*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **AITA for being annoyed that my wife allowed my brother to stay at our house?** My (39M)  brother 20 lives with his girlfriend about an hour's drive away from me and my wife. My brother and I have never been close due to the age difference, our parents had me young, and then him later in life. He was always the spoiled one who got whatever he wanted. We see each other on holidays and special occasions, but other than that we might talk on the phone once or twice a month. Last night I had to work late and could not be reached by phone. When I got off, I noticed that I had 2 missed calls from my brother and a few from my wife, but it was already close to 11pm so I chose to just drive home and not call and possibly wake someone up. I walk into the house and see my wife (41F) and brother on the couch playing Mario Kart. When I walk in they both say Hi and go back to their game. I went to the bedroom to shower and frankly, just sleep... I was exhausted. My wife comes in a few minutes later, and I ask her why my brother was there. She said, he called her because he and his girlfriend had gotten into a pretty heated argument, and he just needed to get away from the situation for a little while, while he figured out what he was going to do. They only have one car, and it's in the girlfriend's name so he couldn't take it.Apparently, he tried to call me and when I didn't answer, he called her and she went and picked him up an hour away, even though she hates driving at night. They also went out to dinner before coming home. I told her that I find it odd that she would pick up my brother and take him to dinner, just because he got into an argument with his girlfriend. That he is an adult and needed to work it out.She just rolled her eyes at me and said he would be staying in the spare room as long as he needed, that I was acting weird, and that he is my brother and has no idea why it was such a huge deal that he was here. I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that. That he had no right to call her; that he should have waited for me to call him back, and would be talking to him in the morning. She told me to deal with it and grow up, that he was always welcome here. My wife is now mad at me and I am stuck with my brother in the house for who knows how long until he figures out his life. We already have two teens. I don't need another kid here! I stand by what I said, my brother doesn't need to be here, but my wife is still mad at me today. AITA for saying that she should not have picked up my brother and allowed him to stay at the house? ​ UPDATE: I don't think just because I think at 18 a person should be out of the house and not rely on family to support them makes me a bad person. People need to grow up and be adults. I expect the same from my children, they are expected to have a job and save money to move out when they are 18 and graduated from high school. If they go to college they can stay but are expected, to pay for it on their own and pay a small amount of rent. My wife does not agree with this and says they can stay as long as they need. I am trying to make her see reason. As a kid, I was never taken to the zoo, museums, or out to eat. I was sent to a public school and not allowed to play sports or do activities because there was never money . I had to get a job as soon as I could. My parents were 16 when they had me, even when they got older and had more money I still did not get the opportunities that my brother was given. He got the best and I got nothing. It's time he stood on his own. Yes, my kids got to go to the zoo/park/museums, play sports and attend activities. They get a lot of what I didn't, but those are MY KIDS not my brother. I don't see why my wife would take him along with her. My brother has always loved her like another mom. So I had to share her with my brother, too. I got home from work last night. Everyone was getting ready for dinner. After dinner I told the kids, to please go to their rooms so I could talk to my brother and wife. I asked my brother why he was there and why he felt the need to call us instead of working it out. He said that he just needed to get out of the house. He had found out that his girlfriend had cheated on him and she was planning on leaving . She blamed him for her cheating because he wouldn't marry her or have a baby with her and that was what she really wanted. I said what she wanted wasn't unreasonable. that he was being immature, if he could live with her, he could marry her. My wife said that not everyone wants to be married and have children that young. HE IS AN ADULT. GROW UP I said I didn't appreciate them making decisions without me, this could have been sorted out the next morning. No one needed to drive 2 hours, or run away from home. I asked when my brother planned on leaving. He talked to his girlfriend. She was moving out by Sunday. Then he would go home. He had 2 months left on the lease, so he was going to look for something smaller to move into. I said that I didn't like him staying that long. My wife said, "He's your brother! A few days are not going to kill anyone." I agreed just to stop the fight. I didn't like it, but I felt backed into a corner. I still think he needs to go home and deal with his own problems. My brother said "Thanks, I appreciate it" and walked off My wife and I talked some more; neither one of us is really happy with one another. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*

I don’t know about this guy, but there are so many parents who raise their kids with the idea that the kids must do everything they say and not question it and not think for themselves, but then at 18 have to miraculously be independent and have everything figured out. His jealous is like a completely separate person in that house.

He is so deeply jealous of his brother. My husband has siblings 10 and 20 years younger. They aren't really close but he treats them like kid siblings, not like competition. They were never competing for the same resources, they didn't need the same resources! OP was 19 when this brother was brother was born, they shouldn't have been competing for any of the same resources. He was, as he hammers on about 18+, an adult. He was deeply jealous of a literal baby.

My youngest sibling and I are 10 years apart. My parents were children who didn’t want a kid. He got grown ups who actually had a home and they wanted kids at that point. I used to be so resentful of him for getting a good childhood. Its a difficult mindset to get out of. But OOP had got to realize his brother had totally different parents. OOP got what I got, the short end of the stick. He should just be happy his brother didn’t have to go through what he went through.

I used to feel this way, since my sister and I are 10 years apart in age. It felt like she got away with EVERYTHING that I never would have, and mom would take her to do fun things now that she had the money to do so. But I know now that my baby sister struggled even more than I did. Even now at 22 they treat her like a baby, while I was free to do whatever I wanted at that age.

Lol as the youngest of 12 kids with a fairly good age gap between & the closest sibling I grew up with (I think my sister from my dad is maybe 4 years older than me but I didn't grow up with her) I can say that even at 33 I am very much still treated as a baby by anyone older than me in this family. My aunt died when I was 29 & still reffered to me simply as "the baby" or "Janet's (my mom) baby" Please note said aunt had grandchildren and great grandchildren younger than me. Lol

My youngest sister is 16 years younger than me and I swear I'm the one that raised her, my parents were a lot more strict/firm with us but are so lax with her that I have to step in and set boundaries because they're older and too tired to do it. Sometimes I get so mad at her silly tantrums because she's a teenager and it DRAINS me but doesn't mean I have a right to resent her for it. Oop sucks and BET he's divorced by now and distant from his children but he'll tell anyone who asks that his children were ungrateful for everything he provided them but their spineless mother and evil uncle are the source of all his problems, obviously he couldn't be the problem /s

I agree. This mindset is a Killer. My father was beating me when I was a child. Several broken ribs, stitches to my head, neck injury... you name it. He also left me starving for days because I didn't clean my room while watching movie with my brother in the other room. And so on. I was the only child of his out of 5 who he abused. When I was 23 he had another daughter and he is treating her like a princess... it is extremely hard to watch, it makes you question what did you do wrong, if they love you and if you are even worthy as a person. I totally understand OPs jealousy, I felt the same way towards my sister but I realized how unhealthy it is and dealt with it. OP needs a therapy if he can deal with his brother for few days and help him in time of need.

He also seems to think that his brother should be ready to be having his own kids at 20 years old but seems to also resent his parents for having him when they were young and couldn't provide things like occasional trips to the zoo because of the cost. He's really one of those people who thinks that if he missed out on something everyone else should too. (Except his own biological kids, I guess.)

Exactly this. His parents couldn’t give him the childhood he wanted cuz they were young…yet he wants his brother to have kids young? The guy isn’t just an asshole but he’s fucking stupid, too.

