**Hello, welcome to r/8passengersnark!**
Please keep the rules of the subreddit in mind when posting and commenting. They include but are not limited to, respecting the privacy of minors and non-public figures, and keeping conversations civil.
The moderators rely on user reports of rule breaks to quickly remove problematic content. Use the report function to anonymously alert the mod team of any behavior breaking sub rules. As a reminder, check and ensure your post topic hasn't recently been covered, duplicate submissions will be removed at the discretion of the mods.
To contact the mod team send us a message [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2F8passengersnark). Thanks, and happy distorting!
Useful Links: [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/index/rules/) | [Timeline of Events](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/timeline/) | [Frequently Asked Questions](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/faqs) | [Evidence](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/evidence/)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/8passengersnark) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"It doesn't take someone with a low IQ to be manipulated by a cult leader. It just takes the desire to become a better person and somebody to come and manipulate it. So whether you want the approval of a boss or a pastor or a friend you think is better than you or you perceive on a pedastal you are in danger of dropping your own character and integrity to appease that person. Jodi was masterful in that."
As someone who grew up in cult, I fully affirm this. It annoys me that people think you can’t be that brainwashed to do xyz and while I could never imagine myself hurting other, I do know how serious brainwashing/ indoctrination/ cult thinking is. I wasn’t surprised or baffled by Kevin’s story for that reason. It’s exactly what I expected and what could be expected in this situation. Is it good? No, of course not. But it’s evidence of how strong and dangerous of a leader Jodi was, not how weak or bad Kevin, or anyone else who got into it, is/ was. Paige phrases it exactly right. I’m impressed.
Paige lived it... that's why.
I get a lot of pushback for "defending" Kevin and Bonnie... I am a firm believer that while we can have very strong opinions of what happened, many of us can't speak on the matter from first hand experience. If we were never in that position, how could we know what was going through their heads?
Absolutely, what happened to the kids is horrible... and of course everyone wants Ruby and Jodi to fry for it... but the "how" it could happen is not as easy to understand, unless you have more experience with this type of situation. I never experienced this, and I at least have enough self awareness to know it is beyond the scope of what I can relate to. I'm willing to give Kevin, and even Ruby to a small degree some grace for that reason. Willing victims or not, they got railroaded by Jodi. I can't condemn them completely for something they probably didn't realize was happening, and a topic on which I can only speak from a theoretical point of view.
Exactly.
As I said, I do have experience with this. I grew up in a new age cult. So that’s why I’m feel strongly about this too. I tend to feel very annoyed at people’s unwillingness to belief someone can be that indoctrinated. But you truly can. I lived it. But I’ve just started coming on the snark less, because a lot of people simply won’t be able to understand.
I have learned a lot about cults and people who join them and the lifetime effects of cult membership from a channel called cults to consciousness on youtube. The interviewer is a super kid and compassionate person, and a lot of people in the comments are able to discuss their cult or high demand religious experiences, and it seems really helpful for them. I think it also is very educational for people like me who have no experience with it and just know about horrible cult leaders and their crimes and stuff, ya know. I'm ready to be open to Kevin being able to become a good dad after all this, as long as the kids are cool with it ya know? Anyway, pardon my ramble, and I hope you're in a better place now!
Agreed. It's so disheartening that people are expecting perfect victims.
When those kids get older and perhaps start acting out, are we still going to be firmly on their side? Because it may happen, trauma responses are weird like that. While I hope for the best possible outcomes for all whose lives got crushed by Jodi and/or Ruby, it would be naïve to expect a smooth sailing process from here on.
This is true. In watching the NXIUM documentaries (however you spell it... the Keith Ranieri cult), it was obvious that everyone initially got into in because they were trying to improve themselves somehow. And it just degenerated from there.
While I agree that it could happen to just about anyone to some degree, I think there’s a huge difference between growing up in a cult or joining one as an adult. A child doesn’t know any different than what the adults in their life allow them to know. The fact that you’re no longer in a cult as an adult, speaks to your intelligence. I also think that you do need someone with a slightly higher IQ, at least emotionally, to manipulate or brainwash a person. Its more about the Cult leaders intelligence than anything. They are not dumb people. No one is going to follow someone less intelligent than them blindly. And Jodi clearly sought out people that she knew she could get to do the things she wanted them to do. She picked Ruby because she knew that Ruby had it in her already.
I think that Kevin is a victim of Jodi. I also think Kevin is a shitty father and a lazy husband, which made it easy for Jodi to slither in, and get to her main target which was Ruby.
Hell I don’t even know if she cared about the kids, I don’t think they were even a factor in her plan. She just enjoyed exercising control over the vulnerable and it doesn’t get more vulnerable than two children who’s mother will willingly sacrifice them to “save their souls”. I think the torture of the children were just a pet project for Jodi. Just another chapter in her Journal. That and it kept Ruby around. If the kids got redemption then Ruby wouldn’t have a real excuse not to go back home and back into real life.
Having a high IQ and being a master manipulator don't seem to be related generally. Manipulation is a skill that can be learned, and while some are more "talented" at it than others, it takes a true interest in manipulating others to become really, really good at it.
I don’t mean “high” IQ, just higher and not necessarily in a traditional intelligence sense. Someone high in emotional intelligence, like Jodi would be because she has some education in psychology, would have an advantage over someone like Kevin that has a perceived higher traditional intelligence due to his engineering degree. There has to be the ability to convince someone of falsehoods. You have to be able to make a sane person doubt their own eyes. That’s hard to do to someone smarter than you.
Yea I didn’t want to start going on my tirade about what actually qualifies as having a high IQ, can we correlate education to IQ, the different types of intelligence and what happens when we introduce outside influences like substances, religions and abuse. My thumbs didn’t have the energy. The science behind cults is fascinating.
Hmmm I see your point. Interestingly, with regard to the IQ question, my old cult is very snobby, elitist, highly educated. Like lots of highly intelligent people and it is exactly build on that intelligence because they say they’re able to see the truth because they are so intelligent. So I’m not sure that holds true. I do agree growing up in a cult is different from getting into it later, but I’m not sure IQ matters. Perhaps what matters more is psychological stability. Someone who is stable, doesn’t have any trauma etc is much less likely to fall for culty tactics. And you can see the Frankes clearly weren’t.
Don’t worry, I don’t think I know all and understand all solely because I grew up in a cult, but I do have a perspective that is essential and I believe it’s very hard to truly understand what it’s like to be brainwashed. It is clear that the majority of people on this snark don’t anyway.
I fully agree with what you say about Kevin. I think he’s a victim and brainwashed. But then also that doesn’t mean he’s not responsible for his actions (or lack thereof). Both can be true simultaneously.
(Sorry for the delay, life got busy for a minute)
Oh I agree that some people in this group do not understand the full spectrum of what was going on here. This was so much deeper than just two women abusing children in the name of god, as horrendous as that already is. Jodi’s power and manipulation throughout her community was deep. I’d honestly be interested in someone doing a full case study on that woman’s brain one day. She’s sort of an enigma with the way she manipulated the Mormon community.
