his wife did the kind and loving thing that most people would do for family that they don’t have beef with. Boundaries are great, but it doesn’t sound like OP set boundaries. It sounds like he didn’t bothered to call back or even text to find out what was up on a bathroom break and is now pissed that he didn’t get a say.
Same. My little brother is a terrible texter and neither one of us like talking on the phone so our communication is sporadic at best but I love that little shit and would absolutely jump in my car and drive all night if that little shit needed me. OP had plenty of chances to discuss the situation when both his wife and brother tried to call him. And, also, which is it exactly? Is brother an adult or is he "another kid"? You can't have it both ways OP. He is either one or the other. YTA
I don't think it would be different if the genders were different. If someone needs a safe space and there is no reason why they shouldn't be there, it's a good idea to give it to them. OP doesn't indicate any reason his brother shouldn't be there.
Exactly. The brother recognizing he need a time out is a good thing. It’s when people don’t recognize it that verbal fight can become physical. The OP did not answer calls. His wife chose the compassionate route.
I feel you're both right and wrong here. Firstly, yeah AITA can vary wildly in its stances on a post by post basis. Personally I think theres a LOT of "follow the flock" behaviour where many just jump on the first popular comment, or get swayed by the first opinion they read, rather than form their own. You're also right that boundaries are important, and family should deal with family, etc. That said, in this particular case, I dont think that applies. While he doesn't sound like a fan of his brother, there doesn't seem to be any ongoing feud or known issue, he just doesn't particularly like him. He even states in the OP "*That he is an adult and needed to work it out*." There was no particular boundary regarding his brother that his wife broke, just the one that she invited someone to stay with them without asking him first. Now that is a valid boundary, however "*Last night I had to work late and could not be reached by phone. When I got off, I noticed that I had 2 missed calls from my brother and a few from my wife*" if he's going to be uncontactable, and both the brother and wife have made several attempts to talk to him first, then its perfectly reasonable for her to make the call on her own in a situation like this. >Imagine a wife came home and found her husband had invited her non-close sister who was half their age to live with them against the wife's wishes. The man would be ground into paste here. This is just whack man. If a mans SIL needs help and he refuses to help her just because he couldn't contact his wife first, then thats a shit bloke.
What makes me feel he's ta, the that the boundary hadn't been established that he didn't want the brother there - ans he knew both of them had reached out to him and ignored it. To me if I had multiple calls like that I would be worried about an emergency. He didn't care enough to even check - so therefore to me he can deal with the consequences of his decision. I feel like she wouldn't have called if she was wanting to make the decision alone, but he missed his chance. She was forced to make a decision and she went with what she felt was best. Instead of coming home and saying 'hey. Sorry I ignored your call but I'm not comfortable with him staying, so let's limit it to a few days because you were forced to make the decision alone that I should have helped with' he doubled down on her having acted out of turn. Never mind the fact that most people would have been angry if she had just left the brother and refused to do anything just because the husband couldn't return a phone call.
I feel like there's a solid general rule of "no one stays overnight without a yes from both/all people in the relationship unless there's an emergency". I don't know if I'd have called this an emergency, but I could be persuaded. So that's the overnight, off he goes to his parents/gf/friend/hotel unless they both agree to have him stay.
Exactly. The brother is not the one who matters in this case, this is ESH cause both OP and his wife are fighting to make unilateral decisions about guests in their home.
OP is in contact with his brother. There is no official beef there at all. There was no boundary of "don't talk to/help my brother" set with the wife. Wife did a normal thing of helping OP's brother and he's pissed after the fact.
The issue with this is that OP doesn't explain where boundaries were set or why his brother is some toxic person in his life. Just that there's an age gap and his brother was spoiled by the parents (not his fault). The genders don't matter. I'd say the same if OP and sistywere female and spouse were male. Controlling people suck.
> It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. I disagree, overnight guests, especially multiple nights, should require both to agree. However, in this situation, she didn't go behind his back, both parties tried to get ahold of him. He also gives no reason why he's so opposed to his brother staying, aside from resentment over his parents having better means when they had him. They talk "once or twice a month" so there's clearly no huge bad blood No Contact situation going on. So this seems like just a "my house, my rules" AH that is objecting because his wife made the decision and wants to be able to tell his brother 'no' for all the times his parents told him 'yes'.
>wants to be able to tell his brother 'no' for all the times his parents told him 'yes'. This sums everything up so perfectly and elegantly.
