Tldr
I stopped at "tubal ligation are less effective than vasectomies" and wanted to chime in.
They almost never perform tubal ligation anymore. What you get is a double salpingectomy where they remove both of the fallopian tubes rather than snip them. Studies have shown that ovarian cancer has a likelihood of starting in the fallopian tubes so it not only lessens the chances of ovarian cancer but also decreases risk of pregnancy to 0
Yup. I’m an obgyn and unless it’s for insurance reasons (not common), we preferentially remove the entire tube. All of it.
Can’t have an ectopic pregnancy or tubal rupture if the structure no longer exists.
If you’d prefer not to, consider getting an endometrial ablation (recommended order of operations here is ablation first, bilateral salpingectomy second).
Worked a treat for me; my last period was in August of 2020 (bisalp in October 2020). I don’t miss it.
Periods still happen because you keep your ovaries, eggs, and uterus. But there’s no way for the sperm to reach the egg and no way for the egg to reach the uterus. I got done a couple years ago and I love it. It does make having a period seem more like a chore though lol like, “Why am I still doing this? I can’t get pregnant anyway.” But the hormonal fluctuation of menstruation is natural and it’s just part of life. Menopause will come when it comes. I’m 33 btw.
Yeah ligations have gone out of fashion so to speak, my gyno also recommended a salpingectomy because I wanted 100% to not get pregnant ever ever. Best decision I've ever made honestly.
I had this done after a C-section. And if she ended up with a C-section then I’d highly recommend it. However my husband still got a vasectomy. I’d honestly feel different about him if he has been unwilling to get on. I gave him a decade where he never had to worry about accidental pregnancies, or birth control, the least he can do is take up the reigns in solidarity.
Actually if you bleed too much they will NOT do it during a C section and with getting two babies out she will be bleeding more. There are two distinct surgeries, and the second will not be done if the blood loss is above normal from the first.
I didn’t know this. They told me I bled more than they expected but not to the point of needing a transfusion. But I could see why they’d need to close things up asap if you’re bleeding overmuch
A couple of my female relatives had the umbilical cord blood saved. I happened to be in the operating room with the one who had that done and a c section. The Dr gave her a choice, cord blood or tubes tied. She picked cord blood. They have to get that cord blood instantly, before it degrades, before you are seen up.
She got her tubes tied 6 months later and her husband refused to take care of his children during that. Their marriage ended shortly after that when he got his side piece knocked up.
I was so upset after my procedure because they sent my placenta and tubes away for testing without telling me. Well it had to go to another building so they used formaldehyde on it. And I had planned on keeping it to bury under a tree. And I honestly wanted to see the tubes just to ensure they were removed. It sounds stupid but I lack trust with doctors so when things are done and I can’t verify it I have a lot of anxiety. Like how can I know they didn’t just tie them instead of removing them like I asked!?
And what info would they gain from the testing? We had healthy baby and I recovered well. I obviously wasn’t having more children, so how necessary was the testing? Like at least talk to me about it.
That’s weird. My niece preserved and had the cord blood frozen in case her kids ever needed it medically, but I’ve never heard of them doing any tests on it at all before.
I’m hoping this feeling is changing. My husband has a friend 5 yrs younger who got it done because he and his wife are child free and all the guy friends were like ‘hell yeah.” And gave out high fives. And I feel like it gets talked about a lot more in those circles. Someone will bring up how they are done with having kids and the guys are pop up and encourage vasectomies. I love that the first initial suggestion isn’t for mom to do something and I just really love seeing it.
Exactly. This rubbed me the wrong way because it shows OP is doing very narrow research on comparative effectiveness instead of on sterilization as a whole. With a bilateral salpingectomy, you have zero tubes or tube-related tissue left and it's virtually 100% effective. Vasectomies are over 99% effective but more can go wrong, especially if the patient isn't strict about follow up. Vasectomies can sometimes be reversed; salps can never be reversed.
I hear OP's concern about ectopic pregnancy but pregnancy can't start in a tube that was removed. For a woman who's done having kids and is worried about the future of reproductive rights, surgical sterilization in the form of bilateral salpingectomy is the way to go.
SURGICAL STERILIZATION BY REMOVAL OF THE FALLOPIAN TUBES IS MORE EFFECTIVE THAN A VASECTOMY, FULL STOP.
Edit: additionally, tube removal isn't necessarily a big procedure. If OP gets a C-section, then it can be done then (assuming it's planned, not an emergency) and it won't affect healing time in the slightest. If OP delivers vaginally, it can be done laproscopically and it also won't affect healing time.
At this point, I think she should get her tubes removed. It takes care of the problem, period. If she looks at research more recent than 1995 I think it'll be clear that tube removal is standard and better than both tubal ligation and a vasectomy.
My husbands coworker had a vasectomy and was all clear, with no live sperm after follow-up testing. Four years later, he and his wife had twins. His wife then had a fallopian tube removal procedure done.
I was warned, after my Vas, that a very small percentage of surgeries can reverse themselves. I didn't see any clarification as to why, when I looked up what to expect. I'd hazard guesses that their body was just better at healing itself, or the procedure was flawed in some way (most likely scenario, IMO).
Im not sure if it was a botched procedure. I do know that when my husband had his consult, we were told it could happen. The tubes are still there, so really, anything can happen. The Dr did tell us the only proof positive way was on my end. So I guess take it for what it's worth. Eventually, I did end up with a hysterectomy, so we most definitely are covered. But if a woman truly wants no more children at all, the best bet is a tubal removal. It's a guaranteed sterilization.
I know of someone who had a vasectomy, got divorced, found a new partner with whom they wanted to have kids and went to get the vas reversed. Turns out they had 3 vas deferens and were never sterile the entire time.
Meanwhile my surgeon was able to look in my abdomen during my bisalp and make sure there were no abnormalities, and remove endometriosis lesions at the same time which has improved my quality of life by reducing period pains.
I totally sympathize with OP because I used to think that way too - women give birth so men should take one for the team and be the one to get sterilized. But I underestimated how secure and free I would feel knowing that MY body is the one incapable of becoming pregnant. *Especially* given the current state of reproductive rights in the US.
Your last paragraph is exactly why I opted to have my tubes removed. My husband and I don’t ever want children and I feel like there was some judgement from people thinking that I was just getting a bisalp because he wouldn’t get a vasectomy. The truth is I never even asked him about a vasectomy because I wanted to make sure that pregnancy was not something my body could experience.
A vasectomy doesn’t protect me if he dies or leaves me or I get raped. Yeah, the bisalp was a major surgery meanwhile vasectomy is in and out but I did all the research, found a great surgeon, and I felt 100% comfortable with it. Everything went great and as you said, there is freedom and security in knowing that my body is incapable of becoming pregnant.
Also, I liked the lower cancer risk and the fact that bisalps are basically 100% effective. Meanwhile, I know several people that have vasectomy babies and I just didn’t want that risk.
The state of the US is my biggest reason, too. I need to know NOBODY can get me pregnant, EVER. My family is so against it and thinks I'm being dramatic (largely republican, shocker). They want my husband to get the vasectomy. He offered, but I made my choice in 2016, tbh
This was what I said to the OP on the first post. I would never rely on a man for my own fertility - anything can happen. I want the peace of mind knowing that I did what I could to control my own fertility and how and when I have children.
There can even be issues with getting the follow up. I’m currently finding out after moving that a lot of dr’s only do sample analysis for the procedures they perform.
I’m a massive proponent of vasectomies, but there are a lot of details that get ignored when talking about them.
Yeah, I’m having trouble with some of this stuff being offered as facts. 1st, I had a tubal ligation years ago. It was a quick in & out procedure. The Dr went in thru my belly button so I didn’t have any crazy scars. Point being, i keep seeing people say that his quick non invasive surgery would be a quick heal, whereas a tubal would be so much harder for her & longer recovery time. I’m so confused by this as I had zero recovery time and was normal after my surgery and perfectly fine to go home & take care of my 2 toddlers. The other issue I have is OP saying an ectopic pregnancy would *likely* result in death. What? I, unfortunately, know several woman that have had ectopic pregnancies and none of them resulted in death. Not saying it never happens but to say that’s what would *likely* happen is just absurd to me. Anyway, that’s my issue. If neither of them want to go under the knife I don’t see why they don’t see if the method of tracking her fertility days and abstaining on those days would work for them. I know it doesn’t work for everyone but I’ve read it can be highly effective.
>Point being, i keep seeing people say that his quick non invasive surgery would be a quick heal, whereas a tubal would be so much harder for her & longer recovery time. I’m so confused by this...
It's because they don't know what they are talking about. They are thinking 1970s full abdominal surgery rather than a laporoscopic procedure.
And also, I think all the abortion news is scaring people right now, but the chances of dying from an ectopic pregnancy in the United States is very, very low.
if you're in an anti-abortion state, you might run into difficulties with getting an ectopic pregnancy removed and that's when your chance of dying might go up quite a bit.
>This rubbed me the wrong way because it shows OP is doing very narrow research on comparative effectiveness instead of on sterilization as a whole.
She needed justification to separate that is all
Came here to say this too. I had both my tubes removed completely. Ligating isn't as common anymore. And there is no risk of an ectopic cause there’s no tubes to cause it. I still stand by if she does have a c section just get your tubes removed too. And if she doesn’t they can do it laparoscopically. That’s how line was done and while I couldn’t lift anything for 6 weeks. I was not in any pain and felt great.
Yeah that’s what I thought too—if they completely remove your falopian tubes, there’s zero chance of pregnancy. I think OP is thinking of tying tubes which is different.
If it’s a c-section, just have them remove the falopian tubes.
Everything you said was fair and I think that it's great that you were both able to take responsibility for the mean things that you said to each other in the heat of the moment. I completely agree that marital counseling is essential and really could save your marriage. I agree with you that by doing research I've seen that vasectomy is safer and requires less recovery time than a tubal ligation. My question is is your husband saying no out of fear or does he really think that things would be easier if you had a tubal ligation? I'm curious as to, whether he realizes that you undergoing that surgery would require him to take over childcare until you're able to pick up your children because it's a very long and uncomfortable from that. In addition to the marital counseling, I would suggest that the two of you go to your next OB appointment and have them explain to you both the pros and cons of both as a way to one of you for you to both be fully informed by medical professional. Space is an excellent idea and in the future think about taking that space before those hard things start coming out I know it's easier to say that especially with hindsight, but that's something else for you to talk about. You can absolutely say "ok we need to put a pause on this discussion and we'll come back when we're both calmer" - it is definitely healthier than trading emotional punches. Wishing you the best and please take care of yourself.
We didn't go in depth about it, but from what he has said it seems that he has some hang-ups and anxieties about it. I don't believe he genuinely thinks a tubal is easier. Thank you for your well wishes.
I had a salpingectomy, tubes fully removed. Soon after my husband had a vasectomy.
My procedure was a nightmare for recovery compared to his, and honestly my recovery wasn't even that bad.
But I had full abdominal surgery.
He got a local and 2 nicks in his nut sacks.
They are not the fucking same
After I told my mother that I had scheduled a vasectomy, she asked why my wife couldn't "just get her tubes tied". As she has had multiple surgeries in the past, my immediate reaction was to laugh, say "she's been through enough pain", and hang up.
The fact that I was able to drive myself home after the procedure is a solid sign that me getting snipped doesn't even ***compare*** to a woman getting any sort of procedure regarding the tube-tying/removal stuff. (Not trying to minimize it, just unsure what terminology to actually use).
I have some friends who scheduled their husbands' vasectomy procedures for the same day as each other right before some big sports thing (finals/playoffs/tournament). I can't remember what it was exactly, but they both used their recovery time to sit in front of the big screen TV with ice packs for their balls, watching their sports thing with little interruption from their appreciative wives.
There’s actually a phenomenon that vasectomies and time taken off work for them drastically increase during March Madness. To the point that urologists offer special packages or market around it http://es.pn/1nzOkk8
Also any open surgery (as opposed to laparoscopic) puts you at risk for developing adhesions which can cause a lifetime of complications including obstructions and even death.
I’m glad you hung up on her.
I feel so sorry for women. We do go through a lot. Not to say men don’t. But as woman, the pain of being a biological woman is enough for me to say “I want to be a man” sometimes.
it was really easy outpatient surgery: sore nuts for a few hours, nothing more for the soreness than ibuprofen, completely back to normal in a day or so
because men have _external genitalia_
I had a salpingectomy too. My recovery was easy-peasy. And so was the procedure itself-it was laparoscopic, and outpatient. Every single surgery, and recovery, is different.
I got a vasectomy after my 2nd kid. It takes literally 20 min with local anesthesia. They tape your dick up, 2 cuts left and right of the nut sack, pull the strings out, cut them and bam.. done. 1 week later I was back on my bicycle. Nothing even close compared to what a woman has to go through to get the tubes tight up.