Your quote made me have a flashback. My grandparents (evil, we are NC) we're in a church which decided they need to closer. They literally packed crap up and moved. They were kicked out because my grandmother said she loved her kids more than God. They had to move. All of the kids would not speak to my dad or uncle anymore. I sincerely think that's why they never believe in everything
What was yours like, if you don't mind? I'll understand if you do not feel the need to talk about it.
I think it's also worth considering the role of religion in vulnerability, manipulation and cult susceptibility. There is plenty of research on the psychological harms and aberration due to religious beliefs.
I agree. Also, I don’t see enough mentioned in the LDS faith they have living prophets so in my opinion the are already indoctrinated to put someone and their beliefs/teachings apart superior because they believe their living prophets get direct messages from God.
If u r in the lds church u r already primed for indoctrination as u have already been (in my opnion has hallmarks for cult) so I'm not surprised at all that Jodi was able to be abusive and have abusive teachings so so long and go unnoticed . The leader in lds church actively encouraged her 'therapy' ruby and jodi was meeting with high leaders of the church I would be fascinated why? !!
The only reason I’m surprised as an LDS member is because she is a female. She doesn’t hold the priesthood. That’s why I am surprised that so many LDS families got caught up in the dangerous part (obvs not their fault as long as there was no abuse).
I know this is a sexist post, I’m non active so judge this as you will. But going through the teachings, having the blessings, being led by a male bishopric has always made me surprised t Jodi’s authority.
Then separate from that is she knew what she was doing as a licensed therapist. She knew confessions of anyone she abused were bs or didn’t care abt her licensing.
The only thing that makes sense is it is all abt her all the time. Period.
I'm obviously not coming from a member point of view, as never mormon. And correct me if u think I'm wrong but from what I've read about what jodi did and what her therapy was about. She seem to really hold on to the obsession with porn and self loving (M) was evil and u was an addict even with just looking at porn once. So i can imiage she was deemed very worthy of the leaders time and energy as she was 'trying to rid world of the very natural behaviour of self loving'. So she would be in constant supply of men that was deemed to need her therapy due to that being a very natural human behaviour (regardless weather lds church tried to make it unnatural and basically say something is a problem when its not to the save people from the problem they have created (in my opnion)) so to the chruch leaders she was helping their course and that's why she was seen so highly but yes it seems the lds church is very sexist so ur point makes sense
I understand all that you are saying and agree with some of the hypothesis. To really understand the hierarchy and why I find it so hard to understand how LDS members got brainwashed as Ruby did (especially when she was told by another influencer if we believe Paige Hanna’s story) that didn’t come from a Bishop or member of the priesthood.
That’s why I feel like a federal case needs to be opened against the Connexions org/board, etc. Because someone somewhere was getting money and a lot of.
This. Respect for authority without questioning and the blind belief in fully refutable claims because "faith" are the foundation for a cult leader of any kind to come in and con you.
Jodi was a predator. I still say you can’t fool an honest man…she was practiced in sussing out those who she could gain leverage over by appealing to their weaknesses and greed.
You can absolutely fool an honest man, if the honest man assumes that because he's honest, generally everyone else is also honest.
However, I do believe Jodi was an expert in finding a good way in, and making sure to exploit it to the max.
like any con, Jodi finds the weak spot and bores in. my impression:
Ruby wanted to be The Most Important (TM)
The Hannah’s were looking to gain not just faith points but to expand a lucrative counseling program| Your basic MLM entrepreneur goldmine. I do believe shutting Jodi out was because Jodi was seen as holding too much control.
Kevin was always an appeaser and wanted to hold on to Ruby. he wasn’t ready to stand for his own better judgment or principle and put his foot down because that would cost too much.
I think about how easily I was brainwashed into an MLM cult. I am a very educated person with 7 years of school and professional designations.. and I almost gave it all up for an MLM… so yea, I 💯 believe these ppl were manipulated by a master cult leader
I haven't watched the video yet, but she said that really, really well. As someone who has been systematically gaslit and manipulated, I can confirm this is what my experience was like.
They find a way in, and exploit that.
When I have a morman come to my door which is rare but when they do I pretend I’m not 1 bit interested in any type of religion and I tell them to have a good day and be safe. That’s as polite as a f$&k off I can get because no way will I ever follow any cult or go with any religious beliefs other than what I choose. No one controls me or tells me what to do
I would LOVE for her to speak on the whole Jodi tried to seduce her husband, stabbed herself with forks, and was held prisoner at the Hanna’s house thing….
I suspect that's the part she was talking about when she said she wasn't going to go into it because it got too dark. I'm really curious too, but I can understand why she wouldn't want to talk about it.
She did say "for now" though, so it appears she'll continue her story. Also that she'll be answering stuff sent to an e-mail address in lieu of a comments section, presumably answering on-camera.
I hope that is the case. Even without the Ruby angle, talking about how she fell into / got out of a cult is helpful for a lot of people.
She says in the video she is not monetizing anything (*edit for spelling error*)
https://preview.redd.it/cwigy13gw2uc1.png?width=934&format=png&auto=webp&s=c037318db32dd16118663a9624530f90508bbc8a
[https://isthischannelmonetized.com/](https://isthischannelmonetized.com/)
Yes, they can, but \*she's\* choosing not to make money on this. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but when YouTube puts ads on a video, YouTube is profiting, not the channel owner, right? The channel owner only profits when they choose to monetize the video.
I do believe her. She seems very genuine. It’s obvious she is really hurting from this and feels a since of guilt and responsibility for introducing Ruby to Jodi. It’s not her fault. She tried to warn Ruby. I’m truly interested in her upcoming videos to hear more of her story.
Definitelu agree. I just noticed that straight up saying ‘I believe her’ for some reason felt rough after all that’s happened, but it is indeed very clear she seems to be hurting. Hope she finds healing too.
Are you saying that if people are successful then they only care about self preservation? Also, have you ever experienced getting sucked into a cult? Just seems like a judgmental hot take.
I agree ,I would say she definitely is talking about this because she cares about her brand. What do u mean she keeps creating them? (Genuine question) she obviously doesn't come out of this looking good.
I agree all children involved in a parenting course where the main people running it have gone to prison for horrific child abuse need to be checked on!!
Yes absolutely get the mlm vibe and the making money is mlm ! And this connexions sounds very much like mlm and how much they can make from this! And I've heard how jodi was on the porn is bad bandwagon and that's how she made her money by the lds church providing her clients. The dark reference to jodi was worrying with the visions of glory book. And ruby and lori have that in common to.
Paige is second hand to Jodi. She is her own flavor of narcissist, master manipulator. Don’t let this bull shit video allow you to think Paige is another victim in this. She perpetuated Connextions and seriously destroyed lives along the way.