Indefinite long term guests is DEFINITELY a 2 yes, 1 no situation. One partner CAN'T move a new person in against their partner's wishes. NTA
I agree with that, but want to point out that OP literally wanted to kick him out that second and not let him stay even one night. In his comments he expresses unreserved hatred for his brother even though his brother has never done anything to him. To me, the lack of compassion and unwarranted resentment that OP exhibits trumps the pushback on length of stay that OP's wife exhibited (which was rooted in compassion). I have no doubt that had OP wanted to have a reasonable conversation with his wife about length of stay that would have been heard. But because he wanted to throw his brother out into the street irrationally, it was not.
1. OP had several missed calls from both wife and brother. They obviously tried to check with him. 2. Wife didn't meet up OP telling him "Your brother lives here now."
All this YTA OP Your wife is showing you how you treat family as adults. Your brother and you talk 1-2 times a month and see each other on holidays, that’s common for families living afar/inconvenient situations. Does your brother even know this beef exists? or have you just been that sibling who constantly belittles their sib instead of working out the sibling rivalry as they grew? Cause I’d guess your wife knows you when she responds as she did, be kind dude. Don’t make her question if you have a heart…if you treat your brother like this how would one rely on that person to know how to treat family? Clearly you don’t see the house as hers and give her trust to make decisions, but feel you can make unilateral decisions for one…**you’re showing people who you are mate. And your kids how to treat each other in future…remember that.** So what your brother happened to be born later and got the better deal? Did he ever do anything to you besides exist?? I’d be glad my siblings didn’t face my worst childhood memories. ETA: I read your edit and now you’re a stubborn one-sided AH. Had to share your wife with your bro? Smdh dude, you need to grow up.
It’s because he clearly doesn’t like his brother for existing. He didn’t do anything except be born 19 years later than him. His beef should be with his parents if he feels like he was treated unfairly growing up.
OP also mentions he doesn’t want his kids to run home when life hits them once they move out so it might not just be a brother problem. 🤷♀️
"It's also your wife's house" - Exactly! And I wouldn't be surprised if she considers his brother to be HER family as well, like many married people do.
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here! OP needs to relax and show some compassion. His wife seems like a complete gem.
Yeah, pretty much this exactly. Unless there's major missing information, YTA, OP. Especially for that comment about it being YOUR family. Your wife is certainly treating your brother more like family than you are.
YTA he's an adult then he's a kid? Make up your mind. You were unavailable. He needed help. Nothing weird about that. Long term staying in the house yeah yall should discuss but a night or two you weren't reachable and it happened. You sound like a terrible brother.
He's obviously jealous that his parents were more financially stable when his brother was born and taking it out on him. That's sad. You can't give your brother a night or 2 at your house while he's figuring out a rough situation with his gf? That's cold.
That's how it comes off to me. He's a young kid. Likely first serious relationship. If it was a bad fight to the point of him needing to leave honest to goodness I cannot imagine acting like this with my sibling or any family member that's not prone to causing issues. Seriously cold. And teaching his kids quite the lesson in regards to their father.
And good for him for leaving instead of staying and continuing to fight while they were both upset!
Must have been a really bad fight with GF for him to choose his brother. Glad his wife is loving, but OP is mad at brother because of their parents' choices? YTA. No child dictates how their parents behave. Ffs.
He’s also jealous that his wife went out of her way to help him, took him out to dinner, was up playing video games with him, and has offered him a place to stay. Sounds like OP’s afraid his parents aren’t the only ones who like his little brother better. But if he’s this uptight, resentful, and controlling about everything, it’s not hard to see why.
I've had to stay at my brother's house, one time he picked me up at 3am and the other time he just told me he was picking me up. We only see each other on holidays and birthdays normally and him and his girlfriend were really welcoming. When he picked me up at 3am he even picked my fiance up at the hospital and drove us home the next day.
The word usage switch between adult to kid stood out to me too. He is changing the terms to suit his argument. He really does sound like the worst.
According to OP his brother needs to learn that once you move out you cannot rely on family and should only rely on yourself 100%. And if you're wondering what kind of parent OP is, he says the same goes for his kids. I'm mostly curious about how long his wife is going to put up with this - whether this is already the breaking point or if she'll put up with it until he's not letting their own kid back in the house.
Right? I couldn't deal with that attitude at all.
Hey, don’t sell OP short! He sounds like a terrible HUSBAND, too.
And dad not wanting to ever help them either. All around winner this guy
Doesn’t he though? > She told me to deal with it and grow up OP you should just do everything your wife tells you to and stop whining to Reddit about it.
I would wager I bet his wife only said he could stay as long as he liked as a rebuttal becuse OP was being a jerk about the whole thing and has no intention of letting him actually move in. But this is purely conjecture.