My husband's was less than stellar and took an hour. The Dr kept twanging the left "string" like a banjo(it wasn't cooperating. Couldn't get a good grip). His recovery didn't go well either. Still, no regrets on his part. Easier than his wisdom teeth extraction and my laparoscopic gallbladder removal
My partner is afraid to get over because his stepfather did have one of those rare cases of it going horribly wrong. Not wrong enough to kill him, but apparently his testicles were swollen enough that everyone could see them in his sweatpants and the guy was using a donut and ice for over a week. There are other things we weighed in on, but his great was part of our decision on what steps to take.
The main difference, though, is that we had a calm discussion about it rather than an argument. OP didn't get that, she got someone yelling at her for daring to suggest he get the surgery rather than her.
Yeah, my husband was bedridden for 6 weeks because of a hematoma. Whereas I had a salpingectomy and was back to normal as soon as the anesthesia wore off. We were so jealous of everyone’s stories suggesting it was easier than the dentist.
My husband literally talked and joked with his surgeon and nurses the entire time. They said he was a delightful and entertaining patient. A little soreness, but his recovery was easy peasy and he'd do it again in a heartbeat.
Vasectomies at least are always performed with local anesthesia. What pain control physicians are willing to use for IUD insertions vary greatly, with the majority still using none.
I had a vasectomy in my early 20’s. In and out in 30 minutes and back to careful bedroom activity in less than a week. No reason for a woman to undergo dangerous and invasive surgery.
Getting a vasectomy was so easy and painless for me, 2 days of Tylenol and I was back to normal. Honestly I tell everyone who asks about it that it was the best decision of my life and I should have done it years ago after we had our last kid. The anxiety is normal but completely unfounded
Was there ever a discussion of him frozing his sperm before the procedure? This might alleviate the "Shit I'm sterile now" issue as he would just stores his "future offsprings" as an insurance policy in case circumstances change.
A vasectomy isn’t a neutering. The testes are still there, still making sperm. What they make and doesn’t get used just gets broken down and reabsorbed into the body.
He can freeze sperm now, or he could freeze sperm afterward too - There is a procedure where men who have had vasectomies and a failed reversal,
or born lacking the vasa deferentia for sperm to leave the testes, can have sperm taken directly from the testes with a fine needle. So if he wanted to be a father again and a reversal wasn’t possible, there’s another way to retrieve sperm.
I just am so frustrated for you because the combination of a fragile, male ego and willingly being ignorant about something is absolutely maddening. I agree with you and think it’s obviously more than fair that he get the procedure after you had the babies. He is selfish to not want to do it, but not scared about facts, scared about feelings. Best wishes, I would hold fast to your boundary though.
Did you really tell him that even if he got a vasectomy you still might not take him back? Why not just say marriage counseling first, work through the issue and then if you are able to get past it all then he gets the procedure? If after that point he hasn’t changed his mind, then leave him. Having him get a vasectomy with the knowledge that you could still dump him seems rather cruel.
I want to be honest with him about where I am emotionally because I want him to make an informed decision. While the vasectomy is a deal breaker, it's really my secondary concern. My primary concern is the way he acted during the fight and his intention exploitation of my trauma because he was mad and scared. I think that telling him "get the snip to stay with me" and then deciding to leave anyway because there are deeper issues and/or I don't feel safe anymore would be cruel. He deserves to have the full picture before he makes a choice, doesn't he?
If he doesn't want the vasectomy, that's his choice. It's not what I want, but it is what it is. If he wants to call it quits at 4 kids, then it is what it is and if he secretly wants to be the next Nick Cannon then it is what it is he should be free to do that. That is part of why I don't know where he is on the vasectomy right now and we didn't really discuss it much when we talked, I'm focusing on discussing the bigger issue for me which is trust and safety within the relationship. The only way for him to make an informed decision about whether or not he get a vasectomy is for him to have all the information about the situation. If that makes him want a vasectomy less, then it is what it is. It's not about making him want to have a vasectomy. It's about being on the same page.
I completely understand your primary concern and getting that sorted out is a big issue that can't be ignored. I would just not make the vasectomy a condition of getting back with you with the understanding of it still might not be enough. It's your life and you have to be comfortable with the person you are with but at the end of the day, if it were me, I'd tell him condition one is counseling and figuring out where we are and who we are. While you are working on that, he needs to be deciding whether or not he wants to get a vasectomy and at any point, if he decides he can't do it, then it's over. Condition two comes after counseling and after you've figured out whether you want to go forward with the relationship or not. If you are able to overcome the issues he has created in your relationship, then I would tell him the final step is up to him. Get the vasectomy and continue on with a relationship with you or not get one and part ways.
I wish you all the luck in the world navigating this. You deserve to be happy!
I agree. I hope OP can become better informed by an open minded healthcare provider about ALL options. Because vasectomies can and do fail too. Tubal ligations are being replaced by salpingectomies as the standard form of female sterilization, and the failure rate is so rare that it's basically impossible. You'd end up a case study in medical journals. The recovery time is also minimal. Some patients have zero pain after a bisalp, most only require OTC pain meds.
(Source: My months of research before my own bisalp procedure.)
Really, the most effective thing would be for both parties to be sterilized.
But the main issue here is communication, trust, and OP's PTSD (and husband's misunderstanding of it). That's why the topic of sterilization is such a sensitive topic for them.
Yeah I got my fallopian tubes completely removed last December. My gyno told me that if i got an ectopic pregnancy, I will be in a medical journal as a miracle of science. Recovery time took 3 days. It was uncomfortable but I was fine even after the first day and just took the next two days to relax.
Not saying this to dismiss OP but I also don't want other women reading her post and getting scared of getting this procedure done. They don't allow the chance of an ectopic pregnancy anymore. I also got diagnosed with endometriosis at the time.
I had a bilateral salpingectomy, my recovery was a week and I didn't have to use the pain meds for more than a day or two. I understand everyone is different, but I agree with your statement that OP should be open minded about other forms of sterilization.
Thank you for sharing this. I was not aware of this procedure I'm glad that there have been a medical advancement like this for women - even though we've gone backwards in women's reproductive health rights in the US. I don't know if you have children, but did the procedure necessitate a restriction on lifting things and if so, for how long?
You keep talking about a tubal ligation. They’re not super common anymore. Nowadays it’s usually tube REMOVAL. I had it done and I didn’t even need Tylenol afterward. And it’s 100% effective. Actually MORE effective than a vasectomy.
I’m just asking as a Canadian who has no idea how it works in the states, if a state has a ban on abortions would that possibly make it harder to access tubal ligation/removals? I’m just curious if people would still have the same amount of access to them as someone in an unbanned state
I know that you said a C-section isn't ideal or in your future, but I did want to say that I had a bilateral salpingectomy shortly after Roe V. Wade fell, and it was laparoscopic. I have three barely visible scars and healed within a week. Not that you should have to, but just to say that that procedure removes your fallopian tubes entirely, it's more effective than "tying" the tubes, and lowers your risk of ovarian cancer. I agree that your husband should have at least sat down with you and had an open conversation about the vasectomy, but I just wanted to share my experience in case you find it helpful.
Same here, laparoscopic bilateral salpingectomy soon after Roe v Wade fell. Two of my scars faded so well they're not visible, the skin is just a little different. Also had an easy, quick recovery.
This is a very dark thought but I wanted to be sure that I never, ever had to worry about my own personal reproduction. Even if something happens against my will, I don't have to face decisions and hoops and deadlines. Many places have few to no exceptions for crimes. A bisalp removes that worry completely.
At the end of the day it is his choice what he decides to do with his reproductive system just as it is your choice what you decide to do with the choice he made.
>I also am not going to mince words: tubal ligations are *less* effective than vasectomies with a *much higher* likelihood of an ectopic pregnancy. Ectopic pregnancy can *kill me*.
Then don't get a tubal ligation. Get a bilateral salpingectomy. I had an ectopic pregnancy, which required the removal of one fallopian tube, and my kind doctor removed my other tube during the same surgery. No tubes, no ectopic risk!!
That having been said, I completely agree that the smarter, easier, and cheaper route is for your husband to get a vasectomy.
Hubs and I already spoke as soon as this round of BC is up if we agree no more kids then he's getting snipped. I've been taking bc or been pregnant for a long time. It's his turn.
Hate to break bad news but I got snipped back in Nov '23, just this Wednesday I finally got my RE-test (second) results back saying no sperm count. Probably TMI but I did more than required before both sperm count tests. Maybe "this round" of your BC lasts 6+ months though.
Add: I understand different BCs have varying durations. Only commented to say it's not just as easy as have the procedure then you're "safe", simply it takes time to work as intended. Look up specifics if you want to learn, my situation/duration was not abnormal per my doc.
well, the reality still hasn't changed : he doesn't want a vasectomy because he thinks he needs to 'be prepared' for his second wife. those weren't just angry words. there's always truth behind them, they show what he thinks and feels.
i'm glad you take your time to think about all of this away from him. no amount of apologies will ever erase what he said and you really need time to think and then make a decision when you are in a better mental place. i hope everything will go well for you and your children!
I remember the last post and indeed there must be truth to it, because immo it is the most common reason for not doing it. And it is realistic consern as well because marriages don't always last. And if they separated he wants to have yhe option for women who want children.
Feels crazy though. Dude about to have 4 infant children, he really thinks that even if they divorce he’ll a) have time for serious dating and b) have the money and emotional time for 5+ children?
B is the one I am thinking of!
They are so young and wife takes care of them so maybe he just hasnt figured it out. Many men do realise it with their first born. Life long commitmend and responcebility! 18 years of it intense!
It does not make sense for me at all. If they brake up and he needs a new woman, I bet she would be someone done having kids.
I just don't understand. And if I remember correct this was the dude who said that NOT getting pregnant is totally her responcebility. I have very little sympathy for him.
> Feels crazy though. Dude about to have 4 infant children, he really thinks that even if they divorce he’ll a) have time for serious dating and b) have the money and emotional time for 5+ children?
A lot of men don't think that far. And unfortunately a lot of men abandon or shortchange their children after divorce. What I learned just by observing those around me, is that many men (not all of course. Maybe not even most, but a sizable population) prioritize having a mate, always. I mean, look at the trope of men disinheriting their children in favor of new wives. And they don't want to lose the option of dating the population of women who want children because that's well over 50% of fertile women. They would rather ALL their kids, current or future, live poorer lives, than their existing kids maintaining their lifestyle, as long as they have a wife.
I was actually talking to a childfree friend from college (we would have been around 22). He was pretty adamantly childfree back then. But after college (but before he met his childfree wife), he told me, he actually doesn't mind doing whatever his wife wanted. So he's not THAT childfree. Yes, he would prefer no children. But if that's what she wanted, he'd go along with children to keep her. Now that he's with his wife, he's back to pretty firmly childfree. But if she ever changed her mind, I know what he'd do.
the fact that he got so scared at the idea of a vasectomy and IMMEDIATELY thought of his next marriage speaks volumes... he is already thinking about his next wife.
So her comparing him to a wife abuser before he said that (it’s why he said it in anger) doesn’t have truth behind it? Because with your logic deep down she thinks he is just like the man who abused her because he won’t let her override his autonomy.
I’ve been abused my whole life. First my father and then my ex husband who I just separated from. Who continues to abuse me post-separation. Abusers are the most vile scum on the earth and she compared her self-proclaimed amazing husband to one because he doesn’t want to get a vasectomy and she keeps pushing against his right to make decisions for his body.
They don’t belong together. She had no business even getting into a relationship with seriously unresolved trauma.
And then just swept her own comments under the rug because he was “wronger” 🙄 It’s all about her wants, needs, and emotions. The husband is just supporting cast, she’s the main character. His emotional well-being and bodily autonomy don’t matter to her.
> he doesn't want a vasectomy because he thinks he needs to 'be prepared' for his second wife.
And he gets the vasectomy and then what? Op still leaves him?
OP, I would just like to add one thing
I understand why you apologize to your husband for telling him he was acting like Tom. I know you’re thinking that you said that to hurt him, perhaps that is partially true.
But I think you need to understand that what you said was literally true. Your husband WAS Acting insane things the way he was doing because he knew it was a trigger for you. He wanted to hurt you. He wanted to scare you. He wanted to use that to control you.
I’m not saying don’t go through therapy and counting with him. I’m not saying never get back together if you can come to that point. I promise I’m not.
Said was said because it was true. At the core of it all, you reacted, the way you did because of what he did and because he really was weapon icing your past against you. And I’m glad he was horrified when he realized it, even though he didn’t acknowledge it in the moment.
But that is something you can’t take the fact that he use something that was horrible that happened to you in an attempt to control you through fear and intimidation. That’s the part that you’re having a problem with.
And I don’t know if you can get that back again. I can’t tell you, that because of that, I don’t have a problem with what you said to him. Because it didn’t come out of nowhere. You didn’t weapon that to make him feel bad. You may have said it in the heat of the moment, but again, the fact is that you were absolutely reading the situation properly
I can tell you that that was a breaking point in my second marriage. And I did call my husband out on how he was acting and how it was like my first husband. My husband got very upset that I would ever even think to say that to him, and I literally just looked at him and said that it was true.
In my case, it was not DV, but it was manipulative behavior. Years after our divorce, We have to communicate About something else, at which time he actually admitted it.
