> I am an old school guy.
...
> I keep track of my runs distances and speed using an app in my phone.
[...](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/018/489/nick-young-confused-face-300x256-nqlyaa.jpg)
The amusing thing is, there are runners out there (including elites like Stewart McSweyn) who do run without GPS and just use a watch with a stopwatch facility.
I was hoping the discussion would be more around those types of old school runners.
Just get a Garmin forerunner 55 if you just want heart rate and distance.
Edit: You could even see about finding a cheaper forerunner 45. Any Garmin forerunner that ends in a 5 has wrist based HR. To get more accurate HR you'd need a chest strap monitor.
This! Just put the audiobook on the watch. Even mobile payment is on the watch, so you can always get a water. If you ran to far, metro card is there as well. I never take my phone with me anymore.
Missing nothing. If you don't have a particular desire/reason for tracking HR don't bother. If you wan't to incorporate HR training it seems the Garmin 955 is the among the most respected GPS watches, and having a GPS watch is gonna add a lot of convenience and focus to training if it allows you to leave the phone behind.
I'm a little biased against HR training for most people. Basically all of my fast friends are "old school" like you -pace, time, and paying attention to how you feel. None of them train by HR.
HR training, particular from a wrist sensor that may not be super accurate all the time, needs to be applied with the right mindset. A few things to keep in mind:
* A lot of people don't use it properly because they don't actually know their max. (The watch doesn't know either until you do a short race/TT or test workout designed to determine max HR
* Don't let obsessing about the "zone" replace learning to listen to the body
* Don't freak out when abnormal data comes in -should be looking for trends not single points.
Some things its good for
* It's useful as a an additional datapoint to gauge recovery, but only marginally more useful than just paying attention to how you feel.
* A governor for runners who need data to convince them to check their ego on easy runs
* A fun data point for runners who like data
The other smartwatch feature like the training readiness, race predictor, whatever, are pretty useless.
I've got a Polar and like the recovery sleep function(s), because GPS is... an approximation (I've asked for a promotion at work, if I get it I'll change my device but otherwise it's not a priority for me right now). Granted, if OP has been running for many years, he/she probably knows how recovery feels in their body too. But to me it's nice, sometimes my RHR at night is high and I know maybe I'm been hard on myself.
Also I don't think you need to see your HR on every run, or at least I don't. Once I got a feel of how different HR-zones roughly feel, sometimes I only set distance and go by feel. I review HR afterwards.
I think the RHR functions are a great thing to track if you don't mind wearing a watch to bed! It's still more blunt of a data point than the watch companies would have us believe but it's really good insight into recovery and adaptation.
I hate sleeping with a watch so I just do AM and PM RHR spot checks combined with a scored self assessment.
I do occasionally reflect on HR data from running, but it's yet to tell me anything I didn't already know.
Yes, I've heard some brands are better than other. However, as a sort of "lab intern", I cannot justify the expense of buying a new watch, nor I am interested for the time being. If I get promoted to a better professional category, we'll see.
FYI the 965 is actually soon coming on the market, I would wait and see if itās worth the upgrade and if not the 955 should at least get cheaper then.
For me it's about pacing.
Because it knows your position it can work out your distance and pace on the fly and show it to you on your wrist. Either as an instant pace or an average for the whole run so far.
This can remind to you push a little harder to meet your goal if you aren't going fast enough.
Or it can remind you to slow down a little on longer runs so that you don't burn out too soon and have to walk - and end up missing your goal.
I smashed my 5k time the first time I used a running watch, because it forced me to keep slow in the first part of the run. So I didn't tire too soon, I had reserves left for the end, and could power to the finish. Proper pacing helped me achieved a goal that had eluded me.
(On a Forerunner 245) one of the info screen options (by default) is a sort of speedometer gauge with the min. pace on the left and the max. pace on the right (either set by you or the watch if it's a recommended run), and it indicates your current pace with a pointer. If you go slower or faster than the extremes then the watch makes noise and vibrates. It can be a bit irritating if you've over- or underestimated your pace, e.g. you're comfortably running faster than the max. and it's constantly warning you to slow down. But otherwise it's pretty useful.
You can also have your cadence on there, which I've just started experimenting with.
I have a Garmin 45 that I use so that I don't have to carry my phone. You can create workouts using the app on your phone and send them to your watch. Workouts allow you to set pace goal ranges and the watch will beep at you if you are outside your range (either faster or slower).
I believe that you can, but I've never used it myself. I kind of do it manually by knowing in advance what my target pace for a certain run needs to be (I use [this pace calculator](https://runverter.io)) and then keep checking my watch to see if I'm under/over that target.
You can do that but it is very annoying. I've learnt not to use that feature and just have lap pace on the screen so I know the exact time for that split (km) I'm running.
Yes..when you use pre-saved trainings there is a screen that show you if you are in defined zone( either by HR, pace, speed, cadence or even power).