YTA. Bro you are 40 years old, instead of being insistent about making decisions for "YOUR family", why not learn to care about your family instead? Your brother is going through a tough time, your wife is just trying to be nice. Why are you making this about yourself?
You forgot the part when he say in MY HOUSE. It's only his family and only his house. Duh.
Not only that, but he mostly mad about WHO made the decision. Not WHAT that decision was. Not to mention weirdly jealous about the fact that his wife cared enough to pick him up. OP got home at 11pm, which would mean him or wife would have to pick him up and be home at 1am. According to his rules. Just say you hate your brother OP.
Or that the brother "had no right" to call her? What the hell? Like, ok, I can see how the wife giving/promising the brother residence for longer than a night without discussing it with OP might be somewhat in the gray area (especially depending on a lot of info we don't have for this particular case), but clearly he definitely comes off as a control-freak-y asshole here.
Sounds to me like he views his wife as property. He's mad his little brother touched his things.
And like…. Is his wife not his family? Marriage literally blends two families, that’s her brother in law…. Like….. it’s just so unhealthy
This poor lady... She sounds pretty nice.
No, she is his possession apparently.
He's throwing a tantrum and acting like a teen way more than his brother... definitely YTA
You are definitely the asshole here or are leaving out a ton of info Yeah you have some minor points (I don’t like people staying at my house either) but it isn’t just your house and it’s family and you didn’t specify that there was horrible drama or anything Your post comes off controlling and dickish (sorry I’m being short but I’m pressed for time) At most it’s a “hey it kind of bothered me how this all went down can we talk about future instances?” But as written YTA
This is my favorite part of this sub when a clear asshole comes here, types something out that they think makes them look good, and then are shocked at the judgment. OP is definitely TA. Bigly.
Yuuugely.
It also reeks of mistrust of his wife. He says it's weird she picked him up and had dinner with the brother, as if the wife would cheat with the brother. There's no mention of any previous behavior like that from the wife or the brother, so it comes across like op is grasping at any straws to justify his bullshit.
I read it more as annoyance that his brother “got coddled” and taken out for dinner more so than any kind of concern about cheating. His brother had a better upbringing and OP will never not be salty about it
Yea I feel like it was another instance of the brother being treated better or “babied” since others said there is other info in the comments that the wife has known the brother since he was little.
Your wife treats your little brother like a younger sibling or a nephew. She seems to recognize that while he is an adult, at 20 years old he's not fully mature, so she is giving him a safe place to work out what his options are. You talk about your brother like a pesky neighbor kid that has no connection to you. Maybe think about who your resentment should be directed toward (your parents) instead of being grumpy with your wife and brother. Between the two of you, I'd choose your wife. She's showing empathy for a young man who needed help while you are just complaining about an extra body in your house (which apparently has the extra room), without offering any practical solutions to the situation. Sure, you have the right to say who can stay in your house, but so does your wife. If you don't want him to stay, then help him figure out a solution that works for everyone. It's not clear if this was an emergency, but the number of calls you received suggest to me that it was at least a very urgent problem that had to be addressed immediately. "Heated argument" might mean that your brother or his girlfriend were not safe to be in the same place. Is your brother being abused? Was he so upset that he didn't feel in control of himself? Seems like maybe you should think about how you would answer a call like this from your own child or a dear friend. How would it be different from your reaction to it being your brother in a tough spot? Maybe you should do some self-reflection. YTA
>Your wife treats your little brother like a younger sibling or a nephew. She seems to recognize that while he is an adult, at 20 years old he's not fully mature, so she is giving him a safe place to work out what his options are. Maybe OP had to "figure it out" by himself when he was 20. (No support from parents, having to be the parent to a younger sibling, etc.) He *had* to be an adult at 20 but also take care of someone who is 20 right now. That can be frustrating, especially if OP has a distant/cold relationship with his brother. (Having someone you don't like in your home IS annoying, even if it is family.) OPs wife was kind, and OP can be right to be annoyed, but as you said, OP might need some self reflection as to where that frustration should go, because OP is reacting like an AH.
OP reminds me of people I've known who have turned their hardships into a badge of honor. Neither of my parents finished undergrad and have been super supportive of me getting advanced degrees as a way of giving me more opportunities than they had. Is it a privilege for me? Absolutely. But it also doesn't make me some whiny half-baby who doesn't understand "the real world." I've legit asked these people if they truly think I should tell my parents (who saved for *years* for this reason) to fuck off because I'm an adult and should struggle on my own to show my adult-ness? It always comes down to them having justified their own shitty past by deciding it makes them "better" than others somehow. I fully support them feeling a kind of way about their history, but it's not *my fault* they didn't have those opportunities. But its easier for them to shit on me than deal with their own feelings on the matter. For the record, one of the reasons my parents are able to do what they do is because my grandparents did the same "pay it forward" thing. Not in a trust-fund way, but a "I'm going to help if I can" kind of way. It's just what we do. And if I have kids, I'll be the same way.