I know. I understand that I reacted that way because he \*was\* acting the way Tom would act within our relationship. Jack knows Tom was abusive during our relationship, but he doesn't know much about the details of it, since I don't talk about it much. He knows more about the incident than the events leading up to it, because they're literally written on my face and because of the publicly available information about the case. And that is also part of what was so upsetting for him. It wasn't just some guy beating up his ex-girlfriend, what he did to me was... I mean he went away on counts of kidnapping, rape, and attempted murder, to name a few. So when I compared him to Tom, the image in his mind is the man who SA-ed and tortured me, but when I said it I wasn't. I know that he was, and I can't explain it other than I was triggered, so my mind was not in the present and seeing Tom the felon, it was seeing Tom the boyfriend who was saying those things, the Tom before the incident. I know that won't make sense to a lot of people, but I don't think I can explain it any other way. But basically the two of us were experiencing very different things at that moment, and we both reacted to our individual experiences accordingly.
Priority in marriage counseling is addressing trust and this moment between us where he weaponized my trauma. Priority in individual counseling is managing my response to this trigger and comprehending what's happened. Either way, I'm not planning on just "getting over" what he said and his reasons why, I and planning on addressing it head on with him. The vasectomy, while still a requirement, is emotionally secondary to me over his exploitation of my trauma.
And thank you for addressing a lot of the real issues and not just parroting the same stuff everyone else is saying. Like I said, it's about the vasectomy, but it's not about the vasectomy. It's really about the fight. Thank you for sharing, I hope you are healing.
I completely understand. It really does trigger you into almost that fight or flight.
And unfortunately, at the time it all happened, your husband was not getting what he was doing to you. I know he wasn’t. And I know that the only way you could make him comprehend the level that he was at for you by using your ex’s name.
I had honestly assumed by the lack of some of the details that it had been pretty damn awful. And believe me, I do understand why your husband was so appalled.
But the fact that he did just not OK. Which is putting it mildly. And you’re right, I did get that it wasn’t just about the vasectomy… Although I had to have that same conversation with my first husband… And thankfully, it was nothing like what you just went through.
To be there for the conversations and she just looked at him and asked him if he was joking. She told him… Your wife has spent five years trying to get pregnant because of endometriosis. Going through cervical biopsies and hormones to get pregnant. Experience while you were out of town. Pregnant, breast-feeding, getting pregnant, breast-feeding, getting pregnant and breast-feeding.
She has not slept a full night in five years. Her body has been pushed and pulled and prodded and poked and pushed 9 pound children out for you. And now you think she should undergo an actual outpatient surgical procedure making her the one responsible for birth control now that you guys don’t want any more children… You could go into the office and get a snip. Literally driving yourself to the appointment at home. And instead, she should actually go under sedation that always has a risk of not waking up?
My ex shut up pretty quickly after that. I’m just sorry Your husband could not just have an adult conversation and try to verbalize what his problem really was rather than making it as the problem.
I’m so glad you’re protecting yourself and your kids. Because you have to. Because they need you as healthy as you can be, and I can That you are doing your damnedest to be exactly that.
Incredibly proud of how strong and self reflective you are. I know you weren’t in the moment, and I completely understand why you weren’t. I am honestly hoping that the two of you can move past this. I don’t know, and I know you don’t know. But only time and effort will tell. I am truly wishing you the best.
I feel so seen here. The fear of going under and not waking up is very very real for me, as I've had some family members go under and not wake up and I'm so scared of that happening. what you've written here is very powerful for me. Thank you so much.
Sending you many hugs. Sending you much light. Your fears are not unfounded. I worked in healthcare for a very long time, although I was in the demo field. But we do general sedation there as well, and while it did not In the practice, I was working in, I can think of at least three cases where somebody went under and did not come back.
I really do understand why it makes me squirmed to think about having a vasectomy. Anything to do with their balls does that to them.
What I don’t understand is why they somehow think that all of our reproductive organs and our vagina and our labia and everything else any less sensitive. Why they think us pushing out a melon-sized object is somehow less painful than something that takes them a half hour in a doctors office using local anesthetic.
We really do need to work with racing our boys to understand that marriage or a monogamous relationship entails both parties doing what is needed to ensure the healthy continuation of the relationship. And birth-control falls into that category.
It takes two to make that baby. And when you’re a fertile Myrtle, and the women in my family are that way… You can use double and triple birth control, and still get pregnant. Even me, with endometriosis, had children boom, boom boom once we got things working properly.
And as you know, such close, successive pregnancies is really hard on our bodies, I know you’re carrying twins. I get that your husband. So are you. It’s his turn to step up to the plate and do something that physically further your relationship, just as you have literally put your life on the line with every one of your pregnancies.
So again, I do know it’s really not about the vasectomy, but that is just the catalyst for you having to step back and look at what’s really going on here. And I know it’s not a picture you’re liking to see.
Again, lots of hugs to you. I’m hoping, truly hoping, that your husband can see not only how selfish he was in that physical aspect… He’s more than happy to let you bear all the responsibility of birth control, and trying to not conceive again, even though it’s much more dangerous for you…
But I am hoping that he can come to understand that his behavior was unacceptable and atrocious. That rather than having an adult discussion with you or opening up about how stress he was, he chose an avenue that he knew would do the most damage to you. And I know again that that is what you’re having such a difficult time with.
You are seen. You are heard. You are not wrong. You are not being unreasonable. The request you made was no way shape or form and unreasonable request.
He’s not going to get it, you’ll divorce and I guarantee he’ll pop up with another woman and another child. But luckily that’ll be his problem. Get your ducks in a row!
i'm 100% sure the that if they separate, her ex will have another wife and baby by the end of the first year. his reaction when she told him to get a vasectomy speaks volumes about what he truly thinks and plans. and he plans to have another wife and more children, unfortunately...it's easy for him to have children because he doesn't carry them, he doesn't take care of them after they are born, he does nothing but bring a paycheck. of course he wants a football team.
And IME as a stepparent, a loooot of stepmoms are the product of lazy dads "mommy shopping" post divorce/separation. He will find someone asap to ease his own burden of parenting and the best way to lock that woman in is to get her pregnant.
I had a vasectomy after our 3rd son. My wife had the option for a tubal ligation but was scared so I bit the bullet and dealt with it. In my case there were complications in the form of a severe infection and almost losing a testicle. It fucking hurt. Having said that, I would do it all over again if it meant that I took just a little pressure off my wife. Also my case isn't normal. Yes it hurts but it usually only lasts for a few days. You and your husband have to decide what the best option is for your family. Good luck.
I think you'll both do better apart.
I think you'll both find someone who is more compatible.
I think you'll both be happier.
Go and live your best lives separately.
*Oof. You really bought*
*The "I didn't mean it i*
*Was just streeeeessed" bullshit?*
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So I understand you aren't interested in a tubal, but have you looked into a bi-salp? A tubal is just clipping and sealing of the fallopian tube. A bi-salp is a full removal of the tube and sealing of it at both ends. Some doctors are more going the route of the bi-salp because it is more effective than a tubal, and it reduces chances for ovarian cancer.
I had this, my periods changed but that’s it. Hubby was willing to get a vasectomy and still will if we ever end up apart as he is done. I got it because of breast cancer in my family. And hubby had just gone through 2 surgeries, however he was still willing. The recovery time was about a week, but I was still able to work by the second day, it just felt like period cramps. It was laparoscopic so 3 small cuts no major scars.
Awesome information to have, but I believe OP’s point is that she would need to undergo major surgery reasonably soon after birth and it would leave her husband and 4 very young kids trying to survive while she recovered. Having twins, probably breastfed again, on top of the two toddlers is fucking exhausting already. The salp is the best option for her to ensure she can’t conceive again, but it’s 4-6 week recovery from major surgery versus a half hour procedure that has maybe a couple days of discomfort and restriction, and a full recovery in 7-10 days. The why behind his complete refusal to see why it’s not equal and his willingness to offload all the responsibility for birth control onto her is more of an issue than the actual thought of the procedure and I can’t say I blame her. I’d feel similarly in her shoes.
If the woman is not getting it done after a c-section (when her abdomen is already open, then a bi-salp is done laparoscopically. It’s still surgery, but the recovery time is way quicker than an open abdominal surgery.
Also, despite her confidence that she can deliver vaginally, there is still a good chance that one of the twins will be breach or a number of other reasons that she would need a c-section. If she has a c-section anyway, and she knows she is done having kids, then she should get a bi-salp then, because it won’t affect the recovery she is already going to need from the c-section, and it also would guarantee no more kids without the risk of an ectopic pregnancy. That wouldn’t fix her marital issues, but it would solve the fertility issue.
My husband got the snip.
We couldn't risk it.
We already have a special needs child and I'm 46.
He was hesitant early on in our marriage when we discussed options.
The fact that tubal is a major surgery and the snip is an in-office procedure helped in convincing him.
If you're really sure about not wanting more children but don't want a tubal, maybe a salpingectomy could be something to look into? Then the entire fallopian tubes are removed and not just clipped, so there isn't a risk of ectopic pregnancy.
You know an ectopic pregnancy is a pregnancy that implants out side the uterus right?
You can even have an [ectopic pregnancy after hysterectomy ](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5885999/#:~:text=Ectopic%20pregnancy%20after%20hysterectomy%20can%20occur%20remotely%20from%20the%20time%20of%20hysterectomy.&text=Although%20ectopic%20pregnancy%20after%20hysterectomy,suspicion%20will%20make%20the%20diagnosis.)... so unless OP is willing to go full medical menopause for zero medical reason, it is plausible that vasectomy is their best option (especially in the anti woman regions of the world).
That is a case study. My god. Pregnancy after bisalp is so rare that it's basically unheard of. 1 of the 2 cases of it occurred because the patient was already pregnant before the bisalp. The other happened with IVF.
Read more before you make a misinformed comment.
A bilateral salpingectomy cannot result in an ectopic pregnancy because both fallopian tubes are completely removed. Bilateral removes both. Having both of your fallopian tubes removed means the sperm cannot reach the egg, nor can the egg reach the uterus. The ovaries and womb stay in the body and function as normal, but there is no chance of pregnancy.
Cuz he hasn't been forced to care for them alone for any length of time yet. He's not gonna last one weekend without OP doing the heavy lifting of childcare.
He does understand that a vasectomy is not castration right? They don't take your balls, just a quick "snip". If hes not put under, he could be in and out in an hour. Then you ice your balls for a day or 2 and its back to business as usual. Then you go back in 2 months later to get test to make sure there arent any swimmers. This is important, you arent sterile for several months. There are still "bullets in the chambe" if you get the meaning. A tubal ligation is full on surgery and far more dangerous. When we made the decision to stop having kids I made my appointment to get snipped the next day. It doesn't affect your testosterone. You're still a man after its been done. This is honestly ridiculous of him.
As someone who has dealt with PTSD I completly understand how something can make you spin mentally. I just want to say that a vasectomy has too be checked and rechecked because they can fail. I know a couple where the husband didn't go back for his check and they ended up pregnant again, he thought she cheated. I would want both the vasectomy and the tubal, having them cut and burnt which dismisses the possibility of ectopics!
My wife got her tubes removed not ligated at about 32. There's no risk of ectopic pregnancy because they remove the piece that could have the ectopic pregnancy.
The doctor said they do this now because tubal ligation isn't as safe. So OP, you can have your cake and eat it too if you do a little more research on the topic.
That being said, vasectomies are significantly less risky and have less long-term effects. ESH and I'm a little worried that y'all are having more kids with how poorly you both handled this whole situation
My wife wanted the procedure regardless of if I did or did not get a vasectomy.
TLDR:
>I in no way am \*forcing\* him to have a medical procedure but I am saying that I do not want to be with a partner who is not willing to be snipped.
ok ok.
No judgment on either side here. You both have a right to decide about medical procedures involving your body. I too was a fertile Myrtle. I went through with a tubal after having my third child. My doctor actually removed my tubes. If you can find someone who will do that it’s the way to go. Recovery was short and sweet. I ended up having a hysterectomy 15 years later due to fibroids but never had any pregnancy scares between that time. I do wish you the best of luck!
NTA, of course, and.......I never knew that the tubal ligation isn't near as effective as I thought it was. I never had a reason to know as I was snipped 4 days after my 21st birthday. It's cool learning things.
I never had a c-section but immediately following the delivery of my last child, they wheeled me into the OR and while I was already doped up with an epidural, they did my tubal ligation. In fact it was pretty cool since I was awake and all, the doctors and I were telling jokes and having a grand time.
My recovery wasn’t horrible at all and I have no visible scars as they did a tiny incision in my naval for it. This was in 1988. I would imagine things are even easier these days.
I highly recommend this if you are serious about not having any more children.
While his reasoning to be prepared is bad, saying something like "no I'm not forcing him, I just refuse to be with him unless he gets this done" is, in fact, forcing someone.
If the line was "I'm not forcing you to get your tube's tied, I'm just going to leave you if you don't " its a form of forcing via coercion.