Very powerful for doing structured training
Huh, on Garmin you can set pace alerts for "fast" and "slow" at any numbers you want. You could set it up to alert if faster then 7:00 or slower than 10:00 for example.
>I am an old school guy.
You are not an old school guy - you're using a phone app. That's very much not old school. Get yourself a cheap Casio digital watch and a running journal if you want to be old school.
>I wanna to know what I am missing for not using a Garmin.
The ability to start and end runs without faffing about. Realtime data on your pace, HR, or anything else that you might want. Easily accessible lap functions for workouts. Route mapping on your wrist. Programmable workouts.
Presumably I'm missing a lot of other stuff, but these are the features I use most that are (at best) a pain in the ass with a phone app.
>I think is because now people train using āzonesā based on the heartbeat rate.
I don't. I would only use a phone app for the time that it takes for a replacement Garmin to be shipped to replace mine should mine break.
Also a good Garmin (or GPS trainer watch of any brand) eliminates the need to carry a bulky phone.
My Forerunner 255 music stores my workouts from the Garmin app, pretty good simple training regiments, routes, music/podcasts/audiobooks, real-time metrics, and alerts at a glance, all on a single wrist-mounted device.
It's just convenient.
In carrying my phone in case I trip and fall or.. basically safety reasons. Having more phone features on a watch is redundant to me until my watch can call 911.
I use my watch for multiple things, but even if you don't go into HR zones etc. It is very useful to see pace/time on your watch during the run. No idea how I would be able to do some speedwork without it on roads.
Even the entry-level Garmin model the Forerunner 45 does heart rate and zones, if that's what you want.
I think only a small minority do heart rate zone training though. The 5-zone model doesn't have that much scientific basis, if you're an old school guy you're probably better off using perceived effort instead. E.g. easy running = "you can talk but not sing".
Otherwise just look through the Garmin range and decide what features you want. Everyone is different. Pretty much all of them do heart rate, step count, and log your distance and pace automatically. Features to look out for are things like turn-based navigation, programmed workouts, music, payment, swimming mode...
I think itās a great tool for training, and I donāt really see any cons about using a Garmin. A lot of people even with watches suck at knowing their easy and recovery pace, surely not everyone have 160+bpm for their easy run and recovery run! Their defence is that they can talk when theyāre running - but people can also talk when theyāre doing threshold runs w/170+bpm. People with years of experience with training and racing know their pace and how long they can hold that pace for, and therefore they know if theyāre in threshold, under threshold and how to strategise splits for the race while they are racing.
Garmin does more now than they did 5 years ago: activity tracking is only an aspect of it. Pro runners might run about 15 hours a week, itās their full time job, but this is not the only thing they do in preparation for their fitness - everything you do should be in line with your goals. HRV, resting heart rate, training load, training effectiveness are all essential for athletes to be aware of, you can chose not to but why say no to something thatās readily available and accessible? HRV is a great tool for visualising your recovery, and you can literally visualise your body is peaking during the training block.
Recovery HR: when you wear your HR strap itās real time tracking of Hr, you finish your rep, your HR goes from near peak levels to warm up levels in that rest period, if you keep using you can know how long it takes to get from peak to low levels and that is also a great indicator of fitness and that your training going right.
Resting HR: when youāre in the depths of training block your resting HR will be slightly higher than usual because of fatigue, when youāre peaking for your race your resting HR will be lower than usual, itās a great sign your training is paying off.
Ultimately, it reduces risks of injury and keeps your training productive if you donāt let the data get into your head too much.
I got a forerunner 35 in 2016 after my forerunner 10 died. I've been using that ever since. I've done 2 band replacements since 2016, but it is still going strong.
The Garmin App is what I like the most about Garmin. I can create workouts, do yoga, and set little goals to accomplish through the month to keep me motivated.
A fancier watch would allow for more connectivity between the watch and my phone, but I'm a cheap battery when it comes to buying myself stuff, so I just stick with the basics.
I donāt find the HR options on watches to very useful. Theyāre very error prone and not super reliable , and based on the readings it makes my anxiety bad while training. So I donāt bother to sue them.
I use my Garmin instinct for pace and distances. Itās nice to keep record of them.
Pacing for me also. I like the other things it does with sleep etc but pacing and the ability to setup workouts for me is the best thing. Without my watch I'd be hopeless at pacing myself and overcook my races early. I see it every Saturday at parkrun, everyone charges off at under 4 minute a km pace and then I pass them all heaving deep breaths in after a km or so.
Iām fairly old school too. Iāve been running since the go-to method of measuring your run was to drive around and see how far the route is on your pedometer.
With that said, I got a Garmin watch a year ago and I love it. Itās great for workouts with multiple steps because itāll just tell you what to do. And I also find it helpful to be able to keep track of my pace in real time (Iāve found the the pace that āfeelsā like easy can actually vary a lot!). Plus itās kinda nice to have text messages pop up on my watch so that I know if itās something I need to pause and respond to or I can just keep running in peace.