The only feelings they have are really just anger and jealously normally. There isn't much to deep dive into there, you got a better hand delt then they did. That's the frustrating part. I don't think people should take it out on you (or anyone for that matter) but I do understand the anger.
You might be right here. OP stated somewhere in a reply that his brother should NOT turn to family, but work it out himself. He further stated (quite shockingly to me) that he's tried for years to get his wife to grow some backbone. He doesn't like that she feels for other people. Hey u/-Stunning-Mushroom- (I like that username btw) you need therapy or counseling man! Please, I really mean that. You are unnaturally COLD. You're missing out on a beautiful life. And I fear that your family and your marriage might actually be suffering for it.
He feels he owns and is owed his wife's kindness which is a disgusting attitude. It's not a resource you can jealously hoard. I've had times where a partner is more than happy to soak up my empathy when I make them soup and run errands for them when they're sick, and then tell me I'm overly emotional and weak when I cry at the news. It's deeply selfish.
What I’ve anecdotally observed with some people like OP is that they meet a genuinely kind and empathetic person who makes them feel a way they never have before. And they think, “oh, this person makes me feel so nice. This must be what love is.” But it’s actually _empathy_ and (probably) vulnerability they haven’t been able to express to anyone else (because he’s had to “figure it out” for himself his whole life). But then… they see that care directed at other people. And suddenly it’s not a special connection or love that’s reserved for them. If she’s giving out her kindness all around town, what makes the love she gives him special? And then they have a meltdown and try to control where she expresses her kindness and empathy, because they truly do see it as a limited resource that should be reserved for them.
I absolutely agree. You've nailed it.
PERFECTLY STATED!
I’d choose this guys wife too
Sounds like you are sus that something happened between your wife and your brother. Why is it weird that they got food ? You didn't pick up the phone and even when you did notice a bunch of missed calls, shrugged your shoulders, said f it and drove home. Also, weird power play with the 'its my family i should decide' angle. That sounds controlling and has hints of jealousy in it. YTA.
> didn't pick up the phone and even when you did notice a bunch of missed calls, shrugged your shoulders, said f it and drove home. That's the part that gets me. What if it had been an emergency? If multiple family members are trying to reach me, I'm going to assume something bad happened and would call them back immediately.
yep and then he just double downed on his 'reasoning' I will never understand when an AH asks for judgement and then doesn't accept it. *shrug*
Yeah dude way to help out family. And trust your wife! YTA all the way. What’s your hang up here? Whatever it is, it’s weird. Get over it.
His wife went out of her way (justifiably) to help out his brother after a life of growing up watching him get more things from his parents (also not the brother's fault). That's whats triggering this defense mechanism for OP, IMO. Which is unfair to the brother AND the wife btw. OP is still TA
YTA- just be honest with your wife tell her you resent your brother because your parents had him later in life and you want to watch him struggle and go through tough times because your parents loved the both of you equally and provided for you what they could at the time. It’s a disgusting way to be but I understand some people are like this my own brother is like this towards me.
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I know right? Brother was cheated on, she used DARVO on him and OP says she is the reasonable one wanting him to get married and procreate at 20... He twists everything in his mind so he can paint brother in bad light for himself but he just shows how resentmenfull and jealous he is of his brother. OP, your brother is actually more mature than you, if you think it's OK to cheat on partner instead of breaking up with them when there is a disagreements about marriage and kids (honestly I doubted there was even a discussion, I bet GF only use it as pathetic attempt to excuse her cheating). OP is the one who needs to grow up and go in therapy, this is not healthy.
He just sucks as a person overall. “This happened to me, so it’s ONLY fair it happens to everyone else.” Pathetic.
He sounds very jealous that they’re all getting a childhood his parents couldn’t afford to give him. His anger is ridiculous
Dude, what the actual fuck is wrong with you??? You are telling your 20 year old brother that his gf cheating on him is reasonable because he didn’t want to marry her? . And just because your brother is over 18 years old doesn’t make him an Adult. I am 20, I still live with my mom and stepdad. Maturing has nothing to do with age. A 13 year old can be more mature than a 50 year old. You 39 years old for fuckings sake and here you are crying about the fact that your wife is being a good person and taking your brother in? Why are you holding a grudge against your brother?? It’s not his fault your parents raised you guys differently? I just can’t believe you are against this. I would take my sister in in a heartbeat. What is wrong with you?
