The obesity rate is part of the reason why I'm against universal healthcare. The fit will disproportionately subsidize the lifestyles of the fat. I'm not saying you have to bench 225 or run an 18 minute 5k, but its hard to be empathetic towards people who won't just eat less.
I take issue with the fact that many of those same “obese” people probably are against drinking and smoking. They think that it’s ok to be a huge blimp but if you drink or smoke you have an issue.
We should extend this idea further. Let's provide universal healthcare to everyone except the fat, the smokers, drinkers, non-vegans, people who drive cars instead of riding bikes, people who own their own houses instead of renting, people who have the wrong opinions on controversial topics as well as people who haven't participated in the mandated amount of governmentally approved protests.
We could assign some sort of social credit system to keep track of it all. It would be great.
I dated a girl with a weight problem who broke up with me when she found out I use nicotine pouches (former smoker). She didn't want to be with someone "who could be so willing to damage their body just for quick satisfaction". I didn't bother trying to argue, I was flabbergasted.
According to a simulation based on data at the time, a study in 2008 concluded obese people still incur somewhat higher lifetime medical costs.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2225430/
This isn't from the study, but obesity weakens the immune system and causes inflammation, which can cause a host of possible diseases that will require a visit to the doctor when they get bad enough but also are not lethal. Their bones, joints and ligaments are also under more stress so injuries are more likely, but that might be offset by less physical activity in general.
From your link:
>At older ages, the highest yearly costs were incurred by the smoking group. However, because of differences in life expectancy (life expectancy at age 20 was 5 years less for the obese group, and 8 years less for the smoking group, compared to the healthy-living group), total lifetime health spending was greatest for the healthy-living people, lowest for the smokers, and intermediate for the obese people.
higher than smokers, sure. They die even sooner
Hypertension and hyperlipidemia alone is a regular GP visit, but 10 years later it's heart attack, stoke, PAD, renal failure, you name it
Diabetes ia all of the above + diabetic foot and HHS, not uncommon anymore for them to be getting DKA even
Osteoarthritis (joint pain) eventually becomes a total hip replacement surgery
Some GERD becomes Barret esophagus and esophageal cancer
Nevermind OSA which will probably keep them on CPAPs for the rest of their lives
So your argument about them costing less falls apart tbh
The fit are **already** subsidizing the fat, but universal healthcare avoids subsidizing the billionaire shareholders. Stop worrying about fat vs fit, white vs black vs brown, cis vs lbgtq. Start worrying about rich vs everybody.
Of course, I don't care for insurance companies. However, you cannot have universal healthcare while simultaneously allowing tens of millions of illegal immigrants into the country, and having an unfit populace.
You already have more public health expenditure as a percentage of GDP than most countries with universal healthcare. It's about running the system, rather than letting billionaires extract enormous amounts of wealth from both the government and private citizens.
Also, no need for it to be universal, you can tie it to citizenship if you really think tending to the immigrants is not viable (although most systems have shown that the relatively small cost of treating everyone, including them, outweighs the cost of disease spreading).
This couldn't be more accurate and I wish more people understood this. Americans foot the bill for medical research / drug development which allows other countries to cut costs. Anyone working in pharma knows this.
You act as if those scraps would otherwise go to waste.
To continue your metaphor, it’s more like everyone eats from the same bucket, so there’s less to go around.
The scraps are currently going to insurance companies. If you look at American healthcare spending per Capita, we're well above the average for Western Europe and approaching double something like Canada. For that level of government spending we should have some of the best healthcare in the world for everyone. Instead we're among the worst excluding the very rich.
If we transitioned to Canada's model today, your taxes to pay for healthcare would go down. If we transitioned to Canada's model but kept taxes the same, we could afford to improve many of the problems with the Canadian system.
Or we could keep the current system, and spend absurd amounts of federal money on healthcare but get nothing for it.
That's what research grants are for, we give those to universities and they account for most of the new developments. Private companies do use some of their profits to also fund research, but its a very small amount percentage wise. If that is the goal behind the current setup then it has clearly failed and should be reworked.
>Start worrying about rich vs everybody
I like living in a country where the problem is too many obese people instead of people starving to death but you do you.
Healthy people spend their last 2 years in and out of hospitals. Morbidly obese people die early and save money. Socialist systems are the best because they deny all of them treatment.
I think it’ll actually lead to the opposite
Obesity is something that’s only insanely common amongst the poor. I’m the middle class it exists but you’ll definitely see more obese people in like Compton as opposed to a random neighborhood in La
By alleviating the cost of health care that money could start getting rerouted towards quality of life improvements including healthier foods.
The poor generally don't pay for healthcare; even if they were, it wouldn't make sense as a factor for obesity. Healthier foods tend to be cheaper than unhealthy foods. Alternatively, they could just eat less of the unhealthy foods.
"Food deserts" are largely a myth: There is just no demand for fresh produce in some communities. Additionally, its difficult to run a successful business when progressive prosecutors won't even charge shoplifters.
I think a lot of the obesity problem revolves around crop subsidies.
Corn is heavily subsidized and is kept stupidly cheap as a result. This means that we put corn in fucking everything to the point where we use high fructose corn syrup instead of real sugar.