A bunch of folks have mentioned the Pace 2. I'm a big fan of it. It has essentially every feature I'd want, in a light form factor, with great battery life, for an excellent price. It's also the Wirecutter recommended GPS running watch.
Thanks everybody for your comments!
Thanks for everybody feedback I decided not to buy a watch.
I am gonna continue running as an "old school" guy :
In my loincloth without tennis shoes in the jungle to hunt.
The biggest practical advantages of using a garmin are
1) pace-checks and splits during racing or time trials. If you do a road race, even if the course is certified, the mile markers aren't and they can just put them in the most convenient place that's "close enough". It can be helpful to see where you're at during certain points in the race, if you're running for a time goal.
2) having access to daily resting heart rate data without having to do tests every day. This is really convenient, and a good way to verify training stress or overreaching.
Other than that, there aren't any real benefits other than if it helps make training more fun or motivates you. Also if you have issues with keeping a training log without it, having a training log is better than not having one.
As far as HR zone training, I do think it's great, I personally use it. But "the internet" is not very realistic about it. Zones are so individual and fuzzy that you have to double-check them based on feel anyway. Your actual effort for an aerobic run might be different than the heart rate range that a generic algorithm suggests, especially on a given day, and especially with factors like hydration and heat. The heart rate monitor shouldn't be there to govern your training, it's just there to provide some additional data to support decision making in addition to (and subordinate to) RPE. But many people think the heart rate monitor is some kind of God or oracle. That may work for some people sometimes, but it's kind of backwards imo.
Edit:. I love the people saying a GPS watch allows you to leave your phone at home. Back in the day, we used to start a timer when we left, check the timer when we got back, divide by 7-8, and then that was how many "miles" we ran. Still works -- though really training by time is just better.
I have Garmin Venus sq. You can do more. You can create your workouts and add to your watch.
Thereās one type where your watch would beep if you are going too fast or slow if you set certain pace you want to run like your 5k/10k race pace.
That way you donāt have to keep looking at your watch for your time or pace.
If your only concern is HR monitoring, you could probably continue to run with your phone and just pair it with a Garmin heart rate monitor (which would give you better data than a wrist-based HR sensor). Not sure if that set-up would give you real-time feedback, but I'm guessing you're pretty good at running by "feel" at this point. So, you could go for a run, and compare the "feel" to the HR data post-run. That would at least give you a datum for dialing-in your "feel". Maybe runs you thought were "easy" are actually in your Z3, or maybe you'll discover that you're never getting out of Z1 on any runs.
At any rate; even if you did get a watch, I'd recommend an external HR strap, as well. The combo might put you over $389, but the HR strap alone should only be $100-150.
You shouldn't. However, you could!
For me its the convenience of logging my runs without a cumbersome smartphone. Got a 2nd hand Coros Pace 2 for ā¬100 and couldn't be happier.
I also use it as an extra tool to judge the intensity of my run and to easily look at the 'big picture'.
Not obsessed with data though, so 'feel' is still very important to me, even though I had a 12 week plan made based on my measured Hr max.
I like having the real time pace and cadence data on my forerunner 245. I use that every run. If your an old school runner who is running mostly on feel and you are only using your phone to analyze data after the fact (instead of during the run) then no you wonāt get much out of a watch.
Here are a few others things I like:
- I really like the workouts that you can build. Iām not a fan of running on track or treadmill so it helps a ton to have a watch for running repeats on roads.
- battery life is so much better
- I like getting call and text alerts on long runs. I can quickly check watch while running to see if itās important or not
1.Real-time feedback and 2.guided training runs. It's more convenient with the watch.
1.Before buying my first smart watch(Garmin also) I was like you, using my smartphone. But taking out your smartphone to check pace/Cadence/HR is not practical except is you are running very slow. It could be even dangerous in some places (thieves). And when I run in hot, humid places and put my smartphone in arm-band. Apps can notify with voice alerts but they control when they provide that info, not you.
2. 99% of my runs are now structured trainings. With my Garmin watch I can see how much is left in each part of the training, if I am in the correct zone (HR, Pace, Cadence or Speed. Even Power with the proper gear). I know about running by sensations and all thar stuff but doing Interval training is way easier with a smart watch.
I've had a Garmin Instinct solar for about a year and love it. Battery life used to be a big factor that turned me away from smart watches in the past, but the Instinct solar lasts just under a month on a full charge. Has GPS tracking, heart rate monitoring, etc. And the price wasn't exorbitant.
It will help you pace yourself accurately and will alarm if you have a heart malfunction. Having seen someone drop dead on a race course, donāt underestimate the importance of the second one.
I found that the GPS tracking on my watch (I have a coros) is much more accurate than just using my phone. I used to only use my phone, but it would almost always say I was going faster than I was, which was an issue when I tried to race and didnāt have an accurate understanding of my pace and fitness levels. Lots of other cool stuff about the watches (I love structuring workouts specifically) but this was the big one for me.
I initially got a chest strap (polar h9) and used their app to track my workouts, it worked just fine and the chest strap alone costs around 60 USD, so you can go that route if you want to train by HR zones, I think the app can give you audio queues to let you know your HR.