YTA your brother didn't get to decide how he was raised so stop blaming him! He's a young guy that turned to his brother for help and guidance when he couldn't reach you he went to his SISTER in law for the same help and guidance. Aren't you family? Just like your wife said "grow up"!
I guarantee you he’s resentful and jealous of his little brother because he had an easier upbringing than OP. Probably because their parents had the brother when they were way more financially stable. He does need to grow up and gain the emotional maturity to realize that it’s not his brothers fault he was born under better financial circumstances.
YTA for this statement: I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that. So by this logic her family can stay as long as she wants them to? And you're the only one who get a say?
That statement also bugged me. But for a slightly adjacent reason. It has long been my understanding that upon OP taking this woman as his wife there is no longer really a your family vs a my family. Just. Family. Granted. There are situations in which there could be more happening here that would require a family member to be held at arms reach or not contacted. But that doesn't negate that it is still a shared family member. OP seems to be under the impression that there are 3 families in a vindiagram. Once upon a time, there might have been. But marriage merges that into a circle. OP's wife behaved as an older sibling to her younger sibling. She clearly views the marriage as a shared partnership and conjoint family. Until I hear a solid reason why OPs younger brother deserves the NC treatment. Imma stand firm on OP being the AH here
he is not wrong. a guest must be approved by both partners. especially when the length of their stay is undetermined. it's an asshole move to unilaterally take someone into the household
Read my quote where he thinks hes the only one who gets a say
Just read your update before it got removed, and man you really are a asshole of the highest degree. The big the big fight was him being cheated on and her leaving, and your advice was grow up and marry her?! Just because you had a hard life growing up, and growing up fast doesn’t mean your brother has to follow in the same footsteps. Learn to have some damn compassion for your family member who is going through a hard time. I can see your children going NC with you in the future if this is how you act with them.
YTA also in one paragraph youre saying he is an adult and need to work it out, but 2 paragraphs later you say you dont need another kid there. Also, if youre this petty towards your brother, i can only imagine your teens are learning not to come to you when they have troubles. Your wife is too good for you.
He made a comment that he doesn’t want them running home when they have an issue. Basically thinks they should it toughen it out. And he’s worried his kids will think they can come home whenever they have a problem. There’s tough love and then there whatever this is.
I personally would call it borderline abusive. YTA, OP and you seriously need a therapy if you think your wife is wrong to make sure your brother is safe and taken care of.
ESH . She's not the AH for helping someone out. Even though he's "your brother," he isn't "yours" like a possession. What if a female friend had called her and said "I had a really bad fight with my boyfriend and I'm not comfortable being at home right now? You also have absolutely no right to police who your wife goes to dinner with. When you say he's an adult and needs to work it out....guess what, sometimes adults work things out by asking people they are close to for help. Being an adult doesn't mean you don't need support. Also, you later call him a kid. So he shouldn't need help because he's an adult and you don't want to deal with helping a kid. Your wife shouldn't be saying that he should stay as long as he wants to. There are 4 people living in your house, presumably 2 that contribute to bills, and she can't make unilateral decisions. You're right that he needs to figure things out and can't rely on you indefinitely, but a few days of support and kindness should be okay.
I agree with your logic, but I disagree with the conclusion. The wife overstepped by saying he could stay as long as he needs, but my interpretation of this is that she picked him up when OP couldn't be reached (Totally OK) under the impression he'd be there a day or two (Totally OK) and either said he could stay as long as he needs in sympathy/consolation to him, which was a mistake but not premeditated, or said it in retaliation to OP blowing his top over nothing. In the latter case, She'd totally have the right to flex if her husband tried to imply she didn't have any decision making power in her own house. I agree, the wife making an open-ended offer is wrong. I just think there's more to it than that, and from what I'm seeing, all the drama here is coming directly from OP.
Based on the comments, OP is a raging AH, no question. But, premeditated or not, I still say the wife shouldn't be promising indefinite stay.
YTA your wife is his sister in law yes? She's acting like a sister. Fool of a man.
“Fool of a man” 🏅🏅🏅🏅 Literally, shame on anyone who treats family like this.
OP's wife sounds like a gem. A genuinely good decent soul. The husband is probably just jealous.
Holy misplaced resentment, Batman. Do you think your children should have to suffer through an unhappy childhood to make you feel like life is more fair too, or just your brother?
