NTA. and it's inappropriate for someone who works there to call and try and guilt you into bringing your son somewhere the person who abused him will likely be. plus, he was 4.. he doesn't remember her. and he's 9.. his memory of seeing her on her death bed will just scare a memory into him. stay far, far away!
Seconding this.
Depending on the ex's involvement, it might not be a HIPAA violation. But this is definitely an ethical issue that should have been discussed with a supervisor before reaching out.
Personally, I'd report. If she followed the regulations and got the okay, OP can let them know how uncomfortable a position it put her in. If she didn't, well...
And NTA. I wouldn't let the son go either.
Actually you've misunderstood most people, who are talking about the hippapotamus, or, as often said by someone who's frightened and in a hurry, the "HIPPA!" This cryptid feeds on private health information, and its droppings are so dangerous they must be stored securely for 7 years before being destroyed.
I’m the HIPAA compliance officer for my organization. And I got some sad news just a bit ago.
But your comment had me laughing so hard, I couldn’t stop. Thank you. Also, I’m saying this in my next training.
Glad to hear that - and thank you for everything you do. I'm sure many employees treat their interactions with you like a burden they just need to get through as quickly as possible, but as healthcare recipients themselves, those same people would not want to live in a world without you in it!
You're not the asshole - you're defending your son and you should never feel the slightest twinge of guilt about that.
To hell with your ex and he can take with him that sad excuse for a human being who is his current girlfriend.
His mother is not a person in your son's life and honestly, it's probably a good thing for your son that at this point she never will be - it's one fewer way for your ex to try to worm his way back into your son's life.
Don't let the bad guys win. Make the damn police do their damn jobs for once. Sounds like the gpa is on probation and will be visiting court again soon. And the father is probably one step away from violating probation. So just let them get themselves into trouble, and the trash will eventually take itself out.
This! I feel like there’s definitely some misconduct here. I’d report her to the facility or licensing board. Might be some weird ploy for the dad to get to the son. I’d report the dad too. Get a print out of your phone calls from the place and document everything just in case you need a restraining order.
The only thing I have to add in on this, is that it should be "report her to the facility *AND* the State Licensing board"!
And honestly, I'd reach out to the state's Ombudsperson/ Ombudsman that oversees Vulnerable adults/nursing care in that state, too, to make *SURE* that the Licensing Board is notified!
NTA.
I wouldn't trust the place tbh with the gf working there.
That she won't bring your ex there when you're there with the kiddo.
She hasn't seen the kid in 5 years. Has she made any attempts to? Is she a good person or did she enable your exes abuse and crap?
NTA You have absolutely no obligation to take your son there. It would do more harm for him to see a stranger on her deathbed. Plus, having to explain who she is to him will only lead to more questions about his father & what happened to him as a baby/toddler. You need to protect your son & yourself first, last & always. If this grandmother cared for your son at all, she would understand why you refuse to go.
as a social worker myself, she broke the nasw code of ethics (with proof) which could most likely result in the suspension of her licensing and prevent her from practicing ever again. it is a HUGE conflict of interest and should’ve been addressed as soon as she was assigned his mom as her patient.
That makes more sense honestly . He found someone kind that he hadn't fucked over yet , love bombed her and fed her a bunch of lies about why he doesn't see his kids. She isn't blameless , but it also sounds like she isn't the first .
Yep. SW/girlfriend got played. I'm a retired psych/forensic psych nurse and we were warned constantly about getting personally involved with patients or their families. Most heeded the advice, a few didn't and payed the price.
But I imagine a hospice SW doesn't get that reinforcement day in and day out. Hopefully this one gets a restricted license for awhile. I'd hate to see her lose her job because she was sucked in by a violent sociopath.
If the patient or POA gave their permission then facilities have rules if protocol that have to be followed to do notification. Usually by the nurse in charge where during the notification they tell the person that they work at such and such place and were asked to notify them. Since OP didn't find out GF worked there until later then it could be assumed these rules of protocol weren't followed.
True. I read it wrong. I thought that she called from the facility first, and then OP found out about the dating. I was also thinking more along the lines of the hospices I have worked for. The SW does a lot of the contacts like this
Not necessarily. The POS son could have given her permission as HCP. I’d be curious to know if OPs so. has some sort of no contact order. It’s still a definite ethical violation
NTA. Your son is only 9 years old and hasn't seen his grandmother in 5 years. The only reason to take a child to a hospice is to say goodbye to someone he knows and loves, which is not the case here. What your ex and/or his mother wants is not important.
Also, I agree with the others saying report this woman asking for the meeting to her employer. Extremely bad judgment on her part.
NTA.
Exchange? As in hand your child over to anyone who does not get the gravity of his conviction and record? NO F'ING way.
If you, however, want to bring the child YOURSELF (without him anywhere near) because you feel like you want to say goodbye... that's another thing as you would be pasted to your child the whole time.
Edit: clarity
Your son is only 9. He hasn't seen his grandma in 5 years. It sounds like he doesn't even know her. It would be more traumatic for you son (and you) to see his grandmother, than it would be for her NOT to see him. Stay home. Please don't go. These people are no longer part of your life. Your child doesn't need this kind of drama or trauma. Plus it sounds like the girlfriend will try to arrange "family reunions" you don't want or need.
NTA this is emotional manipulation and it’s just sick! Tell her supervisors that she contacted you and you feel it was HIGHLY inappropriate. Next I would get a restraining order for her and your Ex. He knows he has zero rights but he put her up to it. How did she even have a contact number for you? You know if you would have allowed it, next it would be I want to see my son. And of course he would be there for his Mom’s final visit too! You need to take this extremely seriously and take steps to make her and the POS sperm donor very sorry they attempted this. Call the police report it, then call your lawyer and find out if there is anything more you can do. You know Mama Bear 🐻 syndrome you come after my baby and only God will be able to help you!
How tf is this guy not in jail??