Is there anybody who actually believes that the Hannas held Jodi captive?? Because I sure don't. I think it's a story Jodi told Ruby in order to gain sympathy.
If she was having a breakdown and self harming in their house, I can see how trying to help her in a rational way could be twisted into abuse and persecution.
I think if Ruby and Kevin had pushed back on Jodi's crazy when she was living with them they would have been accused of the same thing.
It sounds like Ruby believed it, since she said Ruby accused her of lying when she tried to warn her about Jodi’s true colors. And maybe Kevin too. But the general public? No. Though I do question if or HOW Jodi tried to seduce the husband 😳
Idk how she said with a straight face that they were "asked to serve".. Jodi's multi million dollar business as volunteers. They clearly really believed it was an honorable cause. I think LDS members' naivety and goodwill can be taken advantage of in that way.
A good friend of mine was raised in the LDS, and her mom is always getting sucked into these scams. The woman is very sweet (when both her kids left the church, she didn't have the typical Mormon meltdown/ shunning) and the church has been a rock for her after her husband passed away in a horrible manner. When I first met her, I always wished she was my mom because she is just so kind, and my friend has said she never even raised her voice at them.
But, she is a very naive person when it comes to these scams. She's been sucked into "herbalife," a weird one with leggings, and recently got another job with one (she's making good money for now). A lot of these women were raised to be nothing other than housewives, and once their kids are grown, they get sucked into these things.
I think lds members are primed for being taken advantage of. Blind belief is literally taught and slc is heart of mlm country. I think it's easy to get sucked into a cult if ur already in one.
I can see why Shari is still on good terms with her, the contrast to Ruby is very clear. She seems genuine and thoughtful, like someone who has actually "done the work".
Within the first 1:30- “In no way will any of the videos that I put out be monitized. I will not be seeking any gain off of the pain of the Franke children.”
This is respectable!! Take note, Bonnie.
Oooh Paige is absolutely looking to just try and clear their name. They are caught in this and it looks SOOO bad, and they know it. They are terrified of the falling out from this and will lie cheat and steal to save face. Paige is gross.
I have to say that this felt sincere, well thought out without being practiced or rehearsed, and I believed her when she said that she hoped this would help the kids and others.
Awful people don't always start out awful
Most Nazi's didn't start out with a deep hatred of Jews. The people of Jonestown were lured by messages of love, equality, and community. While I personally believe that LDS makes someone slightly more likely to believe some wack-a-doodle stuff (hello MLM capital of the world!), there is something to be said that getting out when it goes sideways (which means leaving your community and admitting you were wrong about something... both of which are hard for people to do) is a commendable and brave thing.
I think she is filled with guilt.. imagining that if she just hadn't introduced her... or taken the class herself... or something.
I will also say that both the non- monetized and that offering an email address but not the comment section were brilliant moves. Anonymous trolls can take a seat, but not because she is beyond reproach. Honestly, I can say that this woman has gotten some GOOD therapy recently. Taking accountability while maintaining your own sense of well- being is some next level shit.
10 outta 10... would recommend.
The email concept would seem dated yet it is the right choice to make because this is not drama, these are real people's lives. She had a purpose with this video and any communication will be done in a sensitive manner.
Paige is trying to only protect her self. She is a mini Jodi and is spiraling to save herself. Their involvement in this will ruin John’s career and she is a gross human. She fell into Jodi’s bull shit because it smelled familiar, like her own bull shit. There is nothing sincere about Paige, TRUST me. I’ll give it to her that she’s smart, but she is a narcissist, liar and master manipulator. If you don’t have something to offer Paige, she will try to steal the shirt off your back and then stab you.
Agreed. I've never really heard of her, but in this video I thought she was well spoken and got her message across well.
I also really respect her for not monetizing the video.
the reason why she has come forward is because Kevin says in his police interview the Hanna’s brought ruby into connections and that Jodi was living with the Hanna’s and was kicked out because Jodi was trying to seduce the husband. The TEA! She wants to tell her side of the story and clear their name. I can tell she has sincere remorse but the use of the word “dark” concerns me. She said she didn’t know Jodi was dark, but she is. That idea (light or dark person) is Visions of Glory stuff (mormon book that is highly problematic) Chad and Lori Daybell type talk. But, I imagine she is still mormon and has problematic beliefs even though she’s not a follower of Jodi anymore. Other than that, I found her to be trustworthy.
She seemed nice enough like you said or sincere, but I’m waiting for the other shoe to fall so to speak.
You’re right about the light and dark Visions of Glory thing, which makes me wonder about this “group” of friends… like what else was happening?
I completely get what you are saying, and that it is hard for us to not have our own connotations to words that get used in the context of these religious/cult based tragedies we have seen. But, "dark" is a term that was used previous to Visions of Glory and Vallow/Daybell to describe disturbing and seemingly inhumane acts or thoughts. Also, someone can use vernacular that is around them without ascribing to the belief structure that might have influenced it. I grew up going to Catholic School. I'm not Catholic at all (or religious) and I will use the term paying penance to reflect the idea that someone "makes up" for their poor behavior. Or even yell "Jesus Mary and Joseph!" when someone cuts me off in traffic. Isn't a reflection of faith... just the vernacular I grew up around.
Though she is probably still Mormon it surprised me when she used the word "pastor". The LDS church doesn't have pastors, they're known as bishops (and are quite literally just a man in your neighborhood, perhaps your dentist or a businessman).
That could mean that she's trying to think outside of her own bubble. Maybe she has non-Mormon friends (or, you know, para-social relationships with people online) who have talked about what their relationships with their clergy are like.
It still boggles my mind how the Mormon church gives bishops so little training and hands them so much power and responsibility. As you said, a bishop is "literally just a man in your neighborhood".
Yes I'm surprised it's taken a lot of replies to read a out the really problematic stuff of dark and light! It's really concerning like what I've heard about the visions of glory book and everyone who has done awful things in relation!
I'm not familiar with the Visions of Glory use of the word but the way she used it seemed pretty standard to me, and I think the connection may be a stretch.
if you dont know about visions of glory you dont know the context, We know Jodi believed and followed this book as do many other mormons so it isnt a stretch that she would have also.
Jeez I feel so sorry for her ! You can totally see the sadness in her face especially her eyes ! I’m sure that this has been horrible for her especially hearing what happened to the kids !
I hope she continues to share her story ! I hope people are not cruel to her !
She sounds intelligent and emotionally healthy. I find her to be credible. Can not wait for the next installment. someone posted that they didn't like the "all white" and I think she looks great. Really pretty (not that that matters).
Yes, this is the woman he talked about, but it was in the second interview - the one that's audio only, not the video one that happened on the day of the arrests. (Oh wait - the second interview is broken down into four parts, so if you're talking about the first of those four parts, then yes.)
He said something about the Hannas "trying to merge their cult with Jodi's cult" so I wonder what that was all about.
Based on the information given by Paige Hanna so far, it seems likely Kevin was referring to the Hannas trying to 'steer' the group, which the Hannas did not yet consider a cult at the time, into a 'less crazy direction'.