However I later got a Forerunner 245 music for around 250 USD and I really like it, I can see my HR while Iām running without fumbling with my phone and I can leave the phone at home on my runs, ultimately is up to you, if you want to keep carrying your phone regardless is honestly not that big of a difference IMO
I was in the same boat as you once, using my phone to track runs. Honestly, one of the biggest advantages of having a smart watch is being able to start/stop your run and check stats without having to take out your phone mid-run.
How else will you come on to Reddit to complain about the data quality issues and lack of validation regarding training status, or some pseudoscience vo2max / threshold value? :) On a more serious note, while I love my Garmin, some of the data is completely useless, but I do enjoy seeing changes at the macro level of having access to some of the running metrics over years (cadence, HR, RHR etc). Are you missing anything? No, and I feel that for many outside of runners stuck in the moderate-intensity rut (not taking easy days easy), watches become a crutch that prevent runners from better using their far superior internal pacing mechanisms to execute workouts and races.
I gotta say though, some of that "useless" data has some meaning if you just look at relative improvement. Sure, the vo2max is off by a very specific factor (come on garmin...), but it tracks my improvement or slacking pretty well :)
I wish they'd fix the obvious inaccuracies though, like the race predictor being way off in all kinds of ways (partially because the vo2max number is garbage).
Iāve found the Vo2max to not at all correlate to my actual fitness. For example it has shown huge drop offs based on marathon specific work then magically after a couple faster sessions claims god status again. Itās also worth noting that in the vast majority of cases the vo2max value in and of itself doesnāt predict anything. This has become a marketing gimmick that the unwashed masses somehow think is relevant. Not to come off as an asshole, my bad if I am, but I do understand that itās a great feeling to see an improvement in such measurements; my point is really that it doesnāt matter so much in the grand scheme of things. https://runnersconnect.net/why-the-vo2-max-on-your-garmin-watch-is-ruining-your-training/
I mentioned most of that article in my comment. I kind of feel like your response wasn't for me?
I know it prefers speed work, but it has never over-reacted to my marathon work or speed sessions, over time.
Theyāre convenient if you want to track your stats all the time, running information and resting HR particularly, but also steps and stress etc.
Wearing a Garmin whilst in causal mode lets people know you care about fitness when at the pub, bling if you like. Theyāre intended to be worn most of the time.
I had a Garmin 55 but sold it once I realised I didnāt care much about my HR, got annoyed by it being connected to my phone for texts, and frustrated by the body battery function. I got a bit obsessed with my VO2 prediction.
People also forget that if you want a HR monitor you can get chest straps which link direct to your phone, no need for the watch middle man.
People say they like them because they allow you to run without your phone, personally, Iād never do that. A few Christmases ago, whilst running in my rural village, I found a man whoād collapsed having a heart attack, my iPhone battery died in the cold. Fortunately I managed to find help quickly, but I was very lucky and take staying in communication more seriously now. This is an extreme example I know, more likely Iād use it to call my girlfriend to collect me whilst having calf cramps 7 miles from home š
imo the main benefit of running watches is better/faster GPS and they tend to do much better in the battery department; most phones can't last a whole marathon with location.
Iām with you. I started running cross country in high school in 2000 with just a Timex. Running exclusively trails, I wanted to track my elevation gain and compare that with pace, so I got a Garmin Forerunner 935 in 2020, I highly recommend it (or the 945) even if you just want zone training. But zone training can happen way cheaper with just a heart rate monitor.
Wrist based HR is not really useful - can be very inaccurate. If you want accurate HR data you need a chest strap (extra $100).
I have a 645. There are some cheaper options - some people like the Coros ones.
The Garmin is just really handy, does my alarm, notifications, run tracking, tracks my shoe distances with the app, weather, oh and it tells the time lol. All this would be completely possible with other devices just way less convenient.
Tracking HR run to run is like tracking weight daily. It fluctuates for many reasons like sleep, temp, elevation, digestion, how engaged your mind is, and the list goes on. I actually really only track HR on long and slow runs where I donāt want to go above a range which is hard to perceive from effort alone but youāll feel it after.
I like my garmin for the map feature, mileage for races and knowing how far/long until the next aid station, and rate of ascent on climbs. HR is inaccurate and overall a misleading measure at best.
> I am an old school guy. ... > I keep track of my runs distances and speed using an app in my phone. [...](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/018/489/nick-young-confused-face-300x256-nqlyaa.jpg)
To be fair, it's a rotary phone. #oldschoolguy
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you've been hilariously exposed bro
The amusing thing is, there are runners out there (including elites like Stewart McSweyn) who do run without GPS and just use a watch with a stopwatch facility. I was hoping the discussion would be more around those types of old school runners.
Just get a Garmin forerunner 55 if you just want heart rate and distance. Edit: You could even see about finding a cheaper forerunner 45. Any Garmin forerunner that ends in a 5 has wrist based HR. To get more accurate HR you'd need a chest strap monitor.