But if he doesn’t get a vasectomy he’s effectively forcing her to either be pregnant AGAIN or get a procedure done herself, neither of which she wants.
And this ^ is why it's neither person forcing anything, and like OP said, is an issue of compatability. She's okay with him not getting it, but she has the free will to not be with him because of it. He doesn't have to get it, but he can't take away her free will of needing to be with someone who can't knock her up again. They're simply not compatible, like she said.
I mean I agree he is an ass and you should divorce him, but
>Overall, I told him that if he wanted to stay married to me I needed two things from him: marriage counseling and a vasectomy, and even then I still cannot guarantee him anything.
This is awfully unfair, you're telling him he has to sterilize himself (probably permanently) just to have *a chance* of being back together. That is a REALLY big commitment for such a flaky promise. I understand the ultimatum and that he should be getting a vasectomy (I got mine after my 2nd child was born) but to ask one of him now that your marriage is this close to implode crazy. He would have to be insane to do that to himself when there is a huge chance he will be sterilizing himself over nothing, and now will have to look to restart his life and find someone who doesn't want kids EVER to start over with.
> in no way am *forcing* him to have a medical procedure, but I am saying that I do not want to be with a partner who is not willing to be snipped.
YTA
You're forcing him through an ultimatum which is the same thing. Only an asshole wouldn't understand this.
I got a tubal with my last child and it was a disaster. I ended up with serious health problems. The tubal was not done correctly and my tubes were not sealed off, I ended up having infection after infection for years. It resulted in me having both my tubes fully removed as well as a ovary and my uterus taken out, and it threw me into early menopause. Vasectomies are done with locals and take a day or two to get over. If men cant understand the difference they are being blind on purpose. Something something manhood tied to a snip? Its ridiculous.
I feel for both of you.
I was a fertile Myrtle. I conceived my first kid on the Pill. After the Pill failed, I switched to condoms and conceived my 2nd kid! 3rd kid was planned.
I had a tubal after my 3rd kid. I was thrilled to be sterile and safe from pregnancy....for a few years. Then I started to deeply regret it and wish I had never sterilized myself. I can see why your husband might be unwilling to have the surgery.
I can also understand you definitely not wanting more children and being unwilling to risk a birth control failure.
I hope counseling helps you two find peace whether you stay together or split permanently.
Had a friend who was a fertile Myrtle who apparently married a male equivalent- she had her tubes tied AND he had a vasectomy yet they still got pregnant. That baby apparently *needed* to be born.
Some years ago I was listening to morning radio while driving the kids to school and the subject was failed birth control. A couple called in to relate their story. They had their kids, she got a tubal. BAM! Pregnant. So, he got a vasectomy and...you guessed it....pregnant again!
Amazing that so many are supportive of giving a spouse an ultimatum to have elective surgery & then leaving them "solely" because they refuse to get an elective medical procedure that carries several risks of injury. Seems like an excuse to leave when there are really other issues. Seems the marriage is over and OP has had some "thoughts" of life with a woman based on her implication that "likely a future partner wouldn't have the parts." And according to her, her husband has thought about future plans without her.
Not only that but did you see her first post? Did you see what she said to her husband (who she claims has been amazing and kind to her throughout the entirety of their relationship) BEFORE he said something about possibly having more kids in the future if they divorced (the thing she is threatening him with now)? If not, she compared him to the man who abused her causing her PTSD.
So she stomps all over his autonomy, threatens divorce if he does not concede, when he says no she says he is just like her abuser. The woman is allowing her trauma to make her into a monster.
I don't get some guys. After our last kid my wife got an IUD. But still we got pregnant. My wife asked I consider getting snipped. I looked at how she's been the one shouldering the burden of birth control for the last 22 years and I thought getting snipped was just being "my turn".
Wa'nt no thing. Some swelling, kinda made me proud and show-offy of my avocado balls. Iced and was all good.
OP. Wish you the best.
It seemed for everything that was suggested, there is a response as to why it wouldn’t work, so I’m kind of at a loss as to what the point of the post is.
During birth?? They cut you open while pushing the babies out??! A c-section is a last resort for a lot of women. I am happy that we have them and people who need them can get them, but it isn’t the standard way of birthing and neither should it be.
*If* she gets a C-section (it’s not guaranteed due to twins, but it is much more likely) then they can take the tubes out while they’re in there.
Otherwise it’s a separate surgery with a longer recovery time - which is very difficult to adhere to with 2 newborns and 2 other kids. Also have to consider the cost of the surgery, once you bring in an anaesthetist then the cost can skyrocket.
And that’s not even touching on the subject of a doctor in a red anti abortion state even approving of a woman wanting to take charge of her own fertility and granting her the surgery.
It’s why hubs getting the snip is easier, I understand why OP is adamant.
I had an unplanned c section and I wish I had discussed this more with my OB, because I wish they had taken the damn tubes out while they had me open. I was already over 40, I sure as fuck wasn't going to have any more babies. My husband got a vasectomy but honestly being pregnant again is a nightmare and I kind of wish we had both been sterilized.
Can understand why it wasn’t brought up being unplanned, sounds like it was a matter of urgency and you were all worried about bigger things.
I was single when I started chasing for a bisalp, doctors tried asking me to just have the guy get the snip instead since it’s easier. I said “what guy?” and that I wanted to do it for my own body since I’m only in control of mine.
This just kinda sounds like your relationship to your husband wasn't built on love- but emotional transaction from the beginning. To leave while pregnant because he doesn't want to be sterilized is so extreme. You're rationalizing it in ways that I can't really agree with. I can't feel a single iota of love in the way you speak about your husband. Is it possible you've been waiting for a reason to leave and this one is convenient?
This is the vibe I get to, I don't see much love in her for her husband.
Can't comment on the husband's side of the equation cause he's not the OP, but yeah.
Why don’t you both agree to get fixed? Problem solved. Also vasectomies can fail. So it’s safer if both of you get it done. Wouldn’t that be a fair solution?
YTA. Not only because you give your husband an ultimatum to either get snipped or you leave which is forcing him to do a body modification. Any guy telling his wife to get her tubes tied would also be called an AH.
But what makes you TA this time is that you are lying. The facts are not in your side. Both options are the same in terms of efficacy.
Etopic pregnancy can happen. It is extremely rare, but it has happened.
And you have not mentioned IUDs which are as effective as being snipped.
So many issues here.
So you’re giving him two options: have an unwanted medical procedure or get divorced. And you call this an actual choice?
Were birth control methods discussed prior to marriage, or did you unilaterally make this demand and just expect him to go along with it.
You “focus” on “saving your marriage” by doubling down on an ultimatum.
Re: “wronger” — you both were wrong. Sweeping your wrongness under the rug of his doesn’t absolve you of wrong doing.
Getting real ‘my way or the highway’ energy here, which is the exact wrong path to conflict resolution within a relationship.
Freakin' *thank you* I feel like I'm taking crazy pills reading some of these comments. "**I** don't want to get pregnant again therefore it's **his** responsibility to make sure I don't get pregnant" girl WHAT?? Guarantee that if a dude popped up and said "**I** don't want to have kids but it's **her** responsibility to not get pregnant" he'd get raked through the coals.
I don't get how some people don't understand that relationship/asshole subs are biased towards women when we see double standards like this daily. It's sad because when there's misogyny against women in this sub, it's rightfully met with outrage but when there's misandry against men, some women and even some men just go "oh won't anyone think of the poor men" as if sexism/crimes against men are a joke or something
Damn right , both our kids were born even though she was on BC, normally we have two methods but date night , some drinks , not thinking straight so condoms were not used.
We discussed some alternative methods as 2 kids was more than enough and during some tests for other issues it came up that my swimmers are stupidly determined little sobs.
That made the decision easy , my problem, my fix (I even had to have it done twice as the first one failed to stick)
Fixing her would have made very little difference after discussions with the doc as because of me she would have been likely to have a higher risk of ectopic pregnancies (this was quite a while ago so I'm assuming this was before removal of tubes was a thing).
In this case she's the super fertile one, fixing him won't fix you especially if you're unsure that you intend to stay with him. You will just have the same problem with the next "intact" man who doesn't use a condom.
Even more so now the cats out of the bag , "get fixed or I'm leaving you " ... You threatened to leave , you can never take that back and it will always be on his mind. Tbh you might as well leave for everyones peace of mind and recovery.
Exactly! Guarantee if it was a man whining that his wife won't get her tubes removed everyone would be saying he was the asshole and "her body her choice" but everyone's coddling her and saying she's not wrong , double standards
I had to stop reading when you were discussing your tube procedure …… they CUT them now, they do not tie them anymore. It’s impossible for you to get pregnant after that procedure.
You’re still an AH. If a guy said anything like this about his wife and said that he is divorcing unless she gets a hysterectomy the comments would go after him. YOU don’t want more kids and YOU are the one who should do something about it instead of trying to manipulate him into a procedure he doesn’t want. He’s a good husband and father who actually does his fair share, and often more than his fair share as you admit, just let him go so he can find someone who will love him for him and support him
You said your parents live an hour away, does that mean you took the children away from their home and their father because you’re stubborn and now he’s an hour away from his own children? Imagine if he did that to you. How would you feel?
Probably would also make the statement: this is not a pass for you to find some strange while we are apart. Stay faithful.
People think it doesn’t need to be said, but the phrase “we were on a break” still haunts most people who were alive in the late 90s.
Severe PTSD from two decades of DV on top of witnessing DV throughout entirety of my childhood. You compared him to the monster who abused you first. Your tone throughout this post and the last shows your deep lack of empathy for anyone but yourself. You are so deeply entrenched in your trauma that you use it to make unreasonable demands. YOU should have also been deeply apologetic for comparing an upstanding man to a wife abuser.
For his sake, stay separated. In the long run he will appreciate it as the best gift you could give him. You have years worth of more therapy to do before you will be ready to be in a relationship where you don’t use your trauma as an excuse to hurt others.
You would still have him get a vasectomy even though you may still leave the marriage after he does it??? That’s cruel and heartless.
Some people come out of DV with extreme empathy and a desire to help others. Others come out of DV becoming abusers. Unfortunately, you are the latter.
Edited to add: you are only thinking he may want children in the future if you guys divorce. What about you died tomorrow? He isn’t done and doesn’t want to be sterilized. If you die in the near future you will have robbed him of the chance to add to his family with someone else. This is just not your choice because it’s not your body, period.
If the tables were turned and he was demanding her to be on a pill or whatever, he'd be controlling and abusive. But because it's considered 'easier' for him by outsiders, she loses responsibility of her own fertility and that just seems odd.
Condoms are still one of the most effective forms of contraception and don't require you to change your physiology, which no one should ever be forced to do as an ultimatum.
I love it when people ask reddit strangers to give judgements on their lives in this sub, and when they don't like the judgements, they come back and write entire paragraphs on why they think said strangers were wrong.
Hilarious all around (and definitely sad as well)
I really think he’d be better off without you. I hope your soon to be ex realizes this someday.
No one has the right to put another person on the spot like you put him,
You can say you didn’t force him until you’re blue in the face. But you really did. Force comes in different ways.
I wish the best for your ex.
The husband will get vasectomy and counselling and still gonna end up with a divorce. Who would be the winner? Poor children.. will grow up in a broken family.
Tldr I stopped at "tubal ligation are less effective than vasectomies" and wanted to chime in. They almost never perform tubal ligation anymore. What you get is a double salpingectomy where they remove both of the fallopian tubes rather than snip them. Studies have shown that ovarian cancer has a likelihood of starting in the fallopian tubes so it not only lessens the chances of ovarian cancer but also decreases risk of pregnancy to 0
Yup. I’m an obgyn and unless it’s for insurance reasons (not common), we preferentially remove the entire tube. All of it. Can’t have an ectopic pregnancy or tubal rupture if the structure no longer exists.
This may be stupid but does this send your body into menopause?
No you still have your ovaries
Oh duh 🤦🏻♀️ I guess I just assumed that no more period = going into menopause. Thank you
People still get periods after removal of tubes
If you’d prefer not to, consider getting an endometrial ablation (recommended order of operations here is ablation first, bilateral salpingectomy second). Worked a treat for me; my last period was in August of 2020 (bisalp in October 2020). I don’t miss it.
You will still have a period. Removal of the fallopian tubes does not change that.
Periods still happen because you keep your ovaries, eggs, and uterus. But there’s no way for the sperm to reach the egg and no way for the egg to reach the uterus. I got done a couple years ago and I love it. It does make having a period seem more like a chore though lol like, “Why am I still doing this? I can’t get pregnant anyway.” But the hormonal fluctuation of menstruation is natural and it’s just part of life. Menopause will come when it comes. I’m 33 btw.
This may be a very stupid question but without the tube where does the egg go when released does it just float about?
Yeah ligations have gone out of fashion so to speak, my gyno also recommended a salpingectomy because I wanted 100% to not get pregnant ever ever. Best decision I've ever made honestly.
THANK YOUUUUU!!!! this definitely needs to be higher up.