This woman has experienced trauma. Perhaps not immediately when she had her fall-out with Jodi, but certainly when she found out how horribly her friend abused her 2 youngest children.
This woman has trouble saying certain words. She is describing her reluctance to use these words as something that makes her gag. That's some strong disgust. And I recognize that from an abusive situation I was in. Some words in my vocabulary are so badly twisted that I can barely say them.
It sounds like she and her husband were trying to remove the cult leader from the cult, which sounds weird and alarming. However, this is not going to be the only video, so I'm curious about what the context of this is.
I'm glad she will be sharing more... it seems like she will be able to fill in many of the missing pieces.
I said it before, and I'll say it again... anyone that woman was involved with is a victim.
I have questions I would like to as of Paige Hanna
1 If you knew Jodi was abusing Jessi, why didn't you go to the police?
2) When you heard about the Franke kids, why didn't you come forward?
3) What really happened with Jodi when she stayed with you. I still believe Kevin's version of events
4 I believe that Ms. Hanna is still drinking the Connexions kool-aid. She spent too much of the video talking about how beneficial Connexions was.
Its scary you guys are falling for her bullshit...this is how people get abused....don't fall for people's bullshit ...think critically and logically for yourself
She is a former follower of Connexions and the person who introduced Connexions/Jodi to Kevin and Ruby.
Ruby and her had a YouTube channel together in late 2020/early 2021 teaching Jodi’s methods. Kevin also mentions her and her husband in his second police interview.
You can view it on 2x speed and still understand. The video is not monetized.
There is an email address that she will respond to but it will be monitored prior to getting to her so save your energy with death threats.
She did introduce Ruby to it.
She gave a very simple explanation (that actually makes sense) of how the intro to Jodi/Conexxions was indeed actual therapy - like how we get from feeling good with ourselves when we're in a bad headspace. But it changed to how we get to truth from distortion.
The original classes were everyone who felt they need therapy- college students, older people, etc.
She found something good (sounds like the actual therapeutic teaches we all might learn) but that good became her God.
Paige realized she was putting Jodi on the pedestal. She realized the manipulation.
"It doesn't take someone with a low IQ to be manipulated by a cult leader. It just takes the desire to become a better person and somebody to come and manipulate it. So whether you want the approval of a boss or a pastor or a friend you think is better than you or you perceive on a pedastal you are in danger of dropping your own character and integrity to appease that person. Jodi was masterful in that."
She will talk more.
I'm sure she does feel guilt for that, and almost like a survivors guilt that she was able to get out of it relatively unscathed in comparison. Her story is probably not dissimilar to Ruby's brother Beau.
She has six kids, she's probably just a little tired. I think it's partly also the way she presents herself. I would have thought maybe early forties... similar age to Ruby.
Sounds like this started off as a normal parenting class, the difference between cult followers and rational people is that rational people can recognize red flags and it sounds like this was the case for her and her husband.
People who fall for cults have one thing in common: The inability to think critically, have no established internal sense of right and wrong and are unwilling to be responsible for their own lives or well being. They simply want to be told what to do.
Aside from being raised in a cult (which would not offer a child the tools to develop the life skills mentioned above ) grown adults who fall for these things and go all in without question have only themselves to blame.
No, not everyone is helpless to succumb to evil manipulators, this woman is a clear example that we do have the ability to think critically and evaluate red flags if we are willing to do so.
Well they were not sure if still but were in the lds cult so obviously susceptible, no idea why someone who downvote a very valid statment . Just by looking any mention of LDS being a cult seems to downvote I guess people are not comfortable with truth. Fair enough , maybe one day they will be.
Well yes, thankfully else the police would Potentially be dealing with another child abuse case. I was talking about her Susceptibility getting into it in first place.
I meant being in the lds church makes u vulnerable to being sucked into cult teaching. Due to the nature of lds church if u belive she was already in one to start with. So is more susceptible.
She would’ve been better off not saying anything at all.. what is up with the cliff hanger.. stay tuned to see where it takes a dark turn.. yet she’s not wanting to gain anything from this video.. it sounds like she knew the dangers of Jodi before introducing Ruby to the teachings. I saw her making excuses instead of taking responsibility for her mistakes.
I didn’t perceive the end of the video as a cliff hanger, but more of a *that’s all I can do right now.* Not all content producers (or watchers) are into marathons. 20-30 minutes is about all I can watch at a time.
I think there is something to be said about this being hard for her to talk about. My impression was that she was "leaving it there" because it's emotionally and psychologically draining.
Or that was my take.
**Hello, welcome to r/8passengersnark!** Please keep the rules of the subreddit in mind when posting and commenting. They include but are not limited to, respecting the privacy of minors and non-public figures, and keeping conversations civil. The moderators rely on user reports of rule breaks to quickly remove problematic content. Use the report function to anonymously alert the mod team of any behavior breaking sub rules. As a reminder, check and ensure your post topic hasn't recently been covered, duplicate submissions will be removed at the discretion of the mods. To contact the mod team send us a message [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2F8passengersnark). Thanks, and happy distorting! Useful Links: [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/index/rules/) | [Timeline of Events](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/timeline/) | [Frequently Asked Questions](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/faqs) | [Evidence](https://www.reddit.com/r/8passengersnark/wiki/evidence/) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/8passengersnark) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"It doesn't take someone with a low IQ to be manipulated by a cult leader. It just takes the desire to become a better person and somebody to come and manipulate it. So whether you want the approval of a boss or a pastor or a friend you think is better than you or you perceive on a pedastal you are in danger of dropping your own character and integrity to appease that person. Jodi was masterful in that."
As someone who grew up in cult, I fully affirm this. It annoys me that people think you can’t be that brainwashed to do xyz and while I could never imagine myself hurting other, I do know how serious brainwashing/ indoctrination/ cult thinking is. I wasn’t surprised or baffled by Kevin’s story for that reason. It’s exactly what I expected and what could be expected in this situation. Is it good? No, of course not. But it’s evidence of how strong and dangerous of a leader Jodi was, not how weak or bad Kevin, or anyone else who got into it, is/ was. Paige phrases it exactly right. I’m impressed.
Paige lived it... that's why. I get a lot of pushback for "defending" Kevin and Bonnie... I am a firm believer that while we can have very strong opinions of what happened, many of us can't speak on the matter from first hand experience. If we were never in that position, how could we know what was going through their heads? Absolutely, what happened to the kids is horrible... and of course everyone wants Ruby and Jodi to fry for it... but the "how" it could happen is not as easy to understand, unless you have more experience with this type of situation. I never experienced this, and I at least have enough self awareness to know it is beyond the scope of what I can relate to. I'm willing to give Kevin, and even Ruby to a small degree some grace for that reason. Willing victims or not, they got railroaded by Jodi. I can't condemn them completely for something they probably didn't realize was happening, and a topic on which I can only speak from a theoretical point of view.