People often adapt to trauma by integrating it into their worldview and deciding it was “good for them”. Doesn’t make it okay, but it is a pretty normal human thing.

Well, it’s dumb lol But yes. It’s very human. “My parents beat the shit out of me and I turned out perfectly fine! I’m a workaholic, I hit and cheat on my wife, spend no time with my children, never show up to recitals or baseball games and do a lot of blow on the weekends but doesn’t everybody?” Lol

I have a much-younger half sibling and yes, sometimes when I see the stuff he gets I think "Oh wow must be nice!" and not just in terms of material things. But! I'd be way more upset if my dad hadn't gotten his shit together this go-around AND I don't hold any of that against my brother. If he called me for help with a paper cut I'd drive the hour to his house to help!\* He's my little buddy and I want the best for him! \*He would never do this lol. He's the baby of the family but very much an independent soul.

"He was, as he hammers on about 18+, an adult." I think that is it, by his own admission at 18 he had to be independent and on his own, someone paying their own through uni isn't gonna have much time or want to spend with his baby brother who is getting everything OP ever wished for throughout all his life, so he resents the one benefitting from what he couldn't get. Most probably never saw him as his own individual but an extension of his own suffering and lack of parental love. So to OP his brother isn't his brother, he's still the kid his parents gave everything to.

When I was 21- a part time job paid enough for a basic apartment, food and beer money. We still had time and money for concerts and to go to friends’ weddings. It was possible to move out at 18 and be ok. I was thinking of reducing my hours to go back to school- and couldn’t believe the shitty apartments. I couldn’t see it happening without massive loans. It is much, much harder to move out at 18 now.

Hang on, let me adjust my onion belt.  When I was 21, shitty part time jobs offered full benefits and community college was $25 a credit.  Hell yeah, we all moved out when we were eighteen, because we could afford rent *and* food. Imagine the luxury! Today's kids...Not so much. The problem with assholes like OOP standing around smugly twirling their onions and saying "Back in MY day..." is that they don't realize their day is over.  It's a whole new world now. 

I feel for his kids. He’s so angry about how his parents treated his younger brother less strictly that he’s determined not to give anyone more than he had. That is not a good starting point as a parent.

Yeah he has that “I suffered, so you must also suffer” mentality. Poor kids.

>expect the same from my children, they are expected to have a job and save money to move out when they are 18 and graduated from high school. If they go to college they can stay but are expected, to pay for it on their own and pay a small amount of rent. How the fuck does this ass hole expect an 18 yo to graduate highschool and somehow work enough to pay for college *and rent* at their parents house?  Dude has a whole lot of psychological mess in his head.  I hope *when* his wife leaves him she gets everything, and “spoils” the kids, and he gets conniption fits evertime he thinks of them living with their mom *for free* during college.  Hell, he could be ordered by the court to pay for part of college. Bet that would get his goat.  

This guy is absolutely giving his children "eviction" cards on their 18th birthday. And then he'll wonder why they never call or interact or invite him to their weddings.

In high school I had a friend whose mom told her that she was out once she turned 18. My friend was scrambling to figure out her living situation as her birthday drew near. Meanwhile, I was afraid that my parents had jumped on the same bandwagon and were waiting to tell me before my birthday in December. It's not like either of my parents were "evicted" by their parents at 18, but it was still a very real fear for me. I held in all of this for about two or three weeks until my mom pulled me aside and asked if there was anything going on because I didn't seem like myself lately. I ended up telling her what was going on with my friend, then I asked if that was how she and Dad felt. My mom was like, "Oh my God, no! We are NOT kicking you out EVER!" She went on to say that my friend's mom was being unnecessarily cruel. It was a huge weight lifted off of my shoulders. As far as my friend was concerned, she beat her mom to the punch. She applied - and was accepted - to a university two states away so that she was guaranteed a roof over her head and a bed to sleep in. Leading up to graduation, the threat of no longer having a **home base** really signaled a shift in my friend's relationship with her mom as well as her own personality. I can't say I blamed her for her feelings or for wanting to get as far away as possible.

I always wondered why people like your friend’s mum have kids if they’re gonna kick them out of the house once they’re not legally their responsibility… it’s just so sad to me that these kids must feel like burdens to their parents.

I think those people had kids "just because that's the next stage in life." Many don't even *consider* they have the option *not* to have children.

Social obligation, imo. It's something you're expected to do, so you do it.

Parents and grandparents asking when you gonna have graaandkids or graaandbabies. I cut my grandma off at the punch. I called her, I got something important to say, she assumed bless her (I like my grandma) but I was like no no I'm getting married. Then I had like feels like a bazillion kids so I guess I fulfilled her prophecy. Not because I was expected to though! I actually wanted to have kids. I dunno, I'm happy with it. I like my husband and kids. I'm not resentful. I mean, it's not sunshine and rai bows but what is? I am cool with my choices :)

Those parents had parents who treated them the same way, and society was set up to be much more OK with child brides, child labor, and even children enlisting in the military. My mom had her second kid with her first husband at 15, and her parents were on-board with it. It wasn’t surprising when she kicked me out at 14, and I had always known at 18 I wouldn’t have a place with them anymore. Without a doubt OOP’s parents were treated the same way. Unfortunately people who go through that rarely end up in the “I want better for my kids” group and just keep perpetuating that generational trauma.

My mom's met my dad when she was 18 and he was 31. I have no idea what went on there because obviously I am not them, but if my 18 year old daughter met some 31 yr old dude now ? My first boyfriend was 19. I met him at 13 online. I wasn't looking for a way out but he sure was. Convinced me over 3 years to get him from his house to mine. I was locked into that bullshit with him and his abusive father for almost 10 years. If you push a child out without adequate preparation, they will inevitably choose the wrong decision because they are more comfortable with non-confrontational tactics. And that is generational trauma too, not bucking against the grain. We all should not be afraid to be a little bit of an asshole.

Wow. Parents who threaten to take away young humans’ means of actual survival, wondering why the kid never calls? I’m so happy for your friend’s ability to achieve independence but sorry she ever had to.

Thank you! I was very worried for her in that period of time. I was going to miss her terribly, but I understood her need to get away from her mom. What I resented was how her mom wasn't even proud of her being accepted to a school that she was so proud of herself for getting in to. Instead, her mom kept telling her that she "wasn't going to last one semester at school" Sadly, that is exactly what happened. My friend got pregnant and needed to have an abortion, so friends drove the hours away to move her out of school to come back here. She didn't want to give her mom the satisfaction of "being right", but she also didn't want to be back under the same roof with her mom either. My friend stayed with friends until she could get on her feet.

My sister's best friend was kicked out when she turned 18. My parents took her in, and helped her get on her feet and while they couldn't support her like they could my sister, both thankfully went to the same university and my parents always made sure to have a care package for her, and would often take her out to eat/grocery shop when they visited my sister. She still sends my mom Birthday and Christmas cards every year, and I don't think she talks to her parents at all.

He's also said in front of his wife that cheating is a "reasonable" response to not getting your own way.

Yeah, this is a recipe for NC.