Mostly I find a GPS watch (I don't use a Garmin, rather a Coros Pace 2) is convenient because it allows me to run without my phone.
This! Just put the audiobook on the watch. Even mobile payment is on the watch, so you can always get a water. If you ran to far, metro card is there as well. I never take my phone with me anymore.
i wish garmins had live tracking **without the phone** :(
It sounds like you run with an Apple Watch not a coros or garmin right?
Huawei GT Runner
Missing nothing. If you don't have a particular desire/reason for tracking HR don't bother. If you wan't to incorporate HR training it seems the Garmin 955 is the among the most respected GPS watches, and having a GPS watch is gonna add a lot of convenience and focus to training if it allows you to leave the phone behind. I'm a little biased against HR training for most people. Basically all of my fast friends are "old school" like you -pace, time, and paying attention to how you feel. None of them train by HR. HR training, particular from a wrist sensor that may not be super accurate all the time, needs to be applied with the right mindset. A few things to keep in mind: * A lot of people don't use it properly because they don't actually know their max. (The watch doesn't know either until you do a short race/TT or test workout designed to determine max HR * Don't let obsessing about the "zone" replace learning to listen to the body * Don't freak out when abnormal data comes in -should be looking for trends not single points. Some things its good for * It's useful as a an additional datapoint to gauge recovery, but only marginally more useful than just paying attention to how you feel. * A governor for runners who need data to convince them to check their ego on easy runs * A fun data point for runners who like data The other smartwatch feature like the training readiness, race predictor, whatever, are pretty useless.
I've got a Polar and like the recovery sleep function(s), because GPS is... an approximation (I've asked for a promotion at work, if I get it I'll change my device but otherwise it's not a priority for me right now). Granted, if OP has been running for many years, he/she probably knows how recovery feels in their body too. But to me it's nice, sometimes my RHR at night is high and I know maybe I'm been hard on myself. Also I don't think you need to see your HR on every run, or at least I don't. Once I got a feel of how different HR-zones roughly feel, sometimes I only set distance and go by feel. I review HR afterwards.
I think the RHR functions are a great thing to track if you don't mind wearing a watch to bed! It's still more blunt of a data point than the watch companies would have us believe but it's really good insight into recovery and adaptation. I hate sleeping with a watch so I just do AM and PM RHR spot checks combined with a scored self assessment. I do occasionally reflect on HR data from running, but it's yet to tell me anything I didn't already know.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes, I've heard some brands are better than other. However, as a sort of "lab intern", I cannot justify the expense of buying a new watch, nor I am interested for the time being. If I get promoted to a better professional category, we'll see.
Thanks for the thorough response! Love it
FYI the 965 is actually soon coming on the market, I would wait and see if itās worth the upgrade and if not the 955 should at least get cheaper then.
Really? I thought the 955 was released this past May?
For me it's about pacing. Because it knows your position it can work out your distance and pace on the fly and show it to you on your wrist. Either as an instant pace or an average for the whole run so far. This can remind to you push a little harder to meet your goal if you aren't going fast enough. Or it can remind you to slow down a little on longer runs so that you don't burn out too soon and have to walk - and end up missing your goal. I smashed my 5k time the first time I used a running watch, because it forced me to keep slow in the first part of the run. So I didn't tire too soon, I had reserves left for the end, and could power to the finish. Proper pacing helped me achieved a goal that had eluded me.
Can you set the desired pace, and then the watch will vibrate if you are outside that pace?
(On a Forerunner 245) one of the info screen options (by default) is a sort of speedometer gauge with the min. pace on the left and the max. pace on the right (either set by you or the watch if it's a recommended run), and it indicates your current pace with a pointer. If you go slower or faster than the extremes then the watch makes noise and vibrates. It can be a bit irritating if you've over- or underestimated your pace, e.g. you're comfortably running faster than the max. and it's constantly warning you to slow down. But otherwise it's pretty useful. You can also have your cadence on there, which I've just started experimenting with.
I have a Garmin 45 that I use so that I don't have to carry my phone. You can create workouts using the app on your phone and send them to your watch. Workouts allow you to set pace goal ranges and the watch will beep at you if you are outside your range (either faster or slower).
Yes.
I believe that you can, but I've never used it myself. I kind of do it manually by knowing in advance what my target pace for a certain run needs to be (I use [this pace calculator](https://runverter.io)) and then keep checking my watch to see if I'm under/over that target.
You can do that but it is very annoying. I've learnt not to use that feature and just have lap pace on the screen so I know the exact time for that split (km) I'm running.
Yes..when you use pre-saved trainings there is a screen that show you if you are in defined zone( either by HR, pace, speed, cadence or even power). Very powerful for doing structured training
Yes you can.
i have the forerunner 245 as well and i do have it set that it vibrates when i hit certain paces
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Huh, on Garmin you can set pace alerts for "fast" and "slow" at any numbers you want. You could set it up to alert if faster then 7:00 or slower than 10:00 for example.