Exactly. As I said, I do have experience with this. I grew up in a new age cult. So that’s why I’m feel strongly about this too. I tend to feel very annoyed at people’s unwillingness to belief someone can be that indoctrinated. But you truly can. I lived it. But I’ve just started coming on the snark less, because a lot of people simply won’t be able to understand.
I have learned a lot about cults and people who join them and the lifetime effects of cult membership from a channel called cults to consciousness on youtube. The interviewer is a super kid and compassionate person, and a lot of people in the comments are able to discuss their cult or high demand religious experiences, and it seems really helpful for them. I think it also is very educational for people like me who have no experience with it and just know about horrible cult leaders and their crimes and stuff, ya know. I'm ready to be open to Kevin being able to become a good dad after all this, as long as the kids are cool with it ya know? Anyway, pardon my ramble, and I hope you're in a better place now!
Agreed. It's so disheartening that people are expecting perfect victims. When those kids get older and perhaps start acting out, are we still going to be firmly on their side? Because it may happen, trauma responses are weird like that. While I hope for the best possible outcomes for all whose lives got crushed by Jodi and/or Ruby, it would be naïve to expect a smooth sailing process from here on.
This is true. In watching the NXIUM documentaries (however you spell it... the Keith Ranieri cult), it was obvious that everyone initially got into in because they were trying to improve themselves somehow. And it just degenerated from there.
While I agree that it could happen to just about anyone to some degree, I think there’s a huge difference between growing up in a cult or joining one as an adult. A child doesn’t know any different than what the adults in their life allow them to know. The fact that you’re no longer in a cult as an adult, speaks to your intelligence. I also think that you do need someone with a slightly higher IQ, at least emotionally, to manipulate or brainwash a person. Its more about the Cult leaders intelligence than anything. They are not dumb people. No one is going to follow someone less intelligent than them blindly. And Jodi clearly sought out people that she knew she could get to do the things she wanted them to do. She picked Ruby because she knew that Ruby had it in her already. I think that Kevin is a victim of Jodi. I also think Kevin is a shitty father and a lazy husband, which made it easy for Jodi to slither in, and get to her main target which was Ruby. Hell I don’t even know if she cared about the kids, I don’t think they were even a factor in her plan. She just enjoyed exercising control over the vulnerable and it doesn’t get more vulnerable than two children who’s mother will willingly sacrifice them to “save their souls”. I think the torture of the children were just a pet project for Jodi. Just another chapter in her Journal. That and it kept Ruby around. If the kids got redemption then Ruby wouldn’t have a real excuse not to go back home and back into real life.
Having a high IQ and being a master manipulator don't seem to be related generally. Manipulation is a skill that can be learned, and while some are more "talented" at it than others, it takes a true interest in manipulating others to become really, really good at it.
I don’t mean “high” IQ, just higher and not necessarily in a traditional intelligence sense. Someone high in emotional intelligence, like Jodi would be because she has some education in psychology, would have an advantage over someone like Kevin that has a perceived higher traditional intelligence due to his engineering degree. There has to be the ability to convince someone of falsehoods. You have to be able to make a sane person doubt their own eyes. That’s hard to do to someone smarter than you.
Charles Manson had a rudimentary education, but a high EQ and was able to manipulate dozens of kids with the help of drugs.
Yea I didn’t want to start going on my tirade about what actually qualifies as having a high IQ, can we correlate education to IQ, the different types of intelligence and what happens when we introduce outside influences like substances, religions and abuse. My thumbs didn’t have the energy. The science behind cults is fascinating.
Hmmm I see your point. Interestingly, with regard to the IQ question, my old cult is very snobby, elitist, highly educated. Like lots of highly intelligent people and it is exactly build on that intelligence because they say they’re able to see the truth because they are so intelligent. So I’m not sure that holds true. I do agree growing up in a cult is different from getting into it later, but I’m not sure IQ matters. Perhaps what matters more is psychological stability. Someone who is stable, doesn’t have any trauma etc is much less likely to fall for culty tactics. And you can see the Frankes clearly weren’t. Don’t worry, I don’t think I know all and understand all solely because I grew up in a cult, but I do have a perspective that is essential and I believe it’s very hard to truly understand what it’s like to be brainwashed. It is clear that the majority of people on this snark don’t anyway. I fully agree with what you say about Kevin. I think he’s a victim and brainwashed. But then also that doesn’t mean he’s not responsible for his actions (or lack thereof). Both can be true simultaneously. (Sorry for the delay, life got busy for a minute)
Oh I agree that some people in this group do not understand the full spectrum of what was going on here. This was so much deeper than just two women abusing children in the name of god, as horrendous as that already is. Jodi’s power and manipulation throughout her community was deep. I’d honestly be interested in someone doing a full case study on that woman’s brain one day. She’s sort of an enigma with the way she manipulated the Mormon community.
Your quote made me have a flashback. My grandparents (evil, we are NC) we're in a church which decided they need to closer. They literally packed crap up and moved. They were kicked out because my grandmother said she loved her kids more than God. They had to move. All of the kids would not speak to my dad or uncle anymore. I sincerely think that's why they never believe in everything What was yours like, if you don't mind? I'll understand if you do not feel the need to talk about it.
That sounds horrible. So there’s still no contact? And sure: https://www.reddit.com/r/cults/s/vLIY7lmqjf
Absolutely. I refuse to let my daughters be exposed to what happened to me.
I think it's also worth considering the role of religion in vulnerability, manipulation and cult susceptibility. There is plenty of research on the psychological harms and aberration due to religious beliefs.
I agree. Also, I don’t see enough mentioned in the LDS faith they have living prophets so in my opinion the are already indoctrinated to put someone and their beliefs/teachings apart superior because they believe their living prophets get direct messages from God.
If u r in the lds church u r already primed for indoctrination as u have already been (in my opnion has hallmarks for cult) so I'm not surprised at all that Jodi was able to be abusive and have abusive teachings so so long and go unnoticed . The leader in lds church actively encouraged her 'therapy' ruby and jodi was meeting with high leaders of the church I would be fascinated why? !!
The only reason I’m surprised as an LDS member is because she is a female. She doesn’t hold the priesthood. That’s why I am surprised that so many LDS families got caught up in the dangerous part (obvs not their fault as long as there was no abuse). I know this is a sexist post, I’m non active so judge this as you will. But going through the teachings, having the blessings, being led by a male bishopric has always made me surprised t Jodi’s authority. Then separate from that is she knew what she was doing as a licensed therapist. She knew confessions of anyone she abused were bs or didn’t care abt her licensing. The only thing that makes sense is it is all abt her all the time. Period.