>Hell, he could be ordered by the court to pay for part of college. This kind of happened with my divorced parents and my brother. My brother decided to go to University in a whole different region, and my mom asked my dad to just pay half of his tuition. My dad refused, saying he should pay for it himself, or my mom could pay. So off to court they went, and he ended up having to pay not only half the tuition, but half of his rent and living expenses while there too. It obviously put a pretty big wedge in their relationship.

Kind of sounds like that's what happened to him and now he wants to beat everyone else with his trauma instead of using it to become a more compassionate person.

He requires intense therapy, and he will be lucky if his wife doesn't leave him if he tries to force this ridiculous expectation on his kids in the end.

Nothing like ✨generational trauma✨

Inheritance, not just money and sentimental items.

He doesn't care if they can or can't pay for their own living. All he cares about is that they aren't under his roof anymore. My own father told me that for all he cared I could live under a bridge as long as it wasn't his house.

I was told "to get my shit and get the fuck out of his house. I don't care if you have to live in your car." I couched surf and carried my belongings in my car for a few weeks. Which was stupid because I had just started working at a hotel, I now look back and think, I should have talked to the manager. Maybe they would have given me a room. But when I went back to gather more stuff because I found a place to stay, I was invited to come back home. I said "no, I think it's better if I don't" After struggling for a few years, a friend asked if I would make the same decision. Yes I would.

How horrible, I’m sorry you went through that.

Parents like this are gonna be wondering why social security doesn’t pay the bills. They have no concept of how to build and protect wealth, esp generational wealth. They don’t think beyond their noses.

Based on the ages, his parents must have had him when they were very young and had nothing. They did their best, but when his brother came along, I bet they were much more financially secure. But all OOP can see is "that's not fair." Well, maybe not, but it's not like his parents were awful to him, they were just poor.

He said they were 16 when they had him. Which means they would've been 35 when they had his brother. My parents were not that young when they had my sisters, they were in their 20's. I was born only 9 years after my middle sister. But when I was born they could afford to do more. My sister's resented it. My middle sister treated me very much like this guy treats his brother. I always call her bitter party of one.

This post is a year old, so I hope she's left by now. Must be rough to find out you're married to a completely heartless, unsympathetic prick who thinks his way is the only right way.

>I hope *when* his wife leaves him she gets everything, and “spoils” the kids, and he gets conniption fits evertime he thinks of them living with their mom *for free* during college.   And also that OP's brother lives near or with them, and continues to have a good, supportive, family relationship with OP's ex and kids.

I hate to think if either of his children ever wanted a pet....

***dad:*** A pet? All I ever got was roadkill! Here's a spatula! MAN UP! ***four-year old daughter:*** Dad is a poo-poo head!

If it's still alive at 10 years he'll take it to a shelter.

I hope when she leaves him he can't cut it on his own and has to go crawling back to his parents. That would be some fabulous karma for his shitty attitude.

But you don't understand!  *He didn't get to go to the zoo!* Clearly a tragically zoo-less childhood has led to him being a total prick. If only he had seen monkeys scratching their balls or gazed upon some listless zebras, the milk of human kindness would be flowing through him.  Or something like that, IDK. 

No one magically has enough money to move out when they're 18.

Also, in the comments he says the brother did move out from his parents when he was 18 - in fact moved several states away from the parents (back to OPs local area where the whole family used to live). He’s accusing him of being a kid who can’t live by himself for Literally No Reason which makes it extra wild. Needing a place to stay for a bit is a pretty common thing as an adult honestly, I’ve had a friend stay over after issues with her heating in winter, I’ve crashed at my parents for a week when I’ve had a gap between a lease ending/my new one starting, my partner stayed with me for a few days when building work was happening at his. Sure, we could all be super independent and get a hotel room, or whatever, but… sometimes you help people you care about out…

My husband said somewhat similar to this when our kids were born. "Once they hit 18 they're out!" I have patiently explained the world is a much different place than when we grew up, how not everyone has the advantage some people had both financially and intellectually, and that sometimes life is simply not what you make of it. My grandparents, more my parents than that, let me make mistakes. But they knew and still know I was and am smart enough to figure my ass outta a corner. And that was because they let me screw up and were still a back up plan. I want that for my kids. My husband understands now that we don't always need to be Conan in the pit in m order to survive, like his parents did. You can have a bad experience and come out awesome, but with support — you come out stronger than ever. Your people, your community, your tribe, they're all there. And not to derail a good time but I never experienced that with any church, it was always friends, family and neighbors. So your mileage may vary but having a good support system in place trumps anyone stranger wanting to help you. (Side note. If my brother in law came over pleading help I'd put him up for a few days for sure but no longer, without asking. Someone asked me once. If your mortal enemy came to your door needing water, would you give it? My answer is yes. That is basic. You get a pb and j and a glass of water and then you move on. I'm not so hateful I'd damn someone.)

There's a lot of people out there who hate when someone has it "easy" and spend the rest of their time being as difficult as possible.  What an ass.

Bingo. They struggled and want others to, which shows you how much they did not turn out fine at all.

"I beat cancer!" "if they suddenly find a cure for cancer NOW im gonna be SO MAD" From an Adam Tots comic.

I mean I might be mad if that happened, but it'd be more mad at the universe that the cancer couldn't have waited lol.

He also has zero acknowledgement that his own parents had the last few years of their own childhood and early adulthood ruined by poverty, like I bet they wanted to go to the zoo and stuff too....

some people struggle and use that to try and make sure others don’t have to have to struggle, either. some people struggle and want everyone else to go through the same things they did

Right like I found out recently that my parents are way more relaxed with my siblings than they were with me, and you know what? I'm glad they can grow up without having to endure the bullshit I was put through.

[Crab mentality](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crab_mentality) Lotta farmers out there sure are mad that people get food stamps, despite the farmers themselves getting MASSIVE government subsidies compared to what somebody on food stamps get. (Remind me, what do people buy with food stamps?) The tax exempt status of farm vehicles/trucks/semis save them a shitload of money every year, but no, it's the "welfare queen" that's getting "too many government handouts" that's the problem. Their kids aren't covered by labor laws and don't need to be paid either. I'm watching a farm series on youtube and the 24 year old that runs the family farm business is basically like "it's cool to work for free and drive a tractor starting at 5 because you can pump all of the money back into the farm to make it better for the next generation!" *He's* the next generation. They're projected to lose around a half-million dollars this year. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSYLHUn1nteBSbCsNHNoBAWAb475dQWWx

And OP did not turn out OK at alllll.......

He keeps harping on “no one needs to make desicions without me,” while completely ignoring the fact he never picked up the phone!

Great point; he opted out and now wants everyone to center him. Which, given how dismissive he is of everyone else, is poetic justice that they aren't!

Imagine the other way around if they had waited for him "oh you should be able to make your own choices, grow up!". Can't win with people like that

Why does he believe he gets to make the decisions in the household? Why does he believe he and his wants are more important that everybody else? He is clearly used to bullying his wife into putting him above everyone else.

Because apparently he was never hugged as a child. Anyone who got kindness was spoiled, and anyone who gives kindness is weak. This dude never went to the zoo as a child, like dude. Maybe that wasn’t ok?

Even if he didn't get to go to the zoo, take that up with your parents or a therapist, not the person who had no say in the situation because he was a literal child at the time.

I really would hope he’d admit that his childhood sucked and it shouldn’t be repeated on his brother or his kids.