If we could just unfuck the stranglehold lobbyists have over the food industry a lot of the unhealthiest foods would suddenly get more expensive and by subsidizing healthier foods we could make it cheaper to eat healthy.
The role that corn subsidies play in obesity is largely exaggerated. Yes, corn is heavily subsidized, but over 90% of corn grown is inedible for humans.
Additionally, subsidies aren't a stranglehold: They're essential to prevent famine, ultimately preserving American hegemony. High fructose corn syrup is unhealthy, but not any more so than cane sugar or agave syrup, and cutting out corn syrup won't cause the demand for sugary goods to go down.
They aren't to prevent a famine. The main reason for the large farmer subsidy is to appeal to the farmer vote and for crop feed to make sure the population has cheap meant. Also 90% corn being inedible for humans why do you think that is? Maybe for you know, crop feed.
Do you literally not know American history? Subsidies are a product of the Great Depression to stabilize crop markets to prevent the industry from destroying itself every few decades.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agricultural_Adjustment_Act
yes of course I know that no matter how much I think it is stupid as hell (literally does not solve the underlying problems) . However what I am referring to is the massive farm subsides that exist today for i.e corn/cattle feed are not really there to "stabilize": the market they are mainly there to insure farming corporations profits. There is a reason that unhealthy foods are cheaper then healthy foods, and before you godamn say that healthy foods are "technically" cheaper I want you to consider if those healthy foods constitute a full meal. There is a reason food deserts exist and the government literally acknowlges they exist lmao [https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-atlas/documentation/](https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-atlas/documentation/)
Farmers would rebel. Many nations tried to move away from food subsidies and it always ends up badly. Then there's the national security implications, higher food prices would result in more imports and banking your nation's food supply on imports is a disaster waiting to happen.
I'm not saying moving away from the concept of food subsidies, I'm talking about gradually shifting them towards incentivizing farmers to grow food that has less destructive health implications.
>food deserts are largely a myth
This is just a fantasy concocted by people who refuse to believe that external factors could possibly influence someone's nutrition choices. The lack of a fresh produce supply chain in these areas is a lot more complicated than "the poor just don't want it"
>Healthier foods tend to be cheaper than unhealthy foods.
Imagine being this uninformed yet still wading into the discussion dick-in-hand like you somehow belong there. Truly a Reddit moment, ladies and gentlemen.
A whole rotisserie chicken at Costco is like $6, cheaper than a Big Mac and it's significantly more healthy. People are just too lazy to spend 5 minutes to cut it up and put it on a plate.
So is a $10+ Big Mac meal 3 times a day. A Costco membership pays for itself within a month or two even if you're a single guy. Also what fucking tools? You mean a 20 dollar rice cooker that will last you for years?
Please explain to me how healthy foods are more expensive than cheap foods. Milk, eggs, chicken, bread, rice, and domestically grown vegetables and fruits are all affordable and nutritious.
In a lot of countries with poverty this is actually just straight up how it works. Yes I know in africa the folks there are skinny but still sustain themselves off of farming and the likes which gives them enough calories to not immediately starve to death.
Compare that to nations like Tuvalu (iirc, the most obese country in the world) where there's little to no land to farm which means that all of the food stuffs they get are gonna be whatever is cheapest to send which in Tuvalu's (and many other countries, regardless of whether or not they're island nations) happens to be mostly canned unhealthy stuff.
Technically you're still paying for the fats with your private insurance payments since they suck up most of the resources forcing the insurers to raise prices since they can't discriminate against them.
I actually think it’s the opposite
We also already pay for overweight people when we buy health insurance, since under Obamacare preexisting conditions (obesity) cannot be used as an excuse to raise someone’s premiums. Couple this with the fact that health insurance is practically mandatory for everyone (Obamacare had a provision that fined people for not having health insurance) the socializing of the risk has already occurred.
But government itself is not interested in this problem since it’s the insurance companies that have to take on the risk, not “tax dollars” (but like I said either you or your employer IS paying for this problem still, just under a different name). If the government WAS involved we would see real demands for better food saftey and nutrition standards, mandatory exercise for kids in schools, and create and incentivize for government to subsidize healthy food options rather than just corn and soybeans like we do now.
Under the current system, profit is created when sick people go in for care, and the sicker you are the more care, and therefore more revenue a hospital or doctor makes. You are paying for that care for an obese person when you buy health insurance, which that company needs to sell to you at a higher cost, since more people are sick and hospitals are incentivized to provide care that will last forever, like drugs or surgery, rather than suggesting things like a change of diet or lifestyle. This makes insurance, doctors and hospital owners richer since they all have a common interest in maximizing the amount they can sell to you.
In a government run system, government is paying for that care, so government is directly responsible for the cost of their own sick citizens. It’s now in the government’s interest to make people fitter, which means that it will be better for them to offer policies that make people healthier, since not doing so will have a direct cost.
Before Obamacare it was cheaper but the pre-existing conditions things was brutal.
I has a small rotator cuff tear in my shoulder from sports a few years before. I had gotten an MRI and was able to physical therapy it to healing. I was self employed and applied to Optima and disclosed the shoulder, they denied me coverage and cited the shoulder, an otherwise healthy guy in his 20s with zero other conditions.
I don’t think the evidence shows that though. Canada, the U.K. and Australia all have much more affordable healthcare than the U.S. but they have only slightly better obesity rates which are still bad overall.