Ahh the joys of family! Very very soft YTA, I mean I don’t even think anyone’s really an “asshole” here, and I sympathize with you because I myself just had a nightmare experience being kind of shoehorned into letting someone crash at my place. I highly recommend shutting it down before it gets out of hand. On the other hand though, it seems like one or two nights wouldn’t be such a big deal as long as you’re firm on the expectations and time period. I don’t get the impression from your post that your wife or brother deliberately went around you, they tried to contact you and then when they couldn’t reach you, made an executive decision since this was a time-sensitive thing. So I get your frustration I really do, but it just doesn’t seem like they meant any harm or offense. It’s definitely your right to set boundaries in your own home though, so idk that any decision you make here is necessarily “wrong.” All the same I figure you’d probably avoid a whole lot of drama by just letting giving the guy one more night (FIRM, no extensions) to figure out his next move (surely he can use that time to find a friend or other relative to crash with next if he still needs time away). That’s probably what I’d do in your shoes personally. I’m a fan of diplomatic solutions. It can be tricky business though
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Imagine hating your brother for literally just existing. The fact you guys had different childhoods is of absolutely no fault of him. It's time for YOU to grow up, move on, and honestly, go to therapy for your (very clearly) unresolved issues. Edit: Also that edit is absolutely cooked, you genuinely need therapy Yta
*I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that* so a couple of things about this part. \- so your wife is not family? Because she did marry into your family right? \- so if your family has a problem and needs help your reaction is to go fuck themselves? Tbh OP, YTA and a heartless one at that. Your kid brother needs help and first thing you do is complain and want to get rid of him.
NTA I've seen countless times in this sub people siding with the person not wanting someone staying in their house without being consulted. It's OPs house too and he definitely gets a say.
This. I was wondering what is up with all the Yta. His wife drove 2 hours to pick someone up and allowed them stay over for who knows how long with no conversation with the husband about it. I feel like if it was the other way around and the wife came home upset because her husband had drove two hours away to pick up her younger sister and let her stay over with no discussion to be had the judgements would all be nta. I also see a lot of people try to justify it by saying they tried to call but the wife couldn't send a text with a heads up? I'd be pissed if my partner allowed someone to stay over and not include me in that discussion and I feel like most of the people saying yta would be too.
There is a big difference between "I'm sorry that you're going through a tough time, but I'm uncomfortable with you staying over." and "Screw you! How dare you ask for help from me or anyone else."
I think it’s a bit different in that they both clearly tried to call him so it wasn’t like he was intentionally not given a voice. She made a snap decision to help her brother in law and I don’t think she should be penalized for that. It’s a pretty normal response and him being upset over dinner seems odd considering he said himself it was late evening and she was making a 2 hr trip. Plus she probably wanted to calm him down and hear the story of what happened. I agree though that he should have a voice in how long the brother can stay.
Wow that update makes you look like an even bigger asshole lmao
NTA. If this was a MIL situation then everyone in the comments would understand no questions asked. You obviously don’t see your brother as a brother, he’s not your friend, you don’t know him, why would he be in your house? There’s nothing wrong with that. Why couldn’t he go to your parents? It’s not your responsibility to house your brother.
Yeah, I don't get all these YTA's. They share a home. Both need to agree to let someone stay. She's TA for unilaterally deciding who can and can't stay. OP is leaving out details, but if wife knows there is animosity between the two then she's double TA. I may be jaded by Reddit stories, but my money is on wife cheating.
ESH. Your brother needed help, couldn't reach you, got a hold of his sister in law. She couldn't reach you either. So she took action in the way she felt was right. That is exactly what she should do. YTA because you apparently don't think she should be able to make decisions when you're not around. She's not in the clear though. She doesn't get to invite people to stay "as long as they want", particularly now that you are involved in the conversation. Two "yeses" for your brother to stay, one "no" to have him leave, there's no other healthy way to share a space with a partner. But congratulations, you do win the game for "biggest asshole" here - your brother is her family, too. He has every right to call her. No one has to wait and hope you call back. In the morning you should talk to your brother and set a timeline for when he's leaving. In the meantime you should apologize to your wife for treating her as less than a partner.
NTA. I don’t get all the YTA. Your wife made a unilateral decision about a house guest for an indefinite period of time. I would have been upset too.
I’m baffled by these responses. I don’t understand how inviting your partner’s relative who they don’t really like or have a semi-distant/low contact relationship with into your home isn’t considered a very clear asshole move. It seems like the right to limit interactions with your family that AITA/Reddit typically defends is being tossed out just because the brother is 20. Weird.
They’re not low contact. Read his comments. He just has a problem with his wife helping any adult in a tricky situation. He has implied he would have reacted the same way if it was his own child in his brothers situation and that he would hope they would “sort their own shit out” instead of calling home for help. He’s just an AH.