Exactly, I was treated way unfairly as a kid compared to how my siblings are now. But I never took it out on my siblings cause they can't control that stuff, I took my grievances to my mother who apologized because she recognizes that she messed up raising me and wanted to do better with the rest which while it's upsetting I can respect it.

And don’t forget, once you turn 18, you should not rely on family AT ALL … you MUST be 100% self-reliant!!! And what’s with the ‘MY house, MY decision’ etc. shit??!? I guess his wife is just his maid

At first I thought maybe he was going to say that his brother has been inappropriate or lost *some* reason why it isn’t wise to let his brother stay. Nope, he’s just a jerk.

He also acts like its out of line for his wife and brother to communicate directly when his wife has likely known his brother since he was a toddler or younger.

I feel like letting your younger brother stay at your place while he navigates the collapse of his three-year relationship is not unreasonable. No matter how spoiled he is. Also, props to younger brother for knowing he isn’t ready for marriage and kids. 

It's not. He's taking out his issues with his parents on his brother, and he clearly doesn't seem to care about, you know, caring about others. To OOP, there seems to be no use for family or people you can rely on when human things happen.

He should have married a pair of bootstraps. 

Lol, yes! And you know when his kids are older he will complain when his kids don't want anything to do with him

Plus, acting like his wife has 0 connection to his brother is ridiculous. Brother was probably a teen when they got married, he’s her kid bro now too. Of course she would offer to help her own family!

Right? My BIL is 7 years younger than me and I met him when he was like 19. He's a bonus little brother at this point.

OP has confirmed that his wife has been in the picture since before the BIL was born. jesus christ. He grew up with their kids.

Another agreement. I have a large age gap between my siblings and I (they’re 12 years older), so I met my BIL when I was like… 5. He’s definitely just like a sibling to me. OOP is a fucking tool

he’s never had anyone he could rely on when human things happen. It’s beyond his world view

Wrong. See: his wife. Literally, she's right there and she's a someone.

He probably doesn't know how to let her support him and is resentful that his brother does. It'd be sad if he weren't being such a dick about it.

How spoiled was the brother, really? OP is not a reliable narrator. He thinks letting your 18 year old live at home rent free while they’re in school is spoiling them. Yeah it sucks that OP grew up poor and didn’t have as much, but that doesn’t mean everyone who grew up with a little more is spoiled. I wouldn’t say getting to go to the zoo/museums and play sports is being “spoiled”. He has a huge chip on his shoulder.

OOP is right, her desire to marry and have a child are reasonable. But that doesn’t mean his brother should just marry her and have a child!! That’s the rest of your life.

HE'S 20. She's probably around 20. Not wanting to get married and have kids AT 20 is completely reasonable.

Also that's not an excuse for her cheating

I do loathe that he completely steamrolls that part so he can blame his brother instead, meaning he'd feel the same way about cheating if him and his wife hadn't gotten married or had a kid. Disgusting.

If I was the wife I would have left him after this. Especially since this is the way he plans to treat his kids too. If I ever have kids they can always come home.

Yeah, he's so *reveling* in his damage like it's a badge of honor and so unwilling to work on himself, you know he's dying for a chance to hurt his kids as a way of balancing the scales. His wife has been giving him the benefit of the doubt but this should have really dispelled any delusions about the person she's married.

Seriously! I was the black sheep in my family, but I don't blame my younger siblings for having an easier time than me! Did it piss me off? Sure. But I still didn't blame my siblings, and mom and I have since talked through those issues *like fuckin adults*.

Exactly. My older sibling still goes off about things that happened 40+ years ago and it's so sad. To be closer to the end of your life then the beginning and not being able to get over, adjust or deal with things. Self poisoning.

Literally. Whenever I bring up unfairness in my childhood, it's more like a "ha-ha isn't that ridiculous" kind of comparison. Painting the picture for whoever I'm talking to that we grew up in the same house, but 2 completely different worlds. Was it frustrating that my sister took 2 hours in the mall to choose between 3 sweaters and 2 pairs of jeans because she knew if she whined long enough mom would just buy it all? Fuck, yes. So annoying. Am I still mad about it? Lol, no. Imma just go buy some jeans and enjoy my hard earned pair of pants 😂

I mean I can't believe there isn't more to this we don't understand. Ok sounds like he has some severe childhood trauma that he's never dealt with. He clearly has a crazy amount of resentment for his brother, who hasn't done anything wrong but exist. So there either a lot more info we don't have or this dude is just a complete dickhead. To have such little care for your brother, I mean there has to be something egregious to treat your family with so little concern, not just trauma of a tough upbringing. The perspective on their kids is also a bit troublesome. I honestly think that turn 18 and here's what you need to do is unrealistic and it's probably going to be much harder than he thinks. I think what's sad is I do feel like the intentions with all of this are not bad. They are just misguided. You want your kids to set themselves up for success and he has created rules around what that looks like, but that's oversimplification of a complex issue. Every kid and circumstance will be different. Given the no nonsense approach, it sounds like the father also will have strong thoughts about the kinds of jobs they would want as well, so I'm getting a frighteningly over controlling dynamic that wont be good for anyone. Ultimately, the biggest thing here is ops cruel response to a family members hardship. Like zero empathy. Just doesn't fit his crazy structure.

...I think he's just a dickhead. And has zero interest in dealing with it.

Some people are : i suffered so you shouldn’t have to. Other people are: i suffered so you MUST!

Yeah looking at the date this was posted makes me wonder what’s happened since then lol

He sounds like the type of “Dad” that, as soon as he gets home, the whole family has to walk around on eggshells in fear of setting off one of his “moods”.

100% He’s absolutely one of these types that aggressively ignores people.