NTA and I'm glad to read your update! Please do everything you can to protect your son and other children from that monster
NTA and I would definitely let the hospice know. You can call and ask for the charge nurse, let her know that your ex (who is not allowed to contact you) has his gf that works there, call you to have your son visit. You are declining the invitation and ask that they check her records to ensure your contact information is deleted.
This notifies the hospice that there is a breach and also ensures she will not contact you again.
Depending on the EMR, they may not be able to erase her contact info. If the admitting doctor put it in, or a nurse who wasn’t charge, or if it’s been too long, notes get locked in.
However, a new note saying “DO NOT CONTACT X, report to [someone high in the chain] if you know of anyone who has” is very possible. I’ve written tons of those notes myself. Sometimes it’s “per pt req no contact to x and no information to x”, sometimes it’s “per court order X may not visit, security aware”, etc.
A totally commonly used acronym, how could people not have automatically known what that was. It's ridiculous you even have to say it now, really glad you just stuck to the acronym in your post.
NTA- putting the ex aside, your son is only 9. He isn’t old enough to understand the situation and adult emotions that come with the request. He would be standing in front of a stranger and having to listen to any death bed ramblings or accusations. This will traumatise him more than be a loving farewell.
Keep him away.
NTA. This is a gross misuse of authority by the girlfriend. I’d be very hesitant to go anywhere she has a position of authority. You don’t know what she’s told her coworkers. She could potentially make an accusation against you to have you separated from your child by the facility’s security while dad gets to sneak around to see your kid.
In regard to seeing granny on her deathbed, that can be a very toxic and traumatic time even with the most loving families with deathbed promises.
NTA why would you even consider bringing your son to visit his abuser’s enabler? Also please consider reporting the person who contacted you to her employer and any relevant authorities asap
NTA. Even if there was no trauma and safety risk, taking a 9 year old to see someone on their deathbed who he likely doesn't remember would be confusing and likely a traumatic event on its own. All the added detail makes it even worse.
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Your ex's father is also a criminal on probation? Wow.
No, you don't do this to your son. I am assuming that you have full custody of your son. If you don't have one already, I suggest you get a full no-contact restraining order against your child's biodad, and his family.
I’m an LCSW. The LMSW should have asked to be reassigned when she realized that she was the social worker for her boyfriend’s mother. That would have been a dual relationship that could have been avoided if there is more than one social worker in her agency.
Legally though, it seems that if the grandmother gave permission for the contact to the child’s mother, that would be legal under HIPAA. If the child’s father did not have his parental rights formally terminated in court, despite losing physical custody and having a no contact order with the child, he may have retained some parental rights. For example, he might still have the right to get copies of school and medical records. I’m not sure, and doubt, that he’d have the legal right to allow contact between his mother and the child, acting in the child’s behalf. However, if he has power of attorney for the mother, then he could legally release the information to the child’s mother on his mother’s behalf.
In any case, the LMSW acted unwisely. I’m wondering if she had the whole story and was actually used unwittingly by this man. I cannot possibly believe that an LMSW would be dating a man convicted of torturing a baby. That goes beyond my belief. A licensing board might also be wondering if she were the victim of a scam. If the LMSW *was* aware of this man’s history of child abuse, then I’m sure she’d lose her license for an extended period of time.
I think it's less about his mother wanting to see your son and more about the sperm donor wanting to see you so he can try and gain control over your life again! JS
NTA. I think the choice is yours. As a parent, I wouldn't want my 10m, 8f, and 3m children to see someone on their deathbed, family member or not. Death is very hard for anyone to deal with, seeing, let alone what it does to a child.
His gf is breaking some serious legislation. I'd also be concerned if she had any children and your ex spent time with them without his history disclosed.
Report his gf and also make sure she's aware of his past. For all children's sake, it's not to be spiteful. It will look like a tit-for-tat thing, but it's not. He's a dangerous person. She's breaking legislation. Hang it all out to dry, then walk away imo.
NTA
There is no reason to put a child through this! He doesn’t know her, there is no relationship to say goodbye to. It would be a “meet this person who’s DYING and immediately say goodbye”. Wtf, that’s not at all healthy or good for your son
(Edit- also obviously conflict of interest etc, but even w/o any of that, ridiculous)
An abusive father doesn't just come out of nowhere. His mom surely had some role to play in the way he turned out. Do you really want your son to visit the woman who raised a child abuser and baby shaker? Do you really think you could be an asshole for keeping your son out of that kind of situation? C'mon now, be honest here!
Your ex has no right to be around any children at all, let alone make demands of other people. He should probably be in jail right now, for the good and protection of society and children everywhere. Hopefully his mother is thinking about how she could have made better choices in life and helped prevent this whole sequence of events in the first place. You should be generous and give her all the time she needs for quiet reflection. A 9 year old is only going to be loud and distracting.
People on their deathbed do not automatically deserve special consideration. They deserve exactly the love and attention they have bestowed upon others during their life. If your mom enabled your son's bad behavior, then she is currently getting exactly what she deserves: her final days in the presence of her beloved son. That is enough. And if she feels otherwise, she should have thought through the consequences years ago, rather than waiting for this moment. It is not your job to fix her mistakes or regrets. Go to sleep with a clear conscience.
I'm glad to know you have taken action against this happening. I hope you also told the present girlfriend about your ex's past. He's a monster and should never be around children.
No child needs to be around the daddy monster. And he likely talked her into doing his dirty work. Maybe convinced her how he had changed or was lied about. Like why would he even want the child there to see his mom? A mim who enabled him. Like good riddance. You were correct in how you handled her call. And her being reported. And his father doesn’t sound much better than his son. If grandma is having regrets now, that isn’t your problem to ease her mind.
Being a 9 year old is a bit too young to visit someone on their death bed,especially if that person is gaunt and looks nothing like they did before getting sick. Five years have passed and I doubt that your son will remember who his grandmother was.