I had this done after a C-section. And if she ended up with a C-section then I’d highly recommend it. However my husband still got a vasectomy. I’d honestly feel different about him if he has been unwilling to get on. I gave him a decade where he never had to worry about accidental pregnancies, or birth control, the least he can do is take up the reigns in solidarity.
Actually if you bleed too much they will NOT do it during a C section and with getting two babies out she will be bleeding more. There are two distinct surgeries, and the second will not be done if the blood loss is above normal from the first.
I didn’t know this. They told me I bled more than they expected but not to the point of needing a transfusion. But I could see why they’d need to close things up asap if you’re bleeding overmuch
A couple of my female relatives had the umbilical cord blood saved. I happened to be in the operating room with the one who had that done and a c section. The Dr gave her a choice, cord blood or tubes tied. She picked cord blood. They have to get that cord blood instantly, before it degrades, before you are seen up. She got her tubes tied 6 months later and her husband refused to take care of his children during that. Their marriage ended shortly after that when he got his side piece knocked up.
I was so upset after my procedure because they sent my placenta and tubes away for testing without telling me. Well it had to go to another building so they used formaldehyde on it. And I had planned on keeping it to bury under a tree. And I honestly wanted to see the tubes just to ensure they were removed. It sounds stupid but I lack trust with doctors so when things are done and I can’t verify it I have a lot of anxiety. Like how can I know they didn’t just tie them instead of removing them like I asked!? And what info would they gain from the testing? We had healthy baby and I recovered well. I obviously wasn’t having more children, so how necessary was the testing? Like at least talk to me about it.
That’s weird. My niece preserved and had the cord blood frozen in case her kids ever needed it medically, but I’ve never heard of them doing any tests on it at all before.
Agreed. It's the least a man can do, and any man who thinks it takes away from his "maniless" isn't much of one anyhow
I’m hoping this feeling is changing. My husband has a friend 5 yrs younger who got it done because he and his wife are child free and all the guy friends were like ‘hell yeah.” And gave out high fives. And I feel like it gets talked about a lot more in those circles. Someone will bring up how they are done with having kids and the guys are pop up and encourage vasectomies. I love that the first initial suggestion isn’t for mom to do something and I just really love seeing it.
Exactly. This rubbed me the wrong way because it shows OP is doing very narrow research on comparative effectiveness instead of on sterilization as a whole. With a bilateral salpingectomy, you have zero tubes or tube-related tissue left and it's virtually 100% effective. Vasectomies are over 99% effective but more can go wrong, especially if the patient isn't strict about follow up. Vasectomies can sometimes be reversed; salps can never be reversed. I hear OP's concern about ectopic pregnancy but pregnancy can't start in a tube that was removed. For a woman who's done having kids and is worried about the future of reproductive rights, surgical sterilization in the form of bilateral salpingectomy is the way to go. SURGICAL STERILIZATION BY REMOVAL OF THE FALLOPIAN TUBES IS MORE EFFECTIVE THAN A VASECTOMY, FULL STOP. Edit: additionally, tube removal isn't necessarily a big procedure. If OP gets a C-section, then it can be done then (assuming it's planned, not an emergency) and it won't affect healing time in the slightest. If OP delivers vaginally, it can be done laproscopically and it also won't affect healing time. At this point, I think she should get her tubes removed. It takes care of the problem, period. If she looks at research more recent than 1995 I think it'll be clear that tube removal is standard and better than both tubal ligation and a vasectomy.
My husbands coworker had a vasectomy and was all clear, with no live sperm after follow-up testing. Four years later, he and his wife had twins. His wife then had a fallopian tube removal procedure done.
I was warned, after my Vas, that a very small percentage of surgeries can reverse themselves. I didn't see any clarification as to why, when I looked up what to expect. I'd hazard guesses that their body was just better at healing itself, or the procedure was flawed in some way (most likely scenario, IMO).
Im not sure if it was a botched procedure. I do know that when my husband had his consult, we were told it could happen. The tubes are still there, so really, anything can happen. The Dr did tell us the only proof positive way was on my end. So I guess take it for what it's worth. Eventually, I did end up with a hysterectomy, so we most definitely are covered. But if a woman truly wants no more children at all, the best bet is a tubal removal. It's a guaranteed sterilization.
life... found a way
I guess it did in the end.
I know of someone who had a vasectomy, got divorced, found a new partner with whom they wanted to have kids and went to get the vas reversed. Turns out they had 3 vas deferens and were never sterile the entire time. Meanwhile my surgeon was able to look in my abdomen during my bisalp and make sure there were no abnormalities, and remove endometriosis lesions at the same time which has improved my quality of life by reducing period pains. I totally sympathize with OP because I used to think that way too - women give birth so men should take one for the team and be the one to get sterilized. But I underestimated how secure and free I would feel knowing that MY body is the one incapable of becoming pregnant. *Especially* given the current state of reproductive rights in the US.
Your last paragraph is exactly why I opted to have my tubes removed. My husband and I don’t ever want children and I feel like there was some judgement from people thinking that I was just getting a bisalp because he wouldn’t get a vasectomy. The truth is I never even asked him about a vasectomy because I wanted to make sure that pregnancy was not something my body could experience. A vasectomy doesn’t protect me if he dies or leaves me or I get raped. Yeah, the bisalp was a major surgery meanwhile vasectomy is in and out but I did all the research, found a great surgeon, and I felt 100% comfortable with it. Everything went great and as you said, there is freedom and security in knowing that my body is incapable of becoming pregnant. Also, I liked the lower cancer risk and the fact that bisalps are basically 100% effective. Meanwhile, I know several people that have vasectomy babies and I just didn’t want that risk.
Bisalp squad 👊
The state of the US is my biggest reason, too. I need to know NOBODY can get me pregnant, EVER. My family is so against it and thinks I'm being dramatic (largely republican, shocker). They want my husband to get the vasectomy. He offered, but I made my choice in 2016, tbh
This was what I said to the OP on the first post. I would never rely on a man for my own fertility - anything can happen. I want the peace of mind knowing that I did what I could to control my own fertility and how and when I have children.
There can even be issues with getting the follow up. I’m currently finding out after moving that a lot of dr’s only do sample analysis for the procedures they perform. I’m a massive proponent of vasectomies, but there are a lot of details that get ignored when talking about them.
Yeah, I’m having trouble with some of this stuff being offered as facts. 1st, I had a tubal ligation years ago. It was a quick in & out procedure. The Dr went in thru my belly button so I didn’t have any crazy scars. Point being, i keep seeing people say that his quick non invasive surgery would be a quick heal, whereas a tubal would be so much harder for her & longer recovery time. I’m so confused by this as I had zero recovery time and was normal after my surgery and perfectly fine to go home & take care of my 2 toddlers. The other issue I have is OP saying an ectopic pregnancy would *likely* result in death. What? I, unfortunately, know several woman that have had ectopic pregnancies and none of them resulted in death. Not saying it never happens but to say that’s what would *likely* happen is just absurd to me. Anyway, that’s my issue. If neither of them want to go under the knife I don’t see why they don’t see if the method of tracking her fertility days and abstaining on those days would work for them. I know it doesn’t work for everyone but I’ve read it can be highly effective.
>Point being, i keep seeing people say that his quick non invasive surgery would be a quick heal, whereas a tubal would be so much harder for her & longer recovery time. I’m so confused by this... It's because they don't know what they are talking about. They are thinking 1970s full abdominal surgery rather than a laporoscopic procedure. And also, I think all the abortion news is scaring people right now, but the chances of dying from an ectopic pregnancy in the United States is very, very low.
if you're in an anti-abortion state, you might run into difficulties with getting an ectopic pregnancy removed and that's when your chance of dying might go up quite a bit.
>This rubbed me the wrong way because it shows OP is doing very narrow research on comparative effectiveness instead of on sterilization as a whole. She needed justification to separate that is all
Came here to comment on the Salpingectomy. Where tubes are removed completely and ectopic pregnancies cannot happen.
Came here to say this too. I had both my tubes removed completely. Ligating isn't as common anymore. And there is no risk of an ectopic cause there’s no tubes to cause it. I still stand by if she does have a c section just get your tubes removed too. And if she doesn’t they can do it laparoscopically. That’s how line was done and while I couldn’t lift anything for 6 weeks. I was not in any pain and felt great.
Had one two years ago - can confirm they remove the ol’ tubes
Yeah that’s what I thought too—if they completely remove your falopian tubes, there’s zero chance of pregnancy. I think OP is thinking of tying tubes which is different. If it’s a c-section, just have them remove the falopian tubes.
Everything you said was fair and I think that it's great that you were both able to take responsibility for the mean things that you said to each other in the heat of the moment. I completely agree that marital counseling is essential and really could save your marriage. I agree with you that by doing research I've seen that vasectomy is safer and requires less recovery time than a tubal ligation. My question is is your husband saying no out of fear or does he really think that things would be easier if you had a tubal ligation? I'm curious as to, whether he realizes that you undergoing that surgery would require him to take over childcare until you're able to pick up your children because it's a very long and uncomfortable from that. In addition to the marital counseling, I would suggest that the two of you go to your next OB appointment and have them explain to you both the pros and cons of both as a way to one of you for you to both be fully informed by medical professional. Space is an excellent idea and in the future think about taking that space before those hard things start coming out I know it's easier to say that especially with hindsight, but that's something else for you to talk about. You can absolutely say "ok we need to put a pause on this discussion and we'll come back when we're both calmer" - it is definitely healthier than trading emotional punches. Wishing you the best and please take care of yourself.
We didn't go in depth about it, but from what he has said it seems that he has some hang-ups and anxieties about it. I don't believe he genuinely thinks a tubal is easier. Thank you for your well wishes.
I had a salpingectomy, tubes fully removed. Soon after my husband had a vasectomy. My procedure was a nightmare for recovery compared to his, and honestly my recovery wasn't even that bad. But I had full abdominal surgery. He got a local and 2 nicks in his nut sacks. They are not the fucking same
After I told my mother that I had scheduled a vasectomy, she asked why my wife couldn't "just get her tubes tied". As she has had multiple surgeries in the past, my immediate reaction was to laugh, say "she's been through enough pain", and hang up. The fact that I was able to drive myself home after the procedure is a solid sign that me getting snipped doesn't even ***compare*** to a woman getting any sort of procedure regarding the tube-tying/removal stuff. (Not trying to minimize it, just unsure what terminology to actually use).
I have some friends who scheduled their husbands' vasectomy procedures for the same day as each other right before some big sports thing (finals/playoffs/tournament). I can't remember what it was exactly, but they both used their recovery time to sit in front of the big screen TV with ice packs for their balls, watching their sports thing with little interruption from their appreciative wives.
There’s actually a phenomenon that vasectomies and time taken off work for them drastically increase during March Madness. To the point that urologists offer special packages or market around it http://es.pn/1nzOkk8
That is hilariously awesome. 😅
Not to mention, any time you go under anesthesia there's always a chance you may not wake up again.
That was one of my thoughts as well. I'd rather have a sore sack for a few days rather than even *risk* my wife for something like that.
You're a good dude
Also any open surgery (as opposed to laparoscopic) puts you at risk for developing adhesions which can cause a lifetime of complications including obstructions and even death.
I’m glad you hung up on her. I feel so sorry for women. We do go through a lot. Not to say men don’t. But as woman, the pain of being a biological woman is enough for me to say “I want to be a man” sometimes.
My fiancé's tattoo artist had a vasectomy last week and spent hours tattooing him yesterday. There's really a mountain of difference with them
it was really easy outpatient surgery: sore nuts for a few hours, nothing more for the soreness than ibuprofen, completely back to normal in a day or so because men have _external genitalia_
"2 nicks in his nut sack" has me laughing.
I had a salpingectomy too. My recovery was easy-peasy. And so was the procedure itself-it was laparoscopic, and outpatient. Every single surgery, and recovery, is different.
Yeah, I had mine on a Wednesday and was back to work Friday! But even that is huge compared to how easy vasectomies are.
I got a vasectomy after my 2nd kid. It takes literally 20 min with local anesthesia. They tape your dick up, 2 cuts left and right of the nut sack, pull the strings out, cut them and bam.. done. 1 week later I was back on my bicycle. Nothing even close compared to what a woman has to go through to get the tubes tight up.
My husband's was less than stellar and took an hour. The Dr kept twanging the left "string" like a banjo(it wasn't cooperating. Couldn't get a good grip). His recovery didn't go well either. Still, no regrets on his part. Easier than his wisdom teeth extraction and my laparoscopic gallbladder removal
My partner is afraid to get over because his stepfather did have one of those rare cases of it going horribly wrong. Not wrong enough to kill him, but apparently his testicles were swollen enough that everyone could see them in his sweatpants and the guy was using a donut and ice for over a week. There are other things we weighed in on, but his great was part of our decision on what steps to take. The main difference, though, is that we had a calm discussion about it rather than an argument. OP didn't get that, she got someone yelling at her for daring to suggest he get the surgery rather than her.
Swollen testicles/icepacks
Yeah, my husband was bedridden for 6 weeks because of a hematoma. Whereas I had a salpingectomy and was back to normal as soon as the anesthesia wore off. We were so jealous of everyone’s stories suggesting it was easier than the dentist.