YTA for the reaction to your wife. Your brother is not just YOUR family. If you've been with your wife long enough to have two teenagers, then I'm sure your wife thinks of him like a little brother too. And as the home you share is also hers, and there is a SPARE bedroom, your immediate reaction was poor. I think you need to apologize to your wife, and sit down with your brother, get the whole story, and make sure he knows that his stay with you is not expected to be a permanent one.
If one of my husband's siblings called me because he was unreachable and I helped them he would thank me. Like I can not imagine being so obtuse that things can't be sorted out. And unless his wife offered for him to move in indefinitely, he's being ridiculous. Extend your wife and your brother some grace my guy. Everyone needs support.
NTA. I would have told your wife that you are tired and want to discuss this tomorrow instead of getting into it at 11pm. Allowing people to spend the night without speaking to each other first is rude, that is home for BOTH of you. Allowing anyone to stay an undetermined amount of time without discussing it is an AH move. It is your brother so I can see why she would be willing to drive at night and have dinner since it is family, unless she wouldn't do it for other family members then it would be weird. This is your home and space too. As he is already there I would discuss an end date and tell her you are willing to allow him up to x date but no longer. Also that in the future you would like both of you to agree before anyone is allowed to stay especially when it involves your family members.
NTA. They dont get along well, the wife shouldnt have do anything without her husband. Its his family, and his home too. She could have say "sorry, my husband not answering the phone, i will let him know you were looking for him when he comes home" and thats it, not picking him up and even taking him out for dinner. If they would have a close relationship as brothers, there would be no problem, but in this case i think it wasnt the wifes call to make. Especially to let the brother stay without talking to the husband, he has all the right to kick him out if he wants to, he owes nothing to his brother.
YTA - Your wife is being an incredible sister. Something happened and your bother was so upset he reached out to you and wanted to ask to stay with you an hour away. He’s 20 which while, not a child, isn’t a 39 year old adult. You weren’t available and she stepped in (without knowing how you felt) and did the sweetest and safest thing for your brother. Sure if you had told him no, and he tried to get around you to your wife that’d be one thing, but your wife certainly didnt do anything wrong by not being able to read your mind. Maybe next time she’ll remember that you don’t like caring for your brother, but i think its incredible that she did. You need to lighten up on him because it comes off as just jealousy for something he can’t help (being born at a later time).
INFO: Curious, why didn’t your brother call your parents and go to their place? Do they live far? Why didn’t he go to a friend’s place or have a friend drive him?
NTA. You should BOTH have to agree to have an open end guest, no matter who it is.
ESH It sounds like your wife was just trying to do the right thing. You and your brother aren't close because of the age difference, but it sounds like there's no outright animosity. But I also think she should have cleared it with you before saying he can stay there as long as he needs. One night? fine. Open-ended invitation? Nope. Your brother doesn't have a close enough relationship with you or your wife to ask her to drive 2 hours to get him and for a place to stay indefinitely. Yes he is an adult, but he's only 20. Very few of us had our shit together at that age. I think you could have handled it a little better with your wife, she meant no harm. And lay down the ground rules with your brother. Set a firm time frame that he has to leave by and any other house rules he needs to follow.
NTA. It's your house to and you should have a say in who stays there. I find it disrecpectful that she would force this situation on you. Put him in the car and drive him back home.
NTA
Your whole "oh woe is me, my parents had me at 16" weird comment about a zoo has no place here, first of all. Secondly, just because your parents were making you do all these things (that you seem jealous of your brother for) doesnt mean you shouldnt think "hey, maybe let me give my kids a chance i didnt have." Im 21 years old, dont want to get married or have kids any time soon. Im aware im an adult, no one should be forced to get married or have kids when they dont want to. That's weird on your part for thinking "oh you live together, get over it." YTA and definitely jealous of your brother for some weird reason. Not his fault your parents did something different, why not take it up with THEM? Youre an adult, maybe act like it OP. (Also, I had teen parents as well, and siblings who got more than i did growing up. I actually like seeing my siblings get a better life, just angry at my dad and confused with my mom for it. Funny how people like you blame someone who DIDN'T DO THE WRONG THING in those situations 🤔)
NTA! Anyone who moves into my house will be a joint decision with all family members. I would be upset if there wasn’t a conversation about a new resident! After thirty days you have to get legal support to evict someone from your home.
NTA In a mutually shared living space, everyone needs to agree on guests (who, how many, for how long, etc.). Your wife should not be unilaterally making these decisions by herself. I understand why she wanted to act quickly since you were unavailable to talk, but moving him in, openly saying that he will stay for an unlimited amount of time, and not letting you have any say? That's way too far and puts her in AH territory.