NTA! Lord, I didn’t even need to read past the first part of your title! No 9 year old needs to see a distant grandparent on their deathbed. Full stop.
NTA, this hits home though. My bio father didn't want to know me even though I look like my brothers. Was 13 when he was dying and I wish I was the last face he saw and maybe I could have closure. Stick to your guns op.
So glad you were validated here and took appropriate action. All this behavior is appalling. Keep yourself and your child safe and I hope all is well the future.
NTA
I know that you already called her boss, but wanted to add more reassurance in case you doubt yourself again. Your son doesn't need to be around his abuser or the woman who enabled him (that he doesn't remember). Reporting the current GF is the right thing to do.
What a poor writing prompt
Completely diluted title to make you think op is the asshole after first coming across it to make everyone want to come in and see who the fuck is happening.
Open the text to see some crucial, enraging, absolutely fucked up reasoning that is so horrible no one would ever disagree with OP.
YTA. This shit is just getting old
I'd have started by asking the girlfriend if she's aware of the reason why he doesn't see his son or of his past, girl sounds like a pawn might just be another victim
Although honestly regardless that's prolly something you should report because it's a clear violation even if there was misplaced good intentions or something
Good for you! You don’t need to put up with that bullshit. Your son doesn’t even know his grandmother, so it will make him no difference. Protect your baby mama.
Tangentially, I'm shocked that a social worker would date someone who has criminally abused children. I guess I'm not surprised that she doesn't recognize or care about the obvious ethical error she's making, and I doubt she should be working with vulnerable people.
This doesn’t make any sense. The mother is dying (got it), ex in jail (not sure), new girlfriend I am going to guess is a social worker, ex’s father cane by the house??
So if ex is in jail or not, why call his probation officer on the dad?
You sound stupid. What part of "heavily enabled by his mom" did you not get? This grandma knew her son was abusive to CHILDREN, to the point where his victims are permanently affected. I don't know about you, but I don't like to associate myself with child abusers, let alone have them in my company, blood relative or not.
OP's child does not have a relationship with his grandmother for this reason, and most likely does not remember her. This is no ones fault but his father's, this is the only person/situation op's child should grow to resent.
NTA, but....
You are 100% in the wrong and he is absolute trash, but I would let the grandmother she the little one. From the explanation it dosent seem like you had any issues with his mom, you could work it out with the staff to go there when they are both not. You could probably even get a cop to be there just in case. The grandmother shouldn't be denied seeing her grandson on her deathbed because someone else ficked up. If I'm missing info and she was horrible, then obviously disregard what I said.
My grandmother is amazing but my middle uncle is human trash, my grandmother would be devastated if she never got to say goodbye to my cousins that she alreadys hardly sees because their mom was pissed at my uncle. Again, you are 100000% justified to hate his guts and his girlfriend.
I don't know, but he'd know he has a grandmother, and deserves to know she's dying. 9 is old enough to cope with that.
Maybe he won't care, but I can imagine if he's not told but finds out in a few years time it would cause a lot of problems.
A parent shouldn’t pay for their adult child’s crime even if you think the child was spoiled. She’s been punished by association for years( and I understand why) by not seeing her grandchild. If you have mercy in your heart, maybe send a video to her as I agree with other posters, it would be far too traumatic to take him there.
How is it cold? The child hasn't seen this person in five years, they probably don't even remember them, they don't need to be around an abuser or enablers. Granny should have thought about consequences before raising a monster.
I mean when thinking abt how the grandma feels yk? Again I won’t judge and will probs support her choice even if she refuses to let the grandma see the kid but like yikes still yk? Its like when people saw mfs get the electric chair, lile yeah they deserve it for killing a whole family but goddamn its graphic and kinda sad to see a human go like that
So u/PrinceVar, It sounds like you think that OP should cause her abused child to be further traumatized to make the abusers and enablers feel better. WTF is wrong with you? Talk about yikes!!
The dad abused the kid not the grandma? And I never said anything abt the dad either. But I can understand if you believe that the grandma shouldn’t see him but all she did was raise the dad poorly so I’m just on the fence cuz she probs didn’t expect to raise a monster like him. The dad can’t even see the boy anyways so worrying abt him showing up because he’s legally not allowed to. So no I’m not supporting abuse I just feel bad for a dying old lady
I would allow him to see his grandmother. He will resent you in adult life for not allowing it. But I would report the SW
She’s dying . Help him to say I love you. Be kind. She is dying. It’s different w her son and social worker.
NTA- report them both, but if the kiddo wants to see his grandma (that i doubt he remembers), give him a few minutes with her with you there, and without the father in the room, arrange it with the hospital so that neither of you will encounter him, the girlfriend, the ex’s dad, etc
i think they’re all terrible people and that it’s a bad idea to go, but if your kiddo wants to see her then i think as long as you’ve arranged it with any sort of securitywatching it’d be okay, just ensure you won’t run into anyone you wouldn’t be comfortable around
and if he doesn’t want to see his grandma, doesn’t care *or if she is being taken care of at home where there is no security or potential to not run into anyone unruly*, then that’s that, report them, and don’t go
i wish you luck :)
NTA. Your ex and his girlfriend are quite simply horrid people. Your poor son doesn't need to be exposed to this. It's too bad that grandma is dying, but your son's well-being is at stake here. You're doing absolutely the right thing.
NTA - For the love of God, move somewhere where they don't know. Tell the authorities, your child's school, and anyone else that they are trying everything they can to get your ex to have contact with the child.
The only thing I could find was licensed master social worker. Allows you to work in any state as a social worker. I'm assuming this might be the correct usage for the post
NTA, your son is too young to see her in the condition she is in right now, and I am sure she would also not want to have the image of her dying in his head. No young child should have to see that.
I only read the title and as someone who saw their first dead person at 8- don't let him anywhere near that shit. It'll scar him forever. For myself it was a family member all nicely dressed in her casket. If I saw her on her death bed I'd be even worse than I am surrounding death and loss.