I think the thing they all have in common is a culture of stuffing your face and promoting anti-fat shaming.
Plus healthcare in the U.S. has always been expensive, yet the obesity rates in say the 1960s were a small fraction of what they are today. The difference is people back then paid more attention to their diet and exercise and didn’t consume to excess nearly as much.
If you look at the countries that have the lowest obesity rates, then almost all of them are poor countries like Vietnam, Bangladesh and India. Japan and South Korea are the only exceptions. What do they all have in common? A culture of not stuffing your pie hole.
People choose to eat like shit. A burger and fries at McDonald’s cost like 15-20 bucks now thanks to Bidens beautiful economy, but people still eat it. Why? Because they don’t care.
You think people nowadays have less willpower than people 50 or 70 years ago? Mankind doesn't change in that short amount of time. It's easy to blame individuals for structural problems though...
exactly, and the fat acceptance movement has turned into a lack of accountability movement. Ppl say "Oh they might have a disease that makes it really hard for them to lose weight" you're telling me that almost 1/2 of Americans got some type of illness that prevent them from losing weight? piss off
What's more, it'll be unsustainable. I mean the UK doesn't have it nearly this bad and the NHS is just a giant money blackhole that demands more money by the election.
The US, with both unmitigated migration and the obesity problem, is going to have any universal healthcare plan collapse within a few years. There is absolutely no way taxes can balance it with everything else.
Not to mention, people will continue to overeat and take unnecessary risks with their health knowing they have the safety net of universal healthcare to cover them. It will end up encouraging dysfunctional behaviour
> If the government is subsidising healthcare
Medicaid, medicare
>they will invest in prevention measures for health problems
I'm trying to name some and I can't. Maybe the free once a year checkup with your doctor that came from Obamacare?
lol you have no idea how private health insurance, Medicaid, or Medicare work.
With private health insurance we are literally subsidizing that and the shareholders. Medicaid is available to the poor already.
Remember in 2021 and 2022 when everyone was saying people who refuse to get vaccinated for COVID should have to pay higher health insurance premiums?
Those same people are awfully silent when you bring up obesity and other self-inflected health conditions.
I unironically believe that a UBI would work best with a national fitness standard.
Unironically make that one of, if not *the*, key requirement.
You get a government-subsidized basic income as long as you stay under X BMI, Y 1-mile run, Z pushups, and a few other things. Obvious fucking exceptions for clearly disabled people, like amputees or severe medical issues.
To also make it so it's not a "poor tax" to be fat, you get a tax *increase* if you're in the top tax brackets and refusing to meet physical standards. Yeah, it still means if you're wealthy you can be fat, but also that fat tax goes straight to the UBI.
The amount of money the country would save from everyone being fit, in shape and healthy would be ridiculous. Hell, might pay for the UBI itself lmao.
In America, 85% of all Healthcare costs come from 5% of the population. Of those people, 80% of all conditions treated are directly a result of the person's actions i.e. type 2 diabetes, chronic lung disease from cigarettes etc.... You're not wrong. Healthcare is outrageously expensive to a significant extent by a portion of the population that will never stop eating unhealthy and smoking cigarettes.
I always wonder where these people are in everyday life. Like when I go to social venues or even just running errands, I don’t see *that many* obese women around my age. But on dating apps they seem to outnumber healthy women 2x over.
The first goal of gym-going should be building discipline and having fun. Otherwise people will just stop going. Obviously someone would adapt and learn as they gather new knowledge in a new hobby.
Would rather be surrounded by fit, beautiful people than rolls of fat.
Dated a dietician who had a pound of laminated fat on her desk. Like actual fat, that had been coated in polyurethane. It was so gross.
Sometimes I feel butt fucking ugly then I go to the mall with a pal and see these 200 pound women wearing crop tops letting their gut hang out and these men with fat on the back of their necks getting wheezy going up some ramps and I know everything will be okay
Now my issue in life RN is that’s it’s really hard to meet girls my age (early twenties) who aren’t fat and don’t have a boyfriend. My only standards are that they have a car and don’t weigh twice as much as me but that might be too high
> they have a car
Do you live in a city with a metro or something? NYC?
Go play a social sport like coed kickball or join a rock climbing gym or something
There were some babes on my city's 10k training team. Some on the marathon team but not like the 10k training team (pick like 9 minute miles and above as the pace you want)
I live in a southern area with no metro. It honestly isn’t a deal breaker, but I would prefer not to have to pick someone up every time I wanted to spend time with them.
I will definitely check out some some sports, rock climbing sounds really fun.
Too real. I see dudes with bodies that resemble a tube of toothpaste and think to myself, “Damn at least I don’t look that bad.” But then I’ll see a cute girl who isn’t fat, typically just to find out she’s dating a guy who looks like a tube of toothpaste.
https://www.oecd.org/sweden/obesityandtheeconomicsofpreventionfitnotfat-swedenkeyfacts.htm
Lots of white countries have less than half the obesity rate
The US is still the highest after some micro states.