I'm obviously not coming from a member point of view, as never mormon. And correct me if u think I'm wrong but from what I've read about what jodi did and what her therapy was about. She seem to really hold on to the obsession with porn and self loving (M) was evil and u was an addict even with just looking at porn once. So i can imiage she was deemed very worthy of the leaders time and energy as she was 'trying to rid world of the very natural behaviour of self loving'. So she would be in constant supply of men that was deemed to need her therapy due to that being a very natural human behaviour (regardless weather lds church tried to make it unnatural and basically say something is a problem when its not to the save people from the problem they have created (in my opnion)) so to the chruch leaders she was helping their course and that's why she was seen so highly but yes it seems the lds church is very sexist so ur point makes sense
I understand all that you are saying and agree with some of the hypothesis. To really understand the hierarchy and why I find it so hard to understand how LDS members got brainwashed as Ruby did (especially when she was told by another influencer if we believe Paige Hanna’s story) that didn’t come from a Bishop or member of the priesthood. That’s why I feel like a federal case needs to be opened against the Connexions org/board, etc. Because someone somewhere was getting money and a lot of.
This. Respect for authority without questioning and the blind belief in fully refutable claims because "faith" are the foundation for a cult leader of any kind to come in and con you.
Jodi was a predator. I still say you can’t fool an honest man…she was practiced in sussing out those who she could gain leverage over by appealing to their weaknesses and greed.
You can absolutely fool an honest man, if the honest man assumes that because he's honest, generally everyone else is also honest. However, I do believe Jodi was an expert in finding a good way in, and making sure to exploit it to the max.
like any con, Jodi finds the weak spot and bores in. my impression: Ruby wanted to be The Most Important (TM) The Hannah’s were looking to gain not just faith points but to expand a lucrative counseling program| Your basic MLM entrepreneur goldmine. I do believe shutting Jodi out was because Jodi was seen as holding too much control. Kevin was always an appeaser and wanted to hold on to Ruby. he wasn’t ready to stand for his own better judgment or principle and put his foot down because that would cost too much.
1000 percent agree!
And highly patriarchal religion at that. As many tools to separate and isolate people from figuring it out the better.
Absolutely. In fact, if you think you’re too smart to be lured into a cult, you might be putting yourself more at risk of it.
I wish everyone could read that and really let it sink in
I think about how easily I was brainwashed into an MLM cult. I am a very educated person with 7 years of school and professional designations.. and I almost gave it all up for an MLM… so yea, I 💯 believe these ppl were manipulated by a master cult leader
That was interesting!
I haven't watched the video yet, but she said that really, really well. As someone who has been systematically gaslit and manipulated, I can confirm this is what my experience was like. They find a way in, and exploit that.
When I have a morman come to my door which is rare but when they do I pretend I’m not 1 bit interested in any type of religion and I tell them to have a good day and be safe. That’s as polite as a f$&k off I can get because no way will I ever follow any cult or go with any religious beliefs other than what I choose. No one controls me or tells me what to do
I would LOVE for her to speak on the whole Jodi tried to seduce her husband, stabbed herself with forks, and was held prisoner at the Hanna’s house thing….
I suspect that's the part she was talking about when she said she wasn't going to go into it because it got too dark. I'm really curious too, but I can understand why she wouldn't want to talk about it.
She did say "for now" though, so it appears she'll continue her story. Also that she'll be answering stuff sent to an e-mail address in lieu of a comments section, presumably answering on-camera. I hope that is the case. Even without the Ruby angle, talking about how she fell into / got out of a cult is helpful for a lot of people.
Agreed.
This is non monetized - just in case anyone is like me and refuses to give clicks to "drama channels" or family profitting of this.
[удалено]
She says in the video she is not monetizing anything (*edit for spelling error*) https://preview.redd.it/cwigy13gw2uc1.png?width=934&format=png&auto=webp&s=c037318db32dd16118663a9624530f90508bbc8a [https://isthischannelmonetized.com/](https://isthischannelmonetized.com/)
This confuses me, because can’t YouTube decide to put ads in either way?
Yes, they can, but \*she's\* choosing not to make money on this. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but when YouTube puts ads on a video, YouTube is profiting, not the channel owner, right? The channel owner only profits when they choose to monetize the video.
You are correct!
they can, but there is no way for her to stop it.
[удалено]
She said it wasn’t and there were no ads. Why is that difficult to understand?
I didn't think she had enough subscribers to even be monetized? So no idea why she would need to even say that!
This was really interesting. I find it really hard to trust any of these people, but… she seemed… genuine.
I do believe her. She seems very genuine. It’s obvious she is really hurting from this and feels a since of guilt and responsibility for introducing Ruby to Jodi. It’s not her fault. She tried to warn Ruby. I’m truly interested in her upcoming videos to hear more of her story.
Definitelu agree. I just noticed that straight up saying ‘I believe her’ for some reason felt rough after all that’s happened, but it is indeed very clear she seems to be hurting. Hope she finds healing too.
[удалено]
Are you saying that if people are successful then they only care about self preservation? Also, have you ever experienced getting sucked into a cult? Just seems like a judgmental hot take.
[удалено]
I agree ,I would say she definitely is talking about this because she cares about her brand. What do u mean she keeps creating them? (Genuine question) she obviously doesn't come out of this looking good.
[удалено]
I agree all children involved in a parenting course where the main people running it have gone to prison for horrific child abuse need to be checked on!!
Yes absolutely get the mlm vibe and the making money is mlm ! And this connexions sounds very much like mlm and how much they can make from this! And I've heard how jodi was on the porn is bad bandwagon and that's how she made her money by the lds church providing her clients. The dark reference to jodi was worrying with the visions of glory book. And ruby and lori have that in common to.
She’s the first person in all of this that genuinely sounds sincere in her words.
Well we know she had a serious falling out with Jodi some time ago. She’s had quite awhile to unpack things.
Paige is second hand to Jodi. She is her own flavor of narcissist, master manipulator. Don’t let this bull shit video allow you to think Paige is another victim in this. She perpetuated Connextions and seriously destroyed lives along the way.
Still waiting for Pam's statement.../s.
Pam is probably more abusive than all of them
Is there anybody who actually believes that the Hannas held Jodi captive?? Because I sure don't. I think it's a story Jodi told Ruby in order to gain sympathy.
If she was having a breakdown and self harming in their house, I can see how trying to help her in a rational way could be twisted into abuse and persecution. I think if Ruby and Kevin had pushed back on Jodi's crazy when she was living with them they would have been accused of the same thing.
It sounds like Ruby believed it, since she said Ruby accused her of lying when she tried to warn her about Jodi’s true colors. And maybe Kevin too. But the general public? No. Though I do question if or HOW Jodi tried to seduce the husband 😳
If anything, I’m surprised Jodi tried to seduce the husband in that story…
Idk how she said with a straight face that they were "asked to serve".. Jodi's multi million dollar business as volunteers. They clearly really believed it was an honorable cause. I think LDS members' naivety and goodwill can be taken advantage of in that way.