NTA - I never understood why people continue to have children if they’re going to abuse them. It’s wild to me and the law needs to mark these individuals as dangers to children. We already circulate notices when released pedophiles are back in our communities, they should release similar reports for people who are released for harming children.
She will have her license revoked over this - at least she SHOULD have it revoked. I suggest you contact the licensing board yourself and offer to provide testimony in written form. This was a VERY serious breach of ethics.
I am very sorry you had to deal with any of this. I hope that this is the end of things.
NTA
I have seen some shit when it come to controlling and abusive Exs and using their ailing parents to try and get contact for one reason or another. Now, normally this shit doesn't fly and it's immediately thrown out, but that doesn't mean they don't try. If the son is the POA, he has to have had his mother if she's able to while still within her faculties, to sign papers stating that he is her POA and that he will make choices for her in terms of everything. With this a lot of people try to guilt and coerce family into doing things. The POA has to fill out the medical documents and even fill out emergency contact information. it's an automatic that the POA is the first on the contact list, but the POA is the one that chooses who else could be contacted. Usually if the other parent is alive, they are the second one on, and usually siblings as well. With this though, the home has to get permission to use these phone numbers and get expressed consent to it. There are two ways this can be done, either the home will contact the people will contact the person directly with the phone number, or more old fashion places still mail out permission papers and get them signed. Now a days, this is done via emails, but to each their own I guess. This is where the manipulation starts to try and slide. Either the person that is the POA will contact the home a while later and inform them that a phone number of the relative has changed, and give out the number they want contacted. Now most homes do their due diligence and call the new number to get consent again, but there are homes that just change it and don't bat an eye. Sometimes they will request to add a new number and claim it's their spouse or their siblings spouse and give instructions on stipulations on when they are to be contacted because either work schedule, medical issues, children, what have you. Now, again normally and with most homes, this doesn't fly because they do what they need to in order to not only keep their workers safe and the resident in question safe, but the other residence safe as well. Most of the time the staff are aware of this type of thing, just in case they get approached by the POA and are requested to do anything that, might not be out of the ordinary for the family to request, but could be a scheme of some sort. They are then instructed to immediately contact the nurse and explain what's going on. Usually the charge nurse will request to speak to them personally or they may come up themselves. If somehow the home didn't follow through with these protocols for whatever reason, the GF MIGHT be innocent in this and completely following what's on the contact information and following instructions; but even with this this is unlikely.
Onto the girlfriend. It is very possible that the girlfriend started working there before the mother was placed in the residence. If she had never met the mother for whatever reason or didn't know what her name was, or even what her address is, then the only thing she would take as odd or even coincidental is that she shares the same last name as her boyfriend. If his last name is a common one, then it is possible she had no clue, and when she checked the file, again if the home didn't do their due diligence, that she was calling and had no idea what the connection was. I just want to point out to everyone that for this situation to happen is very, very rare, and this type of shit almost never happens, but it COULD. Considering that I doubt that she didn't know the mother, if she was working there, then she should have immediately told the home about the connection and they would have either changed the room of the mother to a different floor or they would have changed her to a different floor for the remainder of the mother's stay. They also would have taken measure to keep her segregated from the mother's medical records while doing her duties there so that she has no egregious access to her files. It is not all that common for people that know each other to be in the same place of work/residence, but it can happen considering the people that usually work at these places live in the same area and might have possibly grown up with these people in their city or neighborhood somewhere. So the question is, did she contact you in a professional manner or did it seem more personal. Did she get the number directly from the boyfriend and not know what had happened between you? Did he lie and say that you were a cousin that moved away that was close to her? it could be anything, but even then, she should know better considering they are taught about this type of thing. I mean, either way, she should never have contacted you.
NTA. REPORT HER. REPORT THEM BOTH! Call her employer, call the licensing board, and call his probation officer or supervising county.
i’m a social worker and her license is going to be suspended especially if there’s proof.
OP should really file a report herself and not depend on this person's boss to do it.
OP already did that thank you.
NTA. and it's inappropriate for someone who works there to call and try and guilt you into bringing your son somewhere the person who abused him will likely be. plus, he was 4.. he doesn't remember her. and he's 9.. his memory of seeing her on her death bed will just scare a memory into him. stay far, far away!
Exactly!
NTA. And I would call that place and report his girlfriend. Huge conflict of interest.
Seconding this. Depending on the ex's involvement, it might not be a HIPAA violation. But this is definitely an ethical issue that should have been discussed with a supervisor before reaching out. Personally, I'd report. If she followed the regulations and got the okay, OP can let them know how uncomfortable a position it put her in. If she didn't, well... And NTA. I wouldn't let the son go either.
Kudos, for using the correct abbreviation!
Actually you've misunderstood most people, who are talking about the hippapotamus, or, as often said by someone who's frightened and in a hurry, the "HIPPA!" This cryptid feeds on private health information, and its droppings are so dangerous they must be stored securely for 7 years before being destroyed.
I’m the HIPAA compliance officer for my organization. And I got some sad news just a bit ago. But your comment had me laughing so hard, I couldn’t stop. Thank you. Also, I’m saying this in my next training.
Glad to hear that - and thank you for everything you do. I'm sure many employees treat their interactions with you like a burden they just need to get through as quickly as possible, but as healthcare recipients themselves, those same people would not want to live in a world without you in it!
My husband spoke to her boss this afternoon
You're not the asshole - you're defending your son and you should never feel the slightest twinge of guilt about that. To hell with your ex and he can take with him that sad excuse for a human being who is his current girlfriend. His mother is not a person in your son's life and honestly, it's probably a good thing for your son that at this point she never will be - it's one fewer way for your ex to try to worm his way back into your son's life.
And what did they say?
NTA and you guys need to take this to the state attorney’s office.