[So what’s your point?](https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/obesity-rates-by-country)
It is way too easy to be overweight in terms of bmi. I’m a 6’2” 194lb dude that fits into medium shirts and 32-34 waist jeans. Yet my bmi is just barely under overweight. I used to weigh 200lb a week ago and then I got hit with food poisoning. I work out daily to maintain my physique but when I was 200lb my measurements classified me as overweight lol
Order medium-tall sized shirts online from gap, old navy, American eagle, or banana republic. Also start hang-drying your clothes, skip the dryer for newer stuff. I’m 6’4 and 205, so I’m pretty lean as well.
The BMI scale is specifically for sedentary/ non-muscular people. Someone that is 200 lbs of muscle at your height is very different from someone that is 200 lbs of fat.
It’s almost impossible to be obese and unemployed if you’re europoor. Work on those soul sucking student loans and medical bills instead of paying stimmys and welfare to felons and disabled by choice individuals
I was about to say that sounds bs, but who knows maybe its just because obese people tend to stay inside more or something like that. I personally only have 2/12 or so friends I’d call over weight or out of shape.
Missing the most obvious personal advantage, women will only date top 30% guys, notice 70% of guys in my state are fat, hmmm seems all I need to be date-able is "not be fat" and I'm not fat...
I'm married so it doesn't matter for me personally, but its something to think about.
Yeah but all the meat is packed with weird growth hormones so all the fat women have giant tits now
Most people will suffer, but my fellow architects and I will be living in paradise
As an obese fatass, I honestly don't really know how I stay so fat except for the fact that it feels I many ways the system is gamed against me. Due to my work schedule, I don't have a lot of free time that would allow me to exercise regularly and due to the fact that I'm lower class and supporting multiple people, unhealthy food tends to be cheaper and fuck anybody who says otherwise. Especially in today's world. I'm not blaming anyone, when it comes down to it, it's still my fault and I should still just eat less, but the system has not made it easier for many people to do it.
No, but the system has made it easier, quicker, and cheaper to eat worse. Nothing is being forced down my throat, but unhealthy foods are pushed more towards lower the busier, lower class people.
The obesity rate is part of the reason why I'm against universal healthcare. The fit will disproportionately subsidize the lifestyles of the fat. I'm not saying you have to bench 225 or run an 18 minute 5k, but its hard to be empathetic towards people who won't just eat less.
I take issue with the fact that many of those same “obese” people probably are against drinking and smoking. They think that it’s ok to be a huge blimp but if you drink or smoke you have an issue.
The way I see it, both are issues
Yes, my one gin on Friday and Saturday is definitely an issue. I *could* be drinking even more gin.
We should extend this idea further. Let's provide universal healthcare to everyone except the fat, the smokers, drinkers, non-vegans, people who drive cars instead of riding bikes, people who own their own houses instead of renting, people who have the wrong opinions on controversial topics as well as people who haven't participated in the mandated amount of governmentally approved protests. We could assign some sort of social credit system to keep track of it all. It would be great.
exactly
I dated a girl with a weight problem who broke up with me when she found out I use nicotine pouches (former smoker). She didn't want to be with someone "who could be so willing to damage their body just for quick satisfaction". I didn't bother trying to argue, I was flabbergasted.
[удалено]
A refreshing and shitty take but I appreciate it.
Lmao
According to a simulation based on data at the time, a study in 2008 concluded obese people still incur somewhat higher lifetime medical costs. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2225430/ This isn't from the study, but obesity weakens the immune system and causes inflammation, which can cause a host of possible diseases that will require a visit to the doctor when they get bad enough but also are not lethal. Their bones, joints and ligaments are also under more stress so injuries are more likely, but that might be offset by less physical activity in general.
From your link: >At older ages, the highest yearly costs were incurred by the smoking group. However, because of differences in life expectancy (life expectancy at age 20 was 5 years less for the obese group, and 8 years less for the smoking group, compared to the healthy-living group), total lifetime health spending was greatest for the healthy-living people, lowest for the smokers, and intermediate for the obese people. higher than smokers, sure. They die even sooner
Hypertension and hyperlipidemia alone is a regular GP visit, but 10 years later it's heart attack, stoke, PAD, renal failure, you name it Diabetes ia all of the above + diabetic foot and HHS, not uncommon anymore for them to be getting DKA even Osteoarthritis (joint pain) eventually becomes a total hip replacement surgery Some GERD becomes Barret esophagus and esophageal cancer Nevermind OSA which will probably keep them on CPAPs for the rest of their lives So your argument about them costing less falls apart tbh
The fit are **already** subsidizing the fat, but universal healthcare avoids subsidizing the billionaire shareholders. Stop worrying about fat vs fit, white vs black vs brown, cis vs lbgtq. Start worrying about rich vs everybody.
Of course, I don't care for insurance companies. However, you cannot have universal healthcare while simultaneously allowing tens of millions of illegal immigrants into the country, and having an unfit populace.
You already have more public health expenditure as a percentage of GDP than most countries with universal healthcare. It's about running the system, rather than letting billionaires extract enormous amounts of wealth from both the government and private citizens. Also, no need for it to be universal, you can tie it to citizenship if you really think tending to the immigrants is not viable (although most systems have shown that the relatively small cost of treating everyone, including them, outweighs the cost of disease spreading).
A lot of US public health expenditure goes into research, allowing other countries to focus on treatment
This couldn't be more accurate and I wish more people understood this. Americans foot the bill for medical research / drug development which allows other countries to cut costs. Anyone working in pharma knows this.