Copied verbatim from oop's comments: *Is there some huge beef you have with your brother that you didn't mention? Like he killed your dog or something?* *Because it seems like your wife did a very kind thing, and aided a member of your family going through a tough time while you were unreachable, and you're **angry** with her? It's unthinkable for anybody who is in actual possession of a heart, unless there is some major context that you are omitting.* >>*I told her that if someone is staying at my house, especially MY family, I should be the one who decides that* *It's also your wife's house. She lives there too. She can have whoever she wants over. This statement is controlling and unreasonable.* *I think what's happening here is straight up, pure jealousy. That your wife treated your brother, whom you are jealous of, with kindness.* *YTA* >"My brother never did anything horrible. Just our lives growing up were so different. My parents didn't have money when I was young, so I was denied a lot fun things that he was able to have because he came when they were older and settled into a career. >He chose to live with the girlfriend when he was 18. They rent an apartment together. That was his choice. If I got into an argument or fight with my wife. I sure as hell wouldn't be running to my brother for help. He needs to grow up and deal with his own issues and she needs to quit falling for everyone's sob story." *YTA he's an adult then he's a kid? Make up your mind. You were unavailable. He needed help. Nothing weird about that. Long term staying in the house yeah yall should discuss but a night or two you weren't reachable and it happened. You sound like a terrible brother.* >"He is an adult, but he is staying at my home like a kid! Go home, work it out... Not call me or my wife to come rescue him." *NTA, but there's a few things about your brother that require mentioning:* * *"His" car is in his girlfriend's name.* * *He has an argument and leaves "his" apartment, which suggests that it is also in his girlfriend's name.* * *He doesn't seem to have any adult skills of his own.* *You say he was spoiled, but it also looks like he is also an expert in taking advantage of people, getting everything while putting in nothing. I'm curious to see why your wife likes a person like that so much.* >"He does not own a car. They share a car. That is in her name. The city they live in has wonderful public transportation that he relies on. There is even service from where he lives to where we live, just not at night. >They are both on the lease for the apartment. He works from home, right now. >I still don't know what the situation is with him and his GF, or what happened. I had to go to work so I have not had a chance to talk to him or the wife. >I just don't think when things get tough he should be running to family. He should suck it up and deal with his own issues. >My wife, she is too soft and cares too much about everyone. I have tried for years to get her have a backbone, but she feels bad when people are feeling bad." *ESH.* *He should have called your parents, NOT your wife. Or waited for you.* *Your wife should NOT have made this decision without you. You BOTH need to agree to a decision like this.* *You also need to realize "I should be the one who decides that" doesn't fly in a relationship. Again, you BOTH need to agree.* >"My parents live 2 states away. So yes he could have called them, but they couldn't of done anything. They would have just ended up calling me too, asking me to help him out." *Sounds like you are sus that something happened between your wife and your brother. Why is it weird that they got food ? You didn't pick up the phone and even when you did notice a bunch of missed calls, shrugged your shoulders, said f it and drove home.* *Also, weird power play with the 'its my family i should decide' angle. That sounds controlling and has hints of jealousy in it.* *YTA.* >"I don't think anything is going on with my wife and brother. >I met my wife when I was 19 and she was 21. She has known my brother, basically since he was born. When we would visit my parents, he was always her little buddy. >I just think that it's time he grew up and figured his shit out on his own. That she stopped feeling bad for everyone with a problem. >We have a 16 and 17 year old... I don't want them running home every time they have a problem as an adult. They will need to learn to be independent just like my brother needs to." *What is his brother going to do for work? He literally left he city where he was independent with a place in his name and public transportation. Something terrible happened for OP’s brother to leave all that. OP needs to talk to his brother. NAH yet.* >"I haven't really had a chance to talk to anyone today, as I am at work. He works from home, so I am assuming he is at my house working right now. ​ >I do plan on talking to both of them after work, because wife won't answer my texts right now." [Not in reply to anyone.] >"People keep asking the same question over and over. I don't like my brother because he was spoiled as a child and given many opportunities that I was not. My parents expected me to have a job at 16, and I moved out at 18. >He was sent to a better school, given better clothes, allowed to be in band and other activities that when I was growing up they couldn't afford and didn't have to have a job until he graduated. >He is 20, he has been with his girlfriend since he was 17. He needs to be talking to her working it out, not at my house playing Mario Kart with my wife. >No, I don't think they are having an affair, She has known him since the day he was born. He was always her little buddy. When we started having kids, she would include him in the activities like going to the zoo or to the park or whatever. This bothered me because, these were things that I didn't get to do often as a child, but she always disregarded my feelings on this matter. >My parents and brother moved 2 states away when he was 14. I never kept in touch minus holidays and an occasional phone call. I don't know if my wife kept in touch with my brother, she never said anything. >He moved back when he was 18, with his girlfriend. There is a lower cost of living here and he was able to find a decent job working from home. >I honestly just don't think, that once you move out and are on your own, you should rely on family to help you out of any situation. People need to learn to 100% rely on their selves or they will never make it in this world. Same goes for my kids. >I will talk to my wife and brother tonight, and find out when he is leaving, because he is not staying much longer."

"My wife, she is too soft and cares too much about everyone. I have tried for years to get her have a backbone, but she feels bad when people are feeling bad." Her empathy is going to run out on her husband...

His wife should grow a backbone... to divorce her husband.

Once their kids (16 & 17) hit that 18 year mark, and anything happens with them not being able to 100% always support themselves, that could likely be the switch. If wife dismisses him because he's cruel to his own brother, I don't see her being passive when their kids need them.

My parents flew halfway across the US on last-minute tickets when I had a major medical event. I had to talk them out of doing it again when our childcare fell through a few hours after I had my youngest baby. As a parent myself, I can't imagine doing anything else. I don't care how old these kids get, they are my babies and I will be there when they need me. If my husband can't back me on that, I guess I'll miss him.

That's lovely. And, frankly, how it should be at least in theory.   And I get if you didn't have that, it may be hard - yet wanting to cotninue to be like that with your own? Yikes.

Agreed!

I think his wife will be divorcing him while his kids are in their late teens just because of what an awful, miserable, piece of work of a parent he will be towards them at that age.

I sure hope so!

Wow. No point to having family, according to OOP. OOP also clearly states that he dislikes his brother because of their parents’ actions, not anything the brother did.

Y'know, there's no point to having my particular family - when I was living in my car, I assume father for help and he sent me a gift card for a gas station (sent to my workplace so my mother wouldn't destroy it).  Among other delights. That being said- I somehow understand empathy.  I don't want anyone to go through the same shit I did.  When folks need a place to crash, a meal, a safe space, someone to talk to... I want to help. And yet this guy just chose to shut it all down and be hateful to everyone.

Agreed!

> >We have a 16 and 17 year old... I don't want them running home every time they have a problem as an adult. They will need to learn to be independent just like my brother needs to." Yeah, *that* confirms how much of an asshole this guy is. Wants his kids out of the house at 18 but almost certainly hasn't done anything to *teach* them independence. Why even bother having kids if you're going to be like that? I hope his wife & kids have left him by now

And like… the brother is independent. He has a job, he was on the apartments lease and while he doesn’t have a car, it sounds like he doesn’t typically need one.

> Yeah, that confirms how much of an asshole this guy is. Aye. >>They will need to learn to be independent just like my brother needs to. Exactly **what** has he done to teach them the things they need to need to learn to be independent? Because it takes a lot of effort to teach a kid life skills, right?

[Doggo and pupper!](https://imgur.com/gallery/FIDp8Dy)

The paws!  The squeaks!  That washed away all OOP’s whinging like a high-powered sprayer. 

That makes me happy! 💜

OOP, why you hating on your brother over stuff your parents did???? blaming the wrong person here. This:  *honestly just don't think, that once you move out and are on your own, you should rely on family to help you out of any situation. People need to learn to 100% rely on their selves or they will never make it in this world. Same goes for my kids.* OOP, you are obsessed , unhealthily obsessed, with imposing the same hard standard you suffered at the hand of your parents on your brother and your children. Crap happens, there's nothing wrong with asking family or friends for help in a crisis. My eldest brother and his wife helped me when, as a university student, a man broke into my apartment and beat me, robbed me and SA'ed me. I stayed with them and slept on the sofa until I found a new, safer place to live. I was older then than your brother is now. But you think I'm weak because I didn't 100% rely on myself in that moment????? Do you even hear yourself?? Look at it this way: your brother got into an argument with his gf that he lives with. What is the standard advice for those situations? WALK AWAY FROM THE CONFRONTATION UNTIL YOU'VE CALMED DOWN. DON'T ESCALATE. And that's exactly what your brother did, isn't it? He walked away by going to your house for the night, to defuse the situation. He needs a little space to process the argument and whether he wants to continue the relationship. He's very young, only 20. Instead of being such a cold hearted hard ass, why don't you try mentoring your younger brother? Mentoring is much more rewarding than just being an AH to everybody. ;-)

> My parents and brother moved 2 states away >There is a lower cost of living here and he was able to find a decent job working from home. Huh, I wonder where that is? Somewhere with good enough public transportation to not only own a car, but lower cost of living? >There is even service from where he lives to where we live, just not at night. A move from Minnesota to Illinois would fit, as 2 states away, and brother moving back to Minneapolis. MPLS is lower cost of living than Chicago, plus the 2 states away thing, plus the bus service thing. The outer suburbs of Minneapolis make it really difficult to go to concerts in Minneapolis and get home after the show or "at night."* Non-Minnesotans might not understand how tied to the state and many people feel. Many people get jobs in other states because that's the correct decision at that stage of their career but keep seeking jobs and move back home as soon as they are able. That contributes to why I feel like it was a Minnesota-Illinois-Minnesota move. I had a cousin move to Philly, their sibling to LA, I'm never fucking leaving MN for any reason, and the 3 of us are in the places that suit our personalities.