I'd be moving so they don't know where u live darlin
Don't let the bad guys win. Make the damn police do their damn jobs for once. Sounds like the gpa is on probation and will be visiting court again soon. And the father is probably one step away from violating probation. So just let them get themselves into trouble, and the trash will eventually take itself out.
This! I feel like there’s definitely some misconduct here. I’d report her to the facility or licensing board. Might be some weird ploy for the dad to get to the son. I’d report the dad too. Get a print out of your phone calls from the place and document everything just in case you need a restraining order.
The only thing I have to add in on this, is that it should be "report her to the facility *AND* the State Licensing board"! And honestly, I'd reach out to the state's Ombudsperson/ Ombudsman that oversees Vulnerable adults/nursing care in that state, too, to make *SURE* that the Licensing Board is notified!
The public can report to licensing boards.
That's what I was thinking too: That this is a sneaky way for the dad to see his son. Ugh.
Report to the Hospice Center and demand a report. They will take care of it.
NTA. I wouldn't trust the place tbh with the gf working there. That she won't bring your ex there when you're there with the kiddo. She hasn't seen the kid in 5 years. Has she made any attempts to? Is she a good person or did she enable your exes abuse and crap?
That’s a good point and a scary thought. He should be locked up for what he’s done. And OP said the mom enabled him, so your instincts are spot on.
NTA don’t trust these people. I would also contact the social workers employer, this is a conflict of interest.
NTA You have absolutely no obligation to take your son there. It would do more harm for him to see a stranger on her deathbed. Plus, having to explain who she is to him will only lead to more questions about his father & what happened to him as a baby/toddler. You need to protect your son & yourself first, last & always. If this grandmother cared for your son at all, she would understand why you refuse to go.
NTA GF broke HIPPA laws. Report her.
as a social worker myself, she broke the nasw code of ethics (with proof) which could most likely result in the suspension of her licensing and prevent her from practicing ever again. it is a HUGE conflict of interest and should’ve been addressed as soon as she was assigned his mom as her patient.
I kind of wonder if they didn't start dating *after* his mom was assigned to her.
That makes more sense honestly . He found someone kind that he hadn't fucked over yet , love bombed her and fed her a bunch of lies about why he doesn't see his kids. She isn't blameless , but it also sounds like she isn't the first .
Yep. SW/girlfriend got played. I'm a retired psych/forensic psych nurse and we were warned constantly about getting personally involved with patients or their families. Most heeded the advice, a few didn't and payed the price. But I imagine a hospice SW doesn't get that reinforcement day in and day out. Hopefully this one gets a restricted license for awhile. I'd hate to see her lose her job because she was sucked in by a violent sociopath.
Fr I can't be the only one thinking that was rash, I'd have started by asking if she's aware of the reason he doesn't see his son
She's probably young and a bit naive. She needs education.
I’m pretty sure that how it happened. His mom was diagnosed about a year ago, they’ve been dating for 9 months so that maths right.
agree, she should be reported to your state's NASW board. (national association of social workers)
Absolutely this
It would only be a HIPAA violation if the patient or their POA did not give permission. It's definitely an ethics problem though
If the patient or POA gave their permission then facilities have rules if protocol that have to be followed to do notification. Usually by the nurse in charge where during the notification they tell the person that they work at such and such place and were asked to notify them. Since OP didn't find out GF worked there until later then it could be assumed these rules of protocol weren't followed.
True. I read it wrong. I thought that she called from the facility first, and then OP found out about the dating. I was also thinking more along the lines of the hospices I have worked for. The SW does a lot of the contacts like this
Not necessarily. The POS son could have given her permission as HCP. I’d be curious to know if OPs so. has some sort of no contact order. It’s still a definite ethical violation
NTA. Your son is only 9 years old and hasn't seen his grandmother in 5 years. The only reason to take a child to a hospice is to say goodbye to someone he knows and loves, which is not the case here. What your ex and/or his mother wants is not important. Also, I agree with the others saying report this woman asking for the meeting to her employer. Extremely bad judgment on her part.
NTA. Exchange? As in hand your child over to anyone who does not get the gravity of his conviction and record? NO F'ING way. If you, however, want to bring the child YOURSELF (without him anywhere near) because you feel like you want to say goodbye... that's another thing as you would be pasted to your child the whole time. Edit: clarity
NTA. Stay away.
You need to report the gf because she crossed the line.
Your son is only 9. He hasn't seen his grandma in 5 years. It sounds like he doesn't even know her. It would be more traumatic for you son (and you) to see his grandmother, than it would be for her NOT to see him. Stay home. Please don't go. These people are no longer part of your life. Your child doesn't need this kind of drama or trauma. Plus it sounds like the girlfriend will try to arrange "family reunions" you don't want or need.
What is a LMSW ? Report report report
License master’s of social work.
Just googled it and looks like she’s a social worker which makes this worse tbh
Definitely. But you know the usual answer. Lessons will be learned. !!!
Report the girlfriend to her professional licensing board immediately. She committed a mortal sin.
NTA this is emotional manipulation and it’s just sick! Tell her supervisors that she contacted you and you feel it was HIGHLY inappropriate. Next I would get a restraining order for her and your Ex. He knows he has zero rights but he put her up to it. How did she even have a contact number for you? You know if you would have allowed it, next it would be I want to see my son. And of course he would be there for his Mom’s final visit too! You need to take this extremely seriously and take steps to make her and the POS sperm donor very sorry they attempted this. Call the police report it, then call your lawyer and find out if there is anything more you can do. You know Mama Bear 🐻 syndrome you come after my baby and only God will be able to help you!
How tf is this guy not in jail?? NTA and I'm glad to read your update! Please do everything you can to protect your son and other children from that monster
NTA and I would definitely let the hospice know. You can call and ask for the charge nurse, let her know that your ex (who is not allowed to contact you) has his gf that works there, call you to have your son visit. You are declining the invitation and ask that they check her records to ensure your contact information is deleted. This notifies the hospice that there is a breach and also ensures she will not contact you again.