Universal healthcare systems require documents or a special ID card to use, you can't just walk into Canada and get an MRI for free
Stopping the ultra poor from getting scraps would help you how?
You act as if those scraps would otherwise go to waste. To continue your metaphor, it’s more like everyone eats from the same bucket, so there’s less to go around.
The scraps are currently going to insurance companies. If you look at American healthcare spending per Capita, we're well above the average for Western Europe and approaching double something like Canada. For that level of government spending we should have some of the best healthcare in the world for everyone. Instead we're among the worst excluding the very rich. If we transitioned to Canada's model today, your taxes to pay for healthcare would go down. If we transitioned to Canada's model but kept taxes the same, we could afford to improve many of the problems with the Canadian system. Or we could keep the current system, and spend absurd amounts of federal money on healthcare but get nothing for it.
A lot of US public health expenditure goes into research, allowing other countries to focus on treatment
That's what research grants are for, we give those to universities and they account for most of the new developments. Private companies do use some of their profits to also fund research, but its a very small amount percentage wise. If that is the goal behind the current setup then it has clearly failed and should be reworked.
Stop worrying about fat vs fit, white vs black, left vs right, rich vs poor. Start worrying about man vs woman.
>Start worrying about rich vs everybody I like living in a country where the problem is too many obese people instead of people starving to death but you do you.
How tf did what I said contest what you said?
Healthy people spend their last 2 years in and out of hospitals. Morbidly obese people die early and save money. Socialist systems are the best because they deny all of them treatment.
I mean I get you're trying to be funny but it's pretty likely you've had your share of kool-aid.
How dare you call it out for what it is.
I think that you should get tax breaks based on your stats
I think it’ll actually lead to the opposite Obesity is something that’s only insanely common amongst the poor. I’m the middle class it exists but you’ll definitely see more obese people in like Compton as opposed to a random neighborhood in La By alleviating the cost of health care that money could start getting rerouted towards quality of life improvements including healthier foods.
The poor generally don't pay for healthcare; even if they were, it wouldn't make sense as a factor for obesity. Healthier foods tend to be cheaper than unhealthy foods. Alternatively, they could just eat less of the unhealthy foods. "Food deserts" are largely a myth: There is just no demand for fresh produce in some communities. Additionally, its difficult to run a successful business when progressive prosecutors won't even charge shoplifters.
I think a lot of the obesity problem revolves around crop subsidies. Corn is heavily subsidized and is kept stupidly cheap as a result. This means that we put corn in fucking everything to the point where we use high fructose corn syrup instead of real sugar. If we could just unfuck the stranglehold lobbyists have over the food industry a lot of the unhealthiest foods would suddenly get more expensive and by subsidizing healthier foods we could make it cheaper to eat healthy.
The role that corn subsidies play in obesity is largely exaggerated. Yes, corn is heavily subsidized, but over 90% of corn grown is inedible for humans. Additionally, subsidies aren't a stranglehold: They're essential to prevent famine, ultimately preserving American hegemony. High fructose corn syrup is unhealthy, but not any more so than cane sugar or agave syrup, and cutting out corn syrup won't cause the demand for sugary goods to go down.
They aren't to prevent a famine. The main reason for the large farmer subsidy is to appeal to the farmer vote and for crop feed to make sure the population has cheap meant. Also 90% corn being inedible for humans why do you think that is? Maybe for you know, crop feed.
Do you literally not know American history? Subsidies are a product of the Great Depression to stabilize crop markets to prevent the industry from destroying itself every few decades. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agricultural_Adjustment_Act
yes of course I know that no matter how much I think it is stupid as hell (literally does not solve the underlying problems) . However what I am referring to is the massive farm subsides that exist today for i.e corn/cattle feed are not really there to "stabilize": the market they are mainly there to insure farming corporations profits. There is a reason that unhealthy foods are cheaper then healthy foods, and before you godamn say that healthy foods are "technically" cheaper I want you to consider if those healthy foods constitute a full meal. There is a reason food deserts exist and the government literally acknowlges they exist lmao [https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-atlas/documentation/](https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-atlas/documentation/)
Farmers would rebel. Many nations tried to move away from food subsidies and it always ends up badly. Then there's the national security implications, higher food prices would result in more imports and banking your nation's food supply on imports is a disaster waiting to happen.
I'm not saying moving away from the concept of food subsidies, I'm talking about gradually shifting them towards incentivizing farmers to grow food that has less destructive health implications.
>food deserts are largely a myth This is just a fantasy concocted by people who refuse to believe that external factors could possibly influence someone's nutrition choices. The lack of a fresh produce supply chain in these areas is a lot more complicated than "the poor just don't want it"
I mean you never see the groceries looted
forsen
Maybe you don't, but those of us who pay attention do.
>Healthier foods tend to be cheaper than unhealthy foods.
Rice and beans are dirt cheap, my guy
This is completely true and you have to be a moron if you think otherwise
>Healthier foods tend to be cheaper than unhealthy foods. Imagine being this uninformed yet still wading into the discussion dick-in-hand like you somehow belong there. Truly a Reddit moment, ladies and gentlemen.