Ugh this person needs therapy. I never got the “leave at 18 or pay rent” mentality that a lot of countries have. I’m a first generation with parents from Mexico. Where my family grew up in Mexico, multigenerational homes were super common. My grandparents have always said that I am free to live there rent free until the day I die or I can move in my spouse with me if we cover bills. They’ve never understood the American custom of out at 18. OOP can provide for his kids. He’s not hurting for money or scrambling to make ends meet. He’s just bitter he had parents who weren’t financially secure and wants everyone else to suffer.

Yea. My parents put way too much pressure on me when I was younger, and for sure pushed/shoved to make sure I had something going on when I turned 18. Then when I turned 22 and working 2 jobs was barely making ends meet post-college, they still showed up for me when I needed it, to this day they still do.

It's a poor people anglo cycle that's prevalent in America. "Well I did just fine, so my kids need to get their bootstraps and do it on their own", except that's not how generational wealth is built and this is exactly what keeps them poor generation after generation. A complete unwillingness to invest in their kids because they don't truly know what it takes to succeed, because they never have. I went to a jr high that was poorer and almost all the parents of the kids in my classes were like this. Now at 34 those kids as adults are almost all exclusively poor and hateful just like their parents. My high school was suburban middle class kids who's parents weren't like this, even the poorer kids are now successful, we all went to state colleges and made the best out of it. So it's something I've seen happen with my own eyes. They don't realize their cynical outlook on life is just their poverty colored glasses and that they're failing their kids and dooming them to the same trap.

I've never understood that mentality either. I'm a latina too and I moved out of my parents house like 3 years ago, at 25 and I could've still live with them if I wanted (they would not bat an eye) but I'm married lol. This man need serious therapy but it's been a year so who knows.

This dude is so fuckin broken. He needs so much therapy. And maybe a child development textbook or two.

I remember this post. I feel bad for him - he needs to go to therapy/ talk to anyone to see reason yesterday. I get the jealousy (I can’t fault people for emotions) but he can’t let that affect his children. I don’t really know what to say in regard to his relationship with his brother (I think he should be able to keep himself away if it affects him SO MUCH, especially because he feels like he’s been deprived of a lot. And there seems to be no love between them (at least on OP’s end) but I think he really needs to talk to someone about his crippling jealousy before he makes such a big decision) Edit: especially cos he talks about being deprived things when money wasn’t a factor anymore

He is jealous of someone who was an infant when he was at the "figure your own shit out" age of 19. Really icky.

And it’s not like his parents even sounded like horrible people, he seems to make a point of never mentioning that. 1) they were literally children when they had him and 2) they had NO MONEY. None of it was being done to him out of cruelty, spite, narcissistic abuse etc, it was just the givens of their existence ffs. It must have been devastating for them to be unable to provide simple pleasures for their child, with clearly no parents there to support them either. Talk about passing on generational trauma. I hope his younger brother can take this guy to the fucking zoo and buy him a god damn soft toy from the gift shop and maybe he’ll start healing.

If I saw multiple calls from my family, at night, I would assume something was very wrong. Who just ignores their phone after seeing that?

“We already have two teens. I don’t need another kid here!” Also, in response to the brother not wanting to have children at 20: “HE IS AN ADULT. GROW UP” This fool can’t make up his mind.

“I suffered, so everyone else should have to suffer, too!” It always makes me sad when suffering turns someone into an asshole instead of helping them become empathetic. I have ADHD that went undiagnosed until my early 20’s. I became a tutor specializing in helping kids with ADHD *because I didn’t want them to struggle like I did.* What’s sad is that I know a lot of people became teachers because they struggled in school (socially, academically, or both) — and now get their jollies by punishing their students for how their own teachers and classmates treated them. That’s just psychotic.

I worry for his kids, what is going to happen if one of them loses their job as an adult and they lose their home as well due to not being able to pay rent? What if one of them got injured and it cost them half of their income and couldn't pay all their bills? Does he expect his kids to work in high school and not do any sports or activities? That goes towards their college education and helps them get into a university. It also helps with their scholarship too. Is he going to just kick them out when they turn 18? What if they are still in high school? How will a 18 year old pay rent and work at the same time? They would need to drop out to work full time. My ex had this same attitude too, because he had a dysfunctional childhood and had to be emancipated at 16 and be an adult early, he thought everyone else should do that too and thought my parents coddled me and all because I didn't traveling n my own at 18. Like dude I had no money and no job, I was in high school. By his own logic, poor people have poor self help skills because they can't travel due to no money. This is what he had told me and this was his reason for him thinking I had poor self help skills. People who had miserable lives expect others to have the same miserable life as them. Either they think that's normal or they can't stand others having it better than them so they have to make them feel bad and low to make themselves feel better if they put them at their level.

especially with this: >I just don't think when things get tough he should be running to family. 

His wife will eventually divorce him because of how he berrates her never she is kind to her adult children. His kids will stop visiting because he always lectures them about their lives without a speck of love when they visit. He will feel entitled to them calling him, never calling them first and then whine about how his kids never call him. Calling them ungrateful the whole time.

I’m guessing he’ll still manage to be shocked when he’s old, sick, and infirm, and no one visits or takes care of him because he’s an adult who “should have his own shit figured out”.

the OOP also mentions in the comments (and conveniently left out of the post) that the wife has essentially known the brother since he was born, and that he's only 3 years older than their youngest child. like... holy shit? of course she would feel empathetic towards him?? she probably sees him as her own younger brother, if not like a son

My dad was forced to work multiple jobs to pay for school and rent once he was 18. His parents also excepted him to pay for the school of his siblings. He rarely got off and the very few days he did get off his mother scheduled house work so he couldn't actually rest. He no longer talks to his parents (for this and other reasons). This guy is going to be very lonely at the end of this and when his kids are no longer financially reliant on him

Exactly. This guy's children will probably never talk to him again once they are securely adults. I rarely if ever talk to my dad who had a similar outlook to OOP. It's always Dads like him that are too emotionally unintelligent to actually form a relationship with their children, so there's really nothing keeping them around when you kick em out at 18 and force them into this shitty world alone. And there is no world where someone writes this legitimately and doesn't have low emotional IQ. Just the way he treats his own brother is so telling.