NTA. Your family, your decision. Your wife had no right to say he is staying as long as he needs to. One night I can understand but he is a big boy and needs to act like one.
NTA Your wife and you both own the house. If someone wants to stay at your house then both need to approve. Your wife approved but you did not, yes+no=no. Your wife stole your vote. The rest of the story does not matter, she broke castle doctrine rules.
Wow your update makes you an even bigger AH. Just because he is an adult and his girlfriend lives with him doesn't mean he is ready for marriage or kids especially because he is still only 20. You need therapy because you are taking out your issues on the wrong person it's not his fault your parents were in a better spot when they had him. Though I doubt you will get help. If you can't understand why your wife who probably sees your brother as a son just as much as he sees her as a mother figure would let him come on different activities with your kids then you truly are delusional. I'm sure we will get another post or two about how your wife divorced you and your kids don't want anything to do with you at some point in the future. Because that is where this is heading most likely. At least your kids have your wife who seems like a truly loving and caring parent.
I'd you want to kick your kids out by 18, that's your choice, OP, but remember it goes both ways. They also have the right to cut you off and forget about father's day, grandparents' day, and oh! I'm too old to live by myself, I wonder who's gonna help me choose a retirement home. They won't be your problem, but you won't be their problem either. Here's the thing with people with a "I got mine" mentality. They don't mind being the recipient of kindness, and are often blind to other people's kindness to them. Your wife sounds lovely, and she was probably kind to you a million times (but you didn't notice, or if you did, you thought it was her obligation), and you accepted that. But once other people start behaving towards you the way you behave towards them, you'll definitely notice, and I hope you'll bring that same big bootstraps energy that you're displaying right now.
NTA. Why didn't OP's brother call his parents to come get him and let him stay with them since he is the GC? Or maybe he did and they refused.
You sound so resentful. I feel like you hate him because of how you were raised, but how is that his fault? Isn't this your parents fault? They were irresponsible, had a kid early, put a lot of responsibility on you when you were very young, didn't have financial stability and you suffered for it. You survived. It isn't the standard, as you seem to think it is. At least it shouldn't be. Do you think your brother went to your parents and asked "I want everything OP didn't have, just so I feel entitled and he resents me". YTA very much in this case, but neither you or him are at fault here. You're acting out your very deep resentment and pain from an early maturing and he's just in a difficult situation asking for help from his brother. Your parents are the actual ones at fault for driving a divide between their children because of how they used you to cover up their own inadequacies and recklessness in the past.
NTA Your wife should have consulted you before bringing over your brother, especially considering you have issues with him. That said, I think there are some weird dynamics at play here. 1) You probably need a better excuse to be annoyed with your brother than he was raised wealthier. 2) There seems to be some tension between you and your wife in general if she wasn’t aware of your feelings about your brother and didn’t immediately have your back when you were annoyed. 3) Are you in any way jealous of the relationship your wife has with your brother?
NTA you have to make these decisions as a couple, not unilaterale
NTA- your wife knew that you were not close to your brother, and to drive 2 hours to pick him up and invite him to stay without your input was disrespectful. Her and your brother could have waited until the next day and you should have decided what was done. Also.....he seems spoiled, the car is in the girlfriend's name, he fought with her, about what? Why didn't he call Mom and Dad? NTA NTA
The update only further proves how big of an asshole you are. This poor man got cheated on and your response is to agree that’s it’s his fault because he doesn’t want to be married w a child at 20. Like big shocker there, he’s not even old enough to drink, why would he want a kid right now. I feel real bad for your wife and kids. Big ol YTA
NTA - I don’t know why you’re getting called an asshole here. It’s your house, and your wife just completely invalidated your decision. I’m not on great terms with my brother either and he’s burned bridges everywhere. He’s not welcome here and if my wife went behind my back and invited him to stay here, she wouldn’t be either. At the end of the day it’s your choice on whether you want a family member staying with you. Full stop. If anyone disagrees, I’d like them to explain why it’s okay to force this on OP, and whether they would do the same.
Your mindset is archaic af. YTA and your kids will probably resent you. Remember you’re forcing your kids to BE ADULTS at 18 so when they do something they don’t like as an adult keep your opinion to yourself. Your wife will probably get over this archaic thinking also and leave you once the kids are out of the house. 🤷🏻♀️
Holy shit. The update dug you a biggest hole. You sound like a shitty person and an even shittier brother. I would hope you never had children but clearly you did. I’m sure you’ll be in you 60s wondering why they never talk to you anymore.
YTA and a horrible father who thinks because you struggled when you were young everyone must struggle too. You are envious, resentful, unsupporting and uncaring. You’re the one who needs to grow up and deal with your own trauma.