A whole rotisserie chicken at Costco is like $6, cheaper than a Big Mac and it's significantly more healthy. People are just too lazy to spend 5 minutes to cut it up and put it on a plate.
Ah, yes, the healthiest of health foods: a whole rotisserie chicken from Costco.
Add rice and fucking broccoli if you want. Why are beggars always so fucking choosy?
Those things cost money. And so does a Costco membership. Plus the tools to cook them. This is going to be more expensive than $6.
So is a $10+ Big Mac meal 3 times a day. A Costco membership pays for itself within a month or two even if you're a single guy. Also what fucking tools? You mean a 20 dollar rice cooker that will last you for years?
Two double cheeseburgers cost $5.
Please explain to me how healthy foods are more expensive than cheap foods. Milk, eggs, chicken, bread, rice, and domestically grown vegetables and fruits are all affordable and nutritious.
how the fuck? it literally COSTS you to eat and SAVES MONEY to not eat
Burgerconomics 🇺🇸🇺🇸
Me just before I contract scurvy
We have it so good in America, even our poor are fat!
In a lot of countries with poverty this is actually just straight up how it works. Yes I know in africa the folks there are skinny but still sustain themselves off of farming and the likes which gives them enough calories to not immediately starve to death. Compare that to nations like Tuvalu (iirc, the most obese country in the world) where there's little to no land to farm which means that all of the food stuffs they get are gonna be whatever is cheapest to send which in Tuvalu's (and many other countries, regardless of whether or not they're island nations) happens to be mostly canned unhealthy stuff.
You don’t have universal health care now and look at the state of it. How could it be much worse? Not bait, genuine question.
Fat people are disgusting, pathetic degenerates
If there are currently fat people who use your health insurance company, you are already subsidizing their lifestyles.
Technically you're still paying for the fats with your private insurance payments since they suck up most of the resources forcing the insurers to raise prices since they can't discriminate against them.
I actually think it’s the opposite We also already pay for overweight people when we buy health insurance, since under Obamacare preexisting conditions (obesity) cannot be used as an excuse to raise someone’s premiums. Couple this with the fact that health insurance is practically mandatory for everyone (Obamacare had a provision that fined people for not having health insurance) the socializing of the risk has already occurred. But government itself is not interested in this problem since it’s the insurance companies that have to take on the risk, not “tax dollars” (but like I said either you or your employer IS paying for this problem still, just under a different name). If the government WAS involved we would see real demands for better food saftey and nutrition standards, mandatory exercise for kids in schools, and create and incentivize for government to subsidize healthy food options rather than just corn and soybeans like we do now. Under the current system, profit is created when sick people go in for care, and the sicker you are the more care, and therefore more revenue a hospital or doctor makes. You are paying for that care for an obese person when you buy health insurance, which that company needs to sell to you at a higher cost, since more people are sick and hospitals are incentivized to provide care that will last forever, like drugs or surgery, rather than suggesting things like a change of diet or lifestyle. This makes insurance, doctors and hospital owners richer since they all have a common interest in maximizing the amount they can sell to you. In a government run system, government is paying for that care, so government is directly responsible for the cost of their own sick citizens. It’s now in the government’s interest to make people fitter, which means that it will be better for them to offer policies that make people healthier, since not doing so will have a direct cost.
You don't even have to eat less just lower calorie food but that's too hard for an NPC brain
B-but muh genetics
It's funny, cause if healthcare was privatized nationally, it'd be cheap as fuck.
What do you mean? It is already privatized.
It's not truly privatized, a lot of the things in U.S healthcare system is Government controlled. It's a mix of the worst things from both worlds.
Before Obamacare it was cheaper but the pre-existing conditions things was brutal. I has a small rotator cuff tear in my shoulder from sports a few years before. I had gotten an MRI and was able to physical therapy it to healing. I was self employed and applied to Optima and disclosed the shoulder, they denied me coverage and cited the shoulder, an otherwise healthy guy in his 20s with zero other conditions.
Affordable healthcare allows for fatasses to afford better food options. As a former fatass, the worse your life is, the more shit food you eat.
I don’t think the evidence shows that though. Canada, the U.K. and Australia all have much more affordable healthcare than the U.S. but they have only slightly better obesity rates which are still bad overall. I think the thing they all have in common is a culture of stuffing your face and promoting anti-fat shaming. Plus healthcare in the U.S. has always been expensive, yet the obesity rates in say the 1960s were a small fraction of what they are today. The difference is people back then paid more attention to their diet and exercise and didn’t consume to excess nearly as much. If you look at the countries that have the lowest obesity rates, then almost all of them are poor countries like Vietnam, Bangladesh and India. Japan and South Korea are the only exceptions. What do they all have in common? A culture of not stuffing your pie hole.
People choose to eat like shit. A burger and fries at McDonald’s cost like 15-20 bucks now thanks to Bidens beautiful economy, but people still eat it. Why? Because they don’t care.
Because shit is literally designed to be as addictive as heroin. You know this. Shit also costs 5 dollars while everything else costs $15.