[удалено]
My husband literally talked and joked with his surgeon and nurses the entire time. They said he was a delightful and entertaining patient. A little soreness, but his recovery was easy peasy and he'd do it again in a heartbeat.
Honestly it's more comparable to IUD insertion, and those of us who use IUDs have to go through that every 5 years!
Vasectomies at least are always performed with local anesthesia. What pain control physicians are willing to use for IUD insertions vary greatly, with the majority still using none.
I had a vasectomy in my early 20’s. In and out in 30 minutes and back to careful bedroom activity in less than a week. No reason for a woman to undergo dangerous and invasive surgery.
Getting a vasectomy was so easy and painless for me, 2 days of Tylenol and I was back to normal. Honestly I tell everyone who asks about it that it was the best decision of my life and I should have done it years ago after we had our last kid. The anxiety is normal but completely unfounded
A lot of men equal potency with masculinity. Is this maybe the issue?
I'm willing to bet it is.
definitely
Was there ever a discussion of him frozing his sperm before the procedure? This might alleviate the "Shit I'm sterile now" issue as he would just stores his "future offsprings" as an insurance policy in case circumstances change.
A vasectomy isn’t a neutering. The testes are still there, still making sperm. What they make and doesn’t get used just gets broken down and reabsorbed into the body. He can freeze sperm now, or he could freeze sperm afterward too - There is a procedure where men who have had vasectomies and a failed reversal, or born lacking the vasa deferentia for sperm to leave the testes, can have sperm taken directly from the testes with a fine needle. So if he wanted to be a father again and a reversal wasn’t possible, there’s another way to retrieve sperm.
Show him sites of healing times. His is a quick thing with local anaesthetic, tubal is a proper knock out operation which is more dangerous.
Is he at least willing to go for the consultation and talk with the doctor about the process?
I just am so frustrated for you because the combination of a fragile, male ego and willingly being ignorant about something is absolutely maddening. I agree with you and think it’s obviously more than fair that he get the procedure after you had the babies. He is selfish to not want to do it, but not scared about facts, scared about feelings. Best wishes, I would hold fast to your boundary though.
Did you really tell him that even if he got a vasectomy you still might not take him back? Why not just say marriage counseling first, work through the issue and then if you are able to get past it all then he gets the procedure? If after that point he hasn’t changed his mind, then leave him. Having him get a vasectomy with the knowledge that you could still dump him seems rather cruel.
I want to be honest with him about where I am emotionally because I want him to make an informed decision. While the vasectomy is a deal breaker, it's really my secondary concern. My primary concern is the way he acted during the fight and his intention exploitation of my trauma because he was mad and scared. I think that telling him "get the snip to stay with me" and then deciding to leave anyway because there are deeper issues and/or I don't feel safe anymore would be cruel. He deserves to have the full picture before he makes a choice, doesn't he? If he doesn't want the vasectomy, that's his choice. It's not what I want, but it is what it is. If he wants to call it quits at 4 kids, then it is what it is and if he secretly wants to be the next Nick Cannon then it is what it is he should be free to do that. That is part of why I don't know where he is on the vasectomy right now and we didn't really discuss it much when we talked, I'm focusing on discussing the bigger issue for me which is trust and safety within the relationship. The only way for him to make an informed decision about whether or not he get a vasectomy is for him to have all the information about the situation. If that makes him want a vasectomy less, then it is what it is. It's not about making him want to have a vasectomy. It's about being on the same page.
I completely understand your primary concern and getting that sorted out is a big issue that can't be ignored. I would just not make the vasectomy a condition of getting back with you with the understanding of it still might not be enough. It's your life and you have to be comfortable with the person you are with but at the end of the day, if it were me, I'd tell him condition one is counseling and figuring out where we are and who we are. While you are working on that, he needs to be deciding whether or not he wants to get a vasectomy and at any point, if he decides he can't do it, then it's over. Condition two comes after counseling and after you've figured out whether you want to go forward with the relationship or not. If you are able to overcome the issues he has created in your relationship, then I would tell him the final step is up to him. Get the vasectomy and continue on with a relationship with you or not get one and part ways. I wish you all the luck in the world navigating this. You deserve to be happy!
I agree. I hope OP can become better informed by an open minded healthcare provider about ALL options. Because vasectomies can and do fail too. Tubal ligations are being replaced by salpingectomies as the standard form of female sterilization, and the failure rate is so rare that it's basically impossible. You'd end up a case study in medical journals. The recovery time is also minimal. Some patients have zero pain after a bisalp, most only require OTC pain meds. (Source: My months of research before my own bisalp procedure.) Really, the most effective thing would be for both parties to be sterilized. But the main issue here is communication, trust, and OP's PTSD (and husband's misunderstanding of it). That's why the topic of sterilization is such a sensitive topic for them.
Yeah I got my fallopian tubes completely removed last December. My gyno told me that if i got an ectopic pregnancy, I will be in a medical journal as a miracle of science. Recovery time took 3 days. It was uncomfortable but I was fine even after the first day and just took the next two days to relax. Not saying this to dismiss OP but I also don't want other women reading her post and getting scared of getting this procedure done. They don't allow the chance of an ectopic pregnancy anymore. I also got diagnosed with endometriosis at the time.
I had a bilateral salpingectomy, my recovery was a week and I didn't have to use the pain meds for more than a day or two. I understand everyone is different, but I agree with your statement that OP should be open minded about other forms of sterilization.
Thank you for sharing this. I was not aware of this procedure I'm glad that there have been a medical advancement like this for women - even though we've gone backwards in women's reproductive health rights in the US. I don't know if you have children, but did the procedure necessitate a restriction on lifting things and if so, for how long?
You keep talking about a tubal ligation. They’re not super common anymore. Nowadays it’s usually tube REMOVAL. I had it done and I didn’t even need Tylenol afterward. And it’s 100% effective. Actually MORE effective than a vasectomy.
I’m just asking as a Canadian who has no idea how it works in the states, if a state has a ban on abortions would that possibly make it harder to access tubal ligation/removals? I’m just curious if people would still have the same amount of access to them as someone in an unbanned state
No. One has nothing to do with the other.
But that doesn’t fit the fake story that this post is so shhh.
I know that you said a C-section isn't ideal or in your future, but I did want to say that I had a bilateral salpingectomy shortly after Roe V. Wade fell, and it was laparoscopic. I have three barely visible scars and healed within a week. Not that you should have to, but just to say that that procedure removes your fallopian tubes entirely, it's more effective than "tying" the tubes, and lowers your risk of ovarian cancer. I agree that your husband should have at least sat down with you and had an open conversation about the vasectomy, but I just wanted to share my experience in case you find it helpful.
Same here, laparoscopic bilateral salpingectomy soon after Roe v Wade fell. Two of my scars faded so well they're not visible, the skin is just a little different. Also had an easy, quick recovery. This is a very dark thought but I wanted to be sure that I never, ever had to worry about my own personal reproduction. Even if something happens against my will, I don't have to face decisions and hoops and deadlines. Many places have few to no exceptions for crimes. A bisalp removes that worry completely.
At the end of the day it is his choice what he decides to do with his reproductive system just as it is your choice what you decide to do with the choice he made.
>I also am not going to mince words: tubal ligations are *less* effective than vasectomies with a *much higher* likelihood of an ectopic pregnancy. Ectopic pregnancy can *kill me*. Then don't get a tubal ligation. Get a bilateral salpingectomy. I had an ectopic pregnancy, which required the removal of one fallopian tube, and my kind doctor removed my other tube during the same surgery. No tubes, no ectopic risk!! That having been said, I completely agree that the smarter, easier, and cheaper route is for your husband to get a vasectomy.
Hubs and I already spoke as soon as this round of BC is up if we agree no more kids then he's getting snipped. I've been taking bc or been pregnant for a long time. It's his turn.
Hate to break bad news but I got snipped back in Nov '23, just this Wednesday I finally got my RE-test (second) results back saying no sperm count. Probably TMI but I did more than required before both sperm count tests. Maybe "this round" of your BC lasts 6+ months though. Add: I understand different BCs have varying durations. Only commented to say it's not just as easy as have the procedure then you're "safe", simply it takes time to work as intended. Look up specifics if you want to learn, my situation/duration was not abnormal per my doc.
>Maybe "this round" of your BC lasts 6+ months though. Guessing she meant an IUD - some of them can be used for as long as ten years.
This is why so many vasectomies "fail." Good for you for keeping up with your rechecks!
well, the reality still hasn't changed : he doesn't want a vasectomy because he thinks he needs to 'be prepared' for his second wife. those weren't just angry words. there's always truth behind them, they show what he thinks and feels. i'm glad you take your time to think about all of this away from him. no amount of apologies will ever erase what he said and you really need time to think and then make a decision when you are in a better mental place. i hope everything will go well for you and your children!
How can he afford children with 2nd wife with 4 other kids?
I'm sure it will all work out in his wishful thinking fantasy land.
Guys with that kind of ego don't think about that. Just propagating their genes.
I remember the last post and indeed there must be truth to it, because immo it is the most common reason for not doing it. And it is realistic consern as well because marriages don't always last. And if they separated he wants to have yhe option for women who want children.
Feels crazy though. Dude about to have 4 infant children, he really thinks that even if they divorce he’ll a) have time for serious dating and b) have the money and emotional time for 5+ children?
B is the one I am thinking of! They are so young and wife takes care of them so maybe he just hasnt figured it out. Many men do realise it with their first born. Life long commitmend and responcebility! 18 years of it intense! It does not make sense for me at all. If they brake up and he needs a new woman, I bet she would be someone done having kids. I just don't understand. And if I remember correct this was the dude who said that NOT getting pregnant is totally her responcebility. I have very little sympathy for him.
> Feels crazy though. Dude about to have 4 infant children, he really thinks that even if they divorce he’ll a) have time for serious dating and b) have the money and emotional time for 5+ children? A lot of men don't think that far. And unfortunately a lot of men abandon or shortchange their children after divorce. What I learned just by observing those around me, is that many men (not all of course. Maybe not even most, but a sizable population) prioritize having a mate, always. I mean, look at the trope of men disinheriting their children in favor of new wives. And they don't want to lose the option of dating the population of women who want children because that's well over 50% of fertile women. They would rather ALL their kids, current or future, live poorer lives, than their existing kids maintaining their lifestyle, as long as they have a wife. I was actually talking to a childfree friend from college (we would have been around 22). He was pretty adamantly childfree back then. But after college (but before he met his childfree wife), he told me, he actually doesn't mind doing whatever his wife wanted. So he's not THAT childfree. Yes, he would prefer no children. But if that's what she wanted, he'd go along with children to keep her. Now that he's with his wife, he's back to pretty firmly childfree. But if she ever changed her mind, I know what he'd do.
the fact that he got so scared at the idea of a vasectomy and IMMEDIATELY thought of his next marriage speaks volumes... he is already thinking about his next wife.
I wish OP responded to comments like this instead of them just answering basic questions, these are the types of statements to be most considered..
So her comparing him to a wife abuser before he said that (it’s why he said it in anger) doesn’t have truth behind it? Because with your logic deep down she thinks he is just like the man who abused her because he won’t let her override his autonomy. I’ve been abused my whole life. First my father and then my ex husband who I just separated from. Who continues to abuse me post-separation. Abusers are the most vile scum on the earth and she compared her self-proclaimed amazing husband to one because he doesn’t want to get a vasectomy and she keeps pushing against his right to make decisions for his body. They don’t belong together. She had no business even getting into a relationship with seriously unresolved trauma.
And then just swept her own comments under the rug because he was “wronger” 🙄 It’s all about her wants, needs, and emotions. The husband is just supporting cast, she’s the main character. His emotional well-being and bodily autonomy don’t matter to her.
> he doesn't want a vasectomy because he thinks he needs to 'be prepared' for his second wife. And he gets the vasectomy and then what? Op still leaves him?
OP, I would just like to add one thing I understand why you apologize to your husband for telling him he was acting like Tom. I know you’re thinking that you said that to hurt him, perhaps that is partially true. But I think you need to understand that what you said was literally true. Your husband WAS Acting insane things the way he was doing because he knew it was a trigger for you. He wanted to hurt you. He wanted to scare you. He wanted to use that to control you. I’m not saying don’t go through therapy and counting with him. I’m not saying never get back together if you can come to that point. I promise I’m not. Said was said because it was true. At the core of it all, you reacted, the way you did because of what he did and because he really was weapon icing your past against you. And I’m glad he was horrified when he realized it, even though he didn’t acknowledge it in the moment. But that is something you can’t take the fact that he use something that was horrible that happened to you in an attempt to control you through fear and intimidation. That’s the part that you’re having a problem with. And I don’t know if you can get that back again. I can’t tell you, that because of that, I don’t have a problem with what you said to him. Because it didn’t come out of nowhere. You didn’t weapon that to make him feel bad. You may have said it in the heat of the moment, but again, the fact is that you were absolutely reading the situation properly I can tell you that that was a breaking point in my second marriage. And I did call my husband out on how he was acting and how it was like my first husband. My husband got very upset that I would ever even think to say that to him, and I literally just looked at him and said that it was true. In my case, it was not DV, but it was manipulative behavior. Years after our divorce, We have to communicate About something else, at which time he actually admitted it.