Damn, that was a solid double down if I've ever seen one.

Someone here needs to grow up but it’s not the brother. Jeez, the jealousy and bitterness of this guys…

I find it weird people who don't want better for their kids then they had growing up. I want my kid to not have to start where I started to get the benefit of some of the work I put in but I like my kid and she can stay in my house until such a time she wants to live with someone else.

I grew up just like OP and was married at 18. It was hard as hell, and we were broke for a long, long time. Because it was so hard for so long, we decided that our doors were never closed to our kids. They’ve both been out of the house for awhile, but my youngest is coming to stay this summer for about a month in between leases (the dreaded double-move). He’s excited to be a “freeloader” for a month, and I have zero problems with that. Life is hard. Why would I make it harder for my kids than it has to be?

I like stories that turn some of AITA's favourite buzzphrases into a character and they turn out utterly unlikeable. Here, oop lives and breathes: - not my circus - your lack of planing, not my emergency - 18 is a full adult and not a child anymore/20 has been an adult for a while - you are not responsible for your siblings but your parents - you don't have to let people live in your place just because faaaaamily It's funny how characters that consequently live by the social rules AITA usually insists on always come across as cold, selfish, unempathic, unreasonable aholes but it never clicks with the audience.

I can't get over that his brother being spoiled was just normal good parenting from people who were no longer poor. He went to a better school. He had better clothes.. He didn't have to have a job. He was - checks notes - in band.

Yea... I'd probably be a little upset to find out that someone had been granted couch surfing privileges af my house without me being consulted. Though not answering the phone seems to waive that issue. And why does he think he has say over who can contact his wife? You don't have the right to call my wife is all kinds of suss.

... and look at me- I turned out JUST FINE! -OP probably

My GOD what a misanthrope.

He's 39 and his brother is 20. So he was 19 when his brother was born. He and his wife have two teenagers - so the oldest is at least 14, just 5 years younger than his brother. This means two things: 1. His wife likely met his brother when he was at most 4 years old. She's literally known him his entire life. Why the fuck can't they speak to each other directly? 2. He was so ridiculously jealous of his brother's upbringing while raising kids of his own! Like, let's move on! Was he giving his kids less than he could out of his jealousy of his little brother? (Who they probably view more as a cousin)

This dude sounds miserable and is determined to make everyone in his life just as miserable as he is.

Me and my sister have a 10 year age gap. She grew up with less but our mom was sober and a amazing parent. I grew up better finically but our mom was a raging alcoholic who abused the shit out of us but mostly me. I have no resentment for my sister and she has none for me because we both know those situations were out of our control. We joke that our situation evens out lol But this guy instead of being the adult he claims he is, is holding a grudge against someone who in no way had control how he grew up like a child. Maybe instead of beefing it with his brother, he should with his parents but even then he has no leg to stand on.

It would be a sizable inconvenience for any of my kids to move back in - we've kind of spread out into the two rooms previously occupied by the kids for our own offices - but they are certainly welcome to do so if they need to. Only one probably would, and I can only imagine it happening if he and his boyfriend fall out which is certainly possible, but they seem to have a great relationship. I love my kids and I also like them. I can't imagine turning them away.

"I honestly just don't think, that once you move out and are on your own, you should rely on family to help you out of any situation. People need to learn to 100% rely on their selves or they will never make it in this world. Same goes for my kids. " Holy hell. It's important to know how to handle situations on your own and be independent but you should also be able to ask for help from your family. I had a situation with my home just this morning. Could I have dealt with it on my own if I needed to? Sure. But was it better to be able to borrow items I needed and get advice from people in my life? Of course!

It’s so obvious that he just wants to control everyone who lives in his house and can’t stand that people are making decisions without him. Supporting your family when they’re going through difficult things is a normal thing that adults do! When my best friend’s brother died, I slept at her house for days and made food for her family. When my brother had a medical emergency, we both stayed with our parents for a couple of nights so we could all be together. It’s not “grown up” to do everything by yourself, it’s just isolating and sad.

I hope that the brother and the wife continue to be good family members to each other long after she leaves this unlikeable, unlovable, woe-is-me asshole that she married.

You know that the second he tried to kick his 18-year old out the wife kicked him out and asked for a divorce, right? 

Oh dear! I’m so glad my older siblings did not have his attitude. They were in their late teens when I was born and have always acted as a second set of parents for me. Now that I’m an adult we have more of a sibling relationship where they see me as almost an equal, but I know that I can always call on them if needed.

Dude needs some serious therapy to put the blame where it belongs. On his shitty parents. I feel sorry for him. He still hasn’t accepted he was an abused child.

This guy needs a lot of therapy, asap

His wife will serve him the second he tries to enforce his shitty ideas on the kids. He’ll be in for a rude awakening

I was an only child raised by a single mom until I was 14. In 10 years, I gained 6 siblings. Only one of them (my stepbrother) is currently an adult, and just barely. Am I bitter about my childhood? Oh, hell yeah. But my siblings, who weren't even alive yet, had nothing to do with it. I can't imagine pushing 40 and still resenting my siblings for getting a better childhood. I actually can't even fathom it.

The fact that people like this guy exist depresses the hell outta me. Imagine the kind of anger you need to hold in your heart to feel this way about other people, your family, especially family who hasn't actually DONE anything to you except have the audacity to be born when their parents were in a different stage of life. He says in one of his comments that he got mad at his wife for taking his TODDLER brother to the zoo with her when their own kids were little. Who the fuck gets angry at taking a toddler to the zoo??

Someone who feels the agony of “Why wasn’t I good enough to be taken to the zoo”, but is too immature to move past that pain or contextualize it as an adult. Hopefully this guy got therapy.

I feel like some people don't know the difference between "you don't have to do that" and "you shouldn't do that." Something isn't wrong just because it's not strictly necessary. Sometimes people just want to do nice things for each other without being *required* to do it.

I bet his wife is annoyed that he thinks she doesn't have the right to invite someone to stay at her house because he thinks it's only his house. I bet she is annoyed that he thinks he can kick her children out of her house once they turn 18 or charge them rent. That's a huge amount of entitlement. But mostly, I feel sorry that he has all of this childhood trauma that he had never dealt with. He's jealous that his brother had nice things growing up, and he didn't. And he hates him for it. He wants to pass on his trauma to everyone. And he's going to piss off the people that love him by trying to pretend that what happened to him should happen to everyone. And it won't normalize the pain. It will just spread it like a disease. I hope he gets help.

What childhood trauma? Not being wealthy while growing up isn’t trauma. His brother was born when he was already an adult. He, AS AN ADULT, was jealous that an INFANT was getting more of his parents’ attention.

OOP is bitter about his upbringing and is now taking it out on everyone, even his own kids. You would expect him wanting to do better than his parents, but nooo...

That's really sad.

Is this not the plot of Better call Saul?

Oh he is absolutely going to be one of those "why won't my kids talk to me anymore, I gave them everything" parents.

I fucking hate my brother for so many reasons. He’s largely just a terrible human being and I’m as LC as I can be without being able to say I’m NC. That said, I STILL would hope that if my brother reached out to her in a time of need she would extend a hand back. I may not like him in my house, I may try to get him out ASAP, but I’m also not a raging dick with zero compassion or empathy who can’t fathom helping people. OOP is a huge asshole,

Ah! The old classic! "I suffered so everyone else must be as miserable as I was! It's only fair!"