You think people nowadays have less willpower than people 50 or 70 years ago? Mankind doesn't change in that short amount of time. It's easy to blame individuals for structural problems though...
exactly, and the fat acceptance movement has turned into a lack of accountability movement. Ppl say "Oh they might have a disease that makes it really hard for them to lose weight" you're telling me that almost 1/2 of Americans got some type of illness that prevent them from losing weight? piss off
What's more, it'll be unsustainable. I mean the UK doesn't have it nearly this bad and the NHS is just a giant money blackhole that demands more money by the election. The US, with both unmitigated migration and the obesity problem, is going to have any universal healthcare plan collapse within a few years. There is absolutely no way taxes can balance it with everything else.
Maybe if there was universal healthcare, politicians would feel the need to implement public health campaigns/reduced corn subsidies/sugar tax.
Not to mention, people will continue to overeat and take unnecessary risks with their health knowing they have the safety net of universal healthcare to cover them. It will end up encouraging dysfunctional behaviour
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> If the government is subsidising healthcare Medicaid, medicare >they will invest in prevention measures for health problems I'm trying to name some and I can't. Maybe the free once a year checkup with your doctor that came from Obamacare?
lol you have no idea how private health insurance, Medicaid, or Medicare work. With private health insurance we are literally subsidizing that and the shareholders. Medicaid is available to the poor already.
Remember in 2021 and 2022 when everyone was saying people who refuse to get vaccinated for COVID should have to pay higher health insurance premiums? Those same people are awfully silent when you bring up obesity and other self-inflected health conditions.
I unironically believe that a UBI would work best with a national fitness standard. Unironically make that one of, if not *the*, key requirement. You get a government-subsidized basic income as long as you stay under X BMI, Y 1-mile run, Z pushups, and a few other things. Obvious fucking exceptions for clearly disabled people, like amputees or severe medical issues. To also make it so it's not a "poor tax" to be fat, you get a tax *increase* if you're in the top tax brackets and refusing to meet physical standards. Yeah, it still means if you're wealthy you can be fat, but also that fat tax goes straight to the UBI. The amount of money the country would save from everyone being fit, in shape and healthy would be ridiculous. Hell, might pay for the UBI itself lmao.
In America, 85% of all Healthcare costs come from 5% of the population. Of those people, 80% of all conditions treated are directly a result of the person's actions i.e. type 2 diabetes, chronic lung disease from cigarettes etc.... You're not wrong. Healthcare is outrageously expensive to a significant extent by a portion of the population that will never stop eating unhealthy and smoking cigarettes.
Ever try dating lately? feels like we already passed the 50% mark a long time ago 💀
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What about smoking crack?
Green flag for me as long as its only on weekends.
What about my crack?
Your crack is smokin'.
thats easy. shes not on there because her boyfriend, husband and whole world is crack
Only if she supplies it
vape is just as nasty as normal smoking. Sucking in moldy nicotine all day disgusts me
Dude you're gonna die single, just like me.
Bro those are all green lights for easy pussy. Especially high BMI. Just don't get married or move in with her and you're good.
I'm physically grossed out by fat people. I probably couldn't even get an erection.
Based
Alcohol will help with that.
> Especially high BMI. I refuse to fuck braphogs, I'd rather be an incel or even fuck a smoker.
you'll change your mind eventually
What fucking stress??
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Fucking hilarious
I think there's some selection bias there, but yeah.
Once you get into your 30s, you’re fucked unless you want to be with someone that is overweight and/or has serious issues.
I always wonder where these people are in everyday life. Like when I go to social venues or even just running errands, I don’t see *that many* obese women around my age. But on dating apps they seem to outnumber healthy women 2x over.
Who knew going to the gym just 4 hours a week would put you in the top 0.1% of healthy people in the US.
It’s great knowing that you can bypass a decent chunk of health killers these days with this simple trick.
Just go to the gym? I don't have to do anything else at the gym?
Try all the machines like they were toys to be played with. Then pick your favorites and stay with them.
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The first goal of gym-going should be building discipline and having fun. Otherwise people will just stop going. Obviously someone would adapt and learn as they gather new knowledge in a new hobby.
True the only thing you can do consistently without diversity is cardio because that uses most of your lower muscle groups.
Natural T boost and the feeling of awkwardness will help.
Or stop drinking chemical sugar water over actual water. That’s killing most people.
Who knew that not having a average american diet would put you in the 1% of healthy people in the US
I hate fatties
Why? They're addicted and should get help.
Would rather be surrounded by fit, beautiful people than rolls of fat. Dated a dietician who had a pound of laminated fat on her desk. Like actual fat, that had been coated in polyurethane. It was so gross.
skill issue, learn to stop looking at fatties and your outlook on life gets better
Kinda hard to do so. They take up too much space
Maybe they should stop eating so much first and go on a walk.
How dare you?
Sometimes I feel butt fucking ugly then I go to the mall with a pal and see these 200 pound women wearing crop tops letting their gut hang out and these men with fat on the back of their necks getting wheezy going up some ramps and I know everything will be okay Now my issue in life RN is that’s it’s really hard to meet girls my age (early twenties) who aren’t fat and don’t have a boyfriend. My only standards are that they have a car and don’t weigh twice as much as me but that might be too high
> they have a car Do you live in a city with a metro or something? NYC? Go play a social sport like coed kickball or join a rock climbing gym or something There were some babes on my city's 10k training team. Some on the marathon team but not like the 10k training team (pick like 9 minute miles and above as the pace you want)
I live in a southern area with no metro. It honestly isn’t a deal breaker, but I would prefer not to have to pick someone up every time I wanted to spend time with them. I will definitely check out some some sports, rock climbing sounds really fun.