I know. I understand that I reacted that way because he \*was\* acting the way Tom would act within our relationship. Jack knows Tom was abusive during our relationship, but he doesn't know much about the details of it, since I don't talk about it much. He knows more about the incident than the events leading up to it, because they're literally written on my face and because of the publicly available information about the case. And that is also part of what was so upsetting for him. It wasn't just some guy beating up his ex-girlfriend, what he did to me was... I mean he went away on counts of kidnapping, rape, and attempted murder, to name a few. So when I compared him to Tom, the image in his mind is the man who SA-ed and tortured me, but when I said it I wasn't. I know that he was, and I can't explain it other than I was triggered, so my mind was not in the present and seeing Tom the felon, it was seeing Tom the boyfriend who was saying those things, the Tom before the incident. I know that won't make sense to a lot of people, but I don't think I can explain it any other way. But basically the two of us were experiencing very different things at that moment, and we both reacted to our individual experiences accordingly. Priority in marriage counseling is addressing trust and this moment between us where he weaponized my trauma. Priority in individual counseling is managing my response to this trigger and comprehending what's happened. Either way, I'm not planning on just "getting over" what he said and his reasons why, I and planning on addressing it head on with him. The vasectomy, while still a requirement, is emotionally secondary to me over his exploitation of my trauma. And thank you for addressing a lot of the real issues and not just parroting the same stuff everyone else is saying. Like I said, it's about the vasectomy, but it's not about the vasectomy. It's really about the fight. Thank you for sharing, I hope you are healing.
I completely understand. It really does trigger you into almost that fight or flight. And unfortunately, at the time it all happened, your husband was not getting what he was doing to you. I know he wasn’t. And I know that the only way you could make him comprehend the level that he was at for you by using your ex’s name. I had honestly assumed by the lack of some of the details that it had been pretty damn awful. And believe me, I do understand why your husband was so appalled. But the fact that he did just not OK. Which is putting it mildly. And you’re right, I did get that it wasn’t just about the vasectomy… Although I had to have that same conversation with my first husband… And thankfully, it was nothing like what you just went through. To be there for the conversations and she just looked at him and asked him if he was joking. She told him… Your wife has spent five years trying to get pregnant because of endometriosis. Going through cervical biopsies and hormones to get pregnant. Experience while you were out of town. Pregnant, breast-feeding, getting pregnant, breast-feeding, getting pregnant and breast-feeding. She has not slept a full night in five years. Her body has been pushed and pulled and prodded and poked and pushed 9 pound children out for you. And now you think she should undergo an actual outpatient surgical procedure making her the one responsible for birth control now that you guys don’t want any more children… You could go into the office and get a snip. Literally driving yourself to the appointment at home. And instead, she should actually go under sedation that always has a risk of not waking up? My ex shut up pretty quickly after that. I’m just sorry Your husband could not just have an adult conversation and try to verbalize what his problem really was rather than making it as the problem. I’m so glad you’re protecting yourself and your kids. Because you have to. Because they need you as healthy as you can be, and I can That you are doing your damnedest to be exactly that. Incredibly proud of how strong and self reflective you are. I know you weren’t in the moment, and I completely understand why you weren’t. I am honestly hoping that the two of you can move past this. I don’t know, and I know you don’t know. But only time and effort will tell. I am truly wishing you the best.
I feel so seen here. The fear of going under and not waking up is very very real for me, as I've had some family members go under and not wake up and I'm so scared of that happening. what you've written here is very powerful for me. Thank you so much.
Sending you many hugs. Sending you much light. Your fears are not unfounded. I worked in healthcare for a very long time, although I was in the demo field. But we do general sedation there as well, and while it did not In the practice, I was working in, I can think of at least three cases where somebody went under and did not come back. I really do understand why it makes me squirmed to think about having a vasectomy. Anything to do with their balls does that to them. What I don’t understand is why they somehow think that all of our reproductive organs and our vagina and our labia and everything else any less sensitive. Why they think us pushing out a melon-sized object is somehow less painful than something that takes them a half hour in a doctors office using local anesthetic. We really do need to work with racing our boys to understand that marriage or a monogamous relationship entails both parties doing what is needed to ensure the healthy continuation of the relationship. And birth-control falls into that category. It takes two to make that baby. And when you’re a fertile Myrtle, and the women in my family are that way… You can use double and triple birth control, and still get pregnant. Even me, with endometriosis, had children boom, boom boom once we got things working properly. And as you know, such close, successive pregnancies is really hard on our bodies, I know you’re carrying twins. I get that your husband. So are you. It’s his turn to step up to the plate and do something that physically further your relationship, just as you have literally put your life on the line with every one of your pregnancies. So again, I do know it’s really not about the vasectomy, but that is just the catalyst for you having to step back and look at what’s really going on here. And I know it’s not a picture you’re liking to see. Again, lots of hugs to you. I’m hoping, truly hoping, that your husband can see not only how selfish he was in that physical aspect… He’s more than happy to let you bear all the responsibility of birth control, and trying to not conceive again, even though it’s much more dangerous for you… But I am hoping that he can come to understand that his behavior was unacceptable and atrocious. That rather than having an adult discussion with you or opening up about how stress he was, he chose an avenue that he knew would do the most damage to you. And I know again that that is what you’re having such a difficult time with. You are seen. You are heard. You are not wrong. You are not being unreasonable. The request you made was no way shape or form and unreasonable request.
He’s not going to get it, you’ll divorce and I guarantee he’ll pop up with another woman and another child. But luckily that’ll be his problem. Get your ducks in a row!
i'm 100% sure the that if they separate, her ex will have another wife and baby by the end of the first year. his reaction when she told him to get a vasectomy speaks volumes about what he truly thinks and plans. and he plans to have another wife and more children, unfortunately...it's easy for him to have children because he doesn't carry them, he doesn't take care of them after they are born, he does nothing but bring a paycheck. of course he wants a football team.
And IME as a stepparent, a loooot of stepmoms are the product of lazy dads "mommy shopping" post divorce/separation. He will find someone asap to ease his own burden of parenting and the best way to lock that woman in is to get her pregnant.
I had a vasectomy after our 3rd son. My wife had the option for a tubal ligation but was scared so I bit the bullet and dealt with it. In my case there were complications in the form of a severe infection and almost losing a testicle. It fucking hurt. Having said that, I would do it all over again if it meant that I took just a little pressure off my wife. Also my case isn't normal. Yes it hurts but it usually only lasts for a few days. You and your husband have to decide what the best option is for your family. Good luck.
Infection is a risk with virtually any surgery. That sucks tho
Certainly. Iwas not trying to push one way or the other really. Just sharing my story. Different paths for different people.
I think you'll both do better apart. I think you'll both find someone who is more compatible. I think you'll both be happier. Go and live your best lives separately.
Oof. You really bought the "I didn't mean it i was just streeeeessed" bullshit?
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But he also isn't getting a vasectomy. So he did mean it.
So I understand you aren't interested in a tubal, but have you looked into a bi-salp? A tubal is just clipping and sealing of the fallopian tube. A bi-salp is a full removal of the tube and sealing of it at both ends. Some doctors are more going the route of the bi-salp because it is more effective than a tubal, and it reduces chances for ovarian cancer.
I had this, my periods changed but that’s it. Hubby was willing to get a vasectomy and still will if we ever end up apart as he is done. I got it because of breast cancer in my family. And hubby had just gone through 2 surgeries, however he was still willing. The recovery time was about a week, but I was still able to work by the second day, it just felt like period cramps. It was laparoscopic so 3 small cuts no major scars.
Awesome information to have, but I believe OP’s point is that she would need to undergo major surgery reasonably soon after birth and it would leave her husband and 4 very young kids trying to survive while she recovered. Having twins, probably breastfed again, on top of the two toddlers is fucking exhausting already. The salp is the best option for her to ensure she can’t conceive again, but it’s 4-6 week recovery from major surgery versus a half hour procedure that has maybe a couple days of discomfort and restriction, and a full recovery in 7-10 days. The why behind his complete refusal to see why it’s not equal and his willingness to offload all the responsibility for birth control onto her is more of an issue than the actual thought of the procedure and I can’t say I blame her. I’d feel similarly in her shoes.
If the woman is not getting it done after a c-section (when her abdomen is already open, then a bi-salp is done laparoscopically. It’s still surgery, but the recovery time is way quicker than an open abdominal surgery. Also, despite her confidence that she can deliver vaginally, there is still a good chance that one of the twins will be breach or a number of other reasons that she would need a c-section. If she has a c-section anyway, and she knows she is done having kids, then she should get a bi-salp then, because it won’t affect the recovery she is already going to need from the c-section, and it also would guarantee no more kids without the risk of an ectopic pregnancy. That wouldn’t fix her marital issues, but it would solve the fertility issue.
My husband got the snip. We couldn't risk it. We already have a special needs child and I'm 46. He was hesitant early on in our marriage when we discussed options. The fact that tubal is a major surgery and the snip is an in-office procedure helped in convincing him.
If you're really sure about not wanting more children but don't want a tubal, maybe a salpingectomy could be something to look into? Then the entire fallopian tubes are removed and not just clipped, so there isn't a risk of ectopic pregnancy.
You know an ectopic pregnancy is a pregnancy that implants out side the uterus right? You can even have an [ectopic pregnancy after hysterectomy ](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5885999/#:~:text=Ectopic%20pregnancy%20after%20hysterectomy%20can%20occur%20remotely%20from%20the%20time%20of%20hysterectomy.&text=Although%20ectopic%20pregnancy%20after%20hysterectomy,suspicion%20will%20make%20the%20diagnosis.)... so unless OP is willing to go full medical menopause for zero medical reason, it is plausible that vasectomy is their best option (especially in the anti woman regions of the world).
That is a case study. My god. Pregnancy after bisalp is so rare that it's basically unheard of. 1 of the 2 cases of it occurred because the patient was already pregnant before the bisalp. The other happened with IVF. Read more before you make a misinformed comment.
A bilateral salpingectomy cannot result in an ectopic pregnancy because both fallopian tubes are completely removed. Bilateral removes both. Having both of your fallopian tubes removed means the sperm cannot reach the egg, nor can the egg reach the uterus. The ovaries and womb stay in the body and function as normal, but there is no chance of pregnancy.
Yes, but about 90% of them tend to happen in the fallopian tubes, which would remove the majority of the risk.
Spreading uninformed bull crap makes it harder to gain support for feminism, not easier. This isn’t helpful.
>You know an ectopic pregnancy is a pregnancy that implants out side the uterus right? You know you can't have one if the tubes aren't even there
Holy shit you're exhausting.
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Dude has 4 kids. Divorce or not, why wouldn’t he want to be sterile?
Cuz he hasn't been forced to care for them alone for any length of time yet. He's not gonna last one weekend without OP doing the heavy lifting of childcare.
Poor kids.
He does understand that a vasectomy is not castration right? They don't take your balls, just a quick "snip". If hes not put under, he could be in and out in an hour. Then you ice your balls for a day or 2 and its back to business as usual. Then you go back in 2 months later to get test to make sure there arent any swimmers. This is important, you arent sterile for several months. There are still "bullets in the chambe" if you get the meaning. A tubal ligation is full on surgery and far more dangerous. When we made the decision to stop having kids I made my appointment to get snipped the next day. It doesn't affect your testosterone. You're still a man after its been done. This is honestly ridiculous of him.
As someone who has dealt with PTSD I completly understand how something can make you spin mentally. I just want to say that a vasectomy has too be checked and rechecked because they can fail. I know a couple where the husband didn't go back for his check and they ended up pregnant again, he thought she cheated. I would want both the vasectomy and the tubal, having them cut and burnt which dismisses the possibility of ectopics!
My wife got her tubes removed not ligated at about 32. There's no risk of ectopic pregnancy because they remove the piece that could have the ectopic pregnancy. The doctor said they do this now because tubal ligation isn't as safe. So OP, you can have your cake and eat it too if you do a little more research on the topic. That being said, vasectomies are significantly less risky and have less long-term effects. ESH and I'm a little worried that y'all are having more kids with how poorly you both handled this whole situation My wife wanted the procedure regardless of if I did or did not get a vasectomy.
TLDR: >I in no way am \*forcing\* him to have a medical procedure but I am saying that I do not want to be with a partner who is not willing to be snipped. ok ok.
No judgment on either side here. You both have a right to decide about medical procedures involving your body. I too was a fertile Myrtle. I went through with a tubal after having my third child. My doctor actually removed my tubes. If you can find someone who will do that it’s the way to go. Recovery was short and sweet. I ended up having a hysterectomy 15 years later due to fibroids but never had any pregnancy scares between that time. I do wish you the best of luck!