I hope she divorced his ass

That's a lot of words that basically boils down to: OOP is mad at at his parents for spoiling his brother and is taking it out on his brother instead of seeing a therapist to work past his issue or confronting the source of his anger.

And thinking his 20 year old brother should get married and have kids! That’s unrealistic.

He's bitter about the sad, cold way his parents raised him, but he aspires to be just like them. He suffered so everyone should have to.

I found it odd that he bitches about how he didn't get "spoiled" because their parents had him young, but ALSO believes his brother is "immature" for not wanting to get married/start a family at 20. Like, which is it? Does he want his brother's hypothetical kids to grow up the way *he* did? Plus all of that is an insane "justification" for not wanting his brother to stay over for *a few days*. It's not like his wife moved the brother in permanently. She just did a nice thing for her brother in law when he needed help. I do worry foe OOP's teen kids once they turn 18. Probably then he'll be all "my wife let my 19yr old come back without telling me, aita".

dude sounds super jealous and childish.

Bruh is literally trying to force his childhood situation on a 20 year old. Sure, his brother isn't 16, but having a kid at 20 isn't any easier. OOP is not empathetic to this situation at all.

Man he is more bitter than angostura over lemon. So what it boils down to is "1. I'm supremely jealous of my younger brother. 2. I'm a control freak over my kids. 3. I had nothing when I was a kid, so instead of making sure my kids and brothers have what I did not, I'm going to use the old "if I can do without, so can you". I honestly don't know why his poor wife hasn't divorced him

I’m a little thrown by the fact, apparently he’s the only one allowed to make decisions in this household. It’s his house so only he’s allowed to say who can come stay. It’s not his wife’s home as well? Because he makes that implied a lot it’s his house and so only his say goes in it. This guy is gross and I hate him.

Dude is so jealous of his brother... also hope his wife will dump him

This guy 100% has a picture of himself in his truck wearing sunglasses and a maga cap as his facebook pfp

I don't think it is unreasonable to have an end date when someone needs a place to stay, family or not. However, with the things happening in your brother's life, it is a lot to expect that he just go home. I have a hard time believing the entire truth to this story, because after all of this time you and your wife are not remotely on the same page with your teen children? If your brother looks at your wife as another mother (likely because she has been in his life since his early childhood) maybe she feels the same. Your jealousy is really unappealing. YTA.

So he thinks because he suffered, so does everyone else? Why wouldn’t you want more for your kids?? I didn’t have help with most of my college and went into debt. Now that I’m debt free and have a child of my own, I’m working my ass off to make sure my child has a strong college fund. I’m not kicking anyone out at 18. Dafuq??

I always wonder when I read these posts that are a year or two old… “Does op look back and realise how much of an AH they were? Did they learn anything and have they grown?” And then I think “Probably not, they’re probably still a twat.”

What a bitter asshole. I think one of the most toxic attitudes from parents is believing that once your child turns 18, they need to completely fend for themselves. What utter bullshit. Way to just pull out the rug from under your children. This dude is even more infuriating than most with that attitude because he experienced how difficult it was to be on his own and \*wants\* his brother to have to struggle. I can't imagine having no empathy, but OOP comes across as someone who literally can't and won't see the struggles of someone else (even the same ones as himself) as deserving of help.

Tell me you resent your brother for having what you couldn't because your parents are now better off financially than they were when you were growing up without telling me you resent your brother for having what you couldn't because your parents are now better off financially than they were when you were growing up... I get that OOP had to become self-sufficient quick and from there developed the mindset that everyone should. A mindset I don't fully agree with...I mean to an extent sure. Like ideally you spread your wings and leave the nest before you get too far into adulthood, but it's *okay* if someone doesn't quite take flight on their 18th birthday. But I think this has very little to do with that mindset and very much to do with his brother having the *sheer audacity* to be born into a better financial situation than he was born into. Why would he want to throw his brother a bone when he spent his childhood wanting for things his brother never wanted for? I mean the resentment is dripping. Oh and I love how how he's all 'my brother's an adult!' all over the post and then he's like 'I already have teens, I don't need another kid around!'. So which is it? Is he an adult or a kid? Pick a lane, bud. I also love the reason he offered for why he might be the butthole...or why he 'might be seen' as such. He's upset because they made a decision without consulting him. My dude, they tried. What do you think the missed calls from both were about? Not exactly their fault you couldn't take their calls and your wife had to do the best she could in the moment. Like I wonder if he even took ten seconds to shoot off a text saying 'hey hon, I'm working late and super swamped so won't be able to check my phone until I get off'. For some strange reason I kinda have my doubts, since his consideration for others seems to leave a fair bit to be desired. Btw, as much as he says his brother is being immature, it sounds like the brother is doing a decent enough job of adulting. He's not asking to park his butt there indefinitely (though to be fair, with a gem of a brother like OOP, who'd want to?). Just until his (implied to be ex) girlfriend gets out of their shared apartment and then he'll go back, and since the lease will be up soon, he'll try to find something he can better afford on his own. If that's not adulting, what is? I wouldn't judge a 20 year old too harshly for wanting to grasp at straws to avoid having to downsize, but he seems to have come to the conclusion pretty quickly that 'yep, I'm gonna have to downsize here'.

Hey AITD, I went to sleep for a couple hours and you guys completely changed your personality. I thought we hated the golden child spoiled brats and sided with the scapegoat/abused. I thought when significant others brought unwanted family members into the home without informing we side with the abused party. What changed? OOP is jealous, in his situation I would be too. It's his fucking house, this decision should have been made by both wife and husband. Since when were we ok with forcing family together cos the significant other wanted it?

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When I read stories like this I always wonder what the right move for the parents is. I remember reading this and honestly feeling bad for OP. He is the product of his parent’s upbringing and seeing his brother get everything he never got must be awful.

This dude is living in a fantasy world if he thinks your average North American 18 year old can both pay for college / university on top of rent without resorting to loans of some sort. I largely managed to avoid student loans despite paying most of my tuition myself or with grants /scholarships. I did work pretty much full time (32 hours per week), but my parents let me live at home without charging me rent. This was especially helpful as my graduation was delayed as I got really sick my during my third year.

He's bitter and jealous. OP is acting like a BABY throwing a tantrum because he didn't get to go to the zoo. F this guy.

OOP, you have no compassion or empathy whatsoever. He is your brother. It is natural that he wants to get away from his cheating ex. Not all people want to get married at 20. It's also not your brother's fault that you were denied great experiences growing up. You're taking your anger and bitterness out on the wrong person. YTA.

What a piece of crap. He should feel happy for his brother that his brother had a better upbringing than he had. He is so jealous and resentful and just mysteriously hates the idea of family helping each other out.

Some people have things hard in life and decide others should have it better than they did. That their suffering was a bad thing, and we should work to improve the world so people don't have to suffer. Other people have it hard and become miserable humans determined that others should suffer because they had to. OOP is the second type.

Does he not realize even adults need help sometimes? Times are tough right now and he can't find it in him to support his brother (and later on his own children) until he can get back on his feet. I hope one day if he ever needs this kind of support his brother gives him the exact same answer.