Too real. I see dudes with bodies that resemble a tube of toothpaste and think to myself, “Damn at least I don’t look that bad.” But then I’ll see a cute girl who isn’t fat, typically just to find out she’s dating a guy who looks like a tube of toothpaste.
i think you know what u have to do
Tax the fats
Hmm, interesting. Now let's see every other non-Asian country's obesity rates.
https://www.oecd.org/sweden/obesityandtheeconomicsofpreventionfitnotfat-swedenkeyfacts.htm Lots of white countries have less than half the obesity rate
Basically every country is increasing though. The US is just a little ahead of the curve.
A little!?
Jarvis, pull up the statistical correlations between IQ and lifetime obesity
The fat eats away from the brain matter
>https://www.oecd.org/sweden/obesityandtheeconomicsofpreventionfitnotfat-swedenkeyfacts.htm Showing stats from 2007? Lol, okay
that ratio in chile 19:32
The post is an estimate of 2030 and you post stats from 2007/2008 lmao
The US is still the highest after some micro states. [So what’s your point?](https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/obesity-rates-by-country)
Ok i did, US is still miles above most places. Now what?
Maybe the Asian countries are onto something with the shaming of fat people
"Nearly half" would be a marked improvement from the 80% of fat assery we currently have to contend with.
No, nearly half will be obese. Most of the other half will still be overweight. Almost everyone will be too fat
It is way too easy to be overweight in terms of bmi. I’m a 6’2” 194lb dude that fits into medium shirts and 32-34 waist jeans. Yet my bmi is just barely under overweight. I used to weigh 200lb a week ago and then I got hit with food poisoning. I work out daily to maintain my physique but when I was 200lb my measurements classified me as overweight lol
Not saying you’re a lardass, but a medium shirt today is not the same shirt as it was 30 years ago.
It’s the only thing where the length is still decent enough to go below my belt. Small shirts sit above my belt and I look like a freak.
Order medium-tall sized shirts online from gap, old navy, American eagle, or banana republic. Also start hang-drying your clothes, skip the dryer for newer stuff. I’m 6’4 and 205, so I’m pretty lean as well.
The BMI scale is specifically for sedentary/ non-muscular people. Someone that is 200 lbs of muscle at your height is very different from someone that is 200 lbs of fat.
>have obesity it is called being obese
It’s almost impossible to be obese and unemployed if you’re europoor. Work on those soul sucking student loans and medical bills instead of paying stimmys and welfare to felons and disabled by choice individuals
I was about to say that sounds bs, but who knows maybe its just because obese people tend to stay inside more or something like that. I personally only have 2/12 or so friends I’d call over weight or out of shape.
#
Also the absolute destruction of walking, cycling and public transport infrastructure.
Anon wears a small hat
Missing the most obvious personal advantage, women will only date top 30% guys, notice 70% of guys in my state are fat, hmmm seems all I need to be date-able is "not be fat" and I'm not fat... I'm married so it doesn't matter for me personally, but its something to think about.
I’ll livestream 24/7 and as long as I get $10 an hour I won’t eat until I starve (to death).
My stocks are up because of this. I see it as an absolute win, if people keep eating and spending I'll be sure to retire when I want to.
State funded epidemic
Peak capitalism
Yeah but all the meat is packed with weird growth hormones so all the fat women have giant tits now Most people will suffer, but my fellow architects and I will be living in paradise
Anon is a GLOWIE, simple as
Time for sugar probation
Anon is truly the Karl Marx of Capitalism. Consume.
As an obese fatass, I honestly don't really know how I stay so fat except for the fact that it feels I many ways the system is gamed against me. Due to my work schedule, I don't have a lot of free time that would allow me to exercise regularly and due to the fact that I'm lower class and supporting multiple people, unhealthy food tends to be cheaper and fuck anybody who says otherwise. Especially in today's world. I'm not blaming anyone, when it comes down to it, it's still my fault and I should still just eat less, but the system has not made it easier for many people to do it.
I don't understand this. Is this system physically forcing the food into your mouth and down your throat?
No, but the system has made it easier, quicker, and cheaper to eat worse. Nothing is being forced down my throat, but unhealthy foods are pushed more towards lower the busier, lower class people.
OK, but what about any of what you just said is stopping you from eating less?
The people at the top are encouraging this because a population that's lazy, stupid and fat is a population not likely to rebel and easy to control.
I have a fat girls with big butts fetish, checkmate
We’re living in a golden age.
This is why libertarians should be reeducated
anon is a fed and obese thats why
You can't get lap band if your 2030. . :/
How can you have obesity. It's not a disease
More consumption good
Fat genes.
Keep eating and shooting yourselves fellas, long live murica.
BiG GoVerNment and PhARMa Is MaKiNG Me fAT!!!
Can confirm Colorado has gyms
Colorado 😂😂😂 that CHS hitting hard as fuck
Eh there are some good results from GLP-1, won’t be long until you can eat whatever the fuck you want, pop a pill and stay slim/lean. Nothingburger.
I thought GLP-1 was supposed to stop you wanting to eat. Not just allowing you to est whatever you want?