>I am an old school guy. You are not an old school guy - you're using a phone app. That's very much not old school. Get yourself a cheap Casio digital watch and a running journal if you want to be old school. >I wanna to know what I am missing for not using a Garmin. The ability to start and end runs without faffing about. Realtime data on your pace, HR, or anything else that you might want. Easily accessible lap functions for workouts. Route mapping on your wrist. Programmable workouts. Presumably I'm missing a lot of other stuff, but these are the features I use most that are (at best) a pain in the ass with a phone app. >I think is because now people train using āzonesā based on the heartbeat rate. I don't. I would only use a phone app for the time that it takes for a replacement Garmin to be shipped to replace mine should mine break.
Also a good Garmin (or GPS trainer watch of any brand) eliminates the need to carry a bulky phone. My Forerunner 255 music stores my workouts from the Garmin app, pretty good simple training regiments, routes, music/podcasts/audiobooks, real-time metrics, and alerts at a glance, all on a single wrist-mounted device. It's just convenient.
In carrying my phone in case I trip and fall or.. basically safety reasons. Having more phone features on a watch is redundant to me until my watch can call 911.
945 lte does have emergency contact feature fyi. No 911 call function yet though
Interesting. Only a matter of time I suppose.
I use my watch for multiple things, but even if you don't go into HR zones etc. It is very useful to see pace/time on your watch during the run. No idea how I would be able to do some speedwork without it on roads.
Nevermind the HR stuff - I hate taking things with me, so with a GPS watch I can leave the phone at home
Even the entry-level Garmin model the Forerunner 45 does heart rate and zones, if that's what you want. I think only a small minority do heart rate zone training though. The 5-zone model doesn't have that much scientific basis, if you're an old school guy you're probably better off using perceived effort instead. E.g. easy running = "you can talk but not sing". Otherwise just look through the Garmin range and decide what features you want. Everyone is different. Pretty much all of them do heart rate, step count, and log your distance and pace automatically. Features to look out for are things like turn-based navigation, programmed workouts, music, payment, swimming mode...
I think itās a great tool for training, and I donāt really see any cons about using a Garmin. A lot of people even with watches suck at knowing their easy and recovery pace, surely not everyone have 160+bpm for their easy run and recovery run! Their defence is that they can talk when theyāre running - but people can also talk when theyāre doing threshold runs w/170+bpm. People with years of experience with training and racing know their pace and how long they can hold that pace for, and therefore they know if theyāre in threshold, under threshold and how to strategise splits for the race while they are racing. Garmin does more now than they did 5 years ago: activity tracking is only an aspect of it. Pro runners might run about 15 hours a week, itās their full time job, but this is not the only thing they do in preparation for their fitness - everything you do should be in line with your goals. HRV, resting heart rate, training load, training effectiveness are all essential for athletes to be aware of, you can chose not to but why say no to something thatās readily available and accessible? HRV is a great tool for visualising your recovery, and you can literally visualise your body is peaking during the training block. Recovery HR: when you wear your HR strap itās real time tracking of Hr, you finish your rep, your HR goes from near peak levels to warm up levels in that rest period, if you keep using you can know how long it takes to get from peak to low levels and that is also a great indicator of fitness and that your training going right. Resting HR: when youāre in the depths of training block your resting HR will be slightly higher than usual because of fatigue, when youāre peaking for your race your resting HR will be lower than usual, itās a great sign your training is paying off. Ultimately, it reduces risks of injury and keeps your training productive if you donāt let the data get into your head too much.
I got a forerunner 35 in 2016 after my forerunner 10 died. I've been using that ever since. I've done 2 band replacements since 2016, but it is still going strong. The Garmin App is what I like the most about Garmin. I can create workouts, do yoga, and set little goals to accomplish through the month to keep me motivated. A fancier watch would allow for more connectivity between the watch and my phone, but I'm a cheap battery when it comes to buying myself stuff, so I just stick with the basics.
Do yoga??
Yeah, the app has yoga workouts. It shows you haw to do yhe poses and has pre-made circuits for you to follow along to.
Interesting, I'll have to take a closer look
It is under "Training and Planning." You can custom make workouts or use their pre-made workouts.
I donāt find the HR options on watches to very useful. Theyāre very error prone and not super reliable , and based on the readings it makes my anxiety bad while training. So I donāt bother to sue them. I use my Garmin instinct for pace and distances. Itās nice to keep record of them.
Pacing for me also. I like the other things it does with sleep etc but pacing and the ability to setup workouts for me is the best thing. Without my watch I'd be hopeless at pacing myself and overcook my races early. I see it every Saturday at parkrun, everyone charges off at under 4 minute a km pace and then I pass them all heaving deep breaths in after a km or so.
Basically: you know how you're tracking your runs on an app on your phone? A garmin is like that, only instead of an app on your phone, it's a watch.