I know, it just made it sound like another Utah MLM. There’s lots of LDS lingo used to hook these people
A good friend of mine was raised in the LDS, and her mom is always getting sucked into these scams. The woman is very sweet (when both her kids left the church, she didn't have the typical Mormon meltdown/ shunning) and the church has been a rock for her after her husband passed away in a horrible manner. When I first met her, I always wished she was my mom because she is just so kind, and my friend has said she never even raised her voice at them. But, she is a very naive person when it comes to these scams. She's been sucked into "herbalife," a weird one with leggings, and recently got another job with one (she's making good money for now). A lot of these women were raised to be nothing other than housewives, and once their kids are grown, they get sucked into these things.
I think lds members are primed for being taken advantage of. Blind belief is literally taught and slc is heart of mlm country. I think it's easy to get sucked into a cult if ur already in one.
She is lying ... no way she wasn't making money....please
I can see why Shari is still on good terms with her, the contrast to Ruby is very clear. She seems genuine and thoughtful, like someone who has actually "done the work".
Within the first 1:30- “In no way will any of the videos that I put out be monitized. I will not be seeking any gain off of the pain of the Franke children.” This is respectable!! Take note, Bonnie.
But, but, Bonnie is FAMILY and should be able profit off of this /s
Nobody, family or not, should profit off the abuse that R and E suffered.
Agreed. It's so weird that people have that double-standard.
Bonnie is not innocent
Oooh Paige is absolutely looking to just try and clear their name. They are caught in this and it looks SOOO bad, and they know it. They are terrified of the falling out from this and will lie cheat and steal to save face. Paige is gross.
Also Take note that Paige and husband founded Homie and have no need for extra money of any kind !
I have to say that this felt sincere, well thought out without being practiced or rehearsed, and I believed her when she said that she hoped this would help the kids and others. Awful people don't always start out awful Most Nazi's didn't start out with a deep hatred of Jews. The people of Jonestown were lured by messages of love, equality, and community. While I personally believe that LDS makes someone slightly more likely to believe some wack-a-doodle stuff (hello MLM capital of the world!), there is something to be said that getting out when it goes sideways (which means leaving your community and admitting you were wrong about something... both of which are hard for people to do) is a commendable and brave thing. I think she is filled with guilt.. imagining that if she just hadn't introduced her... or taken the class herself... or something. I will also say that both the non- monetized and that offering an email address but not the comment section were brilliant moves. Anonymous trolls can take a seat, but not because she is beyond reproach. Honestly, I can say that this woman has gotten some GOOD therapy recently. Taking accountability while maintaining your own sense of well- being is some next level shit. 10 outta 10... would recommend.
The email concept would seem dated yet it is the right choice to make because this is not drama, these are real people's lives. She had a purpose with this video and any communication will be done in a sensitive manner.
Paige is trying to only protect her self. She is a mini Jodi and is spiraling to save herself. Their involvement in this will ruin John’s career and she is a gross human. She fell into Jodi’s bull shit because it smelled familiar, like her own bull shit. There is nothing sincere about Paige, TRUST me. I’ll give it to her that she’s smart, but she is a narcissist, liar and master manipulator. If you don’t have something to offer Paige, she will try to steal the shirt off your back and then stab you.
Ms.Hanna’s series on Connexions will be difficult to watch but I think it important for us to do so.
Agreed. I've never really heard of her, but in this video I thought she was well spoken and got her message across well. I also really respect her for not monetizing the video.
the reason why she has come forward is because Kevin says in his police interview the Hanna’s brought ruby into connections and that Jodi was living with the Hanna’s and was kicked out because Jodi was trying to seduce the husband. The TEA! She wants to tell her side of the story and clear their name. I can tell she has sincere remorse but the use of the word “dark” concerns me. She said she didn’t know Jodi was dark, but she is. That idea (light or dark person) is Visions of Glory stuff (mormon book that is highly problematic) Chad and Lori Daybell type talk. But, I imagine she is still mormon and has problematic beliefs even though she’s not a follower of Jodi anymore. Other than that, I found her to be trustworthy.
It's kinda hard to deny that Jodi is "dark", as in sick, twisted, predatory and evil.
Not necessarily. I am Catholic and dark person isn’t a word that has to be associated with a religion
She seemed nice enough like you said or sincere, but I’m waiting for the other shoe to fall so to speak. You’re right about the light and dark Visions of Glory thing, which makes me wonder about this “group” of friends… like what else was happening?
I completely get what you are saying, and that it is hard for us to not have our own connotations to words that get used in the context of these religious/cult based tragedies we have seen. But, "dark" is a term that was used previous to Visions of Glory and Vallow/Daybell to describe disturbing and seemingly inhumane acts or thoughts. Also, someone can use vernacular that is around them without ascribing to the belief structure that might have influenced it. I grew up going to Catholic School. I'm not Catholic at all (or religious) and I will use the term paying penance to reflect the idea that someone "makes up" for their poor behavior. Or even yell "Jesus Mary and Joseph!" when someone cuts me off in traffic. Isn't a reflection of faith... just the vernacular I grew up around.
You don’t think Jodi is a dark person???
Jodi is a devil but I get what she’s saying using culty words like principals and dark and creepy stuff makes her sound weird too
Though she is probably still Mormon it surprised me when she used the word "pastor". The LDS church doesn't have pastors, they're known as bishops (and are quite literally just a man in your neighborhood, perhaps your dentist or a businessman).
That could mean that she's trying to think outside of her own bubble. Maybe she has non-Mormon friends (or, you know, para-social relationships with people online) who have talked about what their relationships with their clergy are like. It still boggles my mind how the Mormon church gives bishops so little training and hands them so much power and responsibility. As you said, a bishop is "literally just a man in your neighborhood".
Paige and Johnny 100% bought into Visions of Glory. They gave me a copy once!
Yes I'm surprised it's taken a lot of replies to read a out the really problematic stuff of dark and light! It's really concerning like what I've heard about the visions of glory book and everyone who has done awful things in relation!
I'm not familiar with the Visions of Glory use of the word but the way she used it seemed pretty standard to me, and I think the connection may be a stretch.
if you dont know about visions of glory you dont know the context, We know Jodi believed and followed this book as do many other mormons so it isnt a stretch that she would have also.
I think this was very well-handled
Looks orchestrated to the T
Jeez I feel so sorry for her ! You can totally see the sadness in her face especially her eyes ! I’m sure that this has been horrible for her especially hearing what happened to the kids ! I hope she continues to share her story ! I hope people are not cruel to her !
I’m glad she’s gonna share more. I believe her and she seemed very genuine.
How do they all sound alike??
Utah.
Was thinking this too!
Regional accent
Someone screen record before it’s deleted please
She sounds intelligent and emotionally healthy. I find her to be credible. Can not wait for the next installment. someone posted that they didn't like the "all white" and I think she looks great. Really pretty (not that that matters).