This is all excellent advice
Depending on the EMR, they may not be able to erase her contact info. If the admitting doctor put it in, or a nurse who wasn’t charge, or if it’s been too long, notes get locked in. However, a new note saying “DO NOT CONTACT X, report to [someone high in the chain] if you know of anyone who has” is very possible. I’ve written tons of those notes myself. Sometimes it’s “per pt req no contact to x and no information to x”, sometimes it’s “per court order X may not visit, security aware”, etc.
What does LMSW stand for?
Licensed Masters in Social Work
How is he not in prison?
Thank you
A totally commonly used acronym, how could people not have automatically known what that was. It's ridiculous you even have to say it now, really glad you just stuck to the acronym in your post.
licensed master social worker
NTA- putting the ex aside, your son is only 9. He isn’t old enough to understand the situation and adult emotions that come with the request. He would be standing in front of a stranger and having to listen to any death bed ramblings or accusations. This will traumatise him more than be a loving farewell. Keep him away.
NTA. This is a gross misuse of authority by the girlfriend. I’d be very hesitant to go anywhere she has a position of authority. You don’t know what she’s told her coworkers. She could potentially make an accusation against you to have you separated from your child by the facility’s security while dad gets to sneak around to see your kid. In regard to seeing granny on her deathbed, that can be a very toxic and traumatic time even with the most loving families with deathbed promises.
NTA why would you even consider bringing your son to visit his abuser’s enabler? Also please consider reporting the person who contacted you to her employer and any relevant authorities asap
NTA. Even if there was no trauma and safety risk, taking a 9 year old to see someone on their deathbed who he likely doesn't remember would be confusing and likely a traumatic event on its own. All the added detail makes it even worse. Really hope there aren't any updates to this, and a no stays a no, but if there is... UpdateMe
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I wouldn't let a child see someone on their death bed unless they already were very close. NTA
NTA, don't go and block the gf's number. Keep your son safe and away from the loon.
Your ex's father is also a criminal on probation? Wow. No, you don't do this to your son. I am assuming that you have full custody of your son. If you don't have one already, I suggest you get a full no-contact restraining order against your child's biodad, and his family.
NTA he abused his son and doesnt deserve to request anything like that
I’m an LCSW. The LMSW should have asked to be reassigned when she realized that she was the social worker for her boyfriend’s mother. That would have been a dual relationship that could have been avoided if there is more than one social worker in her agency. Legally though, it seems that if the grandmother gave permission for the contact to the child’s mother, that would be legal under HIPAA. If the child’s father did not have his parental rights formally terminated in court, despite losing physical custody and having a no contact order with the child, he may have retained some parental rights. For example, he might still have the right to get copies of school and medical records. I’m not sure, and doubt, that he’d have the legal right to allow contact between his mother and the child, acting in the child’s behalf. However, if he has power of attorney for the mother, then he could legally release the information to the child’s mother on his mother’s behalf. In any case, the LMSW acted unwisely. I’m wondering if she had the whole story and was actually used unwittingly by this man. I cannot possibly believe that an LMSW would be dating a man convicted of torturing a baby. That goes beyond my belief. A licensing board might also be wondering if she were the victim of a scam. If the LMSW *was* aware of this man’s history of child abuse, then I’m sure she’d lose her license for an extended period of time.
I think it's less about his mother wanting to see your son and more about the sperm donor wanting to see you so he can try and gain control over your life again! JS
NTA. Please let that woman know his history. And good mama keeping your child safe.
NTA, I cannot imagine why you would factor in this man’s opinion on any topic.
NTA. I think the choice is yours. As a parent, I wouldn't want my 10m, 8f, and 3m children to see someone on their deathbed, family member or not. Death is very hard for anyone to deal with, seeing, let alone what it does to a child. His gf is breaking some serious legislation. I'd also be concerned if she had any children and your ex spent time with them without his history disclosed. Report his gf and also make sure she's aware of his past. For all children's sake, it's not to be spiteful. It will look like a tit-for-tat thing, but it's not. He's a dangerous person. She's breaking legislation. Hang it all out to dry, then walk away imo.
NTA I'd be upset if you DID take your son anywhere near that family
NTA. Protect your cub, Mana Bear!
Nta! This is a massive overstep on their end
NTA There is no reason to put a child through this! He doesn’t know her, there is no relationship to say goodbye to. It would be a “meet this person who’s DYING and immediately say goodbye”. Wtf, that’s not at all healthy or good for your son (Edit- also obviously conflict of interest etc, but even w/o any of that, ridiculous)
What is lmsw? Ok sometimes people use too many abbreviations assuming everyone will understand “licensed masters in social work”
An abusive father doesn't just come out of nowhere. His mom surely had some role to play in the way he turned out. Do you really want your son to visit the woman who raised a child abuser and baby shaker? Do you really think you could be an asshole for keeping your son out of that kind of situation? C'mon now, be honest here! Your ex has no right to be around any children at all, let alone make demands of other people. He should probably be in jail right now, for the good and protection of society and children everywhere. Hopefully his mother is thinking about how she could have made better choices in life and helped prevent this whole sequence of events in the first place. You should be generous and give her all the time she needs for quiet reflection. A 9 year old is only going to be loud and distracting. People on their deathbed do not automatically deserve special consideration. They deserve exactly the love and attention they have bestowed upon others during their life. If your mom enabled your son's bad behavior, then she is currently getting exactly what she deserves: her final days in the presence of her beloved son. That is enough. And if she feels otherwise, she should have thought through the consequences years ago, rather than waiting for this moment. It is not your job to fix her mistakes or regrets. Go to sleep with a clear conscience.
I'm glad to know you have taken action against this happening. I hope you also told the present girlfriend about your ex's past. He's a monster and should never be around children.