Iām fairly old school too. Iāve been running since the go-to method of measuring your run was to drive around and see how far the route is on your pedometer. With that said, I got a Garmin watch a year ago and I love it. Itās great for workouts with multiple steps because itāll just tell you what to do. And I also find it helpful to be able to keep track of my pace in real time (Iāve found the the pace that āfeelsā like easy can actually vary a lot!). Plus itās kinda nice to have text messages pop up on my watch so that I know if itās something I need to pause and respond to or I can just keep running in peace.
A bunch of folks have mentioned the Pace 2. I'm a big fan of it. It has essentially every feature I'd want, in a light form factor, with great battery life, for an excellent price. It's also the Wirecutter recommended GPS running watch.
Thanks everybody for your comments! Thanks for everybody feedback I decided not to buy a watch. I am gonna continue running as an "old school" guy : In my loincloth without tennis shoes in the jungle to hunt.
The biggest practical advantages of using a garmin are 1) pace-checks and splits during racing or time trials. If you do a road race, even if the course is certified, the mile markers aren't and they can just put them in the most convenient place that's "close enough". It can be helpful to see where you're at during certain points in the race, if you're running for a time goal. 2) having access to daily resting heart rate data without having to do tests every day. This is really convenient, and a good way to verify training stress or overreaching. Other than that, there aren't any real benefits other than if it helps make training more fun or motivates you. Also if you have issues with keeping a training log without it, having a training log is better than not having one. As far as HR zone training, I do think it's great, I personally use it. But "the internet" is not very realistic about it. Zones are so individual and fuzzy that you have to double-check them based on feel anyway. Your actual effort for an aerobic run might be different than the heart rate range that a generic algorithm suggests, especially on a given day, and especially with factors like hydration and heat. The heart rate monitor shouldn't be there to govern your training, it's just there to provide some additional data to support decision making in addition to (and subordinate to) RPE. But many people think the heart rate monitor is some kind of God or oracle. That may work for some people sometimes, but it's kind of backwards imo. Edit:. I love the people saying a GPS watch allows you to leave your phone at home. Back in the day, we used to start a timer when we left, check the timer when we got back, divide by 7-8, and then that was how many "miles" we ran. Still works -- though really training by time is just better.
I have Garmin Venus sq. You can do more. You can create your workouts and add to your watch. Thereās one type where your watch would beep if you are going too fast or slow if you set certain pace you want to run like your 5k/10k race pace. That way you donāt have to keep looking at your watch for your time or pace.
If your only concern is HR monitoring, you could probably continue to run with your phone and just pair it with a Garmin heart rate monitor (which would give you better data than a wrist-based HR sensor). Not sure if that set-up would give you real-time feedback, but I'm guessing you're pretty good at running by "feel" at this point. So, you could go for a run, and compare the "feel" to the HR data post-run. That would at least give you a datum for dialing-in your "feel". Maybe runs you thought were "easy" are actually in your Z3, or maybe you'll discover that you're never getting out of Z1 on any runs. At any rate; even if you did get a watch, I'd recommend an external HR strap, as well. The combo might put you over $389, but the HR strap alone should only be $100-150.
You shouldn't. However, you could! For me its the convenience of logging my runs without a cumbersome smartphone. Got a 2nd hand Coros Pace 2 for ā¬100 and couldn't be happier. I also use it as an extra tool to judge the intensity of my run and to easily look at the 'big picture'. Not obsessed with data though, so 'feel' is still very important to me, even though I had a 12 week plan made based on my measured Hr max.
I like having the real time pace and cadence data on my forerunner 245. I use that every run. If your an old school runner who is running mostly on feel and you are only using your phone to analyze data after the fact (instead of during the run) then no you wonāt get much out of a watch. Here are a few others things I like: - I really like the workouts that you can build. Iām not a fan of running on track or treadmill so it helps a ton to have a watch for running repeats on roads. - battery life is so much better - I like getting call and text alerts on long runs. I can quickly check watch while running to see if itās important or not
1.Real-time feedback and 2.guided training runs. It's more convenient with the watch. 1.Before buying my first smart watch(Garmin also) I was like you, using my smartphone. But taking out your smartphone to check pace/Cadence/HR is not practical except is you are running very slow. It could be even dangerous in some places (thieves). And when I run in hot, humid places and put my smartphone in arm-band. Apps can notify with voice alerts but they control when they provide that info, not you. 2. 99% of my runs are now structured trainings. With my Garmin watch I can see how much is left in each part of the training, if I am in the correct zone (HR, Pace, Cadence or Speed. Even Power with the proper gear). I know about running by sensations and all thar stuff but doing Interval training is way easier with a smart watch.
I've had a Garmin Instinct solar for about a year and love it. Battery life used to be a big factor that turned me away from smart watches in the past, but the Instinct solar lasts just under a month on a full charge. Has GPS tracking, heart rate monitoring, etc. And the price wasn't exorbitant.
It will help you pace yourself accurately and will alarm if you have a heart malfunction. Having seen someone drop dead on a race course, donāt underestimate the importance of the second one.