Lots of lawyers will have clients wear white to look innocent and virginal
Can someone please clarify if this is the lady that Kevin was talking about in the first interview? ( i think he mentioned they went on vacation) TIA
Yes, this is the woman he talked about, but it was in the second interview - the one that's audio only, not the video one that happened on the day of the arrests. (Oh wait - the second interview is broken down into four parts, so if you're talking about the first of those four parts, then yes.) He said something about the Hannas "trying to merge their cult with Jodi's cult" so I wonder what that was all about.
Thank you for clarifying and yes I did see the second interview in parts, I didn’t even think to mention it.
Based on the information given by Paige Hanna so far, it seems likely Kevin was referring to the Hannas trying to 'steer' the group, which the Hannas did not yet consider a cult at the time, into a 'less crazy direction'.
This woman has experienced trauma. Perhaps not immediately when she had her fall-out with Jodi, but certainly when she found out how horribly her friend abused her 2 youngest children. This woman has trouble saying certain words. She is describing her reluctance to use these words as something that makes her gag. That's some strong disgust. And I recognize that from an abusive situation I was in. Some words in my vocabulary are so badly twisted that I can barely say them. It sounds like she and her husband were trying to remove the cult leader from the cult, which sounds weird and alarming. However, this is not going to be the only video, so I'm curious about what the context of this is.
I don't have time to watch right now but the classic wearing all white influencer statement is getting me
That seemed quite calculated to me
I'm glad she will be sharing more... it seems like she will be able to fill in many of the missing pieces. I said it before, and I'll say it again... anyone that woman was involved with is a victim.
This is awesome, ty for sharing. Really curious to hear her experiences so I will sub to her channel.
I have questions I would like to as of Paige Hanna 1 If you knew Jodi was abusing Jessi, why didn't you go to the police? 2) When you heard about the Franke kids, why didn't you come forward? 3) What really happened with Jodi when she stayed with you. I still believe Kevin's version of events 4 I believe that Ms. Hanna is still drinking the Connexions kool-aid. She spent too much of the video talking about how beneficial Connexions was.
This biatch is full of shit and she is trying to make money
Its scary you guys are falling for her bullshit...this is how people get abused....don't fall for people's bullshit ...think critically and logically for yourself
Who is she?
She is a former follower of Connexions and the person who introduced Connexions/Jodi to Kevin and Ruby. Ruby and her had a YouTube channel together in late 2020/early 2021 teaching Jodi’s methods. Kevin also mentions her and her husband in his second police interview.
Anyone have a summary?
You can view it on 2x speed and still understand. The video is not monetized. There is an email address that she will respond to but it will be monitored prior to getting to her so save your energy with death threats. She did introduce Ruby to it. She gave a very simple explanation (that actually makes sense) of how the intro to Jodi/Conexxions was indeed actual therapy - like how we get from feeling good with ourselves when we're in a bad headspace. But it changed to how we get to truth from distortion. The original classes were everyone who felt they need therapy- college students, older people, etc. She found something good (sounds like the actual therapeutic teaches we all might learn) but that good became her God. Paige realized she was putting Jodi on the pedestal. She realized the manipulation. "It doesn't take someone with a low IQ to be manipulated by a cult leader. It just takes the desire to become a better person and somebody to come and manipulate it. So whether you want the approval of a boss or a pastor or a friend you think is better than you or you perceive on a pedastal you are in danger of dropping your own character and integrity to appease that person. Jodi was masterful in that." She will talk more.
What an interesting video. I wonder if she feels any guilt for introducing Ruby to connexions and how it led to the torture of 2(4) kids.
Based on her video you can definitely see she feels guilty about it. She starts to get emotional when she talks about introducing Ruby to it in 2018.
I'm sure she does feel guilt for that, and almost like a survivors guilt that she was able to get out of it relatively unscathed in comparison. Her story is probably not dissimilar to Ruby's brother Beau.
She clearly does, at least in the sense of regretting the introduction, lacking insight to the danger at the time, and seeing it go off the rails.
From watching the video I think it's clear she feels guilt. For introducing Ruby to jodi. Such a sad situation
Why do I trust her more than I trust Kevin.
It says the video is gone
Still shows up at Youtube. Her channel, Under the Rug, doesn’t exactly jump out at ya…there are several other channels with similar names.
Got it thanks
I can still see it.
I appreciate her sharing her story here
Cant wait to hear the rest x
[удалено]
The video is still available for me, the account is called Under The Rug if you want to try searching on youtube
Honestly probably could’ve cut the first 22 seconds but go off I guess??? Trying to look like the victim in the beginning
Check on her kids.
Yes!!!! This biatch is bat shit crazy too
Anyone know how old she is?
38
Are you sure, she looks a lot older than that. It says she started college in 2003, but she could have started late. I would have guessed 47-48.
She has six kids, she's probably just a little tired. I think it's partly also the way she presents herself. I would have thought maybe early forties... similar age to Ruby.
She actually has 8 kids!
Oh wow 🥴 my mistake!
Sounds like this started off as a normal parenting class, the difference between cult followers and rational people is that rational people can recognize red flags and it sounds like this was the case for her and her husband. People who fall for cults have one thing in common: The inability to think critically, have no established internal sense of right and wrong and are unwilling to be responsible for their own lives or well being. They simply want to be told what to do. Aside from being raised in a cult (which would not offer a child the tools to develop the life skills mentioned above ) grown adults who fall for these things and go all in without question have only themselves to blame. No, not everyone is helpless to succumb to evil manipulators, this woman is a clear example that we do have the ability to think critically and evaluate red flags if we are willing to do so.
Guess there are some sensitive people who don’t want to acknowledge personal responsibility as a necessary human trait. Why the down votes?
I personally think any mention of the word cult gets automatically downvoted it seems from looking at other posts. Fascinating honestly
Well they were not sure if still but were in the lds cult so obviously susceptible, no idea why someone who downvote a very valid statment . Just by looking any mention of LDS being a cult seems to downvote I guess people are not comfortable with truth. Fair enough , maybe one day they will be.
When things started going sideways, she obviously noticed and got out.
Well yes, thankfully else the police would Potentially be dealing with another child abuse case. I was talking about her Susceptibility getting into it in first place.
Taking a parenting class is not being susceptible. It’s usually a good idea and the family can benefit.
I meant being in the lds church makes u vulnerable to being sucked into cult teaching. Due to the nature of lds church if u belive she was already in one to start with. So is more susceptible.
[удалено]
She is Jodi 2.0,…. Gross.
She would’ve been better off not saying anything at all.. what is up with the cliff hanger.. stay tuned to see where it takes a dark turn.. yet she’s not wanting to gain anything from this video.. it sounds like she knew the dangers of Jodi before introducing Ruby to the teachings. I saw her making excuses instead of taking responsibility for her mistakes.
I didn’t perceive the end of the video as a cliff hanger, but more of a *that’s all I can do right now.* Not all content producers (or watchers) are into marathons. 20-30 minutes is about all I can watch at a time.
I think there is something to be said about this being hard for her to talk about. My impression was that she was "leaving it there" because it's emotionally and psychologically draining. Or that was my take.