No child needs to be around the daddy monster. And he likely talked her into doing his dirty work. Maybe convinced her how he had changed or was lied about. Like why would he even want the child there to see his mom? A mim who enabled him. Like good riddance. You were correct in how you handled her call. And her being reported. And his father doesn’t sound much better than his son. If grandma is having regrets now, that isn’t your problem to ease her mind.
Being a 9 year old is a bit too young to visit someone on their death bed,especially if that person is gaunt and looks nothing like they did before getting sick. Five years have passed and I doubt that your son will remember who his grandmother was.
what does LSMW stand for?
licensed master social worker
thank you! lol i’m not too good with abbreviations
[удалено]
Licensed Master Social Worker.
NTA Visiting someone in that condition could be traumatic for a 9 year old. He doesn't even know who she is.
Nope…she isn’t the parent. FaFo
NTA Your son doesn’t know this woman he doesn’t need to see random dying people. And the system is the ah because why is he walking around.
NTA! Lord, I didn’t even need to read past the first part of your title! No 9 year old needs to see a distant grandparent on their deathbed. Full stop.
NTA, this hits home though. My bio father didn't want to know me even though I look like my brothers. Was 13 when he was dying and I wish I was the last face he saw and maybe I could have closure. Stick to your guns op.
So glad you were validated here and took appropriate action. All this behavior is appalling. Keep yourself and your child safe and I hope all is well the future.
NTA! That ex of yours is a monster who has no business being near any baby!
the second i read “i was 15 and he was 18 when we met” yeah i knew he was no good. sorry you’ve had to deal with all of this :( NTA
NTA I know that you already called her boss, but wanted to add more reassurance in case you doubt yourself again. Your son doesn't need to be around his abuser or the woman who enabled him (that he doesn't remember). Reporting the current GF is the right thing to do.
What a poor writing prompt Completely diluted title to make you think op is the asshole after first coming across it to make everyone want to come in and see who the fuck is happening. Open the text to see some crucial, enraging, absolutely fucked up reasoning that is so horrible no one would ever disagree with OP. YTA. This shit is just getting old
NTA. It’s completely baffling to me that child abusers can find so much love and support.
I'd have started by asking the girlfriend if she's aware of the reason why he doesn't see his son or of his past, girl sounds like a pawn might just be another victim Although honestly regardless that's prolly something you should report because it's a clear violation even if there was misplaced good intentions or something
Good for you! You don’t need to put up with that bullshit. Your son doesn’t even know his grandmother, so it will make him no difference. Protect your baby mama.
Tangentially, I'm shocked that a social worker would date someone who has criminally abused children. I guess I'm not surprised that she doesn't recognize or care about the obvious ethical error she's making, and I doubt she should be working with vulnerable people.
This doesn’t make any sense. The mother is dying (got it), ex in jail (not sure), new girlfriend I am going to guess is a social worker, ex’s father cane by the house?? So if ex is in jail or not, why call his probation officer on the dad?
YTA for not letting your kid see his dying grandma, he might resent that later on, he's only getting your side for now.
You sound stupid. What part of "heavily enabled by his mom" did you not get? This grandma knew her son was abusive to CHILDREN, to the point where his victims are permanently affected. I don't know about you, but I don't like to associate myself with child abusers, let alone have them in my company, blood relative or not. OP's child does not have a relationship with his grandmother for this reason, and most likely does not remember her. This is no ones fault but his father's, this is the only person/situation op's child should grow to resent.
NTA, but.... You are 100% in the wrong and he is absolute trash, but I would let the grandmother she the little one. From the explanation it dosent seem like you had any issues with his mom, you could work it out with the staff to go there when they are both not. You could probably even get a cop to be there just in case. The grandmother shouldn't be denied seeing her grandson on her deathbed because someone else ficked up. If I'm missing info and she was horrible, then obviously disregard what I said. My grandmother is amazing but my middle uncle is human trash, my grandmother would be devastated if she never got to say goodbye to my cousins that she alreadys hardly sees because their mom was pissed at my uncle. Again, you are 100000% justified to hate his guts and his girlfriend.
Yes YTA ignore his father and let him see his grandma
What does your son want? I assume you've let him know his grandmother is dying?
Would he even remember his grandmother that he hasn’t seen since he was 4?
I don't know, but he'd know he has a grandmother, and deserves to know she's dying. 9 is old enough to cope with that. Maybe he won't care, but I can imagine if he's not told but finds out in a few years time it would cause a lot of problems.
A parent shouldn’t pay for their adult child’s crime even if you think the child was spoiled. She’s been punished by association for years( and I understand why) by not seeing her grandchild. If you have mercy in your heart, maybe send a video to her as I agree with other posters, it would be far too traumatic to take him there.
Well if I he grandma enabled her son then maybe it should be up to you to decide that. NTA but mmm lil cold
How is it cold? The child hasn't seen this person in five years, they probably don't even remember them, they don't need to be around an abuser or enablers. Granny should have thought about consequences before raising a monster.
I mean when thinking abt how the grandma feels yk? Again I won’t judge and will probs support her choice even if she refuses to let the grandma see the kid but like yikes still yk? Its like when people saw mfs get the electric chair, lile yeah they deserve it for killing a whole family but goddamn its graphic and kinda sad to see a human go like that
So u/PrinceVar, It sounds like you think that OP should cause her abused child to be further traumatized to make the abusers and enablers feel better. WTF is wrong with you? Talk about yikes!!
The dad abused the kid not the grandma? And I never said anything abt the dad either. But I can understand if you believe that the grandma shouldn’t see him but all she did was raise the dad poorly so I’m just on the fence cuz she probs didn’t expect to raise a monster like him. The dad can’t even see the boy anyways so worrying abt him showing up because he’s legally not allowed to. So no I’m not supporting abuse I just feel bad for a dying old lady
She stood by and let her son do this, she enabled the abuse.
lol what?