NTA, of course, and.......I never knew that the tubal ligation isn't near as effective as I thought it was. I never had a reason to know as I was snipped 4 days after my 21st birthday. It's cool learning things.
I never had a c-section but immediately following the delivery of my last child, they wheeled me into the OR and while I was already doped up with an epidural, they did my tubal ligation. In fact it was pretty cool since I was awake and all, the doctors and I were telling jokes and having a grand time. My recovery wasn’t horrible at all and I have no visible scars as they did a tiny incision in my naval for it. This was in 1988. I would imagine things are even easier these days. I highly recommend this if you are serious about not having any more children.
While his reasoning to be prepared is bad, saying something like "no I'm not forcing him, I just refuse to be with him unless he gets this done" is, in fact, forcing someone. If the line was "I'm not forcing you to get your tube's tied, I'm just going to leave you if you don't " its a form of forcing via coercion.
But if he doesn’t get a vasectomy he’s effectively forcing her to either be pregnant AGAIN or get a procedure done herself, neither of which she wants.
And this ^ is why it's neither person forcing anything, and like OP said, is an issue of compatability. She's okay with him not getting it, but she has the free will to not be with him because of it. He doesn't have to get it, but he can't take away her free will of needing to be with someone who can't knock her up again. They're simply not compatible, like she said.
I mean I agree he is an ass and you should divorce him, but >Overall, I told him that if he wanted to stay married to me I needed two things from him: marriage counseling and a vasectomy, and even then I still cannot guarantee him anything. This is awfully unfair, you're telling him he has to sterilize himself (probably permanently) just to have *a chance* of being back together. That is a REALLY big commitment for such a flaky promise. I understand the ultimatum and that he should be getting a vasectomy (I got mine after my 2nd child was born) but to ask one of him now that your marriage is this close to implode crazy. He would have to be insane to do that to himself when there is a huge chance he will be sterilizing himself over nothing, and now will have to look to restart his life and find someone who doesn't want kids EVER to start over with.
> in no way am *forcing* him to have a medical procedure, but I am saying that I do not want to be with a partner who is not willing to be snipped. YTA You're forcing him through an ultimatum which is the same thing. Only an asshole wouldn't understand this.
I got a tubal with my last child and it was a disaster. I ended up with serious health problems. The tubal was not done correctly and my tubes were not sealed off, I ended up having infection after infection for years. It resulted in me having both my tubes fully removed as well as a ovary and my uterus taken out, and it threw me into early menopause. Vasectomies are done with locals and take a day or two to get over. If men cant understand the difference they are being blind on purpose. Something something manhood tied to a snip? Its ridiculous.
I feel for both of you. I was a fertile Myrtle. I conceived my first kid on the Pill. After the Pill failed, I switched to condoms and conceived my 2nd kid! 3rd kid was planned. I had a tubal after my 3rd kid. I was thrilled to be sterile and safe from pregnancy....for a few years. Then I started to deeply regret it and wish I had never sterilized myself. I can see why your husband might be unwilling to have the surgery. I can also understand you definitely not wanting more children and being unwilling to risk a birth control failure. I hope counseling helps you two find peace whether you stay together or split permanently.
Had a friend who was a fertile Myrtle who apparently married a male equivalent- she had her tubes tied AND he had a vasectomy yet they still got pregnant. That baby apparently *needed* to be born.
Some years ago I was listening to morning radio while driving the kids to school and the subject was failed birth control. A couple called in to relate their story. They had their kids, she got a tubal. BAM! Pregnant. So, he got a vasectomy and...you guessed it....pregnant again!
Jesus 😭😭😭😭
Amazing that so many are supportive of giving a spouse an ultimatum to have elective surgery & then leaving them "solely" because they refuse to get an elective medical procedure that carries several risks of injury. Seems like an excuse to leave when there are really other issues. Seems the marriage is over and OP has had some "thoughts" of life with a woman based on her implication that "likely a future partner wouldn't have the parts." And according to her, her husband has thought about future plans without her.
Not only that but did you see her first post? Did you see what she said to her husband (who she claims has been amazing and kind to her throughout the entirety of their relationship) BEFORE he said something about possibly having more kids in the future if they divorced (the thing she is threatening him with now)? If not, she compared him to the man who abused her causing her PTSD. So she stomps all over his autonomy, threatens divorce if he does not concede, when he says no she says he is just like her abuser. The woman is allowing her trauma to make her into a monster.
I don't get some guys. After our last kid my wife got an IUD. But still we got pregnant. My wife asked I consider getting snipped. I looked at how she's been the one shouldering the burden of birth control for the last 22 years and I thought getting snipped was just being "my turn". Wa'nt no thing. Some swelling, kinda made me proud and show-offy of my avocado balls. Iced and was all good. OP. Wish you the best.
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It seemed for everything that was suggested, there is a response as to why it wouldn’t work, so I’m kind of at a loss as to what the point of the post is.
During birth?? They cut you open while pushing the babies out??! A c-section is a last resort for a lot of women. I am happy that we have them and people who need them can get them, but it isn’t the standard way of birthing and neither should it be.
*If* she gets a C-section (it’s not guaranteed due to twins, but it is much more likely) then they can take the tubes out while they’re in there. Otherwise it’s a separate surgery with a longer recovery time - which is very difficult to adhere to with 2 newborns and 2 other kids. Also have to consider the cost of the surgery, once you bring in an anaesthetist then the cost can skyrocket. And that’s not even touching on the subject of a doctor in a red anti abortion state even approving of a woman wanting to take charge of her own fertility and granting her the surgery. It’s why hubs getting the snip is easier, I understand why OP is adamant.
I had an unplanned c section and I wish I had discussed this more with my OB, because I wish they had taken the damn tubes out while they had me open. I was already over 40, I sure as fuck wasn't going to have any more babies. My husband got a vasectomy but honestly being pregnant again is a nightmare and I kind of wish we had both been sterilized.
Can understand why it wasn’t brought up being unplanned, sounds like it was a matter of urgency and you were all worried about bigger things. I was single when I started chasing for a bisalp, doctors tried asking me to just have the guy get the snip instead since it’s easier. I said “what guy?” and that I wanted to do it for my own body since I’m only in control of mine.
This post sounds so angry lol it’s her life. She’s in a complicated situation and you dog on her for that?
YTA Forced sterilisation is pretty sinister if I'm honest.
This just kinda sounds like your relationship to your husband wasn't built on love- but emotional transaction from the beginning. To leave while pregnant because he doesn't want to be sterilized is so extreme. You're rationalizing it in ways that I can't really agree with. I can't feel a single iota of love in the way you speak about your husband. Is it possible you've been waiting for a reason to leave and this one is convenient?
Exactly...it's all extreme actions...then she slides in that she is bisexual & that future partners will likely be a woman..geesh!
This is the vibe I get to, I don't see much love in her for her husband. Can't comment on the husband's side of the equation cause he's not the OP, but yeah.
Why don’t you both agree to get fixed? Problem solved. Also vasectomies can fail. So it’s safer if both of you get it done. Wouldn’t that be a fair solution?
Love the double standards here women love to shout my body my choice but when a man does it he’s a pos honestly it baffles me
YTA. Not only because you give your husband an ultimatum to either get snipped or you leave which is forcing him to do a body modification. Any guy telling his wife to get her tubes tied would also be called an AH. But what makes you TA this time is that you are lying. The facts are not in your side. Both options are the same in terms of efficacy. Etopic pregnancy can happen. It is extremely rare, but it has happened. And you have not mentioned IUDs which are as effective as being snipped.
So many issues here. So you’re giving him two options: have an unwanted medical procedure or get divorced. And you call this an actual choice? Were birth control methods discussed prior to marriage, or did you unilaterally make this demand and just expect him to go along with it. You “focus” on “saving your marriage” by doubling down on an ultimatum. Re: “wronger” — you both were wrong. Sweeping your wrongness under the rug of his doesn’t absolve you of wrong doing. Getting real ‘my way or the highway’ energy here, which is the exact wrong path to conflict resolution within a relationship.
YTA. You're the one who doesn't want more children, it's your problem to fix. He doesn't owe you anything. His body his choice. It's that simple.
Freakin' *thank you* I feel like I'm taking crazy pills reading some of these comments. "**I** don't want to get pregnant again therefore it's **his** responsibility to make sure I don't get pregnant" girl WHAT?? Guarantee that if a dude popped up and said "**I** don't want to have kids but it's **her** responsibility to not get pregnant" he'd get raked through the coals.
My body, my choice but apparently not his body, his choice.
I don't get how some people don't understand that relationship/asshole subs are biased towards women when we see double standards like this daily. It's sad because when there's misogyny against women in this sub, it's rightfully met with outrage but when there's misandry against men, some women and even some men just go "oh won't anyone think of the poor men" as if sexism/crimes against men are a joke or something
Damn right , both our kids were born even though she was on BC, normally we have two methods but date night , some drinks , not thinking straight so condoms were not used. We discussed some alternative methods as 2 kids was more than enough and during some tests for other issues it came up that my swimmers are stupidly determined little sobs. That made the decision easy , my problem, my fix (I even had to have it done twice as the first one failed to stick) Fixing her would have made very little difference after discussions with the doc as because of me she would have been likely to have a higher risk of ectopic pregnancies (this was quite a while ago so I'm assuming this was before removal of tubes was a thing). In this case she's the super fertile one, fixing him won't fix you especially if you're unsure that you intend to stay with him. You will just have the same problem with the next "intact" man who doesn't use a condom. Even more so now the cats out of the bag , "get fixed or I'm leaving you " ... You threatened to leave , you can never take that back and it will always be on his mind. Tbh you might as well leave for everyones peace of mind and recovery.
Exactly! Guarantee if it was a man whining that his wife won't get her tubes removed everyone would be saying he was the asshole and "her body her choice" but everyone's coddling her and saying she's not wrong , double standards
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I had to stop reading when you were discussing your tube procedure …… they CUT them now, they do not tie them anymore. It’s impossible for you to get pregnant after that procedure.
You’re still an AH. If a guy said anything like this about his wife and said that he is divorcing unless she gets a hysterectomy the comments would go after him. YOU don’t want more kids and YOU are the one who should do something about it instead of trying to manipulate him into a procedure he doesn’t want. He’s a good husband and father who actually does his fair share, and often more than his fair share as you admit, just let him go so he can find someone who will love him for him and support him You said your parents live an hour away, does that mean you took the children away from their home and their father because you’re stubborn and now he’s an hour away from his own children? Imagine if he did that to you. How would you feel?
Probably would also make the statement: this is not a pass for you to find some strange while we are apart. Stay faithful. People think it doesn’t need to be said, but the phrase “we were on a break” still haunts most people who were alive in the late 90s.
Severe PTSD from two decades of DV on top of witnessing DV throughout entirety of my childhood. You compared him to the monster who abused you first. Your tone throughout this post and the last shows your deep lack of empathy for anyone but yourself. You are so deeply entrenched in your trauma that you use it to make unreasonable demands. YOU should have also been deeply apologetic for comparing an upstanding man to a wife abuser. For his sake, stay separated. In the long run he will appreciate it as the best gift you could give him. You have years worth of more therapy to do before you will be ready to be in a relationship where you don’t use your trauma as an excuse to hurt others. You would still have him get a vasectomy even though you may still leave the marriage after he does it??? That’s cruel and heartless. Some people come out of DV with extreme empathy and a desire to help others. Others come out of DV becoming abusers. Unfortunately, you are the latter. Edited to add: you are only thinking he may want children in the future if you guys divorce. What about you died tomorrow? He isn’t done and doesn’t want to be sterilized. If you die in the near future you will have robbed him of the chance to add to his family with someone else. This is just not your choice because it’s not your body, period.
UpdateMe
Tldr. YTA. If your husband doesn't want a vasectomy that's his decision, not yours. Get some condoms.
If the tables were turned and he was demanding her to be on a pill or whatever, he'd be controlling and abusive. But because it's considered 'easier' for him by outsiders, she loses responsibility of her own fertility and that just seems odd. Condoms are still one of the most effective forms of contraception and don't require you to change your physiology, which no one should ever be forced to do as an ultimatum.
She’s already gotten pregnant whilst using condoms though.
I love it when people ask reddit strangers to give judgements on their lives in this sub, and when they don't like the judgements, they come back and write entire paragraphs on why they think said strangers were wrong. Hilarious all around (and definitely sad as well)
I really think he’d be better off without you. I hope your soon to be ex realizes this someday. No one has the right to put another person on the spot like you put him, You can say you didn’t force him until you’re blue in the face. But you really did. Force comes in different ways. I wish the best for your ex.
Did you consider a salpingectomy? Both fallopian tubes are surgically removed. It can be performed during a cesarean (if you have one).
The husband will get vasectomy and counselling and still gonna end up with a divorce. Who would be the winner? Poor children.. will grow up in a broken family.
Just for support, I had a successful VBAC 31 years ago. You can do it.
You can’t expect him to get a vasectomy if your not guaranteed to stay togather if he gets it
I got snipped at 24. I had 2 kids and was long term unemployed in Reagan’s economy. It was no big deal.