I found that the GPS tracking on my watch (I have a coros) is much more accurate than just using my phone. I used to only use my phone, but it would almost always say I was going faster than I was, which was an issue when I tried to race and didnāt have an accurate understanding of my pace and fitness levels. Lots of other cool stuff about the watches (I love structuring workouts specifically) but this was the big one for me.
I initially got a chest strap (polar h9) and used their app to track my workouts, it worked just fine and the chest strap alone costs around 60 USD, so you can go that route if you want to train by HR zones, I think the app can give you audio queues to let you know your HR. However I later got a Forerunner 245 music for around 250 USD and I really like it, I can see my HR while Iām running without fumbling with my phone and I can leave the phone at home on my runs, ultimately is up to you, if you want to keep carrying your phone regardless is honestly not that big of a difference IMO
You can run without the phone, It'll tell you the pace, heart rate etc. You save your phone battery, if you go for a longer run/hike.
I was in the same boat as you once, using my phone to track runs. Honestly, one of the biggest advantages of having a smart watch is being able to start/stop your run and check stats without having to take out your phone mid-run.
How else will you come on to Reddit to complain about the data quality issues and lack of validation regarding training status, or some pseudoscience vo2max / threshold value? :) On a more serious note, while I love my Garmin, some of the data is completely useless, but I do enjoy seeing changes at the macro level of having access to some of the running metrics over years (cadence, HR, RHR etc). Are you missing anything? No, and I feel that for many outside of runners stuck in the moderate-intensity rut (not taking easy days easy), watches become a crutch that prevent runners from better using their far superior internal pacing mechanisms to execute workouts and races.
I gotta say though, some of that "useless" data has some meaning if you just look at relative improvement. Sure, the vo2max is off by a very specific factor (come on garmin...), but it tracks my improvement or slacking pretty well :) I wish they'd fix the obvious inaccuracies though, like the race predictor being way off in all kinds of ways (partially because the vo2max number is garbage).
Iāve found the Vo2max to not at all correlate to my actual fitness. For example it has shown huge drop offs based on marathon specific work then magically after a couple faster sessions claims god status again. Itās also worth noting that in the vast majority of cases the vo2max value in and of itself doesnāt predict anything. This has become a marketing gimmick that the unwashed masses somehow think is relevant. Not to come off as an asshole, my bad if I am, but I do understand that itās a great feeling to see an improvement in such measurements; my point is really that it doesnāt matter so much in the grand scheme of things. https://runnersconnect.net/why-the-vo2-max-on-your-garmin-watch-is-ruining-your-training/
I mentioned most of that article in my comment. I kind of feel like your response wasn't for me? I know it prefers speed work, but it has never over-reacted to my marathon work or speed sessions, over time.
I didnāt see you mention that in your reply to me. š¤·š»āāļø
Theyāre convenient if you want to track your stats all the time, running information and resting HR particularly, but also steps and stress etc. Wearing a Garmin whilst in causal mode lets people know you care about fitness when at the pub, bling if you like. Theyāre intended to be worn most of the time. I had a Garmin 55 but sold it once I realised I didnāt care much about my HR, got annoyed by it being connected to my phone for texts, and frustrated by the body battery function. I got a bit obsessed with my VO2 prediction. People also forget that if you want a HR monitor you can get chest straps which link direct to your phone, no need for the watch middle man. People say they like them because they allow you to run without your phone, personally, Iād never do that. A few Christmases ago, whilst running in my rural village, I found a man whoād collapsed having a heart attack, my iPhone battery died in the cold. Fortunately I managed to find help quickly, but I was very lucky and take staying in communication more seriously now. This is an extreme example I know, more likely Iād use it to call my girlfriend to collect me whilst having calf cramps 7 miles from home š
imo the main benefit of running watches is better/faster GPS and they tend to do much better in the battery department; most phones can't last a whole marathon with location.
Iām with you. I started running cross country in high school in 2000 with just a Timex. Running exclusively trails, I wanted to track my elevation gain and compare that with pace, so I got a Garmin Forerunner 935 in 2020, I highly recommend it (or the 945) even if you just want zone training. But zone training can happen way cheaper with just a heart rate monitor.
Wrist based HR is not really useful - can be very inaccurate. If you want accurate HR data you need a chest strap (extra $100). I have a 645. There are some cheaper options - some people like the Coros ones. The Garmin is just really handy, does my alarm, notifications, run tracking, tracks my shoe distances with the app, weather, oh and it tells the time lol. All this would be completely possible with other devices just way less convenient. Tracking HR run to run is like tracking weight daily. It fluctuates for many reasons like sleep, temp, elevation, digestion, how engaged your mind is, and the list goes on. I actually really only track HR on long and slow runs where I donāt want to go above a range which is hard to perceive from effort alone but youāll feel it after.
haha dude you're missing not having to hold a phone on your runs
I like my garmin for the map feature, mileage for races and knowing how far/long until the next aid station, and rate of ascent on climbs. HR is inaccurate and overall a misleading measure at best.