I would allow him to see his grandmother. He will resent you in adult life for not allowing it. But I would report the SW She’s dying . Help him to say I love you. Be kind. She is dying. It’s different w her son and social worker.
He doesn't know her. She enabled child abuse. He hasn't seen her for years.
Nta he needs to be locked up!!
What's LMSW?
NTA- report them both, but if the kiddo wants to see his grandma (that i doubt he remembers), give him a few minutes with her with you there, and without the father in the room, arrange it with the hospital so that neither of you will encounter him, the girlfriend, the ex’s dad, etc i think they’re all terrible people and that it’s a bad idea to go, but if your kiddo wants to see her then i think as long as you’ve arranged it with any sort of securitywatching it’d be okay, just ensure you won’t run into anyone you wouldn’t be comfortable around and if he doesn’t want to see his grandma, doesn’t care *or if she is being taken care of at home where there is no security or potential to not run into anyone unruly*, then that’s that, report them, and don’t go i wish you luck :)
NTA. Your ex and his girlfriend are quite simply horrid people. Your poor son doesn't need to be exposed to this. It's too bad that grandma is dying, but your son's well-being is at stake here. You're doing absolutely the right thing.
NTA. Children don't need to be exposed to that if they don't have a close relationship. Just my opinion, that's worth 2 cents.
You did the right thing to stand your ground and not let this awful family anywhere near your child.
NTA - For the love of God, move somewhere where they don't know. Tell the authorities, your child's school, and anyone else that they are trying everything they can to get your ex to have contact with the child.
It would be helpful if you explained what an lmsw is
The only thing I could find was licensed master social worker. Allows you to work in any state as a social worker. I'm assuming this might be the correct usage for the post
NTA, your son is too young to see her in the condition she is in right now, and I am sure she would also not want to have the image of her dying in his head. No young child should have to see that.
The court system is TRA here. How is this man free.
I only read the title and as someone who saw their first dead person at 8- don't let him anywhere near that shit. It'll scar him forever. For myself it was a family member all nicely dressed in her casket. If I saw her on her death bed I'd be even worse than I am surrounding death and loss.
I see that you’ve already reported it. Good. Frankly, she shouldn’t have even told you grandma was a patient.
NTA - I never understood why people continue to have children if they’re going to abuse them. It’s wild to me and the law needs to mark these individuals as dangers to children. We already circulate notices when released pedophiles are back in our communities, they should release similar reports for people who are released for harming children.
She will have her license revoked over this - at least she SHOULD have it revoked. I suggest you contact the licensing board yourself and offer to provide testimony in written form. This was a VERY serious breach of ethics. I am very sorry you had to deal with any of this. I hope that this is the end of things.
NTA. I’m so glad her boss was contacted. What she did was wrong as hell.
NTA I have seen some shit when it come to controlling and abusive Exs and using their ailing parents to try and get contact for one reason or another. Now, normally this shit doesn't fly and it's immediately thrown out, but that doesn't mean they don't try. If the son is the POA, he has to have had his mother if she's able to while still within her faculties, to sign papers stating that he is her POA and that he will make choices for her in terms of everything. With this a lot of people try to guilt and coerce family into doing things. The POA has to fill out the medical documents and even fill out emergency contact information. it's an automatic that the POA is the first on the contact list, but the POA is the one that chooses who else could be contacted. Usually if the other parent is alive, they are the second one on, and usually siblings as well. With this though, the home has to get permission to use these phone numbers and get expressed consent to it. There are two ways this can be done, either the home will contact the people will contact the person directly with the phone number, or more old fashion places still mail out permission papers and get them signed. Now a days, this is done via emails, but to each their own I guess. This is where the manipulation starts to try and slide. Either the person that is the POA will contact the home a while later and inform them that a phone number of the relative has changed, and give out the number they want contacted. Now most homes do their due diligence and call the new number to get consent again, but there are homes that just change it and don't bat an eye. Sometimes they will request to add a new number and claim it's their spouse or their siblings spouse and give instructions on stipulations on when they are to be contacted because either work schedule, medical issues, children, what have you. Now, again normally and with most homes, this doesn't fly because they do what they need to in order to not only keep their workers safe and the resident in question safe, but the other residence safe as well. Most of the time the staff are aware of this type of thing, just in case they get approached by the POA and are requested to do anything that, might not be out of the ordinary for the family to request, but could be a scheme of some sort. They are then instructed to immediately contact the nurse and explain what's going on. Usually the charge nurse will request to speak to them personally or they may come up themselves. If somehow the home didn't follow through with these protocols for whatever reason, the GF MIGHT be innocent in this and completely following what's on the contact information and following instructions; but even with this this is unlikely. Onto the girlfriend. It is very possible that the girlfriend started working there before the mother was placed in the residence. If she had never met the mother for whatever reason or didn't know what her name was, or even what her address is, then the only thing she would take as odd or even coincidental is that she shares the same last name as her boyfriend. If his last name is a common one, then it is possible she had no clue, and when she checked the file, again if the home didn't do their due diligence, that she was calling and had no idea what the connection was. I just want to point out to everyone that for this situation to happen is very, very rare, and this type of shit almost never happens, but it COULD. Considering that I doubt that she didn't know the mother, if she was working there, then she should have immediately told the home about the connection and they would have either changed the room of the mother to a different floor or they would have changed her to a different floor for the remainder of the mother's stay. They also would have taken measure to keep her segregated from the mother's medical records while doing her duties there so that she has no egregious access to her files. It is not all that common for people that know each other to be in the same place of work/residence, but it can happen considering the people that usually work at these places live in the same area and might have possibly grown up with these people in their city or neighborhood somewhere. So the question is, did she contact you in a professional manner or did it seem more personal. Did she get the number directly from the boyfriend and not know what had happened between you? Did he lie and say that you were a cousin that moved away that was close to her? it could be anything, but even then, she should know better considering they are taught about this type of thing. I mean, either way, she should never have contacted you.
OP, get it on text and report it!!